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Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums > Unexplained Mysteries > Spirituality vs Skepticism
Megalomania
This is about the BIBLE. Not GOD.
So if you're going to come hare and discuss the existance of God, you can go kick the bucket for being a spammer.

I personally don't believe that the Bible is correct, in any way.
Becuase quite frankly, by the time you get to the end of the flood, if it was real, then most animals would be dead.

The whole Bible just seems stupid.

For example, with Noah,

1. How on Earth did he travel to Antarctica and other such countries to get the Polar Bears and other rare animals?
2. He got EXACTLY 2 of each animal into his Ark, what stops the predators from eating other animals?
3. How did he feed the herbivores?
4. Why didn't the termites lay eggs i nthe Ark, and breed a lot, then destroy the Ark?
5. Some animals (mosquitoes) live for only 7 days. And a certain bug's heart rots after 12 hours, causing death. He only got 2 of each animal. Why are they still existant if they would have died?
6. Noah landed on a high mountain in Turkey. How did all the animals get back into their natural habitats?
7. If trees get to much water, and stay waterlogged for a long period of time, they die. They drown. Why are there still trees?

Like come on, I'm not even trying, and these are only from Noah....

So give me your opinions wink2.gif

~Replacement
Essan
IMO the Old Testament is to the people of Judah and Israel what Geofrey of Mommouth's History of the Kings of Britain is to the people of Britain. A collection of folk tales and legends, melded into a continous narrative to present an attempt at a history. Deep within are some elements based on real events, but most of it is fiction.

(I'm assuming no-one believes that King Arthur defeated the Roman Empire and rules the whole of Western Europe including Scandinavia? wink2.gif )
JMPD1
I agree with Essan. There are parts of the book that read like a family tree. Other parts are as fantascial as any other ethnic saga.

Beowulf anyone?

Or the stories of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Firbolgs.
hoaryhead
[FONT=Times][SIZE=7]
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 25 2005, 07:31 AM)
I agree with Essan.  There are parts of the book that read like a family tree.  Other parts are as fantascial as any other ethnic saga.

Beowulf anyone?

Or the stories of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Firbolgs.
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REPLY: God predicted these historical events:
1) Adam would die; 2) Egypt would mistreat Israel (Gen 15); 3) God would punish Egypt (Ex 5-20); 4) Babylon would destroy Jerusalem (Eze 5.12);
5) Babylon would fall (Isa 13 & 14); and First World War; and Fall of (Spiritual) Babylon in 1870.

Who can doubt the Bible with a record like that?

hoaryhead@hotmail.com
iaapac
QUOTE(hoaryhead @ Aug 25 2005, 03:30 PM)
[FONT=Times][SIZE=7]
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 25 2005, 07:31 AM)
I agree with Essan.  There are parts of the book that read like a family tree.  Other parts are as fantascial as any other ethnic saga.

Beowulf anyone?

Or the stories of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Firbolgs.
[right][snapback]808675[/snapback][/right]


REPLY: God predicted these historical events:
1) Adam would die; 2) Egypt would mistreat Israel (Gen 15); 3) God would punish Egypt (Ex 5-20); 4) Babylon would destroy Jerusalem (Eze 5.12);
5) Babylon would fall (Isa 13 & 14); and First World War; and Fall of (Spiritual) Babylon in 1870.

Who can doubt the Bible with a record like that?

hoaryhead@hotmail.com


Well, it depends on who is doing the interpreting, doesn't it? How many serious Biblical experts, for example, would agree with you that the Bible predicted World War I?
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JMPD1
QUOTE(hoaryhead @ Aug 25 2005, 01:00 PM)
[REPLY: God predicted these historical events:
1) Adam would die;  2) Egypt would mistreat Israel (Gen 15);  3) God would punish Egypt (Ex 5-20);  4) Babylon would destroy Jerusalem (Eze 5.12);
5) Babylon would fall (Isa 13 & 14); and First World War; and Fall of (Spiritual) Babylon in 1870.

Who can doubt the Bible with a record like that?

hoaryhead@hotmail.com
[right][snapback]809109[/snapback][/right]


Ah yes, the old "the bible is true because the bible says it true so it must be true because the bible says so" argument.

And WHERE does it predict the first world war?

And who is going to win the world series this year? I need to place a bet.
zandore
IMO-The Bible makes for some boring fiction. sleepy.gif

QUOTE(hoaryhead)
REPLY: God predicted these historical events:
1) Adam would die; 2) Egypt would mistreat Israel (Gen 15); 3) God would punish Egypt (Ex 5-20); 4) Babylon would destroy Jerusalem (Eze 5.12);
5) Babylon would fall (Isa 13 & 14); and First World War; and Fall of (Spiritual) Babylon in 1870.

Who can doubt the Bible with a record like that?

You can read just about anything into the Bible and how well do you know your religion?

Welcome Hoaryhead to the UM Forum.
Tangerine Sheri
With just a dinky bit of spiritual awareness and a basic sense of ethics the bible
plain as day is not true, Namaste sheri
iaapac
Well put and wholly supported, Sheri.
Purplos
QUOTE(Essan @ Aug 25 2005, 07:08 AM)
IMO the Old Testament is to the people of Judah and Israel what Geofrey of Mommouth's History of the Kings of Britain is to the people of Britain.  A collection of folk tales and legends, melded into a continous narrative to present an attempt at a history.  Deep within are some elements based on real events, but most of it is fiction.

(I'm assuming no-one believes that King Arthur defeated the Roman Empire and rules the whole of Western Europe including Scandinavia? wink2.gif )
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Well, I don't even know what "History of Kings of Britain" is, but I get the general idea. And I agree completely. Its a collection of storyteller history and fables. I still think its an important historical book -- gives a lot of insight into historical ideas.

And I'm a Christian. Well.... kinda.
LarryOldtimer
hoaryhead: REPLY: God predicted these historical events:
1) Adam would die;


Every person dies. What is remarkable about that one? I will go out on a limb, and predict that (name here) will die. How Godlike of me! no.gif

2) Egypt would mistreat Israel (Gen 15);

I will predict that the US will mistreat (country here) Can't miss on that one. The most powerful country is always accused of mistreating the countries with less power . . . by the countries with less power.

3) God would punish Egypt (Ex 5-20);

Hardly a "prediction" when it was "God" who was going to do the punishing. Not so much as a "prediction" as much as a sort of promise. no.gif

4) Babylon would destroy Jerusalem (Eze 5.12);

Babylon was destroying a whole lot of places just then. But wait! Last I looked, Jerusalem was still in existance, and much larger than in those days. Destruction is what Rome did to Carthage! Carthage is no longer in existance. Promises, promises, always promises! no.gif

5) Babylon would fall (Isa 13 & 14);


I predict that (country name here) will fall. Whatever country you choose, I can't miss. no.gif

and First World War;

You have to be making this one up. There is no reference whatsoever in the Bible of WWI

and Fall of (Spiritual) Babylon in 1870.

And just what is the (Spiritual) Babylon you are referring to? The only thing that happened then that I know of was that the pope declared himself (and future popes) to be infallible, whenever he speaks "ex cathedra" on matters of faith and morals. What on Earth fell? Not the Roman Catholic church, for sure.

Who can doubt the Bible with a record like that?

Yes indeedy, looks like the Bible is about 0 for 7, some record. no.gif

So then, tell me some predictions that are made in the Bible of future events which haven't already occured.
SilverCougar
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 25 2005, 12:31 PM)
I agree with Essan.  There are parts of the book that read like a family tree.  Other parts are as fantascial as any other ethnic saga.

Beowulf anyone?

Or the stories of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Firbolgs.
[right][snapback]808675[/snapback][/right]


Hey now! The Tuatha is true!! It really happened!
iaapac
Prophesies are often like the horoscope. If it says that you need to be careful today or you'll have an accident, you try to be careful all day and when there is no accident you say how happy you are that you read your horoscope. If there is an accident you say that your horoscope was right.

Predicitions and prophesies can be manipulated by those who want to prove the unproveable and nothing more.
JMPD1
QUOTE(SilverCougar @ Aug 25 2005, 08:04 PM)
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 25 2005, 12:31 PM)
I agree with Essan.  There are parts of the book that read like a family tree.  Other parts are as fantascial as any other ethnic saga.

