Many experts and scientists believe that Columbus died believing that he'd reached the Indies. (SUX HAHA) If so, Columbus was extraordinarily stubborn and singleminded; otherwise there would be no chance he could have ignored the evidence of his later voyages- or even, for that matter, his initial voyage.

Some historians even believe that Columbus never intended to go to Asia at all and that his "Enterprise of the Indies" was just a ruse to throw other explorers off the track. They maintain that from the start, Columbus's goal was to discover a New World.

WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK??? (lots of controversy here i believe).

Did Columbus have information from the Moors indicating another, non-asian land mass in the west? He did think it was a gateway to the east.

Thats a good point, but he never realized b4 he died on what exactly he discovered correct?

There are alot of old maps that show a fairly good picture of the world and he probably saw one of these. So he knew there was a land mass to the west between Asia and Europe. You might want to read Maps of the Ancient Sea Kings by Charles Hapgood or check out http://www.viewzone.com/pirireis.html

No, Columbus did not mean to discover America. He was looking for India, which is why he named the native inhabitants 'Indians'.
I am pretty sure this is the case.

1. columbus was not the first european in the 'new world'
2. columbus never knew he found a 'new world'

1. Columbus was not the first westerner in the new world
2. Columbus knew exactly where he was and had a map supplied for the occaison by the vatican
3. Columbus was a vatican spy who went to the new world to claim america for the pope before any protestant country could. He had a vatican map
4. The burning of alexandria was a coverup for the theft of the libraries contents, or have you guys got a better reason to explain how the vatican library formed practically the same day as alexandria burned,
5. The destruction of native cultures that followed was in order to supress the thruth that westerners who were non catholic had achieved greater navigational ability than Gods chosen children.

A heresy is any piece of information that contradicts the supremeness of the god of the flood.
the library at aelxandria was burnt because it contained heresies
the religious books of the south american people were burnt because they contained heresies
answer this question
how did roman catholic priests know what was heretical without reading it

i like what your saying marduk, but wouldn't mind a bit more expansion on your claims....

Columbus was trying to find India.

we know ED... but some say he wasnt and he knew where he was going... some even say he died before he realized where he was.... yet ANOTHER hISTORY MYSTERY!!!

Fair enough lucid. I don't see how he would help the Vatican though...

Well in all it says in the history books Columbus did not mean to find america so is america a big mistake?

had no idea he was a vatican spy.....
whers that from marduk??

See roswell? This is what happens when you spend to much time researching the Bayeux Tapestry- you miss things.
Maybe he is researching it now, I have never heard this before either.

i got exams now...
wheres my free time..??

How do you know he had a map from the vatican? Any evidence there?

I mean, I could say dude had a microwave oven -- that doesn't mean its true.

I am of the belief he was looking for the Indies, thought he found the Indies and died thinking he found the Indies.

America wasn't a mistake, though. If it hadn't been Chris Columbusm it would have been someone else around that time. The Vikings had already been in Northern North America several times, so eventually it would have come out.

i believe it was a mistake - native americans are called indians to this day.

also, as to marduk's claim that the south american books were burned for the reason of heresies - it is true, but in a different prospect, i believe than what you're saying.

the south americans worshipped the 'underworld' and believed the world was born from caves in the mountains, from a stream that flowed out, from which all life sprang. To the cathlolics, this must seem like they worshipped the devil and hell - especially with the amount of sacrifices.

Also, I believe it was to disorent them from their religion - they also worshipped the sun - which they believed gold represented the sun for the way that it glinted. And we all know the spanish lusted for gold.

"I have a disease which only gold can cure"
-Cortez

Didn't Cortez say that regarding the Aztecs?

Well it seems if America was a mistake.. it was a good mistake hehe... but its weird because Indians were already in America, at the time Columbus came is that true?

Is that true? Are u seriuos Lucid?

History books tell us he thought he was in India thus (Indiians). Columbus had NO WAY of knowing of America even existing unless someone else had been there first which suggest he DIDNT discover America. No Columbus thought he had landed in India

yeah, i know where he thought he landed, but its said of course by mANYYY and i actually do think its true, that their were Indians in american when he came here... but he slaughtered them all didnt he, him and his men?

I don't think Columbus really discovered anything. He found a place with a million people living there. Looks like the Native Americans found it first, then Polynesians, Egyptians, Vikings, etc... He was looking for a direct root to India and China. If he would have found it he would have died a rich man. As it turned out he died penniless.

sad, its like he set out for nothing, basically when he discorved north america, how did people know he discovered it? like did he get back to the place he came form and told them where he sailed and what he found?

Um... yeah. Weren't you taught history in elementry school? lol

lucid, there were native inhabiants to the land there. Real Americans. Columbus dubbed them Indians because he believed that he was in India.

OHHHHHH im sucha idiot, sorry guys !!!! omg i think ima be a history major... and i NEVER put two and two together... but lemme ask you this guys... its said that the white men killed off the indians... i always thought that was columbus when he came to america, and i wrong? or do i have two seprate stories mixed up?

why hasn't anyone even mentioned amerigo vespucci yet ?
lucid you're studying history ?
what does your teacher think to your claims that aliens did everything

Amerigo Vespucci was mearly the first one to recognize that he was on a new continent.


Lief Erickson and Saint Brendn, as well as a Chinese explorer who's name escapes me, all wrote about traveling to North America.

