If a person were to walk into a Hospital Nursery and kill a newborn, The World would Scream. If they then started hacking off body parts of the infant. No Jury I know of would show them any mercy, If the state they did it in has the death penalty, What do you think their chances are of not getting it?
Five minutes earlier in the Labor room, this was legal, and may be again. Where are the Screams? Not from the Infant, they cover the baby's mouth with their hand before they poke a pair of sissors in the back of their neck and cut the Spinal cord.
I assume when the man who was executed for killing the abortion doctor got to heaven, The Doctor he killed was the first to greet him, and THANK HIM.
Ken
PS. Stem cells can also be harvested from the umbilical cord. Without killing a child, But you do not get as many. TOO BAD.
Full Version: Five minutes to Atrocity.
yeah... and? There's nothing we can do to stop people from killing babies. We'll never agree when a fetus gets a soul, and we'll never agree what's right and what's wrong. It's all about getting as much as you can, as fast as you can, by any means necesarry. They haven't gotten one cure for anything in the 20 some odd years they've been researching stem cells from fetuses. They've found tons of cures using adult stem cells though.
I take it you believe that a fetus in the late second trimester is the equivalent of a newborn, then? Or do you understand what the biological differences are between a full-term and a late term abortion? To say nothing of the legal ones?
Five minutes indeed.
Of course you do. After all, you know exactly what God wants for all of us, and its beyond crystal clear who He wants to live and die. Yours is, can only be, the only global morality, and must be applied to everyone, regardless of their personal feelings on the matter (it's really for their own good anyways, isn't it?). I'm absolutely sure that everyone ever killed by a person who believed with all their heart that they were doing God's work was absolutely justified in doing so. And even more sure that the people murdered were ever so grateful that their assassin cared enough to put a bullet into their skull.
Five minutes indeed.
QUOTE
I assume when the man who was executed for killing the abortion doctor got to heaven, The Doctor he killed was the first to greet him, and THANK HIM.
Of course you do. After all, you know exactly what God wants for all of us, and its beyond crystal clear who He wants to live and die. Yours is, can only be, the only global morality, and must be applied to everyone, regardless of their personal feelings on the matter (it's really for their own good anyways, isn't it?). I'm absolutely sure that everyone ever killed by a person who believed with all their heart that they were doing God's work was absolutely justified in doing so. And even more sure that the people murdered were ever so grateful that their assassin cared enough to put a bullet into their skull.
My theory is that with all the research...they actually HAVE cures for the major diseases...even AIDS....
BUT the only reason why they haven't been released to the public is because the government and whoever else is involved makes tons more money on the medication for these diseases than for the actual curing of it.
Imagine, HIV always after some period of time adapts to the medication that keeps it dormant...hence the change of medication after a year or two...yet the cost of the medication is easily reaching $100 per bottle, with several medications necessary several time per day, refills, doctors appointments, etc., ...you do the math.
Imagine- these same scientists doing all these tests with stem cell research for so long ( BTW I totally disagree with using fetus for this, regardless if it is aware of itself, feels pain, has a soul- it is still wrong) and no breakthroughs??? GIVE ME A BREAK...
They have cures, they just have a disease themself...called greed.
BUT the only reason why they haven't been released to the public is because the government and whoever else is involved makes tons more money on the medication for these diseases than for the actual curing of it.
Imagine, HIV always after some period of time adapts to the medication that keeps it dormant...hence the change of medication after a year or two...yet the cost of the medication is easily reaching $100 per bottle, with several medications necessary several time per day, refills, doctors appointments, etc., ...you do the math.
Imagine- these same scientists doing all these tests with stem cell research for so long ( BTW I totally disagree with using fetus for this, regardless if it is aware of itself, feels pain, has a soul- it is still wrong) and no breakthroughs??? GIVE ME A BREAK...
They have cures, they just have a disease themself...called greed.
Killing someone whose only sin has been to abort tissue that has the potential to become human (God does that about 1 million times a day), is not justification for premeditated murder. Your preacher friend has been sizzling in your Hell for around a year now and will sizzle (according to your delusion) for all eternity. Too many denizens of your Hell had the excuse, "I meant well"! On the other hand the Doctor is probably sitting in Heaven as a martyr to man's religious excesses. I find that very ironic! 
Many, Many unborn are lost before birth. But that is outside most of our control. It is part of the system built into mankind.
And the stopping of the killing of the unborn will not happen, It can be slowed. And that is worth some effort.
But what is the strange differerce between that five minutes? Why is the Child in the Nursery so precious, and the one just exiting the womb not? This is what the thread was about. Does cutting the cord and issuing a Birth Certificate, increases the Value?
If a Child being born has no value, Neither does an abortion Doctor. For life itself has no value.
