2:30 in the morning.. I was just woken up with a spider landing on my face..

I guess. ;p


I can just as easily have said. "YES! I don't let traditional opinions and morals cloud my views of such thing and look at them from the scientific viewpoint!! That and I have my gay guy harem! Much love to the gay man!"

But.. I didn't want to go over the top and into the realm of sleep deprived silliness.. so I went with "I guess"

X)

People take celebrities way to seriously. Celebrities aren't anymore important then anybody else in the world. It's Elton John! It's not the Pope or Steven Hawkings!

It's sad actually...people will listen to celebrities but not people who actually know what their talking about.

I quite like Eltons music but this I feel is a bit silly.


He wants to end intolerance, censorship and the like through...

Intolerance, Censorship and the like.

Not the most intelligent move ever made by Sir Elton

EDIT: Though I must say that I respect him greatly for the work he has done towards equal rights for homosexuals.

Yeah, it's sad... But I do think that practices that breed hate in religion should be banned if ever possible. Keep the religion if you must, edit the Bible. The religious can fear the consequences of not being hateful to gays if they like.

At least, that would be ideal. But you can't ban free speech so you can't ban hateful teachings in the bible.

A great example of crystal clear thinking.

HA! I'm not always right. Though my feline pride thanks you. XD

I'm not bashing you for your views.. for your personal opinions. However, the diesire to edjamicate someone on the scientific why's is there. People use that procreation reasoning all the time. Well.. there are people out there who procreate.. and it's all fine and dandy. However, if *EVERYONE* was to procreate.. we'd be having some serious issues on a global scale. Africa and China are two of the examples of what to many humans can do to the ecosystem. They can't feed everyone and the whole thing goes crashing down.

Which is why China now has that one child only law going on.

And it's not just homosexuality that is a possible population trigger. There are straight people out there (like me) who just.. have no desire to have children. Yet for somereason... it's alright because I'll have sex with a guy. So that whole procreation idea isn't.. exactly fool proof. I mean, I'd be moraly wrong to just for not wanting to have children...

Thats exactly how it works,,which is really sad.

What do i think of homosexuals? This is exactly what i think of them in my own opinion and views...

A) Homosexuality isnt natural.

Homosexuals tell me "But there are Homosexual animals - so it IS natural"...My only reply to that is...Some animals eat their fescies....Should we do that too? Because its natural/animals do it? If homosexual were natural we, as a human race would be able to continute on/ carry on passed 1 generation but we cant. If we were all gay we would live 1 generation and all die off within 100 years!!

I personally had a homosexual guy playing straight with me at a club a few weeks ago - waited till i got really drunk and almost sexually abused me. It was disgusting! I wont try to get detailed but he was attempting to give me hand action....

As people though many homosexuals are just great people. So im not going to deny that. What they do is entirely their business and i never interfere but my personal opinion is that what they are doing is not natural...It may FEEL natural to them - but their actions are not natural...I wish them all the luck in the world but i dont like them trying to tell me things that simply are not true - like being gay is natural and i hate how they brag about straight people breeders when if it wasnt for their "breeding" parents they wouldnt even exist!
I try to look at it from their perspective and its difficult but i never shun them or look down on them.

The only way to increase tolerance and compassion is to actually practice it. You don't need any religious or spiritual framework to do it either.

People spend way too much time complaining about how other people are playing the game (See I just did it myself).

It IS natural, there may be specific animals which would eat fecies but I think that that would be a more species-wide trait. There are animals of all species that show gay tendencies.

If you wanted to, could you force yourself to find a man attractive? No, you couldn't. From what I'm told, that is what it's like being. It's not a choice, because you know what you naturally like. There's people who hate being gay and wish they could choose to be straight but just can't. Then there's people who like it. But I think to say to them that it is not natural is just plain ignorant, wouldnt they know better than you? That's not trying to see it from their view, it's letting beliefs get mangled with reality.

Venomshocker, I pray you've a fire retardant suit!

Ok, one quick thing to add as well: ramster83 your reasons for stating homosexual as unnatural are invalid. Someone says that homosexuality is natural because animals do it, then you rebut that animal also each their own waste. Should we eat our own waste? Not all animals are homosexual, not all animal each their own waste, and not all people are homosexual. Why do some animals eat their own waste? It feels natural to them. Why do some people practice homosexuality? It feels natural to them. Do all animals eat their own waste? No. Do all people practice homosexuality? No.

