http://judicial-inc.biz/Madrid_skyscraper.htm INTERESTING INDEED

Trust me. I doubt that building would still be standing if a jet airliner ramed into it.

well didnt they say it was the fire that brought them down? or am i way off base? i thought i heard that.

Yeah but what happened in Madrid is very different to what happened with the WTC. These buildings are designed to survive fires, typical office fires for example. BUT we are talking about aeroplanes that were laden with jet fuel and the heat and the fire from that would of been enough to damage the structure of the buildings. And like any kind of materials no matter how resistant they are they can only with stand so much. There is no conspiracy about what happened that day.

Also, the two buildings were most likely designed diffrently, they look similar. Anyways I dout that building would still be standing if the fire was concentrated in the middle or 2/3rds up.

~Thanato

Yeah, but what happened in madrid happened 911 days after 9/11. Coincidence?

Do you have more on the Israelies at the time of 9/11 I was actually in Isreal and one of my friends father who works in the Egyptian Embassy in Israel told me how Israeli intelligence knew 9/11 was going to happen I doupted him then he said notice how not one Israeli died in 9/11.

I know the Mossad are better then the CIA but, why did they not say anything to U.S. intelligence.

Oops i said my freind worked at the embassy i meant his father worked their

Well I heard that they were designed to withstand attack by planes. Also the fires seemed to have calmed down when the building collapsed.

dmgspycats: Because they weren't the only ones involved and didn't want to risk getting the people responsible for 9-11 caught. 9-11 was Americans attacking Americans. Right -wing Isrealis would now be able to roll over Palestine w/o the pesky UN or the US getting in the way unlike when Clinton was in office trying to promote peace. Policy shift my friend. Telling the proper US authorities would only compromise Isreals new plans for the Palestinian problem. BTW, the UK-USA Echelon alliance new too. That's right...but at the request of NSA lawyers the agencies 9-11 evidence was burned! That was said on CNN within a week after 9-11 by the NSA itself.

Oh no, here we go again!

first of all, coincidence, no, terrorists being able to count past 100, yes

second , the only conspiricy on 9/11/01, would be the Pentagon

Well thats the assumption and you know what they say about assumptions.
The flames may have calmed down but the structural damage from the intense heat and flames was enough for the building to collapse. I think it would be incredibly unrealistic to say that a building would be able to withstand an attack by a plane. As has now been proved.

the WTC was designed to withstand the impact of planes of THE TIME THEY WERE CONSTRUCTED, they were not designed to withstand a hit from a boeing 747

are you talking about how it was really a rocket that hit the pentagon... not an airplane?

uh oh.. can of worms about to be re-opened

ok thats only a difference of 6ft in length and 10ft in width-thats the difference between a 707 and a 767-
******************************
Towers' Design Parameters
Twin Towers' Designers Anticipated Jet Impacts Like September 11th's

According to Hyman Brown, a University of Colorado civil engineering professor and the World Trade Center's construction manager, 1 and 2 World Trade Center were designed to survive an impact and resulting fires from a collision by the largest commercial aircraft at the time, a Boeing 707-340.

heres a relavent quote you are probably unaware of-
********************************************
Frank A. Demartini, on-site construction manager for the World Trade Center, spoke of the resilience of the towers in an interview recorded on January 25, 2001.
The building was designed to have a fully loaded 707 crash into it. That was the largest plane at the time. I believe that the building probably could sustain multiple impacts of jetliners because this structure is like the mosquito netting on your screen door -- this intense grid -- and the jet plane is just a pencil puncturing that screen netting. It really does nothing to the screen netting.

Demartini, who had an office on the 88th floor of the North Tower, has been missing since the 9/11/01 attack
http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/analysis/design.html

um....just 6 ft in length and just 10 ft in width you say, do you know what inertia is? that extra 60 cubic feet will add a lot more inertia to that plane, and more inertia means more fuel, more fuel means more damage

and the fuel to weight ratio is not directly proportional, i dont know the exact numbers, but that extra 60 feet doesnt mean 60 extra gallons of fuel, it may mean 120 or even 240 extra gallons just for that measly 6x10 foot difference that to you should make no difference

have you ever heard the old saying "the straw that broke the camels back" EVERYTHING has its limits, including buildings, what may seem miniscule, like a straw, may be the leading factor to a specific outcome, like breaking a camels back


---



yea that sounds like a solid statement

Doesn't suprise me that israeli intel knew about 9/11, i wouldn't be suprised if they where involved in the attacks, Israel will have a new ally ( The Americans ) fighting in the middle east. Israel intel seems to have there dirty little hand in everything going on in the U.S. Makes me wonder did the Learn any lessons from WW11 regarding oppression ?

