Full Version: The Dinosaur Figurines Of Acambaro, Mexico
Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums > Unexplained Mysteries > Ancient Mysteries & Alternative History
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm
Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 04:46 PM)
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm
Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
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Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
[right][snapback]678178[/snapback][/right]
all from a bible site eh?
very reliable IMO...
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 04:46 PM)
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm
Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
[right][snapback]678178[/snapback][/right]
Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
[right][snapback]678178[/snapback][/right]
First off go to the homepage of the site that you linked to and check it out
http://www.bible.ca/
Then check out the list of witnesses to the authenticity
Nuff said
can anyone put aside religion for once?
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 05:14 PM)
can anyone put aside religion for once?
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Not when you're discussing the newest FACT in the creation theory debate to prove that the Earth is only 6000 years old.
I think its relevant to show that there is an obvious bias here.
at least three of the credible witnesses are family members. all the others are clearly biased for one reason or another. I've never imagined that i would hear the name charles haplessbutgood mentioned as a credible witness for an apparent Orthodox discovery.
Thats like getting mike tyson to give you a character reference.
its amazing how fast people shut something down if christainity is associated with it. But if its associated with some half assed religion about aliens and nazis from the hollow earth, then of it must be real! Do you people hear how dumb you sound? Your minds are closed so tightly shut, all you want to hear is what you want, whatever fits into your ever changing ideas.
let me start this topic over. hey i was taken by an alien last night. we had a long conversation and we flew to rainbow city in his space ship. he told me to go and have a look at this link. i swear this all really happened, his name was Nojk.
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 05:27 PM)
its amazing how fast people shut something down if christainity is associated with it. But if its associated with some half assed religion about aliens and nazis from the hollow earth, then of it must be real! Do you people hear how dumb you sound? Your minds are closed so tightly shut, all you want to hear is what you want, whatever fits into your ever changing ideas.
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Actually,
if its associated with a groundless factless religeous belief it tends to take a while for people to get over it. (bout 2005 years and counting) but if its associated with aliens and nazis from the hollow earth People never get over it.
just take a look at some of the ridiculous posts in here
recently someone tried to post Religious Quackery in the form of an Ancient mystery. Of course it got debunked staright away and shown for what it was but the poster (religious) took offence.
makes ya think
i am no christian. nor am i religious. i haven't taken offense to anything posted, i just notice how people dismiss things before they read them. its funny really.
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 05:38 PM)
i am no christian. nor am i religious. i haven't taken offense to anything posted, i just notice how people dismiss things before they read them. its funny really.
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I wasn't talking about you Ciraxis.
I would have just used your name.
but it happens all the time.
It's like when a man pulls a gun on you and then asks you to buy his watch you tend to be generous. In this place everyones bullettproof. So theres no need to pretend to like something if you don't
I love the models I think they're great. If it had been announced as anything but evidence that humans and dinosaurs lived together it might have been interesting.
as it is. Its a ploy at best
at worst it's a last attempt to regain credability by a group who previously claimed that the ark was on mount ararat and then failed to produce so much as a matchstick.
Those figurines look like clay dinosaurs I made when I was in Kindergarten. 
...San Francisco?
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 04:29 PM)
let me start this topic over. hey i was taken by an alien last night. we had a long conversation and we flew to rainbow city in his space ship. he told me to go and have a look at this link. i swear this all really happened, his name was Nojk.
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...San Francisco?
QUOTE(marduk @ Jun 15 2005, 05:44 PM)
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 05:38 PM)
i am no christian. nor am i religious. i haven't taken offense to anything posted, i just notice how people dismiss things before they read them. its funny really.
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I wasn't talking about you Ciraxis.
I would have just used your name.
but it happens all the time.
It's like when a man pulls a gun on you and then asks you to buy his watch you tend to be generous. In this place everyones bullettproof. So theres no need to pretend to like something if you don't
I love the models I think they're great. If it had been announced as anything but evidence that humans and dinosaurs lived together it might have been interesting.
as it is. Its a ploy at best
at worst it's a last attempt to regain credability by a group who previously claimed that the ark was on mount ararat and then failed to produce so much as a matchstick.
