My son is severly autistic. I have done a lot of internet research on the subject, and after reading the book EVIDENCE OF HARM, by David Kirby, I have come to believe that vaccines caused the disease in my son. Up Up untill late 2002, Vaccines contained a preservative called Thirmerosal. Thirmerosal was 50% Mercury, which is a known Neurotoxin. IN 1989, The CDC (Center for Disease control) reccomended upping the vaccination schedule to twenty shots in the first two years of life. It had previously been three. IN 1999, they discovered that they wre injecting 5 times the amount of mercury in infants than what the FDA reccomended. A breakdown of the study shows that they used exposure over a two month time limit. This gave a false reading because most of the kids were given 4 shots in one day. This means that little babies were given 125 times more mercury than what was reccomended in federal guidelines! Taking the exposure out over two months is like measuring drunkeness by drinking a fifth of whisky over two months, when in truth, it was all drunk in a single night.
A group of concerned parents realized what was going on, most of them in the medical feild in some capacity. In their research, they found that thirmerosal had been around since the thirties(When the first case of autism showed up) and had never really been tested by the FDA. They also discovered that many of the people who have patents on certain drugs sit on the comittees that approve them! Here is an add from Usa Today summarized:
People often wonder why regulatory officials would
protect drug makers. In large part, because the CDC
and FDA policy decisions are made through advisory
panels whose members have financial relationships with
the same companies they are charged to regulate.
The decisions of the 300 experts who sit on the FDA\'s
18 advisory committees affect billions of dollars in
sales. The panel members play a crucial role in
determining what drugs will be approved and
participate in just about every major decision related
to industry regulation.
When it comes to vaccines, the large population in the
USA transforms into a lucrative customer base when our
government makes vaccines mandatory and keeps adding
more and more to the list.
Between 2003 and 2006, it was predicted that the
annual global market for vaccines would rise
from $6 billion to $10 billion, by Mark Benjamin
for United Press International on July 21, 2003.
Investors follow the decisions made by the advisory
panels closely. A favorable vote by a committee can
add hundreds of millions of dollars to a company\'s
stock value which also means the potential for
corruption in the panels is enormous.
In a July 18, 2000 hearing, Burton mentioned the
problem. \"We have a lot of doctors who serve on
Federal advisory committees who have serious
conflicts-of-interest problems. They?re allowed to
vote on vaccines made by companies that they get money
from.\"
An analysis conducted by USA Today, of 159 FDA
advisory committee meetings that took place between
January 1, 1998, and June 30, 2000, revealed conflicts
of interest were wide-spread:
At 92% of the meetings, at least one member had a
financial conflict of interest.
At least one committee member had a financial stake in
the topic under review at 146 of 159 advisory
committee meetings.
At 55% of meetings, half or more of the FDA advisers
had conflicts of interest.
At the 102 meetings dealing with the fate of a
specific drug, 33% of the experts had a financial
conflict.
We really need to reform the FDA. Are they protecting us or their money? I am not sure. There have been many studies linking and exhonerating Thimerosal. The studies that exhonerate it comes from......The drug companies! If anyone thinks that this is a cockamaini theory, they need to look at the homeland security bill of 2002. Someone took the parents claims seriosly and put a rider in the bill sheilding the vaccine manufacturers from liability. It has since been repealed, and put backin by Senate majority leader Bill Frist. Frist is a doctor with strong ties to the drug manufacturers. Stricken families have no recourse for compensation or justice.
The debate over Mercury and vaccines has made for some strange bedfellows. Republican Congressman Dan Burton has a grandson with autism, and it is rumored when he heard of the rider, he went to then majority leader Dick Army\'s office and the two of them got in a fistfight. Other poloticians on the ball include Ted KEnnedy, Deniss Kucinich, and John Mccain.
My wife tells me I am obssesing over this, that the damage has been done and there is nothing we can do. I disagree. I can\'t turn away. The thought of holding my baby down while they injected him with poison has kept me up ant night and given me nightmares. I swear I will never back down, I am gong to join an activist group and fight these pigs untill there is no breath left in my body. I can\'t believe I was a mindless sheep. If any of you have kids with ADHD or Autism, check into this, I beg you. The name of the Book is Evidence of Harm, and it has won a prize for investigative reporting. Here is a sight where youi can get more information. http://beatautism.18.forumer.com/index.php?
Full Version: Vaccines and Autism
Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums > News, Media & World Events > Conspiracies & Secret Societies
I am sure there are risks for vaccinations, but better that risk then the many diseases she(my daughter) could die from with out them. No sale.
Thank you for responding ot my post.
I only recieved 4 vaccinatins before the age of 5 and I am not dead. Now they give 4 in one day. But I think you missed my point, which was it was the Mercury in the vaccines that caused Autism. The Mercury has been removed from everything but the flu vaccines. The government has most definatly covered up the link between the mercury and autism and other disabilities.
Can you tell me why babies recieve a hep b shot on the day of birth, when Hepatitus is a STD?
QUOTE(Fate @ Aug 1 2006, 06:15 PM) [snapback]1291481[/snapback]
Thank you for responding ot my post.
I only recieved 4 vaccinatins before the age of 5 and I am not dead. Now they give 4 in one day. But I think you missed my point, which was it was the Mercury in the vaccines that caused Autism. The Mercury has been removed from everything but the flu vaccines. The government has most definatly covered up the link between the mercury and autism and other disabilities.
Can you tell me why babies recieve a hep b shot on the day of birth, when Hepatitus is a STD?
Hep can be picked up in other ways. I had to have one to work in the hospital.
Yes, there are aother ways to catch it, but they are rare. Wehn they were only giving 4 shots instead of 20, the rate of autism was one in 10000. Now it is one in 166. This is not new information, it is all over the net, and it is true and accurate.
Fate, I feel for you. My youngest son is autistic, although he never received any vaccinations whatsoever.
From what I have read, liver function is often compromised or not normal functioning in many autistic and ASD people. They cannot filter out heavy metals such as mercury. My son has the telltale spider veins on his cheeks that are a symptom of this (think alcoholic getting liver problems - red nose & cheeks - same thing here). Many of those with this issue are treated successfully with chelation therapy.
While I am not a militant anti-vaccine type, I applaud your efforts to take on the FDA. I don't trust them as far as I could spit.
From what I have read, liver function is often compromised or not normal functioning in many autistic and ASD people. They cannot filter out heavy metals such as mercury. My son has the telltale spider veins on his cheeks that are a symptom of this (think alcoholic getting liver problems - red nose & cheeks - same thing here). Many of those with this issue are treated successfully with chelation therapy.
While I am not a militant anti-vaccine type, I applaud your efforts to take on the FDA. I don't trust them as far as I could spit.
If you want someone to sign a petition to disband the FDA, I'm there, let me know, I'll drive to go sign it.
http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/chemicals/c...th_mercury.html
Autism:
A Unique Type of
Mercury Poisoning
http://www.vaccinationnews.com/DailyNews/J...eMercPoison.htm
Note the candida link to mercury poisoning...
http://ezinearticles.com/?Mercury,-Candida...eaction&id=
Cool and the Candida Autism link...
http://www.autism.org/candida.html
treatment?
http://finditmall.com/health/general/candida/c_treatment.htm
Quote:
# Iodine (potassium iodide solution) Iodine may be the best remedy to eliminate systemic yeast infections.
# Coconut Oil fatty acids in coconut oil have antifungal properties...will also kill Candida and other fungi
# pau d'arco (called taheebo or lapacho)
# propolis
# wormwood fights fungus and parasites
http://www.altcancer.com/lugols.htm
So assuming that the candida digests the mercury.. then can one eliminate it using one of the above treatments?
...would it then help with the autism and other effects of the mercury toxicity?
some think it may..
Autism:
A Unique Type of
Mercury Poisoning
http://www.vaccinationnews.com/DailyNews/J...eMercPoison.htm
Note the candida link to mercury poisoning...
http://ezinearticles.com/?Mercury,-Candida...eaction&id=
Cool and the Candida Autism link...
http://www.autism.org/candida.html
treatment?
http://finditmall.com/health/general/candida/c_treatment.htm
Quote:
# Iodine (potassium iodide solution) Iodine may be the best remedy to eliminate systemic yeast infections.
# Coconut Oil fatty acids in coconut oil have antifungal properties...will also kill Candida and other fungi
# pau d'arco (called taheebo or lapacho)
# propolis
# wormwood fights fungus and parasites
http://www.altcancer.com/lugols.htm
So assuming that the candida digests the mercury.. then can one eliminate it using one of the above treatments?
...would it then help with the autism and other effects of the mercury toxicity?
some think it may..
By your own admission, mercury has now been removed from most vaccines. Yet since then the rate of autism has still gone up. Why do you suppose that is? Is it possible that there is a different cause?
Babies are so fragile and to think of all the "medicine" given to them at such an early age how can anyone deny there is a link to autism. Our bodies that young can barely digest milk let alone support harsh vaccines. I am a big believer in not giving vaccines before the age of 5. Both my sons have not had vaccines and they still go to normal check ups. No problems what so ever with either of them. I did my research on vaccines before making the decision and I was not willing to chance a 1 in 200 of autism screw that!
We have survived thousands of years without vaccines and I for one feel they are dangerous to our kids. Read Jenny Mcarthy's experience she had with her son. She said he was a totally normal toddler until he had his 2 year shots. They gave him 4 vaccines at one time and she says it was like he lost his grasp of reality right in front of her eyes. Can you imagine going through that with your kid? I would feel guilty every day of my life knowing I could have stopped it.
We have survived thousands of years without vaccines and I for one feel they are dangerous to our kids. Read Jenny Mcarthy's experience she had with her son. She said he was a totally normal toddler until he had his 2 year shots. They gave him 4 vaccines at one time and she says it was like he lost his grasp of reality right in front of her eyes. Can you imagine going through that with your kid? I would feel guilty every day of my life knowing I could have stopped it.
QUOTE (frenat @ Jul 18 2008, 08:43 AM) 
By your own admission, mercury has now been removed from most vaccines. Yet since then the rate of autism has still gone up. Why do you suppose that is? Is it possible that there is a different cause?
If the autism rate went immediately way down it would prove without a doubt that the FDA had messed up and was systematically been bought off and allowed the poisening of our most loved and vulnerable. This could never be allowed. There would be an outcry for abolishement of said FDA and prosecution of those responsible perhaps- never mind the lawsuits!
So, to avoid this, all the conspirators would need to do is continue poisening a proportion of our children. This would not be hard to do for a covert team to taint childrens foodstuffs etc... or even the shots still being given. They say the mercury is now filtered out before distribution. You just need to trust the filters are working..
Protect your children- read all sides of the issue and manage your own childrens vaccine program. Don't be an uninformed sheep!
I know someone second hand who had claims her two healthy children both became autisitic almost immediately after getting there vaccines. She had noticed the timing of her first child and questioned it with her doctor at the time whoj said there is definately no link. Sooo a couple years later the second semingly perfect child went in and got her shots. What do ya know within a day her second baby was autisitic. DANG.
But don't worry they filter the mercury out now
QUOTE (Rock Slinger @ Jul 18 2008, 12:33 PM)
If the autism rate went immediately way down it would prove without a doubt that the FDA had messed up and was systematically been bought off and allowed the poisening of our most loved and vulnerable. This could never be allowed. There would be an outcry for abolishement of said FDA and prosecution of those responsible perhaps- never mind the lawsuits!
So, to avoid this, all the conspirators would need to do is continue poisening a proportion of our children. This would not be hard to do for a covert team to taint childrens foodstuffs etc... or even the shots still being given.
So, to avoid this, all the conspirators would need to do is continue poisening a proportion of our children. This would not be hard to do for a covert team to taint childrens foodstuffs etc... or even the shots still being given.
This is an example of how the conspiracy theorists scare themselves right off the cliff.
Many nations stopped using thimerisol in their vaccines several years before the U.S. did. Yet these nations show no decline in the instances of autism since their discontinuing the thimerisol. Do I need to point out that the FDA holds no sway in Europe and Asia?
QUOTE (Rock Slinger @ Jul 18 2008, 12:33 PM)
They say the mercury is now filtered out before distribution. You just need to trust the filters are working..
More absurdity. Thimerisol isn't "filtered out" of anything. It's simply no longer added to the vaccines as a preservative - likely dooming many children all over the world to extreme sickness and early death due to short shelf-lives of vaccines.
QUOTE (Rock Slinger @ Jul 18 2008, 12:33 PM)
I know someone second hand who had claims her two healthy children both became autisitic almost immediately after getting there vaccines. She had noticed the timing of her first child and questioned it with her doctor at the time whoj said there is definately no link. Sooo a couple years later the second semingly perfect child went in and got her shots. What do ya know within a day her second baby was autisitic. DANG.
Then you don't know much. I happen to know that no determination of autism can be made 'within a day."
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
Fate,
You have my profoundest sympathy, but you needn't feel as if you simply stood there while doctors "gave" your son autism. There's simply no evidence anywhere, anytime that thimerisol causes autism spectrum disorder.
I'm in the same boat with you, friend. Believe me when I tell you you've been misled.