I not surprised they knew i wouldn't be surprised if my professor at Cuny NYC was mossad, but I doubt they caused 9/11 if they really wanted an ally they would of warned the U.S. of the attack, why would they conspire with terrorist.

But anyway look at the vidoes of the 9/11 attack those planes completly busted through the buildings walls so they were not able to withstand the attack.

the planes arent rectangles-in fact if you would have payed more attention it clearly stated that the 707s contain more kinetic energy due to the increased top speed

about your last comment- let me put it this way-- who seems more credible to make an educated guess as to the the resiliance of wtc...hmmm...lets see
1-Frank A. Demartini, on-site construction manager for the World Trade Center

or

2-you

ha lol
*********************
about the mousad being involved -sometimes all you have to do is to look an an organizations main mission statement-

Wow....this can of worms will never close on this website.

Let me just put a couple facts out there in what i believe happened on that day.....yes, there are many very suspicious circumstances, why did the buildings come down? weren't they engineered for those kinds of things? how come they came down if the fire was up top, wouldnt that cause it to tip over not collapse? what really hit the pentagon?

all very interesting questions that i dont think we will ever know or even come close to knowing because it will forever be speculation like many conspiracy theories in the past. But! i will say this, to say that an allied government of the US was notified or had prior knowledge of the attack before hand and did not warn the US.....is quite a stretch on the conspiracy radar. i cant imagine someone saying "You know, over 5000 people can possibly die from this thing, but we're not doing a damn thing cause we want to advance our cause." I just think it's highly improbable and highly unlikely.

Fearfulone in responce to what you just posted I'm going to post a quote a great man once said. But it could be applied to what a very dumb man did. "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

Exactly.
The idea of a US "conspiracy" with regards to 911 is absolutely insane.
ANY citizen, official or not, involved in such would agree to murdering thousands and look forward to an automatic death sentence. So, who would participate?
Get real.

It isn't the frist time someone has risked death or jail for their own selfish wants or for some political cause. I think you're the one who needs to get real.

The WTC was not designed to withstand the impact of a fully fueled jet liner, flying at near top speed, period, 707, 747, 767, or 777. They were designed to withstand the impact of a practically unfueled, slow flying, 707 caught in heavy fog.

I kind of remember hearing and seeing on the news of a BIG plane going into the WTC. Not sure if anybody else saw that.

So, the "cause" in this case is SO IMPORTANT that US conspirators would risk everything?!!!!
What is so damn important about "faking" an Al-Qaeda attack which results in the catastrophic loss of human life?

Maybe as an excuse to attack other countries. Maybe they thought that if they focus on the terrorists then it would put them in a good light as people would be glad that they're doing something to bring about peace. Maybe they're just really sick and like making people suffer.
What makes you think that the terrorists who did this would think of the deaths as catastrophic?

I just find it funny to know every Israelian / jews workers in the twin towers that time coincidentally have a mass day off together.

and I find it funny to see explosions in a totally wrong floor than the craft was. You think the the hole boundary the planes would be the one breakign apart not in a play floors away. and coincidentally there are those cutter charges were installed there onmt he walls of the twin towers too.

280 billion in defense contracts to loot from-silversteins 7 billion largest insurance payoff in history,not to mention the money he saved by having the tax payers pay for the demolition cleanup-unfathomable looting of iraq especially from their oil reserves with new pipelines going in where they were previously unwanted-new heavily funded programs to deal with false threats in the homeland-im sorry that is the most ignorant question ever posed concerning the NWO deception-you have surely heard everything i mentioned before its just a good example of how brainwashed the average person is concerning the truth which is ignored like homeless person asking for money-note that i only scratched the surface and anyone with common sense will realise that people will kill for alot less

don't you people think that george w. bush and his administration knew exactly what they were doing when they ordered the 9-1-1- attack?they succeeded admirably in boosting his popularity and of course, organizing the s.s. - whoops- the "homeland security agency"? the sacrifice of the lives of 5000 americans meant nothing to him. just like hitler blowing up the reichstag to blame it on the jews, and nero burning half of rome to blame it on the christians, it will come out in years to come, and he will be revealed as one of the worst dictators the world has known.god bless all of you

G W B Jr is not a dictator he was elected by the people of the United States

herr busch was appointed by the supreme court, not the people-did you forget-by the way, hitler and nero were legitimately placed in THEIR offices.god bless

Do some research into the machines that counted the votes and the people that own the companies that make those machines and come back and say whether you feel he was elected by the people.

Thank you Gideon!! Why is it so hard to believe that the people in power have no concern for the average citzen? Bush is killing thousands of innocent people in Iraq for no reason what so ever besides his greed. The only people who benefited from the 9/11 attacks were all of Bush's friends who own the corporations. Certain people in the american government are the real terrorist. Why do you think they are always claiming something is going to happen but nothing ever does. The best way to control people is through fear.

