Poetic Reven
Aug 8 2006, 04:14 AM
I've been asking myself this for a long time. I have taken the notion, that since light travels in waves, someday we could make it go AROUND things. So, the question is, if light is going around something, would that object be dark, like a shadow effect, clear (see thru) since there is no light to both reflect and deflect, so in sense there is no shadow, or would it seem to glow? And I'm talkin about the entire light source being re-routed, not just a small portion.
Mr Walker
Aug 8 2006, 05:05 AM
In the absence of light, there is darkness!
Poetic Reven
Aug 8 2006, 05:11 AM
QUOTE(Mr Walker @ Aug 8 2006, 12:05 AM) [snapback]1299065[/snapback]
In the absence of light, there is darkness!
Who said the light was gone?
I said it was
REDIRECTED.
ROGER
Aug 8 2006, 05:13 AM
Light is a Charged Ion that travels in a straight line.
Mr Walker
Aug 8 2006, 05:27 AM
If the light is redirected (and you mentioned ALL the light) then it has gone from the area you redirected it from, to wherever you directed it to. Unless you provide/or there is available, another source of light to the original space?, there will be an absence of light. Ergo darkness. If there is another light source available, it rather defeats the purpose of the execise.
Startraveler
Aug 8 2006, 05:44 AM
QUOTE
Light is a Charged Ion that travels in a straight line.
Light (visible or otherwise) will be emitted by an accelerating charge but light itself doesn't have a charge.
Poetic Reven
Aug 8 2006, 05:47 AM
So what evryone is trying to tell me that there would just be a big void of nothing where evr the light is bending? (I think thats right)
Startraveler
Aug 8 2006, 05:56 AM
As Mr. Walker said, if all the light that would fall on the object is deflected somehow then you won't see that object. The exact result depends on what kind of setup you're picturing. If no light is sent toward your eye then you'll see darkness. If you're in a position such that the light is bent around the object and is directed at you, then you'll see the light source; however, the position at which you think the light source lies will not be its true position. As an example of this, light is bent by gravitational fields. To test how big this effect is (and verify a theory of Einstein's that predicted the correct amount) some astronomers observed some stars from Africa during a solar eclipse in 1919 to see how far they appeared to be from the spot the astronomers knew they actually were. The light from those stars was bent a little bit as it passed through the sun's gravitational field so it appeared as if it was coming from a slightly different direction.
Poetic Reven
Aug 8 2006, 06:06 AM
QUOTE(Startraveler @ Aug 8 2006, 12:56 AM) [snapback]1299127[/snapback]
As Mr. Walker said, if all the light that would fall on the object is deflected somehow then you won't see that object. The exact result depends on what kind of setup you're picturing. If no light is sent toward your eye then you'll see darkness. If you're in a position such that the light is bent around the object and is directed at you, then you'll see the light source; however, the position at which you think the light source lies will not be its true position. As an example of this, light is bent by gravitational fields. To test how big this effect is (and verify a theory of Einstein's that predicted the correct amount) some astronomers observed some stars from Africa during a solar eclipse in 1919 to see how far they appeared to be from the spot the astronomers knew they actually were. The light from those stars was bent a little bit as it passed through the sun's gravitational field so it appeared as if it was coming from a slightly different direction.
Whoo... I think I get the concept now. If the light bends around something, that you know for a fact is there, it really isnt "there" but slightly off in a diferent location.
Mr Walker
Aug 10 2006, 01:38 AM
Na! I think the object is still there. You just can't see it. Imagine its night time and you are walking through a forest with a torch. Straight in front of you the torch beam illuminates a tree. You keep walking . Suddenly, some cosmic jester decides to bend the light from your torch around the tree. You can still see the light, but the tree is no longer visible. If you keep on walking into the black space in front of you, Crash! If you were someone on the other side of the tree walking towards the person with the flashlight you might not even notice the dark spot that would normal be created by the tree blocking out the light, because you would still be seeing the torch light ( if it bent round the tree and then back on its original path.) so you would go Crash! into the tree as well. Two victims for the price of one.
Poetic Reven
Aug 10 2006, 08:56 AM
QUOTE(Mr Walker @ Aug 9 2006, 08:38 PM) [snapback]1301723[/snapback]
Na! I think the object is still there. You just can't see it. Imagine its night time and you are walking through a forest with a torch. Straight in front of you the torch beam illuminates a tree. You keep walking . Suddenly, some cosmic jester decides to bend the light from your torch around the tree. You can still see the light, but the tree is no longer visible. If you keep on walking into the black space in front of you, Crash! If you were someone on the other side of the tree walking towards the person with the flashlight you might not even notice the dark spot that would normal be created by the tree blocking out the light, because you would still be seeing the torch light ( if it bent round the tree and then back on its original path.) so you would go Crash! into the tree as well. Two victims for the price of one.
So you can't see it?
DaveyHolyhead
Aug 10 2006, 03:14 PM
QUOTE(ROGER @ Aug 8 2006, 06:13 AM) [snapback]1299071[/snapback]
Light is a Charged Ion that travels in a straight line.
BurnSide
Aug 10 2006, 03:24 PM
I would theorize that if light was to be literally 'bent' around an object, what you would see would perhaps be something simmilar to a heat shimmer on a road. You would see the light itself bending around the object, but the light would not fall on the object itself and as such that object would appear invisible, you would see the light behind it, and around it, but not on it.
However, i'm no scientist and i'm pretty sure that there are people who have posted whose theories are far better than mine.
artymoon
Aug 10 2006, 03:24 PM
QUOTE(Arbiter22 @ Aug 10 2006, 04:56 AM) [snapback]1302074[/snapback]
So you can't see it?
No. How can you 'see' something without light?
Poetic Reven
Aug 10 2006, 03:48 PM
QUOTE(artymoon @ Aug 10 2006, 10:24 AM) [snapback]1302355[/snapback]
No. How can you 'see' something without light?
Again, who said it wasnt there? Im saying its
BENT and burnsides analogy seems like the most plausable.
Poetic Reven
Aug 10 2006, 04:00 PM
Here! I know, I suck at art. But it shows what I am tryin to say. The light is around the tree, but not totally absent from it.[attachmentid=27484]
artymoon
Aug 10 2006, 04:16 PM
QUOTE(Arbiter22 @ Aug 10 2006, 11:48 AM) [snapback]1302381[/snapback]
Again, who said it wasnt there? Im saying its BENT and burnsides analogy seems like the most plausable.
I meant, how can you see the tree with no light on it? You know its there, the only thing to see would be the point at which the light was bent, and make a prediction that the tree is at that spot. Anyway, how are you going to bend the light around the tree?
Startraveler
Aug 10 2006, 04:27 PM
QUOTE
Anyway, how are you going to bend the light around the tree?
Maybe like
this.
Poetic Reven
Aug 10 2006, 04:36 PM
QUOTE(Startraveler @ Aug 10 2006, 11:27 AM) [snapback]1302419[/snapback]
AHA!!! So I was righ! Booya! I knew that there couldnt be a shadow, theres no light to make one.
I feel happy.
artymoon
Aug 10 2006, 04:46 PM
QUOTE(Startraveler @ Aug 10 2006, 12:27 PM) [snapback]1302419[/snapback]
There's a lot of 'ifs' and 'maybes' in there, but you got to start somewhere I suppose.
artymoon
Aug 10 2006, 04:50 PM
QUOTE(Arbiter22 @ Aug 10 2006, 12:36 PM) [snapback]1302429[/snapback]
AHA!!! So I was righ! Booya bit**s! I knew that there couldnt be a shadow, theres no light to make one.
I feel happy.

Whether or not there would still be a void there. You technically couldn't see through it, but around it. I think there would be visible distortion.
Harte
Aug 10 2006, 07:30 PM
Google "gravitational lens" to see some actual pictures of things that you can't see.....eeerrrmm, so to speak.
Harte
donrobison
Aug 10 2006, 08:07 PM
Yes it would be invisible. I solved this problem before and posted it on this forum. At least the mathematical and physical aspect of it is solved, and If you really care I can send it to you. The material aspect of the question is out of my field of expertise. The solution involves creating a sphere with a certain refraction rate gradient. Anything inside the hollow of the sphere will not be seen, because all light will be redirected around it, then sent back along its original trajectory.
Poetic Reven
Aug 10 2006, 08:10 PM
QUOTE(donrobison @ Aug 10 2006, 03:07 PM) [snapback]1302706[/snapback]
Yes it would be invisible. I solved this problem before and posted it on this forum. At least the mathematical and physical aspect of it is solved, and If you really care I can send it to you. The material aspect of the question is out of my field of expertise. The solution involves creating a sphere with a certain refraction rate gradient. Anything inside the hollow of the sphere will not be seen, because all light will be redirected around it, then sent back along its original trajectory.
Yes, please send it to me. I would be most greatful
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