Here's an article about it -with a quote:
From: "Mercury in vaccines as a cause of autism and autism spectrum disorders (ASDs): A failed hypothesis" by David Gorski
QUOTE
One of the most pernicious medical myths of recent years has been the claim, promulgated by a subgroup of parents of autistic children and facilitated by scientists of dubious repute, that somehow the mercury in the thimerosal (ethyl mercury) preservative used in common childhood vaccines in the U.S. until early 2002 causes autism. Although it had been percolating under the radar of most parents and scientists for several years before, this belief invaded the national zeitgeist in a big way in 2005, beginning with the publication of a book by journalist David Kirby entitled Evidence of Harm: Mercury in Vaccines and the Autism Epidemic: A Medical Controversy. The fires of hysteria were stoked even higher by Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., who published a truly twisted and misleading piece of pseudojournalism and pseudoscience published simultaneously in Rolling Stone and on Salon.com entitled Deadly Immunity. Relying primarily on quote-mining of the transcripts of both a conference held Atlanta by the CDC to discuss the question of whether autism is related to thimerosal in vaccines and an Institute of Medicine report on vaccines while simultaneously misrepresenting the results of two studies by Verstaeten et al to paint a false picture of a government coverup, RFK Jr. almost single-handedly managed to stoke fears that vaccines were causing an “epidemic of autism.”
I say “almost” single-handedly, because, unfortunately, he had help. Relying on the dubious research of a variety of investigators, such as the father-and-son team of Dr. Mark Geier and David Geier, whose prodigious output of badly designed studies emanating from a lab in their home in suburban Maryland, done using a rubberstamp institutional review board stacked with friends and cronies to approve the studies, and published for the most part in non-peer-reviewed journals, activists loudly insisted that mercury in vaccines was the cause of most autism. Others claiming to demonstrate this link include Boyd Haley, a chemist from the University of Kentucky, and a few other vocal scientists and advocates, who claim that autism is, in essence, mercury poisoning. Facilitating the dissemination of this message were reporters such as David Kirby, activists such as Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., and media personalities such as Don Imus. Indeed, some activists claimed that some vaccines were “poisoning” our children, even going so far as show photos of autistic children with the label “mercury-poisoned“ underneath them on placards held aloft at protest rallies. They made quite a splash then, and still do to a lesser extent even today. There’s just one problem.
The scientific data, taken in totality, do not support a link between mercury in vaccines and autism.
I say “almost” single-handedly, because, unfortunately, he had help. Relying on the dubious research of a variety of investigators, such as the father-and-son team of Dr. Mark Geier and David Geier, whose prodigious output of badly designed studies emanating from a lab in their home in suburban Maryland, done using a rubberstamp institutional review board stacked with friends and cronies to approve the studies, and published for the most part in non-peer-reviewed journals, activists loudly insisted that mercury in vaccines was the cause of most autism. Others claiming to demonstrate this link include Boyd Haley, a chemist from the University of Kentucky, and a few other vocal scientists and advocates, who claim that autism is, in essence, mercury poisoning. Facilitating the dissemination of this message were reporters such as David Kirby, activists such as Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., and media personalities such as Don Imus. Indeed, some activists claimed that some vaccines were “poisoning” our children, even going so far as show photos of autistic children with the label “mercury-poisoned“ underneath them on placards held aloft at protest rallies. They made quite a splash then, and still do to a lesser extent even today. There’s just one problem.
The scientific data, taken in totality, do not support a link between mercury in vaccines and autism.
Here's a link to the faulty, pre-rigged "study" by Geier and Geir mentioned above, if you're interested. Note that it is a PDF - you'll need acrobat to read it.
More from the Gorski article:
QUOTE
Quite simply, if the hypothesis is true and thimerosal-containing vaccines (TCVs) cause autism (or are even merely a significant contributing factor), we would expect that the removal of thimerosal from vaccines would lead to a rapid decrease in autism incidence and prevalence within 2-5 years.
There have now been several studies that examined this very hypothesis in countries that removed thimerosal from their vaccines before the U.S. did. For example Hviid et al3 reported that autism prevalence in Denmark increased from 1991 to 1996 despite the removal of thimerosal from vaccines, while Madsen et al4 looked at the time period from 1971 to 2000 and concluded that autism diagnoses continued to increase after thimerosal was removed from vaccines. Neither study supported a causal link between TCVs and autism, and they were a prominent part of the dataset that was used by the Institute of Medicine to conclude in 2004 that there was no good evidence to support a link between TCVs and autism. A more recent study by Eric Fombonne5 in Montreal examined 27,749 children born from 1987 to 1998 attending 55 different schools. Cumulative thimerosal exposure by age 2 years was calculated for the 1987-1998 birth cohorts. This exposure ranged from 100-125 μg from 1987 to 1991, 200-225 μg from 1992 to 1995, and then none after 1996, which was when thimerosal was completely removed from vaccines in Canada. The result was that autism, ASD, and pervasive developmental disorder diagnoses continued to increase in all periods, demonstrating no relationship between TCVs and autism or ASDs. Even more recently, a large study6 failed to support a relationship between thimerosal and adverse neurodevelopmental outcomes, a result that led one of the investigators in the study, Sallie Bernard, a proponent of the thimerosal hypothesis, to disavow the study in a case of sour grapes, because it did not show what she had hoped that it would show.
There have now been several studies that examined this very hypothesis in countries that removed thimerosal from their vaccines before the U.S. did. For example Hviid et al3 reported that autism prevalence in Denmark increased from 1991 to 1996 despite the removal of thimerosal from vaccines, while Madsen et al4 looked at the time period from 1971 to 2000 and concluded that autism diagnoses continued to increase after thimerosal was removed from vaccines. Neither study supported a causal link between TCVs and autism, and they were a prominent part of the dataset that was used by the Institute of Medicine to conclude in 2004 that there was no good evidence to support a link between TCVs and autism. A more recent study by Eric Fombonne5 in Montreal examined 27,749 children born from 1987 to 1998 attending 55 different schools. Cumulative thimerosal exposure by age 2 years was calculated for the 1987-1998 birth cohorts. This exposure ranged from 100-125 μg from 1987 to 1991, 200-225 μg from 1992 to 1995, and then none after 1996, which was when thimerosal was completely removed from vaccines in Canada. The result was that autism, ASD, and pervasive developmental disorder diagnoses continued to increase in all periods, demonstrating no relationship between TCVs and autism or ASDs. Even more recently, a large study6 failed to support a relationship between thimerosal and adverse neurodevelopmental outcomes, a result that led one of the investigators in the study, Sallie Bernard, a proponent of the thimerosal hypothesis, to disavow the study in a case of sour grapes, because it did not show what she had hoped that it would show.
My emphases.
Harte
QUOTE (Harte @ Jul 18 2008, 08:01 PM)
This is an example of how the conspiracy theorists scare themselves right off the cliff.
Many nations stopped using thimerisol in their vaccines several years before the U.S. did. Yet these nations show no decline in the instances of autism since their discontinuing the thimerisol. Do I need to point out that the FDA holds no sway in Europe and Asia?
