Just a couple questions/concerns.. I need to forewarn everyone, that I don't know much about religion...

My first concern is this... I kind of feel helpless about religion at time. What is the difference between an everyday sinner.. lets say random lies, hating people at times, just small things and a murderer/killer. Is there different layers of hell? Or are both going to the same place? Seems kind of unfair, b/c if I'm going to be an everyday sinner, I would rather live it up and be an ultimate sinner..... not really, but you get my point.

Also, don't the full blown christians have it made? Even if all of the bible isn't real, they are still all pure people and they will all go where we go... even the bible is right, they get paradise and us normal sinners get a lake of fire? Damn that sucks... It feels like a lose/lose to me... if you are really good and go by the bible (wich I think is very hard to do, I feel like I could not have any fun, I was raised to be the way I am, like binge drink when I want to, make small lies, cuss and make jokes about people, etc... so if I went by the bible, I think my life wouldn't be fun) then you will live a 'boring' life and go to heaven (or where all the 'bad guys' go, if the bible isn't true) but if I lived by the bible and I end up going where everyoen else goes, I would be irrate, b/c I wouldn't of got to have fun. If I don't go by the bible and the bible IS true, then I'm going to live my life in a lake of fire for eternity, but I spent my life having fun, which obviously means nothing, b/c eternity is forever

I know there are some confusing parts in that paragraph above, bear w/ me

Christianity is not the only religion. Some of us believe in religions that don't have hell and lakes of fire. In my religion you are here to learn and when you mess up you return to learn some more. When you learn what you need to learn you move onwards and upwards. My Gods and Goddesses are kind and loving teachers.

Sorry, I didn't intentionally mean to sound so one sided, I guess this question is for the christians or just the confused...

You know, I don't binge drink, (I get drunk once in a while but not to extreme.) tell lies, make jokes about people and my life is anything but boring. Why do you fell you need to do these things to have fun? All you really have to do is respect yourself and others and you will live a honorable life.

I don't feel like I need to do these things to have fun, they are part of my everyday life (which I enjoy might I add)... If I went by the bible I couldn't do those things is all I'm saying... I do respect myself and others, what made you jump to these conclusions?

As far as christianity would have it, nope, sinners are sinners and we are all one of them. Whether or not you are sorry and have asked forgiveness is another. I would be a damn hipocrit if I tried to instruct you, so I will say you would be best to listen to darkwind. Investigate alternatives to Christianity, or at least the conservative protestant side of it.

I'd like to know where it says, "Thous shalt not binge drink." I mean, if you've got a lot of water and Jesus handy you can drink all you want.
A good deal of things that are proclaimed taboo by protestant christians aren't condemned in the Bible.

And I couldn't deal with mormonism.. not just because of the "other" things they practice, but their abstaining from coffee would drive me to Starbucks after three hours (and i don't even want to pay that kind of money for a cuppa... )

No one is completely pure. Everyone sins it just human nature. That is why Jesus died on the cross for us. It also states in the bible “he without sin cast the first stone. No one can cast that stone because we are all sinners. Really it’s all about having a relationship with god. I’m not perfect I am a sinner. The thing is learning from our mistakes and asking for forgiveness. We must remember that god is a forgiving god. We are his children and he only wants what’s best for us. Just because you are not prefect does not mean you are going to hell.

Thanks for the reply, I think you may be the first to actually reply to me seriously

I still wonder about the degree of a sinner though, someone did say "a sinner is a sinner"... Something doesn't sound right to me, I know I'm a good hearted person, but I do sin according to the bible. I don't think I'm going to hell, but I know if I read the bible, it would scare me into thinking so.

It sounds to me like your consciousness is on the right track. The difference between right and wrong are the foundations to your belief system. Good foundations are what you need when living in such a confused and sometimes illogical world.

My thoughts of you would be to continue with your questions and look at how others relate to the scriptures, listen to how they interpret what you are questioning and try to find ‘your’ middle ground on the subjects that are inspiring you.

When you are able to see the foundations on which others stand you can consider their position in life with more empathy. that’s a good position once you find it.

Keep on keeping on….

Ciao….

Wow, thanks a lot, I actually find this reply very helpful.

I have been a born again Christian most of my life so I will try to clear up some of this for you according to my beliefs. My sign in name is not referring to God or hell it refers to ghosts and spirits and alot of the crap that is on these forums. The simple answer to you is that if you are truely a God fearing Christian you will not be the guy out there killing, raping etc. I have sinned plenty and continue everyday. Not proud of it but it's who we are. "For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God" But that is what Jesus died on the cross for. To pay for all of the sins man has and will commit. So, someone that goes out and murders and rapes does not have much of a conscious and most likely will never be truely sorry for what they have done and ask God for forgiveness because he is truely sorry. Mostly they will ask because they are scared of what is going to happen to them once they have time to think about it (sitting in jail). But I can understand your confusion. Religion is a complicated thing that NO ONE fully understands and God will explain himself and his ways when we get to heaven. But one thing you should understand is that you WILL NOT get to heaven unless you ask God for forgiveness of all your sins and ask Jesus Christ to come into your heart and save you from your sins. "For no man cometh unto the father but by me". If you sin after that you are still saved. You cannot become unsaved no matter what you do. and before anyone says it No, even if you murder someone and like I said, a person that was truely saved would not do that so save your breath. No people, keep in mind that I said at the beginning, "according to my beliefs" if you do not agree thats fine but I would prefer not to be bashed for trying to help this guy out.

