This has got to be one of the biggest Ancient mysteries going
In sumerian tradition it's not really a great deluge as in the later christian work thats based upon it. More like a seasonal heavy rain and an ocean journey.
Egyptian tradition has no flood myth
Mesoamerican tradition has no flood myth
There are hundreds that do
but thousands and thousands and thousands that don't
The christian church is sticking to its 26,000bce date. Thats when they can agree that the earth is more than 6000 years old

I'm going with "a series of smaller floods that got mixed together". There's always been floods and they are traumatic events, so it's easy to believe that there could have been some incredible stories told about them in ancient times.

It's also easy to see how a regional flood would be called a "worldwide flood" by someone who lived in that region, and never travelled outside it. To them, their whole world would've been destroyed.

Outright lie methinks.

I'm still waiting for lucid to see this and immediatly hit the annunaki answer
hehe

You missed another theory marduk, ( and I think you're really goingt o like this one )
From a revue for "Uriel's Machine":

"Modern scientific investigations show that Earth has been hit many times by objects such as comets and meteorites. Laboratory work on comet impact effects demonstrates that comets could cause tidal waves to exceed three miles tall and near 400 miles per hour. In the last 10,000 years, there have been two impacts of such proportion: a seven-fold impact into all the world's oceans around 7640 B.C., and a single impact into the Mediterranean Sea about 3150 B.C., the time of Noah's Flood.
Uriel's Machine proves ancient Europeans not only survived the 7640 B.C. flood, but developed a highly advanced civilization dedicated to predicting and preparing for future meteoric impacts. Building an international network of sophisticated astronomical observatories, these ancient astronomers created accurate solar, lunar, and planetary calendars, measured the diameter of the Earth, and precisely predicted comet collisions years in advance. This was the true purpose of megalithic structures such as Stonehenge. In 3150 B.C., the ancients' predictions proved true, and their device- Uriel's Machine-allowed the reconstruction of civilization in a shattered world.

Uriel's Machine also presents evidence that:

* There was a single global language on Earth
* A single female was a common ancestor to all living humans
* Angels bred with human women to create The Watchers, giant half-human beings
* The oral tradition of Freemasonry records real events

A fascinating study of humankind's past, present, and future, Urie/'s Machine proves the world was indeed flooded, but survived wholly due to these ancient Europeans, their heavenly knowledge, and one remarkable machine."

i said smaller floods mixxed together, cuz it cant be a real huge flood that happened like the bible cuz i find that ark totall Bullsh!t cuz to have a pair of every animal on the planet the ship is gonna have to be one huge mother freaking ship.

Periodic massive floods have happened throughout the earth's history. The cause is comets and meteorites.

One single flood, that covered the earth.

However, it was not genocide.

The 'Biblical Flood' was one single, localised, event. which has been greatly distorted over the millenia as it was passed from culture to culture.

The presence of different flood myths from other parts of the world are simply due to the fact that major floods are relatievly commonplace even today (remember seeing half of Mozambique under water a few years back? What would have happened had there been no boats, helicopters and aid?) - and were probably even more frequent and devestating in the post Ice Age era.

So, since the poll relates to the Bibical Flood only, I vote for the last option: IMHO it was a single, localised, natural event which isn't any of the options

that sounds suspiciously like answer number two andy
2 was a series of smaller floods that got mixed together
??

Ah but the Biblical Flood was only one event

Don't you just love pedants

Pedant all you like mate
you're the only one thats said Biblical so far.
and theres me trying to keep religion out of it
hehe

Gilgamesh, Noah, the Popul Vul, there are so many flood myths that there must me some historical basis.
When you consider the ancient mythology in this light, it is pretty interesting. Just as over 300 cultures have flood legends, so do many ancient cultures also have legends of gods breeding with human women.

Rather than tracing links via flood myths you'd do better to look at the other similarities
i.e. hermaphrodites, twin brothers, ocean births,
as essan said, floods are fairly commonplace all over the earth even today.
I'd be surprised if they weren't there in their hundreds

Okay marduk, as long as I don't have to actually look at any hermaphrodites.



Floods, of course, are regularly occuring geological events.
Massive floods that wipe out whole continents or population centers are much more rare, and these are the types of events that I was pointing to.

Something you don't have on the list is what I put.