It isn’t a requirement for all people to be homosexual, just as it isn’t a requirement for all animals to eat their own waste. They do it because it comes natural to them, just as homosexuals are homosexual because it comes natural to them. It’s not like we’re trying to force you to be gay. If you don’t want to do it, don’t.



Oh and here is a story for you. A friend of mine is a lesbian and it is also out. At a party a guy, straight, decided to wait until she was drunk and then tried to get her to sleep with him (he was aware she was a homosexual). He left with his face covered in punch. He went a little beyond what one would consider ‘friendly male attention’ and tried to engage her in ‘hand action’ (I don’t think you need to details). Gay or straight, some men (surely not all) can still be pigs.

Kelvena. Please note im not trying to be rude at all so i hope you see my response from a different angle or perspective. My reason for stating homosexual behavious as un-natural IS valid...Some animals eat their crap because of the vitamins - its a good source of vitamins for them apparently. 2 men or women engaging in a sexual act? Pleasurable maybe- but beyond pleasure what does it do for the human race? 2 things...If we were all gay humanity would be wiped out in 1 generation (100 years if were lucky) and two...It is also a decent contributer to AIDS. People being gay isnt a problem with me - yet people trying to convince me being gay is something extravegant or natural isnt right to me at all. If you are gay great- live your life but dont come and tell me "Oh its natural" - "your homophobic" because i dont support what they do. It doesnt take a rocket scientist to realize male and female genitals connect like a perfect puzzle where as with 2 males or females theres always a certain "piece" missing. Be gay and heck be proud of who you are - but dont tell me its a natural thing...If it were natural we'd be able to be gay and pro-create.

So, I'm assuming sex for any reason other than for procreation is unnatural as well, correct?

I'm sorry, but how exactly does homosexuality prevent procreation?

Procreation is the fertilisation of a egg by a sperm. Homosexuality does not prevent this happening, procreation can still take place (ever heard of artificial insemination?)

Casual sexual activity between male and female would be virtually nonexistent if the entire population was homosexual, but procreation would still be able to take place.

Edited to wonder: Why are we discussing homosexuality? Granted this is the context in which the banning of religion was brought up but it's not relevant to whether or not religion should be banned is it?

While it's true.. sometimes two women in love will have artifical insemination. (Wait... that *IS* unnatural... why arn't people up in arms for all artificial insemination....) is not exactly population control. However not every lesbian couple do this. And actually most adopt.

Though, not many homosexual male couples get artificialy inseminated now do they? ;P Two males do not a baby make. Unless they donate their sperm. However that again goes into the bounds of unnatural with insemination.


I love how people against homosexuality go to extreams. "OMGS! If we were all gay... our species would die out!!" Uhm, last I checked... not every human was gay. And actually homosexuality has been around long before humans had encrouched to every corner of the globe, and we still managed to hit major population crashes in some areas. Most impart because of religion.. and other because of science. (humans were not ment to have litters!! Yet thanks to fertility drugs.. which is also *not* natural... a few people end up with octuplets...)

To say that if every human was gay is kind of ludicrous. Simply because that won't happen. And if it does.. science would make sure the human race got along. Because science is weird like that.

If you don't want to bother reading the entire article, breif summary:

Elton John knows nothing about religeon.

If some think religion is dysfunctional then they have the right to their opinion.
If some think homosexuality is dysfunctional then they have the right to their opinion.

What neither side has a right to is to harass and force their opinions on others, and demand that a government enforce their particular set of opinions about life.

Someone should perhaps start the Institute of Minding Your Own Business where they can research and plan volutary intervention programs for people who are obsessed with forcing everyone in the world to think and behave like they themselves do, and whom have decided they need to change after getting the crap beat out of them for mouthing off once too often.

i'm down with that.

I was dating a woman who was bi who had a partner who was gay. We all got a long fine, for a while, but it ended recently, which was ok with me because I couldn't keep up them anyway. Believe it or not I am kind of a nutty bastard and can be hard to get along with; they were the ones who ended it. The gay one was never that comfortable with me because she was gay and wasn't that interested in men, but she accepted me as a person. I knew that and I was ok with it cause that was what she was, and I loved her for who she was. She wasn't going to change because that was how she was wired.