Mans new found knowledge allowed him to see the law in a different light than his Creator because of our perspective as earth bound and mortal. We tend look at sin/wrong doings as gradients. One sin is greater than another. But God sees all sin as equally abhorrent and therefore not acceptable in His house (heaven). Just as we have the right to tell people that comes into our house to remove their shoes first. It is not a question as to whether we agree with the rules. If your house guest refused to remove his shoes and stood at your door arguing the point you would be inclined to close the door in his face.
The result would be much the same, a separation between visitor and guest. That separation between man and God is what we refer to as hell.
It is very simple really, either you believe or you don’t.
Like the analogy of the house guest being asked to remove his shoes I would comply without question as I have bigger questions to ask over dinner.
Whether we as humans agree or not the ultimate truth is He created us and the law.
And If He brought us into existence He certainly has every right to take us out of it! We could argue this is not fair from our perspective. But who ever said life was fair? Why does the Creator of life have to be reasonable? Perhaps His reasoning is different then ours because of His perspective.

Irish

very well said Irish

The only thing I think is unfair is to expect us to go by the rules of the bible, I might be unclear on this, but if you sin, you aren't welcome into his house? Everyone sins am I right?

God just wants you to acknowledge the fact that you are a sinner and ask for forgiveness for your sins. He sent his son to be crucified on a cross. It was a brutal turtore. He did that for us and didnt have to and to try to not sin and live a good life is not to much to ask after what he gave for us.

You are right that no man could possibly follow all the laws laid out in the old Testament and earn his place in heaven. But God found a way around the law and made His son that legal loophole that no one should be turned away if they truly want to be re-united with the Creator.
Irish

Let’s not forget god is a loving god. I like to look at it this way. When you were a child and did something wrong. Your parents would punish you for your wrong doing.
Tell you to think about why it was wrong. Why you should never do it again. Later on you go to your parent and tell them you understand. That you are true sorry for what you did. It’s really the same if you think about it. God is our father, we are his children. He knows that we are going to make mistakes. If we ask for forgiveness and know that what we have done is wrong. That we have learned from our mistakes. He will forgive us of our wrong doing. Sometime other religious people as you talk about do make it hard for people like you. Because, you are more worried about going to hell. Instead, of having a relationship with god don’t think anyone can abide by all the laws in the bible all the time. God knows this that is why we are given the chance to be forgiven because he is a loving god and he loves his children. When talking about who goes to hell, it is not our place to judge god judges who is welcomed into heaven and who goes to hell. I guess my opinion would be for instant as was mention before murders, rapist and pedophiles. Unless they have a change of heart and except god as there father and truly ask for forgiveness for what they have done. Then yes I do believe people like that will go to hell.

For me god sits on the fence.

Which side of the fence you are on is up to you. The morality of man is found through reason and understanding the consequences of your actions, I think, is what you must achieve.

To feel guilty means you can also feel forgiveness. Learn to forgive yourself for your indiscretions and you will understand what it is to forgive. Once you achieve this I think compassion is but a breath away.

The balance between the physical and the metaphysical is similar to the balance between your conscious mind and your subconscious mind.

The bible is nothing more than words, the words of god are to be found deep within and if you seek then you shall find.

To sin against the bible means you are commit to the bible, if you sin against man then you are committed to man, if you sin against god then you are committed to god.

The laws of god are simple, the laws of man are complexed, the laws of religion use both gods law and mans and results in confusion.

Decide who’s law you would live by, my advice, keep it simple and you go too far wrong in life.

Once your consciousness accepts the laws of compassion god is but a breath away.

Remember there are two sides to the fence just don’t wonder too far from it and you wont go too far wrong.

Ciao…

First of all being a Christian is not boring at all. If you think murdering and killing all your life is "fun" then there's a problem isn't there. However if you think living right is boring then maybe you try and find out what being a Christian is REALLY about.

Everyone sins, if you are a Christian you will stilll sin. God will expect you to still sin however he does not want you to do it and do it knowing you can be forgiven. He wants you to do it. Realize it was wrong then ask him for forgiveness.

A sinner is a sinner because God does not see different sins. To him a liar and a murderer are one in the same, sinner. THe sin doesn't matter what matters is the fact that you sinned.