I think, given its ancient origins, that the story of the Great Flood actually originates from the time right after the last Ice Age (ie 50,000 years or so I think). Think about it. If the ice caps are receding, then that means the water levels would rise right? Most coastal citys and low lying islands would be consumed eventually by the rising waters of the Oceans and Seas. However this wasn't a "40 day and 40 night" event. It probably took a couple hundred years for the waters to get to the levels noted by ancient scribes. To me, this is the most plausable explaination.

And to those who think that the entire would was covered with water...just stating a fact...There isn't enough water on this globe to completely cover ALL landmasses. Most would be covered yes, however several peaks of our tallest mountains would still rise above it... These of course would look more like islands than mountain ranges.

We have seen the destruction of the recent tsunami.

The Earth has gone huge changes over the years, all natural, but all equally as deadly.

If i lived an any time before modern ideas, i think i would have been puzzled why a huge tidal wave is coming to flatten civilisation as we know it. Blame it on God, the personification of Nature.. why not? Who else would it be? Nature.. surely not!

I believe the bible is true.. think about it. The stories are to teach lessons of solidarity, in order to help unfocused lawless people to go in a direction all at once.

The Great floods. I expect we have always had great floods. I expect we will always have tsunamis, and things that are not to do with the Earth like, Meteors, Asteroids, Solar Flares, magnetic forces etc.

I believe the Dinosaurs were defeated by an asteroid. That was a hell of a,ong time ago, when the Earth was a hell of a lot younger. if the Universe is still forming, then is it reasonable to think, more chance of a hit from space?

The dust cloud from that would have resulted from such a hit, would have wiped out most life. Life in the sea probably still existed to some degree, which is why we seem to have creatures like Whales and Giant Squads today.

So, if that theory is believed, why not have similar events later on in history?

In the dates given, 3150 B.C and 7640 B.C.. these are examples of great floods.

The 3150 cataclysm was predicted by Noah, possibly with the help of a wise man who knew something of astrological events. That seems more realistic to me.

And he had 2 of each animal for food, not for the sake of it. This could have meant 10 pairs of chickens. The story has been exagerated for story purposes.

But as i read, it was possible for some civilisations to understand astrology. Noah was spared.. along with his family after God told him to build the Ark? Why would he tell Noah, he was human after, all and could just as easily make more humans from clay.

I would say that Noah may have realised the signs of a comet or meteor strike. God did not tell him so. He took the animals aboard the ark for food to survive?

I would expect that after a 150 days of an extremely high sea level, either everything was wiped out, or it was no where near as bad if it only went say, 100 miles in land. If the impact had been in the land, surely the accounts would also say that their was no sun (due to dust clouds blocking out the sun for a period of time, like Krakatoa)

3150 B.C and 7640 B.C.. truly a bad year for composing, truly a bad year for Kronenbourg and a truly a crap year for lumps of wandering space rock.

I believe the story is true.. great floods. Cataclysm was predicted by Noah. And he had 2 of each animal for food, not for the sake of it. This could have meant 10 pairs of chickens. The story has been exagerated for story purposes.

But as i read, it was possible for some civilisations to understand astrology. Noah was spared.. along with his family after God told him to build the Ark? Why would he tell Noah?

I would say that Noah because he may have realised the signs of a comet or meteor strike. God did not tell him so. He took the animals aboard the ark for food?

you may be surprised to know that the Noah story was based on the sumerian tale of Upnapistim. It arrived at christianity via judaism which was exiled in babylon in 550bce. Upnapishtim took animals purely for food purposes.
in the same way that Sarah michelle gellar thesedays is popularly identified with buffy the vampire slayer
however we all know that Kirsty Swanson played her first

From marduk:

>I believe the story is true.. great floods. Cataclysm was predicted by Noah. And he had 2 of each animal for food, not for the sake of it. This could have meant 10 pairs of chickens. The story has been exagerated for story purposes.

But as i read, it was possible for some civilisations to understand astrology. Noah was spared.. along with his family after God told him to build the Ark? Why would he tell Noah?

I would say that Noah because he may have realised the signs of a comet or meteor strike. God did not tell him so. He took the animals aboard the ark for food?

you may be surprised to know that the Noah story was based on the sumerian tale of Upnapistim. It arrived at christianity via judaism which was exiled in babylon in 550bce. Upnapishtim took animals purely for food purposes.
in the same way that Sarah michelle gellar thesedays is popularly identified with buffy the vampire slayer
however we all know that Kirsty Swanson played her first<

What are you trying to say? That Noah brought a vampire slayer aboard the ark?

