Star.... I can show you verses from the Bible that you would not believe.Yes it was.(Thanks again Jenn.)

Also you can look up the Apocrypha, Constantine and the council of Nicea to start with.

PS. King James was the King of England not France.

how can people call the Apocrypha true and not the gospels??? ok, sounds like a good idea.... call the "lost gospels" true and real, and not he gospels themselves... and if yall are right about Nicea and Constantine changing up the bible itself, who's to say that the "lost gospels" werent just made up in the first place??? and why is it that they have just now surfaced???

Where have you seen them (In this thread) called the truth? Read the history of your Religion my friend.I could ask "Who's to say that the whole Bible isn't made up?"They have been here since then, Just ignored maybe.

my friend.... im was just stating that if the apocrypha was true, the gospels in the bible are also true.. and constantine and nicea, ill look that up in a few min... i have a little free time in class today.. and i read some of the apocrypha just now, it is showing that jesus is who he said he was... look this is what i saw
2 For it is written concerning me, that those who have seen me should not believe on me,
that they who have not seen might believe and live.
3 As to that part of your letter, which relates to my giving you a visit, I must inform you,
that I must fulfil all the ends of my mission in this country, and
after that be received up again to him who sent me.
4 But after my ascension I will send one of my disciples, who will cure your disease,
and give life to you, and all that are with you.

So... at what point in your sleep were you near death...?

That is why I quote said that he was the king of France--I think..so there that don't make me wrong. i never said he was for sure the king of france...

But you are taking these verses out of context and using them to discredit... Your case hold no water...


*sigh*
check it



LBD

hi starlitkate

I have to comment on this again as I think some of the mentalities of people here are shocking, disturbing, and bizarre.

I have answered every question on here thrown at me, but not one time has anyone ever answered any of mine, only made up lies, or exaggerations to try and blacken my name. Why dont you people that dislike me show me anywhere where I have said once that I dislike Christians?, I bet you I could show you where I have said many times that I like Christianity, and even said why I do. I challenge anyone of you, to prove that I have said anywhere that I do not like Christianity, and please dont use any examples where I have said that I do not like any religious extremism, because I have never lied when I say I do not like any form of extremism, because in my opinion religious extremism is the new evil inflicted on this world.

Why do I feel the need to try and explain things to you, as if I am talking to a child ? why is it you dont understand about my English? OK here we go.........




Just because I dont believe in the bible, doesn’t mean I dont believe in god.

Please note the red text it said that idea of god I dont think you need to be a rocket scientist to work out that the (that idea of god) means that I do not believe in (that idea of god) being I do not believe in the idea of god being someone or something that sends human souls into hell to burn for getting "his" name wrong. Does that idea of god mean I do not believe in god I DO BELIEVE IN GOD My belief is I believe in god more strongly than someone that believes god is evil and cruel, because I am not slandering his/hers name as a homicidal maniac.

I do not contradict my self in my beliefs, because I have studied them greatly, to make sure there are no contradictions, and I challenge anyone to prove to me, where I have contradicted anything. I have never hated anyone on here, as I have said before, members on here are just strangers, and I am not that sad that I can get angry at complete strangers. I would like to remind people as some seem to forget this is only a Internet forum.

Instead of try and blacken my name by telling lies and half truths, I challenge anyone that dislikes me to prove to me, or everyone reading this that I have contradicted my self, or where I have said I hated anyone or anything (with the exception of religious extremism) which I find bizarre that anyone can support in the first place.

Come on people out wit me, I dare you. So far all people have done is made accusations they cant back up, and I have backed up all the accusations that where falsely made against me.

I have been honest through out my time here, and never lied, that can not be said for the ones that have decided to gang up against me, and tell lies about me, but I stand uninjured and challenging more attacks, the power I have over anyone that wishes to attack me is strong, because I have the courage to ask uncomfortable questions, I do it honestly, knowing I can back my self up, but people attacking me dishonestly gives them no power, I laugh, because that just strengthens the point I was trying to make.

To say I hate Christians is silly half my friends and family are Christians.

Yes lightbeyondthedark we do understand each other, and I hope and pray that there can be more Christians around like you.


