[quote name='artymoon' date='Mar 13 2006, 12:19 AM' post='1101947']
Sheri, do you believe we have the right to kill animals?
Arty i see no heiriarchial order between me and animals, truthfully my concerns lie more with the manner and way they are killed and the conditins they are to endure before getting to your table and the amount of hormones and antibiotics used i don't know what virus are contagious and which aren't and one who supports the current conditions and inhumane treatment of aminals has lack of concern for the wellness of humanity, I'd like to see better conditions there and in my state of California there actually are people who are demanding the food that we eat is safe and quality and disease free,You have probably heard of the organic movement??? of course you can choose to live as you want to too, i truly care for humanity however it comes across ....Namaste sheri
Full Version: Vegaterians
i can't say it will add 1 hour even for me personally. Statistically it extends life, like with this study:
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/7...ourcetype=HWCIT
however, from personal experince, a plant-based diet has ensured i no longer suffer from sinus problems, it improved my athletic perfomance tremedously, food passes through me quickly and easily compared to suffering from costipation when i allowed even the tiniest amount of dairy to get into my diet (i didn't drink milk, but sometimes had foods that contained dairy products). So I just feel and perform better every day and frankly for me it isn't about the qunatity of life, it is about the quality of life.
QUOTE
Mortality in vegetarians and nonvegetarians: detailed findings from a collaborative analysis of 5 prospective studies1,2,3
Timothy J Key, Gary E Fraser, Margaret Thorogood, Paul N Appleby, Valerie Beral, Gillian Reeves, Michael L Burr, Jenny Chang-Claude, Rainer Frentzel-Beyme, Jan W Kuzma, Jim Mann and Klim McPherson
1 From the Imperial Cancer Research Fund, Cancer Epidemiology Unit, Oxford, United Kingdom; the Center for Health Research and the Department of Biostatistics and Epidemiology, Loma Linda University, CA; the Department of Public Health and Policy, London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, London; the Centre for Applied Public Health Medicine, University of Wales College of Medicine, Cardiff, United Kingdom; the Division of Epidemiology, Deutsches Krebsforschungszentrum, Heidelberg, Germany; the Bremer Institut für Präventionsforschung und Sozialmedizin, Bremen, Germany; the Department of Human Nutrition, University of Otago, Dunedin, New Zealand.
We combined data from 5 prospective studies to compare the death rates from common diseases of vegetarians with those of nonvegetarians with similar lifestyles. A summary of these results was reported previously; we report here more details of the findings. Data for 76172 men and women were available. Vegetarians were those who did not eat any meat or fish (n = 27808). Death rate ratios at ages 16–89 y were calculated by Poisson regression and all results were adjusted for age, sex, and smoking status. A random-effects model was used to calculate pooled estimates of effect for all studies combined. There were 8330 deaths after a mean of 10.6 y of follow-up. Mortality from ischemic heart disease was 24% lower in vegetarians than in nonvegetarians (death rate ratio: 0.76; 95% CI: 0.62, 0.94; P < 0.01). The lower mortality from ischemic heart disease among vegetarians was greater at younger ages and was restricted to those who had followed their current diet for >5 y. Further categorization of diets showed that, in comparison with regular meat eaters, mortality from ischemic heart disease was 20% lower in occasional meat eaters, 34% lower in people who ate fish but not meat, 34% lower in lactoovovegetarians, and 26% lower in vegans. There were no significant differences between vegetarians and nonvegetarians in mortality from cerebrovascular disease, stomach cancer, colorectal cancer, lung cancer, breast cancer, prostate cancer, or all other causes combined.
Timothy J Key, Gary E Fraser, Margaret Thorogood, Paul N Appleby, Valerie Beral, Gillian Reeves, Michael L Burr, Jenny Chang-Claude, Rainer Frentzel-Beyme, Jan W Kuzma, Jim Mann and Klim McPherson
1 From the Imperial Cancer Research Fund, Cancer Epidemiology Unit, Oxford, United Kingdom; the Center for Health Research and the Department of Biostatistics and Epidemiology, Loma Linda University, CA; the Department of Public Health and Policy, London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, London; the Centre for Applied Public Health Medicine, University of Wales College of Medicine, Cardiff, United Kingdom; the Division of Epidemiology, Deutsches Krebsforschungszentrum, Heidelberg, Germany; the Bremer Institut für Präventionsforschung und Sozialmedizin, Bremen, Germany; the Department of Human Nutrition, University of Otago, Dunedin, New Zealand.
