So called self proclaimed "skeptics" pride themselfs into believing nothing except what they want to believe.

Like paranoids, that believe everything is some conspiracy, or the "mans" out to get them, there is no "proving" to them, you can show them, hey, no hidden cameras see? and they make up something else, its a fear.

Skeptics, have an agenda also, you can show them solid research, and they will say its just B.S. show them up front and they will just say its smoke and mirrors.

Its not only that these skeptics reject all data and evidence before them, they seem threatened by those that do believe, they go as far as calling them children, dummies, or plain nuts, they will even try and convince some of these people that what they experienced was not real, as if they had the "chance in heck" to convince someone thats had a premonition that came true, that it didnt happen. or whatever weird experience.

Skeptism is a faith as strong as any religion, they hold onto what they want to believe no matter what anyone presents or any proof. they reject whatever goes against their beliefs.

A real researcher is open to all posibilities, and studies the data and info, sifts through the real mysteries that exist in the world and tries to find explanation, just telling everyone your lying or dellusional is just a sign of a closed one track mind.

There are extremists in every 'group'---the one's that throw out all logic to hold on to their perceived ideology.

A skeptic questions excepted beliefs...Religion is a excepted belief system....What is the agenda of a skeptic???? Other then to question and seek.....to decide truth for ones self....

i am a skeptic on MANY MANY things said in these forums, and i find myself ofended reading this

THIS WORLD HAS ALWAYS HAD SKEPTICS, THATS HOW WE ADVANCE, folowers of your dear lord JESUS had to be skeptical about their previous way of life in order to except new one , same goes for Mohamad (pbuh)

Religion and Skepticsm have things in comon ofcourse but they are not even close to beeing the same,

who you are talking about are those EXTREME skeptics, and we have EXTREME in everything these days,

i will give you a quote that i belive everyone should live by


In a words ofCHRIS ROCK "Anyone who makes up their mind before they hear the issue is a fool.............. Be a person. Listen. Let it swirl around your head. Then form your opinion...........No normal decent person is one thing. OK!?! "

As does anyone who believes in anything. Try using science and common sense when talking to a Creationist or a kid who thinks he's cryokinetic and see what I mean.



There's a difference between paranoia and good old fashioned distrust of the outlandish. What's paranoid about not believing in telekinesis without any evidence, for example? Less foolish than unfoundedly believing in it.



Believers use the exact same tactic with things like religion,telekinesis, etc. I don't see you criticizing that also.

o.k i'm a skeptic in some things, can this be said about religion as well? show them a piece of evidence about evolution and its the conspiracy of the devil! please your a fool if you believe in everything you should know that. i don't 'reject' whatever goes against my own beliefs i look at the facts (like any normal person would) and then make a decision if it's the truth or not. your a bit naiive to believe everything you are told and see i surely wouldn't

Indeed it can be said about religion, Kahrie. It's more paranoid to live your life believing that there's an almight invisible God in the sky watching your every move, while you're thinking "Crap, I'd better not have sex out of wedlock, the giant guy in the sky will put the smackdown on me!".

A skeptic is a person who prefers facts over faith. When one is skeptical of something, they must be shown proof beyond a doubt. This is a very logical approach to things, I think.

There are some people who see skeptics as people who believe in nothing, who refuse to believe what you tell them is true. This is entirely false.
Remember, you may fail to see certain loopholes in "proof" of the paranormal because you choose to believe it's real. Skeptics think of every possibility before accepting something as fact. Again, this is a very logical state of mind.

If you are not skeptical when first approaching a farfetched assertion or situation, you will very easily be fooled.

Holy jesus man, you're describing christians



Have to agree with you there.

gil, you described many religions in that post, and nothinf could be farther from skeptics.

do you blindly accept everything you see or hear? no? then your a skeptic.

you need to think about these things

Funny... thats what defines a skeptic...

totally agree with you one this one Wayfaerer, i find it to be much like a dictatorship where you live for them and do what they say rather than do what you want

I hear this same old argurment all the time, it's getting tiresome.

Pay attention now; I don't believe in the Loch Ness Monster.

Does this non-belief in the Loch Ness Monster make it a religion?

Here's another thought, what does "atheistic" mean? It means the absence of theism.

My Toaster manual is atheistic, so is my VCR manual.

Theism, or a belief in a Supreme Deity does just not figure in, it's off subject as it were.

Ergo, atheism is not a religion.

