im just curious
with the knowledge God has, and knowing the effect alcohol has on humans
why would God (or his boy) decide to change water into wine ?
seems there could be more suitable means of showing miracles
Full Version: water into wine
it was for a wedding... they were out of wine, and jesus helped them
Depends on the perspective you look at things. Some think it was Jesus' own wedding, and it would be the groom's responsibility to replenish the wine. Also, his mother coaxes him to do it, so some would say he was honoring his mother.
But another point, alcohol isn't necessarily bad for you, it's how you use it. If it was outright bad for you, I don't think doctors would recommend a glass of wine a day, or would they.....
And supposedly he did find more suitable means for showing miracles. You have heard that he raised the dead and cured the terminally ill?
But this post only applies if Jesus Christ and his miracles really did happen. (Which I personally BELIEVE, not spout off as cold hard fact.)
But another point, alcohol isn't necessarily bad for you, it's how you use it. If it was outright bad for you, I don't think doctors would recommend a glass of wine a day, or would they.....
And supposedly he did find more suitable means for showing miracles. You have heard that he raised the dead and cured the terminally ill?
But this post only applies if Jesus Christ and his miracles really did happen. (Which I personally BELIEVE, not spout off as cold hard fact.)
All things in moderation! Wine is good but to get yourself soused from it is not. Food is good but being a glutton is not.
1Tim5:23 Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.
Here is the story of the actual miracles.
John 2:1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
John 2:2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
John 2:3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
John 2:4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
John 2:5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do [it].
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
John 2:7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
John 2:8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare [it].
John 2:9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
John 2:10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: [but] thou hast kept the good wine until now.
John 2:11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
1Tim5:23 Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.
Here is the story of the actual miracles.
John 2:1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
John 2:2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
John 2:3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
John 2:4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
John 2:5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do [it].
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
John 2:7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
John 2:8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare [it].
John 2:9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
John 2:10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: [but] thou hast kept the good wine until now.
John 2:11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
The bigest question being, to my mind, WHY Mary & Jesus were concerned about replenishing the wine, and instructing the servants.
Were they the caterers?
Were they the caterers?
John 2:1,2,3 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
(They made me keeper of the vineyards; but, my own vineyard I have not kept!)
John 2:4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
(O that you would kiss me with the kisses of your mouth! For your love is better than wine)
John 2:5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do [it].
(I come to my garden, my sister, my bride, I gather my myrrh with my spice, I eat my honeycomb with my honey, I drink my wine with my milk. Eat, O friends, and drink: drink deeply, O lovers!)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
(How fair and pleasant you are, O loved one, delectable maiden! You are stately as a palm tree, and your breasts are like its clusters. I say I will climb the palm tree and lay hold of its branches. Oh, may your breasts be like clusters of the vine, and the scent of your breath like apples, and your kisses like the best wine that goes down smoothly, gliding over lips and teeth.)
John 2:7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
(I am my beloved's, and his desire is for me)
John 2:8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare [it].
(Come, my beloved, let us go forth into the fields, and lodge in the villages; let us go out early to the vineyards, and see whether the vines have budded, whether the grape blossoms have opened and the pomegranates are in bloom. There I will give you my love.)
John 2:9, 10 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom, And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: [but] thou hast kept the good wine until now.
(Solomon had a vineyard at Ba'al-ha'mon; he let out the vineyard to keepers; each one was to bring for its fruit a thousand pieces of silver. My vineyard, my very own, is for myself; you, O Solomon, may have the thousand, and the keepers of the fruit two hundred.)
John 2:11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
(Your Chrism is fragrant, your name is oil poured out; therefore the maidens love you. Draw me after you, let us make haste. The king has brought me into his chambers. We will exult and rejoice in you; we will extol your love more than wine; rightly do they love you.)
(They made me keeper of the vineyards; but, my own vineyard I have not kept!)
John 2:4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
(O that you would kiss me with the kisses of your mouth! For your love is better than wine)
John 2:5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do [it].
(I come to my garden, my sister, my bride, I gather my myrrh with my spice, I eat my honeycomb with my honey, I drink my wine with my milk. Eat, O friends, and drink: drink deeply, O lovers!)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
(How fair and pleasant you are, O loved one, delectable maiden! You are stately as a palm tree, and your breasts are like its clusters. I say I will climb the palm tree and lay hold of its branches. Oh, may your breasts be like clusters of the vine, and the scent of your breath like apples, and your kisses like the best wine that goes down smoothly, gliding over lips and teeth.)
John 2:7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
(I am my beloved's, and his desire is for me)
John 2:8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare [it].
(Come, my beloved, let us go forth into the fields, and lodge in the villages; let us go out early to the vineyards, and see whether the vines have budded, whether the grape blossoms have opened and the pomegranates are in bloom. There I will give you my love.)
John 2:9, 10 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom, And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: [but] thou hast kept the good wine until now.
(Solomon had a vineyard at Ba'al-ha'mon; he let out the vineyard to keepers; each one was to bring for its fruit a thousand pieces of silver. My vineyard, my very own, is for myself; you, O Solomon, may have the thousand, and the keepers of the fruit two hundred.)
John 2:11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
(Your Chrism is fragrant, your name is oil poured out; therefore the maidens love you. Draw me after you, let us make haste. The king has brought me into his chambers. We will exult and rejoice in you; we will extol your love more than wine; rightly do they love you.)
Carfull Loge!
Galatians 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
2 Corinthians 11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him].
Galatians 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
2 Corinthians 11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him].
QUOTE(Irish @ Apr 19 2005, 02:19 PM)
Carfull Loge!
Galatians 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
2 Corinthians 11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him].
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Galatians 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
2 Corinthians 11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him].
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My Webpage
Well, read it for yourself, if you want to know how did Jesus transmute water into wine!
Interesting web site Loge. But I don,t see the connection. Can you explain please?
QUOTE(Irish @ Apr 19 2005, 02:36 PM)
Interesting web site Loge. But I don,t see the connection. Can you explain please?
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And Jesus, when he was baptized (or anointed), went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God (the Chrism) descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
This is why afterwards he said:
“I am the Light of the World” because this Chrism is the solar light!
The Solar Force with its powerful life makes the seed of wheat germinate in order for the stalks to grow from millimetre to millimetre. The Solar light then becomes enclosed within the dark hardness of this grain which is like a precious coffer. The enchanted germ of the sacred stalk has its intimate exponent in the human gametes.
The solar rays which penetrate into the stump of life are developed and unfolded in concealment, until ripened in the sacred and holy fruit of the grapevine. This is an emblem of life that manifests itself with all of its splendour in the Substance.
Husband and wife who know the mysteries of the weddings of cana perceive this Cosmic Substance of the Sun-Christ, which is enclosed in their sexual glands when in the state of sexual ecstasy. The transmutation of water into wine is the way in which they unbind the solar energy from their sexual substance, from within their physical sexual waters of life in order for the "Chrism" to victoriously penetrate within their human organisms.
This Solar Christic force, "Chrism" this igneous light, this secret force, this lovely Chrism, works silently within the psyche of those who love each other within the mysteries of the weddings of cana, inviting always this Chrism to penetrate and illuminate their eternal nuptials. This is how this Chrism of love invite us over and over again to tread the path that must conduct us into Heaven. The mysterious baptism of Jesus and the transmutation of the water into wine is hidden within this lovely Chrism.
And the light shines within the darkness, and the twelve loaves of hallowed bread of the Proposition appeared upon the Altar of our heart. This manifestation alludes to the twelve zodiacal signs or distinct modalities of this Solar Cosmic Substance related with the development of the 12 senses.
Regarding the wine, which is derived from the ripe fruit of the grapevine, it is the symbol of the Fire, of the Blood of Life which has manifested in this Substance.
It is intriguing that even when the words: Vino, Vida, Vid (Wine, Life, Grapevine) have distinct origins, nonetheless, they do not deny having certain symbolic affinities. By no means can be omitted the relationship of Vino (Wine) with Vis "Strength", and Virtus "Moral Strength", as well as with Virgo "Virgin"; who is the mother of the Son of Man that must be lifted up as Moses lifted up the Brazen Serpent in the wilderness.
Actually, whine can be healthy if taken in proper amounts...
Hey Stellar, didn't you declare yourself to be god a while back? See, if you could turn water into alcohol I'd join your religion.
QUOTE
Hey Stellar, didn't you declare yourself to be god a while back? See, if you could turn water into alcohol I'd join your religion.
I can and have.
I can turn beer into water, but cannot change the colour.
I ain't talkin' about bathtub moonshine, neither. Hell, I can make that.
It wasn't only for the wedding. What you think Jesus never had wine? Wine is a tradition every Sabbath for Judaism (and yes, He did practice Judaism). That and, it was th drink of the times. Of course He had wine, Sabbath, Passover, weddings or otherwise.
This goes back to Noah. In Eden, it was Satanail who planted th vine, wich would evtually make wine. After getting off the Ark Noah found this vine which had ben washed up, and wasn't sure if he should replant it or not. An angel said to him he SHOULD, it is used for both good and bad and will one day be used for religous purposes. However, remember that it still has bad in it, and leads to drunkeness, that leads to fornication, murder, etc. This is why, in Judaism, things are done in moderation. You can drink, wine or otherwise, so long as you don't get off your face a and can't walk in a straight line.
This goes back to Noah. In Eden, it was Satanail who planted th vine, wich would evtually make wine. After getting off the Ark Noah found this vine which had ben washed up, and wasn't sure if he should replant it or not. An angel said to him he SHOULD, it is used for both good and bad and will one day be used for religous purposes. However, remember that it still has bad in it, and leads to drunkeness, that leads to fornication, murder, etc. This is why, in Judaism, things are done in moderation. You can drink, wine or otherwise, so long as you don't get off your face a and can't walk in a straight line.
It was mythology created in the 2nd century CE, nothing more! - CD 
QUOTE(Ashley-Star*Child @ Apr 19 2005, 10:31 PM)
It wasn't only for the wedding. What you think Jesus never had wine? Wine is a tradition every Sabbath for Judaism (and yes, He did practice Judaism). That and, it was th drink of the times. Of course He had wine, Sabbath, Passover, weddings or otherwise.
This goes back to Noah. In Eden, it was Satanail who planted th vine, wich would evtually make wine. After getting off the Ark Noah found this vine which had ben washed up, and wasn't sure if he should replant it or not. An angel said to him he SHOULD, it is used for both good and bad and will one day be used for religous purposes. However, remember that it still has bad in it, and leads to drunkeness, that leads to fornication, murder, etc. This is why, in Judaism, things are done in moderation. You can drink, wine or otherwise, so long as you don't get off your face a and can't walk in a straight line.
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This goes back to Noah. In Eden, it was Satanail who planted th vine, wich would evtually make wine. After getting off the Ark Noah found this vine which had ben washed up, and wasn't sure if he should replant it or not. An angel said to him he SHOULD, it is used for both good and bad and will one day be used for religous purposes. However, remember that it still has bad in it, and leads to drunkeness, that leads to fornication, murder, etc. This is why, in Judaism, things are done in moderation. You can drink, wine or otherwise, so long as you don't get off your face a and can't walk in a straight line.
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Too much wine transforms people into S-wine
And when they were come out from the wedding under the influence of the alcohol, they were possessed with devils
, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way. "So the devils besought him, saying, If thou cast us out, suffer us to go away into the herd of swine. so, they went into the herd of swine: and, behold, the whole herd of swine ran violently down a steep place into the sea, and perished in the waters."
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