As many of us know some of the worlds religions have been twisted threw out history to benefit a certain man or in most cases a group of men. Now these molestations of faith were to mostly gain power or as the title says to control the masses. Even to this day religions are used to move people to false actions.

Now heres the question do you think that the twisters as I have called them are perhaps profits sent to lead the people closer to holiness or are they as stated above molesters of the given religion? Im sure the answers will differ greatly with each person. If you would like to give examples of people controling the masses in history feel free.

(Some of you in my past post have said I have a (superiority complex) and I am just trying to promote my own blind faith. I cant seem to remember stating that I had a faith to blindly promote. So before this is locked for what ever reason it is for curiosity sakes only it has nothing to do with what ever faith I may or may not have.

Who do you mean by "prophets"? Do you mean like Jesus.

No, they aren't prophets, they're power brokers.
Most blatant example: The Catholic Church twisting Christianity in is early days, first to fit with the cult of Sol Invictus and then later on adopting pagan rituals to the religion to convince pagan tribes to join the religion and prevent conflict, not to mention growth (i.e. that whole preventing people from reading the Bible thing) and keep their pampered selves in power.
Another blatant example: televangelism.
Benny Hinn: "Gawd, says-uh to emp-ty your pock-ets for Himmmmm."
Believers: "Ok." <rustling of millions of dollars heading towards Hinn>
Benny Hinn: "Suckahs!"
Another disturbing example: Hilter. Nuff' said.

Beware churches. They tell you that you need them to get to God. You don't. The divine is inside everyone. Churches are just there to get themselves rich and gain political power (i.e. by telling the sheep, I mean flock, how to vote).
Whoops, probably shouldn't have said that, might go the way of the Cathars and the Gnostics.
Bad me! <slaps hand> Bad!

i think the people that change around religion to benifit themselves should die, end of story, goodbye.

They molest religion even worse than michael jackson molests children. I think the molesters should be the molestees.

All good points yes i think the molesters should be the molestees as well. Im glad to see my topic has you so excited exceller.

Thier going to lock my post again.

right, back on topic then, as i said before, anyone who minipulates a religion to get money or power is a sick twisted human being, they would be taking peoples whole idea of life and changing it just so they could make a few dollars. that is just wrong, like for example, scientology (no offense to any scientologists on this forum, this is just what i think about the religion) the person who created that religion was a novalist, he even said the quickest way to make money was to start your own religion, and then he did! He was one disturbed person, making people believe all that BS to make some money....

Sorry about that...I apologize (((hugs)))

Ok on topic



I agree with you...its wrong to create religion just to make money....however a lot of christian churches like to raise money in order to help charities...we must not forget that

i wasnt speaking of that, i was saying more along the lines of those that raise money, and then keep it for themselves, not putting it back in the community or not using it to help rebuild or repair the church. just pocketing it for themselves

Ohh dont get me wrong...there are a lot have done this...some havent...but yes a lot have...

i know, thats why i dont like religions that you have to pay to join, cuz usually the money just gets pocketed. like my religion if you want to actually get involved with the church of satan you have to pay, but you dont have to join the church to join the religion, thats only if you want to get activly involved in groups and meetings and stuff like that.

Yes and some of these (charitys) have a CEO who gets like 50% off every dollar they make lol. Its wrong when you see some one coming to work for a charity in a porsh.

I've cleaned up the thread a little. Taken out the multiple posts and subsequent discussion. That should keep us back on topic

What about world vision christian relief and development organization?

well, alot of it is gathering with like minded poeples to help achieve a goal. if one goes about preaching against organized churches, then he has become in effect organized church of yadda yadda organized church haters, which in effect would be totally heretical and hipocrital unto themselves and their "theology"

bottom line is, like minded peoples achieve more "together" than a bunch of non-like minded peoples achieve in chaos. so what would you all rather have?

1.Christ said that we should love our neigbors. dont you think that that is beneficial to a society? churches remind us of that, gathering together, being at peace with everyone. so isnt that better than being at odds with everyone?

2. Christ never said that we should make our churches rich or make our pastors rich. he tipped over the scales and money changers tables on the steps of the synogogue right? BUT, a church cannot survive without some funding. maybe the nex big thing will be church on the internet, who knows, but to get your message out it takes some money.

3. there are two types of people in the world. leaders and followers. being a follower is OK! those who lead bear great responsibility. many people fear that kind of responsibility.

1: I infact agree with this however it is an impossibility this is fact for instance many people would not agree with my lifestyle. Since not everyone can agree on certain views or in effect agree with how someone might live their lives it may cloud judgement. People judge other people and everyone does it. People dislike other people and this does make it an impossibility no matter how much tolerance you have.

2: I agree however the the christian church for example is pretty much it's own state and one of the most powerful and wealthiest organizations in the world they even have their own embassies. Why would a religeon need an embassy? This an example of how powerful they really are. You infact need wealth to become powerful this is something they have perfected very well.