More absurdity. Thimerisol isn't "filtered out" of anything. It's simply no longer added to the vaccines as a preservative - likely dooming many children all over the world to extreme sickness and early death due to short shelf-lives of vaccines.
Then you don't know much. I happen to know that no determination of autism can be made 'within a day."
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
Fate,
You have my profoundest sympathy, but you needn't feel as if you simply stood there while doctors "gave" your son autism. There's simply no evidence anywhere, anytime that thimerisol causes autism spectrum disorder.
I'm in the same boat with you, friend. Believe me when I tell you you've been misled.
Here's an article about it -with a quote:
From: "Mercury in vaccines as a cause of autism and autism spectrum disorders (ASDs): A failed hypothesis" by David Gorski
Here's a link to the faulty, pre-rigged "study" by Geier and Geir mentioned above, if you're interested. Note that it is a PDF - you'll need acrobat to read it.
More from the Gorski article:
My emphases.
Harte
Many nations stopped using thimerisol in their vaccines several years before the U.S. did. Yet these nations show no decline in the instances of autism since their discontinuing the thimerisol. Do I need to point out that the FDA holds no sway in Europe and Asia?
More absurdity. Thimerisol isn't "filtered out" of anything. It's simply no longer added to the vaccines as a preservative - likely dooming many children all over the world to extreme sickness and early death due to short shelf-lives of vaccines.
Then you don't know much. I happen to know that no determination of autism can be made 'within a day."
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
Fate,
You have my profoundest sympathy, but you needn't feel as if you simply stood there while doctors "gave" your son autism. There's simply no evidence anywhere, anytime that thimerisol causes autism spectrum disorder.
I'm in the same boat with you, friend. Believe me when I tell you you've been misled.
Here's an article about it -with a quote:
From: "Mercury in vaccines as a cause of autism and autism spectrum disorders (ASDs): A failed hypothesis" by David Gorski
Here's a link to the faulty, pre-rigged "study" by Geier and Geir mentioned above, if you're interested. Note that it is a PDF - you'll need acrobat to read it.
More from the Gorski article:
My emphases.
Harte
Do you have children HArte?
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 11:23 AM)
Do you have children HArte?
Uhm, from Harte's post:
QUOTE
Then you don't know much. I happen to know that no determination of autism can be made 'within a day."
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
Cheers,
Badeskov
QUOTE (ericraven2003 @ Aug 1 2006, 07:04 PM)
I am sure there are risks for vaccinations, but better that risk then the many diseases she(my daughter) could die from with out them. No sale.
This all hinges on one of the most ill-understood and most-abused techniques in CT nuttery: correlation does not equal causation.
--Jaylemurph
Along with Harte, I have read so many other stories of UM members with autistic children and my heart goes out to them all. Two of my older grandchildren were given this vaccine before the mercury headlines hit, but my daughter refused to let her two younger ones get it...Fortunately none of them had any problems.. The studies are so pro and con and I can't really say if this is the cause of autism. What bothers me though is the thought that perhaps this could trigger it. I have also read stories on the internet where two children in the same family were autistic, one had received the shot and one didn't...
Jayle you really need to stop posting your trash about CT nuttery. I do not think this topic has anything to do with a conspiracy. This is a cut and dry topic of if you believe vaccines are harmful or not. You and Harte posting this stuff is really frustrating to say the least.
My pediatrician has become a friend on mine over the last 3 years of taking my sons into see him. We even go to dinner with our wives. I believe everything he has told me to be true. I asked him about the vaccines and he said he thinks they are not needed and pose a big risk in the childs neuralogical function. Neither of his two kids have had vaccines and he feels that parents should not be pressured with it at all. He also told me how to fill out the forms with the state so my children would be able to attend school with out them.
Why would he lie? He gives vaccines to kids every day and he said he feels guilty every time he does it. So I don't care how many links you post or have many articles to quote I am taking the advice from the horses mouth! If there is a chance of 1-200 for autism I damn sure will not risk it with my kids!
My pediatrician has become a friend on mine over the last 3 years of taking my sons into see him. We even go to dinner with our wives. I believe everything he has told me to be true. I asked him about the vaccines and he said he thinks they are not needed and pose a big risk in the childs neuralogical function. Neither of his two kids have had vaccines and he feels that parents should not be pressured with it at all. He also told me how to fill out the forms with the state so my children would be able to attend school with out them.
Why would he lie? He gives vaccines to kids every day and he said he feels guilty every time he does it. So I don't care how many links you post or have many articles to quote I am taking the advice from the horses mouth! If there is a chance of 1-200 for autism I damn sure will not risk it with my kids!
Not needed? Sure, if you don't mind your children getting polio, whooping cough, or the measles. Each of which also carries a risk of death. Each of which were considered eradicated in the US years ago but are now coming back because of increased numbers of children not getting vaccinated. This is a step backwards not forwards.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/he...ne/4273262.html
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/he...ne/4273262.html
QUOTE (frenat @ Jul 18 2008, 11:44 PM)
Not needed? Sure, if you don't mind your children getting polio, whooping cough, or the measles. Each of which also carries a risk of death. Each of which were considered eradicated in the US years ago but are now coming back because of increased numbers of children not getting vaccinated. This is a step backwards not forwards.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/he...ne/4273262.html
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/he...ne/4273262.html
I love popular mechanics for a source because I honestly believe that magazine is bought and paid for by you know who.
Guess how many cases of the whooping cough, polio and measles were reported in 2007 in America?
Whooping- 1222 cases (half of those are suppose to be falsely reported in 3 states do to a new test system that reported positive incorrectly. FYI if the whooping cough is contracted they have antibiotics for this that will cure the cough in 2 weeks. Only deadly if left un-treated I will take my chances...
Measles- 42 ouch
Polio- 20 big ouch
Popular Mechanics is full of ****.
It could be caused by many different factors. I've also seen studies that suggest autism is caused from a type of food allergy reaction: link
Changing diet is worth a try just to see if it helps. I'm trying it to see if it helps my sons tourette's. For me, I felt it was worth the risk to vaccinate my son. I don't want him ending up with a life threatening disease and it being my fault. We may enjoy the luxury in the western world of the effects of vaccines, to the point where some do not even have to vaccinate. But there are many places in the world where these diseases are still prevalant. America will be one of those places if more and more people continue to refuse to vaccinate.
There has also been studies that show signs of autism in utero, and genetic causes, so I wouldn't just go on one theory. Are these studies in any peer reviewed journals or just this one guy's book?
Changing diet is worth a try just to see if it helps. I'm trying it to see if it helps my sons tourette's. For me, I felt it was worth the risk to vaccinate my son. I don't want him ending up with a life threatening disease and it being my fault. We may enjoy the luxury in the western world of the effects of vaccines, to the point where some do not even have to vaccinate. But there are many places in the world where these diseases are still prevalant. America will be one of those places if more and more people continue to refuse to vaccinate.
