Hi, I don't know what to think I want to believe i what I cant see but how? And what if you cant see it unless you believe in it first? I have been buying all these books on all sorts of mystical magical topics but I still don't know what to think any ideas? truly, sky

Magic is by it's definition something that happens supernaturally, or beyond explanation. I believe there is nothing that exists that has no reason for existing, that's simply impossible. However, whether or not humans ever find out how certain things work in this world is another matter. There will always be phenomenon that cannot be readily explained and it will always be called magic by some.

So in other words, magic phenomenon exists, until we find out what made the magic happen. Then it just becomes fact.

Edit: Be very careful when reading things about magic. Some people call things magic, ignoring scientific facts, others make up phenomenon to call magic.

nindracula, I hope thats right? You sound very keyed in, you know what you are talking about but I feel like there must be something else. There has to be someone somewhere that has seen magic happen. There has to be someone that knows definitivly that its real. I mean the magic herb and spells and charms kind of magic; However, even if this so called person said "yes, I have see it" would I believe them. I want it to be real, I have always wanted something of a nother world to swallow me up. I feel like I was meant for more. I am sure most people feel this way, but why does it absorb so much of my thought, does this happen to everyone? I would be greatful for a response, I woulde like to have a intellegent conversation with an intellegent person on this topic and others. please reply, or e-mail me nataliereed5@aol.com. Truly, Sky.

Well said nindracula. Think about it, (If thoughts alien abductions are real.) Them Aliens tend to speck throught mind and can paralize you throught thought and can calm your fears. They might have tapped into a locked part of their brain in which give them these ablitiys... Humans might be the same way. We have people that can speck to the dead, retrail a murder with there mind without actually being there, we even have a lady that can communicat with animals. I belive the Human mind has a locked area that beyond the limits of what others belive is the extent of the human mind. We just need to find a way to unlock it... of coures, this is just a theory.

Damn right I believe in magic. What planet have you been living on. Haven't you seen Paul Daniels or Ali Bongo ?

Yeah man, you forget Harry Potter

Hi all

Most people that dont believe in magic are justified in there belief, as they are just supposed to believe what someone says, or what some book says. Questioning things is the way human kind is evolving, its people that dont question anything that are holding human kind back with wars and the suppression of others.

I used to wonder this very same question "is magic real?" when I was younger, I believed in the paranormal as I had experiences where I was not able to believe otherwise, it got me thinking that there was a after life, and if there was an after life that it was more credible to me now that there could be a God or divine creator, so I thrust my self into study and a path of questioning. I did not know it at the time, but I was on a journey of self discovery. I was looking for my truth, both for and against the existence of a divine being, after years of personal debate I came to the conclusion that there was most definitely a divine force, one that hid him/her self from us, for a reason I later come to the conclusion was because most humans as a whole are not able to wholeheartedly believe in the overwhelming knowledge that there is more to life than the mundane lives most of us have to live, most cant deal with the idea of there being a creator or God because most end up hateful and big headed, and end up with extremist views, and think that they are right and everyone else is wrong, which normally results in war and violence or suppression and fear, which is what we see all around the world where religion is the law of the land, rather than common sense. So it makes sense to me why God would keep him/her self just out of the reach of humans, because religion can cause people to suppress there selves and others around them, stunting human kinds progress (and gods progress for that matter) but God will still give hints and things to keep us as a whole guessing, or to let us know that he/she is there, giving comfort to those who seek it, and so we dont lose contact with what we all came from, and one day will all return to, these hints and things that keep us guessing are what some people call "paranormal experiences" and some "miracles" and some "magic".

After I was satisfied that god, and acts of god did exist, I had other questions, such as what this thread is about 'Does magic work, and is it real?' so I went and asked people that where wise and experienced when it came to spirituality and all things supernatural where I should start, I asked Christians, pagans and spiritualists, my learning was fascinating, and made a lot of sense, but still was just the word of others, I was not willing to make a judgement on blind faith so I decided to do experiments for my self, with ritual and magical teachings and philosophies, I wont go into what happened as a result of my experimentation into "magic" as I have learnt form past experience that I will be looked upon as a lair or lunatic, but I can a sure anyone reading this that some of the results where nothing short of unbelievable, and where not silly little things that one could say was just a coincidence, or just a natural occurrence, these where in your face obvious things, some frighteningly real that really blew me away.