Beowulf anyone?

Or the stories of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Firbolgs.
[right][snapback]808675[/snapback][/right]


Hey now! The Tuatha is true!! It really happened!
[right][snapback]809747[/snapback][/right]


Did I spell it right? It has been awhile since I've talked to the cousins. grin2.gif
SilverCougar
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 26 2005, 01:09 AM)
QUOTE(SilverCougar @ Aug 25 2005, 08:04 PM)
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 25 2005, 12:31 PM)
I agree with Essan.  There are parts of the book that read like a family tree.  Other parts are as fantascial as any other ethnic saga.

Beowulf anyone?

Or the stories of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Firbolgs.
[right][snapback]808675[/snapback][/right]


Hey now! The Tuatha is true!! It really happened!
[right][snapback]809747[/snapback][/right]


Did I spell it right? It has been awhile since I've talked to the cousins. grin2.gif
[right][snapback]809756[/snapback][/right]


XD
Tuatha de Danann (the people of the Goddess Danu) are the fairy folk; the fairies, pixies and brownies who inhabit the mounds, or Sidhe, of the Irish countryside.

Yeah yeah.. I believe in poltersprites and the like. Very hard not to when odd things happen. Catch movement and forms by the corner of your eyes. I caught and empty box moving once... Cookies dissapearing...(that ain't being eaten by me or the hubby type)

Though *looks around and frowns abit* If any are Brownies.. they're having corinaries about the mess.
JMPD1
Aye SC, I know of the De Danaan. And the 'gentle folk' too.

My family has a long, long, loooong association with the fey families in Ireland. That is, if the family history is to be believed.
SilverCougar
wink2.gif You asked for the spelling, so I gave it. And a bit of history for people who don't know =)

*ish Irish herself*
theoric
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 25 2005, 05:18 PM)
Aye SC, I know of the De Danaan.  And the 'gentle folk' too.

My family has a long, long, loooong association with the fey families in Ireland.  That is, if the family history is to be believed.
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an irish police officer in new york.... if that doesn't just scream of stereotypes! rofl.gif
JMPD1
Imagine that now.

It gets worse: I come from a long line of Cops.
And those that aren't NYPD, are NYFD

