I was hoping some of you with more knowledge about UFO's than I, could share you view points on this. Has the shape from a traditional saucer to cigars and triangles have a pattern?

For instance, if we look at aircraft from the 1940's and 1950's, they were propeller driven and then we see the emergence of jet aircraft. In is known that the Nazi scientists were developed some flying saucers. In modern times, we have the F117 and B2 which have the triangular shape or a saucer shape depending on your angle of view. Lockheed skunkworks have reportedly designed several flying disc's and other Top Secret projects that are some fifty years more advanced than the aircraft of today. (Discovery Channel "Discovery Hoy")

Therefore, to me it seems logical that if UFO's are really military aircraft, we would see more advanced and changing designs. Kind of like what we are seeing in the various UFO reports today.

If UFO's are really alien in orgin, spanning unknows distances in time and space, I would imagine the shape would likely stay the same year after year.

Any thoughts or other logical conclusions?

Good post, I pretty much agree.

Yes I considered this possibility also. Good post. Unfortunately I'm not a UFO expert so i can't comment....but listening...

i was just thinking about that yesterday.

there are no UFO experts. so your thoughts on the matter are as good as anyones.

beware of self proclaimed experts as there likely section-8's .

However, some BIG holes come to mind regarding the military as the source of UFO's.

Why would the military send fleets to such bizarre places as Guerrero and Xalapa, Mexico for example?

Link

And then why haven't the military used them in a conflict?

Perhaps we are seeing a combination of both. Some military aircraft (perhaps based in part on recovered alien technology) and genuine alien spacecraft. That might explain a lot.

More then one type of aliens??? I imagine IF there are more then one type, it would be safe to say that they have different shapes. Also, crafts with different functions and payload would change the shapes as well.

Of course this is all a guess.

Interesting post but I have to disagree a little bit I do not believe that all these UFO sightings can be explained as simply being military aircraft or secret projects. Saucer shaped UFO’s have been seen for years and years not just the 1940’s and onwards there are reports out there from the 1800’s showing saucer shaped craft. So if the government were working on a saucer shaped aircraft do you not think we would have seen this technology by now? I don’t believe the government have been working on flying saucer technology for over 100 years if they have been then they have wasted an awful lot of time. And then if you look at some ancient works of art some paintings and cave drawings actually depict flying saucers and other types of UFO just type “Ancient UFO” into Google and you will see exactly what I mean. However when it comes to flying Triangles I believe some of those can most definitely be just aircraft or secret projects but I cannot believe that all the UFO’s are just government. You also mentioned the point about if they are evolving in some way I believe that if some of these craft are ET and yes I do believe that some are (many different species) I think that the technology the craft run on would most probably be getting better and more advanced but I don’t think the shapes are changing. I mean we have flying saucer reports right here in 2006 as we did many years so I am not really convinced that the shape of UFO’s is evolving either. -- That is my theory after looking into quite a few UFO cases and doing quite a bit of research into the subject over a three year period.

I agree with you to a point Sam Willey.
I have researched and followed this subject for almost 42 years and I am no expert either.
My view on it is, they have different crafts for different operations.
A very large one perhaps for interstellar or perhaps intergalactic travel.
Smaller interplanetary travel and simpler ones for scouting or reconnesaince.
Add this to the possibility that there may be 50 - 100 different alien spieces involved then you would no doubt see a great variety of shapes and sizes.
But I do believe they may change propusion methods and thus use a different shape or special use designs. But how would we possibly know this for sure...logical deduction.
The real point would be the time span between these changes.
We are in a technology boom.
For them I believe major technology changes comes more infrequent. They already know the many science wonders we are just fantasizing dreaming or touching upon.
I do not believe any of them are new to space travel by any means and and use pretty effective and quick methods to traverse space, thus ship design changes I believe come infrequently.

SW- I mostly agree with you. However, something still doesn't quite fit.

Sure, it seems logical that if there is at least one alien race, why not many different ones with many different classes of ships. Maybe I am looking at this wrong. When I say an evolving shape, I mean the description of reported craft has many new types of designs than in the past. Even if there are many different races of aliens (or ethnicity for Odas) and different styles of craft, then we would see the same styles repeated over and over. Rather, in today's modern world it seems we have much more than the typical saucer depicted in the past. Therefore, if the shape or configuration has changed or refined if you will, that to me would indicate some human involvement.

Just some food for thought.

Actually, descriptions of UFOs have been fairly constant thoughout the centuries only that they weren't called, 'flying saucers.'

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- <^?

1,500 BC:
Pharaoh Thutmose III In Egypt, the Pharaoh Thutmose III sees silent, foul-smelling circles of fire and flying discs in the sky.