After I had enough evidence that magic was in fact reality I stopped, not because I think its wrong or "evil" because I know magic or miracles are within all living things, but because I have no use for it, as I believe life (God if you like) gives us everything we need to achieve our goals here on the physical earth, so magic can be to many a lazy route to personal gain, as magic is bending the normal natural laws of nature to change reality as most of us know it.

Anyone that believes in magic or anything blindly, without having any proof of what it is they believe in are harmless in my opinion, but questioning why we believe the things we do is a good way of becoming closer to god (who ever you might call him/her) Its finding answers to questions that our souls are asking, whether its about magic, supernatural things, or questions about god its self. Asking in my opinion is how we learn, god is always more than willing to teach those who want to be taught, we only have to ask.

God and magic should be investigated, because to know the politics and physics if you like about what it is you believe in, is a whole lot more enlightening and exciting than just believing in something just because someone tells you to. So the answer to this question is (yes I do believe in magic) whether it be someone healing someone in a church through the belief in the power of Christ, or someone performing magic by ancient shamanistic ways, or the magic of science healing a sick child through new medical techniques. Magic is the gift of life itself and the gift of what awaits us in the after life.

Magic in any form is souly based on belief and faith, magic and miracles are only workable if you believe in them, dont believe in magic and the truth is (its not real) Believe in magic and the truth is (its real).

If you know the odds of us actually being here in the first place, you should know that life itself is magic. Its a miracle in its self that we have been given the gift of life. I thank god for it every day, even when it gets hard, because I know through hardships I can learn even more about the miracle of physical life.

If magic and the supernatural is such crap, why have people believed in it since the dawn of man? you would think by now if it was all fake and there was nothing to it, it would not have survived for so long. The truth is, some people have experienced things that give them personal proof, and some people have not, so I respect people that believe in magic, and respect people that dont, both opinions are understandable.

All the best
Faeden

i guess by the definition of magic meaning supernatural, then i do believe. calling it magic sounds like a fairytale thing . who says that you can't see the supernatural? i don't think books and stuff are much help with believing. like someone said, i believe because of my religion.

If by "magic" you mean beer, and if by "believe in" you mean drink some... then I'm in!

Who's with me?!?

I never use this word "Magic".
Only if i will say "The magic of David Copperfield"
Well you know this kind of magic is illusion.
About any other things, i have to use different words.
Combining all unexplained things in one single word like magic is a...
we won't get into a point.

Sigh people have such weak defenitions of things. Several excelent defenitions for these words exist the fact the general public is ignorant of them is another matter. To give a brief glossary:
Supernatural: Any action caused or influenced by God or one of his angels(see a dictionary folks this is the original defenition of the word)
Pretenatural: any action caused or influenced by Satan and his demons
Demonic: Relating to or originating from demons
Diabolical: relating to or originating from devils
Satanic: Relating to or originating from Satan
Satanism: The worship of Satan, the worship of a different personification of evil, a black magician who holds themself as god and makes deals with demons for power, or most innacurately a follower of the cult of Anton Lavey
Magic: "The art and science of causing change in conformity with will."

someone said magic beer, maybe not magic but i Heard beer...............

I think it depends what you expect to find when you think “magic” (as in herbs, potions and so on, which I assume you are referring to).
Personally, I don’t think I believe in the ability of someone to change a human into a frog, for example. I do believe in “will power”, which is what most magic uses. It makes you visualize and believe in something you want (as in a new job or a new love). I think it’s called magic since we can’t explain how our own will can cause this to happen.

Hi KevinM

Its such a blessing that you can be there to correct our weak definitions. The ignorant public need such enlightened people such as your self, to tell us where we are all going wrong. The general pubic is ignorant yes, but that is why we have you, so you can tell everyone the truth as you know everything about the paranormal. Keep up the good work O enlightened one, your knowledge of demonology is overwhelming, and I bow to your superiority. Us weak and ignorant general members of the public learning the paranormal would be no where without your guiding hand. Keep up the good work and stay strong, you know all, and can protect us all from the power of Satan, and the demons that try and keep us ignorant about the truth, but with your unbelievable truth and knowledge, Satan is sure to fail

Behold KevinM the demonologist extrodinaire... Hes my new God

All the best
Faeden

si! viva las brujas!!!!

I wonder if you can insert Powerpoint files in here so i could show my own magic.


Long live the witches !!! oh..oh.. hope i'm right.