grin2.gif
beowulf
Okay, as JMPD1 requested, Beowulf is front and center:
Let’s see, are the stories of the bible true. Well, it depends on which stories you are referring to. As far as archaeological, geological and historical evidence, you can take the tales of Genesis and toss them out the window. What stories that aren’t directly stolen from older Semite religions are chock full of anachronisms (that means things out of temporal place), such as Ur of the Chaldees, the Chaldean people did not come into being for 2 millennia after Ur flourished (historians believe that the town of Urfa, located near the town of Haran with which many of the patriarchs were plainly associated in the bible is what was referred to).We can chuck Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy also, there is no evidence at all of a sizeable group of people crossing and wandering the Sinai for forty years. The Sinai is practically unchanging, we can identify the campsites of Egyptian miners enroute to one of the mines that Egypt maintained in northern Arabia and can see the unchanged tread marks of German recon cars from WWII and Israeli tanks from the 7 Day War. If there was no Exodus, it follows that there was no Moses, Aaron, tablets with the 10 commandments and all the other bric-a-brac of the four books mentioned. What most Christians (and Jews) fail to understand is that during the period of the supposed Exodus, the whole of Canaan was an Egyptian “protectorate”, with Egyptian forts and Egyptian troops spread from the home land across the Sinai peninsula and at or near all city states. Therefore Joshua can also be canned, those cities that he was supposed to have conquered either had lain in ruins for several centuries (Ai means “ruins” in Hebrew, that should show you what condition that city was in when Joshua was written) or had a resident Egyptian garrison. Somehow I doubt that a ragtag rabble would take on the imperial might of Egypt. Recent excavation has shown that the Hebrew were probably nothing more than the “fringe” element of Canaanite society that during the social upheaval caused by the “Great Mycenaean Drought” slowly migrated into the hill country of Palestine. Archaeologists would expect an abrupt change in building and pottery styles with the incursion of a new people into a land. In this case, the houses and pottery of the Proto-Israelites is identical to that of the mainstream Canaanites and remained so until the Assyrian conquest of Palestine. There is no evidence of David or Solomon, none! It would stand to reason that such a ”pocket Empire” as Israel would maintain diplomatic relations with the larger neighboring Empires of Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, and the Hittites, for no other reason than to ascertain their danger to Israel. Yet there are no diplomatic dispatches from Israel’s King David or to him found in the royal archives of these powers of the ancient world. We have correspondence between Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, and Hatti (the homeland of the Hittites), but there is none for David. If David existed, he was probably nothing more that a bandit chieftain ruling over a small duchy in the Palestinian hill country. Solomon is even more interesting, once again there is no diplomatic correspondence with Solomon of Israel from any of the powers of that period. There was a Solomon, he lived during the period of the Pharaoh Shishak reported in the bible in 1 Kings. However this Solomon (whose name was actually Shalmaneser IV) was a strong king of Assyria at that time. His name Salimanu-eser, means Solomon directs. So it would seem that when the post-exilic scribes codified the OT after 560 BCE, they borrowed more than creation myths from older Semitic cultures. We can safely toss out the books of Judges, Ruth (Jews don’t even recognize that book), 1 Samuel, 2 Samuel, 1 Kings, 2 Kings, 1 Chronicles, 2 Chronicles (with no conquest there would have been no Judges, with no David or Solomon, there would have been no true stories of them, hence 1 Samuel to 2 Chronicles would be naught but myth), the books of the minor prophets Ezra and Nehemiah’s books might hold some small grains of truth, but can’t really be backed by history. Esther can be tossed, this is one of two books in the OT that does not even mention God. There is no evidence of a Hebrew favorite wife of any of the Persian Kings. The story of Job isn’t a Hebrew story. Job was an inhabitant of Uz, location unknown but believed by most Biblicists to be in Arabia. This would make Job a story borrowed from another Semitic culture, reflecting no history and can be thrown out, Psalms and Proverbs are mainly “borrowed” from the sacred writings of the city of Urgarit. A city that was destroyed 100 years before the purported Conquest. These books contain no history (a lot of good poetry, but no history). Ecclesiastes is probably the best book in the bible, it contradicts everything else in the OT but contains no discernable history. Song of Solomon is the second book of the bible that makes no mention of God whatsoever and it too contains no history. Now we finally come to the portion of the bible that contain true stories. From Isaiah through Malachi (with the exception of Daniel) there are kernels of truth and history, you have to dig through the overlay of bias and religion to get at them. With these books, it seems that the scribes codifying the OT took the preserved histories of the short lived nations of Israel and Judea and added an overlay of religion to them. The books after the codification of the OT were added during the Maccabeean reconstitution of the scriptures (to replace those burned by the Greeks) between the 3rd and 1st centuries BCE. It was at this time that the Book of Daniel, with it’s surprisingly accurate prophesies, was written. Daniel is an acknowledged pseudepigrapha, that is a work given the name of a famous man to give it authority. It is very easy to make accurate prophesies if you are doing them centuries after the actual happening. Daniel does contain history, once again heavily overlaid with superstition and religion. I hope this helps you understand about the truth and the myth of the Bible. – The Wolf tongue.gif
Essan
Hey Beowulf: you could have broken that up a bit to make it easier to read tongue.gif But, yeah spot on all with that thumbsup.gif
beowulf
Sorry Essan, I have to write and post between assignments. Sometimes I'm not busy and my work is broken up and easy to read, sometimes (like yesterday and today, when the answer was put together) I am flooded with various assignments (and the Far East can be time consuming), which impacts my posting. Sorry, will try to do better in the future. - The Wolf tongue.gif
Nxt2Hvn
Yes.. I believe that the Bible is the Word of God! thumbsup.gif
beowulf
Hey Nxt2...we both haven't been around recently, but good to hear from you - The Wolf tongue.gif
ramster83
