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__Kratos__
RELIGIOUS belief can cause damage to a society, contributing towards high murder rates, abortion, sexual promiscuity and suicide, according to research published today.

According to the study, belief in and worship of God are not only unnecessary for a healthy society but may actually contribute to social problems.

The study counters the view of believers that religion is necessary to provide the moral and ethical foundations of a healthy society.

It compares the social peformance of relatively secular countries, such as Britain, with the US, where the majority believes in a creator rather than the theory of evolution. Many conservative evangelicals in the US consider Darwinism to be a social evil, believing that it inspires atheism and amorality.

Many liberal Christians and believers of other faiths hold that religious belief is socially beneficial, believing that it helps to lower rates of violent crime, murder, suicide, sexual promiscuity and abortion. The benefits of religious belief to a society have been described as its “spiritual capital”. But the study claims that the devotion of many in the US may actually contribute to its ills.

The paper, published in the Journal of Religion and Society, a US academic journal, reports: “Many Americans agree that their churchgoing nation is an exceptional, God-blessed, shining city on the hill that stands as an impressive example for an increasingly sceptical world.

“In general, higher rates of belief in and worship of a creator correlate with higher rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection rates, teen pregnancy and abortion in the prosperous democracies.

“The United States is almost always the most dysfunctional of the developing democracies, sometimes spectacularly so.”

Gregory Paul, the author of the study and a social scientist, used data from the International Social Survey Programme, Gallup and other research bodies to reach his conclusions.

He compared social indicators such as murder rates, abortion, suicide and teenage pregnancy.

The study concluded that the US was the world’s only prosperous democracy where murder rates were still high, and that the least devout nations were the least dysfunctional. Mr Paul said that rates of gonorrhoea in adolescents in the US were up to 300 times higher than in less devout democratic countries. The US also suffered from “ uniquely high” adolescent and adult syphilis infection rates, and adolescent abortion rates, the study suggested.

Mr Paul said: “The study shows that England, despite the social ills it has, is actually performing a good deal better than the USA in most indicators, even though it is now a much less religious nation than America.”

He said that the disparity was even greater when the US was compared with other countries, including France, Japan and the Scandinavian countries. These nations had been the most successful in reducing murder rates, early mortality, sexually transmitted diseases and abortion, he added.

Mr Paul delayed releasing the study until now because of Hurricane Katrina. He said that the evidence accumulated by a number of different studies suggested that religion might actually contribute to social ills. “I suspect that Europeans are increasingly repelled by the poor societal performance of the Christian states,” he added.

He said that most Western nations would become more religious only if the theory of evolution could be overturned and the existence of God scientifically proven. Likewise, the theory of evolution would not enjoy majority support in the US unless there was a marked decline in religious belief, Mr Paul said.

“The non-religious, proevolution democracies contradict the dictum that a society cannot enjoy good conditions unless most citizens ardently believe in a moral creator.

“The widely held fear that a Godless citizenry must experience societal disaster is therefore refuted.”
Source
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Nadal
Already has corrupted America and Britian.
Yelekiah
QUOTE(__Kratos__ @ Oct 1 2005, 04:47 AM) [snapback]869058[/snapback]



“In general, higher rates of belief in and worship of a creator correlate with higher rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection rates, teen pregnancy and abortion in the prosperous democracies.

Source
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Wow, you learn something new everyday.
ramster83
Blah Blah Blah...Yadda Yadda Yadda i'll say!

Ill focus on my beautiful country Australia in opposition to your "studies".

Australia is 71% Christian - 13% other faiths- and 16% "Non Religious".

For a large western country- our crime rates are low and we are much safer than the USA. This just shows it has nothing to do with religion but social and financial upbringing- plus the personality of people, down here in Australia we have a better layed back quality of life- crime rates are marginabally lower- and many of us are Christians...Infact some say we are some of the friendliest people in the world...Wow Christians friendly? Who'd have thought? ohmy.gif
ramster83
"[i]Australia is a safe country compared to almost anywhere in the world. Crime and political unrest are limited in Australia. Australia has low crime rates and strict gun control laws providing a safe environment. Australia is very safe, with low political instability and a harmonious society. The incidence of robbery and assault is relatively low and Australia has strict anti-gun and drug laws.

A peaceful country, Australia has never had a civil war, had to fight for territory or had a political coup. The government is democratically elected, and is not ruled by the military nor based on religion. Australia is part of the British Commonwealth – the Queen of England is also the Queen of Australia. She is represented in Australia by the Governor-General.

Australia is an open society, based on equality for all people.


