Hi Guys,

I have always been interested in this sort of stuff...

Archaeology focusses on graves, paintings, and stone artifacts.

But what about living culture? Do you have any information on Bush Medicine, Plant and Animal Materials used for making items, or Bush Foods?

Here is a link to The Bush Tucker Man:

http://www.teachers.ash.org.au/bushtucker/bibliography.html

Hey you guys!!

Where are all the entries?? I can't beleive that no body knows about the Great Outdoors?

OK I understand that plant lore can be dangerous. But what about other objects. What is the best wood used for, say, canoes?? Or starting fires with? Or what type of sap is the best for using for resin??

Surely somebody knows something out there! Surely all knowledge has not been lost!!

I am just kidding. But if you have a story about a weird natural object I would like to hear it.

OK I will give an example. (Don't know the full details)

When my cousin by marriage (aboriginal) was little she had a stomach ache. Her aunty went down to the swamp and got some giant grubs, boiled them up and they cured her stomach cramps. Sounds gross, but that was the only thing that worked when modern medicine had failed.

There that should start 'em off!! lol

OK, Rainbow. Can't leave you with two sheets and no wind!!
Seems that most North American Indians used a light framework of willow branches (which grow all over here) with various types of bark as covering, depending on location. Birch was good (I've made canoes this way and it works). Sealant was usually pitch, in my neck of the woods, pine pitch is all over the place.
Two bits of wood and a firebow used to start fires, usually with dry pine leaves and the low dried out branches of pine trees; fires were kept small: White man makes large fire, cook one side, freeze other; Indian make small fire, chilly all over. Also was the matter of smoke: unless they were desmelling themselves, smoke was a way of letting others know location. Not good.
While most were definitely aware of surroundings and avoided poisonous plants, on occasion someone would run afoul of poison ivy or sumac. The antidote for this was ragweed, crushed and rubbed on the affected area.
A more interesting aspect was the common idea that by communicating with plants, one could determine the medicinal use or culinary use. Science, of course, denigrates this: however, one must remember that a large percentage of modern drugs are derived from native cures (aside from those manufactured ailments that sell nonsense drugs, like "overactive bladder" and "restless leg syndrome". Ha!!! and some people think medicine is advanced. Jeez!!). 'Course, the drug companies must prevail.
Shut up, Cat!! Before you get in trouble with the big boys.
The legends from southwest US and Mexico have the 'men of knowledge' carrying personal stones which they used for storage in the event they were near death, naturally or by enemy. It was 'known' that the enemy would eat certain parts of the anatomy to acquire the 'power' of a 'sorcerer', so in the event of impending capture, the sorcerer would put his knowledge into the stone (which was cultivated by him), bury it, and if he survived, he could come back and retrieve the knowledge; however, it was not available to the enemy unless the enemy could find the stone (very difficult).
The understanding among them was that material things do not exist except as 'descriptions' of things (and people). So, the stones were, in effect, memory modules. While this makes no 'scientific' sense, it does make sense in the electronics world, to some degree. We also know of some crystal skulls that seem to be inexplicable. Wonder what's in those?
Let's see if others have anything?

Ah, very very interesting RabidCat. I love your knowledge. Keep on posting your stuff; anything you think of. There is not enough education on the natural ways these days, so any tiny bit of information exchange is valid and worthwhile.

As regards to the stones holding memory, well crystals would certainly be able to do this, I beleive. I am positive that memory will be able to be down-loaded into a computer in the future, so it would not be too far off the original idea. Especially considering optic fibre, crystal and silicone involving light technologies (brain waves are another form of light)