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this pic been around then marduk?
http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...pic=41499&st=60
QUOTE(The Roswell Man @ Jun 15 2005, 05:49 PM)
QUOTE(marduk @ Jun 15 2005, 05:44 PM)
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 05:38 PM)
i am no christian. nor am i religious. i haven't taken offense to anything posted, i just notice how people dismiss things before they read them. its funny really.
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I wasn't talking about you Ciraxis.
I would have just used your name.
but it happens all the time.
It's like when a man pulls a gun on you and then asks you to buy his watch you tend to be generous. In this place everyones bullettproof. So theres no need to pretend to like something if you don't
I love the models I think they're great. If it had been announced as anything but evidence that humans and dinosaurs lived together it might have been interesting.
as it is. Its a ploy at best
at worst it's a last attempt to regain credability by a group who previously claimed that the ark was on mount ararat and then failed to produce so much as a matchstick.
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this pic been around then marduk?
http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...pic=41499&st=60
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a long long time
funniest thing was that this snow covered mountain top is a destination to walking tourists every summer.
Maybe they burnt it for firewood huh.
At least they didn't use ancient manuscripts.
see the difference
haha
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 04:14 PM)
can anyone put aside religion for once?
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I'm afraid it isn't quite that simple. Let me explain:
In science, nothing can be taken on faith. In science, faith is replaced by credibility. Credibility comes in many shapes and forms, and is difficult to earn and easy to lose. Credibility matters not just to individuals, but also to entire subjects, in this case, the argument for modern dinosaurs.
This subject suffers from some fairly significant flaws, which I will get into in a moment. For now, suffice it to say that they make regular apperances on this page, and are in no way considered a new topic. It is because of this that you received the reaction that you did. Since you haven't yet established your credibility, and are presenting an argument that suffers from a great deal of negative image, you are tainted with the same brush. In other words, we have seen hundreds of claims identical to yours, and so, since we know nothing about you, have to assume that you are simply the latest in the series.
So, that explains the reaction you received. After all, if the only time that you see a claim is when it is being presented by a group that is trying to advance a specific agenda, would it not make sense to suspect a certain bias? This is all part of establishing credibility.
Now, in reagrds to the figures. I will freely admit that I haven't looked at them yet, but let me make a few guesses:
1) They reflect a comic book version, rather than a scientific version, of what dinosaurs looked like.
2) They do not look like items that were made with a great deal of care or effort, more like items molded by hand somewhat haphazardly.
3) They are available for sale to tourists.
These things tend to pop up regularly in places where tourists flock to. The legends are, by and large, a fabrication created and supported by the local populace.
good, well thought out comment aquatus 
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 03:46 PM)
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm
Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
[right][snapback]678178[/snapback][/right]
Hey everyone, take a look at this. Sorry if this is a repeat topic, haven't been on this site long enough to know if it is. But tell me what you all think.
[right][snapback]678178[/snapback][/right]
I think the reason you caught so much flak on this post is because that website is used a source for a lot of the creationist posts you will find here.
As soon as you see www.bible.ca mentioned in the post you can pretty much tell what's coming
True, so true but he did not know that. Did anyone read any of the info in the link?
i suggest that everyone posting here should read the article. just because you have 10000 posts and think yourself some kind of forum god, does not mean you are all knowing. its easy to look like you know everything on here, its easy to make another view other than your own look stupid, just badger and shut down everything they say. it happens everyday on here. well to all of you that think your kings**t, get your head out of your ass before you make a post. you should know what your trying to debunk, before you try and do it. read the article.
and read the report, don't just look at the pictures.
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm#initial
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm#initial
This is an old article back to about 1984 I think. Here is a reponse I found to the claim:
Source
QUOTE
Response:
The figurines show every evidence of being recent folk art, fraudulently buried in an archeological excavation. De Peso (1953) made the following observations:
The surfaces of the figurines were new. They were not marred by a patina or coating of soluble salts characteristic of genuinely old artifacts from the same area. The owner said none of the figures had been washed in acid. Edges of depressions were sharp and new. No dirt was packed into crevices.
Genuine archeological relics of fragile items are almost always found in fragments. Finding more than 30,000 such items in pristine condition is unheard of. The excavators of the artifacts were "neither careful nor experienced" in their field technique, yet no marks of their shovels, mattocks, or picks were noted in any of the 32,000 specimens. Some figurines were broken, but the breaks were unworn and apparently deliberate to suggest age. No parts were missing.
"The author spent two days watching the excavators burrow and dig; during the course of their search they managed to break a number of authentic prehistoric objects. On the second day the two struck a cache and the author examined the material in situ. The cache had been very recently buried by digging a down sloping tunnel into the black fill dirt of the prehistoric room. This fill ran to a depth of approximately 1.30 m. Within the stratum there were authentic Tarascan sherds, obsidian blades, tripod metates, manos, etc., but these objects held no concern for the excavators. In burying the cache of figurines, the natives had unwittingly cut some 15 cms. below the black fill into the sterile red earth floor of the prehistoric room. In back-filling the tunnel they mixed this red sterile earth with black earth; the tracing of their original excavation was, as a result, a simple task" (Di Peso 1953, 388).
Fresh manure was found in the tunnel fill.
Fingerprints were found in freshly packed earth that filled an excavated bowl.
The story of their discovery gives a motive for fraud. Waldemar Julsrud, who hired workers to excavate a Chupicuaro site in 1945, paid workers a peso apiece for intact figurines. It very well may have been more economical for the workers to make figurines than to discover and excavate them. Given the quantity that he received, the contribution to the peasants' economy would have been substantial.
The figurines are not from the Chupicuaro. They came from within a single-component Tarascan ruin. The Tarascan are post-classical and historical, emerging between 900 and 1522 C.E.
If authentic, the figurines imply even more archeological anomalies:
If the figurines really were based on actual dinosaurs, why have no dinosaur fossils been found in the Acambaro region?
Why did no other Mexican cultures record any dinosaurs?
What caused the dinosaurs to disappear in the last 1,100 years?
There is no credible information to support the claims. The only sources are pseudoscience journalists, creationists, and crackpots, who have obvious ulterior motives for gullibility. Their own dating results are discordant with each other and with the ages of the native cultures, and even attempting to do carbon dating on the inorganic figurines shows their incompetence.
References:
Di Peso, Charles C., 1953. (see below)
Further Reading:
Di Peso, Charles C., 1953. The clay figurines of Acambaro, Guanajuato, Mexico. American Antiquity 18(4): 388-389.
The figurines show every evidence of being recent folk art, fraudulently buried in an archeological excavation. De Peso (1953) made the following observations:
The surfaces of the figurines were new. They were not marred by a patina or coating of soluble salts characteristic of genuinely old artifacts from the same area. The owner said none of the figures had been washed in acid. Edges of depressions were sharp and new. No dirt was packed into crevices.
Genuine archeological relics of fragile items are almost always found in fragments. Finding more than 30,000 such items in pristine condition is unheard of. The excavators of the artifacts were "neither careful nor experienced" in their field technique, yet no marks of their shovels, mattocks, or picks were noted in any of the 32,000 specimens. Some figurines were broken, but the breaks were unworn and apparently deliberate to suggest age. No parts were missing.
"The author spent two days watching the excavators burrow and dig; during the course of their search they managed to break a number of authentic prehistoric objects. On the second day the two struck a cache and the author examined the material in situ. The cache had been very recently buried by digging a down sloping tunnel into the black fill dirt of the prehistoric room. This fill ran to a depth of approximately 1.30 m. Within the stratum there were authentic Tarascan sherds, obsidian blades, tripod metates, manos, etc., but these objects held no concern for the excavators. In burying the cache of figurines, the natives had unwittingly cut some 15 cms. below the black fill into the sterile red earth floor of the prehistoric room. In back-filling the tunnel they mixed this red sterile earth with black earth; the tracing of their original excavation was, as a result, a simple task" (Di Peso 1953, 388).
Fresh manure was found in the tunnel fill.
Fingerprints were found in freshly packed earth that filled an excavated bowl.
The story of their discovery gives a motive for fraud. Waldemar Julsrud, who hired workers to excavate a Chupicuaro site in 1945, paid workers a peso apiece for intact figurines. It very well may have been more economical for the workers to make figurines than to discover and excavate them. Given the quantity that he received, the contribution to the peasants' economy would have been substantial.
The figurines are not from the Chupicuaro. They came from within a single-component Tarascan ruin. The Tarascan are post-classical and historical, emerging between 900 and 1522 C.E.
If authentic, the figurines imply even more archeological anomalies:
If the figurines really were based on actual dinosaurs, why have no dinosaur fossils been found in the Acambaro region?
Why did no other Mexican cultures record any dinosaurs?
What caused the dinosaurs to disappear in the last 1,100 years?
There is no credible information to support the claims. The only sources are pseudoscience journalists, creationists, and crackpots, who have obvious ulterior motives for gullibility. Their own dating results are discordant with each other and with the ages of the native cultures, and even attempting to do carbon dating on the inorganic figurines shows their incompetence.
References:
Di Peso, Charles C., 1953. (see below)
Further Reading:
Di Peso, Charles C., 1953. The clay figurines of Acambaro, Guanajuato, Mexico. American Antiquity 18(4): 388-389.
Source
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 06:40 PM)
and read the report, don't just look at the pictures.
http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm#initial
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http://www.bible.ca/tracks/tracks-acambaro.htm#initial
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Take a chill pill buddy
i can't speak for anyone else but this is the fourth time i've seen these pictures
after a while you get to notice things
like the
on checking for Berkshire U.K. in the telephone hotlines in your own home town"
i got "Phone the main world telephone hotline: 1-905-575-4564.
When someone answers say, "Is this the hotline for the bible.ca website?""
OR
Click here to try searching a second time
OR
Click here to send E-mail request, give your country, state and city
So now i have a dilemma. Would it be quicker to e mail my repentance for my evil sins to the e mail adress or phone up the "main world telephone hotline".
So i supsect somethings up because i always thought that this was the main world so i can hardly go phoning myself can i
Any suggestions as to what i do now (if anatomically possible)
either phone my world main hotline telephone and When someone answers say "Hi i'm an idiot" or click
here
for a direct e mail link to God
still can't get part the god thing eh? i found this link on the dinosaur figurines from another non religious site supporting the same theory. i am not trying to defend either the belief that man ad dinosaur lived together, or they didn't. i am trying to have a discussion about it, and yet we are still stuck on god. this topic has nothing to do with religion stop trying to make it. you can't debunk something because it is supported by christains. not all of them are crakpots. the only person that has posted anything agruing in one way or another is shaftsbury. at least he has added to a discussion, rather than argue about god all day. does every thread have to relate back to someone's issue with there being a god?
Well, I have just finished reading the report, and I have to say that it sounds every bit as detailed and valid as that made by Michell-Hedges about the Crystal Skull. Of course, that turned out to be a hoax as well.
I searched through all the sources listed, but was unable to find any of the Archeology or American Antiquities articles. The other sources, not being credible in nature, would not have served as evidence of anything.
I feel the need to point out a certain part of the report. Towards the end, when the author is excited over the discovery of a spiny tailed figurine, he makes the claim that there is not merely one, but numerous different dinosaurs, all perfectly stylized in the pottery. Now think about this: He is saying that a viable breeding population of megafauna, of giant dinosaurs, meaning at the very least 25 to 50 animals per generation per species (how many different dinosaurs where there walking around in Meso-America?) survived 65 million years longer than we thought, and yet, the only trace of them are these figurines. We have entire mammoths from ten thousand years ago, and from this astounding number of forty-foot beast we have nothing?
Doesn't that at least merit a raised eyebrow?
Incidentally, here is one of the figurines that is alleged to represent a spiny dinosaur: I personally cannot se it it. Frankly, it resembles the standard mythological dragon beast that all cultures turn their local lizards into.
I searched through all the sources listed, but was unable to find any of the Archeology or American Antiquities articles. The other sources, not being credible in nature, would not have served as evidence of anything.
I feel the need to point out a certain part of the report. Towards the end, when the author is excited over the discovery of a spiny tailed figurine, he makes the claim that there is not merely one, but numerous different dinosaurs, all perfectly stylized in the pottery. Now think about this: He is saying that a viable breeding population of megafauna, of giant dinosaurs, meaning at the very least 25 to 50 animals per generation per species (how many different dinosaurs where there walking around in Meso-America?) survived 65 million years longer than we thought, and yet, the only trace of them are these figurines. We have entire mammoths from ten thousand years ago, and from this astounding number of forty-foot beast we have nothing?
Doesn't that at least merit a raised eyebrow?
Incidentally, here is one of the figurines that is alleged to represent a spiny dinosaur: I personally cannot se it it. Frankly, it resembles the standard mythological dragon beast that all cultures turn their local lizards into.
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 07:11 PM)
still can't get part the god thing eh? i found this link on the dinosaur figurines from another non religious site supporting the same theory. i am not trying to defend either the belief that man ad dinosaur lived together, or they didn't. i am trying to have a discussion about it, and yet we are still stuck on god. this topic has nothing to do with religion stop trying to make it. you can't debunk something because it is supported by christains. not all of them are crakpots. the only person that has posted anything agruing in one way or another is shaftsbury. at least he has added to a discussion, rather than argue about god all day. does every thread have to relate back to someone's issue with there being a god?
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You're missing the point
this is a put up job seized upon by a bunch of creationists and as such is not worth discussing. It can not be discussed without mentioning religion because its religious fraud
kapeesh ?
http://www.ntskeptics.org/1999/1999october/october1999.htm
P.S. you didn't post the link from "another" non christian website that supports the same theory. You realise of course that would make it "the first" non christian website and not "another" non christian website
I do hope it doesn't have Omni in the addy
I visited the site and for the 1st time saw a group of the figurines.
What I noticed 1st was the inaccurate depictions. The stegosaur plates on brontosaur bodies.
What other non-saurian animals are in the collection? How accurate are they?
Could these be art??? Are they the meso-american equivalents of Don Maitz and Michael Whelan???
Some of them look like descriptions of "the great unknown of the seas" sea serpents.
Of course the creationist morons would use this to "prove" that men lived in the age of dinosaurs.
It may be that some creatures survived to the age of man.
the creators of these figures based them on something. What?, is the question.
It would be nice if a real dinosaur expert looked at the figures with an eye towards figuring out what animals they were based on.
What I noticed 1st was the inaccurate depictions. The stegosaur plates on brontosaur bodies.
What other non-saurian animals are in the collection? How accurate are they?
Could these be art??? Are they the meso-american equivalents of Don Maitz and Michael Whelan???
Some of them look like descriptions of "the great unknown of the seas" sea serpents.
Of course the creationist morons would use this to "prove" that men lived in the age of dinosaurs.
It may be that some creatures survived to the age of man.
the creators of these figures based them on something. What?, is the question.
It would be nice if a real dinosaur expert looked at the figures with an eye towards figuring out what animals they were based on.
The whole thing is a creationist stunt
please forget all about them
there are no questions to be answered
please forget all about them
there are no questions to be answered
I believe the article that Shaftsbury posted pretty much answers all the questions. 
30,000+ figurines. Even at a pseo apiece thats a lot of work.
Maybe the shaftsberry source is right....but..........
Maybe the shaftsberry source is right....but..........
How many would you make if a peso was a weeks wages ?
would you get your family and friends to help ?
would you get your family and friends to help ?
One of the assumptions that that page has is that since the sculptures have the same postures as modern drawings, that the sculptors must have seen the actual animals. Of course the scultptors could have just looked at drawings in a book, and based them on that.
Some of them actually look like the older (1950"s) representations of dinosaurs.
As Aquatus said credibility is imoprtant. Charles Hapgood, I noticed, is one of the researchers into these dino figures. He was also the same guy who said the Piri Reis map was "completely accurate", which of course it wasn't.
Some of them actually look like the older (1950"s) representations of dinosaurs.
As Aquatus said credibility is imoprtant. Charles Hapgood, I noticed, is one of the researchers into these dino figures. He was also the same guy who said the Piri Reis map was "completely accurate", which of course it wasn't.
His greatest achievement was the Earth Crust Displacement theory (ECD)
which was wrong as well
which was wrong as well
even if you had a village of 100 working full time thats a guiness feat. i'd like to see some more of this folk art and i wonder if 30,000+ IS A REAL FIGURE?
I'm going to try starting my 1st topic. Big fish ?
look for it. this is my 1st day with this site and i am very new to computers
and 64 years old so it may take some time.
thanx to all
I'm going to try starting my 1st topic. Big fish ?
look for it. this is my 1st day with this site and i am very new to computers
and 64 years old so it may take some time.
thanx to all
QUOTE(Ciraxis @ Jun 15 2005, 06:39 PM)
i suggest that everyone posting here should read the article. just because you have 10000 posts and think yourself some kind of forum god, does not mean you are all knowing. its easy to look like you know everything on here, its easy to make another view other than your own look stupid, just badger and shut down everything they say. it happens everyday on here. well to all of you that think your kings**t, get your head out of your ass before you make a post. you should know what your trying to debunk, before you try and do it. read the article.
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What a joke. Read the arguments before you launch into a torade...
Tell you what guys, I live in Mexico and have an appointment in Acambaro within the next month. Want me to check something out?
QUOTE(iaapac @ Aug 6 2005, 04:37 PM)
Tell you what guys, I live in Mexico and have an appointment in Acambaro within the next month. Want me to check something out?
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Tenochtitlan is quite near there
if you were serious about checking out something wortwhile
only on this biblical soure map from the Dinosaurs of Acambaro they call it mexico city
so how much do they know exactly ?
i think the term in spanish is "Nada"
Seriously, Marduk. I have heard these tales before and supposedly a doctor in Acambaro discovered this huge collection of figurines. I have to confess that I always meant to check on it on prior visits to Acambaro but got involved in other things. I have an appointment later this month at the SABES center in Acambaro and if anyone is truly interested in resolving this thing, I can do some investigation.
QUOTE(iaapac @ Aug 6 2005, 06:03 PM)
Seriously, Marduk. I have heard these tales before and supposedly a doctor in Acambaro discovered this huge collection of figurines. I have to confess that I always meant to check on it on prior visits to Acambaro but got involved in other things. I have an appointment later this month at the SABES center in Acambaro and if anyone is truly interested in resolving this thing, I can do some investigation.
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The doctor and everybody involved in this discovery was a creationist christian
no genuine unbiased archaeologist has ever needed to know more than that
if you read through the site that was posted you'll see that they all have a vested interest in making the world think men and dinosaurs were contemporary.
This has been so seriously debunked over and over again.
It's something that daniken would make a big deal over
See i was serious
its not worth your trouble.
I have said before that religious types make lousy archaeologists
its one of the truest statements i have ever made
QUOTE(marduk @ Aug 6 2005, 02:39 PM)
QUOTE(iaapac @ Aug 6 2005, 06:03 PM)
Seriously, Marduk. I have heard these tales before and supposedly a doctor in Acambaro discovered this huge collection of figurines. I have to confess that I always meant to check on it on prior visits to Acambaro but got involved in other things. I have an appointment later this month at the SABES center in Acambaro and if anyone is truly interested in resolving this thing, I can do some investigation.
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The doctor and everybody involved in this discovery was a creationist christian
no genuine unbiased archaeologist has ever needed to know more than that
if you read through the site that was posted you'll see that they all have a vested interest in making the world think men and dinosaurs were contemporary.
This has been so seriously debunked over and over again.
It's something that daniken would make a big deal over
See i was serious
its not worth your trouble.
I have said before that religious types make lousy archaeologists
its one of the truest statements i have ever made
Agreed. There is also a supposed human footprint over a dinosaur print near Dublin, Texas. At the same time, workers claimed that at the sight of the discovery of Mammoth bones in Coahuila, Mexico, there were spear heads found at the site.
But you and I are on the same page. Fanatic Christians are always trying to conform history to support their beliefs. It is amazing how corrupt they become in their efforts! When the evidences are too numerous to combat, they simply destroy them as they did the great Library at Alexandria and Diocletian who burned the classical works of the Egyptians on alchemy and magic.
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That wasn't done to confirm their beliefs
it was done to hide the truth.
it was done to hide the truth.
I have to say as a Christian I am extremely embarrassed for these people. Anyone with any sense whatsoever should know by now that the earth is NOT only six thousand years old. They need to grow up and let go of some of their pre-concieved notions. My faith is not the least bit threatened by acknowledging that there has been stages of developement of the earth, and in fact there are many theories on this, including one in which the phrase "and the earth was void and without form", actually meant "became void and without form", and that there are
great expanses of time prior to this point that are unknown. Of course, any attempt by Christians to justify faith and science is usually met with scathing
diatribes about bending our beliefs to fit what is known. Those who have made up their minds that Christianity is a baseless, factless religion have the same closed minds that the Christians who hold on to archaic, outdated beliefs do. As for those who say that we can't prove Jesus even existed, then I say prove that he didn't.
This is what faith is all about, and if you don't believe, then that's your perogative.
Another thing that annoys me on these sites is how freely some seem to belittle other peoples beliefs. I for one was always taught to respect others, and their beliefs. I would never dream of confronting a Bhuddist, a Wiccan, or an American Indian and tell them that I though their beliefs were a bunch of crap. But then,
respect is something that seems to be out of style, and these attacks on peoples ideas, religious and otherwise, seem to be hatefulness just for hatefulness sake.
Not very enlightened, is it?
great expanses of time prior to this point that are unknown. Of course, any attempt by Christians to justify faith and science is usually met with scathing
diatribes about bending our beliefs to fit what is known. Those who have made up their minds that Christianity is a baseless, factless religion have the same closed minds that the Christians who hold on to archaic, outdated beliefs do. As for those who say that we can't prove Jesus even existed, then I say prove that he didn't.
This is what faith is all about, and if you don't believe, then that's your perogative.
Another thing that annoys me on these sites is how freely some seem to belittle other peoples beliefs. I for one was always taught to respect others, and their beliefs. I would never dream of confronting a Bhuddist, a Wiccan, or an American Indian and tell them that I though their beliefs were a bunch of crap. But then,
respect is something that seems to be out of style, and these attacks on peoples ideas, religious and otherwise, seem to be hatefulness just for hatefulness sake.
Not very enlightened, is it?
P.S. And FYI, I don't put much stock in most "bible" sites either, most seem to be run by the same type head in the sand people.
QUOTE(staver @ Aug 6 2005, 09:39 PM)
P.S. And FYI, I don't put much stock in most "bible" sites either, most seem to be run by the same type head in the sand people.
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I'm gonna nominate you for newbie of the year award
well said
Why thank you 
Staver- Well said!
I myself don't believe in a Sentien Thinking God, but I also feel that we all need to believe in something. A "You have your beliefs, I have mine" sort of deal.
I may offer a differant interpretation, or an alternate possibility, but would never ridicule their beliefs... it's not nice... and if they're right... you're screwed! LOL
Glad to have you on UM!
I myself don't believe in a Sentien Thinking God, but I also feel that we all need to believe in something. A "You have your beliefs, I have mine" sort of deal.
I may offer a differant interpretation, or an alternate possibility, but would never ridicule their beliefs... it's not nice... and if they're right... you're screwed! LOL
Glad to have you on UM!
QUOTE
This is what faith is all about, and if you don't believe, then that's your perogative.
Another thing that annoys me on these sites is how freely some seem to belittle other peoples beliefs. I for one was always taught to respect others, and their beliefs. I would never dream of confronting a Bhuddist, a Wiccan, or an American Indian and tell them that I though their beliefs were a bunch of crap. But then,
respect is something that seems to be out of style, and these attacks on peoples ideas, religious and otherwise, seem to be hatefulness just for hatefulness sake.
Not very enlightened, is it?
Another thing that annoys me on these sites is how freely some seem to belittle other peoples beliefs. I for one was always taught to respect others, and their beliefs. I would never dream of confronting a Bhuddist, a Wiccan, or an American Indian and tell them that I though their beliefs were a bunch of crap. But then,
respect is something that seems to be out of style, and these attacks on peoples ideas, religious and otherwise, seem to be hatefulness just for hatefulness sake.
Not very enlightened, is it?
I think many fundamental creationists try to validate a fundamental interpertation of the Bible in order to convince people of other religions that Christianity is the only right one. I mean if they already belive in the Bible as truth, then why else do they think that they need to validate it? If they don't believe in it, then they won't try and prove it to be true. If they do believe it, then they don't need to prove it to be true. That's why sites like this tend to be very scathing and demeaning towards other religions. I don't think these people are trying specifically to be mean, but it is just the way they grew up.
I don't have a problem with any spiritual path, but I do have a problem with solicitation.
QUOTE
His greatest achievement was the Earth Crust Displacement theory (ECD)
which was wrong as well
which was wrong as well
See, now if this had some credible researchers or supporters behind it, I would take it more seriously. If they got Jack Horner down there to compare the statues with dinosaurs found in the area, and he gave it the thumbs up, that would really be something. I was also surprised by the plethora of species of dinos depicited, I don't know what kinds have been dug up near there, but I doubt was as much diversity.
QUOTE(Byuu94 @ Aug 6 2005, 10:56 PM)
I think many fundamental creationists try to validate a fundamental interpertation of the Bible in order to convince people of other religions that Christianity is the only right one. I mean if they already belive in the Bible as truth, then why else do they think that they need to validate it?
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I completely agree with that. If they are so doggone zealous about the truth of the scriptures, don't they think God has everything pretty much under control? Why in the world do they think he needs any help from them?
QUOTE(JennRose @ Aug 7 2005, 03:05 AM)
QUOTE(Byuu94 @ Aug 6 2005, 10:56 PM)
I think many fundamental creationists try to validate a fundamental interpertation of the Bible in order to convince people of other religions that Christianity is the only right one. I mean if they already belive in the Bible as truth, then why else do they think that they need to validate it?
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I completely agree with that. If they are so doggone zealous about the truth of the scriptures, don't they think God has everything pretty much under control? Why in the world do they think he needs any help from them?
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I completely agree. I don't pretend to have all the answers, there's a scripture somewhere that says "We see as through a glass darkly". I always took that to mean things weren't quite the way we thought they were anyway, so I gave up trying to put God in a box a long time ago. I just think some people have some
irrational need for the box.
I even heard one creationist claim that they were the blueprints made by god before breathing life into the second verson of his creations
we're all made from clay remember
fruitcake city
we're all made from clay remember
fruitcake city
QUOTE(marduk @ Aug 7 2005, 05:05 PM)
I even heard one creationist claim that they were the blueprints made by god before breathing life into the second verson of his creations
we're all made from clay remember
fruitcake city
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we're all made from clay remember
fruitcake city
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You have GOT to be kidding me.
Some of these people should be writing fiction.
Or not.
Sad.
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