"[/i]

-Study Australia

I'm sorry but this study of yours should be put straight to the trash. It completely contradicts your belief that the religious countries are more dangerous than others.
Something Like Laughter
and i thought it was the widespread availiablilty of handguns and violence on TV...
Nadal
QUOTE(ramster83 @ Oct 1 2005, 05:49 AM) [snapback]869103[/snapback]

"[i]Australia is a safe country compared to almost anywhere in the world. Crime and political unrest are limited in Australia. Australia has low crime rates and strict gun control laws providing a safe environment. Australia is very safe, with low political instability and a harmonious society. The incidence of robbery and assault is relatively low and Australia has strict anti-gun and drug laws.

A peaceful country, Australia has never had a civil war, had to fight for territory or had a political coup. The government is democratically elected, and is not ruled by the military nor based on religion. Australia is part of the British Commonwealth – the Queen of England is also the Queen of Australia. She is represented in Australia by the Governor-General.

Australia is an open society, based on equality for all people.


"[/i]

-Study Australia

I'm sorry but this study of yours should be put straight to the trash. It completely contradicts your belief that the religious countries are more dangerous than others.

I take it your a Statistic Scientist now? I've seen this first hand. Ever heard of the Kkk? It's because America has much more diversity in ethnic groups with different religions. Austrillia is 73% chrisitians so they don't really know any muslims so they don't say and pick on muslims for being muslim...you've really not understood to what the surveys saying,
Turtle
QUOTE(Nadal @ Oct 1 2005, 09:45 AM) [snapback]869201[/snapback]

I take it your a Statistic Scientist now? I've seen this first hand. Ever heard of the Kkk? It's because America has much more diversity in ethnic groups with different religions. Austrillia is 73% chrisitians so they don't really know any muslims so they don't say and pick on muslims for being muslim...you've really not understood to what the surveys saying,


You may be onto something Nadel

In Canada The statistics are a little more pronounced.
Due to out lax grin2.gif immigration to garner more votes to the governing Liberal Party, Here are the top 4 religions courtesy of Big Brother:

Roman Catholic 41%----a DECREASE of 16% in 5 years
Protestant 29%- an alarming decrease of 41% in 5 years
NO RELIGIOUS AFFILIATION- 26%----an increase of 40% in 5 years
Muslim and other religions-6%---------an increase if 135% in 5 years

The biggest gainers is that of NO religious affiliation where ONE in FOUR canadians now have No religious affiliation.

EDIT: That is not to say that they do not believe, just that they are unwilling to follow a particular one
Source----Statistics Canada
ramster83
QUOTE(Nadal @ Oct 1 2005, 11:45 PM) [snapback]869201[/snapback]

I take it your a Statistic Scientist now? I've seen this first hand. Ever heard of the Kkk? It's because America has much more diversity in ethnic groups with different religions. Austrillia is 73% chrisitians so they don't really know any muslims so they don't say and pick on muslims for being muslim...you've really not understood to what the surveys saying,



Ummmmm no im not a statistic scientist- but i live the statistics. You say America has much more diversity in Ethnic groups with different religions? Australia is probably the most multicultural country in the world- along side with America. You also are changing exactly what the survey says- the survey said society with high religious ratings was worse off in terms of crime- yet this rings completely untrue. Sorry. To the trash that survey should go.

RELIGIOUS belief can cause damage to a society, contributing towards high murder rates, abortion, sexual promiscuity and suicide, according to research published today.

The above quote is from this survey, whats this got to do with Muslims and Christians picking on eachother? Its clearly speaking of crime - abortion rates, suicide and sexual promiscuity- i think you are the one misunderstanding this "survey".
Darkwind
I think is all boils down to how much religion is in your government and schools. A secular government is in my opinion is the key. Is a government's laws based on a particular religious dogma? The religious right has long battled sex education in public schools in the US. That would have an impact on teen pregnancy. How liberal are a countries gun laws? There is your impact on murder. To be fare to everyone a government must take a blind eye to religion and base its law on ethics and logic. I think they should start teaching ethics and logic in middle school. Here is some thing else that has an impact EDUCATION.
mako
QUOTE
For a large western country- our crime rates are low and we are much safer than the USA.

When you start bragging about the relative peace and safety of Australia, you have to take into considerations several factors. First is your crime rate growing, falling or remaining the same. With Australia, from 1996 to 2003 (the most recent figures) Murder remained static, violent crimes (Assault) increased 40% and property crimes (Robbery) increased 28%. To put it another way, in 1996 there were 623 assaults per 100,000 persons and in 2003 there were 811 assaults per 100,000 persons, a sizable growth in any nation. The second (and major) factor that has to be considered is population density. A very revealing fact is that Australia has a population density of 2 persons per sq km and Japan (the nation with the lowest crime rate and a primarily non-religious nation) has a population density of 337 per km. Imagine what Australia’s crime rate would be if your population density was that of Japan? If your population density was that of the USA (32 per sq km) you would have a crime rate similar to that of the USA (only murder would be lower, but then you do not have the right to keep and bear arms, that great deterrent of dictatorship). It can be shown by your crime stats that the large majority of your violent crimes (murder, rape, and assault) occur in your homes! Seems you blokes are safer anywhere else! I would have suspected the pubs being the most violent places! yes.gif
Paranoid Android
So Mako - are you saying that there are factors other than religion which can influence these statistics? Thank you for disproving this research thumbsup.gif

Regards, PA
ramster83
QUOTE(mako @ Oct 3 2005, 11:56 PM) [snapback]871549[/snapback]

When you start bragging about the relative peace and safety of Australia, you have to take into considerations several factors. First is your crime rate growing, falling or remaining the same. With Australia, from 1996 to 2003 (the most recent figures) Murder remained static, violent crimes (Assault) increased 40% and property crimes (Robbery) increased 28%. To put it another way, in 1996 there were 623 assaults per 100,000 persons and in 2003 there were 811 assaults per 100,000 persons, a sizable growth in any nation. The second (and major) factor that has to be considered is population density. A very revealing fact is that Australia has a population density of 2 persons per sq km and Japan (the nation with the lowest crime rate and a primarily non-religious nation) has a population density of 337 per km. Imagine what Australia’s crime rate would be if your population density was that of Japan? If your population density was that of the USA (32 per sq km) you would have a crime rate similar to that of the USA (only murder would be lower, but then you do not have the right to keep and bear arms, that great deterrent of dictatorship). It can be shown by your crime stats that the large majority of your violent crimes (murder, rape, and assault) occur in your homes! Seems you blokes are safer anywhere else! I would have suspected the pubs being the most violent places! yes.gif


Very well said- thanks for agreeing that religion has nothing to do with crime rates- but more or less population density and the strictness of the laws (like tough Gun laws) that in the end matter to these statistics. grin2.gif
mako
Personally, I think it might be a little of both, but I lean more to population density and relative gap between the rich and poor. Religion may be a factor, but usually it depends on the adherent, not the religion (at least completely). Sorry to disappoint you by not blaming Christianity this time! grin2.gif no.gif
ramster83
QUOTE(mako @ Oct 4 2005, 01:47 AM) [snapback]871690[/snapback]

Personally, I think it might be a little of both, but I lean more to population density and relative gap between the rich and poor. Religion may be a factor, but usually it depends on the adherent, not the religion (at least completely). Sorry to disappoint you by not blaming Christianity this time! grin2.gif no.gif


lol. Rock on. grin2.gif
__Kratos__
QUOTE(Paranoid Android @ Oct 3 2005, 09:59 AM) [snapback]871628[/snapback]

So Mako - are you saying that there are factors other than religion which can influence these statistics? Thank you for disproving this research thumbsup.gif

Regards, PA


He didn't disprove anything... Religion is a factor! Not the whole problem. thumbsup.gif
mako
QUOTE
He didn't disprove anything... Religion is a factor! Not the whole problem

I agree. I even said the religion was only one factor and named the other two (there are probably even more, but let's not go there this time). The two that I consider probably even more important than religion. However, religion can be a big factor in some cases, so I am agreeing with your and disagreeing with you, if you catch my drift. yes.gif no.gif
Paranoid Android
Ok, I chose my words wrong. Perhaps I should have said Mako's statement proves the biased nature of the research.

__Kratos__
QUOTE(Paranoid Android @ Oct 3 2005, 09:32 PM) [snapback]872665[/snapback]

Ok, I chose my words wrong. Perhaps I should have said Mako's statement proves the biased nature of the research.


How is it bias in showing religion is a factor in hurting societies? There are other factors besides religion. It's not flat out screaming religion is purely the problem.
Lamont Cranston
Actually the very fact that those nations with a high population density, a normal gap between the classes and relatively little religion in their daily lives are the ones with a very low crime rate. Whereas those that are strongly religious have the highests incident of crime (violent and property). That alone says that the study is valid, no matter what other factors enter the picture. - Da Shadow ph34r.gif
Mr Slayer
I don't think religion has really something to do with a nation's state of being.

Sure, the extremist Islam of the Middle East and the inbred Bible belt of the US are antipoles (and luckily the few ones that still exist), those countries have issues. But in the big picture, nah... I don't think so.

I come from a very irreligious country (Sweden). And we make it fine here without God, believe me.
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