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schadeaux
Just a thought:

PARADOX

...gotta love 'em...
aerialhippo
dust19,

I see what your talking about I tried to touch on that subject before of altering the past but I couldn't explain it well because I can'explain anything for beans. I agree with that even though the idea of changing the past to make the future better sounds hunky dory but frankly it pretty much isn't possible, something can and pretty much make that happen because at least one person will know that it happened and have witnessed it, meaning it did actually happen.

Topics like this are so beautifully mind- boggling huh.gif
cheesebar101
ok here it is. come to my house. help me make a new flux capactor, and get some plutomnium, re-hook it up to my delorean, and go 88 miles per hour, it works out soo perfect, my delorean would be perfect because just got a new exhaust system, so now its 155hp, instead of the slugish usual 130hp. im siked, what about you? i hope the fuel tank doesnt bust though...like it did when i went to 2015 way back in 85...oh well, whos in?@?@
Magikman
Cheese,

There already is a thread started discussing time travel, so I moved your post there.

MM
Saru
Regarding the viewing of light that left the earth say, 1 million years ago.

What if some 'object' was present 500,000 light years out into space, that was able to reflect that light back towards the earth, or at least some of it. 500,000 years later that light would then arrive back at the earth, and if you viewed it with a telescope, you would be effectively seeing 1 million years into the past without even having to leave the planet.

The chances that you'd be able to make out anything vaguely useful are remote at best, and the chances that something would reflect the earth's light in the exact direction necessary for it to intercept the earth again are probably next to none.

But still, there lies a theoretical means with which to view earth as it was in the distant past without ever having to leave the planet.
Saru
Oops, forgot to answer your questions from earlier:

QUOTE

The question i propose SaRuMan is that when you ar elooking up close at an object in space from far away are you seeing it how it is at that moment or from how it was X years before?


The delay simply depends on how long it has taken for the light from the object to reach you. If you look at a distant object that is 1 light year away, then you are seeing it as it was 1 year ago. If you look at an object that is 3 light minutes away - that is, light has taken 3 minutes to reach you from that object, then you are seeing it as it was 3 minutes ago.

QUOTE

And also, if you are going FASTER than the speed of light and you lookout the window wouldnt you see the light trailing behiund you? That's pretty cool!


Things work a bit differently when your talking about speeds comparable to the speed of light. Time for objects that are moving actually slows down, the greater the speed the more time slows down. If you could actually reach the speed of light, time would in theory stop altogether, and anything in excess would possibly cause time to go backwards.

All theoretical however, nobody has succeeded in getting an object to travel at the speed of light.

QUOTE

I'm seeing my computer monitor as it was in the past, albeit the most infintesimal fraction of a second in the past, and when I hold my hand up to my face, again, I'm not looking at the present, but at the past. Everything I see has already happened. Ok, as close to now as makes not the slightest difference, but nevertheless, all I can see is the past? Is that correct?


That's correct, but as you say the delays in question are miniscule. A tiny fraction of a light-second might be all the time it takes for light to get from your hand to your eyes. In general everyday life the light delay would never be noticeable.
Aslan
Thanks SaRuMaN.

It seems important, but I haven't worked out why. We never have seen, and we never will see the present, but the past we see all the time, and the future we can't see.

The only thing we experience that is truly present is the thoughts in our heads. Like I say, it seems important but I haven't worked out why.
FreyKade
does anyone remember that futurama episode where you find out that fry is his own grandad.....quality episode
Delacorr
I want to say thanks too, SaRuMan...that cleared some things up...
Delacorr
Also, i liked the Paradoxes Sch
Space Moose
QUOTE (Althalus @ Jun 17 2003, 10:30 AM)
An old preist was supposed to have done just that a while ago, he claimed while he was still alive that he had invented a device that allowed him to see the past through a little screen, and take pics, he then claimed that he had taken a picture of christ on the cross.

It turned out to be a picture of jesus on the cross from a church that had been reversed.

By some definitions, he was correct. The picture that he had was an accurate reflection of something from the past. This is true of all photos. It does not mean that he had a machine to look back into the past, unless you consider a photo album a "machine".
Delacorr
Very good point...Photos or videos are all looks at what happened in the past the way it actually was.
nogard
If I was traveling in a spacecraft faster than the speed of light, Then if i look back, i would see myself in a space crafttraveling faster than the speed of light?

