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Paranoid Android
Alien or Predator? Predator or Alien? Which to choose. Hmmmmm

Both are cool in their own way; I can't split them - as long as you never (and I mean NEVER) put them in the same movie together grin2.gif

OH! Too late? Well, let's not make another one then. Unless I get to direct it and make it a smash hit thumbsup.gif

All the best,
Mr Ed
If we are using the film as evidence of who would win then Predator would surely win. They obviously have much better social skills and could go to John Lewis or Wallmart and recruit a load of 20-30 year old women to help them.
nick_fury
indeed, they have that whole parrot thing going on, they hear people talk and repeat what they say in their own funny deep growly voice. This is probably how they enslaved the humans in AvP to build the temples
sublime_serenity75
QUOTE(Jackalope @ Oct 14 2004, 05:52 PM)
Hey guys who do you like better alien or predator?

Personaly iI like preds....they are bad ass lol  grin2.gif

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Predator-an absoltue kick butt movie. thumbsup.gif
BurnSide
QUOTE(Mr Ed @ Jul 9 2005, 05:55 PM)
No matter how awful that film was, I was still curious about what an alien that came from a predator would look like, maybe it would be different.
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Play the game 'Aliens Vs Predator' for the PC.
The humans capture a Predator and have it impregnated with an alien seed. What emerges is a Predalien. This alien has alot of muscle mass, so is much stronger but also slower than human-aliens. It has the predators jaw structure and a smaller head.

QUOTE(nick_fury @ Jul 9 2005, 05:58 PM)
doubt it, they come from eggs, and are only in the body for a few hours, probably not enough for them to be able to adapt or vary based on their host
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The alien takes the traits from the host always.
Alien 3, the host is a dog, and the alien is a 'Dog' Alien. The aliens seen in 1, 2 and Ressurection along with AVP are human aliens.


QUOTE(Mr Ed @ Jul 9 2005, 06:09 PM)
In Alien 3 they came from cows. They two prison inmates had a dead cow/bull and they hooked it up in the carving place. They kept complaining about the stench and talked about how they had no idea how the beast died.

Then, after they left, an alien shot out from the dead bulls stomach.

I wonder if we are talking about the same film. I am 90% sure this happened in Alien 3 as I watched it the other day. I could be wrong though, I suppose.
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Weird. I knew it had been replaced, but not like that. Where the hell were they keeping a bull on the planet, it's barely inhabitable by the humans. Dumb.
You should watch the real version of the movie, it's much better. thumbsup.gif


QUOTE(Snake_6024 @ Jul 9 2005, 06:36 PM)
I have played the games(they are quite popular here),and there are different species of aliens,depending on the host it is born from.
There is the normal drone,the predalien,and a thing called praetorian,which is supposed to be some kind of evolved alien with armor plating(and it is bigger than the other ones).The predalien is slower but stronger than the simple drone.I think there is also a smaller,faster version,but I forgot the name.
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Normal drone in AVP would be a human-alien. Now aliens can develop into queens in incubation if no queens are sensed. Likewise, they can also develop into queens guards. Praetorians are half queen, half drone aliens, basically 'king' aliens.


QUOTE(Talon @ Jul 9 2005, 06:37 PM)
Found the reason for the change

"In the original filmed version of _ALIEN^3_ the alien came from a cow, not
a dog (the entire movie was filmed before they decided to change the "host"
to a dog) Since the alien didn't act like a cow (ie: this alien was more
aggressive, however, a cow would be considered less aggressive than a
human) nor did the film makers originally base the alien's actions on those
of a dog, this works against the DNA theory. The "cow" scene is also
supported by the novel by Alan Dean Foster [page 58]."

http://www.totse.com/en/ego/science_fiction/alien3fq.html
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The dog works miles better, of course.
mr_halo

actually it works better as coming from a cow, as when the alien comes from the dog its born bigger than the dog it came from, while when it comes from the cow, its small enough to fit in the cow yes.gif

they keep the cows to move stuff i believe, they used it in the film to pull the escape pod from the water yes.gif

innocent.gif

Talon
QUOTE
as when the alien comes from the dog its born bigger than the dog it came from,


