Ok, first to make things clear, I am NOT a JW. I know many JW. Now, the reason I'm starting this topic is because I'm angered to no end how people make websites about Jehovah Witnesses to make them look bad when literaly over 85% of the contents of the websites are lies. Search for "Jehovah Witnesses" on google and all you'll find is JW bashing.


I just wanted to clarify a few of the myths that are floating around about Jehovah Witnesses. We'll start off by you telling me what you think they believe.

Things that are true:
They do no celebrate most Holidays.
They do not beleive in the Trinity.
They beleive that any person can have a ressurrection regardless of their religion as long as you're a good person.

I know a JW and the first one is correct. I don't know about the rest. If you aren't a JW why are you concerned about THEM being bashed? Haven't you figured out yet...it isn't the JW who are being bashed...it is ANYONE who professes ANY belief in the BIBLE. Isn't it interesting that the world wants to denounce the God of the Israelites as if He actually existed. It isn't the bashing of JW that is going on here Zero...it is 'thought control' being practiced by all those who are doing the 'bashing'.

Isn't it also interesting that these folk get all lathered up about something they 'know' isn't even real. If I claim the 'boogey-man' lives in the closet, people 'know' that he isn't real and if I try and convince them they will just shake their heads and walk away.

People don't like the JW; not because of what they believe...the world could care less...as long as what they believe involves Scripture from the Bible they are a target.

I personally don't like the JW. I am a Christian and I don't believe what THEY believe. But when they come to my door I just say I'm not interested and leave it at that.

Final Note: People who bash other people's beliefs are insecure in their own beliefs. Bashing is telling the whole world: "I am Insecure".

Like religious people (specially cristians in the western countries) when bash wicans, other religion and people how dont belives in gods?

I'm a JW basher, dont really care what you think of me either. My mother is a JW she was before I was born, and I know dozens upon dozens of them. I have nothing against people of a religious background, you couldnt call me a christian basher or anything else.

Reasons.

I dont like it being forced onto me (door to door)

They dont believe in blood transfusions inorder to save lives.

They will not enter any other religious ceremony Wedding or funeral inside of a church.

The origins of how JW started at the begining of the century, smacks of Scientology at the begining, and a lot of lies told.

There beliefs kept changing originally it was a farce.

I understand your position, Shaun. I think the major complaint that people have is the intrusion JWs do when knocking at your door. Also their insistence in selling the product of Jesus. I have to confess that once I was cooking something in the kitchen and had a large knife in my hand, cutting carrots. The doorbell rang and it was, of course, three kindly little ladies from the JW clan. They had their practiced smiles and asked if they could talk to me about God. It struck me and I could not resist it. "Oh, yes! Please come in!" I said anxiously. "I just lost my job at the post office and I need to talk to someone." I waved the knife for emphasis.

I did not have any JWs at my door for years afterward.

I have a few issues (Here are a dozen to start with!) with an organization church or otherwise that.

1.Insist their interpretation is correct and without flaw, all others must be controlled by satan.
2.Heaven exists only for their members.
3.Heaven is limited only to 144,000 Jehovah's Witnesses.
4.You are discouraged from attending college and furthering your education.
5.All governments are controlled by Satan.
6.You cannot take a blood transfusion, even to save the life of your child.
7.You are forbidden to be a police officer or soldier.
8.If one does not follow the rules of the Watchtower they will be shunned. You cannot speak to former members who are shunned (disfellowshipped).
9.You cannot run for or hold a political office.
10.You are discouraged from giving to charity (except Watchtower causes)
11.You cannot have friends who are not Jehovah's Witnesses
12.You cannot understand the Bible without Watchtower literature to explain it.
You can never question what is printed in Watchtower literature.

And then they wonder why people want to bash them! Hello!! I am sure with those attitudes if they showed up on Mother Theresa’s doorstep she would be inclined to drop kick them!

Irish

I dont like it being forced onto me (door to door)

They dont believe in blood transfusions inorder to save lives.

They will not enter any other religious ceremony Wedding or funeral inside of a church."



Only true one there is the second one. They don't intrude on you when they knock. In that case, girl scouts are intruding on me also. They ask you to study with you, ASK. And they also incourage you to study the bible on your own.





1) Not true.
2) False
3) Half false. They beleive there is 144,000 but not all are JW.
4) LOL! You see what I mean. this is why it pisses me off. False!
5) False. But they don't care for politics.
6) No, but that's why they do other methods.
7) Not sure about that. Maybe in the army but not a policeman.
8) Only if you are baptized and you do something such as drugs, they will try to avoid you untill you change. There's a passage for this, forgot what it was. Although, you can be around the person to help them get off.
9) True
10) Big false.
11) Big false. LOL! In that case they wouldn't be friends with me.
12) Big false.

How does this kind of stuff get around?

I'll tell you how... By people who are JW... and people who left the church. And I know first hand that if you left the church no one from said church will treat you like a brethren or friend again. (atleast infront of others...)

I lived a block from a Kingdom Hall... so I knew quite a few of them. Even know someone who had so much problems with the others when she left the church.

And yes... some of them do get pushy when they come to your door. They put their foot in, so to speak, and no matter how many times you say "Not intrested" they either keep trying, or come back the next week.

Saying "No.. don't come back" Does not always work.

IMO the whole underling reason for this particular expression of religon is the way to god is thru denouncing the things of life to a very exaggerated degree, they see happiness and joy as counter productive to the end product which is beieng the chosen few to inhabit a perfect earth, IMO it is more of a cult and bordering on dangerous, IMO its fear propaganda to the highest degree, they generally attract people who feel rejected for whatever reasons, they except them in where others won't, they play on the fear and rejection that is already there they feel understood possibly???? Namaste Sheri

In that case blame the people not the religion because they don't do that where I live.

I've also heard one where they try to make you read "there" bible. False, when they came here once, they wanted us to get any bible we had, they encouraged us to get another religions bible to show that it said the same thing.





Who told you this?? Why?? Do you actualy beleive this??(I'm doing the Sherri Berri)

Aahh the good old "Blame the people not the religion"

You asked where these "stories" came from.. and were told. Obviously it's not "just in my area" if other's know how JW's can get....

*shrugs*

I believe that they denounce the religion, not the non-existent god. Why would they bother with the god, he isn't doing anything to them, but his followers, well now that is a different story. They are all the time trying to push their beliefs in everyone else's face, trying to ge laws changed to favor their religion and squeal like pigs in a slaughterhouse if anyone says anything nice about another religion or if anyone even dare to intimate that their god just might be fake! Yeah, it isn't the god that people denounce, it is the religion and it's followers! - TA

dude, your avatar scares me.

The reason you will rarely see a follower of the Watchtower society aka Jehovah Witness on these forums is they are discouraged from one on one communication with those outside the organization. As according to their beliefs everyone outside their church is controlled by the devil. That’s also the reason they will never come to your door alone. They are encouraged to report back to the elders if their partner is having any form of doubt while on door knocking assignments.
Any members with doubts are then threatened with excommunication and face being shunned by their family and friends.
I ask you ZeroShadow does this sound like a religion worth pursuing?, and I assure you these are not lies nor slander but directions from their own literature.
Irish

That's not true.




Also not true.



There are also fake books and websites that are "from Jehovah Witnesses" but they're fake to make them look bad. I don't have the links or book titles as of now though.



Go on yahoo, there's a big chat room for people to talk to JW.

Ya know, this could go back and forth all night. He says "a" and you say "false".

Anything to back up these statements? From either side?

that's the most recent photo of my son! I am insulted! not really, it is freaky isn't it, can't remember where I found it. - TA

there's no way in heck am I going outside in the freezing cold to call my friend.. tell her to come here and tell us what it was like for her after she got out of the church. ;P

It's like the mormons and the scientologists. leave them and you're blacklisted.

Uhm, I was asking to avoid this becoming a schoolyard fight with such witty remarks as
"uh-huh!"
"nyu-uh"

If someone states "they don't do....." I would expect some sort or corroboration.
If the defender shouts "false!!", I also excpect to see corroboration from him/her.

Elsewise, this is a hearsay vs rumor argument.

Just trying to do my part for world (and forum!) peace

Actually yes i do its based on personal experince my best friend was a JW, she got out , its very true what Silver says you are black listed by the ones she mentioned also. namaste sheri

I can back it up by telling you to go to a kingdom hall to get all these questions cleared up. I'll leave that up to you though, because that's how I found out what's true and what's not. They take everything the Jehovah Witnesses say out of context.

They beleive that satan is the system of things. I bet that's where they take that out of context and say "they beleive anyone who isn't a JW is controlled by the devil!" when that's not what they're saying at all.

You know I always have back up
From their own books:
The JW church is the self-proclaimed prophet of God (The Watchtower, February 15, 1979, p. 30).
JWs claim to be the only channel of God's truth (The Watchtower, February 15, 1981, p. 19).
Only their church members will be saved, i.e., 144,000 of them (The Watchtower, February 15, 1979, p. 30).
Only 144,000 Jehovah's Witnesses go to heaven (Reasoning from the Scriptures, 1985, pp. 166-167, 361; Let God be True, p. 121).

Irish

ahhh. the old "I know its not correct, go look for yourself" trick.

You are the one attacking these so-called fallacies, it behooves you to provide some documentary evidence to the contrary.

Or shall we just take your word for it?

When they don't do it:

1) When you decide to change religions.

2) When you want to leave.

When they try not to hang around you(not totaly ignore) is when you:

Do things such as murder someone, drugs, adultry

Or turn against the religion after being baptized and say bad things about them. They won't let you get baptized unless you know that you want to and you're sure you beleive that it's the correct religion for you. That's why you HAVE to study with them for 6months before they let you choose to be baptized. This in my opinion is very smart. Unlike other religions baptizing at birth.

No, you should take their word for it. Don't knock it till you've talked to them.




Ahhh yes I admit to being wrong here. This is what they beleive:

There's only 144,000 chosen to go to heaven. Those are of the true religion, and every religion beleives that thei religion is the right one, correct? Well, that's why JW beleive the same thing or they wouldn't be in that religion if they didn't think it was true. BUT, that's not all of the people who will make. Many many people wil be ressurected to a perfect Earth and not all will be JW. You just have to be a good person.




They beleive they're the most accurate. IE: The trinity, the stake instead of the cross, etc... They're confident that what they beleive is true, but this goes for any other religion. Do you really think other religions don't consider themselves correct?


Anymore?

psst Zero, did you check out Irish's last post?

Thats what I'm talking about.

A gentle bit of advice: If you are going to debate something, it helps to have resources to back up your claims.

Zero the majority of the rejection of religon or the not choosing one versus another is the Dogma most conflict is becasue of the dogma, my friend had nothing against anyone she just couldn't swallow the dogma and its required to except the beleifs and even if its not why do it if you aren't gonna try and beleive as them??? It sounds as if you want to be JW and everything said to the contrary is filtered trough your wish or desire to be a JW , the best thing is if its kool with your parents just try it out if you doesn't work out for you get out. namaste Sheri

Meh, I told you, ask them yourself and you'll see if I'm lying or not. If I am then you have the right to call me wrong. They have all the magazines and iformation for you.

Also here is their site.


http://www.watchtower.org/

As I said, Zero.. And let me make this clearer..

I HAVE TALKED TO THEM! I have talked to JW.. I have talked to people who left them. One of my best friends left them.. and she's not the type that would lie to make them look bad.

So telling me that I don't know what I'm talking about.. or that I should talk to a JW is pointless. I HAVE! *gasp* Is this a hard concept for you?


I have had them come to my door. I lived in spitting distance from the hall.. so I got to see it and talked to those I saw within it. One of my school friends was in a JW family...

So yes, I know what I'm talking about. When I said everything I said.. it's from first hand knowledge.. not hearsay.

Zero you are having quetions about them we telling you what we have heard and you are arguing, Why???we are telling you waht we have heard, Silver has a best freind similar to my best friend they are awesome people who aren't lying I also work with a girl who is a beautiful girl your age she is having a crisis of faith her self since she started college her too she has said specifically I' have nothing agains the Jw's they were nice to me I just want to explore other things. things don't have to be for bad reasons to not want to choose them or leave them behind or grow, People just outgrow things they no longer serve them for where they are going next or who they want to be. Namaste Sheri

Silver I never said you don't know what you're talking about. The odd thing is we can both be right. Maybe it's the church you live near? It differs from the one here because they're not like that here. I HAVE JW RELATIVES. And I've also studied with them. That's also first hand knowledge.