All the best
Faeden

im not sure if i had anything to do with it, but Faeden, i can say that u have never shown anything but love and respect for myself, christians, and everyone else in that matter.

Thank you LoVer_Of_GoD. It was not directed at you no, it was directed at the attacks personally. I was asking that if people are going to attack me, then use evidence against me that is factual, or at least stands up.

all the best
Faeden

Faeden is a most respectable man... I have nothing but respect for him...

LBD

as can i LBD.. i know that we can get into heated discussions and may get a little purturbed with each other, but he is a very respectable and respectful person... and has on many occasions said that he likes christianity

Faeden, In most of your posts you are fair and polite, and I respect you for that.

"God created you just to send you to hell"

I must ask again, why would you even start a thread with that statement if not to enflame those that do believe in the biblical version of hell. And if that was not your purpose why are you suprized that some of us would not be offended. You statement is not "I think" or "I believe" it is written in the context as if it is a fact and us christians are to stupid to see your truth. You say you are not attacking christians for say, only their God. And you are suprized by the reaction you get, come now you are smarter than that.
No one is trying to blacken your name. But when you make a blanket statement like that expect to be called on the carpet for it. We all have to take one on the chin once in a while, I am guilty of being a zealot once in a while and some issues I can even seem fanatical.
But I state it is "what I believe" or "what I think" or even "perhaps"
Understand that a persons belief system right or wrong is a very personal thing. And matters close to the heart are defended with zeal.
All The Best
Irish

The problem Faeden is you seem to label the vast majority of christians with strong beliefs as extremists, and you also DO have many veiled insults in your posts towards them. The "Do you consider yourself brianwashed?" was a classic example.

If you REALLY want I can go through your old posts and find examples but my martial arts class starts soon and I need to get some food and get ready...

Hi Irish



I think people have miss interpreted the reason for me making this thread. Maybe I should have put a question mark on the end of the title, as I was asking a question (well many questions actually) I was not attacking Christians. And I was not saying that god creates people for Satan’s fire, I was saying this belief makes god look that way. I was asking questions that I feel should be asked it was a question to extremists rather than to Christians. No one could answer the questions, which was the point I was trying to make. I was aware that I might cause people to be enflamed, but I am just asking valid questions, I personally think the idea of hell for people that get gods name wrong is barbaric, and I am sorry if it offends people, but I do not making apologies for my beliefs, because my beliefs are good, and I have helped many people in my time, with my beliefs, even Christians. I write for an international paranormal news paper, and write for a web site, and get many e mails and letters from people thanking me for my words, as I have helped them find god, or re-find god, many of these people are Christians.

I think maybe people might have misunderstood my intentions, and have jumped to conclusions. Again I have never hated Christianity, anyone that came into my house would think I am a Christian, there are pictures of Jesus and the virgin Mary, and Christian angels all over the place.

People that use the accusation against me, that I am anti Christian, lose even before they post it, because its just so not true.



Yes!! and I have taken a few in my time, but not in this case. People have swung and missed every time, because I have not done anything wrong, only asked a question, one that some felt uncomfortable with, but why would they feel so uncomfortable if they are so comfortable with there own beliefs ? People have only accused me of things on half truths and lies, hoping I would not notice. If anyone swings and chins me and knocks me down, then fair enough, ill take it like a man and get back up with my pride harmed, but I am man enough to move on and forget it, but so far I have not been hit. I have not hit back either in aggression, just moved my head from side to side missing oncoming attacks, because I have been honest through out and have no reason to attack others with dirty blows, because I dont have to, I have my honestly, and clear conscience to back me up.

all the best
Faeden

the thing is richdog, and all u others that are claiming that faeden was being, in easy terms, mean, is that he has never said anything nor stated anything to stir people up.... and the fact that a lot of u are using negativity and throwing things in faedens face only shows how uncomfortable u are about ur beliefs... faeden and i have had many DISCUSSIONS, not arguments, and most had been very heated ones at that, but regardless, faeden and i both understand that we have a shared respect for each others belief, because we cannot fully prove them wrong... and they may not be, just a little different... but throughout the posts faeden has made, there is no evidence proving that faeden has ever been anything less than respectful to all of us.