Actually when it burstss out its still pretty small, it just shedss its skin in the first few scenes, so it becomes bigger than the dog.
BurnSide
Yeah, when it first bursts out it's tiny like all chestbusters are. In the first couple scenes it's about as big as a cat, and you see it starting to shed skin right away.
TheOneAceRimmer
Predator is definitely the best. Come on he has lasers, invisibility, heat vision, and cool killer claws.
seeking
you can see at the very end of AvP the chest buster has predators jaw structure, thats all the proof you need of the alien taking dna from its host


also, the aliens that come from humans, arent they known as warrior aliens? or is that just in the action figure universe?
Mr Ed
I just think of them as aliens or classic aliens.
TheOneAceRimmer
So what if aliens can inpregnate people. Male human beings can do the exact same thing. The offspring just doesn't bust out of the womens chest.
Mr Ed
laugh.gif Well I think that difference is enough for them not to be compared.
mr_halo

heres the alien 3 dog in question....

innocent.gif

Mr Ed
Talon provided a link for it already. It looks pretty nasty. I will watch the original version later to see what has the better dramatic effect.
Richdog
Guys check out this excellent set of stories written by average Joe's, notable the Diary of a Xenomorph story and it's sequel. Took me fricken ages to read, and it is very, very good. Though it humanises the slains a tad. It also involves those space jockeys later on in the sequel. Great reading. http://www.gamestory.net/story.php?f=lb&t=Aliens

First Diary of a Xenomorph story - http://www.gamestory.net/story.php?f=vc&b=60&c=0

Sequel - http://www.gamestory.net/story.php?f=vc&b=111&c=0

original.gif
Talon
QUOTE
Sigourney doesn't like women action heroes

Sigourney Weaver says she doesn't like what has become of female action heroes since she starred in Alien.

"I'm not sure I'd say Angelina Jolie was brilliant in the way they used her in Lara Croft", the actress, 55, told Spiegel magazine.

"Angelina is a great actress, but her role is limited to fighting evil with weapons."

"I think it's quite a pity that an actress as good as Angelina Jolie isn't given more room to portray the character of Lara Croft with a touch more intelligence", she said.

"They limited her to the video game character too much", Weaver complained.

"To me, big breasts, hot pants and a gun in your hand aren't what makes a heroine."

The actress also said there will probably be a fifth Alien film, but she won't be in it.

"I know there's a script, but I haven't read it", she said.

"Never say never, but I'm pretty sure this thing is over for me," she added.


http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story...ertainment.film

QUOTE
UK Teletext reports that British director Paul W. S. Anderson ("Alien vs. Predator", "Resident Evil") is to write the sixth movie in the "Alien" franchise, according to sources close to the film maker.

Newcastle-born Anderson, 39, has apparently been asked by Twentieth Century Fox to pen a new script featuring the creatures on their own (ie. no Predators). Whether that includes the return of Ellen Ripley (Sigourney Weaver) however is unknown.

The offer for the moment is simply to pen the script, not to direct as such although that may happen thanks to the success of AVP.


http://www.darkhorizons.com/news04/041018n.php

Oh my god no.gif


nick_fury
w00t.gif Oh well at least it's not a franchise i'm particualrly fond of this time. If he'd done predator now THAT would have been different.
Talon
QUOTE
Paul W.S. Anderson ("Alien VS Predator") has apparently been chosen to write the screenplay for "Alien 5," according to several Web sites who cite the UK Telext as the original source.  Mercifully, there is a glimmer of reasonable doubt.

Apparently the original article called the film "Alien 6," which is a mistake since there have been only four in the series so far.  Because of that mistake, there is a little room to believe that the rumor is not true.  I can tell you're not impressed, but I'm clinging to the hope that they'll take another look at "Alien: Resurrection," followed by an extended screening of "Alien VS Predator" and decide to start up an espresso stand or open a landscaping company before they throw any more money to a group of people who are turning a solid franchise into a huge joke.

There was apparently no word whether Sigourney Weaver would reprise her role as Ellen Ripley, the happless space trucker who happens upon the aliens and fights through three bloody movies, surviving each encounter save one, but then is genetically re-created through a series of terrible executive decisions and ridiculous screenwriting only to become part alien herself and utter such useless lines as, "It was in my way," in a tone that suggests her decision to take the role had more to do with the mortgage payment being overdue than any artistic integrity that she has.

It should be noted that "Alien 5" would be the sixth movie in the "Alien" franchise (when you count "Alien VS Predator"), so calling the new film "Alien 6" could have simply been an honest mistake by a journalist who got his notes mixed up.  Here's to hoping.


http://www.dtheatre.com/read.php?sid=2762


QUOTE
Mercifully, there is a glimmer of reasonable doubt.