God does not expect us to be perfect. he expects us to sin. That's why he sent Jesus to die so that when we do sin we have something to turn us back on the right track.

I'd like to add my 2 cents on this.

Being a Christian is EXCITING!!!! No need to elaborate. Anyone with a close relationship with God and living as an ACTIVE CHRISTIAN, knows it is a very exciting life!

right it is very exciting.

I wrote this for a different thread but maybe an understanding of what exactly sin is in Gods eye's is needed here as well.

Man looks at sin as gradients of right and wrong and feels each sin to have a separate punishment depending on the severity of violation.

God sees all sin as all equal and wrong and all having the same punishment.

To understand the Christian idea of sin you could look at sin as mud on your boots you will have a better understanding of the concept.
God says you can not come into His home with muddy boots and asks you to remove them before entering.
Now the problem is no man can afford the cost of the cleaner required to remove the mud. So God provided that cleaner at His cost, that being His only son Jesus. He offers us the cleaner at no charge should we wish to accept it and gain entrance into eternity (heaven). So we either accept the offer or take the chance of cleaning them ourselves in the very slim hope that we can do a good enough job. Or we can turn our backs on eternity and walk away into oblivion (hell).
Many view this gift as a charity and it is their egos that prevent them from accepting handouts.

Irish

Why in the world would someone send their own son to die for other peoples supposed sins. People say well God send jesus to die because he LOVES us so much. I can just picture it God is looking down at the people thinking how naughty we are for thinking impure thoughts or doing something he did not want us to do, so he goes I KNOW i will send my son down to die..yeah that's what i'll do that will make them see the error of their ways. So poor jesus gets crucified and dies then god is there thinking what a great job i did they better send me a MUG saying worlds greatest dad because that's what i am for sending my own son to die a horrible death.

I misworded my first post, I didn't mean that christians lead a boring life, I meant I feel like my life would be boring if I tried to lead that life. I've learned a few things though, I don't go to church, but I know I'm a good person, I just wonder if that is enough...

Being a good person is , alone, not enough to get to heaven.

That is kind of what this whole post is about..... I don't understand why its not.

Why would you want to go to a place that seems to have high standards for you to join. If you are truly a good person cant you be happy with just knowing that you are a good person. Heaven seems like a special club where only the select with the proper dress code can go in.

Yeah, but its hard not to think about, b/c it is eternity.

if you are that concerned about it, go talk to a priest. They should be able to answer any questions you have far better than anyone here.

It depends how you define heaven. If you particularly want the christian heaven you can't get in on good works, but being a good man is certainly a good start. The only other requirement is accepting jesus as your saviour. Really accepting him will get you into at least some of the christian variants of heaven if you are truly a good man. Personally, I believe there is room in the christian section of heaven for good men who have never heard of jesus and for young children who can't even understand the concept, but not everyone is with me on this.
If you are happy to enter the non christian section of heaven (or whatever this section may be known as), then being a good man is again a very healthy start. You will need to work out what some of the other universal precepts for entry are. For example truly loving yourself, loving others as your self, and then doing to others as you would have them do unto you. There are probably more, like genuine faith in a supreme being, but as I said check it out.
All of the above is meant in complete seriousness, but the best news of all is that if you qualify for entry to any of these heavens, your life on earth is much more likely to reflect a heavenly existence in one form or other.
To specifically reply to the author of this thread. Its not the binge drinking you are doing, its whether you are hurting your self or other people by this or other things you do. (if you love yourself or others you will chose not to do harm). I think you knew this when you posed the question. All our choices have consequences, in this life or the next. If you are consciously harming yourself or others, and don't at least make an attempt to end/minimise this harm you are not likely to have a very pleasant life in this or any other world. In the long term that is pretty much one of life's universal rules.

it's not because only the blood of Christ can outweigh sin. More damage is done through sin than good is done through a good deed.

Good answer.
And as you continue to question, look to many different interpretations of the scriptures, from sources you trust and respect as wise. Don't be satisfied with any one person's view. We humans can put alot of our own baggage into what we think the meanings are. The scriptures interpret themselves, as you cross-reference and keep asking questions, you'll see what God wants you to learn and relate it to your life in a gentle, loving, non-condemning, personal way. I started getting to know God by reading the chapter of John, because starting at the beginning of the Bible was too confusing.

I have not read the bible yet, but I am going to start soon. The older I get, the more I feel like I can read it with an open mind. Being told to read it as a child is a bad idea imo. I'm actually excited to read it. Even if I end up thinking it is fake, I think it will be worth it. I am going into reading it kind of thinking that, but its ok, I know by the end I'll figure it out. Thanks for all the help everyone, I do appreciate it.

Here's a tip, whenever you read one verse read the others around it to understand. Also if you read something and it seems odd read it again and again sometimes you don't get it at first glance.

Another tip -- get yourself a NIV Study Bible. It'll make it A LOT easier to understand.

Thanks for the tips guys ^.^