From my experience being gay doesn't seem to be a matter of choice. If it is as you say ramster unnatural then why are some brains wired gay. In nature I find there is usually a reason for things being the way they are. Maybe someday we will understand, so in the mean time we can be more understanding and accepting.

Bella, when we refuse to understand we place limits on our ability to love/grow, i will repeat that when we insist on limiting our understandings you limit your ability to love/grow, love is about letting one be who they decide they are, that was jesus's message how you love/grow your brother is how you will love/grow yourself, you can only recieve love in the way you give love.... there is great wisdom in that.........The question would be why would you choose to limit your ability to grow what purpose does it serve for you ???? its an expression of jealous conditional stagnation... Relgion has taught that love is about limits and need , it is in error...

I'm probably just parroting what's already been said here by smarter people than I, but the whole "If everyone was gay, humanity would die out!" argument is a complete failure. If you let people who were born gay, be gay, without feeling shunned and hated, it would NOT make everyone gay! In fact, it would probably greatly help humanity, as a form of population control.

never is a going over the same ground not worth a million trys thanks for sharing this

I agree if we would just allow one to be who they are we would grow in kindness, love and understanding in magnitudes many can't fathom at this point...Only good would come from it..


Dark great story of exceptance...

So what, you're basically saying that all a partner is for is sex?

And being Gay is a natural thing, just because you are unwilling to accept it doesn't change the fact that it is. Humans are also an animal, just with more complex thought patterns. Other animals as far as we know don't think consciously about love, and still end up gay which shows that it is natural.

And there is a disease that causes the eating of feces. It's called coprophilia, and will cause some of the people who have it to eat feces.

I think you're correct, IF the religion is harmless. If they're teaching hate, I don't think it's completely fair to say that it's wrong to try and stop them from doing so.

And they are teaching hate.. Look back to that Israel gay parade thing, people were planning on killing and throwing apples with razors in them at the people who were going to march in the parade. There was torching of cars, etc.. even before the parade to protest it even happening.

blame blame blame

the abrahamics do teach hatred, limitations and intolerance and superiority ect for about the millionth time...The things that divide us need to be let go of, division and diversity are often confused...such as ones decsion to be gay how absurd we have to decide if this is okay, we in our extrodinary immaturity have created in a society almost insurmountable limitations as one needing to deny who he/she is for exceptance or be subject to a life of unspeakable horrors and this is what relgion wants us to do.... saying this is what this gOd wants,I find that unreasonable to demand/command that humanity should do this...Well it has and it has become not very nice in its expression....We have to hav a police force to handle us .....

Yes, it's very sad just how much we humans try to tell others who they should be. I personally think that religion plays a big role in that in today's world because it gives us an ego problem. It says that this is how everyone should be, and I your God demand it. The people see it, then they start to demand it. We constantly are bringing out the monster that exists inside of us because we see ourselves fit to judge others for their worth based on simply who they are as a person.

What ever happened to "Judge not lest you be judged." One verse that would actually help all this intolerance if it were put into practice.

And note: I only am against religion when it causes problems. If people keep their beliefs to themselves, and if their beliefs do not cause them to commit crimes and to have hate, then religion is not a problem. It's when they do these things that we need to take serious looks at what religions are teaching.

You cant stop religion. You cant stop people from being gay. If we could just get rid of the hate. Possible? Probably not thats to bad because the world has much more bigger problems then these 2 things that we should be focused on.

Indeed the monstrousity of religion, It can't agree on anything , agreement and compromise or the art of diplomacy isn't even part of the mix, its a tyrants rule, fear is the ace in the hole....... For every limitation there will be a fear, Or "there are many mansions in my fathers house". may be another one useful if applyed.....

What do you see as the most prominent issue? The war on terror maybe? A million dead Iraqi civilians? Hundreds of billions in increased deficits because of the war? What do you think causes a man to run into a building and blow himself to nothing these days?

Religion.

As far as we know, the war is against terrorists and there are real enemies. Now I'm not saying I know what the government is keeping from us, bet we know that terrorism does have a major role in it. And as I said before, terrorism is the product of religion in almost every case today.