QUOTE(beowulf @ Aug 26 2005, 11:50 PM)
Okay, as JMPD1 requested, Beowulf is front and center:
Let’s see, are the stories of the bible true.  Well, it depends on which stories you are referring to.  As far as archaeological, geological and historical evidence, you can take the tales of Genesis and toss them out the window.  What stories that aren’t directly stolen from older Semite religions are chock full of anachronisms (that means things out of temporal place), such as Ur of the Chaldees, the Chaldean people did not come into being for 2 millennia after Ur flourished (historians believe that the town of Urfa, located near the town of Haran with which many of the patriarchs were plainly associated in the bible is what was referred to).We can chuck Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy also, there is no evidence at all of a sizeable group of people crossing and wandering the Sinai for forty years.  The Sinai is practically unchanging, we can identify the campsites of Egyptian miners enroute to one of the mines that Egypt maintained in northern Arabia and can see the unchanged tread marks of German recon cars from WWII and Israeli tanks from the 7 Day War.  If there was no Exodus, it follows that there was no Moses, Aaron, tablets with the 10 commandments and all the other bric-a-brac of the four books mentioned.  What most Christians (and Jews) fail to understand is that during the period of the supposed Exodus, the whole of Canaan was an Egyptian “protectorate”, with Egyptian forts and Egyptian troops spread from the home land across the Sinai peninsula and at or near all city states.  Therefore Joshua can also be canned, those cities that he was supposed to have conquered either had lain in ruins for several centuries (Ai means “ruins” in Hebrew, that should show you what condition that city was in when Joshua was written) or had a resident Egyptian garrison.  Somehow I doubt that a ragtag rabble would take on the imperial might of Egypt.  Recent excavation has shown that the Hebrew were probably nothing more than the “fringe” element of Canaanite society that during the social upheaval caused by the “Great Mycenaean Drought” slowly migrated into the hill country of Palestine.  Archaeologists would expect an abrupt change in building and pottery styles with the incursion of a new people into a land.  In this case, the houses and pottery of the Proto-Israelites is identical to that of the mainstream Canaanites and remained so until the Assyrian conquest of Palestine. There is no evidence of David or Solomon, none!  It would stand to reason that such a ”pocket Empire” as Israel would maintain diplomatic relations with the larger neighboring Empires of  Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, and the Hittites, for no other reason than to ascertain their danger to Israel.  Yet there are no diplomatic dispatches from Israel’s King David or to him found in the royal archives of these powers of the ancient world.  We have correspondence between Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, and Hatti (the homeland of the Hittites), but there is none for David.  If David existed, he was probably nothing more that a bandit chieftain ruling over a small duchy in the Palestinian hill country.  Solomon is even more interesting, once again there is no diplomatic correspondence with Solomon of Israel from any of the powers of that period.  There was a Solomon, he lived during the period of the Pharaoh Shishak reported in the bible in 1 Kings.  However this Solomon (whose name was actually Shalmaneser IV) was a strong king of Assyria at that time.  His name Salimanu-eser, means Solomon directs.  So it would seem that when the post-exilic scribes codified the OT after 560 BCE, they borrowed more than creation myths from older Semitic cultures.  We can safely toss out the books of  Judges, Ruth (Jews don’t even recognize that book), 1 Samuel, 2 Samuel, 1 Kings, 2 Kings, 1 Chronicles, 2 Chronicles (with no conquest there would have been no Judges, with no David or Solomon, there would have been no true stories of them, hence 1 Samuel to 2 Chronicles would be naught but myth),  the books of the minor prophets Ezra and Nehemiah’s books might hold some small grains of truth, but can’t really be backed by history.  Esther can be tossed, this is one of two books in the OT that does not even mention God.  There is no evidence of a Hebrew favorite wife of any of the Persian Kings.  The story of Job isn’t a Hebrew story.  Job was an inhabitant of Uz, location unknown but believed by most Biblicists to be in Arabia.  This would make Job a story borrowed from another Semitic culture, reflecting no history and can be thrown out, Psalms and Proverbs are mainly “borrowed” from the sacred writings of the city of Urgarit.  A city that was destroyed 100 years before the purported Conquest.  These books contain no history (a lot of good poetry, but no history).  Ecclesiastes is probably the best book in the bible, it contradicts everything else in the OT but contains no discernable history.  Song of Solomon is the second book of the bible that makes no mention of God whatsoever and it too contains no history.  Now we finally come to the portion of the bible that contain true stories.  From Isaiah through Malachi (with the exception of Daniel)  there are kernels of truth and history, you have to dig through the overlay of bias and religion to get at them.  With these books, it seems that the scribes codifying the OT took the preserved histories of the short lived nations of Israel and Judea and added an overlay of religion to them.  The books after the codification of the OT were added during the Maccabeean reconstitution of the scriptures (to replace those burned by the Greeks) between the 3rd and 1st centuries BCE.  It was at this time that the Book of Daniel, with it’s surprisingly accurate prophesies, was written.  Daniel is an acknowledged pseudepigrapha, that is a work given the name of a famous man to give it authority.  It is very easy to make accurate prophesies if you are doing them centuries after the actual happening.  Daniel does contain history, once again heavily overlaid with superstition and religion.  I hope this helps you understand about the truth and the myth of the Bible.  – The Wolf  tongue.gif
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Whoah. Too late in the night to reply the entire thing but lets get one thing straight... You claim there was NO evidence at all of King David. Well Scholars also discounted the existence of King David, arguing that he was a mythical creation of the Jews at a time when they desperately needed heroes. However, stone tablets were found approximately five years ago dated from David’s time and naming him (King)- specifically providing significant evidence that David did indeed exist. thumbsup.gif
JMPD1
Not that I don't believe you ramster, but do you happen to have a source for that info?
just curious.