Why search for a missing Child if they had no value the moment before Birth? Why care for anything?
Half caring? Care for cures but not for life? But then, A cure for some ailment might have YOU live longer, or better, so do it at all cost.
If you place no value on a child being born, Why in the world should we care about your health? You have value? How do you figure? If you give no one else value, Why should we assume you have some?
I believe that is called a Double standard. One for ME, and one for THEM.
Ken
And the stopping of the killing of the unborn will not happen, It can be slowed. And that is worth some effort.
But what is the strange differerce between that five minutes? Why is the Child in the Nursery so precious, and the one just exiting the womb not? This is what the thread was about. Does cutting the cord and issuing a Birth Certificate, increases the Value?
If a Child being born has no value, Neither does an abortion Doctor. For life itself has no value.
Why search for a missing Child if they had no value the moment before Birth? Why care for anything?
Half caring? Care for cures but not for life? But then, A cure for some ailment might have YOU live longer, or better, so do it at all cost.
If you place no value on a child being born, Why in the world should we care about your health? You have value? How do you figure? If you give no one else value, Why should we assume you have some?
I believe that is called a Double standard. One for ME, and one for THEM.
Ken
What you seem to be referring to is a seldom done procedure and not done just for the parents "convienece". Abortions are normally performed in the first trimester when the "baby" (your word not mine) is little more than a collection of cells and beginning of physiological systems. I do not intend to argue abortion with you, the truly biased (for whatever reason) seldom see the truth, so you can gleefully chorkle about a cold blooded murder and giggle about how the doctor is burning in hell. Me, I just see another "ate up" nut that let an organized religion tell him what to think (either too lazy or too stupid to think on his own), going off and committing mayhem in the name of his god....typical of all theists and even more typical of Christians! 
*rolls her eyes*
So, your saying that if you become a parapalegic... and they have the stem cells to help you walk again... But they came from a fetus that didn't make it. You'd pass it up...
Right...
If I had the chance to sell all my eggs for this I would in a heart beat.
So, your saying that if you become a parapalegic... and they have the stem cells to help you walk again... But they came from a fetus that didn't make it. You'd pass it up...
Right...
If I had the chance to sell all my eggs for this I would in a heart beat.
QUOTE(Ken1Burton @ Jan 2 2005, 08:18 PM)
If a person were to walk into a Hospital Nursery and kill a newborn, The World would Scream. If they then started hacking off body parts of the infant. No Jury I know of would show them any mercy, If the state they did it in has the death penalty, What do you think their chances are of not getting it?
Five minutes earlier in the Labor room, this was legal, and may be again. Where are the Screams? Not from the Infant, they cover the baby's mouth with their hand before they poke a pair of sissors in the back of their neck and cut the Spinal cord.
I assume when the man who was executed for killing the abortion doctor got to heaven, The Doctor he killed was the first to greet him, and THANK HIM.
Ken
PS. Stem cells can also be harvested from the umbilical cord. Without killing a child, But you do not get as many. TOO BAD.
[right][snapback]433344[/snapback][/right]
Five minutes earlier in the Labor room, this was legal, and may be again. Where are the Screams? Not from the Infant, they cover the baby's mouth with their hand before they poke a pair of sissors in the back of their neck and cut the Spinal cord.
I assume when the man who was executed for killing the abortion doctor got to heaven, The Doctor he killed was the first to greet him, and THANK HIM.
Ken
PS. Stem cells can also be harvested from the umbilical cord. Without killing a child, But you do not get as many. TOO BAD.
[right][snapback]433344[/snapback][/right]
And I was just talking about stem cell research. No one seems to find anything wrong with this. I find it disgusting and a true atrocity to human nature. They also want to create humans with no heads and use them soley for transplants.
And yes, they should stick to umbillical cords, leave the unborn alone.
QUOTE(Jesus_Freak @ Jan 2 2005, 08:46 PM)
yeah... and? There's nothing we can do to stop people from killing babies. We'll never agree when a fetus gets a soul, and we'll never agree what's right and what's wrong. It's all about getting as much as you can, as fast as you can, by any means necesarry. They haven't gotten one cure for anything in the 20 some odd years they've been researching stem cells from fetuses. They've found tons of cures using adult stem cells though.
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Fetuses HAVE SOULS. How much of the Bible do you actually read??? Then again, maybe it's not in any part you have yet.
QUOTE(aquatus1 @ Jan 3 2005, 04:40 AM)
I take it you believe that a fetus in the late second trimester is the equivalent of a newborn, then? Or do you understand what the biological differences are between a full-term and a late term abortion? To say nothing of the legal ones?
Five minutes indeed.
