I believe there is a central vertical channel yet undiscovered in the great pyramid that was used to lift the stones from the level of the Nile river up to position. I've never been to Egypt to see for myself but from all I have found the Pyramid is about a half mile from the Nile today and the base of the pyramid is is about 90 feet above the water level.

If a channel was dug from the center of the construction site of the pyramid to where the subterranean room is then the building stoness could be lifted vertically by means available to the builders. It is obvious they knew how to lift stones up to 100 tons and put them in place so lifting heavy stones was something they knew how to do.

A channel thirty feet wide would have accommodated two way traffic from the Nile to the pyramid for barges capable of carrying the heaviest stones in the pyramid. The excavation of such a channel if in rock, which is a presumption on my part, would have yielded only 10% of the stone necessary to build the pyramid. I can say more on this for anyone interested.

The first question I would have is how did they lift the stones? There is no evidence they knew anything about pulleys, nor can I think of any means to lift something vertically other than by brute strength, which I do not believe could have been carried out safely for the entire amount of time it took to build the pyramid.

interesting theory! never heard that one before!

I think the spaceships moved them.

there might be evidence that pulleys were used in the sense of how we use them, but maybe they used something similar...i figure if they were able to create something like that...the concept of some kind of system to leviate the weight could have been used....
brute strength also could have also been a good possibility as well considering _if i am correct_ all the slaves they had to do their work.

ufo's definitely possible too...
can't deny that considering the fact that the reason why most pyramids were destroyed were to "uncover' space ships...which allegedly were never found...I don't know how true that statement I made is, I just remembersomeone say ing this to me before in a related discussion;.

hi guys.
no insult intended.
please check the info-there are pictures inside some of the pyramids of them building the pyramids.ramps, etc. it is all known.

Do you have any pics of this. or a link?

A million slaves.

The use of slaves and pullys were all used building the pyramids(as have been proven in many programs on tv)i have wondered for years about many of the fasanating features in the great pyramid,who made them ,for what reason and purpose,how did they make them .......there are many thearies out there from many experts but i tend to go on the side of graham hancocks thearies

Check it out HERE this and see what u think

[edit:fixed link]

What about levitating rocks?

The Necronomicon
The Ancient Book of the Dead
And Communication with our Sumerian Ancestors of Earth

This book I believe to be an accurate description of the Spritual Beings, Aliens and Evil Spirits, that our ancient Sumerian Ancestors worshipped and believed in, albeit very strange and lurid, most of the facts are referenced to another more formal site, which I have linked on the fifth part of Necronomicon. Strange Realities........

Written in Ancient Times.....circa 738 A.D., by an Arab who roamed the sacred places....as a nomad....and this is his story.....

This was the book that most influenced Lovecraft and Aleister Crowley, in all thier Majikal Works. This book has been a mystery through the ages, and was kept secret.....for many years. It has influenced many other writers and majikal Adventurers.

The story also puts another light on Our Sumerian Ancestors, as described in the 12th Planet, by Zacheria Sitchen. I will cover a section on this in my other articles. Our Alien Ancestors had some very strange powers indeed. Many of these powers correspond with ley lines, and sigils.....and higher "mind" powers....and Time Travel.


Levitating Rocks

When I was only a youth, traveling alone in the mountains to the East, called MASSHU by the people who live there, I came upon a gray rock carved with three strange symbols. It stood as high as a man, and as wide around as a bull. It was firmly in the ground, and I could not move it. Thinking no more of the carvings, save that they might be the work of a king to mark some Ancient victory over an enemy, I built a fire at its foot to protect me from the from the wolves that wander in that region and went to sleep, for it was night and I was far from my village, being Bet Durrabia.

Bieng about three hours from dawn, in the nineteenth of Shabatu, I was awakened by the howl of a dog, or perhaps a wolf, uncommonly loud and close at hand. The fire had died to its embers, and these red, glowing coals cast a faint, dancing shadow across the stone monument with the three carvings. I began to make haste to build another fire when, at once, the gray rock began to rise slowly into the air, as if it were a dove. I could not move or speak for the fear that seized upon my spine and wrapped cold fingers around my skull. The Dik of Azug-bel-ya was no stranger it seemed to melt into my hands!

Presently, I heard a voice, softly, some distance away and a more practical fear, that the possibility of robbers took hold of me and I rolled behind weeds, trembling. Another voice joined the first, and soon several men in black robes of thieves came together over the place where I was, surrounding the floating rock, of which they did not exhibit in the least fright.

