I decided to write this thread because some of the recent topics have been about witnesses. Normally I am the sort of person who really looks into a case before a make my mind up, but some cases im really torn because there is no evidence, but the witnesses seem to be credible and once held high and very respectful positions wherever they worked. Over the last decade or so, allot of people have come forward with what they know about aliens and the crashed ufos we have. Not just the disclosure project, but other people too, from atronauts to nasa workers.

I just find it hard to put them all down to attention seekers, hoaxers etc. Some of these witnesses have been very old and they have decided to come forward, and i just hate to think that there is truth to this, that people are shouting the truth to us. It must be frustrating for witnesses who are telling the truth, only to have people call them crackpots!

It seems to me, no matter how high ranked you are, if you come out and say that you know aliens exist, you will lose your credibility and the respect you might of gained through your work. So would you risk that, knowing that people will not take you seriously?

I am still torn, because at the end of the day its only words. But me, as a human being cant call all these people crackpot attention seekers, because if they all are, then i guess i find that just as distressing as the government covering up aliens.

There are just to many important people from the government, nasa, militery etc coming forward. So are we to say that some of these people in charge, or part of very important nasa,government, militery work are attention seekers, hoaxers, unstable, and willing to lose all credibility and respect they might have gained. I just cant see it! And if they are crackpot attention seekers, why are so many of these crackpot attention seekers hold good and some high ranking jobs in our government?

I have talked to some of my contacts about such things that include members of the intellegence community and military as well as defense contractors etc. I have come to beleive that all UFO's are human in origin and such people in the government saying their alien are unknowingly participating in a massive world wide psy-op to hide the technology developed over the last 60 to 70 years.

Everything I have seen and heard suggests this. Why no evidence of alien visitation?

The technology is also not developed by the government persay but rather defense contractors like Boeing and Lockheed Martin for the government.

Is it so hard to beleive that scientists have developed top secret propulsion systems and craft that run off of these. Perhaps some are capable of reaching inconceivable speeds or space flight?

Not to me it isn't however what better way of hiding such things like releasing fake documents and having government plants say it's a psy-op. It worked when they first started testing and using stealth aircraft and it certainly more then effective now.

interesting, and if true, then the people behind this are criminals. But i have to say that i don't believe that theory. Of course some of these, if not most of the crafts are human operated. But i find it hard to believe , after hearing a hell of a lot of testinmonies from inside the government
that your theory is the case. I am not saying its not, and i guess it would not suprise me if it is true. We dont know 100% either way

Nope, they have nothing to do with secret aircraft either.

The UFO enigma is thousands of years old and besides, we don't treat our classified assets in such a manner, for an example, flying them next to airliners in positive controlled airspace nor do we hover them over cities in full view of the local population. Also, the UFO enigma is a worldwide phenomenon that involves no secret aircraff of the U.S Air Force.


Bariloche UFO, 1995

SAN CARLOS DE BARILOCHE 02/08 (AFP) = On Monday morning, around ten eye-witnesses reported that, moving at high velocity and defying all known laws of physics, a white flying saucer perturbed the air traffic at the San Carlos de Bariloche airport, located 1 800 km S-W of Buenos-Aires, during 15 minutes on Monday to Tuesday night.

http://www.ufocom.org/UfocomS/usbariloche.htm

There is no proof to say otherwise.


How would you know unless you have been privy to top secret materials. The phenomenon being thousands of years old is questionable too as many anceint culture used to partake in ritual drug use mostly the use of psychodelics.

As for the UFO phenomenon being world wide that it to dupe enemy governments from finding out what they really are.


What laws of physics did it defy???

It moved at a high velocity must be an alien gimme a break this proves nothing.

Good points sky:) i always thought it was strange that if these are secret government projects, then why are they over the skies where populated people live, or when it comes to pilots who say the ufos stay with them for a bit. Just does not make sense

For me personally it is the truth and there is nothing to suggest otherwise.

The thing about these testimonies is that they came from 'inside' the government. Do you honestly think people won't falsify things to protect their secrets. Just to let you know people who really want to tell the truth do not live very long.

I do know 100% the answers are all there for people to find it is just ufologists have been thrown off track by alien propaganda and rumors.

Wrong! Read last month's edition from Air Force Magazine. The details are all there for all to see.



Almost 40 years in Air Force aviation puts me in a prime position to know what I am talking about.



Wrong again! You can find many reports of 'flying silver shields' in ancient UFO reports.