good journey
ramster83
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 27 2005, 01:42 AM)
Not that I don't believe you ramster, but do you happen to have a source for that info?
just curious.




good journey
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'Ey dude.

Until 1993 there was no proof of the existence of King David or even of Israel as a nation prior to Solomon. Then in 1993 archeologists found proof of King David's existence outside the Bible. At an ancient mound called Tel Dan, in the north of Israel, words carved into a chunk of basalt were translated as "House of David" and "King of Israel" proving that he was more than just a legend.


LINK + IMAGE
JMPD1
Never mind.

I found two sites that discuss it. www.kchanson.com, which has a translation-in-progress.

and www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org, which repeats the information from your site.
Nxt2Hvn
QUOTE(beowulf @ Aug 26 2005, 03:34 PM)
Hey Nxt2...we both haven't been around recently, but good to hear from you - The Wolf  tongue.gif
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Hey beowulf... good to see you!!... I some how knew I would find you in here! tongue.gif

Take care!

Nxt2Hvn innocent.gif
mako
Ramster, you are totally ignoring the rebuttal that I gave you on that before. Some scholars say it refers to the House of David (in this case the literal house or temple), which would be a house of a man name David (king was nowhere mentioned in the fragment) of the temple of a God named either David or Dvd. Even the most ardent Christian scholars agree with that. Prof Salibi of the American University at Beirut has this to say about the inscription: In line 9, the reading of BYTDWD as a construct (BYT + DWD) referring to the "house of David" by name is unjustified, as + BYTDWD + features in that line as a single word. Taken as one word, the initial B in B-YTDWD would be the prepositional B, leaving YTDWD as possibly a place name (archaic noun formation from the _hithpa`el_ form of DWD, "love, have affection for, be related"?) One would only be justified in reading the word as the construct BYT + DWD if it can be demonstrated that other constructs in this inscription, or in the Moabite stele, feature as one word, which to my knowledge they do not. Kinda forgot I posted that before, huh? Typical forgetfulness of those that believe in something. yes.gif
ramster83
Apparently the word "King Of Israel" was inscripted too. So hmm we have a "House Of David" and a "King Of Israel" put 2 and 2 together. You say most scholars even agree to this? No actually most scholars and general people believed this to be accurate and sufficient evidence to suggest that this was the correct title for the correct man, i didnt forget you posted that- it was just your opinion and one Lebanese scholars, go look at many other sites of which most claim that this was hard enough evidence to back up the existance of THE King David.
JMPD1
really? one of the sites I had found, only had a few words translated. I didn't see anything that said "king of Isreal". Could you point out the site you found that on?

Oh, and not the site you already linked. That didn't have a translation.
Thank you



good journey
draconic chronicler
Most Biblical stories probably have a kernel of truth that has been exagerated upon and made into something bigger. It is conclusive now that there was a great flood in the middle east during the historical time of Noah, as Dr. Ballard showed in his underwater investigatin of the Black Sea. It is very possible a man named Noah saved his family and livestock by building an ark during that flood, but like so many "true" stories, they become embellished with age.