Excerpt from an Egyptian papyrus - part of the annals of Thutmose III, who reigned around 1504-1450 B.C.:

In the year 22, of the 3rd month of winter, sixth hour of the day... the scribes of the House of Life found it was a circle of fire that was coming in the sky.... It had no head, the breath of its mouth had a foul odor. Its body one rod long and one rod wide. It had no voice. Their hearts became confused through it; then they laid themselves on their bellies....They went to the Pharaoh... to report it. His Majesty ordered .... [an examination of] all which is written in the papyrus rolls of the House of Life. His Majesty was meditating upon what happened. Now after some days had passed, these things became more numerous in the sky than ever. They shone more in the sky than the brightness of the sun, and extended to the limits of the four supports of the heavens.... Powerful was the position of the fire circles. The army of the Pharaoh looked on with him in their midst. It was after supper. Thereupon, these fire circles ascended higher in the sky towards the south... The Pharaoh caused incense to be brought to make peace on the hearth... And what happened was ordered by the Pharaoh to be written in the annals of the House of Life... so that it be remembered for ever.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

216 B.C.
Things like ships were seen in the sky over Italy... At Arpi (180 Roman miles, east of Rome, in Apulia) a round shield was seen in the sky.

99 B.C.
When C. Murius and L. Valerius were consuls, in Tarquinia, there fell in different places.... a thing like a flaming torch, and it came suddenly from the sky. Towards sunset, a round object like a globe, or round or circular shield took its path in the sky, from west to east.

90 B.C.
In the territory of Spoletium (65 Roman miles north of Rome, in Umbria) a globe of fire, of golden colour, fell to the earth, gyrating. It then seemed to increase in size, rose from the earth, and ascended into the sky, where it obscured the disc of the sun, with its brilliance. It revolved towards the eastern quadrant of the sky.

85 BC:
From Pliny, Natural History: Book II, ch 34 "In the consulship of Lucius Valerius and Caius Marius, a burning shield scattering sparks ran across the sky."

776 AD:
From an old chronicle by W. R. Drake "Those watching outside in that place, of whom many still live to this very day, saw they beheld the likeness of two large shields, reddish in color in motion above the church, and when the pagans who were outside saw this sign, they were at once thrown into confusion and terrified with fear and began to flee from the castle."

1180,
A term equivalent to our "flying saucer" was actually used by the Japanese approximately 700 years before it came into use in the West. Ancient documents describe an unusual shining object seen the night of October 27, 1180, as a flying "earthenware vessel." After a while the object, which had been heading northeast from a mountain in Kii province, changed its direction and vanished below the horizon, leaving a luminous trail.

1361,
A flying object described as being "shaped like a drum, about twenty feet in diameter" emerged from the inland sea off western Japan...

1387 A.D.
In Novr. and Decr. of this year, a fire in the sky, like a burning and revolving wheel, or round barrel of flame, emitting fire from above, and others in the shape of a long fiery beam, were seen through a great deal of the winter, in the county of Leicester, Eng., and in Northamptonshire.

1909
* Persian Gulf: Objects described as rotating wheels, which could go under water were sighted and a Danish captain.

* Vietnam, Dong Hui: Fishermen located at the port city of Dong Hui; saw an elongated brightly lit object flying over the community for nearly ten minutes. It then disappeared after plunging into the sea of the cost.

1912 (Triangular UFOs)
England, Chisbury, Wiltshire: Charles Tilden Smith reported the following case to the respected British science journal, Nature. For over half and hour Smith observed two fan shaped or triangular 'heavy shadows' cast onto clouds overhead. The clouds were moving rapidly, but the shadows remained stationary in the sky. From time to time the unidentified apparitions varied in size. Smith concluded that two large unseen objects in the west were intercepting the Sun's rays.

1917
Portugal, Fatima: Such phenomena include disks, like an "aircraft of light," described exactly in these terms by the witnesses of the fifth apparition. Also observed were double supersonic detonations, light protuberances, electro-static charges, and moving "stars," mysterious white flowers or snow that dropped down from the "aircraft of light," but disappeared when it made contact with the ground. These descriptions of "snow" or mysterious white "flowers" are quite similar to the descriptions of "angel hair" that are well known from some famous UFO cases. This was accompanied by additional unexplained aerial phenomena, in the form of glowing spheres and disc-shaped objects. A UFO sighting had taken place before a crowd of somewhere between 50,000 - 100,000 people! The story given was that a silver disc appeared just as "the rain stopped and the clouds rolled back, the sun dimmed out and everything took on a gray, opaque appearance". The disc then dove in an erratic, zigzag pattern at the crowd, stopped just above their heads and then slowly maneuvered back into the sky. As it faded from view, the sun brightened and began to shine again normally. A local reporter took a photo of the disc.