'Mercifully' laugh.gif


Please, please let there be reasonable doubt
nick_fury
Hey! whats wrong with resurection, i found it an enjoyable romp. yes.gif

BTW Talon, i wouldn't be too worried, Anderson is already working on two upcoming movies due out around 2006

'Man with the football'
Terrorists steal the U.S. president's "football" -- the briefcase equipment used to initiate a nuclear strike -- causing a team of agents to quickly diffuse a potential attack.

'Deathrace 3000'
A no-holds-barred, ultraviolent car race, set in 2020.

They sound.....nice
Talon
resurection was the worse of them tongue.gif

In order;

Best
1. Aliens Special Edition
2. Predator
3. Alien
4. Alien 3
5. Predator 2
6. Alien vs Predator
7. Alien Resurection
Worst
Mr Ed
QUOTE
6. Alien vs Predator
7. Alien Resurection


You have gone too far.
Talon
QUOTE
'Man with the football'
Terrorists steal the U.S. president's "football" -- the briefcase equipment used to initiate a nuclear strike -- causing a team of agents to quickly diffuse a potential attack.


You know that doesn't sound that bad.

It'd probably be good if it was Denzil Washington, Bruce Willas, Samuel Jackson or Will Smith play the lead role, with a decent director like the guy who did Enemy of the State or Negotator (Jackson's BEST movie ever!)

But instead we'll have Anderson, who'll run it buy going for what he thinks looks 'cool' rather than whats good.
Paranoid Android
Talon - I'd definitely have to put AvP dead last (and I mean a thousand year gap between that and Alien Resurrection). Indeed, you have sullied the name of Alien and Predator simply by putting this in the list.

If you have any shred of humanity and decency, you will go back and edit AvP out altogether
nick_fury
It kind of reminded me of Metal Gear Solid 2, not that i want to associate Anderson with that great franchise.
I think using the actors you mentioned would be a little cliche and just make it a boneheaded action flick, maybe using someone who doesn't usually play these kinds of rolls like...oh i don't know...Liam Neeson or something would be better. But then again Anderson's titles are hardly known for their 'big name' casts, and i'm not surprised, who'd want to destroy their 'big name' on such a pitiful project
Talon
QUOTE
QUOTE
6. Alien vs Predator
7. Alien Resurection



You have gone too far.


How so? tongue.gif

Personally I look at those two and all I see it both directors wanted to go for a movie which would make these long-haired rock types you see swinging their hair around to electric guitar saying 'cooool' whenever they see fancy special effects and gore. I mean the scene where the Alien kills the guy, but not before he has time to pull out his own brain and look at it……… for the luv of…

The rest were very decent attempts to make either a dark action-packed science-fiction movie, or to make a dark horror movie. Some succeeded better than others. But even the two lowest rating of that list (P2, A3) did a far more successful job of staying loyal to the feel of there predecessors than the most recent two.

Ultimately is a matter of taste, but the AVP and A4 were simply in my opinion... lacking.
Talon
QUOTE
Talon - I'd definitely have to put AvP dead last (and I mean a thousand year gap between that and Alien Resurrection). Indeed, you have sullied the name of Alien and Predator simply by putting this in the list.

If you have any shred of humanity and decency, you will go back and edit AvP out altogether


Like it or not its part of the franchise.
Mr Ed
Even so, I do not see how you rank andersons atrocity higher than Alien ressurection!!!!!
Talon
Because I hated ressurection tongue.gif laugh.gif
Mr Ed
Nooooo Talon! Please go and watch it and then watch avp.

At least a r stays true to the nature of the aliens.

In avp the predator makes friends with a 30 year old woman! SHE BECOMES HIS SIDEKICK! That film made me laugh out loud with shame that such a genre could be destroyed in one quick blow by anderson!
Talon
QUOTE
In avp the predator makes friends with a 30 year old woman! SHE BECOMES HIS SIDEKICK!


Thats what happens in the AVP books tongue.gif

Anyway, don't see why your so uptight tongue.gif I said I hated both of them laugh.gif

Its a matter of opinion like I said, your free to have your, and me mine. I just didn't think AVP or A4 felt like Alien or Predator movies.
Mr Ed
laugh.gif Ok, I wasn't being uptight, just cringing with sheer amazement that someone could hate anderson's abomination slightly less than they hated ressurection!

Fair enough, as long as you hate avp as well, that will make me happy enough.
Talon
QUOTE
I wasn't being uptight, just cringing with sheer amazement that someone could hate anderson's abomination slightly less than they hated ressurection!