I could see clearly now that the three carvings on the stone monument were glowing, a flame red color, as through the rock were on fire. The figures were murmuring together in prayer or invocation, of which only a few words could be heard, and these in some unknown tongue; though, ANU have mercy on my soul!, these rituals are not unknown to me any longer.


The figures, whose faces I could not see or recognize, began to make wild passes in the air with knives that glinted cold and sharp in the mountain night.

From beneath the floating rock, out of the very ground where it had sat, came rising the tail of a serpent. This serpent was surely larger than any I had ever seen. The thinnest section thereof was fully that of the arms of two men, and as it rose from the earth it was followed by another, although the end of the first was not seen as it seemed to reach down into the very Pit itself.


These were followed by still more, and the ground began to tremble under the pressure of so many of these enormous arms. The chanting of the priests, for I knew them now to be some the servants of some hidden Power, became much louder and nearly hysterical.

This is an interesting theory. It is very likely such a channel actually existed, since ancient sources, including Erodotus, speak of such a channel connecting the alleged burial chambers of Khufu to the Nile (according to Erodotus, the sarcophagus lied on a island within the pyramid sorrounded by the water of the Nile. Actually, this might be the description of the osireion of Ghizah, in which Osiris' coffin (cenotaph) is sorrounded by water. However, pyramids were much closer to the Nile in anciet times, since a huge ramp connected the pyramid temple with the Nile.
This however doesn't solve the mystery connected to pyramid building, but only the transportation of stones. One major problem is however the absence of stones in the Nile river. if they were carried on boats, it's very unlikely no boat could have sunk or stones fallen, although no stones pertaining to the pyramid have ever been found in the Nile.

http://lexicorient.com/e.o/pyramids.htm

i think you'll find that graham hancock is a journalist not an egyptologist
he doesn't have any theories of merit at all
and it shows what kind of tv you've been watching cos the way i see it everyone used to believe that they used slaves and now have proven that they didn't

Like I said, I have yet to find a single source that has a credible reason to believe the Egyptians made use of the pulley. And I reiterate, brute strength would have been a very poor approach to the building of the Great Pyramid.

Blake says;

"hi guys.
no insult intended.
please check the info-there are pictures inside some of the pyramids of them building the pyramids.ramps, etc. it is all known."

There are no pictures in the three largest pyramids at Giza to which I am limiting my theory because there is specualtion that this particular complex along with the Sphinks is much older from a period preceding the Giza Pyamids. There is just one scrawed identifyer in the Great Pyamid that has been found above the King's chamber in the releaving segments naming Khufu written in red by a suspected workman who laid the stones.

Those pictures found in other places of many people dragging stones up ramps could very well have been later specualtions in ancient times as to how the pyramids got built. We tend to lump all Egyptian history into one history. In fact the Egyptian saga was spread over many lifetimes and thousands of years. I still say someone should investigate the possibility of there being a central vertical shaft within the Great Pyramid. All that has been found lies in a narrow band running north and south through the vastness of the pyramid. There could be much more to be found but Egyptian authorities have a nest egg on the ground with the tourism money being brought in by the mystery of the ancient Egyptians. They protect the mystery and dissallow any futher exploration that they don't do first themselves so they can add to their story, history and the mystery of it all.

I think pulleys and levers are a given, they couldn't have managed without them.
They could contrust precise dimensions, but couldn't imagine a pulley? Very improbable.

Right, so the idea of ripping a hole through the center of the pyramid just in case there is a center shaft is not done out of self-interest?

I don't suppose you would be willing to give the archeologists a little credit for not going at one of the Wonders of the World with dynamite and pick-axes everytime any unsupported idea comes up?

Ideas are all well and good, but don't expect people to spend a ton of money and endanger a national (heck, a global) treasure without a little more support than just a hunch.

And like all of us ,you have to start some where,unless like one or two i know you are born with every answer to every question

He does have theories ,like all of us have they are only of no merit if you dont believe them,and since know one has the answer who `s to say the rest of the theories flying about have merit,even yours

Pulleys and levers may be basic science to us, but there is no reason to assume ancient cultures had the wealth of knowledge we do. Unless there is evidence that they used pulleys, we cannot, in any way, assume they did. We have evidence of them using levers, but not pulleys.

Similarly, we know the Egyptians had the wheel, and that they used it in chariots. For the longest time, it was assume the Egyptians made a war chariot for battle, as it was simply assumed to be common sense. Today, the idea of a war chariot has been abandoned, because not only was there never a reason to believe it existed in the first place, what we do know of chariot construction would have made them practical for battle.

