There was a flood, it killed nearly everyone in the valley for as far as the eye could see with the exception of Noah.
You see, Noah had accumilated great wealth as a shipping merchant. He saved much of his earnings by having his family work the business with him. One day he realized that insead of having several small boats, that are imossible to navigate when his sons all decide to go fishing once each week, he would build one very large one. So if they were not around heck he could sail the thing by hisself.
People laughed at Noah for building such a large boat. They had never seen anything like it and couldn't understand how a boat could be so big.

One very bad monsoon season, it rained for a whole week straight. The rivers overflowed like never before. Noahs family was on the big boat because of the fact that all the houses were underwater. Then without warning, a massive wall of water came rushing upon the area as far as the eye could see. And everyone in every village all through the valley as far as the eye could see was drowned. But Noah was safe on his boat with all his family and all the farm animals that they needed to keep safe.
Later, after the waters resided, Noah went back to his farm land and lived out his life for many years. As time went on, people began to come from afar and settle in the valley where Noah lived. Everyone used to gather around on Sunday's to listen to Noah and his story of the great flood.

After Noah's death, and the death of all his immediate family members, his story carried on without him. But each time it was told it changed a little. Finally one day, this priest from afar heard the story and thought that if all he did was change it around a little bit he could make people think God was involved and convince people to believe the ideas he had so he could continue being a priest. It was after all nice to be a priest when you didn't have to work and you could get people to give you food just for telling a few stories about God.
So he did, and it worked! He then decided to do it again. He took many old legends and myths from far away lands and changed them so that God was involved and each story could hold a lesson for people on how God wants everyone to behave.
Well, it went over so nice. He soon became a rich man. He quickly got together with some scribes that could write on clay tablets and had them record every story he told. When asked were he got the information he would just say that God spoke to him personally and that was enough for them.
One day he died. And he was standing in a place that was very strange. He heard a voice that came out of nowhere. It was loud and angry, it said, " Do you realize what you have done! I''ll never get those people down there to understand me now!"

Actually.. there is also theories that the whole flood thing orriginated when the water level rose sharply in the mediteranian sea... causeing this thin rocky wall and flooded the vally that is not the Black Sea... there is evidince under it showing that the land under the sea was once dry land... and that there was a fresh water lake there.

They think that the survivors of the flood spread out to whever they could... and thus the legends of a "huge flood" spread. And how we got these four flood stories.. epic of gilgamesh... and then later on.. Noah.

But.. that's a theory.. there could have been another valley flooding that spurred the Noah story as well.

And maybe not. In fact, not a chance. There are 72 global accounts of a global flood intermingled in just about every continent on the planet. And it gets deeper.

Don't assume.

And you're assuming that these 72 accounts of a global flood arn't just localized floods...

And well... if Noah and his kiddos are the only human survivors... then how come there are all these other legends?

Very hard to believe that people who lived in a place longer then the bible accounts for human existance all are from this one instence. Again... geneticly.. incest is bad... If human stock went down to Noah.. his two kids and their spouces... we'd still not make it geneticly.

Wow! 72 accounts out of the 500,000 different cultures that have existed worldwide since 10,000 BCE! That must be a rollicking .0114%. Noah was probably based on a flooding in Mesopotamia long before the Hebrews came along and stole the story to include in their new "holy book"!

It never ceases to amaze what the fervently religious will believe. Stories meant as allegory are literalized and taken as authentic. Even the Vatican and theologians have warned against doing such things--particularly with Genesis.

The Noah story is a blatant rip-off of the Gilgamesh epic--a far more ancient tale than the Noah story. These--and there were two different discoveries of the Epic of Gilgamesh found, by the way: one dated from 600's BCE, the second from the 2000's BCE--were well-known and retold. They were very popular tales. They heavily influenced the Hebrew scribes while in exile in Babylon.

Exploring Ancient World Cultures
http://eawc.evansville.edu/nepage.htm

Canaanite/Ugaritic Mythology FAQ, ver. 1.2
http://home.comcast.net/~chris.s/canaanite-faq.html

Sumerian Mythology FAQ (Version 2.0html)
http://home.comcast.net/~chris.s/sumer-faq.html

The Assyro-Babylonian Mythology FAQ version 1.9html
http://home.comcast.net/~chris.s/assyrbabyl-faq.html

Sean

And your point is?
History is meaningless. It exists solely to provide a point of reference. Dwelling on or in the past is deleterious & wasteful if not downright indulgent. No offense but who's telling stories now?

I'm sure you're not claiming there were 72 global floods AFTER Noah's, are you?

Those that do not know the mistakes of the past are bound to repeat them endlessly.

[QUOTE
History is meaningless. It exists solely to provide a point of reference.
Those that do not know the mistakes of the past are bound to repeat them endlessly.]

- "Those who do not LEARN from the mistakes of past history are doomed to repeat them."

And, yes, to certain degree, history is misguided misinformation because it was written, for the most part, by a subjective author offering only one POV. Examples: Columbus, Colonization of Africa, Warren Commission Report...

German philosopher Hegel: “history teaches that history teaches us nothing ”. I do say I rather have to agree with him.

Unlike myths or tall tales, or folktales, these stories were written down by Moses and the others who wrote these books, God told them what to write, THE Bible ISN'T!!!! I repeat ISN'T written from word of mouth or from passing it down and priests don't write the books of the books of the bible, people who were in the bible, wrote the bible.

God made Noah's family able to breed with each other until they had kids, who had kids, who had kids, who had kids, who had kids, who had kids and then God made it back to where you shouldn't breed with family.

....

Ok then... the cornstalk flood legend is true.

Old Man told Coyote that there was going to be a flood that will cover the lands. Coyote then felt that it was his job to save the tribe and such. So he told this old couple to take this magic cornstalk and when the time comes.. fill it with the young and brave of their tribe and the animals they can find. Not to worry about the water animals like the loon, duck, otter, turtle, and fish.

So when the time had come for the flood, the old couple placed the cornstalk where Coyote told them to.. and and grew and grew and grew and grew untill it reached where the sun lives... and thicker then the mightiest tree. With the help from their tribe, the loaded it with food, items and animals... then sealed themselves in. Soon it began to rain and rain and rain till all the land they they could see was covered with water. After a few days, it stopped raining, and the old couple opened up the stalk and saw that it was still flooded. So they closed it back up and they waited more. On the third try, they saw that the water was gone and they could leave the stalk.

Once everyone was out.. and the animals... the stalk withered and fell to the ground. And with that.. the tribe repopulated their lands as did the animals they took with them. And the water animals did indeed survive as well.

Although the evidence strongly suggests it, it is unfair to state categorically that the Biblical flood was simply copied from the Gilgamesh epic. Both cultures could have "remembered" the known Black Sea flood and developed their seperate legends.

Even if we accept that the God of the Bible is a real entity, and a man named Noah preserved his family on the ark, this does not prove there was a world flood, for which the geologic evidence cannot be proven, nor the absurdity of all the world's animals crammed on such a ship. In fact it is the diversity of animal on all continents that proves there simply could not be such a catastrophe in human times.

The ancient hebrew text can be translated to mean there was a localized flood in "Noah's World", not the whole world. Interestingly, the Black Sea flood corresponds fairly closely with the Biblical chronology.

If the biblical God is real, perhaps he did warn Noah of the Black Sea flood, and instructed him to build a "realistic" ark that would have preserved his family, and their all-important livestock, without which, they would have perished.

Certain fundamentalists have carried the Noah story to such a ridiculous extreme that not only do they believe examples of all the world's living animals were somehow placed on this ark, but even DINOSAURS since they believe these are the "dragons" mentioned in the bible as living animals after the "Flood"!

Oh my. And your evidence for such a bold statement?

Sean

That is why a good historian does not depend on a single source, but instead studies multiple sources. Since each recorder sees things in a different perspective and all too often has an “axe to grind” for one reason or another, it is necessary to study all aspects of a subject action, event, or oration before making a definitive declaration concerning it.

This I find to be ludicrous! The military commander who understands Hannibal’s strategy at the Battle of the Trebia is much more likely to be a successful antagonist than the poor slob that says, “History, who needs it!” This carries on in the non-military life also. The Financier that understands the basis of Roman, Medieval, and past financial systems, the Merchant that understands the basis laid down by all the previous merchants of the long drawn out past is more likely to be much more successful than those who do not understand history and it’s impact upon us in our everyday life. Yes Virginia, history is more than a dull dusty study of things that don’t affect the “real” world. After all, once it was the real world!

No. Ashley was implying that the number, and worldwide distribution, of flood myths implies there may have really been a global flood.

However, the differences in details amongst these myths suggest a number of more localised events if a more logical explanation - especially in view of the absolute lack of geological evidence for a global flood.