Of course you do. After all, you know exactly what God wants for all of us, and its beyond crystal clear who He wants to live and die. Yours is, can only be, the only global morality, and must be applied to everyone, regardless of their personal feelings on the matter (it's really for their own good anyways, isn't it?). I'm absolutely sure that everyone ever killed by a person who believed with all their heart that they were doing God's work was absolutely justified in doing so. And even more sure that the people murdered were ever so grateful that their assassin cared enough to put a bullet into their skull.
[right][snapback]433982[/snapback][/right]
Five minutes indeed.
QUOTE
I assume when the man who was executed for killing the abortion doctor got to heaven, The Doctor he killed was the first to greet him, and THANK HIM.
Of course you do. After all, you know exactly what God wants for all of us, and its beyond crystal clear who He wants to live and die. Yours is, can only be, the only global morality, and must be applied to everyone, regardless of their personal feelings on the matter (it's really for their own good anyways, isn't it?). I'm absolutely sure that everyone ever killed by a person who believed with all their heart that they were doing God's work was absolutely justified in doing so. And even more sure that the people murdered were ever so grateful that their assassin cared enough to put a bullet into their skull.
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I'm sorry but have you heard of PREMATURE BABIES???
QUOTE(HolyDevil2053 @ Jan 3 2005, 05:00 AM)
My theory is that with all the research...they actually HAVE cures for the major diseases...even AIDS....
BUT the only reason why they haven't been released to the public is because the government and whoever else is involved makes tons more money on the medication for these diseases than for the actual curing of it.
Imagine, HIV always after some period of time adapts to the medication that keeps it dormant...hence the change of medication after a year or two...yet the cost of the medication is easily reaching $100 per bottle, with several medications necessary several time per day, refills, doctors appointments, etc., ...you do the math.
Imagine- these same scientists doing all these tests with stem cell research for so long ( BTW I totally disagree with using fetus for this, regardless if it is aware of itself, feels pain, has a soul- it is still wrong) and no breakthroughs??? GIVE ME A BREAK...
They have cures, they just have a disease themself...called greed.
[right][snapback]434011[/snapback][/right]
BUT the only reason why they haven't been released to the public is because the government and whoever else is involved makes tons more money on the medication for these diseases than for the actual curing of it.
Imagine, HIV always after some period of time adapts to the medication that keeps it dormant...hence the change of medication after a year or two...yet the cost of the medication is easily reaching $100 per bottle, with several medications necessary several time per day, refills, doctors appointments, etc., ...you do the math.
Imagine- these same scientists doing all these tests with stem cell research for so long ( BTW I totally disagree with using fetus for this, regardless if it is aware of itself, feels pain, has a soul- it is still wrong) and no breakthroughs??? GIVE ME A BREAK...
They have cures, they just have a disease themself...called greed.
[right][snapback]434011[/snapback][/right]
You're right, they have cures, and they make a fortune out of not releasing them. My mother was working in a mdeical centre when I was little (mid 80's) they KNEW then how lethal and contagious AIDs was but they would refuse to sterilize acupuncture needles, etc. They knew it could be spread through all mucous membranes, and they did NOTHING. The cure for AIDs lies in the first people who contracted it in Africa. They have the cure (and my ex-bf, was WAS an african who had LIVED in Africa up until his 20's even knew this), they just don't want to hand it out. They also know that Chemotherapy KILLS you faster that cancer itself, and now, a some guy has found that radio therepay DOES actually work, but ifyou've already have chemo, it's unlikely to have any affect, because chemo kills GOOD AND BAD CELLS.
QUOTE(Ken1Burton @ Jan 3 2005, 10:24 PM)
Many, Many unborn are lost before birth. But that is outside most of our control. It is part of the system built into mankind.
And the stopping of the killing of the unborn will not happen, It can be slowed. And that is worth some effort.
But what is the strange differerce between that five minutes? Why is the Child in the Nursery so precious, and the one just exiting the womb not? This is what the thread was about. Does cutting the cord and issuing a Birth Certificate, increases the Value?
If a Child being born has no value, Neither does an abortion Doctor. For life itself has no value.
Why search for a missing Child if they had no value the moment before Birth? Why care for anything?
Half caring? Care for cures but not for life? But then, A cure for some ailment might have YOU live longer, or better, so do it at all cost.
If you place no value on a child being born, Why in the world should we care about your health? You have value? How do you figure? If you give no one else value, Why should we assume you have some?
I believe that is called a Double standard. One for ME, and one for THEM.
Ken
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And the stopping of the killing of the unborn will not happen, It can be slowed. And that is worth some effort.
But what is the strange differerce between that five minutes? Why is the Child in the Nursery so precious, and the one just exiting the womb not? This is what the thread was about. Does cutting the cord and issuing a Birth Certificate, increases the Value?
If a Child being born has no value, Neither does an abortion Doctor. For life itself has no value.