The aliens did not come until President Truman invited them to the Whitehouse in 1946.

Columbus didn't kill the Indians, though I am sure he and his men had their fair share of scuffling with them.

Some Indians and Europeans got along, though mostly the Europeans thought of the Indians as less intelligent and savage, though unlike Africans, they could be tamed. Some were enslaved, some were brought into Christianity.

There were a lot of Indian raids on European colonies, resulting in thousands of dead Europeans -- so it wasn't a one-sided affair.

Mostly the disease the Europeans brought with them eventually killed the majority of the Indians as they had no immunity to them.

amerigo vespucci discovered south america with the help of the protestant portugese in 1497
christopher columbus discovered south america in 1498.
the vatican knew of vespuccis quest before he left
all of a sudden columbus turns up unable to speak italian (like a frenchman not speaking french) and claims the continent for rome.
Vespucci went the longest possible route like a man would if he didn't know what was out there
columbus went the most direct route making good use of the current. The way someone would go if they were supplied with a map. The only place on earth at that time that had maps of the american coastline was the vatican
Because Spain was a greater military power than portugal they then went in and carved the land up.
It was disease that killed off the vast majority of the native population.
cholera, plague being the largest factors
in return they gave the west syphillis and a new strain of malaria

There's no doubt that some of the Europeans behaved in an honourable fashion, but many of the ones that didn't were those in positions of power.

Name one european that behaved in an honourable fashion ??

So columbus never slaughtered the Indians... what story then am i thinking about when the white men killed off the indians???

It was desease that decimated the Aboriginal population in the states, then war and then finally the reservations. But mostly it was smallpox and cholera like Marduk said

During the time of Christopher Columbus, people thought the Earth was flat, and believed if you sailed too far west in the Atlantic Ocean you would fall off the edge of the world.

But Columbus believed the world was round - and most people thought he was crazy. He intended to prove them wrong by sailing westwards in the Atlantic Ocean until he reached land - he thought he would the Eastern Coast of Japan, meaning he would have sailed around the world. Obviously, he didn't know that a huge landmass - North America - lay between him and Japan. And because of that, when he landed in the Caribbean islands, he thought he had actually gone further south than Japan and had landed in India. So he named the the Indies. Nowadays, we know them as the West Indies.

Yes thats the vatican approved story
It's bull (NO PUN INTENDED)

I no that people though the world was flat, and he knew it was round.. and thats why he sailed out to prove them wrong.. but what made him want to come across India?

Um... did you take basic history?

Actually, most people at that time KNEW the Earth was round. That was established fact not only via direct exploration, but via scientific evidence and testing. Only the most ignorant of people at that time still believed the world was flat.

Columbus was trying to get to India to create a secondary trade route for spices that did not include the Arabians in between. It's the same reason Marco Polo took his little journey. At the time one of the most important spices, pepper was used to flavor meat to disguise it being rancid (no real refridgeration remeber.) The problem was is since was imported from so far it was extremely expensive, even accounting for inflation it was much more expensive then it is today.

Columbus sailed south with the currents because that's the direction they took him. He also had a map showing a large northern land mass that he knew he had to go around. The only problem is that he misjudged the distance and thought he traveled further then he really had.

I do not buy that he was a Vatican spy, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Vatican hadn't bent Queen Isabella's ear a bit in exchange for political favors.

yep i just took it thanks to you.. haha, no i took it a longgg time ago.. but we never really got into Columbus, thats why i was bringing it up thank you for that explanation Hamellr.

That is what I was taught in elementary school....a very long time ago. Do you mean it's all wrong???

no no..... exactly i learned it suchhh a long time ago thats why i forgot all the basics, i appreciate all your guys help!!! keep any new theories comming rather evidence and facts thank you!

you guys know why we thought the world was flat right ???

Did people really think the world was flat?

lol
i was gonna say because
"Too few scholars work with primary sources and the errors of other writers are repeated and propagated.
Scholars are often led by their biases more than by the evidence.
Sociological and cultural factors need to be recognised in scholarly work, and scholars must beware of making value-judgments based on today’s norms. "
ner

Thank you for the link essan its fascinating!

No, Columbus never knew about the existence of America... He thought he had reached India, because that was he's original intention. But, for those who don't know, America had been discovered before, Columbus, by the Portuguese! If you know the content of the Treaty of Tordesilhas (http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Treaty-of-Tordesilhas), it said that the world would be divided in two, half to Portugal, and half to Spain... And if you see where Portugal part ends it is exactly where Brazil is... And the supposed discovery of Brazil by Pedro Alvarez Cabral, was to be done, before the Spanish had the opportunity to claim it their own... And I doubt that is just a coincidence. Also because Columbus first asked Portugal to allow him to go in their behalf, but Portugal refuse... Maybe because they know that Brazil was there, and it was very rich in gold? For as you can see after America was "discovered" by Columbus, began an hunger for power and land, gold and slaves! But if it Columbus didn't reached America Portugal could keep all to himself! At least it's my theory, and I think that there are very supporting facts!

from your post
"America had been discovered before"
"No, Columbus never knew about the existence of America"
"For as you can see after America was "discovered" by Columbus"
non sequiteur

I kn ow he didnt discover America, and i know that other civilizations were living their.... but when he came to America he slaughtered those civilizations correct?

No
he was an explorer not a conquistadore
theres a difference you know