1926,
* Mongolia: During his expedition explorer Nicholas Roerich and members of his caravan, caught sight of a huge oval-shaped object high in the sky. It had a shiny surface that reflected the sun on one side and moved at great speed north to south.

1927,
USA, Nebraska, Scottsbluff: While flying near Scottsbluff, pilot Barney Oldfield finds his biplane flanked by "flying manhole covers."

If these beings are really just cosmic neighbors from another star, then they have physicists and engineers just as we have. Their techology will advance and produce ships that look different over time. Also, there may be different designs for purely artistic reasons.

I think that ufos have changed in this last 50 years, mainly because of "fakery fashion" (sorry for my english, what i mean is that, in the 50´s and 60´ it was really common the "classical saucer with windows,and a lot have been debunked"); and in other decades, you can see other types of ufos.

I think that the real ones, the genuine ones, are the ones that havent changed in time, the ones that are the same in ancient testimonies as in actual sightings.

Its the same with the suposedly aliens. In the 50 and 60´s, they were just like us. And now, they are all greys.

In the 1950's SciFi movie; " Earth vs The Flying Saucers," the facial features of the alien depicted after his suit was removed, does not look human and resembles a description of the "Greys" of today. There was another movie of the 1950s where alien beings were depicted as short beings with large heads and large eyes. The old movie of "War of the Worlds" also depicted aliens as beings other than humans.

Yes, but thats just a few cases.

The big mass of "contactees" at that time (Adamsky, Paul Villa, The Ummo cases, and a lot more) depic very "human like" aliens.

Adamski, Fry and others you mentioned are mostly considered nut cases.

im pretty sure you would become a nut case to if little green men violated your rear end!

Here is the latest, 3 triangles together, trying to fool us.


Same location, just plain triangle.


Some trails and dark triangles.

High voltage electrons given off by the craft E&M fields is the only explanation
I can give for such appearance.

what? why would it? I fail to see the logic. You mean cuz it's the same ship that keeps twirling around the universe? Cuz otherwise it would make more sense to me, IF our concept of time is valid throughout the unknown spaces of the universe that they too evolve and change, become better. So why wouldn't there be different models of "ships"?

And if you start talking about shapes, well maybe UFO's have shapes we can't even see or process with our mind, yet. A completely new concept of shape.

The reason i postulated the shape of UFO's would remain basically constant is because of the time factor.

Imagine the distance some vessels must travel to get here. If they travel faster than the speed of light, time will seem to stay the same for them while moving ahead for us. If they travel less than that, it would take them centuries or more to cover the expanse of space and therefore again the craft would remain the same.

Nice research Sky. So, we have a fairly consistant shapes described throughout the ages. This would tend to give credence to the theory they have not evolved and would point toward a alien connection.

While doing some research on Soviet UFO and USO encounters, I found some interesting items that tie in nicely with this discussion.

1. Both the former Soviet Union and the American governments (and presumably others) have been aware of the existence of extra-terrestrial life for many years and have orchestrated a cynical cover-up.

2. Contact has been established with extra-terrestrial life forms.

3. Advanced technology has been obtained from these life forms. 4. They have the ability to engage ICBM's and possibly other nuclear weapons systems.

5. U.S. astronauts did encounter extra-terrestrial craft and there was a significant sighting made on the moon, all of which have again been cynically covered-up.

6. The U.S. Air Force and Navy do possess "material" from extra-terrestrial craft.

7. Extra-terrestrial life forms have the ability to "distort" time, as we know it.

http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc1142.htm

I will go with 3, 5, and 7 as most likely to be accurate.

not to step on anyone's toes or anything, but can any of you find evidence and article somewhere besides an UFO site?

i'm not trying to start an arguement here, but if i want to argue about the existance of loch ness monster, i would get my info from the nessie site. the problem is noone takes these sites seriously other than other believers. this is a problem for me to accept it as hard evidence.

It's an open ended question. At the start of the topic I didn't list any sources. It was more of a logical puzzle based on people's knowledge or experience. But feel free to add whatever source you like.

How do you know ufos have been anywhere but in earth's skys?

Granted the same mechanism may be in effect to propel them
through the ages but nothing comes across as Alien except
a diatribe, a prolonged discourse from phonies, of cover stories
to hide what a physicist can't tell you about how they work.

Physical phenomena is the realm to the physicist, and they can
say or be out of a job fast.