Or 2 vampires?

BTW, has anyone else considered how difficult it must have been to round up 2 of each animal for Noah?

What about the amphibious birds
like ducks for instance
why have two ducks on the ark or two swans
do they represent a special religious kind of duck
As for vampires being on board the ark
had to be really
otherwise Buffy wouldn't be a real person would she
hehe

I had an early let down when i was a kid so i'm a bit biased against the story of Noah
My sunday school teacher told me that Unicorns are extinct because they wanted to play and were reluctant to get on board the ark
that suggest to me that Noah wasn't as virginal and pure as he made out or
I was lied to about the existence of unicorns
Still trying to make my mind up over that one.
Someone once calculated that for a ship to accomodate two of every animal on board it would be bigger than Ireland.
Maybe there was a mistake in translation and they actually went to arkansas.
hehe
Noah as well i'm a little bit dubious
one day he's an old man with a family and next hes captain of the biggest vessel in human history
I'd doubt anyone untrained could even handle a canoe
have you tried that ?

This ark would have been the size of a supertanker, and the water was said to have come as high as everest. It was water water everywhere, but not a drop to drink.

Noah did know how long the flood would be, so he was perplexed really in trying to guess supplies for every land animal ever.

it culd easily be a large flooding events celebrated by pagans and such
and the christian church got on the bandwagon and stole the idea.
btw tho eygptians had no flood myth, the nile floods yearly to provide much needed water, silt and soil nutrients for their crops??

pagans and such
who exactly are you reffering to here
before the xtians existed there was no such thing as pagans
it's christian slang for "A countryside idiot who doesn't worship God the father, Son, or holy ghost"
theres an addendum that got added in modern times
"A countryside idiot who doesn't worship God the father, Son, or holy ghost or Judaism and Islam" who we have to now recognise cos they're a military power

atheist and non christians and such....

[QUOTE]I had an early let down when i was a kid so i'm a bit biased against the story of Noah. My sunday school teacher told me that Unicorns are extinct because they wanted to play and were reluctant to get on board the ark[/QUOTE]

PMSL.. i suppose that goes for Chupacabras too. Can you imagine have 2 horses with the horn on your boat? You'd have to plan some kind of orgy. Oh well, Noah did sacrifice a lot.. i suppose that's what god meant by l'ook after the animal's every need'.

Someone once calculated that for a ship to accomodate two of every animal on board it would be bigger than Ireland.[QUOTE]

That's utter B.S. Everyone knows it's the size of George Best's minibar.

[QUOTE]Maybe there was a mistake in translation and they actually went to Arkansas[/QUOTE].

I'm sorry, that's highly unlikely. You are truly thick. You just wont accept they all hid in the Ark of the Covenant (like the Tardis), and thats when the Anunnaki took them back to Nibiru for anal probing.

[QUOTE]Noah.. as well i'm a little bit dubious.. one day he's an old man with a family and next he's captain of the biggest vessel in human history. I'd doubt anyone untrained could even handle a canoe[/QUOTE]

That's like asking Malcolm Glazer to take over a soccer club and run it.. no actually, nevermind lol..

I get the impression you don't know much about religion Roswell
i wish i had your shoes
i wouldnt be so paranoid

Before we get lost on this subject, take a look at the seven deep impact sights of the 7,640 B.C Comet Impact. This comet entered earth atmosphere and broke into 7 different peaces. This date was confirmed by core samples of Tektite.
Tektite material fragmets found in layers of deep sea sediment from around the world.

The debris field forced into the the earths atmosphere by an impact would have caused a short-term nuclear winter an a long term global warming effect. Leaving behind traces of nitric acid, magmetic finger prints, tektite trails and radiocarbon blips which can be used to date theses events.

Core samples taken from around the world. From trees, earth, and ice from Antartica indicated a common denominator of facts, another meteor hit the planet in or near the year 3,150 B.C.

Some 50 years before the Egyptian entered into Egypt..

The nitric acid levels and the tektite samples found indicate that this meteor hit in the Mediterranean in the year 3,150 B.C.