We combined data from 5 prospective studies to compare the death rates from common diseases of vegetarians with those of nonvegetarians with similar lifestyles. A summary of these results was reported previously; we report here more details of the findings. Data for 76172 men and women were available. Vegetarians were those who did not eat any meat or fish (n = 27808). Death rate ratios at ages 16–89 y were calculated by Poisson regression and all results were adjusted for age, sex, and smoking status. A random-effects model was used to calculate pooled estimates of effect for all studies combined. There were 8330 deaths after a mean of 10.6 y of follow-up. Mortality from ischemic heart disease was 24% lower in vegetarians than in nonvegetarians (death rate ratio: 0.76; 95% CI: 0.62, 0.94; P < 0.01). The lower mortality from ischemic heart disease among vegetarians was greater at younger ages and was restricted to those who had followed their current diet for >5 y. Further categorization of diets showed that, in comparison with regular meat eaters, mortality from ischemic heart disease was 20% lower in occasional meat eaters, 34% lower in people who ate fish but not meat, 34% lower in lactoovovegetarians, and 26% lower in vegans. There were no significant differences between vegetarians and nonvegetarians in mortality from cerebrovascular disease, stomach cancer, colorectal cancer, lung cancer, breast cancer, prostate cancer, or all other causes combined.
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/7...ourcetype=HWCIT
however, from personal experince, a plant-based diet has ensured i no longer suffer from sinus problems, it improved my athletic perfomance tremedously, food passes through me quickly and easily compared to suffering from costipation when i allowed even the tiniest amount of dairy to get into my diet (i didn't drink milk, but sometimes had foods that contained dairy products). So I just feel and perform better every day and frankly for me it isn't about the qunatity of life, it is about the quality of life.
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 01:40 AM) [snapback]1101961[/snapback]
, food passes through me quickly and easily compared to suffering from costipation when i allowed even the tiniest amount of dairy to get into my diet
so youre telling me it is better to spend your time crapping several times a day instead of once ?
not sure i buy that logic
it is better to "go" than not to "go". the measure of intestinal health is the ease and cleanliness by which things pass through. If you are eating optimally your poop will pass easily and not require toilet paper. How often you go will depend on the individual.
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 12:40 AM) [snapback]1101961[/snapback]
i can't say it will add 1 hour even for me personally. Statistically it extends life, like with this study:
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/7...ourcetype=HWCIT
however, from personal experince, a plant-based diet has ensured i no longer suffer from sinus problems, it improved my athletic perfomance tremedously, food passes through me quickly and easily compared to suffering from costipation when i allowed even the tiniest amount of dairy to get into my diet (i didn't drink milk, but sometimes had foods that contained dairy products). So I just feel and perform better every day and frankly for me it isn't about the qunatity of life, it is about the quality of life.
Well said Hyper In my case too if I died tommorow enjoying the health I have now....As I've said i was an asthmatic for my entire life and i was down alot and couldn't do alot becasue of potetnial attacks I have enjoyed 3 years of asthma free no inhalers i run ( I couldn't do that before) In the eight years of my sons life I have never lost a nites sleep worrying over some serious illness i have spent little money or time in doctors offices due to poor health, we actually go to hear how healthy he is....My son is almost nine years old and has all his baby teeth the denist said he is the only child he has ever seen that has kept his teeth this long, the longer they are in the better, My son takes great pride in caring for himself, and has inspired many of his friends to the same he has a best friend who was obese my sons lifestyle and the honesty of a child saved this boy from impending diabetes this boy has lost 60 lbs he is 8 also he was obese his mother thanks me constantly... I have a friend at my work who suffered horribly from sinus she is free of it she has been a vegan for one year...
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 01:47 AM) [snapback]1101967[/snapback]
your poop will pass easily and not require toilet paper.
um isnt that medically referred to as having the runs ?
yeah, i think if it is considered a negative medical condition i dont want it
more power to ya though
et,
the runs? no... you are going to extremes. Well formed, easily passed, no mess.
sheri,
much also comes down to maintaining an alkalyne diet and not eating in ways that cause blood glucose levels to rise. It is blood sugar spikes that are factors in many health problems including obesity, and diabetes.
edit:
here is something for you et:
the runs? no... you are going to extremes. Well formed, easily passed, no mess.
sheri,
much also comes down to maintaining an alkalyne diet and not eating in ways that cause blood glucose levels to rise. It is blood sugar spikes that are factors in many health problems including obesity, and diabetes.
edit:
here is something for you et:
QUOTE
Bile acids, neutral steroids, and bacteria in feces as affected by a mixed, a lacto-ovovegetarian, and a vegan diet
A van Faassen, J Bol, W van Dokkum, NA Pikaar, T Ockhuizen and RJ Hermus
TNO-CIVO Toxicology and Nutrition Institute, Zeist, the Netherlands.
In a metabolic ward 12 healthy male subjects consumed mixed Western (M), lacto-ovovegetarian (L), and vegan (V) diets in a randomized order for 20 d each. The concentrations of deoxycholic acid, isolithocholic acid, and total bile acids in 4-d composites of feces on the L and V diets were significantly lower than on the M diet. The chenodeoxycholic- to-isolithocholic plus lithocholic acid ratio was significantly higher on the V diet. The concentrations of coprostanol and of coprostanol plus cholesterol were highest on M diet and lowest on V diet. The number of fecal lactobacilli and enterococci on the V diet was significantly lower than on the M or the L diets. This study showed a decrease in the concentration of fecal (secondary) bile acids by the L and the V diets and an alteration of the fecal flora composition by the V diet.