There has also been studies that show signs of autism in utero, and genetic causes, so I wouldn't just go on one theory. Are these studies in any peer reviewed journals or just this one guy's book?
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 07:14 PM)
I love popular mechanics for a source because I honestly believe that magazine is bought and paid for by you know who.
Guess how many cases of the whooping cough, polio and measles were reported in 2007 in America?
Whooping- 1222 cases (half of those are suppose to be falsely reported in 3 states do to a new test system that reported positive incorrectly. FYI if the whooping cough is contracted they have antibiotics for this that will cure the cough in 2 weeks. Only deadly if left un-treated I will take my chances...
Measles- 42 ouch
Polio- 20 big ouch
Popular Mechanics is full of ****.
Guess how many cases of the whooping cough, polio and measles were reported in 2007 in America?
Whooping- 1222 cases (half of those are suppose to be falsely reported in 3 states do to a new test system that reported positive incorrectly. FYI if the whooping cough is contracted they have antibiotics for this that will cure the cough in 2 weeks. Only deadly if left un-treated I will take my chances...
Measles- 42 ouch
Polio- 20 big ouch
Popular Mechanics is full of ****.
Does it matter how many? No. Did I claim there were many? No. Did Popular Mechanics claim there were many? No. The point is there were some. And this is a disease that was supposed to be eradicated.
Did Popular Mechanics claim anything that couldn't be backed up? No. So your claim about them being bought and paid for really doesn't apply.
QUOTE (315 @ Jul 19 2008, 12:21 AM)
It could be caused by many different factors. I've also seen studies that suggest autism is caused from a type of food allergy reaction: link
Changing diet is worth a try just to see if it helps. I'm trying it to see if it helps my sons tourette's. For me, I felt it was worth the risk to vaccinate my son. I don't want him ending up with a life threatening disease and it being my fault. We may enjoy the luxury in the western world of the effects of vaccines, to the point where some do not even have to vaccinate. But there are many places in the world where these diseases are still prevalant. America will be one of those places if more and more people continue to refuse to vaccinate.
There has also been studies that show signs of autism in utero, and genetic causes, so I wouldn't just go on one theory. Are these studies in any peer reviewed journals or just this one guy's book?
Changing diet is worth a try just to see if it helps. I'm trying it to see if it helps my sons tourette's. For me, I felt it was worth the risk to vaccinate my son. I don't want him ending up with a life threatening disease and it being my fault. We may enjoy the luxury in the western world of the effects of vaccines, to the point where some do not even have to vaccinate. But there are many places in the world where these diseases are still prevalant. America will be one of those places if more and more people continue to refuse to vaccinate.
There has also been studies that show signs of autism in utero, and genetic causes, so I wouldn't just go on one theory. Are these studies in any peer reviewed journals or just this one guy's book?
On a neuralogical level I would hope that the food we eat could not produce such results as autism. Now depression, bi-polar disorder, ADD and ADHD that is a different story.
QUOTE (frenat @ Jul 19 2008, 12:33 AM)
Does it matter how many? No. Did I claim there were many? No. Did Popular Mechanics claim there were many? No. The point is there were some. And this is a disease that was supposed to be eradicated.
Did Popular Mechanics claim anything that couldn't be backed up? No. So your claim about them being bought and paid for really doesn't apply.
Did Popular Mechanics claim anything that couldn't be backed up? No. So your claim about them being bought and paid for really doesn't apply.
In 2007 there were 32,671 cases of autism diagnosed in America with children under the age of 5.
The numbers do matter and if I was a betting man I would take the lower percentage bet for my kids.
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 07:14 PM)
I love popular mechanics for a source because I honestly believe that magazine is bought and paid for by you know who.
Guess how many cases of the whooping cough, polio and measles were reported in 2007 in America?
Whooping- 1222 cases (half of those are suppose to be falsely reported in 3 states do to a new test system that reported positive incorrectly. FYI if the whooping cough is contracted they have antibiotics for this that will cure the cough in 2 weeks. Only deadly if left un-treated I will take my chances...
Measles- 42 ouch
Polio- 20 big ouch
Popular Mechanics is full of ****.
Guess how many cases of the whooping cough, polio and measles were reported in 2007 in America?
Whooping- 1222 cases (half of those are suppose to be falsely reported in 3 states do to a new test system that reported positive incorrectly. FYI if the whooping cough is contracted they have antibiotics for this that will cure the cough in 2 weeks. Only deadly if left un-treated I will take my chances...
Measles- 42 ouch
Polio- 20 big ouch
Popular Mechanics is full of ****.
According to the CDC measels is still a leading cause of preventable illness and death worldwide link. The reason it isn't so prevalant in the states is because we make vaccinations mandatory.
As far as polio goes, you are reaping the benefits of those vaccinations right now. Where would we be without the polio vaccine? As long as a single child in the world remains infected every child in the world who is unvaccinated is at risk. Accordings to the World health Organization between 2003-2005 25 previously polio-free countries were reinfected due to importations. link
Pertussis is a very dangers disease with a high mortality rate. Most deaths occur among unvaccinate children, deaths which were completely preventable. In the U.S epidemics of whooping cough occur every 3-5 years, so the rates may have been low in 2007, but could be dangerously high next year. link You are playing russian rhoulette with your child's life when you do not vaccinate. I would rather have an autistic child than a dead one.
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 07:40 PM)
In 2007 there were 32,671 cases of autism diagnosed in America with children under the age of 5.
The numbers do matter and if I was a betting man I would take the lower percentage bet for my kids.
The numbers do matter and if I was a betting man I would take the lower percentage bet for my kids.
Well, since as previously said (and mentioned in the PM article which admit it, you didn't even read it did you?) the numbers of autism have gone up since thimerisol was removed from vaccines so it is wrong to blaim it on them anyway. So now your bet as well as your claim about PM are invalid.
You're not just betting for your kids anyway. Some vaccines are not 100 percent effective. Diseases do not spread easily though because large numbers of people are vaccinated. When more people choose not to vaccinate it not only puts them at risk but potentially others that have been vaccinated as well.
QUOTE (315 @ Jul 19 2008, 12:43 AM)
According to the CDC measels is still a leading cause of preventable illness and death worldwide link. The reason it isn't so prevalant in the states is because we make vaccinations mandatory.
As far as polio goes, you are reaping the benefits of those vaccinations right now. Where would we be without the polio vaccine? As long as a single child in the world remains infected every child in the world who is unvaccinated is at risk. Accordings to the World health Organization between 2003-2005 25 previously polio-free countries were reinfected due to importations. link
Pertussis is a very dangers disease with a high mortality rate. Most deaths occur among unvaccinate children, deaths which were completely preventable. In the U.S epidemics of whooping cough occur every 3-5 years, so the rates may have been low in 2007, but could be dangerously high next year. link You are playing russian rhoulette with your child's life when you do not vaccinate. I would rather have an autistic child than a dead one.
