How can this be if Orro personally knew them?


And many (probably more) are non-vegetarian.

Frog come on that is the point why wouldn't you give fast food or soda???neither would I why becsue its garbage and one who is looking for an optimim living expericne would never knowingly put garbage in their mouths ...I agree your reasons too can't help the bones but diet is the biggest contributor... i didn't say it was the only way just the most prevelant......So you don't eat fast food then?????

They said they had "heard" this reread the post, i'm a vegan i don't fit the myth, hyper is one , nova is one, aniyash, ashley star child the list goes on... is one there are many saying who are vegans who aren't pale and sickly its a myth.......my best friend at work is a vegan my kids etc etc...i know this to be a fact.........

No it is not. I have given more than enough proof that PHYSICAL LIFESTYLE is the biggest contributor. You cannot break bones by just sitting around UNLESS you have a severe disease. ood cannot weaken bones to the point that walking would break them. Someone who drinks a can of soda a day can go without breaking a bone all their life if they don't do any strenous physical activity.


Nope. Only home-cooked Indian Food.

frog lets move on you are getting more and more out there its okay to be wrong frog....


Hank Aaron (home run champion in major league baseball) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
B J Armstrong (US Basketball star)
Al Beckles (body builder)
Sorya Bonali (ice skater)
Les Brown (veteran runner)
Peter Burwash (tennis)
Andreas Cahling (body builder)
Andreas Cahling (bodybuilder)
Chris Campbell (1980 world champion wrestler)
Joanna Conway (ice skater)
Sylvia Cranston (triathlete)
Sally Eastall (Marathon runner - UK No 2, vegan)
Di Edwards (runner, Olympic semi-finalist)
Katie Fitzgibbon (marathon runner)
Clare Francis (sailer)
Louis Freitas (body builder)
Carol Gould (marathon runner)
Estelle Gray (cyclist) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
Sammy Green (runner)
Ruth Heidrich (3-time Ironman finisher, marathoner, age-group record holder, Pres. Vegetarian Society of Honolulu) (vegan) Source: personal acquaintance, also...her book--A Race for Life
Sally Hibberd (British Women's Mountain Bike Champion)
Sharon Hounsell (Miss Wales Bodybuilding Champion)
Desmond Howard (formerly w/Washington Redskins, now w/Jacksonville Jaguars) Source: PETA mailer
Roger Hughes (Welsh National Ski Champion)
David Johnson (BAA coach)
Kathy Johnson (Olympic Gymnast)
Alan Jones (British ski jumper)
Billie Jean King (tennis champion) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
Killer Kowalski (wrestler) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
Jack LaLanne (Fitness guru) (vegan)
Donnie LaLonde (Former Light Heavyweight Champion of the World. (Lost title to Sugar Ray Leonard)) Source: Article in San Jose Mercury News
Tony LaRussa (Manager of St. Louis Cardinals - US team) Source: PETA, Animals Agenda, Animals Voice, Veg Times, others
Silken Laumann (Olympic rower) Source: Cooking Television Show
Judy Leden (British, European & World Hang Gliding champion)
Marv Levey (Buffalo Bills Coach)
Jutta Müller (multiple Windsurfing World Cup Champion) Source: Flutlicht 95/6/18 on Südwest 3 (German TV program)
Jack Maitland (triathlete and fell runner)
Cheryl Marek (cyclist) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
Leslie Marx (fencer;1996 woman's epee national champion)
Kirsty McDermott (runner)
Lindford McFarquar (body builder)
Robert Millar (cyclist)
Katherine Monbiot (world champion arm wrestler and nutritionist) (vegan) Source: The Vegan Society UK
Monika Montsho (weightlifter, 2 x runnerup GB Championships 60kg, NW woman weightlifter of the year 1991)
Edwin Moses
Martina Navratilova (Retired Tennis Champion) Source: Magazine Interviews/Genesis Awards
Julie Ann Niewiek (Basketball commentator) Source: Grand Rapids press/ Image Magazine
Paavo Nurmi
Robert Parish (Center - Warriors, Celtics, Hornets, Bulls) Source: Hearsay
Bill Pearl (Bodybuilder, Mr America) Source: Getting Stronger by Bill Pearl, pg 399
Bill Pearl (Mr. Universe and bodybuilder) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
Anthony Peeler (NBA Grizzlies basketball player) Source: NBA web site profiles
Dave Scott (five time winner of the Ironman Triathlon) (vegan) "The New Laurel's Kitchen" cookbook
Debbie Spaeth-Herring (Georgia State power-lifter) Source: A Teen's Guide to Going Vegetarian
Jonathon Speelman (chess)
Lucy Stephens (triathlete - vegan)
Jacques Vaughn (All American point guard, #1-ranked Univ of KS Jayhawks)