As has already been said on this thread, the Bible can be interpreted different ways, and the original hebrew text can be read to infer that the entire world was not flooded, but simply the "world" /region where Noah dwelled.

But if you think the standard Noah story is ridiculous, some fundamentalists also firmly believe that DINOSAURS were also placed on the ark to explain their being mentioned as living creatures in the Bible after the "great flood"! These of course, are the references in the bible to dragons, which the fundies often lump together with dinosaurs.

There are scientists who are amazed with their interpetation of the scriptures which they believe chronicles the big bang, and a long creation of millions of years and the evolultionary development of life on Earth. Then there are the fundamentalists who reduce it all to a 6 day fairy tale complete with dinosaurs in Noahs ark.
Wingman
I beleive that most of the old testimate is symbolic, it's just to show what god want's you to do. The new testimate on the otherhand, is mostly true accounts and history, even though it is debateable.
RaginCajun
the bible is as true as Shrek the ogre. it teaches moral stories.
Paranoid Android
Shrek's real. I saw him on TV - it must be true tongue.gif
ramster83
QUOTE(JMPD1 @ Aug 28 2005, 12:58 AM)
really?  one of the sites I had found, only had a few words translated.  I didn't see anything that said "king of Isreal".  Could you point out the site you found that on?

Oh, and not the site you already linked.  That didn't have a translation.
Thank you



good journey
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Lines 7 & 8 of the Tel Dan stone states that Israel was a divided kingdom, because it mentions the "King of Israel" and the king of the "House of David". This is exactly how the bible describes Israel as being divided after the death of King Solomon.Here is found one of the oldest references outside the bible to King David and his descendants. Thus proving wrong the allegations made by liberal scholars that King David was just a myth.

Translations For You Sir

LINK 1

LINK 2

Enjoy.

thumbsup.gif
Evaluna
Of course we will never know, but I don't really think of the bible as accurate at all. In all honesty I havent read it all, and I only remember certain things from it.

But if Adam and Eve were created first, and if I remember rightly they had 2 sons.. where did everyone else come from if it was only Adam and Eve that started it? (I could just be being really dumb here, but like I said I can't remember half of it)

Also, where is the inclusion of dinosaurs which we know existed, and how did man supposedly evolve from an ape?

I could be completely wrong - I don't consider myself a religious person and I don't really konw too much about it. I think the Bible is a book that was written based on a few facts and lot of fiction. Maybe Jesus in those days was like the David Blaine;s of today? People mayhave seen his 'magic' and because they didn;t understand it and had never seen anything like it they thought it was a miracle?

We will never know what the truth is/was - we just have to make our own opinions.
JMPD1
Thanks for the links ramster! I'll look into them tomorrow, when I'll have some time to read them fully.





good journey
beowulf
Incidentally, FYI Ramster68….there is an investigation being conducted by the Israeli Department of Antiquities on the “BYTDWD” inscription. There is forensic evidence that it is another Jehoash inscription (that is, a fake). A partial list of the problems with the inscription is:

Chisel slips (that is, scratches emanating from letters out across the unpolished broken margins of the rock) which would indicate this inscription was carved after the inscription was broken and several examples of “disking as a letter reached the edge of the break”, that is such as the incomplete daleth (a letter which the inscriber failed to complete due to its proximity to the broken edge of the rock. These and various other phenomena appear to show the inscription was made after the rock was broken.

But, even if the BYTDWD referred to a dynasty and not a palace, it would not prove there was ever a historical David, only that the eighth-century BCE Judeans thought so. I have been surfing the academic bulletin boards and am finding more and more scholars coming out against the BYTDWD inscription being a mention of the “House of David”, more and more think it is a place name, a palace or a temple. Of course, the true believers will never admit that. It is really rather pathetic, that such a grand Empire would have one single (very possibly forged) inscription to support it. Even the Phoenician cities were mentioned in Assyrian, Babylonian, and Egyptian correspondence and received diplomatic correspondence from them. Yet, nothing for such a grand Empire…the mind boggleth! - The Wolf tongue.gif
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