As far as polio goes, you are reaping the benefits of those vaccinations right now. Where would we be without the polio vaccine? As long as a single child in the world remains infected every child in the world who is unvaccinated is at risk. Accordings to the World health Organization between 2003-2005 25 previously polio-free countries were reinfected due to importations. link
Pertussis is a very dangers disease with a high mortality rate. Most deaths occur among unvaccinate children, deaths which were completely preventable. In the U.S epidemics of whooping cough occur every 3-5 years, so the rates may have been low in 2007, but could be dangerously high next year. link You are playing russian rhoulette with your child's life when you do not vaccinate. I would rather have an autistic child than a dead one.
It is a small risk and a very small risk. I think with a 1 in 150 chance of getting autism you are the one playing roulette. Any one with an autistic kid would take the shots back in a heartbeat if they thought they had any thing to do with there kids mental handicap. An autistic kid will require assisted help their whole life. I have met many autistic kids and it is a very painful handicap to deal with.
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 07:57 PM)
It is a small risk and a very small risk. I think with a 1 in 150 chance of getting autism you are the one playing roulette. Any one with an autistic kid would take the shots back in a heartbeat if they thought they had any thing to do with there kids mental handicap. An autistic kid will require assisted help their whole life. I have met many autistic kids and it is a very painful handicap to deal with.
They don't know that vaccinations caused autism so there is most definitly not a 1 in 150 chance. How do you explain children who have no been vaccinated with autism? Autism has been around a lot longer than vaccinations. They used to call them "idiot savants." I know, it's horrible to call them that, but it's what they did. So, not only are you going to have a child with special needs on your hands, but one who is at risk for a host of deadly diseases and putting others at risk. Frankly, I don't think they should be allowed in public schools or daycares. They already are not allowed to travel over seas, and for good reason. There are superstitious cultures world wide that would rather chop off their children's arms then vaccinate them.
studies have found no relationship between MMR vaccine and autism. For example, researchers in the UK studied the records of 498 children with autism born between 1979 and 1998. They found:
The percentage of children with autism who received MMR vaccine was the same as the percentage of unaffected children in the region who received MMR vaccine.
There was no difference in the age of diagnosis of autism in vaccinated and unvaccinated children.
The onset of "regressive" symptoms of autism did not occur within 2, 4, or 6 months of receiving the MMR vaccine. link
How can you explain that the precentage of cases of autism are the same between vaccinate and unvaccinate children? It's obviously not a contributing factor, and you are putting your child more at risk by not vaccinating.
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 06:07 PM)
Jayle you really need to stop posting your trash about CT nuttery. I do not think this topic has anything to do with a conspiracy. This is a cut and dry topic of if you believe vaccines are harmful or not. You and Harte posting this stuff is really frustrating to say the least.
You really need to understand that just because you don't /like/ a post, that it doesn't deserve to be posted. As usual, I'll say: if you think it's that much of a problem, quit bootlessly complaining (and dragging the thread off-track), press the "Report" button and talk to a mod. If you really, really need to complain about it to me, PM me.
I probably won't read it, but it will be better than publicly going on about it.
--Jaylemurph
QUOTE (Fate @ Aug 1 2006, 04:45 PM)
My son is severly autistic. I have done a lot of internet research on the subject, and after reading the book EVIDENCE OF HARM, by David Kirby, I have come to believe that vaccines caused the disease in my son. Up Up untill late 2002, Vaccines contained a preservative called Thirmerosal. Thirmerosal was 50% Mercury, which is a known Neurotoxin. IN 1989, The CDC (Center for Disease control) reccomended upping the vaccination schedule to twenty shots in the first two years of life. It had previously been three. IN 1999, they discovered that they wre injecting 5 times the amount of mercury in infants than what the FDA reccomended. A breakdown of the study shows that they used exposure over a two month time limit. This gave a false reading because most of the kids were given 4 shots in one day. This means that little babies were given 125 times more mercury than what was reccomended in federal guidelines! Taking the exposure out over two months is like measuring drunkeness by drinking a fifth of whisky over two months, when in truth, it was all drunk in a single night.
A group of concerned parents realized what was going on, most of them in the medical feild in some capacity. In their research, they found that thirmerosal had been around since the thirties(When the first case of autism showed up) and had never really been tested by the FDA. They also discovered that many of the people who have patents on certain drugs sit on the comittees that approve them! Here is an add from Usa Today summarized:
People often wonder why regulatory officials would
protect drug makers. In large part, because the CDC
and FDA policy decisions are made through advisory
panels whose members have financial relationships with
the same companies they are charged to regulate.
The decisions of the 300 experts who sit on the FDA\'s
18 advisory committees affect billions of dollars in
sales. The panel members play a crucial role in
determining what drugs will be approved and
participate in just about every major decision related
to industry regulation.
When it comes to vaccines, the large population in the
USA transforms into a lucrative customer base when our
government makes vaccines mandatory and keeps adding
more and more to the list.
Between 2003 and 2006, it was predicted that the
annual global market for vaccines would rise
from $6 billion to $10 billion, by Mark Benjamin
for United Press International on July 21, 2003.
Investors follow the decisions made by the advisory
panels closely. A favorable vote by a committee can
add hundreds of millions of dollars to a company\'s
stock value which also means the potential for
corruption in the panels is enormous.
In a July 18, 2000 hearing, Burton mentioned the
problem. \"We have a lot of doctors who serve on
Federal advisory committees who have serious
conflicts-of-interest problems. They?re allowed to
vote on vaccines made by companies that they get money
from.\"
An analysis conducted by USA Today, of 159 FDA
advisory committee meetings that took place between
January 1, 1998, and June 30, 2000, revealed conflicts
of interest were wide-spread:
At 92% of the meetings, at least one member had a
financial conflict of interest.
At least one committee member had a financial stake in
the topic under review at 146 of 159 advisory
committee meetings.
At 55% of meetings, half or more of the FDA advisers
had conflicts of interest.
At the 102 meetings dealing with the fate of a
specific drug, 33% of the experts had a financial
conflict.
We really need to reform the FDA. Are they protecting us or their money? I am not sure. There have been many studies linking and exhonerating Thimerosal. The studies that exhonerate it comes from......The drug companies! If anyone thinks that this is a cockamaini theory, they need to look at the homeland security bill of 2002. Someone took the parents claims seriosly and put a rider in the bill sheilding the vaccine manufacturers from liability. It has since been repealed, and put backin by Senate majority leader Bill Frist. Frist is a doctor with strong ties to the drug manufacturers. Stricken families have no recourse for compensation or justice.