Just some of the vegan vegetarian athletes.......those pale sickly vegans ha ha ha ha ha ha

You have no medical expertise or insight! You are the one that is wrong!

I see 2 basketball players...What about the rest of the insanely talented basketball players like Kobe, LeBron, Shaq? How about football? All I see was a losing coach for the Bills. You canno trust PETA as they said Desmond Howard was a vegetarian. First of all, he played for Green Bay and Atlanta, not the Redskins and Jags. Second, he DID eat meat. He ate a turkey leg during the Thankgiving game of the 1995 season when they beat the Lions.

It's not "a myth". It's just a reaction among some people who try vegetarianism, not the result of of every one who tries it on the planet. One person I know, in particular, was not raised as one, decided to be one, and had to drop it when she became pale, sickly and her hair and skin became dry. Please note, this is not someone who was raised as a vegetarian, and was only an individual. Vegetarianism is not right for everyone, nor is becoming a complete carnivore. Vegetarians may wish everyone to "convert", but this is just not healthy for some people, just like trying to get everyone to eat only meat is not good for some people. Ultimately, it should be the prime decision of the individual person to become a vegetarian, and if it works for them and keeps them healthy, then good! I know it to be the healthiest choice for many people, and I would like to try it myself sometime- my point is mainly that it should be restricted to those who know they do well with it, not every meat-eater everywhere.

I would attempt to argue further, but I would just be digging myself in deeper, when arguing is not the answer.

i do not wish to convert... i am a vegan who wasn't raised a vegan either didn''t become pale and sickly nor is that the norm...sorry about your friend but maybe she/he was sick to begin with who knows.....i am saying that a plant based diet is optimum, the better you care for the body the better it cares for you....why should I care what you do i am putting info out not trying to make people feel badly about their diet....I'll tell you something i too was you and many others once beleived all the hype and B.S. i was probably worse i actually thought I would die if i didn't have meat...j I found out that this is not true...We are condidtioned deeply by the time we are 2 to think eating good means meat and dairy...its just not true........I'd say try it see for yourself what it means to you....... take nutriton classes thats what i did and vistit a nutrtionist research it.

Frog you know nothing of my education... young man i happen to have a client who is a professional basketball player who is 7'1 and guess what he's a vegetarian....My best friends son went to the Jr. olympics in Australia you guessed it basketball and yes vegetarian..... superior athletes world class athletes is what I was referring too.

*sigh*

I...will...not...argue...I...will...not...argue...

Argh, the heck with it.

She was not sick to begin with, and thankyou for the concern... she is actually has one of the, if not the healthiest lifestyles of anyone I know.
What I am saying is a plant-based diet is not optimum for everyone, no matter what you say, even though it's a good idea for some or many. Of course you don't care anyway.
And I don't think I'll "die" without meat, lol!

C'mon, I'm waiting for an angry retort!

i have never heard that a plant based diet isn't optimum do you know what their diet consisted of?????? Its the same as saying breast milk isn't the best for every baby its a myth...I'm sorry to be difficult but some things are indisputatble.........

It is not unheard of to go vegetarian nad experince health cleansings which cleanse the body of accumulated toxins sometimes depending on the prior lifestyle a new vegetarian can get sick....This happened to me i was a smoker and rarely ate fruits, veges etc i knew this would happen though and wanted it too, i had debilitating asthma and some other health issues imbalances which are no longer and issue, i was on inhalers etc....for a very toxic person (and ciggs have over 200 toxin they store in the body ) the first few months maybe first year whilst the body cleanses may be rough going.... the nature of whole foods its to restore the natural enviorment to the organism and get rid of the crap, tha tis why one is a vegan to eat to be healthy lol maybe this is what yo are talking of.......I was under a doctors care and was told to expect some healing crisises...not everyone has this of course.......My bewst friend had been on a birth control and at first when she becasme vegan she also got alittle sick prior she had horrible sisnus issues very bad it has completely corrected itself she no longer has sinus issues......