And also, I would be in the same suroundings at all times, and the only changes that would occur in my vision, would be those that would be happening in front of me me.


PS If some one posted this already, i am sorry, i didnt have the time to read the whole thread. unsure.gif
nogard
There also is a problem with super-light travel:

to get to light speed, you would have to fly for a long time to accelerate without being squashed into a pancake, so there is kind of no way even if we did have advanced enough technology to get to light speed) to get to light speed, and possibly above, without being squashed. (that was a long sentence. Should of payed more attention in english class)
nogard
If there was a way to view your memories on a screen, would that be qualified as time travel?
Yelekiah
Sound, under certain circumstances, can travel faster than light speed. Just thought I should throw in that recent discovery.
Yelekiah
I think the only way time travel is possible is through a form of space travel or quantum travel. Other than that it is physically impossible because time is invariant.
nogard
i agree
yes.gif
Quantem Singularity
QUOTE(Yelekiah @ Nov 11 2005, 08:44 PM) [snapback]928251[/snapback]

Sound, under certain circumstances, can travel faster than light speed. Just thought I should throw in that recent discovery.



Same thing applies with radio waves, by bending them over and over again we can make radio wvaes travel fatser then the speed of light (Noe: we can do this now) but we would need a machine to resieve them (we are currently building this). If the machine works we will resieve messeges from the furture as soon as it's turned on.

Yelekiah
Haha I said that yesterday. "Now all we need to do is attach atoms"...
Deja vu tongue.gif
Quantem Singularity
and i've siad the smae thing aboot radio waves 5 time in a row.
Yelekiah
No kidding ohmy.gif
Quantem Singularity
Oh and I looked into the sending atoms ans "attachments" and it would be like putting together a 3D 1000000000000000000000 piece puzzle.
Yelekiah
But with a powerful quantum computer, it may be possible...
Quantem Singularity
But theres always the risk of coming out like this







user posted image
Yelekiah
looool
Exactly.
Quantem Singularity
Or you could come out as a piece of extremially dense broccali. A truly horrible fate.
Raptoid
QUOTE(Yelekiah @ Nov 12 2005, 02:45 PM) [snapback]928256[/snapback]

I think the only way time travel is possible is through a form of space travel or quantum travel. Other than that it is physically impossible because time is invariant.

Or, you could've read my post in the other Time Travel thread...

QUOTE(Raptoid @ Nov 9 2005, 05:34 PM) [snapback]923500[/snapback]

Now, people, aren't we forgetting good ol' overkill? wink2.gif

Theory: Time travel could be achieved by reversing the events of the Universe itself, as opposed to sending the traveller back legitimately to another coordinate in the time dimension.

This is done by either producing a 3D "photograph" of the Universe at this point, waiting some time, erasing the current Universe and using the previous Universe's energy to replicate the "photograph" (no suggestions on how to make the photograph, or replicate it, though it would have to be accurate down to the last electron); or initiating a "reversal reaction" to theoretically send every event backwards.
You would exclude yourself from the reversal ofcourse, though you would have to create an identical energy structure to your presence so it could be reversed if you opted for the reversal reaction.

This could be greatly implified (though still a colossal project) if you could limit the reversal to a smaller section of the Universe, say our solar system; though you would have to be careful of the impacts of external influences, or the reversal would be off.
It may also be considered that inaccurate reversal/replication isn't of too significant an impact, depending on your requirements, though you may also cause some particularly disasterous abnormalities if it's more than 0.000000000000000000000000000000000001% (approx.) off.

This is "cheating" - time still has remained the same, or even moved forward as you proceeded with the change. You may've also unaligned the solar system with the timeline of the galaxy and the rest of the Universe, though if it's not too far it won't be too significant (except for a few interstellar asteroids etc, which I would attempt to accurately immitate). This "time reversal" would then be able to develop another sequence completely unique, ofcourse, andif you kept a photograph of the "time" you left, if you've gone this far with your technology you could probably go back, too.