Why search for a missing Child if they had no value the moment before Birth? Why care for anything?
Half caring? Care for cures but not for life? But then, A cure for some ailment might have YOU live longer, or better, so do it at all cost.
If you place no value on a child being born, Why in the world should we care about your health? You have value? How do you figure? If you give no one else value, Why should we assume you have some?
I believe that is called a Double standard. One for ME, and one for THEM.
Ken
[right][snapback]434879[/snapback][/right]
Yeah, well, it's called greed. Money in 'cures', and a sick one at that. If they cared about or had ANY respect for life at all, they wouldn't be killing to find 'cures'.
QUOTE(SilverCougar @ Jan 3 2005, 11:22 PM)
*rolls her eyes*
So, your saying that if you become a parapalegic... and they have the stem cells to help you walk again... But they came from a fetus that didn't make it. You'd pass it up...
Right...
If I had the chance to sell all my eggs for this I would in a heart beat.
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So, your saying that if you become a parapalegic... and they have the stem cells to help you walk again... But they came from a fetus that didn't make it. You'd pass it up...
Right...
If I had the chance to sell all my eggs for this I would in a heart beat.
[right][snapback]434959[/snapback][/right]
You could live with yourself knowing that you gave your own would be children away to be chopped to pieces or born without heads for transplants? Funny, most people can't live with themselves after giving a child away for adoption, it plays on their mind every day, and apparently even people who have abortions ALSO, one day in their lives feel remorse for killing their own flesh and blood, especially after they actually have a child.
I can.. concidering I let nature flush the little buggers out of my body monthly.
If giving them to science is quicker to get ride of them, then I'm all for it.
And being adopted myself.. *shrugs* If I ever become clinicaly insane to have a child, I'll adopt. Why bring a child into this crazy world when I can just adopt one that's already here and needs a home. My parents did that for me and my brother...
But I highly doubt I'd ever become that crazy to get a child. Just not for me.
If giving them to science is quicker to get ride of them, then I'm all for it.
And being adopted myself.. *shrugs* If I ever become clinicaly insane to have a child, I'll adopt. Why bring a child into this crazy world when I can just adopt one that's already here and needs a home. My parents did that for me and my brother...
But I highly doubt I'd ever become that crazy to get a child. Just not for me.
My mother was adopted, she was left orphaned at the age of 7. And I'm not going to tell you whether I was or not because it's none of your damn business, so, what's your point?
I have nothing against adoption, I've thought about adopting myself (later on in life though), but what's that got to do with killing your own children? You're talking about eggs. I'm talking about turning those eggs into babies for science. It's not the same, and if you'd do it, well, all I can say is it's on your conscience.
I have nothing against adoption, I've thought about adopting myself (later on in life though), but what's that got to do with killing your own children? You're talking about eggs. I'm talking about turning those eggs into babies for science. It's not the same, and if you'd do it, well, all I can say is it's on your conscience.
YOU brought up the adoption stuff! Cripes... don't go off on me for touching apon something you braught up in the first place! I was telling you my stance on it... sheesh...
And their not going to be making eggs into babies any time soon... they can just take the cells out of the eggs. THey're not my "children" they are my unfertilized eggs.. They mean nothing but a monthly nusence to me. Shall I say this again? I have *NO* intention of having any children! None, zip, nadda... No freaking little parasites....
And their not going to be making eggs into babies any time soon... they can just take the cells out of the eggs. THey're not my "children" they are my unfertilized eggs.. They mean nothing but a monthly nusence to me. Shall I say this again? I have *NO* intention of having any children! None, zip, nadda... No freaking little parasites....
As this is an incredibly sensitive subject, I would like to remind everyone that each person here is entitled to their own personal opinion on the matter.
Please be respectful of others opinions. Thank You.
Please be respectful of others opinions. Thank You.
Ashley, I think your lack any basic understanding of science.
My advice to you - stay away from debates about it, untill you'll get at least the basics.
You obviously have no idea what stem cells research are all about, you also seem to believe that human awareness\soul\emotions lurk in the body and not in the brain.
Please, I beg you, go and learn something about the subject before you come here and lay those ridiculous claims. It's really embarrassing.
I don't pretend to be an expert, but at least I have some basic knowledge about it.
My advice to you - stay away from debates about it, untill you'll get at least the basics
.You obviously have no idea what stem cells research are all about, you also seem to believe that human awareness\soul\emotions lurk in the body and not in the brain.
Please, I beg you, go and learn something about the subject before you come here and lay those ridiculous claims. It's really embarrassing
.I don't pretend to be an expert, but at least I have some basic knowledge about it.
Yes Ashley... chemo kills everyone! Chemo does no good! No one has ever survived chemo!
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