Debate Suggestion by frogfish.

Fetal and Embryonic Stem Cell Research: Saving or Taking Lives?

frogfish and Yelekiah will be debating that Stem Cell Research IS SAVING lives.


Looking for one more person who will debate that it is TAKING lives.

I will gladly debate that it is taking lives, but i dont have another person, so I can be the first of the team.

hey guys !
GOOD DAY TO YOU.
abecrombie here ......I would love to be on Jonnyboyc 's team.
Is it possible to be active in two debates .
I'm currently debating formal nature nuture but would like to be a part of this debate as well.
if yes is the answer i hope im not too late
please let me know,mind you ,i can post at least three times aweek
and log on to the um everynight ,......

thanks
abecrombie

Guys!

Once you have established who is doing what please let me know and I will start the debate for you.

This is how the debate will be structure:

Team 1- Yelekiah - A and FrogFish -B
Team 2 - JohnnyBoyC - A and abecrombie -B

1. Team 1 - Single introduction
2. Team 2 - Single introduction

3. Team 1A - Main post
4. Team 2A - Main Post

5. Team 1B - Main post
6. Team 2B - Main post

7. Team 1A - Main Post
8. Team 2A - Main Post

9. Team 1B - Main Post
10. Team 2B - Main Post

7. Team 1 - Single conclusion
8. Team 2 - Single conclusion

So you will individually have two main posts each to write.

Another example is:
Yelekiah 1A will be countering Johnny 2A
FrogFish 1B will be countering abercombie 2B

The Introduction and conclusion will be done together.

Any problems let me know before I start this.

no problem with me but a question though? when i contact my team partner jonnyboy...
do we discuss all post together then post seperatly like structure above?
or..are we not allowed to interfer with eachothers individual posts even though same team..?

You post seperately like the structure above details.

You are 2B so you will be countering 1B who is FrogFish.

It is perfectly acceptable to plan and discuss as part of a team how you would like to counter your opponents within your posts.

Does this help you at all?

Yel and I are working on our opening statement!

Good luck to you, JohhnyBoyC and Abecrombi

Team 1- Yelekiah - A and FrogFish -B will be debating that its SAVING lives.
Team 2 - JohnnyBoyC - A and abecrombie -B will be debating that it is TAKING lives.

Please be aware that:

This is a 2v2 formal debate.

The debate will consist of an introduction, 2 bodily posts each showing countering of the opponent, good style, persuasive arguments and information relevant to the topic, and a conclusion. Remember to quote your sources, no flaming or offensive langauage.

There is a point deduction for debaters who fail to make a post within the 7 day time frame. The deductions will be 2 points for every day the participant fails to post after the 7 days.

This is to ensure that debates continue in a timely fashion. If for any reason you cannot post within the 7 days, please ensure that you let myself, Aztec or tiddlyjen know to avoid having the points taken off your debate.

If, however the participant does not then attempt to make a post for upto 2 weeks after the 7 day rule has started an immediate disqualification will occur.

Thank you.

Whenever you're ready to begin guys, good luck

Lottie

Introduction

You have been diagnosed with Parkinson's disease, and you are rapidly losing control. You are desperate to find a cure. The doctors tell you that there is only one way to cure it...embryonic and fetal stem cells.
Neurons undergo mitosis during the fetal stage. They are relatively quiet afterward. This is why neurological diseases, such as Parkinson's mentioned above, are so difficult to cure.
Here is a background on the topic for anyone interested.

The reason that stem cells have the potential to develop into varying cells within the body is because they can theoretically divide without limit. They can also replenish cells and serve as a "repair system". As a stem cell divides, every single cell has the capacity to either remain a stem cell or become a separate cell altogether and have a more specialized function, like a brain cell for example.
"Another potential application of stem cells is making cells and tissues for medical therapies. Today, donated organs and tissues are often used to replace those that are diseased or destroyed. Unfortunately, the number of people needing a transplant far exceeds the number of organs available for transplantation. Pluripotent stem cells offer the possibility of a renewable source of replacement cells and tissues to treat a myriad of diseases, conditions, and disabilities including Parkinson's and Alzheimer's diseases, spinal cord injury, stroke, burns, heart disease, diabetes, osteoarthritis and rheumatoid arthritis."
source1

This research will one day provide effective low-cost treatment for some forms of blindness, heart attack, diabetes, stroke, spinal cord injury and several other health problems.
"These cells are taken from days-old embryos. They are extracted and then implanted into human organs. Let's say you have a bad liver. Research shows injecting the stem cells into your liver grows healthy liver cells, healing your liver in the process."
source2
This is done instead of an organ transplant, which eliminates the chance of organ rejection.

If an embryonic/fetal stem cell is going to be discarded, it should be instead used to further knowledge about this research. Also, stem cells can be harvested from amnionic fluid, so the argument of its dependent correlation to abortion is void.
The scientific community is on the verge of a major breakthrough, and this research could lead to benefiting health and even saving millions of lives.
Main points
1. Three classes of stem cells: multipotent, totipotent, and pluritpotent
2. Potential for curing anemia and neurological diseases
3. Stem cell line
4. In vitro and therapeutic cloning

[attachmentid=24035]INTRODUCTON - EMBYONIC STEM CELL REASEARCH ------TAKING LIFE TEAM 2

footnote* reffernce material based on resources and factual information in red

Let us begin with both some questions to the reader. How valuable is your life to you and or the meaning of it?
Do you value it enough to avoid railroad tracks, being around a smoker, having unprotected sex? I am sure you will agree that as human beings, we all take certain precautions in promoting good health and are responsible for it.Research industries having to do with cancer, aids, mental health, are being cut financially due to deficits and global industry competitiveness. In America the deficit is so bad and unmanaged it perplexes me to wonder and determine that no one is going to look after any one individual to insure his or her ultimate best interest at heart
Hurricane Katrina is a good example of this. We must look to our own discerments and try to use the decisions we make the best for families. The bigger picture here is there are wars going on in world, military and biochemistry are a paralell force not to be reckoned with and…. Another question? What is not being told to the world and the citizens that occupy and pay into it, and what governments and federal information withheld is preventing people from knowing the full truth about what *cloning possibilities, germ warfare and what it has to do you and the rest of the world? Here are some facts that might change your mind on the stem cell research issue.

*An arm's length advisory body, was created in 1999 to advise the federal government on a broad range of policy issues that cut across various government departments such as the patenting of higher life forms, genetic privacy, regulation of genetically modified food, social and ethical considerations relating to biotechnology, and use of genetically based interventions
. We have not yet figured out nature’s secret – how to tell one stem cell to form blood, another a specific organ and yet another skin.
Scientists know that complex combinations of growth factors, genetic and chemical signals drive the process, but they are a long way from making the leap to being able to perfect or order the process

Money spent globally on stem cell -embryonic research is in the billions.
Thus putting the budgets of economic technology as money spent when the same amount of money if spent on earth environmental resources could reduce the effect of death in America in fact it would promote and save lives.and even with this new tech of stem cell and embryo research, the discoveries found still remains in position to change due to inconstant time to calculate the individual effects good or bad can only be determined through patient studies and various complications down the road .
There is a tremendous amount spent when simple technology that has been done before such as bird flu vaccinations research could save the planet but the money is not there. More federal monies go to stem cell research and not global warming concerns or such things as funding a better homeland security, better pesticides, education,
good point is this -
* stem cell - future thinking far future -unpredictability of long term results
planning and budgeting the same amount of money on environmental health safety sanitation codes immunizations for a bird flu are all being overlooked. Therefore, shows the disinterest of where the lives are going here? Taking life is what they are doing because New Orleans is still not receiving the help as they could have if the economic system was thinking in the present with any day such catastrophes and preventive simple measures that basically money is what it would take. I guess you can say it has become an investor’s bankbook stock marketer’s dream to vote technology and companies that invest in this market of research every day. In the most likely business, section of the newspaper next
to the other less full health section


*Two years ago in Brazil, where officials were also anxious about allowing the entry of a Monsanto product, reporters turned up evidence of significant smuggling of genetically engineered soy over the border from Argentina. Soon after reports of the abuses showed up in the press, Brazil approved planting the crop in test plots. Another source of concern for many experts is China, one of the world’s leading producers of genetically engineered seeds. “Illegal planting is a very worrying indication of how this technology could go,” says Sahai. “I’m not sure the developing countries are equipped.” International Collaboration: Under the Integrated Long Term Programs of Indo-Russian collaboration in biotechnology an Indo-Russian Center for Biotechnology is being established. A new phase of Indo-Swiss collaboration in biotechnology is under implementation during 1999-2004 with focus on biotechnology applications in agriculture and environment with special reference to improvement of wheat and pulses. Vaccine and contraception brain research and genomics are the areas for joint programs with USA. More than a dozen new collaborations both with developing and developed countries have been initiated.

cloneaid.com ebook yes to human cloning
http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/genetics/charts.htm
http://www.motherjones.com/about/admin/index.html

Post 1-Three classes of stem cells: multipotent, totipotent, and pluripotent


I believe that Hurricane Katrina is a bit beside the point period, but even more so based on these sources:

source1

source2
You fail to mention that billions of dollars were spent for Hurricane Katrina. Furthermore, planning has been going on for years to prepare for disasters. Despite planning and foreign aid (which was turned down), Katrina was not handled well.
So to say that the money could have been used for the disaster isn't exactly comparable to the money used to help save lives through research. Science is not to blame in this case.