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/4...ourcetype=HWCIT
A van Faassen, J Bol, W van Dokkum, NA Pikaar, T Ockhuizen and RJ Hermus
TNO-CIVO Toxicology and Nutrition Institute, Zeist, the Netherlands.
In a metabolic ward 12 healthy male subjects consumed mixed Western (M), lacto-ovovegetarian (L), and vegan (V) diets in a randomized order for 20 d each. The concentrations of deoxycholic acid, isolithocholic acid, and total bile acids in 4-d composites of feces on the L and V diets were significantly lower than on the M diet. The chenodeoxycholic- to-isolithocholic plus lithocholic acid ratio was significantly higher on the V diet. The concentrations of coprostanol and of coprostanol plus cholesterol were highest on M diet and lowest on V diet. The number of fecal lactobacilli and enterococci on the V diet was significantly lower than on the M or the L diets. This study showed a decrease in the concentration of fecal (secondary) bile acids by the L and the V diets and an alteration of the fecal flora composition by the V diet.
E.t no it isn't, the runs is indicative of illness, how old are you????just curious....But waht ever serves you is my motto....
how old am i ? ? ? ? ?
hyper is talking about taking a crap and not using toilet paper, how sanitary is that ?
and you ask how old i am ?
tell me there isnt a large section of the population not using toilet paper, cause that is just wrong
and you wonder how old i am
hyper is talking about taking a crap and not using toilet paper, how sanitary is that ?
and you ask how old i am ?
tell me there isnt a large section of the population not using toilet paper, cause that is just wrong
and you wonder how old i am
[quote name='hyperactive' date='Mar 13 2006, 12:56 AM' post='1101978']
et,
the runs? no... you are going to extremes. Well formed, easily passed, no mess.
sheri,
much also comes down to maintaining an alkalyne diet and not eating in ways that cause blood glucose levels to rise. It is blood sugar spikes that are factors in many health problems including obesity, and diabetes.
Indeed, i am aware of what you are saying just not as versed, can you explain this for all???thanks
et,
the runs? no... you are going to extremes. Well formed, easily passed, no mess.
sheri,
much also comes down to maintaining an alkalyne diet and not eating in ways that cause blood glucose levels to rise. It is blood sugar spikes that are factors in many health problems including obesity, and diabetes.
Indeed, i am aware of what you are saying just not as versed, can you explain this for all???thanks
QUOTE(et's daddy @ Mar 12 2006, 11:00 PM) [snapback]1101982[/snapback]
how old am i ? ? ? ? ?
hyper is talking about taking a crap and not using toilet paper, how sanitary is that ?
and you ask how old i am ?
tell me there isnt a large section of the population not using toilet paper, cause that is just wrong
and you wonder how old i am
thats just wrong?
how interesting. we yet again find the imposition of false absolutes.....
let me ask you, if you don't need something is it "just wrong" to not use it?
QUOTE(et's daddy @ Mar 13 2006, 01:00 AM) [snapback]1101982[/snapback]
how old am i ? ? ? ? ?
hyper is talking about taking a crap and not using toilet paper, how sanitary is that ?
and you ask how old i am ?
tell me there isnt a large section of the population not using toilet paper, cause that is just wrong
and you wonder how old i am
E.T hyper was speaking metaphorically, not literally lol there is another rule of thumb if you can open your reading material you have been on the crapper to long,your speed of elimination is a guage on the health of the intestines is what he is saying.......
This is well established in the medical community for sh**s and giggles ask your doc the next visit okay 
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 02:04 AM) [snapback]1101985[/snapback]
thats just wrong?
how interesting. we yet again find the imposition of false absolutes.....
let me ask you, if you don't need something is it "just wrong" to not use it?
QUOTE(Sheri berri @ Mar 13 2006, 02:04 AM) [snapback]1101986[/snapback]
E.T hyper was speaking metaphorically, not literally
metaphorically ?
you sure ?
et,
i think you are a little anally fixated...
i think you are a little anally fixated...
QUOTE(et's daddy @ Mar 13 2006, 01:07 AM) [snapback]1101992[/snapback]
metaphorically ?
you sure ?
yes, he often uses metaphores to convey complex ideas, its okay really....
ok enough about poo, back on topic lol
would you feelings change at all if you found out plants felt pain when we cut them down ?
is there something lab made you can eat and survive healty on ?
would you feelings change at all if you found out plants felt pain when we cut them down ?
is there something lab made you can eat and survive healty on ?