The debate over Mercury and vaccines has made for some strange bedfellows. Republican Congressman Dan Burton has a grandson with autism, and it is rumored when he heard of the rider, he went to then majority leader Dick Army\'s office and the two of them got in a fistfight. Other poloticians on the ball include Ted KEnnedy, Deniss Kucinich, and John Mccain.
My wife tells me I am obssesing over this, that the damage has been done and there is nothing we can do. I disagree. I can\'t turn away. The thought of holding my baby down while they injected him with poison has kept me up ant night and given me nightmares. I swear I will never back down, I am gong to join an activist group and fight these pigs untill there is no breath left in my body. I can\'t believe I was a mindless sheep. If any of you have kids with ADHD or Autism, check into this, I beg you. The name of the Book is Evidence of Harm, and it has won a prize for investigative reporting. Here is a sight where youi can get more information. http://beatautism.18.forumer.com/index.php?
Thank you so much I am behind you on this and I have been since Jenny McCarthy started writing about it, like you I am gathering information and believe their is a connection my son has ADDA group of concerned parents realized what was going on, most of them in the medical feild in some capacity. In their research, they found that thirmerosal had been around since the thirties(When the first case of autism showed up) and had never really been tested by the FDA. They also discovered that many of the people who have patents on certain drugs sit on the comittees that approve them! Here is an add from Usa Today summarized:
People often wonder why regulatory officials would
protect drug makers. In large part, because the CDC
and FDA policy decisions are made through advisory
panels whose members have financial relationships with
the same companies they are charged to regulate.
The decisions of the 300 experts who sit on the FDA\'s
18 advisory committees affect billions of dollars in
sales. The panel members play a crucial role in
determining what drugs will be approved and
participate in just about every major decision related
to industry regulation.
When it comes to vaccines, the large population in the
USA transforms into a lucrative customer base when our
government makes vaccines mandatory and keeps adding
more and more to the list.
Between 2003 and 2006, it was predicted that the
annual global market for vaccines would rise
from $6 billion to $10 billion, by Mark Benjamin
for United Press International on July 21, 2003.
Investors follow the decisions made by the advisory
panels closely. A favorable vote by a committee can
add hundreds of millions of dollars to a company\'s
stock value which also means the potential for
corruption in the panels is enormous.
In a July 18, 2000 hearing, Burton mentioned the
problem. \"We have a lot of doctors who serve on
Federal advisory committees who have serious
conflicts-of-interest problems. They?re allowed to
vote on vaccines made by companies that they get money
from.\"
An analysis conducted by USA Today, of 159 FDA
advisory committee meetings that took place between
January 1, 1998, and June 30, 2000, revealed conflicts
of interest were wide-spread:
At 92% of the meetings, at least one member had a
financial conflict of interest.
At least one committee member had a financial stake in
the topic under review at 146 of 159 advisory
committee meetings.
At 55% of meetings, half or more of the FDA advisers
had conflicts of interest.
At the 102 meetings dealing with the fate of a
specific drug, 33% of the experts had a financial
conflict.
We really need to reform the FDA. Are they protecting us or their money? I am not sure. There have been many studies linking and exhonerating Thimerosal. The studies that exhonerate it comes from......The drug companies! If anyone thinks that this is a cockamaini theory, they need to look at the homeland security bill of 2002. Someone took the parents claims seriosly and put a rider in the bill sheilding the vaccine manufacturers from liability. It has since been repealed, and put backin by Senate majority leader Bill Frist. Frist is a doctor with strong ties to the drug manufacturers. Stricken families have no recourse for compensation or justice.
The debate over Mercury and vaccines has made for some strange bedfellows. Republican Congressman Dan Burton has a grandson with autism, and it is rumored when he heard of the rider, he went to then majority leader Dick Army\'s office and the two of them got in a fistfight. Other poloticians on the ball include Ted KEnnedy, Deniss Kucinich, and John Mccain.
My wife tells me I am obssesing over this, that the damage has been done and there is nothing we can do. I disagree. I can\'t turn away. The thought of holding my baby down while they injected him with poison has kept me up ant night and given me nightmares. I swear I will never back down, I am gong to join an activist group and fight these pigs untill there is no breath left in my body. I can\'t believe I was a mindless sheep. If any of you have kids with ADHD or Autism, check into this, I beg you. The name of the Book is Evidence of Harm, and it has won a prize for investigative reporting. Here is a sight where youi can get more information. http://beatautism.18.forumer.com/index.php?
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jul 19 2008, 01:10 AM)
You really need to understand that just because you don't /like/ a post, that it doesn't deserve to be posted. As usual, I'll say: if you think it's that much of a problem, quit bootlessly complaining (and dragging the thread off-track), press the "Report" button and talk to a mod. If you really, really need to complain about it to me, PM me.
I probably won't read it, but it will be better than publicly going on about it.
--Jaylemurph
your post does not need to be reported I am just telling you I am tired of your closed minded bull crap.
I probably won't read it, but it will be better than publicly going on about it.
--Jaylemurph
Sorry about your kid.
By the way I have zero vaccinations and I dont have smallpox so lets reassess the risk factor...
EDIT: I had whooping cough...aint no thang tho
By the way I have zero vaccinations and I dont have smallpox so lets reassess the risk factor...
EDIT: I had whooping cough...aint no thang tho
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 11:08 PM)
your post does not need to be reported I am just telling you I am tired of your closed minded bull crap.
*pats your head
And I your whining at being confronted with different views.
--Jaylemurph
QUOTE (MindFire @ Jul 18 2008, 11:43 PM)
Sorry about your kid.
By the way I have zero vaccinations and I dont have smallpox so lets reassess the risk factor...
EDIT: I had whooping cough...aint no thang tho
By the way I have zero vaccinations and I dont have smallpox so lets reassess the risk factor...
EDIT: I had whooping cough...aint no thang tho
You are only one person, hardly a credible example of the risk factors associated with not being vaccinated. Besides, smallpox vaccinations are not mandatory and not normally given because they can cause serious reactions in people with eczema and other risk factors.
QUOTE (315 @ Jul 19 2008, 09:57 AM)
You are only one person, hardly a credible example of the risk factors associated with not being vaccinated. Besides, smallpox vaccinations are not mandatory and not normally given because they can cause serious reactions in people with eczema and other risk factors.
That, and unlike other diseases, smallpox was eradicated worldwide not just nationwide.
QUOTE (Harte @ Jul 18 2008, 03:01 PM)
This is an example of how the conspiracy theorists scare themselves right off the cliff.
Many nations stopped using thimerisol in their vaccines several years before the U.S. did. Yet these nations show no decline in the instances of autism since their discontinuing the thimerisol. Do I need to point out that the FDA holds no sway in Europe and Asia?
More absurdity. Thimerisol isn't "filtered out" of anything. It's simply no longer added to the vaccines as a preservative - likely dooming many children all over the world to extreme sickness and early death due to short shelf-lives of vaccines.