It is funny what we consider a commodity today had all sorts of purposes at one time among natives and settlers.
Take for instance "baker fern" everybody who has ever ordered a dozen roses for their love has seen this hard waxy fern. It grows in abundance all along the East Coast of North America in pinelands habitat and in the Appalachian Mountains. Its shoots are commonly called "Jersey Devil food" by the old time woodjins here in the Jersey Pines and provided springtime greens to many Eastern Native Americans. The shoots have to be cooked to death to remove the hairs but it provided a good source of vitamin A and was used to treat this defficency by both the Nanticoke-Lenape and local pineys.
Spagnum moss also used by florists today forms the ground in a certain type of cedar swamp and cypress swamp called a quaking bog. The trees, shrubs and small plants grow on a bed of this compound organism and the swamp literally floats on a large deep lake.
It provided bedding for Nanticoke baby hammocks and child carriers and as a wound dressing. It is very acidic and contains iodine making it antibacterial and it produces a small amount of iodine gas acting as a bug repellent for the child. It was later used by the United States Army as wound dressing from the Revolutionary War up to World War I.
Sugar pine which grows up in the higher areas also provided emergency food for many tribes and the Eastern Algonkians ate so much of it the Iroquois called them " Bark Eaters"
Bear grass another native plant here is also used in arrangments by flower shops ( I am a terminal screwup who volunteers for all night shifts at bad times and I buy a lot of roses)
were woven into baskets and some Nanticoke-Lenape still weave little beargrass baskets and fill them with cranberries or blueberries as "house warming noveties". It can also be woven into binding and used to build wikwams and racks when wild grapevine is not available.
During the early part of the 20th century many "pineys", white and Indian collected many of these plants and sold the to floral wholesalers in the city along with pinecones, sugar bush ( heather) cedar and pine boughs during the holidays. It was banned in the 1980s when the pinelands protection laws were passed and (this was a shame and disgrace) the last seasonal harvester "Crazy Bill" Wasovwich was arrested for gathering in 2000.

Lapi'che

Now that you have me thinking. Yarrow, which grows throughout the United States and is commercialy grown is also good for cuts, bruises and poisonous plant afflictions. Sweetgrass a type of "timothy grass" that grows in meadows and prairies and has a mild "pipe tobacco / fresh hay" smell was used to pack clothing and sacred items and is hung around the house in general for its odor absorbing ability. It is woven into a braid and kept all over by members of my tribe. It even absorbs that yucky cigarette smell. I was writing my first post and staring at two braids of it - talk about brain lock!
You know I don't like thinking at night Rowan. LOL!

Lapi'che

i like this kind of stuff

I know the Tamil were a very "nature oriented" and resourceful jungle people. Do you have any input for us?


Lapi'che

Great information there Piney. There is so much that us white people have no idea of, so keep the info coming...(sorry about the night time brain strain session! lol)

One other interest of mine is herbal lore (although I am still learning the European herbs) I love the way that herbs may be used in so many different ways, from teas to poultices to aromatherapy.

I have also heard that trances and visions have played a role in revealing medicinal uses in herbs and plants in native tribes. Does anybody know anything about this?

hi rainbow rowan, not really what you are looking for but something same...
http://www.astrogyan.com/herbal_cure_index...ge_library.html
and the other is for pure outdoor Nettle Beer..lol. http://www.woodsmoke.uk.com/p/v/Resources/Hints+(and)+Tips
and some useful but common outdoor skills... http://www.wilderness-survival.net/fire-5.php hope this was useful to you!

Honey is anti bacterial and was known to cure stomach ulcers. Stomach ulcers have now been proven to be caused by bacteria in most cases and my tribe uses mint tea with honey for most stomach aliments. All types of mint are good for nausea, indigestion and various other stomach aliments.
Tobacco has now been proven to slow the effects of alzhiemers (Science Daily Online). We always treated this debilitating disease with tobacco tea and now use "nicotine patches" on our elders who suffer from it.
Red Willow bark acts like aspirin. It both blood thins the blood and is a painkiller. We also mix it with our smoking tobacco.
One problem with herbal suppliments and herbs in general I noticed is people take them as a preventative when they are not sick. There can be no good coming out of using a herb to prevent a disease. Herbs are drugs and you can grow resistant to the herb or make yourself sick.
I have a notebook somewhere that I wrote a lot of stuff down in. When I was a kid I did a project were I interveiwed elders for folklore info. I will find it.

Lapi'he

Hey, all!!
I really like this Piney guy! You've got to keep this up! Good, good stuff. Unfortunately I'm sadly lacking in East Coast stuff having grown up in the west.
About trances and visions with respect to SW Indians: There was the act of 'stopping the world', as I've mentioned. I'm reasonably sure that this was done throughout the Americas, using different forms. In the SW, the use of certain mushrooms, peyote, and other hallucinogenic plants were used to rattle the foundations of those who wished to learn more of the esoteric knowledge (using the term 'sorcery' for lack of a better one). The compounds had the effect of allowing the user (who was always guided by a Nagual) to see those things the conscious usually rejects. When the foundations were shaken enough, the use of the plants was stopped. As Piney has stated, moderation was the keyword.
This area of knowledge, that of those things that we now tend to pass off as myth, is, I think, very important to us. Strange how we tend to accept the teachings of the Far East but won't accept most of the things that were known on these two continents, isn't it? The same is true for Australian Aborigines.
See you all again, got to work.

Think I'm going to bow out of this one and just read the good stuff from the rest of you. For many years my research has been into the mind (spirit?) aspects of ancient races. I think unfortunately there is a lot of dung around about that part.
Keep it up. If I think of anything I'll put it in here.

You were asking about vision herbs. Before a teen ventured out for a an'gou (blessing or "vision quest") he drank the "black drink" which made your body dump out all its contents orally and the other way. Some of my people that want to cleanse their systems also drink it the day before they take a "sweat" in the steam lodge.
One thing I was thinking about it work today was that the word Tomahawk comes from "(oX' kwewi) tema'hikan" the grooved and rawhide wrapped blunt type of stone ax that was used only by women. The men used a celt shape bladed ax called a "le'nawi".
Raccoon, Chipmunk (Chemungk), Wigwam (wikwam), Moccasin (mohosin') are all words that originate from the Algonquian linguistic group.
The "overhand"swimming stroke was also something that came from the Native Americans. Before that Europeans only swam using the "breast stroke"

How come I have the feeling I will be doing homework for someone on this forum?

Lapi'che

Yes, the Ancient Dravidians would use various plants, such as passionflower and others for herbal remedies for colds and such.

Google is very helpful also

Cedar water which is highly acidic from the cedar trees and contains iodine from the spagnum moss has antiseptic qualities. It's brown color comes from iron leached from the soil. Ship captains from Georgia to Maine prefered it on their boats because it did not go stagnant on long voyages.
I thought about this for a couple of days then I decided "Aw nuts! I am going to post this." Urine as long as you are not carrying any diseases or infections is sterile and has fungacidal qualities. If you have an open wound and no good water or herbs around. Urine will keep it clean and sterile. If you have athletes foot it will cure it. This trick was also used by American jungle fighters in Vietnam and was taught at "Camp Sherman" the United States Army's jungle training school. The urine from menstrating women is not clean though. Actually it is forbidden for menstrating women to go near any sacred object or building. It is considered powerful medicine.

Lapi'che

thats intresting

I would have to agree here.

Yes but there is nothing like actual KNOWLEDGE straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak. Google is great for lots of things, but when it comes to word of mouth traditions, this is the ideal thread. Thanks for your 'input' all the same....

You are quite welcome; any time....

I agree, Rainbow. It is nice to hear from someone with actual experience who has actually done these things and can tell you their own viewpoint. Unfortunately, around here, it seems that people have a preference for referring others to books and websites.

Yeah...

I read the book, and asked myself a few questions... now what I heard as the answer?

"Read the book..."

"The answer is in the book!"

OK everybody, thanks for your 'support'....

Now BACK ON TOPIC!!

You're very welcome... we aim to please, and we're pleased to aim.

If you want more informtion on this ask Piney..He's a NA tracker... And those of us who are NA feel we don't have to explain the way's of our fore father's just so you know....

Well it is obvious that you are throwing insults at me regarding the Raelian thread which, incidently, ended weeks ago. Unfortunately you and your little 'hunting party' missed it's target....

Oh, and just so that you are totally aware of my stance - I am not a Raelian.

And thanks for your info, isis-999. Those who wish to post in their important information in this thread are free to do so, according to it's topic.

A huge thanks to everybody who has done so (round of applause)

Back on topic...

I have thought of another fascinating piece of Aboriginal medicinal lore. When somebody needed an open wound closed, instead of stitches, ants were used. The large ants would bite down on the sides of the wound, clamping it together, then their bodies were pinched off leaving the 'staples' in place.

It is amazing what tools mother nature provides!

........As with the Rutgers Argricultural School's Forestry and Watershed management program and the Swarthmore Library School..................

I will be lecturing at the College of New Jersey on various Native American cultures. Anyone interested can contact Dr. B. Evans of the anthropology department. You can use my nickname "Piney" when inquiring with her. It was her sister who gave it to me. Anybody else want info has to pay my rates as the colleges around here do. There is too many ignorant people here.......

Peace bros, I'm out

Once again; I agree.

This past weekend my tribe just celebrated the "Feast of the Dead" or Gam'wing. The Nanticoke are the only tribe of the Algonquian Family that celebrates this ceremony so many anthropologists think that it originated from Yorba or Ashanti slaves who were assimilated when we harbored escaped slaves. Cuff or Cuffee a prominate name in the the tribe comes from "Cufi" an Ashanti "day" name and we use the Ashanti word "Obeah" for majic.
Anyway the feast was originally celebrated by taking the dead out of communal huts and burying them together on a hill. Today we celebrate it by bringing family pictures and personal heirlooms down to the tribal grounds and showing them to other people and telling their stories. If the state archeologist has bones found during digs. We bury them at this time on a hill on are tribal grounds. I always camp on that hill but I have yet to see a ghost. One year another tribe who was an original member of our confederation, the Munsi from Moraviantown on the Thames in Ontario, came down and we all camped on the hill.
Another ceremony that is performed this weekend is where the "Misinghali'kun" the fur covered game guardian who was later twisted into the "Jersey Devil" was was thanked for a good hunt and harvest. This was later called by colonists "the Devil Dance" I attached a picture of a misingw' mask. The mask is out of my personal collection and was carried by John Fremont's Delaware scouts when he was mapping the Western Frontier.




Lapi'che

In our village in India, Cow Dung has many purposes...not medical though

Really, Frogfish? I have heard it can be used for fuelling fires. What other uses does it have?

Another ceremony that belonged to the Nanticoke and Delaware was the "Ao'tas Kin'teka" or "Doll Dance". This dance originated with one family. When a father carved his daughter a realistic looking doll and his daughter gave it so much attention it seemed real. The girl's parents made her throw it a away and moved away. Soon the girl became sick and dreamed about the doll. In the dream the doll told the girl to make it a new dress every spring and hold a dance in its honor. The father listened to the dream and returned to the spot to find the doll. When he brought it back the girl's mother made the doll a new dress and put wampum beads around it's neck then gave it back to the little girl who became well again. After that the family held a dance for it every spring. The family grew to several families each making it's own doll. Some families that posessed a doll say the spirit was the daughter of "Kahe'sanaXas'kwim" or "Mother Corn".

........and some anthropologist's think that the ao'tas originated with Arawak-Taino or African slaves.


Lapi'che

Here are three Lena'pe (Delaware) shoulder bags which contained medicine, ammo and rations. The ribbonwork and embroidery style bag was used from the late 18th to the 20th centuries.

Lapi'che

Cool stuff, Piney!

Another interesting fact about Australian aboriginals. Their genetic makeup helps them to stay warm on cold nights. They have slim arms and legs and hold the most of their weight in their torso. At night their body heat withdraws into their torso from their extremities, keeping them warm and not requiring blankets.

Hi Piney...I found it....I have to say though i do not agree with telling so much as some here have....The question i would like to know is why does RR want to know so much about our people.. Sorry RR i am Cherokee and we don't tell tribe bussiness!


Here is the local tribe's site...... http://www.cherokee-nc.com/

Ok Isis, my husband is aboriginal and their tribe has lost it's knowledge through white man's actions. Their family has systematically had 2 generations 'stolen' from their families and put into white families. Do you not think it is about time that knowledge of the land be known to the people? I am not asking for traditional or spiritual knowledge, just knowledge of the land. People do not need to hide anything anymore for fear that it will be misused against them. My children also need to know.

Piney is free to post whatever he chooses, as is anybody else. Thank you for your concern, but my motives are pure.

EDIT: Isis but you have just posted the link? Thanks for telling your tribal business.

RR/..I only came by cause Piney PM me and asked me too.... I have not told my tribes bussiness cause's that link is too what we let other's see..If you think you'll find much in there other then what we show at powwow's ..you wont dear.... And for Piney..if you read what he has posted it is only what his Chief has OK.... If your husband is truely what you said..The best thing for him to do is find a tribe near him and ask for the information he needs.. Just so you know RR.... All the tribes are different in what they believe and do... We all do NOT think alike.. So what you learn from Piney may have nothing to do with your husbands tribe..or mine for that reason...


And just so you know almost all tribes have a web site, It in no way tell's tribal bussiness.... I have Native Chick on Yahoo right now..I'll see if she will post her tribes web site, that way you will see what i mean..Plus.. if i understand this wright, You are a Aussie?.. If i may ask what about your husband, If he is too then the tribes you want to know about will be nothing like us....?


And NO i do not nore will i ever agree that we need to tell tribe bussiness.

Thanks for the link, Isis. I agree that every tribe is different. My husbands tribe was originally from Sydney, the first settlement in Australia. Although his grandmother was born and raised in the bush, she was eventually stolen by troopers when she was tiny, and then some of her children were stolen from her. A little of the food knowledge was retained by her, but not enough for two generations (my husband and his cousins) to really have to call tribal culture.

I do not wish to know about tribal rites of passage, etc. The thread is not about spiritual knowledge. I beleive that knowledge of the land is invaluable to everybody, white, black, coloured. As we are having so many natural disasters of late: earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunamis, etc, survival off the land should be common knowledge for all people of the planet.

RR...What you are looking for has nothing to do with NA, We are totally different..I've heard some about your husbands people, If you really want to know the history for him and your children..I think the best thing would to be goggle it..There should be a web site about his tribe..I know you can find all the NA tribes on goggle.... I see what you want to know and i understand but NA tribes are not anything like what you speak of!.... The food and clothes and everything is very different...Our history is based by tribes and not as a whole unit.... I think if you look at your local libery you could find out more as well.. But as i posted earlier, Piney asked me to caome to this thread, or wi would have never made a post... I don't agree with some of what has been said... I still believe the old ways should stay secreat.. But if his chief has ok his post then thats the tribes bussiness... Mine would never allow it.. But once agin all tribes are not the same.. ..Good luck on your hunt for the truth, I hope you find what has been lost to your husband and kids.....

Thanks again Isis. I recognise that tribes are not all the same.

Thanks for your luck too.

Because there really isn't anything written down about my tribe and because many of our younger generation is attaching themselves to the urban Black subculture and we are dying out. Maybe someone will write this down and our culture will live on. We have a member now who is an Olympic track star but she will only admit to being "black". We have another member who is a big city mayor and he is only "black". Both were raised Nanticoke. Also because of the African slave cultural influence students and anthros are not interested. They only want to study the Plains tribes or the Canadian ones.


Lapi'che

The last gathering I was at before this one was 1979. It was jam packed with 200 people and everybody was involved. The tribal center was happening at that time too. People were in and out all day every day. At this gathering 50 people might have showed up. Anybody under 30 was strutting around in their baggy cloths and talking like that Iverson idiot from ther Sixers. They were there for the free food and were more concerned with getting home on Sunday to watch the "Eagles". If anybody under 30 walks into the center now it is for their welfare and college handouts. I would like to see these things remembered before they are no more.

Lapi'che

We use it as fertillizer, obviously, and when mixed with some stuff (sorry, i don't know)...it creates incense.....You are also right, cow patties are excellent source/fuel for fire.... It also keeps certain plant-eating insects away, but attracts others dung-insects...

It's also very hard on the lung's...

It doesn't smell when you burn it. Believe me I ride fence at my mom's ranch in Nebraska and there is no firewood in the Sandhills.


Lapi'che ni'tis

you are right Piney...

We also use banana leaves for a lot of stuff too