If the process of existence is predetermined (which is a theory I subscribe to), it makes time reversal more possible, though ofcourse, there is a reason why I call these theories "Overkill".

I also theorise that, if computer simulation could be produced both efficient and powerful enough, this sort of thing could be done entirely in computer simulation; photograph of the current Universe taken, time reversed in simulation, data in simulation produced into reality over top of our current reality, whatever.
Hell, for more practical purposes, ie in order to advance technology, we could create a simulation of Earth today, send them forward 1000 years and collect data on their technological progress.
Oh, and a few points:
-Your mere presence say, 60 years ago, would probably wipe you from existence.
-Once you have mastered everything else and are travelling back in time, don't forget that moving to a different coordinate in the 4th dimension would also require adjusted 3D coordinates - otherwise you'll land yourself a linear distance of several trillions of kilometres away from Earth, extended from the line connecting Earth and the Universe's centre.
Real time travel is risky business.
nogard
What if we could use warp-holes for time-travel?
Quantem Singularity
QUOTE(Raptoid @ Nov 12 2005, 11:26 PM) [snapback]929573[/snapback]

Or, you could've read my post in the other Time Travel thread...




That would require so much energy that it would destroy the universe trying to get it.


QUOTE(nogard @ Nov 13 2005, 06:51 PM) [snapback]930605[/snapback]

What if we could use warp-holes for time-travel?




That would just make you travel betwean point A and B, unless you curved it, but again that would require a type 3 civalisation.
Yelekiah
QUOTE(Quantem Singularity @ Nov 13 2005, 10:11 PM) [snapback]930721[/snapback]

That would require so much energy that it would destroy the universe trying to get it.

loooool
I know it wasn't meant to be funny, but it still made me laugh.
Quantem Singularity
I'ts ironic and useless, plus matter cannot be made or destroyed only changed into pure energy so our universe would be nothing while his would be pure light. Not much use woth nothing in it.
Mad Cobra


QUOTE
You can actually travel through time very easily, to see it just get 2 people, both with watches on that are synchronus to each other. one gets on a plane or some other fast moving object, and move for a predetermined distance, at a set speed, then when you compare watches, they will show different times. As the one in the fast moving object will have had time move slower than that of the person on the ground


Question to the above quote:

This achieves to slow time down but does not reverse on its self which is time travel.



(not to scale)

Time slows down <<<<<<<<--------------------------------------------------------------
50min 40min 30min 20min 10min 5min 0min -5min -10min -200min

Speed/Motion-------------------------------------------------------->>>>>>>>>>>
1000mph 2000mph 3000mph 4000mph 5000mph



Quantem Singularity
Yes slows down but does not stop, but when you reach the speed of light...
FADER89
Personally i feel that time travel whether possible or not, should never be used or attempted to be developed.

-If you traveled back in time you would change all of reality in a never-ending change sequence forever changing the future until time is put in an infinite loop repeating itself forever.

For example: say the year is 2285 and the time machine has been invented, if someone were to travel back to NY September 11, 2001 and prevent the terrorist attack, then it would bring about a whole different future, and in 2285 you would have absolutely no reason to go back and time to prevent it. Then you wouldn’t go back in time and the whole event will happen again. Then you would prevent it again. Then you would have no reason to again… etc. Basically all of reality would be stuck in a loop from the second you arrived in 2001 from the future and the time you left in 2285. Even if you didn’t go back to change an event anything you do will bring about a different future not necessarily preventing you from traveling back in time but will change reality until you end up preventing yourself from going putting it into an infinite loop.

-If you travel to the future you also will change times natural sequence, similar to traveling back in time.

For example: say again the year is 2285 and the time machine has been invented, if someone were to travel into the future anything they saw would affect them and bring about a different future for them when they returned, possibly bringing about a different future all-round and what they seen would change again changing what they would have saw. Also if someone where to take materials from the future to the past and the advanced technology studied/developed the person who normally would have developed it in the future wouldn’t have and that would not be available to take into the past, but then it would not be taken and he would develop it again only for the person who traveled into the future to take it again.

All in all I think time travel could mean the end of the world (in the sense we will no longer have a future and we will be stuck in an endless time loop from the time we went to, to the time we first left.)

Let me know if you have any other theories...
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