Oh don't feel to bad, it was close. But I'm afraid several things shoved A4 down the rank list 1. The bit with the brain 2. The guy running up to the bad guy and using the chestbuster comming out of his stomach as a weapon. 3. Ripley's god awful lines. 4. The whole half-alien thing. oh and 5. I hated the alien-human at the end. 6. The induendo between Ripley and the andriod..... it'd be hot if Ripely wasn't so old.... but she is.

With AVP I just hated 1. The director 2. The alien being taken apart and used as a weapon and sheild 3. The director 4. The cross-breed alien at the end 5. The director 6. The look of the Predators. And since I repeated my main hatred several times there, I guess AVP wins out between the two wacko.gif

In all seriousness, I can watch AVP, I just can't watch A4.
Mr Ed
laugh.gif Fair enough, each to his own I suppose.

QUOTE
5. The director


In my opinion, this crushes all other reasons regarding avp tongue.gif

Thinking about it now, that alien being used as weapon to shoot through someones head was a bit cheesy (in AR).
BurnSide
QUOTE(Talon @ Jul 11 2005, 09:52 AM)

QUOTE

The offer for the moment is simply to pen the script, not to direct as such although that may happen thanks to the success of AVP.


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The... success of AvP?

... blink.gif

There are some seriously stupid people making decisions for Fox it would seem.


QUOTE(Mr Ed @ Jul 11 2005, 10:52 AM)
Nooooo Talon! Please go and watch it and then watch avp.

At least a r stays true to the nature of the aliens.

In avp the predator makes friends with a 30 year old woman! SHE BECOMES HIS SIDEKICK! That film made me laugh out loud with shame that such a genre could be destroyed in one quick blow by anderson!
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Guess again dude. Predators teaming with humans IS the nature of predator. That was in the original comics and the original books. The storyline of AvP was exactly what was penned as the nature of predators. The hunt and honor are all that matter.

In the original story, it's set in the time of aliens on a remote desert farming planet. The predators seed the planet with aliens and prepare to hunt. However, there are humans on the planet, and it is a very strict rule with predators to never hunt humans. Only the very oldest warriors are allowed.
The predator pod however crashes into the surface, and the leader, Dachande, is wounded. The young predators, without a leader to guide them, run rampant on the planet hunting the humans. Dachande with the help of the humans recovers fully, and now has to fight against both the predators and the aliens. He enlists the help of the woman exec of the planet and together they hunt the dishonorable predators and aliens and she eventually kills the queen, and Dachande is killed. He 'bloods' her in the same was as in the movie before he dies. She, with her queen head trophy, joins the predator clan and becomes one of them, travelling from planet to planet hunting aliens.

Andersons story is just a variation of the exact same thing. So to hate that storyline, you are technically hating a predator in general. tongue.gif

People didn't like AvP because they didn't understand it. They think preds are merciless killers like the aliens, but they are not, they are a civilized race who believe in honor at the very highest mark.
The main problem with AvP is that Anderson penned the script around thinking that the audience would understand everything in full about both franchises right off the bat, but of course, this isn't true, and as such, most people didn't understand it and therefore hated it.

Not that i'm saying it wasn't crap. tongue.gif


Mr Ed
QUOTE
Andersons story is just a variation of the exact same thing. So to hate that storyline, you are technically hating a predator in general


Nope, I must just hate the way Anderson did it.

QUOTE
People didn't like AvP because they didn't understand it.


I don't like AVP not because I didn't understand it, but for several thousand reasons, some being:

1) Anderson directed it.
2) Anderson damaged the genre
3) The shield bit using the Alien
4) The predator-human relationship was not portrayed to my liking. As well as many other peoples.
5) It completely contradicted the alien genre timeline
6) Ripley was not in it
7) The Characters were unconvincing and boring.
8) It made me laugh when it should have made me interested.
9) I am not a massive predator fan anyway.
10) The character of that woman especially sucked.

The list goes on and on, and on and on...


QUOTE
Not that i'm saying it wasn't crap


laugh.gif I don't think you will get any arguments from anyone for saying that.
nick_fury
QUOTE(BurnSide @ Jul 11 2005, 05:19 PM)
it is a very strict rule with predators to never hunt humans. Only the very oldest warriors are allowed.
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So all those preds in the movies (excluding AvP of course) were really old??? damn i hope i'm that mobile when i'm ancient

Also can anyone actually remember the names of any of the characters in AvP other than Weyland? teeheehee thought not
BurnSide
In the Pred movies actually the first predator (first movie) was very very old, yes.