Wrong again! It cost us millions of dollars to fly just one SR-71 mission so it is not conceivable that we would spend billions of dollars to fly many UFOs over foreign lands for the purpose of duping nations. That is laughable to say the least!!



All you have to do is to produce proof that the UFOs, which were tracked at hypersonic speeds in 1952, were conventional aircraft. If you are unable to do so, then I rest my case that they were not vehicles of mankind.

There is more tha enough evidence that proves that something is flying in our airspace, that much we do know. If its human or alien, we just dont know, as simple as that.



So, say the disclosure project, what they going to do, kill them all. Things have changed now. Its just plain denial now.



Im sorry, but you do not know 100%, just like i dont know 100%. Im not that arrogant or ignorant to think that way!

I was playing with some more hypothetical ideas that are similar to your question above. I tried to find a hypothetical connection to humans being in charge of the UFO phenomenon. Here is how it would have had to have worked, in my opinion.

A country or group at some point in humanity's past made some of the discoveries with electricity that we made recently. Using our own technology age as a template for how long it would take a society to excel once they discovered electronics, it is plausible that a society over seven thousand years old, (maybe older, who knows how old we are,) stumbled onto the discovery of electricity and became an extremely sophisticated race in 300 years. Realizing that technology equals power, this group kept their discovery's within the borders of their own society.

So now we have an advanced society of humans that have stayed seperate from other humans. Using their technology to the best advantage, this group makes a base on the moon, or deep inside the earth. From there, they are able to perform tests on their former fellow humans on the surface of the earth, in order to better understand things like DNA, consciousness, phsycology of societies, etc...

Perhaps through a deliberation in their inner councils, this society decides to let the rest of the human race begin to progress technologically. They still do not want to be discovered however, so they invent the idea of aliens, and sell it to the public, which works extremely well. From that point on, humans believe every strange occurence in the sky is the result of an ET, and no one guesses that it might just be a group of humans that managed to keep their technological advancements secret.

That would be my only explanation for how humans could be the primary source behind the UFO phenomenon.

Well if they are manmade why havent they been put to commercial or military use yet ? I mean they've been around for years and years ...surely some use would be made of them by now ...such as commercial flight or even being used in the Gulf wars ????
We know that it's not uncommon to see UFO's over battlegrounds but it's not known for them to actually participate in battles.....If they're manmade....why not ?
I have no doubt that the vast majority of UFO's are manmade vehicles of some kind......But i dont think all of them are
Also ...ridicule is the best suppressant ever .....I was once on the Sceptics side and then i had 2 sightings personally that i know in my heart and head were highly unlikely to be manmade ....i knew this by the way they moved and by the sheer speed from an almost standing start.
This proves nothing to any sceptics because i could be lying. But it was enough for me to have this personal sighting to show that most of us really dont have a clue whats flying around in our skies.

The question really isn't if you're "lying". I certainly don't think you're lying...I've seen something unusual myself. The real issue is exactly what did you see? And, how can you be certain that what you saw was without question (at the exclusion of all other possible explanations) an alien space craft?

Now, some people claim to have encountered strange alien beings in conjunction with UFOs. Seems like pretty good evidence on the surface, but we have to remember that human perception is not with out it's flaws. Some folks do indeed lie (for various reasons), and some simply have incredible difficulty determining the line between internal and external reality. So, eye witness testimony is only going to get us so far...and that's just not very far when it comes to looking for irrefutable scientific evidence supporting the UFOs=ET space craft hypothesis.

Witnesses etc are not proof

This proves what exactly you know alot about 'conventional' aircraft not unconventional ones.

Ancient cultures also reported seeing Gods and mythological creatures as well...

To you perhaps but maybe it does not cost 'billions' to fly them because they are flown by remote or computer control. To my knowledge it seems likely such craft would make perfect UAV's to spy on the unsuspecting.

All you have to do is produce the proof that the craft tracked in 1952 were alien. If you are unable to do so, then I rest my case.

Like the witness below. I find it hard to believe she is lying. She had a very good and respectable job at nasa.

Donna Hare had a secret clearance while working for NASA contractor, Philco Ford. She testifies that she was shown a photo of a picture with a distinct UFO. Her colleague explained that it was his job to airbrush such evidence of UFOs out of photographs before they were released to the public. She also heard information from other Johnson Space Center employees that some astronauts had seen extraterrestrial craft and that when some of them wanted to speak out about this they were threatened.

My name is Donna Hare. During ‘70 and ‘71 I worked in Building 8 of NASA for a contractor, