For the love of God! Man, I've been reading up on these posts, and all I see is "I can do Psi", and "No, you can't". Bickering doesn't do ANYTHING. Nothing. It solves nothing. I get sick of bickering and I also get sick of, "I can't prove it, but it's true".

I'll tell you what. In aaaallll of the these posts, I've not seen ONE ultimate, "This is how you do it" guide. If someone who believes themselves to be knowledgeable on the subject of PSI will post right here, in one post, what to do (instructions), I, myself will give it a try with a completely open mind. I will get back with my findings. IF anyone can give me instructions in a clear, legible and coherent way, I will definately give it my very best shot.

Now, bring it.

One other thing. Don't refer me to some obscure website. I want to know what you, in your infinite wisdom, is doing to change the laws of physics as we know them.

Well, I have given an ultimate 'why no-one provides proof post'.

Are you willing to comit time to it? If you are I will post a very long article that I wrote.

We know why, Ed. But from an optimistic viewpoint, the thing is, it really is hard to present believable evidence when you're not in person. That is why I've made this suggestion. If someone can bring me to the fold, then better for them.

Aquatus gave a guide earlier. He actually did.

I am not sure which thread it is in though.

Go ahead, sir. Just post it here so others can do the same experiment if they so wish.

And yes, if this will teach me that everything that we know is wrong, then I will find the time. I'm serious.

It's not exactly in order but oh well.


Since the first thing you should start out with tk is the psi wheel I have a tutorial. First of all, you'll have to make one. Fold a peice of tin foil in half both ways and then diagonaly both ways and place it on a thumb tack or needle. It shold look something like a pyramid. Note, wind and vibrations can easily move your psiwheel, espicially if it's large and made of tin foil because it will pick up more wind and tin foil is much smoother and will glide easier so put it under an air tight container and make sure you don't bang the table. Go somewhere quiet and peaceful where you can relax and won't be disturbed, I suggest meditation before doing this exercise if you're a novice. You need to focus on the wheel and the wheel only. Try and clear you mind of all thoughts. You can think about supper and walking the dog later, right now you need to focus on your wheel. Observe every inch of it. Once you feel you have a connection start using whatever technique you'd like to use. I will post a couple because I don't want you to feel restrained to just one method.
1.The famous Just do it method: Just do it. There's nothing more to it. When you write with a pencil you just do it, right. You don't say "Hand pick up pencil, fingers move pencil.etc." You just do it. This method is very hard to explain but you'll eventually get it.
2. Fool your sub conscious: Your sub conscious os very gullable and can be fooled easily. You tell it things like "Did you see it move?" or "It move a little, that was you do it again.". Things like that. Eventually your sub conscious will kick in and say "Hey, I'm doing this. Maybe I should do it some more."
3. Make yourself beleive you have to: Just tell yourself things like "I have to do this, it needs to be done.".
4. Visualization: Some people can do tk by visualizing it. Just stare at it and imagine it moving. Watch it move in your head. Know how it's going to move. It should be like a movie you've seen several times.
5. Energy manipulation: Emit energy from your fingertips into the wheel and it will turn in the direction that you're sending the psi.
6. Some tips: Placing your hands very close to the wheel helps me and most people. Don't become dependent on it though. It will make performing tk from a distance more diffacult. Always stay relaxed, don't get frustrated if you don't get immediate results. Just like anything else this takes time. Be patient, these skills take time. If you're having problems after a month or so and you've really been trying look for other ways to do it.
Here are a few more things you should know.
Safety: Be safe, oyu shouldn't over work your self. If you become tired or start hurting you should stop whatever you're doing and get a glass of water or lay down. This is the same as working your physical body, if you do to much without rest you CAN die or seiously hurt yourself.
Practice daily. And I don't mean try for a few minutes and then quit. You need to work on it for about 2o to 30 minutes.
Even if you don't get results your still learning. Just because it doesn't happen doesn't mean that you're not learning. Everytime you try you're teaching your sub conscious how to do it. The longer you do tk the stronger you become because you're teaching your self.

Sorry to offend you all it would seem ive struck a cord i really could care less about grammer under such circumstances and you ghost it makes no difference to me how many sceptics there are im simply telling the truth, i have no need to talk to fools who chase the wind. If you find buddha kill him, enlightenment, is personal, of what use is psi levitation other than mundane caprice. To add: i beleive this is my third graduation, TO KEEP SILENT. So goodbye i do away with this foolish bickering and shall once again return to the eternal sanctuary. SO LONG, and may the ONE and ALL be your guide. BLESSINGS everlasting from a fellow human.

Go away already.

Yes, please do. All you did was proove that you are more full of it then we already thought you were.

Okay, a couple of questions.

Making a psi wheel-Let's say I have a tack upside down on a flat surface that I have verified with a level. I balance the tin foil on the pointy tip in the middle where the folds come to a point, right? Now, to make it air tight would this work? I have a very heavy glass cake cover in a dome shape. Could I line underneath the edges with some fabric or something to make it air tight? And how big should the tin foil square be?

I would suggest sticking a needle into your table or whatever you're going to use, the psi wheel its self doesn't have to be that big. Start with about the size of a silver dollar and fold. Yeah, just use the cake cover, a jelly jar is good too. Line the inside with something like foam or tape the outside with duct tape. But don't be to conserned about that. The chances of air gettingunder there and moving it are slim to none.

to be specific the tin foil square should be 2.5 inches length and width before it's folded

And what about lighting, just out of curiosity?
In an enclosed space like that, if you are attempting something like this in direct sunlight or similar, that could cause convection currents inside the enclosure, correct? That would surely muddle things.

Just do it inside with some dim lighting.

Got it. I'm not planning on doing it outside as too many wind factors and distractions and such can distort the outcome. Any other suggestions will be much appreciated.

hurry up and get to it so we can see the results

hurry up and get to it so we can see the results

sorry about the double posts my computer screwed up

It is a shame that the results won't change anyones mind. They will still believe that these things can be done by the people on this site.

Mr. Ed, I do believe you're right. But I have agreed to go into this with an open mind and display my results. I can't at this point disclose my opinion on any outcome because of this reason. I will say this: In the end, if anything, I, MYSELF, will have an answer. Then, I will be able to argue one way or the other based on what I, MYSELF, have experienced.

And IAC, chill. I'm at work. And I won't be able to start until tomorrow night, anyway. We're getting ready to leave town on Thursday afternoon. Someone else said it best, "Patience is a virtue". Have patience young one, and the answers will come.

And I know there are more experts hanging out in here. I see the posts every day. Any other things to keep in mind?

i see where skeptics are coming from because ecerybody claims to be "psychic" and have powers

psychic-Capable of extraordinary mental processes, such as extrasensory perception and mental telepathy

and everybody could not be psychic because it is extraordinary so i do not know myself if this type of such stuff is true but if it is it's the ordinary losers that just want to be heard that are ruining it for the others that actually have the powers. so what i'm tryin to say

is get proof or get everybody on your side or get out

I seeeee Aquaaaatussss v

Hey guy, could you give me an experiment outline?

Certainly. What is it you wish to accomplish?

This is what you said earlier. I wonder if it would come in handy now...

Thanks, Ed. My blonde is showing. I just read this a little while ago.

Aquatus, that's ok. I'll just report my findings in my own unique and charismatic way, I guess. Otherwise, it just wouldn't be much fun.

It will, but thruthfully, 90% of the problems I have seen come from setting up an experiment incorrectly, rather than any actual theory work being done.

So Aquatus, can you tell me how to set up a psi wheel? I've never even given this much thought.

Setting up a psi wheel is pretty easy. Getting anything conclusive out of it is another question altogether.

Here are my instructions:

1) Get an ordinary school eraser, either pink or white, depending on your color preferance.

2) Get a sewing needle, standard size.

3) Get a square piece of paper about four inches or so on the side. You can buy these pre-cut at craft stores for making origami and such.

Take your square paper and fold it diagonally, making a crease from one point to the opposite point, crossing the middle. Unfold it and crease it again using the other two corners. Unfold it again and you now have a square piece of paper with a creased X in the middle. This both gives you the exact center of the paper and gives it a bit of a concave shape so it balances more easily. Set it aside for now.

Take your needle and stick it vertically into the eraser head first, meaning that the pointy end is sticking out and pointing at the ceiling. Now, take the paper you creased earlier and balance the middle of the X on the tip of the needle. Be gentle, don't press down on it; the point is for the paper to just sit on the needle.

Congratulations, you have just made a psi-wheel.

Now, take a moment to look at your psi-wheel. The first thing you will probably notice is that it is quite likely moving a bit. I'm afraid to say that this isn't any sign of any latent abilities you may have. This crude psi-wheel is simple trying to find its balance (yes, it is unbalanced, no matter how good you are at creasing). The paper is balanced so delicately on the needle that pretty much any external force, no matter how minute, is likely to affect it. So, how can we use this for our purposes?

We build a second psi-wheel. This will be what is referred to as your control. While you are testing your first wheel, this second wheel will be under observation. The purpose of this wheel is to show whether or not the movement of the first wheel is due to the experiment, or to some external factor. This step alone would be enough to invalidate half the experiments that are claimed here as proof .

Shall I continue with the actual experiment?

Please do, sir.

All right then, most experiments, obviously, take place in laboratories where external factors can be kept to a minimum. Since few of us here have access to these sorts of facilities, we will do what we can.

Experiment #1: The first thing to do is to test whether or not you can move the thing at all. Have a seat at your local table, either dining, kitchen, or otherwise. Ideally, it should be fairly stable and solid.

Place the psi-wheel directly in front of you. You should be able to comfortably rest your hands cupped under and around the base of the wheel, giving it enough clearance to spin freely if it so chooses to do so. Relax. Think of the mystical energies flowing freely from your mind, through your hands, shining gloriously through your palms, and gently nudging the wheel forward.

Alternatively, think of last Sunday's football game. Either way, relax.

For me, it worked the first time out, and it spun quite readily. I would strongly expect the same to happen to you. With your hands cupped under the wheel, it should begin spinning around the needle in a fairly obvious way.

Congratulations! You have spun the psi-wheel!

That was the easy part. Here's the hard part: trying to figure out why it happened. The simple fact of the matter is that there are far too many variables involved that could be responsible for spinning the wheel. Any future experiments we make will have to remove those factors as well.

As far as explanations for this go, however, here is the most likely one. Your hand, cupped together, with blood freely flowing through them, give off heat. Heat rises up through the top. Your hands are cupped together, meaning that the only path the air has to re-enter and fill up your cupped hands is through the gap between your wrists and your fingertips. The air enters through here, swirls around your palms, heating up, then rises out of your cupped hands, at the same time imparting a spin to the wheel. There are a variety of ways to test this out, but I will leave them to your imagination, as our goals are to explain far loftier things than this in Experiment #2.

To be continued...

Title of Thread:

You know...sometimes it's good to be skeptical.

I am skeptical about:
Aliens/Extraterrestrials
Ancient Mysteries
Conspiracy Stuff (yuck)
Ghosts

If you are skeptical about something, and you try to do research on it, your head would be a little more screwed on straight than if you were a fanatic believer and tried to prove everything.

Some alien threads I go to some people just don't give up...

However it is also wise to be open minded and to accept the possibility that it might be real.


You also need to be logical and you need to treat your...uh... believer counterparts with decency.


Follow the steps above and you will learn a lot about the world around you, and of course, yourself.

Wait a minute. Aquatus, I thought the wheel sat on the table. You're supposed to touch it or hold it or something? I can't imagine that would give you any kind of positive results. My hands shake too much.

The wheel does sit on a table. Your hands are also on the table, cupped around the base of the wheel. Don't actually touch it.

Okay, I think I see. My arms will be sort of alongside the airtight dome resting on the table, right?

No airtight dome in my example yet. One step at a time, one step at a time.

Putting your hands near it isn't very wise. It will make distance tk, performing telekinesis across the room, very hard and can easily provide false results. I strongly suggest looking at and even joining http://www.ppsociety.com and http://www.psipog.net You can find me at both of those sites and there are many many many things there that will help you. Trust me, you won't get very far without some sites alog the way. I also suggest working with psionics/energy manipulation.

This isn't about wisdom. This is about learning the proper way to go about setting up an experiment. As I said at the very beginning of Experiment 1, the purpose of this experiment was to see if you could move the wheel. It wasn't to see if you had psychic powers, but simply to see if you could make the wheel move without touching it.

This is not a training guide for developing TK. The problem with such a thing is that it assumes the existance of TK, where there is no reason to do so. The purpose of these experiments is to eliminate all the known variables that could make the wheel turn, so that, once all the variables are removed and we still have an unexplained phenomena, we might then have reason to believe the existance of TK.

Ghost, remember the pre-requisites: Allow the data to lead you to the results. Don't start at the end and assume the beginning. Let what you learn from the experiment tell you if TK exists. Don't assume TK exists, and then expect the experiment to confirm it for you. As you yourself pointed out earlier, it is entirely too easy to make your brain believe practically anything.

HAHAHA That's the stupidest thing I've ever seen!
Go meditate some more, it might help you with your spelling and grammar.

You've never seen them. And a typo or two doesn't suddenly mean they're an idiot. I won't blindly believe in his claims, but I generally believe in certain aspects of psi. Please stop taunting people for no apparent reason and making no sense whatsoever in the process.

Its apparent to me that none of you have an idea how a controlled experiment goes.

Aquatus your psi wheel "control" method is questionable purely because the wheels you gonna make are not identical. It also lacks any accuracy in eliminating variables that may influence the wheels movements. The hand made wheel has too many imperfections to even be used properly.



The sites are set by people who are trully misguided and obsessed beyond belief. I visited those some time back to check on the "proof" they provide and the footage leaves alot to be desired. The most striking though is giving advise without any credentials of any kind. Its easy for someone to say"concentrate" and all that nonsense but does that really help anyone? I don't think so. This to me is just like religion. People coerse others to a certain belief by exploiting peoples inner needs. the sooner you wake up to this the better. None on this planet can claim to be able to reproduce this phenomena consistently, nor are they fit to teach others. Doesn't that bother any of you?

My experiments are designed more for the purpose of introducing the new explorers to the facets of scientific research, rather than providing conclusive proof of any sort of psychic phenomena. I have already stated that they are designed more with the kitchen table in mind, rather than the laboratory. A control made to the same standards as the test model will be sufficient for our purposes.

Now, I would take a moment and look back on your approach to teaching. All you have essentially done is put down other peoples claims and made your own in return, effectively doing nothing more than the claimants themselves. Having them take your word on the matter is just as bad as having them take someone elses, even if you turn out to be correct. I, on the other hand, with the series of experiments I am outlining, intend to walk through the exact same process that most of these youngsters have, showing them were they made assumptions that did not warrant making, and were the logical errors of the conclusions arose. I have already made clear what the purpose of the first experiment was, and also that we have not yet removed many of the variables that could also have been responsible for the wheels rotation.

Prior to boldly stating "Its apparent to me that none of you have an idea how a controlled experiment goes. ", I would suggest you read the experiment in its entirety, and avoid making assumptions that were clearly covered before.

What you term "sufficient" I term sloppy.

I am not the one making bold statements here. "Your" experiments are nothing more than common sense. If they don't have that in the first place then there is little point. Your intention of introducing a scientific approach is admirable but you know well as I, that none of this is going to change anything. Unless on of them gets tested by some legitimate research body and confirmed as an oddity, neither I or others will take this seriously for similar personal claims.

Regarding teachings...I never make any nor am I here to argue. I don't have to back myself with any facts since these kinds of posts don't produce any to begin with. To come here and be utterly convinced you can make things like psi balls and telekinesis and actually offer advise being an adept at the age of 13 is beyond discussion.

Stop being a goody goody and don't let people take you for a ride. If they were interested in learning they would read a book or two on physics and biology. If they want to post more like this though they can go to that psipog site or whatever...

Again, all you have done is put down other peoples claims and made your own in return



You do not consider this: "Its apparent to me that none of you have an idea how a controlled experiment goes." a bold claim?



Quite the contrary. If they (I'm assuming you are referring to the claimants) lack common sense, then it is only logical to teach where the lack is.