Cheers

From my experiences that is absolutely true. By insulting, and ganging up on people who claim theyve had experiences, they (the skeptics) manage to intimidate other people who would have otherwise spoken up, for fear of being insulted. Bullies use the same methods, that is until one little guy comes up and punches him square in the nose, knocks him on his butt, and everyone sees how weak he is (its obviouse because they prey on people)

And for those who wont believe the evidence if you slap it in their face, thats just the difference from close mindedness and prejudice, to open minded and polite.

They keep use down, where everything is just perfect for them, I cant wait until a few highly respected scientists get the BALLS to stand UP!

Although I'm sure some have, and oops there went their career!

Nina Kulagina is one object of much neglect. yes just one. atleast the russians opened their eyes, (for a little bit)

I’m a sceptic and I base my views on observation, yes I require proof before acceptance and would take a more probable explanation based on observed systems over one that relies on only faith am I closed to the possibility of error or the fallibility of science no of coarse not that would make me arrogant and small minded is religion open to the possibility of error you tell me?

I find it quite insulting to be categorised as some small minded zealot because I am not afraid to question

Why is there still a million pound reward for anyone that can display or prove any paranormal activity in an controlled environment I would have thought that there would be an abundance of takers but sadly as of yet there are none

A sceptic is is one who questions accepted beliefs. Hence it is quite possible to be, for example, a Christian who is sceptical of some of the church's teachings. Doubting Thomas was a sceptic as he required evidence before accepting Christ's resurrection. To claim that scepticism is a religion is to have a fundamental failure to understand the nature of scepticism.

I am a sceptic when it comes to many things. I am sceptical over the existence of ghosts, of flying saucers and of the Loch Ness Monster. I require evidence before I believe in these things. That does not mean that I state categorically that these things do not exist, just that I have not seen enough evidence to make me believe.

When it comes to religion I would not call myself a sceptic. I am an atheist. I believe the evidence I have seen is enough for me to conclude that there is no god. However I pride myself on not having a bigoted attitude to those that do believe. I agree totally with a freedom to practise what ever religion people choose. I count Christians, Muslims Hindus and Sikhs amongst my friends and do not consider my beliefs to be superior to theirs.

How sad then that gilgamesh and desty attack those that differ from themselves in belief. This is exactly the kind of intolerance that they claim to be victims of. As well as showing ignorance of what scepticism actually is it shows a high level of hypocrisy.

Yes, it does indeed.




Supreme irony perhaps?

I think you will find that religion is a set of beliefs, feelings, dogmas and practices that define the relations between humans and the deity/deities, usually to include a community of like-minded individuals, sacred books and paraphernalia, sacraments and rituals.
The defining characteristics are:
Beliefs and practices
Faith
Unity of those who share the same faith
I think you will find that skepticism does not meet these characteristics, therefore skepticism (Atheism, Agnosticism, etc) can not be considered a religion, rather the anathema of organized religion (if not all religion). Good try, but no seegar!

This is just another thread that claims atheism is a religion..<--seen one too many of them...now its skepticism is a religion...whats next??? Sugar coat it again and say...NB's is a religion LOL

Everyone is SKEPTIC of something...that dont make it a religion...if it dont include a deity...then its not a religion

well said. It's getting annoying, all these "skeptism is a religion"...

also... how can NB's be a religion, they'd not beleive their own religion because they are NB's and gah... I could go on but it'll give me a headache

LOL I laugh when I see threads like this LOL

Thank you I am glad you caught that

But thinking back at history and seeing the intolerance that Christianity has shown other beliefs and cultures it does not surprise me in the least

It is unfair to single out a single religion when you talk of intolerance. Throughout history man his been intolerant to man wherever there is a difference, be it religion, race or nationality.

One of the biggest mass murderers of modern times was Mao, and he was an atheist.

To quote the movie Libertine "It's fun to be against things but there comes a time when you must be for things as well.

Very often I find a person that defines themselves as a skeptic lacks the ability to follow their intuition.

It is this intuition that has propelled man through science. Skepticism often falsely gets the credit because a new idea sometimes calls an old one into question.

For instance. Thomas Edison was not following skepticism to reach the light bulb, he was following intuition allowing him to persevere through repeated failures proving a light bulb is possible.

ok you can worship me its ok




P.S. very well said

Yeah and we had 1800 years of they who defined themselves as Christians that lacked the ability to follow thier intuition - we call it the Dark Ages!

hmmmm, seems like the only ones who agree with gil are hard core religious members....