This was the cause of the Great Flood. Ocean salt waters poured into the Baltic Sea which was a fresh water lake at that time. Still to this day know living thing can survive at the bottom level of this Ocean. Fish and other marine life do live at the high water levels.
Bob Ballard sent his mini-subs to the bottle of Baltic Ocean on a theory from book that claimed that any wooden ships that did sink in this Ocean waters would be perfectly preserved due to the conditions of the water. The theory was right Ballard found an ancient sea faring ship at the bottom perfectly preservered. There are more treasures down their just waiting to be found.

As for the 3,150 B.C date to some genealogy work from the bible. Noah was 600 years old at the time of the great flood. He would have been born in the year 3,750 B.C which is the same year that the human dating calender was created some coviencidence huh? Also Noah lived 350 years after the flood he would have died in the year 2,800 B.C.
Islamic legend say that Moses recanted this story in the Torah the first five books of the bible 1,300 years after it supposedly happened 2800 B.C-1300 B.C = 1500 B.C There was a pharoah born near this date 1500 B.C. He was none other than the great warrior pharoah that ever lived Tuthmosis III/Thutmoses III. Moses of the bible.
Thutmoses the III destroyed his step mother Hatsetsups image from Egypt after he took over the kingship from her. She ruled for 20 years in his stead and even dress as a man, and she wore a fake beard. Egyptologist still to this day do not no why Thutmosis Obliverated her name from Egypt.
But I do, it commonsence. There is no written history of Moses in Egypt yet he was taken from the river by Pharoahs daughter Hatsetsup and raised as an egyptian prince and lived in Egypt for 40 years before leaving.
Moses refused to be called the son of Pharoahs daughter, because Hapsetsup was not his mother for one, and she had lied to him his hole life, and she maimed his tongue from speech when he was a child of 3 year old to keep him quiet.

The baby Moses at the age of 3yrs. notched the crown from his stepmothers head
the egyptian priest saw this to be a bad omen. The boys intentions had to be test. They brought two bowls and placed them in from of the boy. One was filled with hot coals the other was filed with gold. If boy chose the gold he would have to be put to death if he chose the hot coals he would live. The boy picked up the hot coal and through it in his mouth disfiguring his tongue and maiming his speech.
When Moses went infront of burning bush he was slow of tongue and slow of speech.

Amenhotep II was the son of Moses he was killed in the exodus by his father Moses his bow was broken and he was placed in his sarcophagus. The only Pharoah found in his own tomb besides the boy king Tutankhamen. Amenhotep II had three sons the eldest died from the curse of the fist born in egypt. The second son died when he followed Moses and the Hebrews across the parted waters.

The third son was none other than Thutmoses V, Moses grandson. Moses told him if he unburied the great spinx that the Egyptians people would except him as there new Pharoah.

Impact sights 7,640 B.C

wheres ure source/link to all this info??

I'am the source my specialty is combining information from around the world. I investigate and separate the facts and the truth comes out.

You're investigating facts in a religious book are you mad.
The old testament was written in 550bc while the jews were in exile in babylon.
There is no evidence whatsoever that supports their story of being slaves in egypt.
Tutmose, Ahmose, They were egyptian Pharoas. None of them rushed off to israel to talk to god on a mountain.
You're mix of fact and fiction is Amusing but not very reliable.
However your astronomical impact knowledge is spot on as far as i can see.
However i had heard the splashdown in 3150 was closer to the Yucatan.
That makes a lot more sense with my source. There was no inundation of egypt or any other mediterranean civilisation at that time. There was in the caribbean.
can you link to a source that backs your claim for the Med ?
very interesting all the same
cheers
M

The Atra-Khasis fragment and the Gilgamesh deluge tablet are maybe more impressive than the Bible's description of the great flood: the complete darkness, the metaphors describing the violence of the flood and the Gods screaming and fearing the flood. Egyptian tradition has indeed a flood myth, in which RA, the sun god, and Isis are both involved. However, it's a rather secondary myth, above all if compared to the position reserved to flood myths in most mythologies. Meso America has some of the most impressive flood myths too. The Toltecs had also myths which are paralleled by the biblical tower of Babel. The most important amongst the meso-american flood myths is the mayan one. The Maya flood myth is described in the Popol Vuh, the sacred book of the Quiches Mayas. Even the Aztecs had myths paralleling the deluge stories and accounts. According to aztec cosmogony, one of the earlier suns (era) was destroyed by a deluge of water, which killed any living being on earth, turning men into fishes. The Church claims the deluge to have appened around 5.640 b.C. (I don't remember the exact date, maybe I'll check later), basing such a claim on the bible and the chronology of antediluvian patriarchs.