I have no interest in changing their believes. My sole purpose here is to show them the difference between a properly conducted experiment that leads to a conclusion, as opposed to a belief taken on faith. I will be quite satisfied if I can succeed at that. As I have said before, this has nothing to do with proving psychic abilities to the world.



Then cease commenting on those who are attempting to teach, whether or not you consider it a worthwhile endevour.



Not everyone likes to read. Different sorts of people learn in different ways. Some are not even aware that there are different ways of learning. The job of someone who wishes to teach is to find the best manner of imparting that information on a student, and I have yet to encounter a situation in which belittling a students knowledge has encouraged them to continue onward. As a teaching method, I consider it equivalent to tossing a child out of a boat and expecting them to learn how to swim.

And you don't? ....fancy that?



Its a fact....if anyone ever done research in this forum they will know. I am not going to elaborate before you present your credentials. Bold claims is what you do with "your" experiments and the kids with their super powers...phew



Yeah....you seem to be down to earth...they are orbiting pluto



Get of your high chair master yoda. Others have tried here, myself included, to point out that people need to be a bit more sceptical and inquisitive. Do you think they care? They know already apparently...don't you read anyhting?



I agree some kids find it difficult to study....however if they find this easier, then why do they reject the information given here and stick to their own little world? Maybe they need to be tossed....worked for the Spartans.

That is correct. I have not put anyone down in this thread.



No. What I do with my experiments is exactly what I claim to do with my experiments at the very beginning of them. There is nothing bold about this, as everything is laid out clearly from step one. You, on the other hand, make an opinion, and a clearly condescending one too, and then proceed to call it a fact.



And my objective is too have them see that. They can decide whether to attempt a re-entry themselves.



Quite a bit. If you have given up attempting to teach...assuming you ever tried...then that is your choice. Cease critizing others for deciding to continue. Your decision that others do not care and believe they know everything already is not mine, and I will not stop trying to teach simply because you have given up.



I suggest the reason they stick to their own little world is because the manner in which you have greeted them immediately creates a defensive attitude. No one likes to be told they are idiots. No one likes to be wrong. If that is the first response they get, then you should not be surprised to see them turn their backs on you. Pointing out that they need to be a bit more sceptical and inquisitive, particularly in the manner that you have shown here, is not enough. Frankly, a great majority of these people do not know how to be more skeptical and inquisitive. That is why they need to be taught.

That is quite enough on this topic. I remain available for anyone who wishes to continue the series of experiemnts on whether the psi-wheel can measure any sort of telekinetic ability. Similarly, if anyone has any questions regarding scientific methodology, I stand ready to answer to the best of my abilities.

Ghost, I never asked: Do you understand the five pre-requisites of scientific methodology?

All this will do is create a convection current which will move the psi wheel and not actual TK. I have debated with Bio-Mage before about the possibility of TK and I'm actually on the side for it, but psi wheels by no means prove or demonstrate TK abilities. I would trash this experiment and not even teach it since its been debunked many times over.

Its weird that someone who obviously does not believe in the subject would be so upset. It has a personal tone to it, does someone in their family have a psi in the family they are ashamed of?. I myself have a special gift but it isn't super natural. I can tell how people are feeling just by looking at them. My brain seems to be able to instantly "read" from body posture, facial expresions and sometimes breathing what kind of emotional state a person is in. Its a function of my many years working in a public capacity, its mostly common sense, but not everybody can do it. I believe the mind has more ability and use than is more commonly known today. I get deja vu all the time, but maybe its my subconciuos mind putting memories together i don't know. I've missed death twice because I had a bad feeling, both horrific car crashes, could be fluke. The point is, there is now and always will be more for the human mind to understand than is possible for the human mind to understand. No one person can give the answers the answers come from a collection of ALL knowledge together. harmony is the only answer. Its like a puzzle and each representation of humanity has a piece, apart its chaos and confusion, together its cohesion and order.

Yes, I explained the convection current on the post with the actual experiment (does no one ever finish reading posts anymore?). These experiments are for those who believe the psi-wheel does indicate psychic powers. Those who do not believe can read it for their amusement.

i know exactly what you mean it's almost humorous it's like your not gonna care how your friend spends his money because it's his money not yours!!!

exactly