My friend.

Christians believe in a GOD they have never seen. In angels they have never heard. They believe a man walked on water, turned water to wine, commanded the wind and rose from the dead.

The Christian has only intuition.

Actually verax...people do hear angles from within...I believe so

Yes...thank you BM.

Actually for me anyway the only thing I have ever said was why should I beleive in anything. Becoming angry and agressive like you makes me inclined not to beleive what you do. Fact is I'm not sure what to beleive and that is why I am skeptical.


What have you shown me to make me beleive you said you can show us but what exactly have you shown to make people beleive you. I think that comparing us to paranoid conspiracy theorists and calling us fearfull etc. will make people beleive you less. You are not providing a solid arguement to back your side.


I have seen no solid research from non-biased researchers to proove anything as of yet. As for an agenda yes I do have one it is to find out the truth. In order to do this you need to question everything.


I only reject data that does not come from any reputable source. I have not called anyone a child, dummy or a nut. I will say though this post is childish....
As for premonitions etc I have not seen any premonition made come true as of yet if you or others have any for the forseeable future with specific dates post them if they come true well then that's great. But merely saying i had a vision that came true without posting here for example before it happens does make it hard to beleive. Most other weird experiences people have you would have to see to beleive. I once heard someone say she is in contact with 218 alien species and that their ships run on air and sunlight.... How can you beleive this.


Your view of skepticism is flawed since i really don't beleive in anything and am not sure what to beleive. You try to lump us all in one pile when everyone is truly a skeptic even you. You are skeptical of the skeptics because they question you and others. Thus you are being skeptical. Being skeptical is more or less questioning things that may not be true to get the facts. I do not reject good data and never have i have not seen very good data however to substantiate many claims people have made over the years.


Some people do lie and are delusional however and it is quite easy to tell them apart simply by the nature of the posts. I am open to many possibilities however some things people say are truly 'out there' and cannot be beleived. Since most of these people who make absurd claims do not provide evidence except their words what are we supposed to do? Just beleive on 'faith' alone?

===============

Skepticism is not a religeon since every human being is a skeptic. You are skeptical of skeptics. As funny as it sounds it's true. If you have ever questioned anyone ever you are a skeptic. It is more or less a part of human nature as opposed to a religeon. A religeon is a beleif system where as skepticism is about seeking answers. skeptics come from every walk of life.

I can say however based on your post you were either offended by someone or you had some other type of an encounter with someone or perhaps more then one person. I will say however you have offended me with you post as you clearly went on a pointless rant based on absolutly no fact and by lumping everyone into a category then claiming skepicism is a religeon was 'proof' enough that you do not know what you talking about. I would suggest the next time you make a post of this nature you back up what you say.

I am a researcher and open to many possibilities however you say we are close minded and scared of you. Really this is not the case and because this post was clearly typed out of anger and hatred for those that have questioned you in the past. It shows that you are infact fearfull of those who do ask questions and won't beleive everything we are told by you and others. I have done a satisfactory job at countering every point you made.

Thus you are my hero.

Total nonsense. Edison was following scientific method. He already knew the light bulb was possible because science said it was (and the fact that Joseph Swan had already made one in England some 20 years earlier). Edison was attempting (and succeeding) to improve the design. He certainly didn't do this by guess work but by applying his knowledge to a problem.

Edison said himself, "Genius is 1% inspiration, 99% perspiration," he didn't include intuition in the equation.

Anyway this is all getting a bit off topic.

it's only a religion for some, not all. but it's hard to tell the difference sometimes because the religious ones deny it and hide behind (abuse) a veil of "impartiality"... "I'm only looking for the truth". Some really are just looking for the truth, but some claim that while trying to convince you of Their "truth". Just like the media that tries to present itself as "impartial" when by virtue of the words they choose it's obvious that there IS a bias, yet they deny it claiming some journalistic integrity. Same thing with "skeptics", some real normal ones, and some religious ones. Just like atheists, some normal everyday guys, and some Preach the evils of religion.

I agree that anyone who has devoted their lives to preaching a "truth" about spiritual matters is indeed practicing their own form of religion.

There is nothing wrong with this until they turn fundementalist and want any other spiritual views than theirs wiped out even if it takes force and violence to do it.

You just described the symptoms of mental illness!