The second movie though, starred a much younger predator. He was reckless and un-blooded. However, on earth he was completing a test to become blooded and to become a respected honourable wiseman. The other predators at the end were all old, one of them had been to earth 250 years before (by the date on the gun). They were in a clan allowed to hunt humans because of their status.

Obviously at the end of the movie, they let the guy live even though he killed a pred. Why? Honor. He killed fair and square, there was no dishonor in the death of a predator who fought and died bravely at the hand of a tougher opponent.

Likewise, there was no dishonor in fighting alongside a human who was able to kill the aliens. This is the predator way. So the storyline of AvP was not flawed at all, just directed and written very crappily by Anderson.

If James Cameron directed it with the exact same story, i'm sure it would have been amazing. original.gif




And no, i cannot remember any of the names. Weyland was obvious since his is the name of the company. But i do agree 100% that the character development was extremely flawed. I didn't care about the characters the slightest bit. I cared more about the inmates in Alien3.
Talon
QUOTE
People didn't like AvP because they didn't understand it. They think preds are merciless killers like the aliens, but they are not, they are a civilized race who believe in honor at the very highest mark.


Anyone who thinks that's never seen Predator 1 or 2. Its made very clear early on that they don't kill those who are unarmed, in 2 we learn they won't kill children or unborn babies, even if their armed or the mother's armed (which makes sense you can't hunt the next generation if you've already eliminated it). We are also shown they have honour enough in both P2 and AvP to acknowledge human warriors also, whether they fought with or against them.
The P2 end scene was a lot like Zulu's ending. After being slaughtered in their hundreds the Zulu's turned up totally outnumbering the invader, could have wiped them out, but instead gave them a few cheers for bravery and went off. The Preds were the same in P2, if they were ruthless they would have killed Glover, instead they give him a trophy and leave.
Talon
QUOTE
I cared more about the inmates in Alien3.


Most of them did have personality though.

We had the Black guy who was the badass leader.
We had Moris who was negative about everything and the only surviror.
We had the guy who was also in JP2 who seemed to be a ringleader
We had 72 or whatever his name was, the lacky to the prison officer.
etc etc etc
can't remember their names, but we know who they are.
BurnSide
In P1 too we see the honorable, warrior side of the Predator.
The Predator could have killed Dutch in a second , and pretty much did, however the Predator spared his life because it considered Dutch to be a very worthy and admirable opponent, one worth the honor of battling rather than hunting. So the predator removed it's armour, it's weapons and even it's mask, and did battle with Dutch to man, as it were.
Talon
You know I'm watching Alien 3 again, and I've said this before many times. But its one of those movies which grows on you ever time you see it.

I just wish Newt had survived.
BurnSide
hehe, 85. So called, because of his IQ.
All he wanted to do was survive, and get off that rock. But goodness inside him prevailed, and he died buying Ripley just a couple seconds to stop the company getting their hands on the Alien.

Alien3 really wasn't that bad, alot of people hated it because of the lack of guns and whatnot though. Bah.
Talon
QUOTE
Alien3 really wasn't that bad, alot of people hated it because of the lack of guns and whatnot though. Bah.


Cameron also hated it. In an interview he said he didn't put Ripley, Hicks and Newt together as a family at the end of 2 only for them to be torn apart at the start of 3.
BurnSide
Yeah i know, i read that interview. And he has a damned good point, i don't know what they were thinking with Alien3. But, we got what we got.
Talon
QUOTE
Scott is reportedly quoted as saying that originally he wanted a much darker ending. He planned on having the alien bite off Ripley's head in the escape shuttle, sit in her chair, and then start speaking with her voice in a message to Earth. Apparently, 20th Century Fox wasn't too pleased with such a dark ending.


http://www.brian-oshaughnessy.com/alien/alien-review.html

Erm.... lovely hmm.gif

Maybe Scot wasn't such a great director after all wacko.gif
BurnSide
WHAT!? haahhahaha!! That's hi-larious, i'd never heard that before.

I'm sorry, i have to repeat that to myself. The alien bites off Ripleys head, sits in her chair in the escape pod, and send a message to earth in her voice.

Not only talk, but talk in her voice. AHAhHAHAHA too good.
Shadowsleet
The good news is, that ending was cut....

The bad news is that Paul Anderson, if he ever got wind of it, would incorporate it into his next movie.
BurnSide
Anderson would probably think that would have been the greatest ending of all time.
Shadowsleet
He probably would have "improved" on it, by having the alien assume Ripley's physical form....
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