Thank you again LoVer_Of_GoD, and yes you have to question why questions that I ask would enflame people so much, maybe they should evaluate there own beliefs? The strong content Christians here never became angry at my questions.

all the best
Faeden

honestly, ive never been angered, just aggrivated and it is very weird how angry these others are getting....

maybe they do need to reflect on themselves.

Yes richdog I dare you to look through my old posts, and find where I have said that "I hate or dislike Christianity" I am making a direct challenge from me to you personally here. And please do not use examples of where I said I disagreed with extremism, because I do not deny that, and please quote the whole of what I said, and dont brake up little pieces of my whole statements I made, so you can make what I said something it is not. Quote all that comes with my statements. Good luck and may the force be with you.

all the best
Faeden

yes, padawan warrior, please enlighten us both u should.. lies u are talking... rediculous statements u make.. the truth u shall speak..

I am glad that you realize that wording can be taken the wrong way. I have made the mistake myself. I am president of a national multi million dollar service club. And the media have a hay day when I make that kind of mistake. I could spend the rest of my term defending myself and lose focus of my original goals. Or I can apologize and say that is not what I meant to say and continue on.

As for answering your question I feel I was blunt and direct in my answer that If you believe that God brought you into existence than He has the almighty right to take you out of it. I know not too many people want to hear that answer because it is cold.

There are many incidents in the bible were I think God was cruel and unjust from my perspective. But I do not try to recreate Him into the God I would like to see. I have to except the fact that He see's a bigger picture than I.
I believe our time on this earth is but an hour of our total existence, and we can not comprehend what our existence will be in a day.

I am not sure I want to believe in the existence of a fire and brimstone hell but being eternally separated from my creator and loved ones, to me would be far worse than having a my ass fried in molten lava. But that just my opinion.

All The Best
Irish.

im seriously a star wars nerd... hahahahaha i love yoda hes a pimp...

Hi Irish

I do not make god into what I want god to be, I have looked into the idea of a fiery hell being true, and god being wrathful with an open mind, and found to me personally that it to be a contradiction, and I do not believe god is like that. That is my belief, and always will be, because I think god is unconditional love.

I believe in a dark side, where the evil naturally go to, I do not believe god sends evil man there, and how long a man or women will stay in that dark side is up to the person there, as they still have perfect free will, if they change the nature of them selves, then they will be in a place that naturally suits there nature.

God will never be a cruel dictator in my eyes, we dictate our selves, I do not disbelieve in a fiery hell because it scares me, I do not believe it simply because I have debated within my self if this could be possible, and in my opinion its just a ridiculous and extreme idea to control people with fear.

Also I have edited my original post with a statement.

All the best
Faeden

I am a prime example...

LBD

Yes and I salute you for that, your a good guy, and its good to see Christians practising what they preach.

I think the main reason people became so aggressive towards me, is because they could not answer my questions, which made them frustrated, so it turns out the people that became angry where the ones I was directing my questions at all along (Irony is my friend) the ones that acted with anger here are the ones that answered my question in a round about way, and I thank them for that, even though they have kind of shot them selves in the foot (ouch).

all the best
Faeden

Ok, I'll make one post before I go back to sleep to answer Richdog lol.

Some people believe Heaven is big white fluffy cloud. The Heavens have always been in space (even I didn't know that until revently), and why the stars have been referred to, as angels. Not in an alien-nation sense, somehing bigger than that. God doesn't need a spaceship LOL. But it all depends on what people believe I guess.

1. The human Heaven is on the 3rd level. It's paradise, everything Eden was. There's a tower there, surrounded by milk, honey, wine, and oil, on each of the four sides of it. There are angels there, but they are the ones designated to that level usually. I've never actually seen the 3rd Heaven though, dream or otherwise, this is just coming from texts. I saw from the 8th-10th in a dream. Once as a 7 year old, once a few years back in Feb 2002. I've gone through the descriptions of it in 'The 10th Heaven' on here. The symbols on my sig, are the angelic script I saw there, one, relating to a constellation. The Zodiac belt (8th Heaven), and the houses of the Zodaic (9th) are the 'Firmanent of Heaven'. God's throne, on the 10th, is beyond that, in all that is beyond it. The 10th is the greatest.