Stephen Oppenheimer argues that many of the elements seem to originate from SE Asia - and area which did suffer catastrophic flooding at the end of the ice age. However, I believe that the Mesopotamian flood myths - of which the Biblical Noah stories (there are actually 2 seperate accounts in the Bible, rather inexpertly melded into one) is a later variation - is based on a real event which took place, probably in the Persian Gulf, sometime around 5 to 5.5 thousand years ago.

How do you know that? You dont.



Thats your belief. If that is the case, then I suppose its also reasonable to assume that thats what happened during the other 72 floods, right?

Now, wheres Ashley, I want her to answer my question!

Meh, good enough.

So, if she's not implying that there were 72 global floods after Noah, the only other explanation is that either they originated from localised floods and were exaggerated, or they are not individual legends at all, but derivitives. In either case, it shows that the number is not important at all, it doesnt at all serve to support the argument that there was a global flood.

The 72 accounts would be of the exact same event, and most re-tell the exact same story. Angry God, 'sky beings' mating with mortal women creating giants, global flood which wipes them out.

As for Gilgamesh, this was a POST-FLOOD STORY about a GIANT who ESCAPED AND SURVIVED THE FLOOD. Golgamesh, I'll add is the name of a NEPHILIM as per Dead Sea Scrolls.

And as I've said before, it wasn't simply 'just a flood' it being with several asteroid hits into the ocean causing tsunami's global climatic changes, flooding, and an eventual ice age.

Now, we all know that tsumani's can be related to the breaking of continental plates. Anyone who denies that was living under a rock when the last tsunami hit. Think about that.

Oh, this just makes me sad...

Judeo-Christian beliefs about incest did not originate untill the law was laid down in the time of Moses, for one thing.

And if the flood was just local, why did Noah need to bring on all the kinds of animals he did.

For those of you who cannot believe that he could fit all the species of animals in the world onto one boat, he didn't need to. The Bible said that they came two by two in thier own "kind". This word more closley relates to a genus level of genetic "closeness". This would amount to only about 16,000 animals that needed to be on the ark to recieve even today's level of variety in species.

And yeah, sure Gilgamesh was probably a giant, and big headed too. Most likely Noah passed down the story of flood (who wouldn't) to his decendants and that's how he knew about the flood, he was a decendant of Noah. I don't know where you all are getting the idea that he was a Niphilum. Niphilum were pre-flood anyway. I also happen to believe that humans around the flood era happened to be huge compared to today's standards, with some larger than others. So its understandable that he was a large man.

Please not that tired old much discredited "kind"...that requires accelerated evolution (yes the dirty word) in order for the kinds to become the myriad of species today! While you are at it, explain how the ark, Noah and family and the "kinds" survived the pressure and heat!

not just that... but again, there has never, ever, ever, been recorded marsupials, penguins, puffins, seals, mantatees, echidnas and platypusses, Lammas, alpachas, rheas, emus, cassowaries, cougars, polar bears, sea otters, coyotes, prarie dogs... ( you get the idea) in that area. EVER. So how could Noah even get those "Kinds"? He couldn't have...

Exactly why it doesn't make sense.
SC, is that avatar a modern variation of Bast.

It looks so....

._o that's... me...

He didn't, God did.

I don't believe it to be scripture, but I do believe it to be true; the Book of Jasher does have something to say about this! It kinda cool, too.

That's not.. exactly what the bible said now is it. He clearly said "Moses, get off her keister and go out and collect these animals..." He didn't say "Here, I brought them all to you, shove them on that boat..." (well neither is that.. but I'm not going to look for the dang verse... cold medication makes my mind not..something...something... *daze*)

He said take the animals, not go get them.

To quote " 19 You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you. "- Genesis 6:19 NIV

He never stated how he got 'em, just to bring 'em in. The word bring in the orginial hebrew lexicon means "to bring in", or to "lead in". Nowhere does it hint at going out to collect, and then to bring back.

Later on in Chapter 7, the bible says:

8 Pairs of clean and unclean animals, of birds and of all creatures that move along the ground, 9 male and female, came to Noah and entered the ark, as God had commanded Noah.
--NIV

It clearly states here that the animals came to Noah.

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Book of Jasher is not the Word of God, but has some interesting incite into how the animals came to Noah, and how Noah chose the animals to come onto the ark.

well then, why the #$@%$@# did he bring mosquitos?!?!?!

I still want to know how Noah and all withstood the heat and pressures!