I agree sanchera1978 I live in NYC but I'm not afraid of terroism but some red neck in now where U.S.A is afraid of Saddam Hussien.

Bush won the election fairly the Liberal New Yorkers will never vote for a conservative and it ain't a surprise that kerry won NYC but if you go to some state out in the middle of no where all you hear is god and neo conservatism

If your so smart and have all the answers, then answer this:
How come Iran, North Korea and other countries who absolutely hate the US have not suggested a US conspiracy with 911???
Oh, I suppose it's all part of the NWO "conspiracy" too.
Anyway, I would like a direct answer, if you even have one.

thank your snowball, sanchera1978 and super pancake for backing me up-i am sincerely touched by your enthusiasm really-no joke god bless:tu:

You guys make me laugh.

You say, in no uncertain terms, that Bush and others are mass-murderer's.
But your statements and so-called "evidence" can't even stand in a court of law in any country on the face of this earth. Even in those countries which hate us!!!
Wow! Go back into your closet and stay there.
I promise that I will feed you through the vents as you twitch in your own insanity.

Padlin calm down those countries you just named have nothing to do with 9/11 it was terroism and I do think the bush administration played on the fear of terroism and religion to get re-elected.

Yeah it's silly to think that Bush caused 9/11 with no proof i want to know how Gideon knows this, I believe Mossad knew it and saved all the Jews who worked in the world trade center I just want to know why they never said anything.

since when were there no jews in the twin towers?where did you get this info?the neonazi party?doesnt anyone notice busch was amazingly in florida when all this happened, after spending the month of august on "vacation"=planning the event? let's not even discuss the imaginary weapons of mass destruction...let's see...saudi arabian-born terrorists, trained in the united states, then a war on "terrorism", including the destruction of a government of a sovereign nation...i admit i am only guessing, but its sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
obvious

Nice. I never said that those countries had anything to do with 911. What I said is that those countries really, REALLY hate the US, and yet those countries have NEVER suggested a US-based 911 conspiracy, and surely they would have taken any opportunity to do blame us. But THEY HAVE NOT !!!!!!!!!!!!!
Seems that the world opinion on that event is Al-Qaeda clear, and with NO US INVOLVEMENT.
Is ANYONE willing to dispute those FACTS??????

GIDEON MAGE this is what I posted on the first page on this thread anyway when the reports of the dead where being sent to each country despite of the number of Jewish and Israeli citizens that work in the Twin Towers Egypt got 5 or more I think but on that list no casualties for Israel.

Oh Ok pallidin, but it seem you edited your post so I can't explain why it looked as if you blamed them for 9/11. But all this thing about the U.S. government is to blame is indeed unsound.

OK, Gideon, you keep insisting that Bush had everything to do with 911.
So, let's put your actions were your mouth is:
Go and arrest the President on your evidence. Or, at the very least, produce a document that outlines your charges and evidence and present it to the court.
There are many "Bush-detractors" that would love to view it.
Oh, be very specific with "evidence"; speculation is not allowed.

pallidin 1. what makes you think that any of those countries care about what we do to ourselves. There are millions of Americans that feel our own government are the terrorist but yet there is nothing that they can really do about it. What proof could those countries provide that americans wouldnt be able to provide. What would they accomplish by saying that USA did it to themselves. When people like you arent willing to open their eyes to the various possibilities. You are 100% positive it was al queda why becuase your loving government told you so. And we all know that our government would never lie to us right. they care deeply for its citzens.

Agreed. It is somewhat sad that there are those whom believe a US "conspiracy" happened on 911.
To be very honest, I worry about those people, as they seem hell-bent on twisting known facts. Even clear, common and reasonable facts are ignored or twisted to suit their opinion.
Even more disturbing is that they do not stop there.
They encourage and promote the destruction of the United States in their rhetoric.

sanchera1978 or Gideon please explain to us how then did the us govt are to blame for 9/11 instead of telling us to open our eye's.

Al Qaeda may have or may have not caused 9/11 but I do know it's a possibility they got us this one time you can't deny the serious flaws in our national security.

I will say this the hype about Al Qaeda is way out of the claims of the administration, if Al Qaeda is this global organized group then how come they never attacked us before or how come we never hear about them, well they been around for decades but are probably the smallest terrorist group out of the middle east.

Well it was a lucky shot and the only shot they will get, but I do want to hear what you got to say about Bush and 9/11.

I read you loud and clear pallidin

Really? Show me here even one country outside of the US that said differently.
That is a challenge... now answer it.

Need to go for now... back in a few hours.