2. Well, there's no gravity, don't know about gaining powers, but you know there what you don't know here.

3. No humans don't turn into angels. Angels are a separate creation. Only twice has this happened that I know of. Two angels which sit next to God, Enoch became Metatron and Elijah became Sandalphon. Though, it's said they were those angels before they were human to begin with. Angels in Heaven have jobs, a different role to humans. Man goes through all the tests on Earth, so when an angel needs to be tested (yes, God does tests His angels) He does it directly. It's when they don't pass these tests that alot become 'fallen angels'. Prior to the 'war in Heaven' in Revelation, it was satan, the prince of accusing angels who could test his own kind, many angels fell on that account, so, a war, they threw him out, and sent him to Earth solely to judge humanity. Now God tests His own angels. It was a war between angels, and the difference between angel wars and man's wars is that when they fight, someone gets 'cast out', when man fights, someone gets killed, the former being a fate worse than death for most angels.



Stellar, that wasn't the Near Death Experience. I already said that. This all startede happening after.

Contradiction. Which statement is true?

And I state again: This 'Book of Enoch' sounds like a great read. Where can I find a copy?

Hi Faeden first off I don't ever recall you saying that you hated christians. I don't ever recall me saying you did. But I do recall you saying you loved christians even though you don't accept all they're beleifs. And that is fine but we got off on wrong foot cuz you personally attacked me and hurt me. Obvisouly lover of God didn't read that post or she would had seen that. Also, reason you are being brought down on this is cause you say you love christians yet you attack God and change alot of Christians perception of him to your beleifs and you're saying this is how is really is. Well we all have our beleifs. But if you interacting one perception with another one, then we'll be just fine Faeden!

Hi JMPD1



Book online

the book of enoch

You can also buy it from amazon.

all the best
Faeden

No I did not, you just assumed I was talking about you, and you got all over dramatic about it, without thinking, I have seen you assume that a lot of people are attacking you on here, even when they where trying to stick up for you.

Think before you comment Kate, your do your self a huge favour believe me.

All the best
Faeden

Can you describe your NDE then?

I guess you missed the bit where she said she thought they were angels before they were human huh?

And Faeden, I never said you hated christianity, seems like you also have selective reading at times. I said you seem to throw the term "extremist" around quite liberally. But after just coming home from 2 hours of Thai Boxing I am too tired to type let alone anything else...

Nighty night everyone, and thanks Ashley for the explanation I find your beliefs interesting.

Your right richdog, I do use the word extremist a lot, but I want to expose them for who they are.

I do not wish to offend anyone. I just want to ask people questions, so I can try and better understand why people have these beliefs.

all the best
Faeden

No Faeden, I have facts. You in other words need to stop beating around the bush. And do yourself a huge favor and stop siding with everyone that agrees with you and stop dissing others that don't...
LOOK BELOW EVERYONE!!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi sprinkles

Please ignore starlitkate monstrous post, I am sorry if you know anyone that has lost there life due to suicide, some people just dont have compassion or a heart. I think starlitkate post is enough for you to know that what she says is barbaric and a travesty against God, her lack of sensitivity is enough for anyone to realise that anyone that thinks like that doesn’t know a thing about the nature of the after life.

Again if you have lost someone due to suicide, I am extremely sorry for some peoples cold and cruel hearts. Most of these people bend and twist the words of the bible to meet there own fearful ends and needs, they feel the need to bring the same fear and hate upon people that they have brought upon them selves. None of them have actually studied the after life rationally as I have, and I can a sure you that suicides do not go to hell, god is not heartless and cruel, I promise you.