The merit of an idea does not arise from a person's belief in them. An idea is merited only if there is credible, objective evidence supporting it. Only if you give every idea the same amount of merit, will you never be able to come up with answers. If, instead, you evaluate the ideas for merit, based on the probability of them occuring, you will be able to claim quite correctly that your idea has the highest likelyhood of being correct.

Graham hancocks one and only theory about egypt is that the site was laid out in 10,500bce
if he can prove that then his assertion that the sphinx is a lion to coincide with the age of leo would have more merit
unfortunatly every piece of evidence he's looked at contradicts that theory
the pyramids were built much later and the the lion hasn't always been used to represent leo
he's a pyramidiot
live with it

he doesn't have thoeries like the rest of us at all
his theories are made up to sell books
for people that don't know any better themselves
He has never studied archaeology
he has never studied egyptology
have you ?

I don't propose anything that would be destructive to the pyramid. The major destructions have already been accomplished by many treasure seekers over the enterviening years since its creation. If there is a central shaft as I am suggesting it will be found close to the top and also close to all the rooms which by my calculation all line up immediately adjacent to a presumed central construction shaft. The narrow band of known tunnels and rooms is offset 24 feet to the east of the north - south central plane through the pryamid. I think that was done for a reason and the reason I'm suggesting is to make all construction convenient to the central access shaft.

One glaring question is how did they bring the coffin to the King's room, since it was too big to fit through the doors and access ways that have been found? I say it was brought up through the central shaft then manuvoured into position before walling up the King's room.

err ok then
you realise of course that the pyramids were built layer by layer
so the kings chamber was once open to the air
think that gap was big enough to drop the coffin into or are you still theorizing that theres a central chamber
hehehe

I'll grant that it is a possible theory (though I'm still not convinced it is in any way probable), however I still need to hear how these extremely heavy stones were lifted vertically through the shaft using nothing but brute strength. Without the use of pulleys, I might well say it is as close to impossible as one can come. Even with the use of pulleys, the forty ton lintels for the King's chamber are simply far too heavy to lift in this manner.

why this insistence on finding out about pulleys
thats not the most effective method of moving hewn stone and it never was
The egyptians used levers and fulcrum points to move the blocks slowly up the stepped side of the pyramid
they were built form the outside
it wasn't neccesary to slide each stone up an internal passage

maybe just used shortcuts
normal techniques available to them at the time
but instead they found more efficient ways of using them.

I agree completely, however I am attempting to point out missing elements that are needed for this Central Shaft idea. Even if they did have pulleys, it would still be far more efficient and safe to haul the stones up the sides of the pyramids, rather than through a central shaft. However, if this idea is to be considered credible, it must explain how the stones were raised through it. The only manner in which I can think of is through pulleys, and even assuming the Egyptians had pulleys (which I have not seen evidence that they did), I still cannot conceive of how they could have arranged it so that it could lift up such massive stones.

You're saying that you don't know the principles of leverage ?
the sides of the pyramids weren't flat when it was being built
they were stepped
make it any easier aquatuus ?

The slabs sealing the king's chamber inside Khufu's pyramid were held in place through a mechanism closely resembling a pulley. besides, triangular shaped stones with marks which might indicate them to have been used as pulleys were found near the pyramid.

which site/texbook is this from?

F. Petrie describes some stones which might allegedly have been used as pulleys. For what concerns the slabs sealing the king's chamber they still bear the marks of the ropes (?) used to lift them and keep them in place.

Dirt ramps where built up the sides (the dirt was removed after construction), Log Rollers and Skids pulled and pushed by hundreds and thousands of workers to manipulate into place.

I have never studied the workings of an ants balls
i have never studied the nervous system of an ants eye socket
I have never studied the workings of an ants arse hole
Have you?

As i said,i tend tio go towards hancocks theories as they were about as far fetched as the rest i have looked at,i didnt say i believed they were true,but you always get a smart arse who cant wait to jump down some ones throat the first chance they get,and i have found one

i think normal citizens were used to build the pyramids
not slaves.

i have another theory.
the pyramids used to be 3 great big granite hills, and the pyramids were
sculpted out of the hills.
then they were further sculpted to look like they had been built from big blocks, just to screw us up, for the rest of time.
works for me

This theory has been dismantled many times. The amount of dirt needed would have been nearly 2,5 (exstimated) times the volume of the pyramid itself, besides, a dirt ramp would have easily collapsed, unless it were built of bricks. In which case, however, tracks of the ramp would have survived, besides, no signs remain of the huge amounts of clay which would have been needed, unless they have simply vanished, which is a rather unlikely occurance.