A war on terror , interesting we are fighting our own creations.....How about solving killing with killing, what surprises me is so many don't see this isn't solving anything , it has become a means to survival , we have become dependent on conflict it is fueling the firess of capitalism almost soley....We are making money off of killing now in large part.... ....Humanity has not grown in awareness but has grown in ways to hurt itself.....a very lethal combination...We are putting matches into childrens hands and wondering why we are getting hurt....hmmm?????something to ponder....

Marvin, why did you ever leave us?

Can we please just stop with all the Vietnam era feel goodies....

This isn't the VietCong...and I personally don't give a rats hiney what Elton has to say...

...as far as Hollywood goes...as far as musicians go...if they wear their politics on their sleeves I cast them into the fire heap...

...but Elton is different...he could say bad things about my Mama and I would still like him.

Who, me?

Guess beer and posting don't go together so well.

Sleep time....

It's funny how we tell entertainers they can't have a say in things worldly.. like they're just dumb atomitons... Yet here we sit bickering about the same issues, and no one tells us to shut up.

They are people like us. They are entitled to opinions like us. If you don't like being told to shut up and do your job only, and form no opinion about anything, I'd bet anything you'd be against that.

You can dissagree with their opinions.. like people can disagree with yours. However, telling entertainers to shut up and form no opinions is close to a very bade form of government I know you all hate...

Well actually this is one of the things I do agree with ramster about though, I'm sure he has different reasoning then I do on the matter. I look at it from an evolution stand point and being born homosexual is actually somewhere along the line a mutation in the genes. We all know that the natural way is to have sexual feelings towards the other sex for reproduction purposes. To cut down on the nasty comments towards me on this opinion of mine, I also feel that asexual people (no sex drive) are also genetic screw ups. If you look at evolution, it always doesn't go forward on the evolution stepping blocks, sometimes evolution will take a U-turn. It's Darwin's theory of the fittest and best adapted will survive.

As for eating crap... Well, there are actually a lot of people that do it for different reasons. It's not really widespread but it does happen around the globe.

This is why religion says being homosexual is a choice and not genetic... If it was proven genetic (which I believe it is) that would make them out to look worse then they already do by picking on a minority by asking for them to be killed, punished, to be tortured in hell and all those other wonderful things the culture of hatred (aka religion) says about them.

What did I already say in other posts? Ban religion and you won't have war. DUH!!!

Well, not really. There would still be some wars. Just that without religion there would be less conflict in this world that would in turn result in much less wars and bloodshed.

I remember that was the theme of the last episodes of South Park.




You're right girl... although it's hard to realize it when there's people like Paris Hilton on TV. Call me sadistic, but I only watched The House of Wax just to see how she was killed. The whole theater cheered when she died

Mad Man Across the Water was his best because he did it with Bernie Taupin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Taupin

I knew someone was going to bring that up. The makers really only brought it up so they would be fair across the board. I think they're both atheists but one of them is sort of agnostic from what I understand.

Though, religion has caused far more problems seemly then anything else.

look religion should not control goverment laws ( I am looking at you Iran) so gay people should have a right to marry

Well, I don't care if they're atheists or not, they still make one helluva show . I bow down to South Park (well, and 24 too- Jack Bauer rules!)

As for religion causing more trouble than anything else, when you get vicious and you only want to get power, you'll use any mean you can, and if one of those is religion, then so be it. Unfortunately...

Gays marry for tax breaks. That is why the law is stepping in.

hooray I'm a genetic screw up ;P

Let's celebrate!!!

*takes the chance to steal the rum*

Yeah, and straight people don't get tax breaks huh?

*steals it back*


Boo wanting little children.

Horray rum!

There is no worse a bondage to man than to be a prisoner of religion.

Might I suggest then that some courses in a local college and perhaps some actual charity and spiritual field work could help you to break down your limitations then.

You have convinced yourself that religion is the root of all evil and that is the little box you have chosen to live in and never come out of. That is the limit that you have placed upon your mind and upon yourself. You have created your own limited demon who is the source of all pain, one that you can hope to wipe out and the world can then live happily ever after. To me it is the simple dream of a frightened child who knows very little about people and about the world.

As long as morality and ethics exist, as long as civilization itself exist, some form of religion will always exist because there will always be good and evil in every civilization of mankind on this planet and religion is mankind's way to help that which is good and deter that which is evil.