Such as the frankenfoods (GMOS) No thanks i'll pass not enough studies on them at this point...I'm fairly certain plants don't feel pain, but again i don't think that gives me the free rein to abuse the soil and kill the whole plant if you know what i mean, i use what i need only and would care for the plants, it makes me think There is a difference between cutting out your heart and trimming your hair ........Would you quit eating meat if you though t you would be causing your body pain down the road?????In order to be asking these questions you must have some interest in investigating an area you hadn't before correct?????
i do have interest, as i am the thread starter
i just didnt see enough evidence to support such a radical change in my lifestyle
and it seems cutting what you need of a plant to eat a little at a time could almost be compared to just cutting a leg off a cow and replacing it with a fake leg
true the leg wont grow back, but the pain or feeling the missing part could be the same
i thought i had read somewhere that trees can "sense" missing branches
have no idea if it is true though
i just didnt see enough evidence to support such a radical change in my lifestyle
and it seems cutting what you need of a plant to eat a little at a time could almost be compared to just cutting a leg off a cow and replacing it with a fake leg
true the leg wont grow back, but the pain or feeling the missing part could be the same
i thought i had read somewhere that trees can "sense" missing branches
have no idea if it is true though
QUOTE(et's daddy @ Mar 13 2006, 01:49 AM) [snapback]1102027[/snapback]
i do have interest, as i am the thread starter
i just didnt see enough evidence to support such a radical change in my lifestyle
and it seems cutting what you need of a plant to eat a little at a time could almost be compared to just cutting a leg off a cow and replacing it with a fake leg
true the leg wont grow back, but the pain or feeling the missing part could be the same
i thought i had read somewhere that trees can "sense" missing branches
have no idea if it is true though
Et Hyper and i are very serious vegans and came over to share with you the beneifits of the lifestyle< i don't follow your logic on the plant growing back and the cows leg never growing back, possibly plants are meant to eat???? You still don't see evidence to make changes in your diet??? i didn't go vegan all at once i gave up meat first with the conditon I would go back if i chose, i have to date not regretted my decison at all, its a funny thing i used to be a smoker 6 years ago and not one moment is spent saying gosh dammit I wish i would of smoked another cigarette i do wish i would of never smoked at all, its the same with meat and most say that too, I wish i'would of done the vegan thing earlier., truly had i of known the health benefits i would reap. Hindsiteis 20 20 , I'm almost 40 health is a concern . bon appetite on the cows legs and whatever other animals you chew on
I'm a vegetarian also...
I just can’t bring myself to eat a slab flesh anymore. Every time I see chicken or beef I immediately hear a cow mooing or a chicken clucking and it just makes me wanna hurl.
~ADHD~
I just can’t bring myself to eat a slab flesh anymore. Every time I see chicken or beef I immediately hear a cow mooing or a chicken clucking and it just makes me wanna hurl.
~ADHD~
QUOTE
my grandfather was over-weight and he lived to be 96
Sorry this is a bit off topic now because CR isnt vegetarianism.
QUOTE
ou have a source for this ?
Well great... but that doesn't mean anything because on a big population scale you wouldn't see this, there aren't any fat centenarians out there right? Also just to point out, in animal studies CR has nothing to do with weight, ob/ob mice are genetically different so they are obese, when put on CR they live upto 50% longer and are still overweight.
in okinawa for example they eat around 20% less and many become centenarians. Okinawa has the longest life expectancy in the world. They don't even do retirement, they still work beyond 100.
Here was a study done on some people doing long term calorie restriction:
http://mednews.wustl.edu/news/page/normal/...ml?emailID=7755
QUOTE
This decline in diastolic function is a marker of primary aging," Fontana says. "Diastolic function declines in most people as they get older, but in this study we found that diastolic function in calorie-restricted people resembled diastolic function in individuals about 15 years younger."
QUOTE
Their serum levels of a pro-inflammatory molecule called tumor necrosis factor-alpha (TNFa) were significantly lower. They also had less C-reactive protein (CRP).
CR extends average and maximum life span in every animal ever tested and it's worked consistantly since the 1930's. 30% cr in monkeys is currently on going and they have superior health to the controls.
This is what hapens in mice when you restrict calories
Also CR prevents or delays nearly every known lethal and non lethal disease
here is an interesting read: Low calories tied to long life
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/...1/ln/ln11a.html
There are hundreds of studies done so just look for them if you are interested
you can find lots of information and references here: http://www.cron-web.org/
I also have been following calorie restriction since I turned 20 and have had excellent improvements in health. All my allergies dissapeared, don't get sick anymore, which is common because CRONers have improved viral immunity, some haven't been sick since they started 15 years ago!, i haven't been sick once since starting, yet my immediate family have been ill with colds, flu, somtach bugs many times over the last year. My memory has also improved and concentration. I also don't get headaches anymore or ibs.
I restrict calories by 20% (1800k/cal) and this is my diet
I restrict calories by 20% (1800k/cal) and this is my diet
QUOTE
Breakfast
Food #1 : Quaker Rolled Oats (w/water)
Food #2 : Milk, (fat free or skim)
Food #3 : Nuts, almonds, dried, unblanched
Food #4 : Nuts, brazilnuts, dried, unblanched
Food #5 : Bananas, raw
Food #6 : Blueberries, raw
Food #7 : Whey Protein drink
Food #8 : Strawberries
Essential Mix (Vitamins / minerals and other things)
Sometimes 3g lindt dark chocolate on porridge
( all above mixed into porridge together! except strawberries)
Snacks:
Food #9 : stawberry low fat yoghurt
Food #10 : Nuts, almonds, dried, unblanched
Zinc / Copper balance supplement
EPA Concentrate
Dinner:
Food #11 : Brussels sprouts
Food #12 : Broccoli, raw
Food #13 : Extra Virgin Olive Oil (if I have chicken instead of salmon)
Food #14 : Salmon
Food #15 : Carrots
Food #16 : Cauliflower
Food #17 : Mushrooms
Food #18 : Basil
Food #19 : Lemon Juice
Food #20 : Salsa
Food #21 : Garlic
Food #22 : Green beans
Food #23 : Balsamic Vinegar
salad later on in the night
Food #24 : Spinach
Food #25 : Red Cabbage
Food #26 : Red Onion
Food #27 : Basil
Food #28 : Garlic
Food #29 : Balsamic Vinegar
Food #30 : Tomatoes
Food #31 : Egg whites
Food #32 : Flax Oil
Food #33 : Apples
Food #34 : Blueberries
Food #35 : 100ml Orange juice (somtimes)
Food #1 : Quaker Rolled Oats (w/water)
Food #2 : Milk, (fat free or skim)
Food #3 : Nuts, almonds, dried, unblanched
Food #4 : Nuts, brazilnuts, dried, unblanched
Food #5 : Bananas, raw
Food #6 : Blueberries, raw
Food #7 : Whey Protein drink
Food #8 : Strawberries
Essential Mix (Vitamins / minerals and other things)
Sometimes 3g lindt dark chocolate on porridge
( all above mixed into porridge together! except strawberries)
Snacks:
Food #9 : stawberry low fat yoghurt
Food #10 : Nuts, almonds, dried, unblanched
Zinc / Copper balance supplement
EPA Concentrate
Dinner:
Food #11 : Brussels sprouts
Food #12 : Broccoli, raw
Food #13 : Extra Virgin Olive Oil (if I have chicken instead of salmon)
Food #14 : Salmon
Food #15 : Carrots
Food #16 : Cauliflower
Food #17 : Mushrooms
Food #18 : Basil
Food #19 : Lemon Juice
Food #20 : Salsa
Food #21 : Garlic
Food #22 : Green beans
Food #23 : Balsamic Vinegar
salad later on in the night
Food #24 : Spinach
Food #25 : Red Cabbage
Food #26 : Red Onion
Food #27 : Basil
Food #28 : Garlic
Food #29 : Balsamic Vinegar
Food #30 : Tomatoes
Food #31 : Egg whites
Food #32 : Flax Oil
Food #33 : Apples
Food #34 : Blueberries
Food #35 : 100ml Orange juice (somtimes)
i just wish you had more studies on humans
i am glad for you though, going so long without illness and allergies is a great accomplishment
however, dont you think atleast some of it could be attributed to will of the mind ?
ya know, i think it will work therefore it does
im not saying it isnt working, i just think a positive attitude helps
i am glad for you though, going so long without illness and allergies is a great accomplishment
however, dont you think atleast some of it could be attributed to will of the mind ?
ya know, i think it will work therefore it does
im not saying it isnt working, i just think a positive attitude helps
QUOTE
i just wish you had more studies on humans
dont you think atleast some of it could be attributed to will of the mind ? ya know, i think it will work therefore it does. I'm not saying it isnt working, i just think a positive attitude helps
I understand what you mean, the placebo affect. There are quite a few studies done on humans and more in the near future. You can see on this website a whole list of diseases that CR has been proven to prevent or slow down. Look on the left side to choose spefic evidence for each condition: http://www.anti-aging-guide.com/
When a person or animal does calorie restriction, changes happen at the cellular level. Expression certain genes change and it benifits the organism. The changes are very real and explain why the animal or person has these benifits. Many people that go under caloric restriction have a 30% decrease in WBC and are generally under the normal reference range, but at the same time have improved immune function. I wasn't expecting the improvements i seen in my own conditions but they just happend, I later found out that the same is true for all others that do CR. Quite amazing really...
Here are my latest blood results and are typical of someone doing CR>
Blood Pressure = 90/58
Total Cholesterol = 120mg (3.1)
HDL cholesterol = 46mg/dl
LDL cholesterol = 65mg/dl
Triglycerides = 35mg/dl
It's the same kind of results we also see in animals.
I just got this in my inbox the other day:
QUOTE
The effect on health of alternate day calorie restriction: Eating less and more than needed on alternate days prolongs life
The effect on health of alternate day calorie restriction: Eating less and more than needed on alternate days prolongs life "Restricting caloric intake to 60–70% of normal adult weight maintenance requirement prolongs lifespan 30–50% and confers near perfect health across a broad range of species. Every other day feeding produces similar effects in rodents, and profound beneficial physiologic changes have been demonstrated in the absence of weight loss in ob/ob mice.
Since May 2003 we have experimented with alternate day calorie restriction, one day consuming 20–50% of estimated daily caloric requirement and the next day ad lib eating, and have observed health benefits starting in as little as two weeks, in insulin resistance, asthma, seasonal allergies, infectious diseases of viral, bacterial and fungal origin (viral URI, recurrent bacterial tonsillitis, chronic sinusitis, periodontal disease), autoimmune disorder (rheumatoid arthritis), osteoarthritis, symptoms due to CNS inflammatory lesions (Tourette’s, Meniere’s) cardiac arrhythmias (PVCs, atrial fibrillation), menopause related hot flashes. We hypothesize that other many conditions would be delayed, prevented or improved, including Alzheimer’s, Parkinson’s, multiple sclerosis, brain injury due to thrombotic stroke atherosclerosis, NIDDM, congestive heart failure."
"Our hypothesis is supported by an article from 1957 in the Spanish medical literature which due to a translation error has been construed by several authors to be the only existing example of calorie restriction with good nutrition. We contend for reasons cited that there was no reduction in calories overall, but that the subjects were eating, on alternate days, either 900 calories or 2300 calories, averaging 1600, and that body weight was maintained. Thus they consumed either 56% or 144% of daily caloric requirement. The subjects were in a residence for old people, and all were in perfect health and over 65. Over three years, there were 6 deaths among 60 study subjects and 13 deaths among 60 ad lib-fed controls, non-significant difference. Study subjects were in hospital 123 days, controls 219, highly significant difference. We believe widespread use of this pattern of eating could impact influenza epidemics and other communicable diseases by improving resistance to infection. In addition to the health effects, this pattern of eating has proven to be a good method of weight control, and we are continuing to study the process in conjunction with the NIH."
"In collaboration with Mark Mattson, PhD, Chief, Neurosciences Laboratory, Gerontology Research Center, National Institute of Aging, National Institutes of Health, we are nearing completion of a manuscript describing an IRB approved 8 week pilot study of the effect of following a repeating pattern of eating ad lib one day and 20% of daily caloric requirement the next day on subjects with moderate persistent asthma. Preliminary results show highly significant improvement in parameters of pulmonary function and markers of inflammation and oxidative damage and will be submitted to a peer-reviewed medical journal."
The effect on health of alternate day calorie restriction: Eating less and more than needed on alternate days prolongs life "Restricting caloric intake to 60–70% of normal adult weight maintenance requirement prolongs lifespan 30–50% and confers near perfect health across a broad range of species. Every other day feeding produces similar effects in rodents, and profound beneficial physiologic changes have been demonstrated in the absence of weight loss in ob/ob mice.
Since May 2003 we have experimented with alternate day calorie restriction, one day consuming 20–50% of estimated daily caloric requirement and the next day ad lib eating, and have observed health benefits starting in as little as two weeks, in insulin resistance, asthma, seasonal allergies, infectious diseases of viral, bacterial and fungal origin (viral URI, recurrent bacterial tonsillitis, chronic sinusitis, periodontal disease), autoimmune disorder (rheumatoid arthritis), osteoarthritis, symptoms due to CNS inflammatory lesions (Tourette’s, Meniere’s) cardiac arrhythmias (PVCs, atrial fibrillation), menopause related hot flashes. We hypothesize that other many conditions would be delayed, prevented or improved, including Alzheimer’s, Parkinson’s, multiple sclerosis, brain injury due to thrombotic stroke atherosclerosis, NIDDM, congestive heart failure."
"Our hypothesis is supported by an article from 1957 in the Spanish medical literature which due to a translation error has been construed by several authors to be the only existing example of calorie restriction with good nutrition. We contend for reasons cited that there was no reduction in calories overall, but that the subjects were eating, on alternate days, either 900 calories or 2300 calories, averaging 1600, and that body weight was maintained. Thus they consumed either 56% or 144% of daily caloric requirement. The subjects were in a residence for old people, and all were in perfect health and over 65. Over three years, there were 6 deaths among 60 study subjects and 13 deaths among 60 ad lib-fed controls, non-significant difference. Study subjects were in hospital 123 days, controls 219, highly significant difference. We believe widespread use of this pattern of eating could impact influenza epidemics and other communicable diseases by improving resistance to infection. In addition to the health effects, this pattern of eating has proven to be a good method of weight control, and we are continuing to study the process in conjunction with the NIH."
"In collaboration with Mark Mattson, PhD, Chief, Neurosciences Laboratory, Gerontology Research Center, National Institute of Aging, National Institutes of Health, we are nearing completion of a manuscript describing an IRB approved 8 week pilot study of the effect of following a repeating pattern of eating ad lib one day and 20% of daily caloric requirement the next day on subjects with moderate persistent asthma. Preliminary results show highly significant improvement in parameters of pulmonary function and markers of inflammation and oxidative damage and will be submitted to a peer-reviewed medical journal."
The living longer may not be due to calorie reduction at all. it may be a healthier diet that does the trick. if you look at whoa182's diet, that would make anyone healthy. it is well balanced, with lots of fruits and vegetables. and it looks delicious. compared to what an average american eats, with candy bars, fast food, and packaged meals, it is no wonder that people who eat like whoa182 are healthier.
cut out sodas if you want to be healthier. it is tough to do, but it goes such a long way toward a healther lifestyle. high fructose corn syrup is not good for anybody.
the secret to healthier living just seems to be: eat right and exercise!
cut out sodas if you want to be healthier. it is tough to do, but it goes such a long way toward a healther lifestyle. high fructose corn syrup is not good for anybody.
the secret to healthier living just seems to be: eat right and exercise!
That would be good frothydog, but just eating healthy doesn't seem to do it. of course average life expectancy would be extended... no doubt! but to get maximum life span extension of a species it requires restricting calories. Look at this, it speaks for itself right? The mice are fed the exact same diet and supplemented so they are not deficient. Each group is fed a bit less and it results in longer life span.
All these are identical diets and supplemented the same but just reduced in calories for each group. think about it.
All these are identical diets and supplemented the same but just reduced in calories for each group. think about it.
whoa182 I didn't see alot of grains on your diet grains such as brown rice, nor legumes....
You can still consume dairy at your age???? Why the whey protien supplement....nonethe less just adding the strive for five fruits and vegetables will dramatically improve the health Have you read diet for a new america by John robbins???Its an excellent read.....
You can still consume dairy at your age???? Why the whey protien supplement....nonethe less just adding the strive for five fruits and vegetables will dramatically improve the health Have you read diet for a new america by John robbins???Its an excellent read.....
whoa,
you are off to a good start.
what you reference as a "calorie restriction" is what i call dietary matching.
i eat a core diet of 800 calories a day and then have designed modules that add in the components i need based on activity and duration which can take my intake as high as 6000 calories a day.
The problem is that the average person in the developed world eats in excess. This is very easy due to the levels of processing involved in the mainstream foods.
If you eliminated meat and dairy from your diet and replaced it with plant based protien sources you would be doing extemely well. Don't forget that your diet needs to reflect your activity though, and thus should adjust with it. Simple caloric restriction will lower your metabolism which is likely the reason for the increased longevity.
you are off to a good start.
what you reference as a "calorie restriction" is what i call dietary matching.
i eat a core diet of 800 calories a day and then have designed modules that add in the components i need based on activity and duration which can take my intake as high as 6000 calories a day.
The problem is that the average person in the developed world eats in excess. This is very easy due to the levels of processing involved in the mainstream foods.
If you eliminated meat and dairy from your diet and replaced it with plant based protien sources you would be doing extemely well. Don't forget that your diet needs to reflect your activity though, and thus should adjust with it. Simple caloric restriction will lower your metabolism which is likely the reason for the increased longevity.
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 03:22 PM) [snapback]1102795[/snapback]
whoa,
you are off to a good start.
what you reference as a "calorie restriction" is what i call dietary matching.
i eat a core diet of 800 calories a day and then have designed modules that add in the components i need based on activity and duration which can take my intake as high as 6000 calories a day.
The problem is that the average person in the developed world eats in excess. This is very easy due to the levels of processing involved in the mainstream foods.
If you eliminated meat and dairy from your diet and replaced it with plant based protien sources you would be doing extemely well. Don't forget that your diet needs to reflect your activity though, and thus should adjust with it. Simple caloric restriction will lower your metabolism which is likely the reason for the increased longevity.
Do you fast?????
I have not fasted in a long time. The last time i recall fasting I was 17.
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 05:18 PM) [snapback]1102974[/snapback]
I have not fasted in a long time. The last time i recall fasting I was 17.
do you agree with it or see no need for it????
i am mixed on fasting.
it can assist in cleansing, but eating a cleansing diet can accomplish the same without the added stress to the body.
fasting maybe more "metaphysical" than anthing else. in pushing your body into extremes you may experience "things" you otherwise would not.
it can assist in cleansing, but eating a cleansing diet can accomplish the same without the added stress to the body.
fasting maybe more "metaphysical" than anthing else. in pushing your body into extremes you may experience "things" you otherwise would not.
is there anything either of you really miss eating that you now dont due to your diet ?
ya know just really crave a Big Mac ?
ya know just really crave a Big Mac ?
Great discussion. I'm curious if the vegans have ever considered a RAW food diet? And in relation to fasting and cleansing, are you avid in colonics?
et,
there is nothing i "miss".
cycledelic,
my diet is mostly raw. i only "cook" a food if it can not be eaten raw, and i only do the minimal amount of processing to any food.
there is nothing i "miss".
cycledelic,
my diet is mostly raw. i only "cook" a food if it can not be eaten raw, and i only do the minimal amount of processing to any food.
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Mar 13 2006, 05:58 PM) [snapback]1103039[/snapback]
i am mixed on fasting.
it can assist in cleansing, but eating a cleansing diet can accomplish the same without the added stress to the body.
fasting maybe more "metaphysical" than anthing else. in pushing your body into extremes you may experience "things" you otherwise would not.
I'm conflicted on the subject , i am torn between the does it give the body a break or does it stress it>>>i'm currentlyuy investigating the subject...
ET, no I don't miss fast food pereiod!!!! ( translates out to toxic dump site to me i won't eat garbage so why would I eat fast food) Its like poisioning yourself in my world)... your body acclimates to the new conditoins and you actually crave vegtebales and such, last nite i craved an apple and blueberris, i crave water, to me the body lets you know what it wants...Actuallyy the smell of meat turns my stomache packaged foods means a headache, too much sugar is sinus infections for me, dairy is asthma attacks, thats what happens food becomes health conditions.... Sunshine means cleansing and drying up of toxins to me......Thankyou for asking, right now there is a flu going around that is so serious two rounds of antibiotics are being taken to treat it, several people i have talked with feel its from hamburger or red wine so I just feel comforted knowing I won't have to stress about it or the kids won't get it....I'm a bit ecclectic and military when it comes to diet but I 'd rather be healthy truthfully...
For me on raw its the same as Hyper i try to eat raw as much as possible, and as hyper has said a raw diet is cleansing in and of itself, naturally cleansing....the point is tha tyou go however you acheive that maybe i shouldn't of said that????the colonics idea is interesting but thas as far as it gets with me if you can appreciate the visuals on this....
I'm glad to see mroe advocates of a veg, vegan and raw diets, and to those attempting to educate many of the Standard American Diet. Science backs all the claims made here regarding not eating meat and dairy.
Think of the root of all dis-ease: toxicity and deficiency. Vegans are becoming healthier because of what we don't eat. This also combines to form a heightened spritual awareness and quite the expansion of mind.
Think of the root of all dis-ease: toxicity and deficiency. Vegans are becoming healthier because of what we don't eat. This also combines to form a heightened spritual awareness and quite the expansion of mind.
I agree colonics can be an aquired practice, but truly is the cornerstone to rebuilding the body through a raw food diet.
Cycle thankyou for your hearting our journey, Hyper and I often are the voice of doom eh hyper?
are you a vegan also or what is your diet??????
are you a vegan also or what is your diet??????
I eat whatever tastes good. That includes meat, and I'm pretty healthy myself. 
QUOTE
my diet is mostly raw. i only "cook" a food if it can not be eaten raw, and i only do the minimal amount of processing to any food.
You should cook it more....it will kill pathogens.
cooking breaks down food making it less nutritious.
there is also this thing called washing
(along with organic produce)
there is also this thing called washing
(along with organic produce)
So washing raw meat will make it safe to eat???
I thought you said eat for health, not for enjoyment. Cook your food if you really want it to be healthy. It can carry Salmonella, E. coli, etc.
I thought you said eat for health, not for enjoyment. Cook your food if you really want it to be healthy. It can carry Salmonella, E. coli, etc.
he doesnt eat meat dude
try to stay awake in our class
lol
try to stay awake in our class
lol
QUOTE
he doesnt eat meat dude
try to stay awake in our class
lol
try to stay awake in our class
lol
I'm trying to make a point
Still waiting for his answer.
et answered you already frogfish!
i don't eat meat, and i said i eat mostly raw (cooking foods that can not be eaten raw)
to refresh: i don't eat anything that requires pasturization, i don't eat any dairy or other animal products.
i don't eat meat, and i said i eat mostly raw (cooking foods that can not be eaten raw)
to refresh: i don't eat anything that requires pasturization, i don't eat any dairy or other animal products.
QUOTE
et answered you already frogfish!
i don't eat meat, and i said i eat mostly raw (cooking foods that can not be eaten raw)
i don't eat meat, and i said i eat mostly raw (cooking foods that can not be eaten raw)
No you didn't!
Question: Is washing raw meat make it safe to eat? Same goes with Veggies and Fruits, unless they have been put in a fridge for some time.
you apparently missed the point of a vegan-raw diet, but just so you and whomever you are trying to "inform" about the storage and handling of foods, take a look here:
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/corpaf...s/fruvege.shtml
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/corpaf...s/fruvege.shtml
Cooking food is still better...Like I said, it KILLS Pathogens that other ways cannot.
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