Actually the opposite is true.
Auditory and visual hallucinations are seen as mental illness, to have seen or heard.

It's amazing how few people realise this. Sorry, back on topic.......

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Christianity is the most talked about religion here on these boards.

It isnt funny how some people appears from no-where, attacks non belivers and later post from very long time to very long time?

If I had a penny for everytime a Christian has said to me, "God spoke to me in my heart and told me blah blah blah...", I would have a couple of million dollars to spend. I know many that have seen these angels and seen Jesus, etc. As I said he described symptoms of mental illness - or we can have it you way and say that it is symptoms of childishness!

Skepticism a religion? Nope.
Pathological Skepticism a religion? Seems like it these days XD
Might as well call it the Religion of Denial

The central tenet of skepticism is to accept nothing without evidence and sound reasoning. If skeptics don't accept your ideas, it is time to back them up with evidence and sound reasoning. If you do that, you will be believed; if you don't do that, then nobody should believe you, anyway.

Reliance on untested and untestable ideas is the realm of religion. It has produced religious wars, persecutions, burning at the stake and other atrocities. We need to no more of this.

I suspect that some of your skeptics weren't relying on evidence and reasoning, either. In that sense, you are right that they were practicing a religion. That they came up with some screwy ideas is not surprising.

Test everything. What survives the process is truth; what doesn't is falsehood and what can't be tested is just a screwy idea.

--DJS

Yes, Skepticism often rise from an attempt to discover the truth, not from an attempt to hide fro m the truth





Yes i don't think i've ever heard of ID or the like being pushed to be taught by any one not associaited with the Church.





Thats right, i challenge ANYONE on these forums to predict something on this site accurately, giving a date, but i dare say that will not happen.

(Though i Predict the sun will rise tommorow)





Yes there are as many types of non-belief as there are belief. Just because someone does not believe in YOUR vier of god is no reason to lump them togethor with all non-believers.





Yep, look at Sylvia Browne or Alison DuBois, lucky to be right 40% of the time and then it is obvious things.

This shows the need for skepticism





Yes, Skepticism is about finding the truth instead of following the party line.




Yeah but that describes many of the things that religious people believe in. Because i have tried and tried but i can not move a moutain. (at least not without a hell of a lot of gelignite

Skepticism is probably a religion in the same way my cats' view on the food bowl is a religion. They see it empty and ponder if it's possible it can be full, and through scientificat experiments, observations, and collection of evidence, can formulate a working theory that if they sit at the bowl and yowl, eventually the humans will fill it again.

Now, if they decided that the yowling itself caused the bowl to be full again and created little hymnals with various musical yowling, then it's starting to be a religion.

That goofy parallel didn't work out as I hoped, so how about this?

Skepticism is a religion just as much as my socks can walk on their own.

Edit: By the way, anyone who has cats will recognize their ability for science. For example, Ashy will push a glass jar off a table, observe the results, dance around a bit, and then later will push another jar off the table. If the results are different, she gets puzzled and does it again. And in different setups with different items, say casserole dishes.

Plus, cats are good investigators.

Okay, NOW I've lost my mind.

I had to paste this first remark in this thread, for the sake of context to my commentary, as it could very well be applied to christians/christianity and their pov at one point, of non-believers. Because if one substitutes; "christian" for "skeptic", as I've done in the paste, it's germane to the attitude many christians exhibit. Even in these forums, one might note.

However as written it is clear there is an agenda of misinformation communicated that reflects a christians defensive posture toward rationalism and those that eschew blind faith, as well as ignorance of the definition and application of the word; skeptic.

A skeptic can be said to be that which is illustrated in the first sentence of that final paragraph;(sic)"... A real researcher is open to all possibilities, and studies the data and info, sifts through the real mysteries that exist in the world and tries to find explanation." With a brief addendum ; "before accepting the data as true or plausible."

At least a skeptic, that may habitually doubt assertions or unsubstantiated claims, can be said to be optimistic of an opportunity to find sustainable evidence that corroborates said claim. Whereas I find it telling that the synonym for "gullible" is; un-skeptical!

So then, given that observation, which attitude would one subscribe to so as to call themselves an intelligent skeptic (christian)!?

Nice "commentary" IF!

If Skepticism is a religion...then who on earth do these skeptics pray to?

Sceptics like to use religion in their work the curiosity to want to know and find out things using religious sources helps them understand life and the way it works.
I don't think skeptics could have their own religion what would they call it?