Sherri, what are you talking about? Lol, I didn't say there was anything wrong with not choosing to be a JW. Hell, I'm not even in a specific religion, I just beleive in the God of the bible: Jehovah/Yahweh.

Is there another reason beside the obvious, going door to door?? I would have issue with pimping myself for God?? I find that hilarious namaste Sheri

What's wrong with going door to door? Why wouldn't a christian want other people to beleive and love in God? They don't force anything on you. They ASK you if they can come in where I live. And they also encourage you to study the bible yourself and if they have any questions feel free to ask them. And they in no way try to keep the people they study with away from other religions.

Pimping myself for God does sound funny, I gosta admit. XD

Simply put... and from my point of view...

I am happy with my faith. And when I ask them first to kindly leave and don't come back, and they do anyways... every flippin weekend... I get annoyed. I know all about Jesus... I used to be christian... I don't need to be solicited to.

soliciting jesus.....

some things sell themselves, and other things have to be shoved at people every way possible to sell them. Most people can quickly identify the key attributes of these two classes of products.

I would like to correct myself on something I said earlier, that they dont allow blood transfusions. Apparently they have now changed their mind. Not that is unusual for them to change their minds, seeing as they have changed their name and doctrines to suit several times. But they are now allowing transfusions called "Hemopure" which is derived from cows blood! So now what are they going to have to do? yes, you guest it, revise their literature to fit.

As far as I and my family members know, they still don't. But, if you can admit you're wrong and change your mind, that just shows you're more honast than others who still won't admit they're wrong and refuse to change what they beleive.

Regardless of what religion I was I'd be knocking at your door and giggling to myself all day XD. I want those.......(on myself, not a door)

Awesome I AAAm I haven't laughed that hard since flying pigs, thank you that was much needed. namaste Sheri

such a hater you are sheri. "pimping" !! boy, somebody is a bit disillusioned by some negative event in life. somebody named sheri. seriously, what happened to you?

heres why i ask.
1. posts sensationalistic adjectives and verbs like "pimp" and "hilarious"
2. always has a negative view of someone elses beliefs. especially when it has to do with the judeo christian god.

so something caused such animosity. opinons should be posted maturely.

I am not wrong. The "Hemopure" transfusion started just recently in sweden.

I just found this -




So if you would like to admit you were wrong ZeroShadow, I wouldnt think any the less of you.



I agree pbarroso.

Although I can be acused of the same thing sometimes.

Just playing devils advocate but,

If I went around to their house with one of my books, let me think which one, oh I know, The secrets of Witchcraft. It has a really gothic cover, very mood inspiring. Just to discuss the virtues of nature worship and maybe sex magik or something, this would be o.k?

I mean I know imposing on their time is a tad rude, but it's not like I would be trying to share my ideas on what is in my opinion, the One true religion, because telling people there is only one way to God in my eyes, is not very good manners.

On the door knocking subject I had an interesting experience a few years ago. I had two members of the JW’s and two Mormons arrive on my door step within minutes of each other. It was one of those quite Saturday mornings the wife and kids where out of town and I was in the mood for some stimulating conversation.
I invited them all in for coffee and dialog, well I had to drink the coffee myself. The conversation was very interesting, it’s a good thing they are pacifists by belief because the ensuring verbal brawl was much akin to a bar fight.
Having studied both religions and knowing where they differed I played dumb and just pushed the right buttons at the right times. I know it was not a good Christian thing to do. But the entertainment factor was to appealing.
The meeting lasted an hour an forty five minutes of non stop bible quoting WWF style.
Even though I do not agree with either’s interpretations, I must admit I admire their tenacity and zeal in their faith.

Irish

Ummm...well...yeah, I would guess that you would get a much better response than the folks sending out the watchtower...

If someone is going to stop by on a sunday morning to talk; I know who I would choose

Uhm, do we get a practical demonstration of the sex magick?

Call Sunday around 9:30am (the wife and kids will be away...)

Yes, in church!!

*laughs* OY! I knew as soon as Kis said "sex magic" the boys would make their comments.... *snickerfits*

what? I'm interested in learning new things...........

When did I tell you that you were wrong? O_o...


You told me JW changed their minds, I'm saying that shows that they're honast and can admit to being wrong unlike alot of other religions. Where'd you get that I said you were wrong? O_o