[/quote]

The Atra-Khasis fragment and the Gilgamesh deluge tablet are maybe more impressive than the Bible's description of the great flood: the complete darkness, the metaphors describing the violence of the flood and the Gods screaming and fearing the flood. Egyptian tradition has indeed a flood myth, in which RA, the sun god, and Isis are both involved. However, it's a rather secondary myth, above all if compared to the position reserved to flood myths in most mythologies. Meso America has some of the most impressive flood myths too. The Toltecs had also myths which are paralleled by the biblical tower of Babel. The most important amongst the meso-american flood myths is the mayan one. The Maya flood myth is described in the Popol Vuh, the sacred book of the Quiches Mayas. Even the Aztecs had myths paralleling the deluge stories and accounts. According to aztec cosmogony, one of the earlier suns (era) was destroyed by a deluge of water, which killed any living being on earth, turning men into fishes. The Church claims the deluge to have appened around 5.640 b.C. (I don't remember the exact date, maybe I'll check later), basing such a claim on the bible and the chronology of antediluvian patriarchs.
[right][snapback]647652[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]
you mean this bit ?

"I watched the appearance of the weather--
the weather was frightful to behold!
I went into the boat and sealed the entry.
For the caulking of the boat, to Puzuramurri, the boatman,
I gave the palace together with its contents.
Just as dawn began to glow
there arose from the horizon a black cloud.
Adad rumbled inside of it,
before him went Shullat and Hanish,
heralds going over mountain and land.
Erragal pulled out the mooring poles,
forth went Ninurta and made the dikes overflow.
The Anunnaki lifted up the torches,
setting the land ablaze with their flare.
Stunned shock over Adad's deeds overtook the heavens,
and turned to blackness all that had been light.
The... land shattered like a... pot.
All day long the South Wind blew ...,
blowing fast, submerging the mountain in water,
overwhelming the people like an attack.
No one could see his fellow,
they could not recognize each other in the torrent.
The gods were frightened by the Flood,
and retreated, ascending to the heaven of Anu.
The gods were cowering like dogs, crouching by the outer wall.
Ishtar shrieked like a woman in childbirth,
the sweet-voiced Mistress of the Gods wailed:
'The olden days have alas turned to clay,
because I said evil things in the Assembly of the Gods!
How could I say evil things in the Assembly of the Gods,
ordering a catastrophe to destroy my people!!
No sooner have I given birth to my dear people
than they fill the sea like so many fish!'
The gods--those of the Anunnaki--were weeping with her,
the gods humbly sat weeping, sobbing with grief(?),
their lips burning, parched with thirst.
Six days and seven nights
came the wind and flood, the storm flattening the land.
When the seventh day arrived, the storm was pounding,
the flood was a war--struggling with itself like a woman
writhing (in labor)."

What you've got to remember is that this segment of atrahasis was a rededited version of this following segment.

"Anzu was tearing at the sky with his talons, the land,
He broke the Flood [came out (?)].
The kas'us~-weapon went against the people like an army.
No one could see anyone else,
They could not be recognized in the catastrophe.
The Flood roared like a bull,
Like a wild ass screaming the winds [howled]
The darkness was total, there was no sun.
like white sheep
of the Flood
the noise of the Flood.

Anu (?) went berserk,
The gods (?) ... his sons ... before him
As for Nintu the Great Mistress,
Her lips became encrusted with rime.
The great gods, the Anunna,
Stayed parched and famished.