People believe that they used biotechnology to try to control the seed market. What is the relevance to research to save a life?

Where are you quoting Clonaid? They are for cloning (I can't see the text).

Below are the categorized ameliorative potential of stem cells:

*Totipotent stem cells are produced from the fusion of an egg and sperm cell. Cells produced by the first few divisions of the fertilized egg cell are also totipotent. These cells can grow into any type of cell without exception.

*Pluripotent stem cells are the descendants of totipotent cells and can grow into any cell type except for totipotent stem cells.

*Multipotent stem cells can produce only cells of a closely related family of cells (e.g. blood cells such as red blood cells, white blood cells and platelets).

*Unipotent cells can produce only one cell type, but have the property of self-renewal which distinguishes them from non-stem cells.

Stem cells can easily give rise to other cells (they are essentially "progenitor" cells).
Totipotent cells are referred to as "master" cells considering that they contain all the genetic information that is necessary to produce all the cells of the body (plus the placenta, which nourishes the human embryo). Human cells can achieve this only during the first few divisions of a zygote. After 3 - 4 divisions of totipotent cells, there follows a series of stages in which the cells become increasingly specialized. The very next stage of division results in pluripotent cells, which are extremely versatile and can give rise to almost any cell type. The very next stage is where cells become multipotent. Multipotent cells can produce a various number of cell types.
For example, hematopoietic cells-blood stem cells that can develop into several types of blood cells (it is essentially multipotent).

"Multipotent stem cells are stem cells capable of generating different cell types, such as bone, cartilage, endothelium (cells that line blood vessels and other body cavities), liver and neurons (brain cells). Multipotent stem cells are in human and animal bone marrow and other organs. Studies using multipotent stem cells are further defining multipotent stem cells by their genetic structure, and discovering the potential of multipotent stem cells to multiply into different kinds of cells. Studies also evaluate the mechanisms that mold stem cells into different forms, and focus on the embryonic cells that become various tissues and organs.
"Scientists are especially interested in cells that become cartilage and bone, cardiac muscle, endothelium (cells that line blood vessels and other body cavities), hematopoietic cells (cells that produce blood cells), neuroectodermal cells (embryonic cells that become nerve tissue), hepatocytes (liver cells), and islet cells (cells in the pancreas that secrete insulin)."
source3

Scientists have long held the opinion that differentiated cells cannot be altered or caused to behave in any way other than the way in which they have been naturally committed. New research, however, has even called that assumption into question. In recent stem cell experiments, scientists have been able to persuade blood stem cells to behave like neurons, or brain cells.
It is held that stem cells could lead to a greater revelation about our bodies. Also there is research on making multipotent cells pluripotent.

Below may give a bit of insight into the potential of this research:
"Stem cells repair failing livers
08 October 2005
Andy Coghlan
Magazine issue

'The old philosophy of "body heal thyself" has been given a new high-tech twist with a treatment for liver failure that uses bone marrow stem cells from the patient's own blood.
To obtain the cells, the patient is first given an injection of a chemical called granulocyte colony stimulating factor (GCSF), which stimulates their bone marrow to produce extra stem cells. After five days on the drug, the patient's blood is screened for cells bearing the surface protein CD34, which marks them out as stem cells. These are then extracted from the blood, concentrated and injected into the patient's portal vein or hepatic artery, both of which feed blood directly to the liver.
No one is sure exactly where these cells go or what they do, but they appear to home in on, and help repair, any liver damage.'"
source4

Based on the above excerpt it is obvious that this research holds a lot of promise for the future of our health. This alone has already improved the health of many.
The potential for embryonic stem cells is great, however, the ethical question tends to arise. Nevertheless, you do not have to take human life to get a stem cell. They are derived from miscarriages, amniotic fluid, and umbilical cords. Since this is often discarded why not use them for research to help grow a new organ for a dying patient? This cannot be accomplished with adult stem cells taken from bone marrow. These cells can be discarded, or they can be used to help lower medical costs, ameliorate the discomfort from terminal illnesses, and extend your life.

There are numerous dangers involved with stem cell research. When stem cells are injected, the immune system can react, and reject, or destroy them. This can cause multiple problems such as kidney failure and shock.

The International Society for Stem Cell Research says:





(http://www.scinfo.org/bonemarr.htm)

If this does occur, it may kill the patient, why take this risk when there may be other alternatives to treat the disease?

In my opinion, the death of a patient, even if it is one patient per million, is a problem, risking a life for an experimental process seems unethical and improper.

If the cell is rejected in ANY part of the body, it may completely destroy the entire part, causing irreversible and handicapping injuries, including ones listed above such as kidney failure.


In conclusion, the risk of stem cell rejection is high and causes terrible injuries and should not be used until conclusive ways to stop rejection besides an identical twin is found.

Poster 1B Post 1-in vitro Fertilization and Therapeutic Cloning

One of the biggest criticisms of Stem Cell Therapy is that stem cells will have to be derived from an embryo. Many people say that there is no justification of taking the 'life' away from the embryo. However, one way to get culture stem cells without killing an embryo is in vitro fertilization (IVF). IVF is fertilization outside the body. The sperm and egg are joined in a labratory, making it possible for infertile couples to have children. Not all the embryos grown will be used. Multiple eggs are fertilized, giving the couple a maximum chance for a healthy baby. The 'leftover' embryos are then frozen and stored. It is these embryos that hold a huge source of stem cells for research. According to CBS news in a February 12, 2006 article (Link), there are over 400,000 embryos in storage nationwide. The embryos are already dead, and are stored for any potential use. Embryonic stem cells can easily be extracted. Why not use them to save other lives?
Source 1

JohhnyBoyC said:


This is where Therapeutic Cloning comes in.

Therapeutic cloning is the process for creating stem cells that is the same as cloning whole organisms. First, the nucleus of an egg cell if removed. Then with an electric current, the nucleus from the patient will be fused into the egg. This gives the zygote the same exact DNA as the patient. Then, the zygote is allowed to divide, creating stem cells. Since, the stem cells are the exact match of the patient, it won't be rejected. This also allows the exact tissue needed to be grown.
Source 2
Therapeutic cloning does not take life either, as stated in a paper published by the Medical Research oundation in 2002. It states that:
"Therapeutic cloning research can create cloned human cells, BUT NOT whole embryos beyond the 14-day stage"
Source 3
Therapeutic cloning can also greatly advance the research of degenerative diseases like Alzheimer's and Parkinson's
The MRC says:
"Therapeutic cloning has potential applications in commonly occurring disease, or damage, of the brain, internal organs, bone and many other tissues and organs. These include stroke, Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s disease, heart disease, osteoporosis, insulin-dependent diabetes, leukaemia, burns and spinal-cord injury (see Research In Focus: Stem Cell Therapy). Therapeutic cloning’s most attractive feature is its potential to create perfectly matched transplant material, genetically identical to that of the patient. Such transplants would avoid the severe problems of overcoming immune rejection that accompany conventional transplant surgery. For example, there would be no need to suppress the patient’s immune system and the risk of infection would therefore be reduced."
[see source 3]

Therapeutic cloning and in vitro fertilization are the best ways to conger totipotent embryonic stem cells. They accomplish them in a safe, legal way and offer the patient the best chance of survival.

New jersey stem cell inst. Commission on science and tech. California prop 71 to fund both adult and embryonic stem cell Ballot of initutives for stem cell grants Capitol funds to build stem cell institutes Connecticut 2003 senate bill 934- created a fund to provide…. General revenues allocated to new jersey stem cell institutes
8.5 million 300.0 billion 230.0 million 150.0 million 10.0 million 14.5 million
350.0 million a year for ten years




This is just a small fraction of what kind of funding is, has and probably always will be invested in this uncertainty called embryonic stem cell research.