3: Being a follower is not ok especially if the leader or leaders lead you down the wrong path. Everyone can and should have control over their lives. Remember an elected official for example works for you not the other way around. A leader should be guided by the word of the people since we allow them to have the power that they have. What people need is guidence not leadership. By advocating it is OK for those to follow you essentially advocate it is OK to do what you told when your told. People just simply need to be more informed then what they are, and should be allowed into the decision making process of either a country or a religeos institution. Those who lead should not bear responsibilities as they do those responsibilities should be everyones to bear. We should all share equall responsibility and work toward bettering ourselves.

Seems the easiest way to control the masses would be to erase the belief in a higher power. The only higher power instead would be the government officials. Instead of being guided by belief and ideology of that religion, they would be guided by the state. When people's loyalty is to their religion, there will be conflicts with the state. When the god is the government, who takes care of them, they are more likely to blindly follow the government.

How about not controlling the masses by getting everyone to follow to further developement of mankind. See The government is more beleivable then God The governments of the world actually exist they are there and we live within these systems of control. How ever in certain parts like here in Canada or the US we for the most part question authority and often show a lack of control on their part. Government is not the problem just the people we elect. However I know for a fact up here when the government goes too far people riot, protest and speak out. In other parts of the world they aren't so lucky like North Korea or China etc. Governments should always be kept in check by the people. The hardest thing a government body has to deal with is it's own people turning again'st them.

i fail to see your point.......you are a follower no matter what you think........we all are. and there fore it must be ok.

And what do you imagine is the reason for the advent of institutionalized faith, but to obtain power and of course, money!? Religion is one of the reasons humans are self-destructive and lesser evolved as a species, had we not invented the concept. It's divisive, ignorant and vain. And yet some believe it is worthy of death (martyrdom) and the slaughter of others, so as to enforce it's edicts. Thinking that is in service to the god of their creation to. And on the world stage, given every faith presumes their faith is the only one among the many, as well as is possessed of a loving spirit (god), in the process, nothing will change about that until the entire world lets go of fables that keep them striving to preserve the soul after life, while desecrating the flesh in the course of living.

Holy wars. (how patently absurd)
Ethnic cleansing (ditto)
Inquisition (convert or suffer to death)

Given the history, the other absurdity is that anyone can imagine a loving spirit called god, approves! Yes, burning people to death, tossing their babies on the pyre because they were believed to be the spawn of their evil parent(s), is holy. Well of course it is! For those that strike the flame, of course and render themselves guiltless in the process because they further imagine they are doing "gods work".

If there was a god, I imagine if we had the ears to hear we would still cringe at the weeping that resounds from the heavens.

OF course you fail to see my point and no I'm not a follower of any faith nor do i do what I am told. I do what I want and that's the point. We all aren't followers and if you choose to be then then you make that decision. Just because I have no choice but to live in a system, does not mean I have to obey it, nor do I have to agree with it. I figured you would say something like anyway because you like the other sheeple and can't see past your own ignorance. You cannot figure out that without us they are nothing. This will be your downfall.

No, the worst is when the government turns against the people.

I feel like venting here on a subject that's sort of related.

I met an old friend last night, I have not seen in years. We got into a political discussion. Basically he thinks people need to be told what to do and how to behave. He wants the United States government to stay on top of the world, because he is white, and he can only see white males being in charge of the United States, so he thinks that's what's best. He believes 9/11 was an inside job, but he thinks it's for our own good. I asked him about government corruption, and he sees nothing wrong with because he truly believes his leaders have his best interest in mind. He would trade liberty for security, if the government decided it was for the best. He seems to be a nationalist, in that he want the United States to remain the world's only super power, but does not know what makes America (united States) American. He thought it was strict capitalism, and not the constitution bill of rights. He wants the power to be consolodated into fewer and fewer hands as long as it's white people because he thinks he will benifit from that.

I tried to tell him that our leaders do not have the best interest in mind for the people of the United States, and I told him it sounds like he wants to live in a dictatorship. He said he didn't know the deffinition of a dictatorship.

It took all my self control I could muster not to slap him in the face. This guy is what's wrong with the world. They think they are informed, but are so ignorant and uninformed they have tunnel vision, and are doomed to become a boot licker.

They already do that...

It is not a problem they have to deal with that is the problem we have to deal with. Their problem would be it's population turning again'st them. A government cannot handle a an entire countries population turning again'st them.

I agree with you completely. The government already turned against the people. Yes a government could not handle the entire population revolting. There would be a change of leadership if that happened. That's why governments use their power to suppress and demonize any dissent among the populace. they even go so far as to plan an attack against the population if they rise up. From the perspective of the government, they need to completely control everything. Do it in a way that the people still think they are free though, so they don't get upset. Basically make them love thier servitude.

"All propaganda must be so popular and on such an intellectual level, that even the most stupid of those toward whom it is directed will understand it... Through clever and constant application of propaganda, people can be made to see paradise as hell, and also the other way around, to consider the most wretched sort of life as paradise."
-- Adolf Hitler 1935 Mein Kampf, p. 197. 14th Edition