The goddess watched and wept"

I think the second does it for me better.
The first segment was from gilgamesh. The second was from Atrahasis. Although the version of atrahasis is younger than the gilgamesh tablets, It's still valid to say that the story of atrahasis is the earlier. We just haven't found that copy yet.
Theres two main reasons for that.
when things are redited they tend to get longer and more descriptive,
and
Atrahasis has a cameo role in Gilgamesh because he was already a Famous legendary figure when it was written.
Atrahasis in actuality is an epiphet and not his name. His real name was "Upnapishtim". He's not to be confused with Adapa/Uan/Oannes who is in fact a completely different sailor. hehe
The egyptians do not have a flood myth. What you're referencing to is the "myth of the egyptian flood myth". Only one person (i forget the name) mistranslated a damaged papyrus as a flood myth. Everyone else who has seen it since translated it differently. You've only heard about it at all because its a creationist theory.
That serves No purpose.
Additionally the popul vuh does not contain a flood myth per se
"A flood was brought about by the Heart of Heaven; a great flood was formed which fell on the heads of the wooden creatures. "
the wooden creatures were one of gods early attempts at man according to the popul vuh. They weren't human.
Having checked the dates of the supposed christian flood myths I can tell you that they still haven't made their minds up
They're currently investigating 26,000bce, 9600bce, 2300bce, and 200,million bce however most fundementalists are still using the 4000bce date for the creation of the earth so are quite hopelessly flawed. Thats what happens when you use faith instead of fact.

A ship bigger than Ireland?

Could something this massive actually float?

Right now, there is only one County in Ireland able to float.... Cork.

Going off at a tangent here, has anyone thought that Noah wouldn't have needed to take all the fish & sea creatures? So they wouldn't have been wiped out in the flood ... so that's why they survived to the present day! hey! i could have something here! That's why Megalodon survived!

I wish Noah would have swatted those 2 mosquitos...

Codebreaker - I think you meant the Black Sea, not the Baltic

When interpreting ancient stories, you have to remember one important thing:-

Storytellers invariably embellish their tales over time - in response to questions from their audience and to the location in which the story is being retold. If Noah originally took just his domestic lidestock onboard, and some spotty faced kid asked the storyteller how the wild asses survive, then in the next retelling, Noah took on the wild animals too..... And if the mountain at the head of the valley is the highest anyone has ever seen, surely that is where the ark landed, not on some mountain in a far off foreign land.....

The bare bones of the story are all we really have to go on. There was a flood. And someone survived it in a boat. That's it.

Actually, I think its more around 6000 bce. And this is only referring to the creation of man. 6000 bce does not signify the creation of the earth, at least biblically. Genesis 1:1 through Genesis 1:23 could be talking about 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 of years for all we know.

It is not a "fact" on how old the earth actually is.

go on then
keep clutching at straws
see where it gets you
hehe

Actually the famous Bishop James Usher (1581-1656) Archbishop of Armagh, Ireland declared in the 19t century by edict that the earth was 6000 years old
by counting backwards from known dates using the lengths of lives given in the Bible Usher calculated that creation happened in 4004 BC

and thats a fact
allegedly


http://www.csd.uwo.ca/staff/magi/personal/...1-creation.html

This is only if you consider the "days" in early Genesis as actual days.

However, an actual "day" was not created till the fourth "day."

So that means....how could the "day" mean an actual 24-hour "day" if the actual "day" wasn't made till the fourth "day?"

You'd argue with a bishop over matters of christian faith
in the old days they used to call guys like you heretics
they made good firewood
hehe

I don't see a bishop anymore high up or anymore knowing than a old church lady.

Tell that to the dinosaurs!

These are a few of the problems with the theory of a relatively recent flood. The theory has no explanation for the restriction of marsupials and monotremes to the vicinity of Australia. There is no explanation how the carnivores' need for food was met right after the flood. There is no explanation for why some species spread widely and others went to one region. There is no explanation as to how slow, delicate animals like salamanders could get to their destinations. There is no sense in the computations of population growth that are used. These problems have not been answered, to my knowledge, by creationist Chrisrians. Their theory does not seem to stand up to critical examination.

To be honest I don't see the importance of it, whether it happened or not. A lot of things in the Bible are true, for example there was a man called Jesus, I do not believe that he was neccesarily divine, but I do not doubt his existence.
If there was a great flood then what does this prove? That some things in the Bible are accurate? That we are at risk from another flood?
I suppose it is interesting because it allegedly wiped out thousands of people.

In the Bible, God said he would not destroy the earth again......by flood at least.

The second ending of the earth is much worse

Are you actually Chrisitan amalgamut?

Thats right.

Ok, I just wasn't sure. Interesting, so do you believe the creation story literally or as something to be interpreted?