Of Course i beleive im magic
and yes it's real

To me when I hear the word magic, I think of a magician performing a show with special tricks. There's certainly nothing paranormal about that. I don't think magic is a good word to associate with the paranormal because it might confuse some people with what is real and is just a trick. Things that happen paranormaly cannot be explained all the way. However, "magic" can be explained with some procedure and mind trick effects.

I believe in magic.

Hi Nightycat



True, but then so can all of the paranormal. Rabbit out of a hat magic, has nothing to do with spiritual magic. Stage magic are illusions, spiritual magic is using nature, supernatural forces and our own will or consciousness to cause change.

All the best
Faeden

¿Por qué usted está hablando en español sobre algo que no tiene nada hacer con el asunto?

I am wiccan ofcourse i do

Surely being wiccan isn't a reason to believe in magic, rather believing in magic is a reason to be wiccan ?

Thanks everyone for your replies, I found cptblackbeards esspecialy intriging. I think that this disscussion actually helped me. I do believe in magic and when I say "magic" I think we all know what I am talking about. I am definitly Wiccan but I dont follow blindly I need to be sure about things I need to keep asking who, what, where, when, and why. I feel somthing inside of me is trying to get out and it is of the spirtual nature. And I do believe as I always have but like every other human I am a social creature and sometimes I need to hear what other humans think? So, thanks again for all your help, I also would be interested in hearing from other Wiccans as it is I currently dont know any so please e-mail me at nataliereed5@aol.com I live in NYC so it would be great to hear from a coven in my area. Thanks again!

BLESSED BE,

LOVE SKY

yeah, i believe in magic.. but i believe it should be practiced responsibily.

i do

If you're speaking of magic in the sense of spells and charms then I would say no, I don't believe in it. Simply for this reason. People I have talked to who claim to be able to use "Magic" describe it as using spells or rituals to focus thier willpower to make something happen..
I'm with it to; the human mind properly focused can be harnessed to do great things, as we all know. At least in regards to a persons physical body. After that the argument derails for me..
Claiming to effect things outside your own self and effect deep changes in the environment(making it rain and such) calls for a molecular manipulation of huge proportions. Since humans still don't seem to be able to spin a little paper wheel on a pin reliably using mind power yet tells me these claims might just be a little grandiose, or perhaps rooted in wishful thinking..

QUOTE

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Arthuc C Clarke

Depends on how you define it I suppose , is magic a phenomenon that acts outiside of or contrary to accepted science ?

In which case if its later learned that said accepted science was wrong, does that mean it never WAS magic ?

Perhaps magic is only a way of perceiving things ?

Here's one Dictionary definition

The art that purports to control or forecast natural events, effects, or forces by invoking the supernatural.

We can seed clouds to make it rain, and we can forecast the weather.. is that magic ?

Personally I believe magic is just something we havent found a lable for, this doesnt diminish it any way imo, its just something we don't understand . . . yet

KevinM you forgot to include the rest of the definitions in the dictionary:
Supernatural: 1. pertaining to or being above or beyond what is natural or explainable by natural law. 2. pertaining to or attributed to God or a deity. 3. of a superlative degree; preternatural. 4. pertaining to or attributed to ghosts, goblins, or other unearthly beings; eerie; occult. 5. a being, object occurrence, etc., considered as supernatural or of supernatural origin. 6. the supernatural, a. supernatural beings, behavior and occurences collectively. b. supernatural forces and the supernatural plane of existence.
Preternatural: 1. existing or occurring out of the ordinary course of nature; exceptional or abnormal; extraordinary: preternatural powers. 2. being outside of nature; supernatural.
Demonic: 1. inspired by or as if by a demon, indwelling spirit, or genius. 2. demoniac.
Diabolic: 1. devilish; fiendish; outrageously wicked: a diabolic plot. 2. pertaining to or actuated by a devil.
Satanic: 1. of Satan or Satanism. 2. characteristic of or befitting Satan; extremely evil or wicked; fiendish; diabolical.
Satanism: 1. the worship of Satan or the powers of evil. 2. a travesty of Christian rites in which Satan is worshiped. 3. diabolical or satanic disposition, behavior, or activity; diabolism; deviltry.
And finally
Magic: 1. the art of producing illusions, as by sleight of hand. 2. the practice of using various techniques, as incantation, to exert control over the supernatural or the forces of nature. 3. a result of such practice. 4. power or influence exerted through this practice. 5. any extraordinary influence or power: the magic of fame 6. done by or employed in magic: a magic trick. 7. mysteriously enchanting, skillful, or effective (witchcraft)

Gee guess some of us ignorant people do have dictionaries and know how to use them. It's a Webster's by the way.