Laws are being provoked into what the loopholes are and what is actually considered human so they could possibly tweak the system there they will. In actuality what has been put out there for public interests and views on this topic is all sounding good but there is a underlying unpredictability of real catastrophic destructive forces and possibilities that are not put in the media. Unfortunately, it takes a debate board such as this one for people, the public, to investigate it for themselves. It is at those situations we are informed and perhaps perplexed to inform others of what statistics generally and on a wider scale, what is being done here in genetically altering cells for diseases that were created by scientists in biochemistry to begin with.


Currently there is no law saying that one can not produce human cloning in this kind of destructive research. Lets look at the stuff they have not been telling us.
In Canada and in Mexico for the last ten years, human organs mutated to become in hosted by the body skin and formed inside the common mouse. Baboons, cats, etc. this has been hush hush due to the cruel nature of experimenting cruel and torturous experiments on animals without a mass hysteria going on around the world. If we all knew thing that are being uncovered now, then, no person in their right mind would donate or fund the technology that goes back to the German nazi camp experiments.

So, it is a cover up of some kind, why? Keeping a goal such as controlling life itself for whatever purpose in markets internationally, PROFIT seems to be a secret when its laundered without and public knowledge prior to what they say are new discoveries and possibilities this will provide for the human race, …blah blah blah.

Listen when you or I die one day and we experience the unique unknown experience that ends with question worries and sometimes regrets. Is it painful, unbearable, it looks horrific and uneasy to see death at any level of physical suffering if any, It is still yours to deal with, No one is going to die for you or I and this is inevitable.

Why put billions of crooked black market money legal or not into the research if it has no real promises factually given to show it is successful. It can not be done without the price of life and they do not tell us that they just want the global competition in the world the rise and keep rising. Power greed sex violence selfishness and no remorse for even a consideration of proper analogies are or ever have been made until just recently.


It all goes back to the one thing that all souls are alive and beating in every heart of every living creature.
The soul is in the blood of every flesh creature and life was given to man from god’s mouth to his nostrils the spirit of awesome life force to make man and became a living soul. So blood in this world age is a form and symbol of life sacrifice folklore and vampires sources of mythical immortality as well as how when a soul is no more living the blood distinctively becomes a contaminated source of disease such as bubonic plague and malaria as well as many others that the bio germ warfare industry came up with certain genus occupations to support the increase of this diseases caused by blood when it is a dead thing and alive it has so much more possibilities to power controlled military research or money making research such as plastic surgery . They do say the devil is in the details don’t they.


There is and always has been for example a synthetic plasmaa available to any patient who doesn’t want the complications of getting hepatitis or aids or whatever medical scientists are try to clean first but you cannot control the very means of life like it was a Barbie doll. It is an element not to be messed with, yet the world is so desperate for cures {by the way all caused by the human race} they could be bought into any type of news that seems convincing enough for their despair now.

Who can one man trust when man cannot be a trusted species haven’t the history books told enough evidence of what monsters are out there in a position to where the less unfortunate have no chance to not become victim to its source.

Embryonic stem cell research is and always will take life and not support it. Distort it, not support it, again taking the simple common knowledge that is out there especially though cyberspace, …knowledge is power and what you do not know will kill you.

Here is an analogy for the human mind to reason on,

Every morning in Africa, the gazelle gets up and runs, not walks, runs and do you know why? Because he knows if he does not run he is going to be the lions lunch.

However, everymornig in Africa, the lion gets up and runs, not walks, runs.do you know why?
Because he knows that if he does not, …somebody is going to beat him and take his lunch

In other words there is survival and there is revival and there can become a loveline between love and hate such a thinline that in desperate measures people will go to great lengths to control the things they know they can. Without carefully considering others or environments around them. Self indulging success in the past that Are considered evil are realities and like in a court case a trial case it is long drawn out prosecutors against defense llawers are going back and forth then the jury takes it in the closed room to discuss what is the verdict if this cannot happen the judge can sentence the punishment for the crime committed by the accused. Its much easier to but into the industry and industrial type of communism that Hitler almost got away with, in medical dictionaries it is termed genocide treason archany tyrantcy and just world power. Mankind has been in a destructive mode more than a peace mode on the planet and if that kind of info such as what law describes exactly what is human in a word sense to pass laws lie to people steal cheat presidents have been known to be impeached or tried among the political systems crooked cops have done drugs and rape innocent Hitler’s doctor experimented with humans in torturous ways unchaining and uncomprienhensible to most made people sit in boiling water so the flesh could be easily stripped off the bodies …….propaganda feeds the ignorant into a false perception of trusting and in the leaders feeding them the lies knowing this still doesn’t regard another’s pain or loss with empathy instead it is a competition or just desensitizing after and becomes like a deck of cards shuffling that easily brainwashing the unfortunate diabled and elderly propaganda was technologies stem cell but this embryo has become the devil itself and it is not even fully grown. We want to hear what we want believe what we want. So without any facts posted for a source on this post .I am fully confident in this to be the true nature of man in the ending years of the planet. In addition, everything on it. Takes live by lying to lives in giving the lives and the possible offspring’s lives to not choose what they will turn out like and speaking of lies there is a no child left behind act that was passed by a American president and that is a lie because the lottery along with the progress of casinos and porn and other black markets every one has evil inside them wanting to spill out and make a mess of situations whether it be vomited up due to individuals decision to puke it out or manifests and becomes the person and becomes the alpha evil of a destructive path we call mankind in socially corrupt environments. It is too hard to be a humble loving person because the majority is against you from all angles
If you cant beat em join em, that comes from a knowledge of experience in mans history to give a philosophy to make sense of it all or call it a common means of behavior to quote things like that of such nature it is biblical and real it is much easier for flesh rottening bodies to ddo the most easiest convienent thing because we missed the marked people from the first world age and this world age is going to be emndding soon.obviously we do not manage our species to well now do we. Doesn’t it make sense wherein the brains of president Kennedy were lost when forensics had it in there special secret laborty . Cover ups and socially expectable pressures we are all faced with here on planet earth but we have a mind to utilize in ways most do not and money is the tool that supports whatever is going to be. But not truthfully we will only know the truth to ourselves and what we decide on our choices to do the extra mile and stick it out and possibly be in harms way because if we all give up on the struggle for empathy in eachother than we mesh with the population that right now is dominating the planet. It is scientology as a religion alister Crowley and l Ron hubbard discussed when the Grey alien mistress from space used to spot a cup of tea with on a Wednesday or have some teacakes in a private conspiracy to make believe the alien race from outer space is where we come from and medication brain med. I might add are not part of the picture, …because brainwashing over a history of thousand years maybe longer have been affective up till today because its like fomenting peppers in the ground in a wooden barrel it has to reside and resonate in hearts and minds actions and times and if you cannot see the trees from the clouds then its easier to become part of a inevitable part of social behavior in a taking life sort of way, these are the orgins of where it stems from .lol. Where we are at today is debating saves or takes live? Therefore, the predictability of the past lessons should be evidence enough to equal common sense on this judgement call. I figure if the money spent and invested are in the billions we as a human race should support life where it needs to be supported that only happens if one decides to will it and sometimes the wicked world will still find a way to prevent that good act from happening.

This post is the perfect example of source. My emotional whirlwind is blowing hard whipping winds of fury are and will be stern about the root of this type of biotechnicol science. It is my source and will use it as my testament inasmuch an admittance of emotional wreckage so easily could be the human trait to habitual and eventual abusive one sided without thought out reasoning adrenaline rushed act on stupid impulse. Yea this is a prime example of every one of us and what we are all guilty of somewhere down the road in a day. I am allowing myself now to stand back and look at what ive typed. Pure emotions yes but it had been something that is based on facts and will cause a reaction when In fact is an action to react on. Without that initial action there would not be a reaction and the human race needs more help with the immediate problems now today as the seconds pass on the clock thousands of life emergencies and life and death situations to where people are dying unexeceptablbly and unesseccarilaly. If a cut is an open wound and we are bleeding we have to stop the blood from evacuating from the body or there is a consequence. Right? Why would not one apply pressure to the wound to stop that flow of blood or automatically hold your hands up to the thought if choking is the topic of immediate action is a necessity? ASAP. Alternatively, death might be prognosis in that event. ?

SOURCE there is emotion of humans, potentially dangerous if not kept in a management of recognition in order to stop the endless rage such as road rage, and then there is no turning back. Luckily, I was able to catch the critic who was I and come to terms with what was being a constructive or destructive accomplishment.
In that respect this example is demonstrated in the fact that humans are emotional beings and emotions are what seeds the control over others under such theories like scientology Satanism occults and worships of a unknown force that permeates ones ability to cope in healthy way or taper the tears of such bad actions. Aliens are another part of the puzzle. It is all tied together that has me wondering if this is really the possible control trip like world war two and Hitler pride is another form of iniquity that is a fierce prediction of monsters inside the human psyche and if the person has the means to make a perfect race of human existences or create the perfect pandemic to rule out the pheasants of the poor in this planet it is a evil that will always be around lurking waiting for its next meal inside the minds of every thought process and action is what follows the though process prevention and possession are a thin line as well it is all about sweet words in the science fields and I’m not saying all scientists are bad but in the biochemical technology world were its all about figures profits and world trades then one would have to consider the alternate motive of this research when there is clearly not enough about all the unfinished life threatening things left unfinished to save lives today in two seconds . Money is the primer, it fuels the hotrods roadster in the race of markets in the international level, and war is the paintjob. The color is not a decision for anyone to make unless they plan on painting the Car and that would be feeding war ethics not saving lives but controlling populations of the most evil and critical way.

Looking into biochemistry and medical science they are from two different ends of the spectrum and because money is influence to power and means of survival or material gains pride will blind a person once they realize that money in its self is a root of all things evil it is hard for a camel to passthru the eye of a needle than a rich man entering the kingdom of god

I do not understand the reason for the main perogivite for discovering a ice man up by the European nrthern lands and concluding it to be from the fifteenth century of bubonic plague or the back death they called it AKA. In addition, going after the cell that this plague was still present on the carcass of the well-preserved man? With an autopsy done to drive and preserve the Black Death gene, …doesn’t that seem conspicuous? Then aids cancer influenza to sars anthrax etc these are all chemical altered by biochemiststs in military secrecy nuclear germ warfare Russia had it Einstein retrieved it America heard it and used it for Hiroshima in Japan
Newtron bomb to invisible mechanics these are techono realities that exist and we all heard that genetically altered this biochemical mess is a catastrophic effectiveness and will take the lives of a continent populated with civilians even then some natural disasters are unpredictable and the slow agonizing effects of agent orange and napalm burns were real during the Vietnam war. War takes lives doctors and facilities save lives more children to grasp out of poverty stricken communities are what should be focused on not casinos and lotteries that have no questioning to prove justice life isn’t fair but hunger is exhisting and education is lacking and in all fairness to plastic surgery and brain messing hypnotheriutic sickness are convincing those who are not willing to die for a good cause. Alternatively, is one out of a thousand in a regimen stand up civil war?

This is all analyzing paradigms from recent to far past real issues that just do not add up. It isn’t god who allows suffering it is the human race the majority who do not believe in a creator and they call them selves science some call themselves scientologists but that is also in a audience made for promotion of a pyramid plan in wealthy civilians and celebrities whom don’t think antidepressants are affective and used to help mentally ill patients. Now who’s is playing god here the trippy thing is too about Hitler and aliester Crowley and l Ron hubbard is this underground Satanist occult it all comes from and it comes from Crowley.

They all had one theory and that was to consume the soul of the victim a female during intercourse while on heroin and that is the time when power is bestowed upon them and they all died broke junkies as well but the alien master chick is a part of it as well and they all probably thought it to be a nifty little resort of such knd as UFOs flying to meet them in the hollow earth. That is more I need to research on my own time but ive been comparing the information to genetic mutations concentration camps human trafficking and black market industry that all seed the same source and it seems to be parallel in the reasons without more facts or results to continue thinking that embryonic stem cells research is going to save lives. It is solely made to be a tolerant to a bigger evil of destroying the ones they could if they wanted to or at least leave into a possibility that controlling health conditions to the point of controlling destinations where lies upon manipulations and deceitful plans to trick weak individuals into a early tomb if they couldn’t serve the purpose of there evilness which is a state of confusion then simply kill them off or sneakily try to find ones that have the real answers and want to forewarn those that are deserving to know what truth is every man willing to hear it and would risk their life so people had the chance to decide for themselves what to believe in once all the facts were out on the table,… if discovered it would be a threat to there perfect society of brainwashed or willing individuals already caught up in the lie but still the threat is out there so death is the ultimate power trip here when it comes from any bad person in the right position to do all the wrong things with the knowledge of knowing it was the wrong thing and they salivate in the shadow of seeing people die unless it is useful for there sick and twisted theories . Mankind has these potentials and who can we trust known we need to trust ourselves and that is only when the efforts we’ve made in seeking the real structure of why it is a multibillion industry to mess with a new life conception and extracting genes from it. Even then, some the disfuvtion could lead into a severe mental retardation stage if not death in the unborn fetus. There are too many commonalties with the wickedness of what was and still today remains. Today there are people that just need the basics to continue the support of live and it is ignored from mass populations until the dirty little secret comes out and there is a entity to blame but we don’t know who or where but the fact of the matter is they would know and would probably exterminate any one with the knowledge of the loser crime beast in the situation so life is a scary thing today and too much tells me that it is all a giant money maker that could be catastrophic disaster and perhaps the end of populations all at the will of a opposition to submitting the element of empathy for the importance of somebody besides themselves . It is selfish to have no middle class.or eat knowing there is hunger or toy with the very first stage of human life itself and that is another malnurished rezsearch tiopic that ignores this as medical finding to be looked into the female body is another the unborn gene process of molgular strures proteing that made you and me and bobby mgee . Lol. What is going on relay in this world? Too many loose threads I think and we need the know to hold the sail up. Not to sink the ship of life and human DNA is what I believe is the primary focus of political evil powers that are in gripped on this planet earth. Cant wait until the battle is over supernaturally so we can get a break from alkl thing bad. That is my hope and my reason for allowing the post to be somewhat of a different anbfle of statgy
I don’t need strategy when a passion for truth is what I’m continuing for and unanswered questions that go left unsolved in political hands that relay could probability care a rats butt about you or me but I bet ya if that source saw it fit to feed in the suffering of mutating a human ear from a mouse’s body, they would and biochemical science is where I see the main goal for is to make destructive materials for there better gain, and take advantage of people by not telling them the real reasons why men do the things they do. Evil men that is and you know who you are darlings
So sosorry if anyone dislikes my post its just the way I felt I needed to do when I realized that my emotional state was getting the better of me. So now I am brave and baring all but for a good cause and a good cause to question embryonic research does it save lives? On the other hand, does it take lives?

Here are some interesting findings,..there are two forms of mutualy totally independent cycles of fertility. First cycle is the ovulation cyle and fertiliy cycles . gender prognosis is a predictable factor as well as health of baby , the studies were founded from fourty two years of natural fertiliy clinicians and doctors and professionals in such medical procedures when complication with the conception process isnt working. Dr, eugene jonas. natral fertility process

Post 2-Potential for Curing Anemia and Neurological Diseases

*Your quotes are in blue.
Interesting fact: Hitler is mentioned more times than stem cell research in your post. You only used stem cells 3 times. Well I got a lot from your text, but not too much on the topic at hand.

what is being done here in genetically altering cells for diseases that were created by scientists in biochemistry to begin with.
How so? If they were "created" then there is no need to extract a stem cell. Is that what you are trying to say? If so, how is that in favor for your argument?

Baboons, cats, etc. this has been hush hush due to the cruel nature of experimenting cruel and torturous experiments on animals without a mass hysteria going on around the world. If we all knew thing that are being uncovered now, then, no person in their right mind would donate or fund the technology that goes back to the German nazi camp experiments
Ok where is your baboon source? I'm not saying that it isn't the truth, but it would be convenient. You are comparing torture on animals to "Nazi" experiments. Interesting. But how does this tie into stem cell research, given that it is not taking lives?

Listen when you or I die one day and we experience the unique unknown experience that ends with question worries and sometimes regrets. Is it painful, unbearable, it looks horrific and uneasy to see death at any level of physical suffering if any, It is still yours to deal with, No one is going to die for you or I and this is inevitable.
What is this relevant to?

If the cell is rejected
Scientists are working on this to prevent it through therapeutic cloning, etc. They are also studying stem therapy.
"The goal of any stem cell therapy is to repair a damaged tissue that can't heal itself.This might be accomplished by transplanting stem cells into the damaged area and directing them to grow new, healthy tissue. It may also be possible to coax stem cells already in the body to work overtime and produce new tissue.To date, researchers have found more success with the first method, stem cell transplants."
source1

So blood in this world age is a form and symbol of life sacrifice folklore and vampires sources of mythical immortality as well as how when a soul is no more living the blood distinctively becomes a contaminated source of disease such as bubonic plague and malaria as well as many others that the bio germ warfare industry came up with certain genus occupations to support the increase of this diseases caused by blood when it is a dead thing and alive it has so much more possibilities to power controlled military research or money making research such as plastic surgery . They do say the devil is in the details don’t they.
Ok...you went from vampires to...the devil...help me out here?
Are you saying that blood (when "alive") is destructive?
But now that we are on the topic of blood, I can discuss stem cell research and anemia. It has had benefits in the past, particularly correlations to the umbilical cord.
"Human umbilical cord stem cells and sickle cell anemia.
Maggakis-Kelemen C, Bork M, Kayser P, Biselli M, Artmann GM. Biological and mechanical quality of red blood cells cultured from human umbilical cord blood stem cells. Med Biol Eng COmput 2003; 41(3): 350-6. Human umbilical cord stem cells are a valuable source of hematopoietic stem cells. Clinical applications include (1) reconstitution of blood cells after chemotherapy; (2) cord stem cells transfected with genes for thalassaemia and sickle cell anemia, and (3) large-scale production of mature blood cells."
source2

always will take life
I believe you missed my post on amniotic fluid. How then is it taking a life, especially when this will be discarded anyway? Also, frogfish wrote about therapeutic cloning. One cannot speak in absolutes that it will "always take lives" in the future.

Every morning in Africa, the gazelle gets up and runs, not walks, runs and do you know why? Because he knows if he does not run he is going to be the lions lunch.
???? wtf

Hitler’s doctor experimented with humans in torturous ways unchaining and uncomprienhensible to most made people sit in boiling water so the flesh could be easily stripped off the bodies …….propaganda feeds the ignorant into a false perception of trusting and in the leaders feeding them the lies knowing this still doesn’t regard another’s pain or loss with empathy instead it is a competition or just desensitizing after and becomes like a deck of cards shuffling that easily brainwashing the unfortunate diabled and elderly propaganda was technologies stem cell but this embryo has become the devil itself and it is not even fully grown. We want to hear what we want believe what we want. So without any facts posted for a source on this post .I am fully confident in this to be the true nature of man in the ending years of the planet. In addition, everything on it.
I see Hitler again. You are implying that Hitler is comparable to the hard work of scientists who have had years of training and study. That is rather insulting to stem cell research. Including all the research that has successfully developed specialized cells from stem cells and transplanted them into the nervous system of rats to fight disease.
Here is a video. Here is the article on the video, that may give insight into the promise of research.

source3

Takes live by lying to lives in giving the lives and the possible offspring’s lives to not choose what they will turn out like and speaking of lies there is a no child left behind act that was passed by a American president and that is a lie because the lottery along with the progress of casinos and porn and other black markets every one has evil inside them wanting to spill out and make a mess of situations whether it be vomited up due to individuals decision to puke it out or manifests and becomes the person and becomes the alpha evil of a destructive path we call mankind in socially corrupt environments. It is too hard to be a humble loving person because the majority is against you from all angles
If you cant beat em join em, that comes from a knowledge of experience in mans history to give a philosophy to make sense of it all or call it a common means of behavior to quote things like that of such nature it is biblical and real it is much easier for flesh rottening bodies to ddo the most easiest convienent thing because we missed the marked people from the first world age and this world age is going to be emndding soon.obviously we do not manage our species to well now do we. Doesn’t it make sense wherein the brains of president Kennedy were lost when forensics had it in there special secret laborty .
Speaking of brains, there is ongoing research with stem cells to aid with neurogdegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's disease.
It is scientology as a religion alister Crowley and l Ron hubbard discussed when the Grey alien mistress from space used to spot a cup of tea with on a Wednesday or have some teacakes in a private conspiracy to make believe the alien race from outer space is where we come from and medication brain med.
There is no proper emoticon for this statement. I see the word brain so I will work off from that. In this newest research, that was reported in Science magazine, scientists took stem cells, manipulated them into neural cells and injected them into fetal or newborn rats with a disease in which the coating around nerve fibers is missing. The cells then developed into "key cells" that were able to help the nerves to function properly. No tumors were formed, it wan an overall success.
"This is the first study showing that embryonic stem cells can be used for brain and spinal cord repair in an animal model of a human neurological disease," said researcher Oliver BrŸstle, a neuropathologist at the University of Bonn in Germany.
source4

My emotional whirlwind is blowing hard whipping winds of fury are and will be stern about the root of this type of biotechnicol science. It is my source and will use it as my testament inasmuch an admittance of emotional wreckage so easily could be the human trait to habitual and eventual abusive one sided without thought out reasoning adrenaline rushed act on stupid impulse.
???

emotions are what seeds the control over others under such theories like scientology Satanism occults and worships of a unknown force that permeates ones ability to cope in healthy way or taper the tears of such bad actions. Aliens are another part of the puzzle.
Are you talking about alien stem cells?

Now who’s is playing god here the trippy thing is too about Hitler and aliester Crowley and l Ron hubbard is this underground Satanist occult it all comes from and it comes from Crowley.
Wha?? How did Crowley get into this discussion?

It is all tied together that has me wondering if this is really the possible control trip like world war two and Hitler pride is another form of iniquity that is a fierce prediction of monsters inside the human psyche and if the person has the means to make a perfect race of human existences or create the perfect pandemic to rule out the pheasants of the poor in this planet it is a evil that will always be around lurking waiting for its next meal inside the minds of every thought process and action is what follows the though process prevention and possession are a thin line as well it is all about sweet words in the science fields and I'm not saying all scientists are bad but in the biochemical technology world were its all about figures profits and world trades then one would have to consider the alternate motive of this research when there is clearly not enough about all the unfinished life threatening things left unfinished to save lives today in two seconds .
This has got to be the longest sentences I have seen...ever. We are discussing stem cells correct?

They all had one theory and that was to consume the soul of the victim a female during intercourse while on heroin and that is the time when power is bestowed upon them and they all died broke junkies as well but the alien master chick is a part of it as well and they all probably thought it to be a nifty little resort of such knd as UFOs flying to meet them in the hollow earth.

Speaking of aliens...


source5

embryonic stem cells research is going to save lives. It is solely made to be a tolerant to a bigger evil of destroying the ones they could if they wanted to or at least leave into a possibility that controlling health conditions to the point of controlling destinations where lies upon manipulations and deceitful plans to trick weak individuals into a early tomb if they couldn't serve the purpose of there evilness which is a state of confusion then simply kill them off or sneakily try to find ones that have the real answers and want to forewarn those that are deserving to know what truth is every man willing to hear it and would risk their life so people had the chance to decide for themselves what to believe in once all the facts were out on the table,… if discovered it would be a threat to there perfect society of brainwashed or willing individuals already caught up in the lie but still the threat is out there so death is the ultimate power trip here when it comes from any bad person in the right position to do all the wrong things with the knowledge of knowing it was the wrong thing and they salivate in the shadow of seeing people die unless it is useful for there sick and twisted theories .
I was wrong, I think this is the longest sentence. Like tolerate a bigger evil? I don't believe that there is evidence to support this.
You mentioned fertility later on but wow...huge quote. Sometimes embryos are surplus, which are going to be discarded. All the decisions that a couple make, are independent of stem cell research.
This is what Christopher Reeves (suffered a spinal cord injury) had to say on the matter:
"Stem cell research holds the promise of hope for 100 million people living with incurable diseases from diabetes to heart conditions to Alzheimer’s to Parkinson’s, ALS, MS, and spinal cord injury. It will affect the entire American family. I believe this is why we find in this new survey such strong support from people with such diverse religious and ethical beliefs." He was the chairman of the Christopher Reeve Paralysis Foundation. Can you imagine all the lives that can be saved? Hundreds of millions, that could include your mother, your father, your friends, coworkers. Putting a stop to it is putting a stop to a scientific breakthrough.

Yelikiah, you fail to mention a resolution to stem cell rejection, this is by far the largest danger, and, sadly, there aren't that many identical twins compared to the near 7 billion people in this world.

The video you posted was amazing, perhaps a miracle. But you fail to realize it is a rat. A rat. That is all it is. Show me a video of a crippled human crawling across a room, then a human injected with stem cells running a marathon, and that would be something.

I think we have to point out that all stem cell research is just expiremental. It may fail, and even more dangers could be discovered.

Also in counterance of YOUR countering of my partners post, you again fail to realize that even though he only used stem cell research 3 times,
Approx 40% of your post is making fun of or pointing out any bit of un-relevent content.

But now to add to the debate:

Religious Opinions on Embryonic Stem Cell Research

87% of the world believes in a religion, so I believe it is important to listen to there input on stem cell research from a religous and humanitarian point of view.

Sondra Wheeler, Professor of Christian Ethics at Wesley Theological Seminary says:

Great words. From a Christian point of view, Stem cell research isn't promoted, that is 33% of the world.

A lot of religons also are against stem cell research as well.

In conclusion, the majority of religons in the world are un-supportive of stem cell research.

Post #2 - Stem Cell lines


Actually, I have mentioned a surefire resolution to rejection...It is called therapeutic cloning. It is never rejected.
Link 1

Stem Cell lines are ways of creating vast amounts of stem cells with the same DNA as the recipent. Using therapeutic cloning, stem cell lines allow for the creation of stem cells readily.

"A stem cell line is a continuously dividing population of cells obtained from human or animal tissues," [see link 1]

Stem cells lines are created by fusing and egg without a nucleus with a nucleus from the donor. Researchers then use the cells from the blastula as stem cells. This ensures that the stem cells will have the same DNA, and won't be rejected. [see link 1]

To add on to what Yelekiah said, Stem cells therapies can cure neurological disorders. The main cause for neurological disorders are death of neurons, dopamine-producing cells, and glial cells. All these cells, unlike anyother cell in the body, DO NOT REGENERATE. With Stem Cells, we can grow neurons, and use them on patients to cure diseases such as Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, Multiple Sclerosis, ALS, Huntington's Chorea, and many more disorders.



Link 2
Link 3


Link 4

Stem Cells are the only viable options to treat many diseases, and techniques like Therapeutic Clonig and Stem Cell Lines are ways to provide many stem cells, and will never be rejected.

Post 2b
–EMOTION TIES ,PROOF OF BLACK MARKET ,..AND FACTORY FARMS THAT TIE INTO THE TOPIC OF EMBRYONIC STEM RESEARCH . FINDINGS BEHIND A POSSIBLE LIE THAT WOULD TAKE DOWN THE HUMAN RACE


*
“For the soul of the flesh is in the blood,and I myself have put it upon the altar for you to make atonement for your souls, because it is atonement by the soul in it { Lev17:11 } For like reason, the connection is even more direct,

“ The soul of every sort of flesh is its blood “ {Lev :17:14 }
“all the souls –to me they belong” {Eze 18:4}
God commands not
to eat blood {Gen 9:1-4}



In irratticated geneticaly alterted food and unsanitary enviroments to keep up with with market industries around the world in the film at the below website is the best animated true life behind the meatrix spoofed from the matrix of course,..the film is about two minutes very entertaining and informative. In it there is the meatrix 2 revolting is what the tilte of it and is accessable as well easy to find ..in that second eposode it tells a bloody tale most people would only see in a horror film .absolutely mindblowing information about blood and what it is fed to …
http://www.themeatrix.com/inside/

Through faith in the blood of jesus christ , christians and believers alike can have there consciences cleansed by asking for forgivness and true repenting and at passover with the disciples he used his blood as a symbol to keep us from beeing thirsty in spiritual food because everlasting life is what is promised by him and through later his aposiles to complete the works of god throudh completeing the scriptures and the bible as a whole with both old and new testiments therefore publishing it in every language for all to have for themeselves to be a part of this kingdom and paradised promised by god through the sacrafice given and represented by the blood of his only begotten son..

Seems far fetched by most but studying to know holy scripture and the bible is a lifelong journey of validatying rewards for belivers in god. Love , hope and evidence is the faith are the thing unseen. Even today scientist have unknown answers of the exact chemical make up of the blood and how it works,…it comes from a life source ,..without it we cannot be alive physically . god says this is his atonement with mankind .
Who can one man trust when man cannot be a trusted species haven’t the history books told enough evidence of what monsters are out there in a position to where the less unfortunate have no chance to not become victim to its source.
Embryonic stem cell research is and always will take life and not support it.

A surgeon in Southern California removed the beating heart from a baboon and transplanted it into a baby known as "Baby Fae".For reason which are obvious from what we have just seen, the heart was rejected and the baby died.However we are now seeing similar experiments in reverse: organs removed from late human foetuses that have just been aborted, and inserted into animals.
Emotionaly we are all linked to this orgin and raises many flags with populations and cultures. Indivduals have profoundly took these issues all barrels loaded. Waiting and ready to battle out the differences in the intense search for structuring a clone or tampering with our very exhistance could pose or threat. .trust would be without a doubt the ruling tonic to ease the indigestion of even a naushous adrenaline, sweating of hands , palm off what is sacred and in its mystery . itself. life

Bodily post 2a was merely some personal comments reguardinding the emotional ties one would have . Either side of the issue. It still causes alert, excitement, hope, alternative motives and suspicions and ultimately emotion. This is the fragile genetic chemical combination of what makes us a human being. Whether evolution, creationism, or scientific theory. It is us from where we began and the conception of life takes place at fertilization. That is a human being we fanatics call abortion rights for the unborn embryo that has no choice to become a wanted child here on earth .but it is also new knowledge ,not far back we ever knew when fertilization occurred and how. Today it is still an unknown process at conception. The woman’s body is still to be unsolved with many mysteries to it and the brain itself scientists say have more cells in the trillions far beyond what is presently counted as stars. Stars are indefinite accordinding to science but the trillions of nerve sells in the human brain go part by a massive comparison.


Human being is still solving the complex strands of where they come, who they are, and what there here for. Chemically and medically, even in chemistry and astromey, bio scientists and medical researchers are finding different means than previously discovered, thus always learning about the complexity of life itself.
I would say this would cause any body with common reason to realize the delicate balanced gift of life is precious and is inherently, our own in each individual living thing, independent of its race or species. We all have a mystery and living it not knowing what if anything after will become of our experience here on planet earth. , whatever invisible god one might believe in, its all the same. However, scientists and biochemists and federal agents in gaharge if industry markets and laboratories are just humans we never met. They are strangers, as we know strangers to be. If you look at the history of humankind, …and learn from it with a discerning heart, one realizes we are the most destructive forces on the planet. With a brain that is beyond comprehension when compared to the heavens above and the number of star that cannot be counted. What limits the destructive nature of a man and by what good would it be placing the genetic make up of a chemical structure DNA do any good if a stranger was in complete say so, over it. Being able to do with it what they want, …and not just one but thousands of thousands even millions perhaps on this godlike team of strange humans, …life would be in great jeopardy. Man loves to play god for all the wrong reasons in the end of it. We are mankind we should be in learning mode and finish some of these other tasks we know we could like cancer cures vaccinations safer water environmental heath Eco systems in balance cleaner air and last but not least peace between the many hate crimes, wars of religion and misunderstanding or threats that powers will take over. By genocide such like the past we learn quickly when life is threatened and conditioning has a lot to be said as well as social behavior when in groups. These are obvious reasons that it could be the end of the human as we know it.just due to one or more perhaps choice to take matters in there own hands and money is always the vain that pumps the powerful and polital source of its purpose. I will mention such cancer and irraticated food as well as agent orange are all caused by mankind and some have this knowledge but will not allow it to be publicaly advertised due to market and profit secrecy to wealth the ones in whom usually get the taste for destroying what a once beautiful and inhabitable planet contain food fresh water and much vegetation to provide a clean and health atmosphere, to be gone, Imtimidation I suppose. God is sometimes the blame for all of the upsets in life and questions of why is there babies dyeing etc, Well at least he gave us a unconditional free will in love to make a choice to research him through holy texts. The textragramminton holds within even His name, which is called by definition,” He that causes to become”

mankind is destructive by its primitive will to choose and death is what we have the power of in our tongue lies that power of life or death and thought to action is what determines choices made by our hand and war has been it for the last 2 thousand years or so and every man woman child are all human beings …scientists are human beings too some are good and some are well a stranger to us. Would you leave your child with a sitter in whom you did not know or never have met? Trusting them because whatever they say sounds convenient or would you place the value of the ingredient of a life in DNA complex cells after conception occurs in the hands of a stranger. NO you would not science tries to determine what is what and biologically it is a chemical composite or mathematically figured out. A life is much more than a math equation to another stranger who is human and in a powerful position. Leaving the future to mankind perhaps vurnable and extinct slaved or tortured to become a breeding ground to make a hybrid race or continue a unhealthy form of food and water consumption by keeping the big cover up of what they take no responsibility for or accountability for responsibility for and I have the facts on those which industries have consciences done by irraticating our food and water supply for greed and wealth. Selfish means for a selfish goal to a selfish end. Too many what ifs considering the history of man. Science in modern days has also expanded, even into a religion for some. Thousands of scientists as well as researcher’s not having to do with medical field are experimenting with bio thermal nuclear war germs and biochemical such as man made anthrax, etc, so consider cancer, Lung heart disease, Liver disease, Obesity diabetes and add a little poising from these humans from somewhere in a political or powerful position knew what they were doing knowing what it would do and doing it without our knowledge, too many coverup and lies already. There is not much a person can convince me with into trust, especially if of that stranger could do with embryonic fetal stem cell research.untrustworthy possibilities.
*
http://www.organicconsumers.org/ge/sprea Agent Orange Victims Gather to Seek Justice from Monsanto, Dow, & U.S. Governmentding072505.cfm victims of the Agent Orange defoliant used by the U.S. military. Deformed children born to parents Vietnam believes were affected by the estimated 20 million gallons of herbicides, including Agent Orange, poured on the country were brought to the conference as dramatic evidence of its effects.
"The use of Agent Orange in Vietnam produced unacceptable threats to life, violated international law and created a toxic wasteland that continued to kill and injure civilian populations long after the war was over,"
said Joan Duffy from Pennsylvania.
*Action Alert--Tell President Lula of Brazil to Ban GE Crops


environmental groups are outraged because the Biosafety Bill included
legislation on Stem-Cell research for a range of diseases

It is obviously
ridiculous that the two issues were part of the same Bill, but ingenious
work by Monsanto.

During his campaign, he pledged to keep Brazil GM-Free,
and was fiercely critical of the effects of GM crops on farmers. Now, it
appears that the influence of US foreign policy and Monsanto corporation
have changed his mind.
http://www.organicconsumers.org/ge/gebrazil31005.cfmThe researchers, from Stem Cell Sciences in Australia and Biotransplant in
America, both big players in the biotechnology industry, took a cell from a
human foetus, extracted the nucleus and then inserted it into a pig's egg
cell. Two embryos were grown to the 32-cell stage, which took a week.
Experts in medical ethics are deeply concerned about the patent
application, which has a strong chance of being granted. They say the
research exploits loopholes in European law. It is not illegal because the
embryo is not technically human.
http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/pages/sti/2000/10/08/stifgnaus01001.html

http://www.themeatrix.com/inside/
A MUST SEE TO PROVE FARM FACTORY AND THE FOOD WE EAT .IMPORTANT!!

Liver Cancer: Danger of Radiolytic Products in the Diet
Jeffrey Reinhardt, M.Sc., co-founder of The National Coalition to Stop Food Irradiation.
Summary FDA estimates the amount of Radiolytic Products (RP) in foods irradiated at 100 Krad at 0.3 parts per million (PPM). Source.
Calculation of number of molecules of RPs produced by 7.5 ounces of irradiated food.
Analysis of the Impact of Radiolytic Products (RPs) at 0.3 PPM
Mathematical Calculations
A. Seven and one-half (7.5) ounces of irradiated "foods" equals 42.5 grams of "food" substance:
B. RPs at 0.3 PPM in 7.5 ounces of "food" substance yield 0.01275 mg. of RPs per 7.5 ounce meal.
C. Assuming an average Molecular Weight (MW) of one RP molecule equals 300 Daltons, permits the calculation of the total number of RP molecules ingested in a 7.5 ounce meal of irradiated "food":
D) To convert to the number of RP molecules, the Mole fraction is multiplied by Avogadro's Number (6.023 x 1023 molecules per Mole):
E) Since there are approximately one million liver cells ("hepatocytes") in the adult human liver, there will be 25,600,000,000 RP molecules potentially targeted at each liver cell.
F) If, however, only 1 out of 1,000 RP molecules is actually assimilated from the small intestine into the hepatic portal circulation (ed: blood flow through the liver), then for every 7.5 ounce meal with 0.3 PPM of RPs, 25,600,000 of these reactive RPs will enter the liver: [viii] <#8> "Link Eyed Between Beef And Cancer." CBS News, May 20,
2003.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/05/20/eveningnews/main554857.shtmlG) Further, if only 1 out of 10,000 RP molecules is a potential carcinogen, co-carcinogen, or mutagen, then for every 7.5 ounce meal with 0.3 PPM of RPs, 2,560 potentially carcinogenic or mutagenic RP molecules will contact each cell in the adult liver:
H) If, over protracted periods of time, the liver is depleted of protective, anti-oxidant nutrients which are destroyed by irradiation, then the inherent capability of the liver's protective and regenerative mechanisms will be compromised. This reduction in the quality and quantity of functional nutrients available is caused by the consumption of diets containing irradiated "foods" over long periods. This depletion in the intake of functional anti-oxidant nutrients, in conjunction with genetic, lifestyle, and occupational factors, will lead to a tissue environment in the liver which will evolve to unique susceptibility to RP-induced initiator and/or promoter carcinogenesis mechanisms.




So the PROOF IS IN THE PUDDING emotions are evident to this topic and it doesn’t matter which side your on with the issue here,.they both have a emotional response to reasons of promoting this research or try to make it out of reach to the vast industry of government bio labs and pharmaceuticals ,,some call science research but it only is used by medical science by a small population the rest is anybody in the global market in for profiting in black market laundering and biochemistry as well as for real means to make it into the top power of the economical market ,by ways of making government laws and secretcies not our own , choices not our own ,… in god we trust is on the currency of the USA and even that is bound to change but might I add as time goes by and technology continues to excels poverty still remains and exhists charities areseperate from the common wealth and the middle class has nearly staying exhisting struggling everyday death and victimizing ,..Desperate hungry plagues stricken nations are infected with HIV the world population is at its most exceedingly highest mass numbers of people and children are so unplanned and born as if they were a piece of property one can disregard or take no responsibility for.

Thousands are on this side of willingness to fight for this control over the human DNA.why wouldn’t they if they’ve done it with our food and livestock and contaminating calves with blood meal of dead cows, mad cow disease bird flu and sars and anthrax cancer diabetes lung disease and obesity all caused by man. Why would anyone with such knowledge of this trust what any person would have to say about what this embryonic fetal stem cell research would do good when the descent scientists want to remain apart from the wickedness of destroying the good name of the real meaning of what a scientists job is for and fighting these forces with combated strategies in which scientist debates scientist in truth about what has been done with this knowledge and what needs to be said the the populations that are victim to its lye . There are good scientists out there trying to bring us truth in the matter and if it wasn’t for this debate I wouldn’t have known as much as I do now and I am very thankful for the opportunity in learning from this debate team topic thanks to everyone for such a enriching learning eye opening experience
Hey johnnyboyc what is shaking I urge you to look under my resource in which both bodily posts 1b and 2b are constructed after the fact.


BIG QUESTION IS REALLY ???? Does enbyonic fetal stem cell research TAKE LIFE I would stem to think so.

Team 1 - Conclusion

It has been evident that Fetal and Embryonic Stemm Cell Research is a vital step in the advancement of medicine and treatments. 80 Nobel Laureates urge the funding of Pluripotent Stem Cell research.
Link 1



Therapeutic cloning and Stem Cell lines are ways to create multiple stem cells without loss of life. The stem cells are identical to the recipents, so rejection will not happen.
Link 2

Stem Cells have the potential to cure diseases like Diabetes, Anemia, Huntington's Chorea, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, and others. Stem Cells are especially useful for neurological disorders, because neurons do not regenerate.
Here is a link on how Stem Cells are advancing Parkinson's Treatements:
Link 3
Link 4
Link 5

Fetal and Embryonic Stem cells are especially important because they are totipotent, they can turn into any kind of cell. Adult Stem cells cannot turn into any kind of cell, and that is why fetal stem cells are so important.
Link 6

Lastly, in vitro fertilization (IVF) is a way to harvest stem cells. The leftover fetuses from IVF are frozen and stored, creating a HUGE "vault" of Stem cells. And there is no killing of a fetus involved.
Link 7

As you can see, Embryonic and Fetal Stem cells are saving lives. They are the best way to advance medicine around the world, and can be done in an easy way. Who knows, maybe stem cells will save your life one day...

CONCLUSIONTeam 2
Abecrombie/Johnnyboyc
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Topic: FETAL - EMBRONIC STEM CELL RESEARCH TAKING LIVES by breaking the code of life and its original delicate balance.
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Our team, 2, has condensed the many phases, complications, contradictions, irradications, cover-ups, illegal activity, and varieties of other such industries having access to, and using stem cells without it being expressed to the public. Due to the billion dollar global financial costs, and all of its uncertainties, the conclusion in turn, has been broken down into all of the reasons me and my team partner decided it is certain, taking into all the data and factual issues, this research of embryonic stem cells will and has TAKEN LIVES. There is simply not enough evidence of the opposing argument that it saves lives in this field of stem cell research. Concluding, there is without a doubt, lack of security in the work involving human life. Below are evidential means that like wildfire spreading, will, not when, consume the human population. By causing a disconcern for any of interests, rights, safety and truths that constitute life in every form. This, financial means profited is obviously one motive as this concerning issue plays a vital role in the many faces this research has if human DNA is the factor that causes such devatational effects on the population of life in every form.

Key points of consideration:

Scenario: imagine if the scorpion in the following fable below represents embryo stem cell research
The frog represented the Earth’s populated human race. READ THE FOLLOWING


http://alternative-therapy-for-the-bipolar...rg/capter_8.php

Q: What constitutes life.? God has been a favorite answer and man and woman is an another, some say evolution even alien. We know from our ancestors and our prehistoric friends the dinosaur that animals were and still are an important part of the earth’s Eco system. Therefore, hence the term a delicate balance has been used by what life is generally. Human conception has constituted it as a form of life due to two counterparts making one as an individual being, from a cell fertilization is termed after conception takes place. So if one values life in general, would they impose potential harm to it or protect its vital origin?

SCIENCE – RELIGION = life. They both have many faces to its definition, and expressions of those faces could be frowning on life itself. You be the judge. Observe the findings that has this been so shocking for my own eyes as research in this debate. Psalms139: 13



MAN AND ANIMAL= There are no doubts that both animal and man learn from observing eachother. We would have to if both need to co exhists and survive. Man learned by observing the fowls of the air that airplanes became a duplicate model. Man took the computers technology from mimicking the system of the brain. Children copy their parents in looks as well as physical attributes. Copy cat killers after their serial killers detestable behavior. To better understand ourselves and the animal world and keeping both exhisting, science has researchers and means to do a lot of duplicated beneficial lessons from life here in the universe and earth is alive and well.

FACT- humankind is the one animal on the planet that has freedom of choice and with animals has the intelligence that free will can create and do works that spark imaginations and creative independent thought.
Crows look down and observe man in their cars. Learning that cars crush things, the crows started hurling their nuts they could not crack to the tar paved streets where a car would be speeding through and right on over the nut to break it for them.

http://www.pastpaper.com/List-Life1965.htm

Then they learned, that going after the nut in the street at ground level got them killed so what did they do, they waited for the signal to change, knowing the car was going to stop and when persons below walked through the crosswalk, so did the crows to retreive the newly cracked open nut.

EXPERIMENTS – both human and animal experiments have been beneficial and informative to certain needs of life to continue. A fine line crosses it when harm or cruelty becomes centerstage. And in human experiments in any inhumane way becomes a discontinuing of the cause it could and future possible ethnic well being of what rights we all have for resect to life not to be an experiment for the independent mind of a man. A lot of controversy usually has to do with human life, rights, and morality.


THE CELL DIVIDED BY THREE = plant animal human – that delicate balance .Any harm done to one is harm to another in time and present.


http://www.pastpaper.com/List-Life1965.htm

POTENTIALS – Dangerous genetically cloned life in any form of the three above. Mixing is even worse and unpredictable when trying to master after mutations are the first obvious sign, potentially dangerous to try to altercate the strand of human DNA by a human stranger. Now who isn’t using their brain?
THREATS- our food resources are being genetically altered by cloning technologies, factory farming is one, and crop cloning another and the facts below will startle you.

CLONING CROPS. Pesticides that kill off insects in crops are effecting the consuming participant next up the Eco system, without knowing this. Animals cannot decide if they can consume chemically fed food, the population majority does not either.
Biochemical labs that genetically alter the cells of plant germs isolate projects of interests and modify it for market and production.

FOOD IRRADICATION cancer causing agents such as Benzene in our beverages has been going on for at least 15 years now with the knowledge being obviously threading for consumption. Issues are coming out of the woodworks just recently.

AGAIN…GO TO THE MEATRIX.COM

When time continues technology grows in to a competitive field of surviving in itself and today money is a main vein in the heartbeat of earth’s future by manipulating its cells. Man explodes in the numbers and survival is key so if money can purchase the most expensive tech to produce interests in gene altering, this is a underlined problem if potential dangers are present.
HYBRIDS –Ancient Egyptians domesticated the cat later modern men domesticated dog. That was then, today there is talking about hosting animals for the purpose of human organs. Seems barbaric. No. IS BARBARIC .

Taking ovaries from female foetuses aborted at a late stage and finding ways to
Mature their eggs in the laboratory. After all, scientists believe that a female foetus
Has some 7 million eggs in its ovaries; whereas a new-born girl has just 1-2 million; a
Teenage girl even fewer and just 400 on average is released in a woman’s lifetime.
-- Genetically engineering foetuses so that girls are born with their full 7 million
Complement of eggs.
-- Creating eggs by getting human embryonic stem cells extracted from left over
IVF embryos to develop into egg cells, or simply fusing these embryonic stem cells
With the cells from the sick adult patient to develop suitable transplant cells.66
When I learnt about these research avenues, I began to wonder whether my focus on
The potential hazards for women in providing human eggs was perhaps too narrow –
Alternatively, perhaps just the tip of the iceberg. These other developments might not involve
Women’s eggs and might not involve embryos, but they still have grave implications
For health care, childcare, livelihoods, the public interest and gender equity and justice
– Issues that perhaps underlie our unease about egg donation in the first place. Maybe
Some prior questions need to be asked about why such research avenues are really
Being pursued, and who decided to follow and support them.
.
The history of funding research into molecular biology, genetics, reproduction and
Embryo research both in the last century and this is fascinating.69 it ebbs and flows
Between wealthy individuals, universities, corporate foundations, governments, large
Corporations and venture capitalists in different countries and regions. An article in
The Financial Times a few years ago on biotechnology regulation posed the question:
Who is regulating all the biotech activity? Its answer? “Firstly, the financial markets”.
But the financial markets, venture capitalists and pharmaceutical companies – all
Those who aim to make profit somehow out of their investments – have not been that
Interested in putting their money into embryonic stem cell research, even as they look
Forward to large markets for stem cell therapies in future.70 “Venture capital, the
Traditional engine of biotechnology, is remarkably scarce in stem cells” comments The
Economist.71 Another Financial Times article in 2002 suggested that “the finances of
The world’s cloning companies are so precarious that a lack of funding may soon
Accomplish what moral objections have so far been unable to do: bring research in the
Area to a halt.”72
The citizens of California, the richest US state
With an economy larger than that of the UK, voted for legislation in November 2004
To raise $3 billion in public money over 10 years to support stem cell research and
Cloning techniques. The total cost to Californian taxpayers, however, will be about $6
Billion. Other US states are now following suit. 78
Public funding in any country invariably provides not just money but also
Acceptability, legitimacy and the prospect of additional private sector finance.
Commenting on the new Californian legislation, for instance, the CEO of a San
Francisco life sciences merchant bank, Burrill & Company, said:
“At present, stem cell science is tainted. Proposition 71 [the name of the
Californian legislation] will legitimize a lot of research in the US, which under
Federal guidelines is perceived to be not investible”.


There is simply not enough evidence of the opposing argument that it saves lives in this field of stem cell research. Concluding, there is without a doubt, lack of security in the work involving human life. Population. By causing a disconcern for any of interests, rights, safety and truths that constitute life in every form. This, financial means profited is obviously one motive as this concerning issue plays a vital role in the many faces this research has if human DNA is the factor that causes such devatational effects on the population of life in every form.

CONSIDER Patient case studies to show a mass sum of successes might prove that this reasearch has potential. However, no posts were made for these implications to hold the argument. Consider and Compare what donors whom already are in action giving science voluntarily in wills after dying to science. Costs nothing. The donor decides to donate. Also there are options to have ones own bone marrow plasma extracted or blood for treating there own body if diseased later in life those would be stored for such necessity if it were having to occur. Again, it is an option with little to no risks. The fetal and embryonic stem cell research does not provide much except the definition of the cells ability to continue on, in the womb with placenta as the form of nourishment and oxygen until labor. Did anyone mention that the placenta could be cloned? Picture that? Not right- the placenta is vital for replacing the missing exchange of hormones the mother needs after birth, to replenish her system

OUR FINDINGS – resulting in, the potential to prove outcomes resulting in Conclusion
That this fetal embryonic stem cell research is TAKING LIVES.

Thanks to the BOARD and to our team as well
Abecrombie and JohnnyboyC

Well done you 4 on a really good argument. This has been our first proper 2v2 debate and you have all done brilliantly.

I will now hand this over to our fab debate judges .

We wish the best of luck to abercrombie and JohhnyBoyC!

FROGGY,....YELI,...AND LOTTIE LOL

thanks guys ,and good luck to you
i thought we were respectful and made for a good argument it was fun and thanks to you as well lottie for keeping us on top of it.
i'LL SPEAK FOR THE BOTH OF US JOHNNY WONT MIND WE A TEAM OR WAS A TEAM.LOL



Abe'crombie and JohnnyboyC

Your welcome abecrombie, you all did fantastically well.

Okay and now its back to our debate judges...