To put it simply:



If eating meat was bad for our health, the FDA would have omitted the meat from the food pyramid entirely long ago. It's as simple as that.

Perhaps the vegan diet is best for you, but for the public as a whole, we have been eating meat for as long as we can remember and will not be stopping without obvious and radical proof that it's bad for our health. And while you're at it, remind all the 90-year-olds that have eaten meat all their lives to stop, it's "bad for their health".

Orro, I respect your determination and I agree with you. But Sheri is a tough one, you will not convince her.

Lol, thanks for the tip! I'm not particularly fond of arguing, but I get pulled into debates too easily- bad habit. I do stand by my case, and believe that this is not a valid argument anyway, as we don't stand for the vegetarian public or the meat-eating public as a whole- we're just two people bitterly spatting out petty little points at eachother. Case closed.

How do you know? I asked have you had any tests done to see?



Yes I know we can we can manufacture our own cholesterol (I am a biomedical student so I know a bit...).

My average daily cholesterol intake from foods is 35mg a day, look at the bottom of this post at those screenshots. I log all my foods daily, takes 2 minutes of my time, but worth it!

Do you really believe that if I did have a higher intake of cholesterol it would actually make my cholesterol go high? Anyway these are my lab results from December:

Total Cholesterol = 120mg (3.1)
HDL cholesterol = 46mg/dl (1.20)
LDL cholesterol = 65mg/dl (1.7)
Triglycerides = 35mg/dl
Total Cholesterol : HDL ratio (2.6)



Yes so what, I must get my lycopene from tomatoes and tomato sauce. They are very healthy for you (cooked)



CR is more effective than what exersise can do, so I just take a little run 10 min a day and do some resistance training... gotta keep those bones nice and strong!



Because it extends average and maximum life span in every animal ever tested since the 1930's and can be replicated any time provided good supplementation and gradually decreasing calories. The only known way to effectively prevent almost every disease associated with aging. Prevents cancer, diabetes, AD, PD, decline in immune function, prevents autoimmune disorders like lupus, reduces inflammation and more. It enhances DNA repair, decreases oxidative stress, down regulates P53 which accelerates apoptosis (cell death). CR increases SIRT1 which increases the organisms ability to handle stress and life span is extended.



Salt has no negative effect on me at all. I told you the reason I have to make sure I get enough. I just barely meet the minimum requirement through my food intake, thus I have to add some. Adding salt is hardly going to raise my blood pressure, it is already at 90/58



I eat what I listed



I am 21

I guess you figured it out yet... I totally support vegatarianism and its a good thing... but many people damage their health because of the lack of education in nutrition.

Here are those nutritional analysis:

Before supplementation



After supplementation




Matt

I don't think all vegetarians are unhealthy at all, like sherri said, a lot of vegans and vegetarians also eat a lot of processed junk.

I used to be pale (fair skin) but now I've turned ORANGE because of the carrots and sweet potatoes

orro sweetie the FDA is the dairy and meat industry (they are calling the shots hun)....now look at that does that pyramid make sense to you???????Its designed to sell product...........look up the vegetarians food pryamid......I'm not being mean I can sicerely see you don't know......

Whoa yes I have been tested thanks for asking...As i said you do alot right i can tell you know alot, I'm not trying to be rude , i just take the diet very seriously I'd like too see you add a sea vegetable loaded with vitanims minerals why not check into dulse, hyper turned me on to it....it actually taste good and I wondered if it wouldn't be a better source of salt for you i'll look in a minute....will you be honoring national earth day???? (Sat) You are a good example whoa a young man of your age caring so much for himself my hats off to you and the kool thing is your name is Matt which i smy sons name ...Great name To the excersise and no fast food

PS dulse a very good source of iodine and replacemnet for salt...and it activates the enzyme systems...rich in magnesium....also a high source of calcium much better than milk ( especially patuerized high heats limit calcium)

Wow, more nonsensical vegan propaganda...The FDA is just trying to sell food? That is abolutely a horrible idea!