Elspeth

Hi Sky,

As you can see by definition magic can be in many forms from the illusionists to a more serious form. It can cover many things. If it's spells and such that you are interested in just remember that you have to know what you are doing first. Don't dabble, you don't know what may happen.

My belief in "magic" comes from the power of nature, so yes I believe in magic.


Elspeth

I do believe in magic, Only because a wiccan witch gave our family a blessing and we started to hear very strange things, even to seeing shadow like animals prwling around the house. But I only believe, Because I have seen it.

I believe in magic. I practice Wicca, so ski if u ever have any questions just msg me and ill answer them fer yah I think its true, the spells i do work, my cuzin and i practice all the time, not only just spells involving ourselves, but more like spells involving nature. Dunno if this helps u guys here

Afrogirl

Magic can be:
- all but a little trick of... illusion.
- a gift or talent or skills.
- some different religion or cult given by a higher power or spiritual.

I am not buying it, even thought I know that stuff does work on some people, but I rather not to be involved and be a believer to it.

how old are you? i know your young about 14 or 15 would be my guess, why don't you fill me in on your wicca believe's i would love to hear about it

Hey isis-999, yea im 15
ive always been interested in other religions since i was about 11. I was talking ot my mom about this paticular religion, and she said that she went thru it aswell, all my cousins did. "Its more like a phase i guess" thats what she told me, but im really into it. Its not like i changed my religion er anything, and im not planning to. I just like to experiment with others. I believe in God, but the Wicca that i do is not like the common that you hear about. I dont do rituals often, i tried it once, and i 'specially DONT DO BLACK MAGIC. My other cousin is into it aswell, whenever we go up to my grandmas, we go into the woods and pratice. Its more like meditation, healing spells, also spells with nature, just to test the power.
There is also like, i guess a line that goes in my family on my moms side. Every 2nd or 3rd daughter has psychic powers, and im that lucky one Thats one of the other reasons i took up this practice, just to test and work my powers. Alot of my friends ask (close ones ofcourse, i dont just spread it round) why i would take it even tho i have this psychic ability, ofcourse my true religion doesnt allow us to believe that. So why not believe and have your own religion, thats wat i think, i have a mix between alot of'em. not just one But if you have any questions, plz dont be shy to Im me, ill tell you anything/ and answer all questions

Afrogirl

my dad is magical he once stopped me from going deaf in one ear

ok so now u got me wondering

I know that street magic isn't real, it's all a trick of the eye and they distract you. But when it comes to magic of healing I partly believe in that.
The thing I've always wondered is what's the difference between magic and magick anybody got answers?

I don't believe in magic. It's all a trick of the eye if you ask me. Also I remember on tv one time there was some man revealing the magic showing how it was all just a trick of the eye. So no I don't believe. But it's cool Ill admit that.

Afrogirl_001 sweetheart there is nothing you can tell me about being a wicca,! wonder how i knew how old you were? look maybe it is you who needs to talk to me, you are to young to pratice wicca with out help from a real witch, with that said, please listen to me, YOU do not know what you are getting into,magic, no matter what you call it's is the work of the devil, now i know alot of people do not believe in the devil, that is there right, and you should respect that, but i can tell you, that you are not a wicca-how do i know a real wiccca would have never looked in a mirror and called out a spirit, we know better, let me re- say that they would know better; young lady you are playing with fire, why don't you PM me, so we can talk.also there is no truth in evey second or three child it does not jump that way you either have psychic power or you do not and if you do then; you should not be playing with magic,i know you are young and there for think you have it all figured out but please if you do not listen to me find a real wicca who still pratice's and let her help you before you let this get to a point were you can not control it all it takes is one spirit to feel your weakness, and you are going to have real trouble! p.s. if that really happen to your couisin the mark's you wrote about them you may already be in trouble, let me guess, strange things are going on around you? and you do not know why, i pry i am wrong!

I saw something like that a while back. But there was one thing i saw once which nearly seemed impossible. There was a man doing all these tricks and one of them was he was spun round on a sword and was pushed right to the bottom, amazing trick I must admit. I know how the one where the chop people in half and stuff like that is done but I'll leave that to you.

no such thing as magic,imo.it's all slide of hand,or somebody taking advantage of a common human flaw.i believe in esp,psychics,and houdini really could escape from anything,but magic!naaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh