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Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums > Unexplained Mysteries > Spirituality vs Skepticism
Beckys_Mom
To me religion is meant to be friendly, loving and respectful not just towards God but to eachother...remember love thy neighbor???


But what is it that makes a lot of people look down and frown apon religion??

It's obvious...the people that follow it....ok I don't mean ALL that follow...but I do mean a lot dontgetit.gif

I have lost count on how many times I have seen and heard people use a persons faith just to show spite and ignorance...after all I have lived in N.Ireland all my life so I know what I am talking about.........They use it and it turns into politics and then people die for just having a faith.

I have met so many people that are taught that other faiths are so wrong, this has shown a lot of judgmental issues and hate from these so called followers of Jesus/God

I think if they where taught that ALL faiths are good, but their own is best for them, that it would not cause any harm.....but this don't happen...I have heard and even read on here...people that are taught that other religious teachings are false.....this is pure ignorance and it creates hate and ill feelings...then they try and sugar coat it by saying...."oh I don't mean it in a bad way, it's just my beliefs" ......... so is that supposed to make it OK??? No it doesn't ..cuz if they wernt taught such a thing in the 1st place then this wouldnt happen..(well not nearly as much)

Do you think that's what God really wants??? For us to look down and say that other faith to him are FALSE and WRONG??? If you think this...what makes you so sure?? Why can't you see just how ignorant that is?? Think of it this way....when others that say your faith is WRONG and FALSE..you don't take it too kindly do you?? and yet you are more than willing to do it to others??

I am not aiming this at anyone in particular..but reading posts and hearing things said in real life got me thinking.....Religion is supposed to be - Friendly, Loving, Warm, and Faithful....
It sounds so ironic...when someone preaches - God is ALL LOVING..yet says "Pssst btw your faith is false and you wont go to heaven" rolleyes.gif

Has anyone ever thought that God is happy that he has many different faiths that are devoted to him??? And that there is NO SUCH THING as one true faith...to him ALL ARE EQUAL??? hmm??.................. See if everyone did think along those lines...then religion wouldn't be frowned upon by others...well IMO anyhoo original.gif
Boff
QUOTE(Beckys_Mom @ Apr 9 2006, 01:52 PM) [snapback]1140481[/snapback]


Has anyone ever thought that God is happy that he has many different faiths that are devoted to him??? And that there is NO SUCH THING as one true faith...to him ALL ARE EQUAL??? hmm??.................. See if everyone did think along those lines...then religion wouldn't be frowned upon by others...well IMO anyhoo original.gif


Thats how I now think. I wish many others did to.

I guess one reason for the hatred of other relgions and things like that is people reading to much into the lines of there respective relgious texts.
novaceleste
Great post BM!! I agree with you. I have seen since I was young that when I went to church everyone was kind and good, but then when you would see the same people during the week, they were completely different. Do they think that because they go to church on Sunday that all is well with their spirituality??? This is one reason I don't like organized religion.
StalingradK
Religion becomes destructive when people take it too far and out of context. Then the selected person/persons ideas get passed down generation from generation. Or added into a religious text, kinda of like after the crusades, Islam introduced "death to the infidels" in the Koran.
theoric
indeed stalingrad,

religion becomes an issue when people take it as their universal truth rather than as one of many "lessons" within life. It should be used by those that desire to, to give them direction, but not to encompass everything. To have yourself revolve around one book is rediculous, no matter what the book. Take the lessons, and move on to the next teacher.
Beckys_Mom
My partner was watching a programme on National Geographic Channel and it was showing -- The Gospel Of Judas

He tells me that there where 30 gospels and how some decided to leave a vast number of these out of the bible...also what I found intresting was that Jesus told others to go forth and spread the word of God...but he didn't want other religions formed or any churches, temples and to add to that he didnt want any preists or leaders..he just wanted them to spread the word................now those who read this ignored it and decided to write a bible, build a church..form a religion..this apparently was not the word of Jesus...funny that...cuz when i did follow a faith and went to church ect...nothing really worked out for me...but when I dropped it all and just followed God my own way things changed...bare in mind this is just my opinion


If you dont believe me...check it out yourselves - > http://www.nationalgeographic.co.uk/

More info - http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/chan...aily/daily.html then click on the title - The gospel of Judas
Vehement
It is just a simple truth that it has been this way since the beginning. If you look all through history clear back to the days of Jehovah riding the big cloud in the sky emitting smoke, who told all that he is the only one and true God that all should follow to his chosen people, forgetting about every other civilization that was on Earth at that time. This was the time that the faith at the time, the worship of the Goddess, was supressed. It was when the great kings or prophets at the time supposedly defeated the serpent, which was the name given to the Goddess or the Goddess's Son.

From this point on, Christianity did all it could to suppress any other belief system that could possibly emerge. It is also the time when 'time' took on a linear aspect instead of a cyclical aspect which followed the life and death of the Sun. In the following link you can read a very good look at history and how Christianity has been nothing but a means of control of the people which nationalism eventually allied with in order to take advantage of the control. I will heavily warn you though, it is a LOT of reading. It took me a good week to go through this, but it was the biggest eye opener of any reading I have done and it makes complete sense as to what is going on today.

http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/grail.htm

Enjoy!! thumbsup.gif
Vehement
Here is a little bit more on the matter taken from the following website...

http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/grail_4.htm



But, what is the underlying principle, the abstract idea, the "form" from which monolatry is drawn? Ms. Schwartz writes:

"Why is claiming a distinctive collective identity important enough to spawn violence? I found an answer to this question in a principle of scarcity that pervades most thinking about identity. When everything is in short supply, it must all be competed for - land, prosperity, power, favor, even identity itself. In many biblical narratives, the one God is not imagined as infinitely giving, but strangely withholding. Everyone does not receive divine blessings, some are cursed - with dearth and with death - as though there were a cosmic shortage of prosperity. [...] Scarcity is encoded in the Bible as a principle of Oneness (one land, one people, one nation) and in monotheistic thinking (one Deity), it becomes a demand of exclusive allegiance that threatens with the violence of exclusion.

"[The origins of violence] are located in identity formation, arguing that imagining identity as an act of distinguishing and separating from others, of boundary making and line drawing, is the most frequent and fundamental act of violence we commit. Violence is not only what we do to the Other; it is prior to that. Violence is the very construction of the Other. This process is tricky: on the one hand, the activity of people defining themselves as a group is negative, they ARE by virtue of who they are not. On the other hand, those outsiders - so needed for the very self-definition of those inside the group - are also regarded as a threat to them. Ironically, the Outsider is believed to threaten the boundaries that are drawn to exclude him, the boundaries his very existence maintains. Outside by definition, but always threatening to get in, the Other is poised in a delicate balance that is always off balance because fear and aggression continually weight the scales. Identity forged agains the Other inspires perpetual policing of its fragile borders. History has shown that in the name of our identities - religious, ethnic, national, racial, gender - we commit and suffer the most horrific atrocities. ...Acts of identity formation are themselves acts of violence." [Schwartz, 1997]

What is it that generally makes others "other?" Their worship of "foreign gods." Their allegiance. Their free will to do or be something else!

What was it that this Yahweh/Jehovah wanted to get clear from the very beginning with his "chosen people?" That exclusion of worship of any other god at all was the fundamental and primary basis on which the covenant was based. Curiously, this was expressed in terms that made it equivalent to sexual infidelity!

"I am a jealous God, you will have none but me!"

Of course, this was immediately translated to the ownership of women and their demotion to mere chattel, but that is another issue we will deal with later.

What is important here is that the Others against whom Israel's identity is forged are abhorrent in the extreme, and vast numbers of them are obliterated, while in the "New Covenant" of Christianity, they are offered the choice of being obliterated or converted!

Now, what is the foundation of the "covenant" that Yahweh/Jehovah made with Israel?

Well, the rules of a covenant, including the one between the Jews and their god, are pretty explicit in ancient Mideastern archaeology. Foremost among these rules is the demand for the vassal's complete loyalty to the overlord. Then, there are the "blessings and curses." The overlord promises blessings in return for the vassal's loyalty, and threatens complete annihilation should the vassal fail to fulfill the stipulations.

Again, this doesn't sound like a Free Will choice; it sounds like an ultimatum!

It also sounds like pure Machiavelli.

"Historically, such treaties were made with a vanquished people by their conqueror. The treaty gave the conqueror the option of letting the vanquished people live, and in turn, they could choose to be subjected to the stipulations of the treaty instead of having obliteration chosen for them. [...] The covenant at Sinai is given amid a huge display of such terrible power, with the full fanfare of fire, brimstone, thunder, and lightning... 'Moses spoke and God answered him with peals of thunder' (Ex 19:19) 'I am Oz, the great and powerful. Who are you?' 'I am Dorothy, the meek and weak,' begins the parody of the Sinai theophany that exposes God as an inept hot-air ballonist from Kansas. Toto pulls back the curtain of the holy of holies, and we see the all too human wizard from Kansas generating his own mysterium tremendum at a microphone.

"We are, then, the heirs of a long tradition in which monotheism is regarded as the great achievement of 'Judeo-Christian' thought... Monotheism is entangled with particularism, with the assertion that this God and not any other gods must be worshipped, a particularism so virulent that it reduces all other gods to idols and so violent that it reduces all other worshippers to abominations... The danger of a universal monotheism is asserting that its truth is THE Truth, its system of knowledge is THE System of knowledge, its ethics THE Ethics - not because, as in particularism, any other option must be rejected, but because there is simply no other option... [This] presupposes a kind of metaphysical scarcity. They imagine hoarding belief, hoarding allegiance, and even hoarding identity. Because there is a finite supply - of whatever - it must be either contained in the whole or protected as a part. Whether small or large, limited supplies suggest boundaries.

"In this remarkable myth, the division of people into peoples is not in their interests, but in the interest of maintaining the power of a tyrannical, threatened deity jealously guarding his domain." [Schwartz, 1997]

Okay. We can definitely see Machiavelli at work here. Using linear time as his chief weapon, I might add.

And, it is pretty clear from the analysis of Ms. Schwartz, that we DO need to take a serious look at this Monolatry business, but this is really difficult because most of the people of Western culture have been so brainwashed with the Judaeo-Christian idealogy, that breaking free of it is an almost impossible task!
Paranoid Android
QUOTE(novaceleste @ Apr 10 2006, 09:37 AM) [snapback]1140620[/snapback]

Great post BM!! I agree with you. I have seen since I was young that when I went to church everyone was kind and good, but then when you would see the same people during the week, they were completely different. Do they think that because they go to church on Sunday that all is well with their spirituality??? This is one reason I don't like organized religion.
They're called hypocrites yes.gif And the Bible is clear about what happens to them devil.gif tongue.gif

My opinion on the matter - as a general rule, religion (as in an organization) naturally breeds elements of segregation. That's why it's not a good idea to invest your time solely in such an organization. That does not mean however that religion cannot have good elements. It's when it's taken too far that it becomes a problem.

GOd doesn't care about your "religion". He cares about your relationship with him. I tend to believe that this relationship can only be truly realised through Jesus Christ, but I'm not going to force anyone else to believe the same thing. And I don't need an organization to give me this relationship with God.

Unfortunately, I cannot say that I believe everyone's way is the "right" way, because I just don't believe that. My opinion is that Jesus is the only way. I will not condemn or heap curses on you for choosing what you do believe though, because I know that I might be wrong. I don't believe I am wrong. But I accept that I might be.

Know what I mean?

Regards, PA
science101
QUOTE
To me religion is meant to be friendly, loving and respectful not just towards God but to eachother...remember love thy neighbor???


I totally agree! We are to respect one another even if we do have differing opinions.

QUOTE
I have met so many people that are taught that other faiths are so wrong, this has shown a lot of judgmental issues and hate from these so called followers of Jesus/God


This statement is interesting & disturbing to me for a variety of reasons. The thought that SOME congregations are being taught by the pastor/minister/cleric/diocesan that other faiths are wrong is well..............just wrong! I have been fortunate to only have ordained ministers/pastors that teach the will of God & the works carried out by Jesus. The church I attended also parlayed how the events today coincide with corresponding Bible scriptures.

Because there seems to be dissention between the Catholics & Protestants it makes you wonder - are they learning and carrying out the TRUE will of God?

QUOTE
Do you think that's what God really wants??? For us to look down and say that other faith to him are FALSE and WRONG???


No! Lord's only request is to spread the word of the TRUE God throughout the four corners of the earth while winning souls in the process. Those not receptive of God into their lives will have to answer to Him; not us!
Paranoid Android
QUOTE(Vehement @ Apr 10 2006, 10:53 AM) [snapback]1140686[/snapback]

Again, this doesn't sound like a Free Will choice; it sounds like an ultimatum!
It depends. Israel entered into a Covenant with God. Research the word covenant. It's essentially an agreement, or a contract if you will. In return for being God, Israel would worship.

Israel did not hold their end of the bargain. It wasn't forced on them. they chose to enter into the covenant (their forebearers did, at least).

Just a thought.

Regards, PA
HarleyBlue
I'm so glad to hear someone else bring this up. I personally believe a little bit of all religions and think they are all right and wrong in their own way. There's nothing I hate more than judging people for what they believe. I think this happens more in Christian and Muslim faiths. Those two groups seem to be the least tolerant of other faiths. Why is this?

There's plenty of room in this world or all faiths and beliefs. I think most religions worship the same God. We just do it in different ways. I think God is happy if we just believe, not how we believe.

Great post and thanks for saying it!
The Silver Thong
What most people fail to see is that the Bible was plagerized, christianity plays off a much older "belief". Just cunformed.
Skeptic102
This is definitely a good point. What are the main things that unite all religions on this planet? Love others, live a good life, and help people. Sadly these timeless messages are commonly ignored and religious intollerance takes over. The Christians and Muslims kill the pagans, atheists, and everyone else who doesnt believe in their God. Why? Is this really what the prophets of these religion would want?

Religion has negative qualities, but also has a lot of good qualities too. All religions have valuable things to teach and followers should, in my opinion, focus on the moral teachings more than the dogmas. It seems that fundamentalists just can't do this. Extremism in all its forms is bad, and that's why wars are fought. I choose not to believe, and that is my choice. That doesn't make me or anyone else any less of a person. Religion can be good for humanity only if it's followers try to live by the moral principles their religion teaches, and not go around condemning people to hell for what they do or don't believe.

QUOTE
What most people fail to see is that the Bible was plagerized, christianity plays off a much older "belief". Just cunformed.

Yes. However, if people wish to believe it because of faith, that is their choice. As long as they don't force their beliefs on anyone else, I have no problem.
science101
QUOTE(HarleyBlue @ Apr 10 2006, 02:15 AM) [snapback]1140767[/snapback]

I'm so glad to hear someone else bring this up. I personally believe a little bit of all religions and think they are all right and wrong in their own way. There's nothing I hate more than judging people for what they believe. I think this happens more in Christian and Muslim faiths. Those two groups seem to be the least tolerant of other faiths. Why is this?

There's plenty of room in this world or all faiths and beliefs. I think most religions worship the same God. We just do it in different ways. I think God is happy if we just believe, not how we believe.

Great post and thanks for saying it!


I can't say I agree with you, but I do respect your opinion. Let's just say this - Not all using name of the Lord will enter kingdom as referenced in Matthew 7:21-23

QUOTE
Not everyone saying to me, "Lord, Lord,' will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. Many will say to me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?" And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew YOU! Get away from me, YOU workers of lawlessness



HarleyBlue
QUOTE(science101 @ Apr 9 2006, 09:35 PM) [snapback]1140788[/snapback]

I can't say I agree with you, but I do respect your opinion. Let's just say this - Not all using name of the Lord will enter kingdom as referenced in Matthew 7:21-23



What you just said is what we are talking about. Because you are obviously Christian, you think others aren't going to heaven. Do you think all buddist and hindus and muslims and pagans etc. are going to hell?

I believe in God and Jesus but I also believe in the other religions prophets.
ramster83
BM great post i really believe that as well and im so over the hypocrites....At work the other day this friendly enough man needed some assistance i helped him out and he said to me "You are a great boy thank you!" then he said "what nationality are you"? I said "Half Croatian and Half Lebanese" he said "Ahhh...okay"...Then he stares at me for a few seconds and he says "Are you Christian!?"

OMG I HATE it when people ask what religion i am- they obviously ask it so they can judge you- im paranoid to say im a Christian to a Muslim- and that im a Muslim to a Christian!
Why else would you ask someone such a personal question? The moment i said "Christian" he smiled and said "Oh Orthodox or Catholic" i couldnt believe it...I said "Catholic"....He said "Oh...we're all Chrstians anyway".

Then he goes on talking about JEWS and how they tried to destroy Christianity in its early years and blah blah blah...I was avoiding him at this point and signalled for him to leave the store- he eventually left to store...See the only reason he asked was to JUDGE ME- and if i answered correctly to his "beliefs" then hed start judging OTHERS!

What the hell! Dont Judge and Judged Be Not! The Bible says so! angry.gif
science101
QUOTE(HarleyBlue @ Apr 10 2006, 03:02 AM) [snapback]1140815[/snapback]

What you just said is what we are talking about. Because you are obviously Christian, you think others aren't going to heaven. Do you think all buddist and hindus and muslims and pagans etc. are going to hell?

I believe in God and Jesus but I also believe in the other religions prophets.



HarleyBlue:

Did I say that! I didn't even imply it! It's amazing how things can be taken out of context. Simple reading & comprehension skills is all that is needed.

To answer the 2nd part of your question, it's not for me to say!

Matthews 7:1-3

QUOTE
Stop judging that you may not be judged; for with what judgment you are being judged; and with the measure that you are measuring out, they will measure out to YOU.


thumbsup.gif
artymoon
There's another thread around here that asks if good and evil are man-made concepts.
I think they are, just like all the religions and all their books are. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but these "man-made concepts" have a tendency to be flawed in certain areas and are naturally biased to an extent. Religion can be helpful spiritually, as long as its ideals aren't taken to the extreme.
Tangerine Sheri
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Apr 9 2006, 04:57 PM) [snapback]1140636[/snapback]

indeed stalingrad,

religion becomes an issue when people take it as their universal truth rather than as one of many "lessons" within life. It should be used by those that desire to, to give them direction, but not to encompass everything. To have yourself revolve around one book is rediculous, no matter what the book. Take the lessons, and move on to the next teacher.


i agree with this sacredness is not in one book or one 'faith' all of life is sacred and value can be derived from all things, following a faith to the exclusion of all others creates dogmas and extremists which become dangerous IMO
Kismit

The reason some people state that the only way to God is through what ever rligion they believe in, is because their particular belief system is a dualistic concept. The dualistic concept was one of the cleverest tools ever enlisted in religion. The concept basically states you are either with us or you are against us there is no in between. This allowed the church responsible for dualism to have absolute control over their congregation.

The trouble is you cannot change people from what they believe reasons being they; some people are actually scarred to give up their belief in a religion because they don't want to risk being wrong or right depending on how you look at it, people don't want to contemplate something seperate to what they have been taught is the absolute and only truth and pushing our own belief that that style of religion is wrong is no better then them pushing there's as the only way to God.

You can educate, you can even question but you can't alter another persons belief system.
HarleyBlue
QUOTE(science101 @ Apr 9 2006, 10:49 PM) [snapback]1140874[/snapback]

HarleyBlue:

Did I say that! I didn't even imply it! It's amazing how things can be taken out of context. Simple reading & comprehension skills is all that is needed.

To answer the 2nd part of your question, it's not for me to say!

Matthews 7:1-3
thumbsup.gif


I didn't say you did. It was just a question. Most people who quote the bible feel that way. Didn't mean to offend you!
Glacies
I agree, one cannot convert another, fascinating post, i never really gave much thought into the dualistic concept used by a great deal of religions, though in retrospect it makes a great deal of sense, and can be seen in many different cases.
HarleyBlue
QUOTE(HarleyBlue @ Apr 9 2006, 11:12 PM) [snapback]1140898[/snapback]

I didn't say you did. It was just a question. Most people who quote the bible feel that way. Didn't mean to offend you!


Ok I re-read my post. Maybe I did imply that. Sorry. Didn't mean it in the way it sounded
Tangerine Sheri
[quote name='Kismit' date='Apr 9 2006, 09:10 PM' post='1140895']
The reason some people state that the only way to God is through what ever rligion they believe in, is because their particular belief system is a dualistic concept. The dualistic concept was one of the cleverest tools ever enlisted in religion. The concept basically states you are either with us or you are against us there is no in between. This allowed the church responsible for dualism to have absolute control over their congregation.

The trouble is you cannot change people from what they believe reasons being they; some people are actually scarred to give up their belief in a religion because they don't want to risk being wrong or right depending on how you look at it, people don't want to contemplate something seperate to what they have been taught is the absolute and only truth and pushing our own belief that that style of religion is wrong is no better then them pushing there's as the only way to God.

You can educate, you can even question but you can't alter another persons belief system.
[/, IMO we should all be open to all paths one of the greatest problems in mankind is this exclusivity idea, that there is one way to god or a best way to god. Or this need to beleive in a god at all, who says so anyways??????
science101
QUOTE(HarleyBlue @ Apr 10 2006, 04:13 AM) [snapback]1140902[/snapback]

Ok I re-read my post. Maybe I did imply that. Sorry. Didn't mean it in the way it sounded


HarleyBlue:

It is perfectly okay man! I really love the debate we are having this evening. Very thought-provoking!


Kaknelson
I hear you Beckysmoms.

I don't strategically follow any religion, but i tend to believe the bibles teachings, from either christianity to rastafari, i tend to see a significance with the bible and life.
And, the teachings in hinduism, Karma and rebirth are interesting.. Hindus also have a good grasp on what is the soul, or atman.
I just believe in soul, and in god... oneness.... whatever you wish to call it. You cannot force an ideology on a peoples, or one religion.... I also believe in good and evil.... and although the world can be an ugly place, GOOD WILL PROSPER.

And not though a scientific means, but through prophets of our time... and messengers from the almighty. original.gif positive things
Beckys_Mom
QUOTE(HarleyBlue @ Apr 10 2006, 04:02 AM) [snapback]1140815[/snapback]

What you just said is what we are talking about. Because you are obviously Christian, you think others aren't going to heaven. Do you think all buddist and hindus and muslims and pagans etc. are going to hell?

I believe in God and Jesus but I also believe in the other religions prophets.

Yes Harley this is exactly what we are talking about here. Science has his beliefs and thats good for him, it makes him happy and my belief is..if it makes you happy so be it....but I personally don't think it's right to go and tell others they will answer to God and wont go to heaven because they follow God through another faith, there is something not right with that. What I mean is you can believe it because its what you have been taught...but believing it is one thing....saying it to others is showing disrespect to their faith and I don't think a number of people are aware that through saying stuff like that is showing disrespect towards their faith...whether it be Muslim, Jewish...ect.....Think of it this way...A christian would not take it too kindly if a Muslim for example was to tell him/her they wont go to heaven just because of their faith as a christian....this is true...but do people actually stop and think this is disrespectful towards another person faith???? not really no
All I am saying is...if you believe that other faiths are wrong...keep it to yourself, and its ok to believe and follow your own faith...do what makes you happy...but try not upset others by telling them their faith is wrong original.gif

QUOTE(Kismit @ Apr 10 2006, 05:10 AM) [snapback]1140895[/snapback]


You can educate, you can even question but you can't alter another persons belief system.

I see what you are saying, and yes you can educate and question....as for altering ones belief...this actually does happen all the time. My mother used to be Catholic like myself, untill one fine day she met up with a group of christians to whom she worked with. In no time my mom came home and told us she was now a Born again Christian...she spoke on how they made her see the true light...she told her kids that if we didn't change and remained catholics...we would not get into heaven....this was well over 10 years ago..and still to this day she will preach this. They altered her existing beliefs and had her believing them and becoming one of them....my mom never used to say stuff like that....to us and other around her it sounded harsh telling us our faith was wrong....but because I love my mother I came to understand it's what she now believes..and I can't hold her belief against her.....after all it makes my mom happy...she doesnt realize that telling her own kids they will burn in hell is fooked up a lil and wrong.....but we forgive her and she seems to love her faith...so be it...but many others that turned to a different faith have been coaxed into it and I am not just talking about christian either


QUOTE(ramster83 @ Apr 10 2006, 04:31 AM) [snapback]1140860[/snapback]

BM great post i really believe that as well and im so over the hypocrites....At work the other day this friendly enough man needed some assistance i helped him out and he said to me "You are a great boy thank you!" then he said "what nationality are you"? I said "Half Croatian and Half Lebanese" he said "Ahhh...okay"...Then he stares at me for a few seconds and he says "Are you Christian!?"

OMG I HATE it when people ask what religion i am- they obviously ask it so they can judge you- im paranoid to say im a Christian to a Muslim- and that im a Muslim to a Christian!
Why else would you ask someone such a personal question? The moment i said "Christian" he smiled and said "Oh Orthodox or Catholic" i couldnt believe it...I said "Catholic"....He said "Oh...we're all Chrstians anyway".

Then he goes on talking about JEWS and how they tried to destroy Christianity in its early years and blah blah blah...I was avoiding him at this point and signalled for him to leave the store- he eventually left to store...See the only reason he asked was to JUDGE ME- and if i answered correctly to his "beliefs" then hed start judging OTHERS!

What the hell! Dont Judge and Judged Be Not! The Bible says so! angry.gif

I fully understand you ramster...and I am behind you on this

I watched a programme once and the presenter was a scottish man..but his parents both of them where indian....he interviewed a number of people in the streets in the UK and he had this map of the world with him......he pasted his pic on the map and says with his scottish accent... - "Where do you recon I am from"?? - 95% of the people he interviewed said - "Oh you have to be from India" .... they judged him by his cover..this was the main issue of that programme.....you never judge a book by it's cover

If I met you ramster and you spoke to me with an aussie accent...I would just peg you as an Aussie and nothing more...pretty sure a lot of people may do the same LOL

As for religion....that man had no right to ask if you where christian or not...1st of all it's none of his business and 2nd of all what's the big deal???

Where I live in N.Ireland and for those of you that are tunned into what goes on over here ref - religion & politics.....people are forever asking you what religion are you??? gee I have lost count....this is funny but they say they can tell just by hearing your full name!!!! and if they can't tell by your name they will be sure to ask what school you attended and where you live.....this is not because they are intrested LOL they are beating around the bush to get to the real question they want answered.... - What Faith do you follow??? <--thats it....when I used to go out and get asked all 3 questions I would stop them and say... - "would you like me to fill out a form for you??" happy.gif "Ohh and BTW I dont follw any faith so I guess you will make do with that"...however some where ignorant to ask..was I once a catholic or protestant...now I never would answer that...how rude??!!! They would do that so they can decide whether to fight with you or talk to you as if you where someone...sad acts the lot of them. rolleyes.gif Another good reason as to why I dropped religion all together, it was too much baggage for me!!!

QUOTE(Kaknelson @ Apr 10 2006, 07:50 AM) [snapback]1141031[/snapback]

I hear you Beckysmoms.

I don't strategically follow any religion, but i tend to believe the bibles teachings, from either christianity to rastafari, i tend to see a significance with the bible and life.
And, the teachings in hinduism, Karma and rebirth are interesting.. Hindus also have a good grasp on what is the soul, or atman.
I just believe in soul, and in god... oneness.... whatever you wish to call it. You cannot force an ideology on a peoples, or one religion.... I also believe in good and evil.... and although the world can be an ugly place, GOOD WILL PROSPER.

And not though a scientific means, but through prophets of our time... and messengers from the almighty. original.gif positive things


I too believe in the soul and in God...it makes me happy..but I cant bring myself to tell other that don't believe...they will answer to him...how the heck would I know this???
LOL believing is one thing but actually knowing is another

IMO..folks do what makes you happy...but try and consider what other people believe and how they like to worship God...it's ok to think their faith is false because its what you are taught, but being tactful to others that are different shows respect to their faith .....after all don't you think that they should resect your faith too??You wouldn't like it much if they told you that you where so wrong and you wont get to ever see God in heaven..this is disrespectful to you and your faith right??? Well next time you tell others this very same thing, try and think....should I just keep that lil bit to myself, as this may upset this person??? but talking to this person about my faith is ok right?? RIGHT IT IS OK...people can have friendly discussions all the time about their different beliefs with out upsetting eachother....key word is tact!!!

Thanks for the responces so far thumbsup.gif
StalingradK
QUOTE
What you just said is what we are talking about. Because you are obviously Christian, you think others aren't going to heaven. Do you think all buddist and hindus and muslims and pagans etc. are going to hell?

I believe in God and Jesus but I also believe in the other religions prophets.


On my be-half: I believe that as long as you do not pick an other religion in SPITE of god, like you acknowledge him but you disrespect him by choosing not to worship him you are going to hell. Not because you don't think he exsists.

I too believe in other prophets. I believe Jesus was the son of god. And Muhammad was the messenger of god. And that Judaism, Christianity, and Islam follows the same god. Things like that.
mklsgl
Excellent topic, Becky's Ma. It's a prominent component in my "Cultures, Religions, and Societies" course.

Vehement posted (#8, I think) an excerpt from an outstanding book, 'The Curse of Cain: The Violent Legacy of Monotheism' by Regina Schwartz, which is a required reading in that course as well as a few others. The focus of her book is upon Othering and Markedness (Cain, as most know, was the first "marked" man) as it applies to how religion serves to only create a counterproductive, destructive, and ill-nurtured society. She argues that religion is built to fail the pursuit of happiness and equality.

What good is there in Othering diversity? Isn't much more gratifying and educational to embrace difference? Where is the logic in limiting yourself through identification in such a narrow perspective?

- Michael, sending letters postmarked "Desolation Row."
Nadal
QUOTE(Beckys_Mom @ Apr 9 2006, 04:52 PM) [snapback]1140481[/snapback]

To me religion is meant to be friendly, loving and respectful not just towards God but to eachother...remember love thy neighbor???
But what is it that makes a lot of people look down and frown apon religion??

It's obvious...the people that follow it....ok I don't mean ALL that follow...but I do mean a lot dontgetit.gif

I have lost count on how many times I have seen and heard people use a persons faith just to show spite and ignorance...after all I have lived in N.Ireland all my life so I know what I am talking about.........They use it and it turns into politics and then people die for just having a faith.

I have met so many people that are taught that other faiths are so wrong, this has shown a lot of judgmental issues and hate from these so called followers of Jesus/God

I think if they where taught that ALL faiths are good, but their own is best for them, that it would not cause any harm.....but this don't happen...I have heard and even read on here...people that are taught that other religious teachings are false.....this is pure ignorance and it creates hate and ill feelings...then they try and sugar coat it by saying...."oh I don't mean it in a bad way, it's just my beliefs" ......... so is that supposed to make it OK??? No it doesn't ..cuz if they wernt taught such a thing in the 1st place then this wouldnt happen..(well not nearly as much)

Do you think that's what God really wants??? For us to look down and say that other faith to him are FALSE and WRONG??? If you think this...what makes you so sure?? Why can't you see just how ignorant that is?? Think of it this way....when others that say your faith is WRONG and FALSE..you don't take it too kindly do you?? and yet you are more than willing to do it to others??

I am not aiming this at anyone in particular..but reading posts and hearing things said in real life got me thinking.....Religion is supposed to be - Friendly, Loving, Warm, and Faithful....
It sounds so ironic...when someone preaches - God is ALL LOVING..yet says "Pssst btw your faith is false and you wont go to heaven" rolleyes.gif

Has anyone ever thought that God is happy that he has many different faiths that are devoted to him??? And that there is NO SUCH THING as one true faith...to him ALL ARE EQUAL??? hmm??.................. See if everyone did think along those lines...then religion wouldn't be frowned upon by others...well IMO anyhoo original.gif

Not to start anything, but religion's the most violent thing in existence. The entire Hebrew and Christian faith was sparked by war and violence. Such as Exodus and when the Israelites attacked the 'Paradise Land.' and took over the cities, killed every living thing in them, and burned them to the ground.
Beckys_Mom
QUOTE(Nadal @ Apr 10 2006, 11:20 PM) [snapback]1141952[/snapback]

Not to start anything, but religion's the most violent thing in existence. The entire Hebrew and Christian faith was sparked by war and violence. Such as Exodus and when the Israelites attacked the 'Paradise Land.' and took over the cities, killed every living thing in them, and burned them to the ground.

I see where you are coming from...but...it's not religion that is at fault...it's those who use it as an excuse to create harm on to others..this is so wrong
LoopyLou
QUOTE(Paranoid Android @ Apr 10 2006, 02:49 AM) [snapback]1140748[/snapback]

They're called hypocrites yes.gif And the Bible is clear about what happens to them devil.gif tongue.gif

My opinion on the matter - as a general rule, religion (as in an organization) naturally breeds elements of segregation. That's why it's not a good idea to invest your time solely in such an organization. That does not mean however that religion cannot have good elements. It's when it's taken too far that it becomes a problem.

GOd doesn't care about your "religion". He cares about your relationship with him. I tend to believe that this relationship can only be truly realised through Jesus Christ, but I'm not going to force anyone else to believe the same thing. And I don't need an organization to give me this relationship with God.

Unfortunately, I cannot say that I believe everyone's way is the "right" way, because I just don't believe that. My opinion is that Jesus is the only way. I will not condemn or heap curses on you for choosing what you do believe though, because I know that I might be wrong. I don't believe I am wrong. But I accept that I might be.

Know what I mean?

Regards, PA


My thoughts exactly PA! Well said! thumbsup.gif
Kismit
QUOTE(Becky's-Ma)
My mother used to be Catholic like myself, untill one fine day she met up with a group of christians to whom she worked with. In no time my mom came home and told us she was now a Born again Christian

I see the point you're trying to make, however it was you Mother who choose to convert, Nobody could force her to convert she had to make that decision herself.

Sheri, Your opinion is valid it is the option of variety that gave Becky's ma's Ma the option of converting from Catholisism to Christianity. I also believe that life is a search for what fits you in a religion and I find the dualist concepts floored.


Nadal, In my opinion, it is not the religions that are violent but the people who use them as an excuse for violence that cause all of the blood shed.
Beckys_Mom
QUOTE

I see the point you're trying to make, however it was you Mother who choose to convert, Nobody could force her to convert she had to make that decision herself.

Sheri, Your opinion is valid it is the option of variety that gave Becky's ma's Ma the option of converting from Catholisism to Christianity. I also believe that life is a search for what fits you in a religion and I find the dualist concepts floored.
Nadal, In my opinion, it is not the religions that are violent but the people who use them as an excuse for violence that cause all of the blood shed.

My mom did choose yes this I know but she told us she was coaxed into making this choice...being coaxed does not mean forced, she took their advice and seemed to agree with it....but it makes her happy...and thats what really matters to me...finally she is happy with what she believes in
Nadal
Actually, it was Mosis idea to do it, and Mosis is considered one of the founding-fathers of Christianity, Judaism, and Islam. He told the Israelities that god told him to do such. This was before he received the 10 commandments, though. Perhaps god saw this slaying and battle then he found it neccessary to ban man-kind from killing one another? Dunno...complicated to state anything accurate.
stargazer123
BM

I truly wish people could respect eachother in this way. It just saddens me.
I really don't know what to say except the worst part is when it hits very close to home and you see it happening to your children. When they come home from sunday school and tell you that they were told that the Muslim religion isn't only bad but evil and than you feel yourself growing angry at them and it becomes this rolling wheel, this cycle. sad.gif

The thing is that it seems you cannot rationalize most times with prejudice and sometimes people use religion as an excuse. I am fortunate to have friends of all walks of life and all religions and non-religion. We respect eachother and hear eachother out and it has been not only a grand learning experience but a blessing. It reminds me how much we stand to learn from one another.

Bm, being in Ireland I know you understand that tension for sure. One song that I love that reminds me of your part of the world..."Sunday Bloody Sunday" U2.
Beckys_Mom
QUOTE(stargazer123 @ Apr 11 2006, 03:04 AM) [snapback]1142343[/snapback]

BM

I truly wish people could respect eachother in this way. It just saddens me.
I really don't know what to say except the worst part is when it hits very close to home and you see it happening to your children. When they come home from sunday school and tell you that they were told that the Muslim religion isn't only bad but evil and than you feel yourself growing angry at them and it becomes this rolling wheel, this cycle. sad.gif

The thing is that it seems you cannot rationalize most times with prejudice and sometimes people use religion as an excuse. I am fortunate to have friends of all walks of life and all religions and non-religion. We respect eachother and hear eachother out and it has been not only a grand learning experience but a blessing. It reminds me how much we stand to learn from one another.

Bm, being in Ireland I know you understand that tension for sure. One song that I love that reminds me of your part of the world..."Sunday Bloody Sunday" U2.


I dont think anyone over here will forget - Bloddy Sunday no.gif..see this is what I mean...its not religion that causes things like Bloddy Sunday to happen..its the people that use it as an excuse that causes this

If anyone does not know about Bloddy Sunday...feel free to google it!!
stargazer123
QUOTE(Beckys_Mom @ Apr 10 2006, 10:07 PM) [snapback]1142347[/snapback]

I dont think anyone over here will forget - Bloddy Sunday no.gif..see this is what I mean...its not religion that causes things like Bloddy Sunday to happen..its the people that use it as an excuse that causes this

If anyone does not know about Bloddy Sunday...feel free to google it!!


Ultimately you're right it is people and people use religion as an excuse. But sometimes I think certain people and religion are like children with loaded guns.

I do want to add that even though it is people who display prejudice, religion also has its mark to bear in my mind. Many religions have been based on violence and such and God himself in many religions advocates violence, slavery, women being inferior.

But ultimately people from all walks of life are not immune to prejudice and intolerance.
Darsawl
QUOTE(Beckys_Mom @ Apr 9 2006, 08:52 PM) [snapback]1140481[/snapback]

To me religion is meant to be friendly, loving and respectful not just towards God but to eachother...remember love thy neighbor???
But what is it that makes a lot of people look down and frown apon relion?





mostly lake of proof people can't see it, it doesn't exist.
reality is in these days so if the common don't see it as real it isn't.
i don't mean nobody belives it's just they don't want to get caught belive.
what are you doing? praying. at lunch?
In general it's considered rude to pray in public some think it shows that you want to shovel your religion on to them.

Rligion pushing is another reson people are sick of it
not saying you do just that people feel others do
like they whine over the pledge of alligence
it's not a big deal
or money people complain about that i mean if religions want to seem greedy let them
thats my opinion you couldn't possibly push a religion onto me any more.

modernization robots the new fad. why have god do things when you can have a nifty robot do it. thats the new craze total machine take over even ideas of computers that know more then we put in no wonder we wouldn't need a god with that. it's too much we need so faith.

fear people no longer are fearful of anything not even god wow. its true alot of people don't fear any gods everything can be forgiven i'm not saying that isn't peachy but you need to be afraid of something and if not god what? just a question/

patience lack. now now is the saying. with instant coffee and minute rice. No one is willing to wait for results I wait for my gods to answer my questions. It's just hurry hurry.

With no religion there is nothing for them to do but look down on religion.
alteclancing
double post
alteclancing
Religious people are the meanest people in the world. It's a tool for a group of power hungry people to do their meanest deed. It's a facade. Even our Lord was nearly stoned because of them. They are always trying to catch Him in his words in order to discredit Him. All of them failed and could not even utter a word.

As a christian, our Lord taught us 2 things, and it's very simple, to love God with all our heart, with all our soul, with all strength and to love our neighbor as ourselves. Love is all there is to christianity.
To Becky's Mom:

I recommend you read this:

http://www.faithwriters.com/article-details.php?id=17966
Beckys_Mom
QUOTE(Darsawl @ Apr 11 2006, 03:35 AM) [snapback]1142408[/snapback]

Rligion pushing is another reson people are sick of it
not saying you do just that people feel others do

Ohh I wont argue with that,and I never push religion on to anyone, because I dont follow a faith of any kind.....and never will wink2.gif
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