About the atheletes, the worlds greatest atheletes are still non-veg.
Kobe, Lebron, Shaq, Carmello, Randy Moss, Jerry Rice, Garnett, Vince Carter, etc.

I don't call them world class athletes frog i already said that......Just like kobe is a great role model you should pick your role models better doc......

Have you been living in the cave? How about MJ, KAJ, Magic, all non-veg!
These are the greatest atheletes of bastekball, if not all time. I also do not need to go into the hundreds of football greats that are non-veg.


When did I say he was a great role model? I just acknowledged his skill for the game...

Sherri, the way you described the digestion process for meats, are fish similair in the way they hang around in your intestines for so long or do they pass more easily?

Thats a very good question, I think it would depend on your digestion if it works real well well you are okay if it doesn't eat alot of fiber ( veges plants) with your fish....i would be concerned because of the mercury levels and toxins in fish please eat wild only...farm raised has alot of antibiotics and hormones......anythig that sits inthe intestines to o long putrefies esepcially meat and it reabsorbs causes break outs and other serious things....

I don't normally eat fish, and the suppliment I take for omega-3 I made sure was not tested positive for mercury, but I don't know, I still worry.

I'm with you everytime I'am at he store my hubby likes fish on occassion and ther ae alwys warning signs so we just only buy wild but its hard to find.......Flax oil????for your omega threes???? Did you see the list of athletes i posted alot of body buildres on ther thought of you you ought to look up one of thier diet see what they eat Bill Pearl Mr. Universe....nice to talk with someone who is interested in the diet....lol

I use fish oil for omega 3's but I will look into flax oil, also been looking into calorie restriction too, I was thinking if I could combine a vegi diet and watch my calories that would be ideal, but I don't think that would be a problem most fruits and vegtables have low calories.

Exactly you'll have to get your calories, lol Add dulse to its a seawed which is loaded in vitanims minerals calcium b-12 in particular..thats the only thing you have to make sure of is that and omegas which you are doing........Do you smoke??drink???i think the vegetarian diet sort of like whoas his if it wasn't for the chicken he could be a lacto ovo vegetarian many start out like that..He takes alot of suppliments though, i don't feel that is nessecary, My friend who contributes alot too too the threads and is IMO the best healthiest eater known doesn't suppliment either......He's a world class athlete although not professional (by personal choice) he is in superior condition........I aspire to eat as he does.....

Never smoke, I'm 20 and I've only gotten drunk twice, lol, so I hardly ever drink, mostly I have a few glasses of wine on the holidays.

Thats great to hear Rage keep it that way...I asked to see if you had any toxic habits.....yeah you would do just fine on a vegetarian diet......How is your health any acute conditions or anything....Its probably gret at 20 shees...

What's wrong Sherri? 20 too long ago for you to remember?

I have Lyme Disease (too much paintball in the woods), but it is completly in remission, didn't even need a shot or anything my body fought it all on its own. I have alot of allergies (I'm even allergic to grass and trees!)but I notice they are gradually disapearing as my diet improves. The biggest problem I have really is cats.

yes RAge i'm 20 light years away it is getting harder to remeber lol..You know many vegans and vegetrians correct allergies that one of the first things i really think it has alot to do with pesticides in the foods....i wouldn't rule out your body cleansing itself of Lymes....I'd be hopeful...i was asthmatic horribly and had excema no cure,s no hope i didn't even think about these things going away... when i became vegetarian but they did and sinus issues gone.....i did smoke i quit 6 years ago...Now I had 2 major healing crisis, they weren't fun and i had to rough em out but they also corrected the above....you said you are already noticing changes..... i love these storys....The father of all medicine was big beleiver in diest and health. ( frog will probably say that is a myth lol)..

You might want to look into doing mild CR (10% reduction). CR almost always results in allergies dissapearing. Within two weeks of starting CR all my allergies went (after having them for 10 years or so!) and this is the same for a a lot of CRONers I know.