Then you don't know much. I happen to know that no determination of autism can be made 'within a day."
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
Fate,
You have my profoundest sympathy, but you needn't feel as if you simply stood there while doctors "gave" your son autism. There's simply no evidence anywhere, anytime that thimerisol causes autism spectrum disorder.
I'm in the same boat with you, friend. Believe me when I tell you you've been misled.
Here's an article about it -with a quote:
From: "Mercury in vaccines as a cause of autism and autism spectrum disorders (ASDs): A failed hypothesis" by David Gorski
Here's a link to the faulty, pre-rigged "study" by Geier and Geir mentioned above, if you're interested. Note that it is a PDF - you'll need acrobat to read it.
More from the Gorski article:
My emphases.
Harte
Many nations stopped using thimerisol in their vaccines several years before the U.S. did. Yet these nations show no decline in the instances of autism since their discontinuing the thimerisol. Do I need to point out that the FDA holds no sway in Europe and Asia?
More absurdity. Thimerisol isn't "filtered out" of anything. It's simply no longer added to the vaccines as a preservative - likely dooming many children all over the world to extreme sickness and early death due to short shelf-lives of vaccines.
Then you don't know much. I happen to know that no determination of autism can be made 'within a day."
I know this from my own experience - my nine year old son is autistic. If anyone has researched this topic, I have.
Fate,
You have my profoundest sympathy, but you needn't feel as if you simply stood there while doctors "gave" your son autism. There's simply no evidence anywhere, anytime that thimerisol causes autism spectrum disorder.
I'm in the same boat with you, friend. Believe me when I tell you you've been misled.
Here's an article about it -with a quote:
From: "Mercury in vaccines as a cause of autism and autism spectrum disorders (ASDs): A failed hypothesis" by David Gorski
Here's a link to the faulty, pre-rigged "study" by Geier and Geir mentioned above, if you're interested. Note that it is a PDF - you'll need acrobat to read it.
More from the Gorski article:
My emphases.
Harte
Thanks Harte,
Great reply. I was admittedly just adding gasoline to the fire to see if the firetrucks would actually show up for this one. I do not believe a covert team is poisening our children to cover up but it did get you to step up case pretty quickly. I am sorry about your kid and anyones kid having autism. I am sure your passion runs deep for this topic and I applaud your research and your reply to my comparible nonsense. Yours is the kind of response I was hoping for.
For I also am worried about my babies next few sets of shots and am glad for your reply. It is scary- and there are two sides of the story.
QUOTE (MindFire @ Jul 19 2008, 04:43 AM)
I had whooping cough...aint no thang tho
Tell that to the parents of children who die from it:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/07/18/...ain515617.shtml
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 05:07 PM)
Jayle you really need to stop posting your trash about CT nuttery. I do not think this topic has anything to do with a conspiracy. This is a cut and dry topic of if you believe vaccines are harmful or not. You and Harte posting this stuff is really frustrating to say the least.
Enigma,
My mention of what you refer to here as "CT nuttery" was in response to the following post by Rock Slinger:
QUOTE (Rock Slinger @ Jul 18 2008, 12:33 PM)
If the autism rate went immediately way down it would prove without a doubt that the FDA had messed up and was systematically been bought off and allowed the poisening of our most loved and vulnerable. This could never be allowed. There would be an outcry for abolishement of said FDA and prosecution of those responsible perhaps- never mind the lawsuits!
So, to avoid this, all the conspirators would need to do is continue poisening a proportion of our children.
So, to avoid this, all the conspirators would need to do is continue poisening a proportion of our children.
I take it, then, that you agree with Rock Slinger that the US Government is poisoning a predermined fraction of our nation's youth as a means of protecting the FDA?
QUOTE (Enigma wrapped in a puzzle @ Jul 18 2008, 05:07 PM)
My pediatrician has become a friend on mine over the last 3 years of taking my sons into see him. We even go to dinner with our wives. I believe everything he has told me to be true. I asked him about the vaccines and he said he thinks they are not needed and pose a big risk in the childs neuralogical function. Neither of his two kids have had vaccines and he feels that parents should not be pressured with it at all. He also told me how to fill out the forms with the state so my children would be able to attend school with out them.
This is a seperate issue, with seperate justifications.
I am (was) not against removing thimerisol from vaccines. I am, however, against pseudoscience and the misleading tactics used by the practitioners of such.
Thimerisol in vaccines, it is today undeniable, did not cause the increase in the diagnoses of Autism Spectrum Disorder that that fool RFK junior jumped on with both feet - merely to establish himself as a contrarian (an urge I readily admit my own affinity for!)
To your point, there are many risks associated with vaccines. If previous citizens had not taken these risks, you might not even be here today to make your argument. However, in my opinion, that in no way means that you must accept the same responsibility that they did. It, to me, should remain a personal decision.
Of couse, in the long run, those that opt for no vaccine will eventually become extinct. Not necessarily you or your family, but eventually.
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jul 18 2008, 02:31 PM)
This all hinges on one of the most ill-understood and most-abused techniques in CT nuttery: correlation does not equal causation.
--Jaylemurph
--Jaylemurph
Jayle,
This reminds me of an example - examine the characteristics of the percentage of the US population with severe back pain. A large correlation will exist between the people with back pain and the people having at least one US denomination of coin in their pocket.
From this, we can determine that carrying coins causes severe back pain.
For the record, I have two kids. My son Sam is 9, my daughter Libby is 10.
Harte
QUOTE (Rock Slinger @ Jul 19 2008, 09:20 AM)
Thanks Harte,
Great reply. I was admittedly just adding gasoline to the fire to see if the firetrucks would actually show up for this one. I do not believe a covert team is poisening our children to cover up but it did get you to step up case pretty quickly. I am sorry about your kid and anyones kid having autism. I am sure your passion runs deep for this topic and I applaud your research and your reply to my comparible nonsense. Yours is the kind of response I was hoping for.
For I also am worried about my babies next few sets of shots and am glad for your reply. It is scary- and there are two sides of the story.
Great reply. I was admittedly just adding gasoline to the fire to see if the firetrucks would actually show up for this one. I do not believe a covert team is poisening our children to cover up but it did get you to step up case pretty quickly. I am sorry about your kid and anyones kid having autism. I am sure your passion runs deep for this topic and I applaud your research and your reply to my comparible nonsense. Yours is the kind of response I was hoping for.
For I also am worried about my babies next few sets of shots and am glad for your reply. It is scary- and there are two sides of the story.
You are welcome Rock.
Glad to know there is one less tinfoil hat-wearing Chicken Little out there than I had previously thought!
Also, good luck to your babies. And, please, take my advice: enjoy them while you can. They'll be moved away and not calling before you know it!
Harte
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.