Some people are so brainwashed and crippled with fear, that they are blinded to the harm and hate they do to others, so please forgive them, some people are just so thoughtless.

starlitkate did you ever stop to think that there might be people on here that might have lost loved ones because of suicide? And that you telling them that they are burning in hell for all eternity might be a little barbaric? Maybe you want to check your self before you go condemning and judging others. I think you might be scared about what you might find. You cant hide behind the bible forever you know. -Stating that someone is gonna go to hell from stating you beleive people go to hell for suicide is two different readings of perception. when I said what I said then it wasn't stating that others beleive oppostire aren't right. I just stated what i beleived. You read wrong!!think first

All the best
Faeden
----------
People like starlitkate seriously make me feel ashamed to call my self a human being. And again I apologise to anyone that might have lost a loved one in this manner. What angers me the most is I love Christianity and people like this are giving Jesus a evil and horrific name. It stops me from ever even considering ever becoming a Christian.----you say you love christians, but you don't accept every christian beleifs especially considering you speak on love so much, i don't think so.!!
------------
I agree with you, where has turning the other cheek gone? Jesus taught it for a good reason, but people cant see past there anger, anger which they might well be entitled to as anger is a natural emotion that humans can not escape from, but the real test is how we deal with that anger. Many are failing, hence the current state of the world
All the best
Faeden----ya did you turn the other cheek and turn your cheek against your angers and disbeleifs about my beleifs? nope so maybe you should be the one that needs to think!!
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Are you going to go on about how evil and nasty I am for the rest of your time here-i never said you were evil. you said i was.
------------
your continued anger and hate at me is not healthy.-i was fine till you attacked me at the beggining which started it all.
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I do not mean this in a mean way Kate, but would you say you are brainwashed ?
-did i deserve that for just stating my beleifs. you seem to get mad and defensive when someone disagrees with ya. it wouldn't matter how bad we didn't like each other-if i turned around tommorow and agreed with you on something that involved others bullying you on,then you'd probably call me intelligent for being the only one siding with ya. that's bull-whatever
------------
plus I had emails of you sending pms to another person that you know who I'am talking about calling me mosterous, barbaric, cruel, evil, heartless among many other things. I deleted it cuz it wasn't worth taking up space in my box-but I might be able to get a copy of it if you want to see it. but i'am sure you know what i'am talking about..
so no faeden you aren't innocent. you speak of turning other cheek and speak of love, yet you attack others for they're beleifs and hypocritically beat around the bush. No faeden you need to think first.!! If you had turned the cheek to begin with, we wouldn't have so many disagreements that we have now!!

Oh are we going to start this up?

Ya but aren't you the one that turns the other cheek and beleive in peace and love. Don't add kindle to the fire when you see fit to.

Hi starlitkate

That proved nothing, but I am glad you brought some of my ideas back into view, as its good to expose your beliefs for all to see, your entitled to your beliefs, but I was trying to point out a little sensitivity would not have gone a miss, and that is the reason why the post was closed kate.

I have never been angry Kate, only felt shock by you telling someone that there loved ones had gone to hell, when all they where doing was obviously looking for comfort.

I was attacking your belief, that suicides go to hell, and I stand by that, I was trying to make you see that you should think about peoples feelings, before you go telling people things like that.

I think to tell someone that suicides go to hell, is a horrible belief to have, but you are entitled to it, but cant you at least keep it to your self, as people reading it might have lost people due to suicide here, just out of respect for there feelings?

all the best
Faeden

c'mon people, this is getting really tiresome now, I like reading these threads, but please, we've been through all this once already!

Yes it does prove everything. And your attacks are mostly based on misinterpretations. I never said they're loved ones was going to hell. I said I beleived suiciders go to hell but it also depends. If I said, ya you gonna go to hell. That is another perception. Stating your beleifs and standing by them without accepting other beleifs is one thing, but to state your beleifs and be openly hearted in accepting what others have to say without a personal attack is another thing.
And how does anyone know that they was looking for comfort. As far as I knew this was a religion forum which is open to all discussions. I think the question of hell and suicide is on alot of peoples minds. It could had been a topic so no that was another misinterpretation on your part.
and did i see you attack anyone else that stood up for me for havin a right to my beleifs. no you chose to not turn the cheek and instead chose to misread perception and attack me personally with childish name calling and vulgar words. only heartless one i seen there was you.
did you ever think that was you say can hurt others. of course not, you are supposadely open to everyones opinions and beleifs yet you stand by your beleifs are the true beleifs and them alone..

OK, this has gone on long enough.

Starlitkate......next time you post someone's pm's on here you better make sure you have their permission to do so. Luckily for you Faeden has been reasonable and is not asking for them to be removed.....otherwise warnings would have been issued.

Thread closed.