What if Hitler Had Invaded the United States in World War Two?
Ave Maria


Posted on 06/16/2003 6:15:57 PM PDT by AveMaria


This is a nightmare scenario targetted towards all of you World War Two history buffs.

About a week ago, a statue of Eisenhower was unveiled at the Capitol in DC, honoring President Eisenhower in his army uniform. In a speech commemorating that occassion, Bob Dole asked the audience to consider what would have happened if Ike had failed in his crusade. Is there a possibility that Hitler would have managed to take advantage of political, regional, and ethnic divisions in America in the 1940s, and defeated good old USA?

It certainly would not have been possible for Hitler to stage a successful naval invasion across the Atlantic to take the Eastern Seaboard, irrespective of whether or not America succeded in Europe. He simply did not have a Navy that was large enough for that task.

I considered various ways in which the Germans would have defeated America, assuming that they had succeeded in their mission to conquer the Soviet Union:

1. They might have attempted to conquer Alaska, based on their ability to control Siberia and the arctic regions of Russia. From there, they would have rolled over poorly defended Canada, from which they would have launched a massive invasion from the sparsely populated North-Western US.

2. Using the historic grievances that Mexico has, especially over territorial loss in the 1848 war, Hitler could have encouraged the Mexicans to stage a massive military invasion from the South (something similar to what their illegals are already doing). Given that many South Americans had pro-axis fascist feelings during the war, Brazil and Argentina could have send their own armies as well, to support the Mexicans. And, considering that Latin America continued to trade with Germany in the war years, Germany would have been able to move massive armaments and troops to South America, support an invasion from Mexico. As a reward, Mexico would have been rewarded with the return of California, New Mexico and Arizona. The rest of South America would have had a chance to be freed from American regional dominance that has existed since the Monroe Doctrine.

3. Hitler could have reached out to the anti-FDR right-wing, the likes of Charles Lindberg, Henry Ford, Rev. Charles Coughlin, and their many followers who were influential in the America First Movement. He could have used the resentment that Irish-Americans and German-Americans had for Anglo elites who wanted to save Britain, a nation that many in both groups disliked (I am Irish myself, and I am aware about how many Irishmen resented going to help Britain. The Republic of Ireland made a conscious decision to stay neutral in the war to the very end).

4. Germany could have offered the South a second chance. If the South militarily supported the defeat of the Yankees, they could get back the Confederate States of America. The CSA would have been a fully independent right-wing nation that was allied to Germany, like Franco's Spain. They would have been allowed to preserve their system of segregation, a system that Germans approved of.

5. In the 1940s, Eugenics was highly favored by both liberal and conservative elites in New England. American race scientists like H. Goddard, Carl Bingham, Madison Grant, and Lothrop Stoddard were standard readings in the school system in Nazi Germany. A shared interest in race issues would have brought the Nazis and the New England Eugenicists together.

A combination of all those forces would have overwhelmed the FDR administration.

true, only part of number 2 would be good, our control of south america would have been broken, the only good to come of all that, the res would simply make it so you never would be, meaning don't focus on what could have been focus on whatcould be.

huh there i was thinking that the number of Nazi scientists, SS intelligence officers and rich industrialists who were smuggled into America, did already contribute to running it. Or maybe they were just the rich jewish industrialists and bankers that leg'd it at the first sight of trouble[though had no quams about actually trading with the Nazi's] were runing it now, oh well.

that could be but just think about if Hitler did invade the U.S. we would of had to pull our divisions back to protect our homeland..there leaving the germans to take back Europe and the Japanese to take back what they took from us at the beginning of WWII. which means that Austrailia would have fallen and that Hawaii and the rest of the Aleutian Islands to Japan and London would be under a constant bombardment from German Artillery that landed with the rest of their forces after the Americans pulled out

I agree, could the Germans aford to fight on another battlefront on another continent?

as of June 6, 1946 no but if they did while wwe were still tied up in Normandy yes...

The Aussies would have still been a soveriegn nation, for they had their own military and could repel such advances.

RUSSIA rmbr russia?

Ya most of the German military machine was in Russia.

~Thanato

russia backed hitler until he turned on stalin, he tried for Moscow, tried mind you, and was stopped by a nasty winter storm,which cost him a third of his troops and then he retreated and began to destroy germany itself.

And after that, Mexicans and CSA would probably fight amongst themselves. The continued war will make the germans be spread too thin, and rebels would probably rise up in both Canada and in the US to push the invaders off...

Heh. This is a never-ending story.

Hitler could have never done such a thing.. Why do you think he didn't try.. He didn't cause in for him to invade the US.. he'd had tp pull his troop out of Europe and move them here.. Thats time money and men he did not have.. Also by doing so he'd lost the war faster cause his force's would have fell to the Brit's and the Russian's.....Hitler's army was not strong enough to spead out over the planet...He could have never invaded counrty's so far apart.. And with the US a ppower house even then what you are asking whould have made no sense......

However, the dream is still alive. Think about it.

This scenario presents us with an absolute impossibility.
The German army was stretched over Europe and Russia. There is no way they would have had the man power to invade the USA, they couldn't even invade my country, a small island with a very small distance between it and an occupied France.

The USSR would have just rolled into Germany if armies were sent to invade the USA.

This could never have happened unless the Germans conjured up a magical army.

wtf? how could hitler engage in another front when he was already losing in two. if he wouldnt have attacked the ussr so soon and actually read a lil history about napolean, then he might have been able to take britian out, the russia, the america. other than that the only sound salute would be to have kept the soviet alliance, which would have resulted in them conquering the world, and then having another world war

I doubt Hitler would of had any concern or want to actual control North America. If Hitler took over Russia, he would of had the resources to complete his A-Bomb program. With this complete, I assume he would of dropped several on North America, and would of beat them into submisson, much like how U.S.A did to Japan, they didn't need to send troops to win.

Even if they could do it... Which they couldn't... Considering they had all the needed supplies, men, etc. they still could not do it. The only reason Germany did so well in WWII at first was because of the Blitzkrieg Doctrine.... And you can't preform an Amphibious assualt-type Blitzkrieg.

ALSO! The war in Russia... Russia pretty much crushed Germany. The war in Europe didn't even need us. The Soviets had Germany shaking in its shoes by June 6, 1944. Even if Hitler had listen to his Generals, most of them knew they could not win the war just after a few hours once it started.

Everyone's ignoring that part. Assuming they did it handily with maximum effect too and the Soviet's were fully and quickly conscripted by Germany.

To further the nightmare scenario, and since this is Alternative History, and just an exorcise in fancy... assume America had an isolationist policy and once Hitler had the Soviet Union he conquered Europe.

Aside from some of the probably erronious assumptions in the enumerated points, I go with Azalin's idea. Simply Bombs us to oblivion till we beg for the comfort of a kick in the pants.

To bring it over, they would also of had to make an Aircraft like the B-29... EVEN BETTER!!!! They would have to fly 3,000 miles, or build an aircraft carrier... Also avoid any naval or other aircraft interceptors... I really couldn't see GErmany conquering the USA... Even with the A-Bomb, not being able to deliver it. Also, Germany had no intent on marching into Washington DC. They should had told Japan to screw themselves.

That is an interesting senario, and thinking of it is just plain creepy.


We are not poorly defended. Nvr mind, I'm not going there

Yeah amen to that scenario....no jew secret organisations everywhere and people with actual brains (if not emotions in the touchy feely manner) to rule the planet.

On a historical note, Germany went through with the war because they actually believed they would be more countries joining them...unfortunately their only ally was italy (which is only good for spaghetti if that), half europe was neutral (or doormats as they should be called including France) the Scandinavians only played spectators and a few incidents with resistance movements served only to spice up their rather monotounous lives and of course last but not least England decided to actually resist because they just dont like germans more over their own american offspring.

I am telling you that was one screwed war...

Germany had more allies than just Italy... What are you smoking? They were just small crap countries with crappy armies, with crappy weapons, and crappy food.

Bio... holy crap... Don't teach a subject if you barley know what you are talking about... "England decided to actually resist because they just dont like germans more over their own american offspring." First of all they didn't like Germany because they invaded their buddy Poland, and they were fascist basta*ds

Hah, we are poorly defended. Our soldiers might be good but currently there's more officers in the NYPD then in our army, not to mention our helicopters and submarines are in wretched condition.

There are plenty of bombers that can support the fuel needed to fly the distance. First of all, like I said, IF they captured Russia, they would fly over the Strait past Canada to the US. While doing this, for the fun of it, they can Hammer Canada with A-Bombs as well. Now of course all this is going to be possible, because if Germany took over Russia, that means Japan is still hitting pearl harbor, and attacking United States, which is consuming a large number of USA's fleet and Navy. So while the USA is trying to protect Europe's front, also defending the southern front against Japan, their is no way they are going to stop a Northern attack by Germany, when all German needs is a few bombers to swing by with some A-Bombs.

it could never have happened for the following reasons:
When Hitler invaded Chzeckoslovakia the world began to suspect what Hitler's real ambitions were. After the invasion of Poland they were in no doubt. Hitler intended to turn Poland into a vast industrial machine for the destruction and processing of human beings into a selection of by products. And he was going to use the Polish as slave labour
to build it. One in five poles died during the Nazi occupation and it became quite apparent that the remainder of the population would soon follow them. A point to remember here is that the death camps in Poland were not specifically intended as a means with which to exterminate the jews. An estimated 200,000 germans went thru those camps along with hundreds of thousands of poles, slavs,gypsies, the mentally retarded the infirm the ill...anyone who didnt meet the Nazi criteria for the perfect 'Aryan'
When the Nazis marched into the Ukraine they were welcomed with flowers but within weeks the population had been made aware that they were destined for the same fate as the Poles and as the Ukranians began to resist so the realisation of what the Nazis really intended spread.
had the nazis brought feedom from Stalin's oppression then the second world war may have had a very different outcome as it was the Nazi machine was doomed to failure from the very beginning.

but what if he found the spear of destiny in time????

(who rattled my cage!!)

the spear of destiny?....who knows..maybe adolf would have given it to goering so as to give authenticity to his orgies with fat eunuchs.

sounds like a PRIDE party!!!

Interesting topic, I always wondered what would have happened if Hitler took over the world. What life would be like now.

This is talking about WW2..not modern days. Things were different.

Had Hitler actually invaded the UK and conquered Russia like he could have...I think it would have been possible. Though I dont think he ever even wanted to invade America in the first place..so its kind of a moot point.

I may be Welsh, but I'm a British citizen, we fight side by side with our scottish, English and Irish counterparts. At this moment in time we are standing side by side and dieing with our American counterparts. We have and have always fought for the good of mankind. Stupid and idiotic digs at us, only causes divides between men and women who need our support.

I dont appreciate it, neither probably do they.

You may think you are the greatest country and the biggest super power, but only because smaller nations like ourselves support you.

This is a possibility maybe they would of done it VIA Secret Agents or some secret weapon or something...... the thing is if Hitler had ANY plans to get there WWII would probably of been the great war to end all wars because there wouldnt be anyone left American Citizens would of fought to the death leaving probably nothing, and look at it Washington D.C. is connect to the sea by rivers all Hitler had to do was sail an army up the Potamach (sp?) River and well the Washington D.C. Police Department wasn't really trained to fight off and army with Batons and Pistols therefore forceing F.D.R. to sign a treaty forcing the Americans off the war I did it in a game called Axis&Allies with the starting troops given to Germany. It was possible if Hitler had a few more friends on his side well....lets just say Trench Warfare....heck it might even be still happening look at Japan buying that AMerican Oil company there is a way to stop that...Japan is a forgein nation so there for it is not covered by the Consituition and therefore has no property rights to American Soil...just take them to the Supreme Court...and you'll get your house back.

the point is hitler didnt and couldnt have conquered russia, he didnt want to attack britian because they were aryian also but was forced to, and the only country to be offically declared war on by germany was the united states (due to the japanese treaty stating so )but he must have had plans for them anyway. even if hitler did by some insanly rare chance conquer the ussr and england, and then had atomic bombs (which the americans would have had to) then he could have launched them on altered v2 rockets, but america would f*** everyone else up with a mass production of them, thus ending the world. he also had bombers that had capabilities to attack new york but it didnt serve a purpose and he was down the man power (yeah they didnt run out of planes they ran out of pilots and gas), and for the guy who played axis and allies that game is so stupidity unrealistic (even the new one) that its left up to the roll of the dice and you can alter crap, it is insane to even begin to believe it

Also, just a thought...to support the German Amry, they would have needed alot of conscripts from conquered countries...not a good sources of manpower.

They also had Japan for an allie.

Japan Italy and Germany were the MAIN Axis powers, just like USA, GB, and the USSR was the MAIN Allied powers. There were more than just those countries fighting the war.

AXIS

Major Powers:
-Germany*
-Italy*
-Japan*
-Vichy France

Minor Powers:
-Romania
-Hungary
-Bulgaria
-Austria (If you want to count annexed)
-Some Middle Eastern Countries (Direct colation with Axis powers are still being discussed till this day)

Neutral Axis Supporters:
-Argentina
-Spain
-Portugal

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ALLIES:

Major Powers:
-United States*
-Soviet Union*
-Great Britain*
-Free France
-China
-Poland
-Australia
-Canada

Minor Powers:
-India
-New Zealand
-Rhodesia
-Nepal
-South Africa
-Norway
-Belgium
-Greece
-Brazil

There are more, but I just want to list countries that had any "large" significance in the war.

Point taken, but MJB222 used the present tense and I responded accordingly. Perhaps they meant to say 'were'.

Any theories on how the world would be IF the nazis got there way. I have no doubt in my mind that if this did happen, there would be non stop underground revolutionaries ALWAYS putting up a fight no matter what. So my theory is that the fighting would never have stopped if you know what I mean.

There is no way in my mind that Hitler would have had a large enough army to invade and occupy the UK and the vastness of Russia, with its army of millions, keep order all over Europe and be invading America at the same time.

Had Hitler stay out of military matters, the war would have been much longer, with more casulties. America may have needed to use the Atom bomb more times than they did. The outcome would still be the same though, othere than loss of life.

Hitler coundn't of taken opver the USA but the real interesting part is that even if hitler did the world would be normal in 40yrs beacause no man can have that vast an empire i mean alexander the great was a good example and the mongols both fell into chaos in 50yrs after Alex and Genghis both died and 100yrs later almost everything was back to normal



Now if this was the Romans than yeah id be worried

[quote name='StalingradK' date='Nov 4 2005, 09:20 PM' post='917002']
-Vichy France

hey france was forced into submisson beacause of the germans read all the ww2 books they almost always say that oh and there was Mexico for the axis they led the first attack on american soil in what 200yrs i think oh and back on france they also helped the british deafete the germans by giving ther spys to them next time think before u post






im still wondering about rome though

What the hell are you smoking? There was a difference between Free France/French Resistance and Vichy France... You pick up a book. Vichy France attacked the Advancing Allies in North Africa and other places scattered throughout Europe. Though most of them surrendered under heavy fighting, they are still considered a major Axis power because they contributed so much to the other powers, not military wise, but other aspects as well. Why don't you think before you post? You seemed like a Jackass.

Also, Mexico was an Axis supporter, they almost caved into Hitler's demands to engage the USA in battle. But they did not. They stayed Neutral military wise throughout the war.

ohh my books say there was 2 frances not three ( throws book into furnace ) and actullay mexico did in fact attack the usa once but only with 30 men all but three ran and they were killed but american civilans did die from the japanese ballon bomb ( yeah i know its silly but true ) and of course i was wrong with the frech part its just maddens me so went someone insults my french heritige

Yeah.. But I believe the Mexican attackers were radical axis supporters, not issued to attack the USA. Yeah.. .Like a couple hundred of those balloons made land fall, but only 1 killed a family in Oregon.... or was it Washington... ****!

And how was that insulting your french side? I merely stated a fact.

beacause i didn't know there were 3 french sides i thought vinchy was a insult and it was wasington

Thanks

Those baloon bombs are crazy. I think they killed more than just a family. I think there was also some people in the hills camping as well. Then again maybe those were the people...I cant remember.

They were also thinking of turning those into kamikaze wepons and having a Japanese pilot sit in the baloon and manually control it. Me thinks that never fell through .

it didn't oh and ur welcome

He had to get passed the british to get to USofA there was no way he could have done that .