Actually you're the smart arse for making up facts as you go along to provide credibility for your ridiculous central chamber hypothesy
You were clearly unaware of how the pyramids were built because you think its a mystery as to how the kings coffin got in there
So basically you don't know what you're talking about
I don't claim to be an expert on egyptology but compared to you I'm omnipotent


your ananlogy doesn't work either
"I have never studied the workings of an ants balls
i have never studied the nervous system of an ants eye socket
I have never studied the workings of an ants arse hole"
we're not talking about studying ants,
though from what i can see you're probably better off if you do
you may have more success of convincing people you're right if you were talking like an authority about ant crap
You're failing miserably in egyptology class

and you're not a very good liar
1) As i said,i tend tio go towards hancocks theories as they were about as far fetched as the rest i have looked at,i didnt say i believed they were true
2) but i tend to go on the side of graham hancocks thearies

so you go with things that you know aren't true
that would acount for your belief that slaves built the pyramids then huh
Theres a term for people like you
Its pyramidiot
go waste someone else's time

So they were built by the empire as a whole involving no slavery?
Sounds good to me(OcRz)

they actually found out how the pyramids were built, as the explanation found was the most likely, fisable and most possible. It was shown on the BBC-god bless it. It basically involved hundreds of slaves pulling the stones around the pyramid.

Remember it was civilians Not slaves

Ok.

lol that'd be right
you guys are getting confused
the mystery of the pyramids isn't how they were built
we know exactly how they were built
they even drew pictures of them building them inside pyramids
they weren't built using slaves though the distinctions a fine line.
They weren't slaves but as roswell said if they didn't like it they didn't get a choice
Slaves in the ancient world were valuable
You didn't use them for those purposes
you're thinkig about slavery from a middle ages perspective where they were commonly worked to death in squalid conditions

The mystery of the pyramids is WHY
not how
doh

I've heard of levitating rocks, space ships, etc.

But in my belief, they used ramps to move the stones to build the pyramids.

why would they need them ?

ramps inclined angled to the sun
when they had breaks maybe sunbathing
lol

Hello,

I have just discovered the topic and do not wish to read it all ( sorry).
Nevertheless, I would like to give you a piece of information which should be interesting and which, I hope, has not been suggested here :

I have - in front of me - a French historical magazine specialized in historical mysteries "Les mystères du temps".

They reveal the results of the research of a French scientist - Joël Bertho - about the Gizeh pyramide : The stones were not transported but merely built. Indeed, ancient egyptians used the technic of formwork (i've just checked in a dictionnary for the translation and hope it is the right word).

It was indeed much easier to bring up the material necessary to build stones than lifting real, natural stones.

The way certain stones are intertwined, embedded into the others seems to exclude the use of carved stones.

Olivier

Sorry Olivier, but that just didn't happen. We know where the stones were quarried from. We have the tools that they used to cut the stones. We have found rafts that they used to ferry the stones down the Nile, in one case the raft sunk with the stone on top of it. Now, I'd be willing to bet that the fresco (the part that made the pyramids smooth instead of stepped,) were built on site, but not the bulk of the stones themselves.

And for the person who says that the ramp would have to be built of stone and clay, here's a picture of the ramp built by Romans to conquer the Jewish fortress of Masada http://www.mustardseed.net/html/pmasadad.html and http://www.primeau-canada.com/israel5.htm The ramp has been eroded away by rain over the years, but it still gives you a good idea of exactly how big it is.

Marduk, you claim reliefs depicting the building of pyramids have been found. Since it would be a major archoleogical discovery you need to give me proofs supporting you statements, which, as far as I know, are nothing more than fables, since no such relief exists. The only known depictions show the building of obelisks and the transportations of colossal statues, but the enigneering skills and know how required for building a pyramid, although not necessairly more complex, are at least different. besides, all the known reliefs date to the middle kingdom, more than XII centuries after Khufu's pyramid was allegedly built.

Why not consider that part of the pyramide was made of stones and more technical parts made of reconstructed stones?
I have indeed pictures in the magazine which tend to proove the formwork. But, maybe not for the whole building.

I guess I can scan and send you all that if you wish.

Olivier

I know of the ramp at Masada. However, it's a huge ramp, and it's rectilinear, not a spiral. so that it doesn't present particular problems for what concerns its statics. If you note, it has a very wide base, while it's rather narrow on the top, something which wouldn't have been possibile if they had built a spiral-shaped ramp. Even in that case, however, the ramp would have been far bigger than the pyramid itslef, being hundreds of meters long and nearly 150 meters high.