I copied this from the Infinite Player master index. I thought it very convincing and would explain the battle we see going on in the courts, the media, and the coming revelation. I thought this forum the most approapriate area to talk about this. What do you all think?

The Anti Christ Exposed

Imagine for a moment Christ is Love. Imagine what would be it's opposite, Fear.
So the Anti Christ would create and use fear rather than Love.
Remember how many were taught they would go to Hell if they did not obey God and be good? Here we have fear being used as a tool, of the Anit-Christ.

Imagine you were God would you want people in Heaven that were good because of fear? Is that really the right motivation? Wouldn't you rather have an atheist that was good just for the hell of it? or a Pagan that was good out of Love, because they saw their self in all others. No and as you can see this notion of punishment is not of God.

It has been said that what portrayed itself as light and of God was really the darkness and what was claimed to be the darkness was really the light. It warns in the Bible something that would portray itself to be of God but was really the Anti Christ, the opposite of Love.

If you were selling salvation what better way to increase revenue than to create guilt? What better way to produce guilt than to tie it to the expression of the Life Force. SEX

It was forbidden to masturbate, a sin, they would tell you one would go blind, because they knew everyone would and then would feel guilty and then must buy their salvation and for some appear in the confession to admit your sins. For if you did not you would go to hell.

Guilt and Shame are tools of the Anti Christ, that which would use them are not of God.

What parent would send there children to Hell? You see this is a lie. Heaven and Hell are not a destination they are a state of mind.

Sexual repression causes conflict, what better way to destroy unity? Make sex something dirty and unclean.

Why should it be a sin to stimulate another human beings nerve endings causing great pleasure?

What is the purpose of the depositing of the seed but to replicate a new machine, to provide for a new point of view?

Could nature be perverted? What would claim that it was? Perhaps something that was not of God.

The young child is taught to cover his body in shame, the child is also taught to identify with his body. Therefore he is taught to identify himself with shame.

Jesus mentioned that you could do and be greater than he. Yet there are institutions that teach that you are some lower sinful creature. Rather than have you express your greatness and divine nature there are those that would have you live in servitude as an indentured slave.

See through the Illusion the religious institutions and men have cast, for you are not finite you are infinite, you are not limited there are no boundaries; there is no scarcity there is abundance, for all matter is energy and energy is unlimited.

So now we understand that this is what the Church fears, that it will be found out that it is the Anti-Christ.
It is true that there is a spiritual foundation, great teachings, wisdom, in religion but it has been twisted to serve those who benefit from the deception. It is also true that religions served a purpose in their time for everything is in Divine Order; they no longer serve a purpose.

It is also true that religion, a man made fabrication, has become the conflict creator while it claims to promise Peace.

So now religion born of Ego will fall away leaving Spirituality born of the Divine.

Perhaps this is what certain religious institutions do not want to be known, that they are the Anti Christ in disguise.

I would note that this is not a reflection on any individual that is a member of these institutions but have some passed judgment, and labeled something evil and then attacked it with hate or justified lies and deception in it's regard.

This is not of the Divine nature, it is that of the Anti Christ the Ego, that which denies it's Self in others.

This is not directed at any specific church, it is just a notion.

Interesting. I personally don't believe in a literal anti-Christ, but it is a common suggestion. A more popular version of this post of yours is that one of the pope's will be the anti-Christ.

Regards, PA

I think LucidDreamer has created a topic that will be hotly debated here, however I have noticed that a lot of people are coming to this conclusion. I can't fault anything in the original post, it echoes my views perfectly; although I must admit the "church as anti-christ" is an interesting take I've not really considered before... I can see how you'd arrive at that decision. I've never heard of the Pope as antichrist version though

The antichrist is a man, an evil ruler at the time of the end. He is called by several different names, in the scriptures.
Scriptures about the antichrist: what the bible really says about him
Dan.7:24,25 Dan. 9:27 Dan. 7:7, 8,20,23,25 Dan. 2:44 Rev 13:1,2 Dan 8:23, 25 Dan 13:5,7, 11,12 Rev. 17:8 Rev. 17:11,13,14 Dan 11:21, 31, 36, 37, 38 45 2Thessalonians 2:4,8 Dan112:7 Rev 14:11 Rev.15:2 Rev 19:20 Rev20:10

Prophecies that the Antichrist will fulfill How will anybody know who the antichrist is? Is there any sure way of knowing? Yes, there is! The Bible gives specific clues as to what this "man of sin" will be like. Here we will take a look at scripture to find out exactly what is predicted for the "son of perdition". The antichrist will be a man - Daniel 7:24-25 He will confirm a covenant for 7 years - Daniel 9:27 Now also, this does not mean that he creates this covenant. The word here for "confirm" is 1396 gabar (gaw-bar'); a primitive root; to be strong; by implication, to prevail, act insolently: KJV-- exceed, confirm, be great, be mighty, prevail, put to more [strength], strengthen, be stronger, be valiant. The antichrist will strengthen a covenant for a 7 year time span. Now this could be an existing covenant (like the Jerusalem Covenant) or a new covenant drawn up at that time. He will rise among 10 kings - Daniel 7:8 This 10 nation union will be a revived Holy Roman Empire - Daniel 2:44 He will uproot 3 kings from the original 10 kings to gain political power - Daniel 7:8 His 10 nation union will merge into a world government which he will dominate - Revelations 13:1-2 Now this also, could refer to several things. First, the 10 nations could merge into an EXISTING world government, such as the U.N. Or it could for a new world government, much like the U.N. Or, this 10 nation confederation could be something like the new 10 nation common stock market. A union like this would definitely rule the world, without having a "seat" of power. Whoever controls the money, controls the globe. He will ascend to power on a platform of peace. By peace, he will destroy many - Daniel 8:25 He will be promoted and exalted by a miracle working religious partner (false prophet) - Revelations 13:11-12 He was, and is not, and yet is - Revelations 17:8 More than likely this is referring to political power. The antichrist will have ruled, but then be taken out of power. Only to rise back up again to power as the head of the One World Government. The antichrist will be preceded by 7 kings or rulers. He will be the 8th king. He will also be "of" the 7 - Revelations 17:11 Now this scripture has many different ways it can be viewed. The word "goeth" in the scripture is 5217 hupago (hoop-ag'-o); from 5259 and 71; to lead (oneself) under, i.e. withdraw or retire (as if sinking out of sight), literally or figuratively: KJV-- depart, get hence, go (a-) way. So we see that he will withdraw or retire from sight. But will rise back up again to power. Now this could be taken as to mean 7 kings. Or this could be taken as 7 World Governments that have ruled. So far there have been 6. 1. Egypt. 2. Assyria. 3. Babylon. 4. Medo-Persia. 5. Greece. 6. Rome He will have a mouth speaking great things. Very boastful - Daniel 7:8 His look will be more stout than his fellows - Daniel 7:20 The word "stout" means 7227 rab (rab); by contracted from 7231; abundant (in quantity, size, age, number, rank, quality): KJV-- (in) abound (-undance, -ant, -antly), captain, elder, enough, exceedingly, full, great (-ly, man, one), increase, long (enough, [time]), (do, have) many (-ifold, things, a time), ([ship-]) master, mighty, more, (too, very) much, multiply (-tude), officer, often [-times], plenteous, populous, prince, process [of time], suffice (-lent). So this can have several meanings. It could mean one of the following: the antichrist will be larger in size than everybody else, will be older than everybody else, will have more of a "following" than anybody else, is a higher military or political rank than anybody else, or is more qualified than anybody else. What ever this verse is speaking about, it is obvious when you look at him. He will have a fierce countenance - Daniel 8:23 He will understand puzzling things - Daniel 8:23 He will cause craft to prosper - Daniel 8:25 It is interesting to note the definition of the word "craft" here. It is 4820 mirmah (meer-maw'); from 7411 in the sense of deceiving; fraud: KJV-- craft, deceit (-ful, -fully), false, feigned, guile, subtilly, treachery. No wonder, for the Bible says that he is the father of lies. So his policy or his success will make it possible for his deception of the world to prosper. God said that if you do not believe the truth, that he would send strong delusion that you should believe a lie. He apparently assumes world dominating power 3 1/2 years after he confirms the covenant. He then will continue to reign for 42 months - Revelations 13:5 The Abomination of Desolation is the event that signals the beginning of this final 42 months - Daniel 9:27 He opposes God - 2 Thessalonians 2:4 He will speak marvelous things against the God of gods - Daniel 11:36 He will exalt himself above all that is called God - 2 Thessalonians 2:4 He will sit in the temple of God - 2 Thessalonians 2:4 He will claim to be God (or an incarnation of God) - 2 Thessalonians 2:4 He will take away the daily sacrifices from the temple - Daniel 11:31 He will plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain - Daniel 11:45 It would seem here that the Antichrist will setup small "fortifications" in between the sea and Jerusalem, to help keep control over things in distant areas away from the main offices. He will have power to make war with the saints and to overcome them - Revelations 13:7 He will continue this war with the saints for 3 1/2 years - Daniel 7:21, 25 This time of Great Tribulation is launched upon the Earth by the antichrist at the Abomination of Desolation. - Matthew 24:15,21. Up until this time, it would seem that he is a man of peace and not war. But now he shows his true colors. Perhaps is possessed by Satan himself at this point as well. Which would account for the false front being dropped at this time. During this time, the antichrist will scatter the power of the holy people - Daniel 12:7 He will rule a mighty and strong kingdom - Daniel 7:7 He was given power over all kindreds, tongues and nations - Revelations 13:7 His kingdom will devour the whole earth - Daniel 7:23 He will have great military power that will stand behind him, to enforce his laws - Daniel 11:31 He will try to change times and laws; and they will be given into his power for 3 1/2 years - Daniel 7:25 He will give great honor to the God of forces, with gold, silver, jewels, etc - Daniel 11:38 He will prosper in everything that he does - Daniel 8:24 He will not regard the God of his fathers - Daniel 11:37 He will not regard the desire of women - Daniel 11:37 It is interesting to note here that most people think that he will be a homosexual, which could be. The mark of the beast will be the amount of his name - Revelations 14:11 All that dwell upon the Earth will worship him, except those who's names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life - Revelations 15:2 He will have an image made after him - Revelations 15:2 This could also be in reference to his kingdom's logo or insignia. Much like the U.N. has a logo that every soldier on a U.N. mission must wear, there might also be a logo or insignia that his armies would have to wear His coming will be after the workings of Satan - 2 Thessalonians 2:8 He will fight against Jesus Christ at Armageddon (and loose I might add!) - Revelations 17:14 He will stand against the Prince of princes - Daniel 8:25 The Lord will consume him with the spirit of his mouth (which is the Word of God) - 2 Thessalonians 2:8 The Lord will destroy him with the brightness of his coming (which is his glory) - 2 Thessalonians 2:8 He will be cast alive into the lake of fire - Revelations 19:20 He will be tormented day and night for ever and ever - Revelations 20:10

you know, I would find it hillarious if the antichrist actually turned out to be a Pope. It would actually make sense as well. Millions of people followed and supported John Paul II.

Actually I think John Paul II was pretty good, he said heaven and hell were a state of mind and people in the church freaked. This new guy comes from the hardliners the same people that executed thousands in the past. Of course I don't know him so I cant really judge him, and even if I did it wouldn't be the right thing to do.

But I think it is obvious anything that is uses fear is the Anti Christ which could even include some administrations and even industries.

My BF told me he heard it could well be the pope John Paul 11 but now he has died so there goes that theory

Didn't the Antichrist already come? With Nero

nero was the anti-christ?...id say hitler was a lil closer

Sure Nero (616). It is a human number after all. But if there had to be another, who would it be?

There are many people who could take this title: Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Saddam; the list is endless. I'm not an expert on the scriptures, but I thought the antichrist was supposed to do more than mass genocide? The people mentioned, although I'd agree are basically what we class as "evil", never really had enough followers outside their own countries to help them efficiently. As far as my memory goes, they all were overthrown by other countries, I'm not too sure about Pol Pot, but the others were overthrown by more than one country working in unison. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong; I'm simply going by memory.

On a lighter note... How about Bill Gates as the antichrist?

Bebi - some scriptures actually point to everyone who is not Christian is an anti-Christ (literally, "against Christ")......

Regards, PA

Too bad, this is't the case. The Bible does't say what kind of tactics the anti-christ(s) will use. There will be many anti-christs. Now, I do not think that it is impossible for the church
itself to be the anti-christ. It is logical. However, the Beast of Revelations will use monetary control through the use of a single, advanced form of currency which will doom all of humanity. Now, the church could still take on the role of an anti-christ or a false prophet. Heck, lots of churches today are going the wrong direction. It is ashame that the blind are lead by other blind men.

LOL ! The problem is that it is not only the church that is the anti christ, but all off "unconcious" society. Every unconcious person is part of a huge industrial machination and is designed from bitrh as a "spare part" to keep the "machine" running. Want me to prove it ? Look at your lifestyle. It's based on fear, everything situation you are confronted with, you react towards with fear. Fear of loss, fear truth, etc. This list can go on a hell of a lot of pages long.

Think about it, and thyink about how you feel about this statement....

You'll also find that Anti-Christ doesn't mean what you think it means.

The original "Anti" doesn't mean "against", it means "in place of" - which falls entirely in line with the biblical wordplay, because the Anti-Christ is supposed to deceive the foolish and the evil and be accepted as the Savior - just as Jesus was known as (what was it, help me out a little - the bright morning star?), Lucifer means "light bringer", which is where we get the term for the chemical in fireflies - Luciferian (sp?).

The original hebrew text does not have the word Lucifer in the Bible. This is a word added by the translators. It is even trivial that Lucifer = Satan. The Bible says that there are many anti-christs.




Fortunately, I cannot relate, so I must not be an anti-christ.

I'm not a christian but I am not against christ...so what does that make me?

Say if you are a non believer does that make you an anti christ also?

Yep.

this is why I am glad I am not a christian...talk about bais LOOL

I've considered this controversial conclusion, and find it quite fascinating to argue. points seem to be well thought out. and conclusions follow rather logistically from the points being made. Regardless of it's validity, it's a hoot to talk about.

That's what anti can mean, opposite of. It doesn't mean you're the Son of Perdition necessarily.

You are not an anti-christ unless you claim to be the messiah. Everyone claiming to be a christ after the first one is considered an anti-christ. Jesus was the first and only Christ. Don't even get started about wether He really was the first or not!

Actually if you're not Christian this can mean you are an anti-Christ.

Yea I never saw it that way oppppssss a daisy...but it got me thinking...christians that say you are the anti christ if you are not a christian... Jesus himself was not a chrsitian neither...as my memory from what i have learnt...he was the king of the Jews

So then technically, he would have been an anti-Christ (meaning, no, he wasn't Christian), but the term was used *after* the death of Jesus, so it's not really applicable. Because God would be an anti-Christ. It's just a human term.

I see

No, actually, if you are not a christian, then you would not believe in a messiah. If you are a christian, then you will not impersonate the messiah. If you are not a christian, you have the option to empersonate a messiah, which you yourself do not believe in. It would not make much sense though, unless you were satanically inspired.

Incorrect. You can be Catholic and believe in the messiah, my friend.

The term "Christian" means "someone who follows Christ", so Jesus couldn't really have been classed as Christian anyway if he died before it came into use could he? (could he follow himself and still have the humility he is supposed to have had?) Yelekiah, just to clarify, how long after Jesus' death was the term first used? What did his followers class themselves as before he died? Or was it simply "followers of Jesus"? Sorry; I'm just curious

Catholic is a denomination. They believe that Jesus is the Son of God and that He rose from the dead on the third day. Any and all additions to this by organized religion is called a denomination. You can be a Baptist, a Catholic or Presbiterian, and still believe in a messiah. Believing in the Messiah- Jesus Christ, and following Him qualifies you as a Christian, which is: Christianos (khris-tee-an-os') means follower of Christ.

Am confused... So Catholics follow God rather than Christ? Can God be called a messiah? If so; wouldn't God be "The Messiah" rather than Jesus? sorry; I'm just trying to get things straight in my head.

Both God and christ...christ being the son of God


Norman did you or have you ever heard of a - Free Presbiterian? It funny how once the 1st protestant church was built how many others split from it and built their own..so many differnt protestants and only one kind of catholic..as far as I know!!

The God of the Old Testament became Jesus Christ the Messiah of the New Testament.



Yes, well, that is very interesting. I did not know that. However, it is a prime example of how organized religion can have different beliefs and practices and still claim to be a whole.
Enforced organized religion is even worse because the people are either against it, or they are with it, which discourages me from joining organized religion due to their vast variety of ideologies and doctrines.

Hmm true but where I come from free presbiterians and presbiterians don't like eachother in fact both sides don't like any other form of religion...all leads back to the same ole my faith is the right one and yours is wrong......to me no one knows really which is wrong or which is right

This is true, and it may never be known. Whether you believe in God as the Messiah, or whether you believe in the Holy Trinity. If you believe in the Holy Trinity that then makes the religion polytheistic instead of monotheistic, it will wage wars for along time.

some say that Pope Benedict will die after 3 years and comes a new pope named "Peter"....some believe he's alive in the middle east....

The abomination of desolation had nothing to do with the antichrist, that was a minor early event.

actually you are close... anti DOES mean against... the word in Greek is "pseudo" that means "in place of"...