But there are lots of foods and drinks you can buy that are natural antihistamines which would help like Ginger or Green Tea. Improving diet definitily helps!

here are some references you can look at

1) Attenuated Allergic Responses to House Dust Mite Antigen in Feed-Restricted Rats
http://www.ehponline.org/members/2000/108p.../dong-full.html
Wumin Dong,1 Frank W. Kari, 2 MaryJane K. Selgrade,1 and M. Ian Gilmour1
Caloric restriction has been shown to alter a broad range of immunological end points in both experimental animals and humans. Feed restriction decreased TNF- secretion in serum and decreased mRNA expression of TNF- and interleukin-6 in pulmonary lymph nodes. We conclude that feed restriction strongly dampened the allergic immune responses to HDM in rats and that this attenuation was associated with decreased expression and secretion of pro-inflammatory cytokines

2)2) low levels of TNFa, CRP and TGFb in people on caloric restriction (very low levels of inflammation)
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_relea...o-cra011206.php

3) TNF alpha may be an important cytokine in allergic inflammation.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...5&dopt=Abstract

I will most surely look into those studies, I despise green tea, lol, the taste to me is horrible. I was considering buying the gum that is like 4 dollars a pack that claims to have all the benifits of green tea, but as always the real thing is usually the best, I guess I will just have to learn to like it, such as I did with plain almonds and asparagus

I've realized over the past year that I can get myself to enjoy almost anything... except peanuts! EVIL!




almost 22 and never got drunk once! , the last time I had alcohol was when I was 18 LoL

Well it does seem that diet plays a big part in health. How many carrots are you eating to turn orange whoa??????my hubby and i were wondering.....lol

I love carrots, I have eaten them almost everyday, literally, since I was young enough to chew them. My Eyesight is better than 20/20. I'm not sure exactly how it works, if it is possible to have 15/15, but I remember 15 being one of the numbers on my chart.

I can not emphasize enough how many time a day I must say "did you see that?" and somebody say "what the hell are you talking about?"

NO alcohol here too no way under any circumstance for years...thats so awesome on both of you My oldest he's 22 he too has only tryed it once never again......

None? What about all those studies that say a glass of wine a day is good for you? I don't like drinking regardless, I enjoy having as many brain cells as possible.

i eat alot of carrots too but i haven't turned orange whoa said he is orange..lol

Not even a Guinness on occassion. I couldn't do it Sheri.

well I eat 146g of carrots every other day, but it is probably the sweet potatoes that have made me turn orange, it took quite a few months until people started to comment lol

This is from a website

"Carrots are famously high in beta carotene, but sweet potatoes win the contest for most per serving. One average sweet potato contains about 10 milligrams of beta carotene (16,000 IU). A medium carrot has 6-7mg."

-I don't think the human body was designed with alcohol in mind... and.I'm too nueroticfor alcohol, I'd be a wreck jsut imagining the damage i was causing myself....I kinda think it causes cancer it is just IMO though.... most of my family members that drank got cancer but they were hard core alcoholics not as you are talking...

Red Wine contains resveratrol which is thought to be a CR mimetic. The compound does activate SIR2 in lower organisms, which extends their lifespan.

Flavonoids found in many different vegetables and fruits also seem to activate this enzyme, but not as much as resveratrol.

hey arty no, no alcohol someone has to drive thats me My hubby likes his beer though...i'm loud and obnoxiuos without it I'm one of those people that has to try and keep it down (quiet)

Whoa why so much what is the benefits?????

I'm real tired... 6am ! no sleep!

check this out http://www.drpressman.com/Library/Resveratrol.htm

That's from eating to many veggies, not enough meat.

don't let Arty bug you he's actually a sweetheart..... alittle humour for this thread ha ha lol

will do whoa get some sleep....thats the time we heal....

i'll have to read on this more..I have heard scientists were on the verge of reversing aging or slowing it down...but i don't remember where i read that.....

http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/13/plants.htm

So I guess everyone would have to turn into fruit bats to be reeeallly healthy. Ah well, I enjoyed the chicken-and-green bean-with-rice dish I had earlier... so good.

Sheri deary, you're not going to "convert" me, or arty. If we want to start munching on carrot sticks and celery, it'll be our desicion. Go on with your diet, we enjoy ours as much as you enjoy yours.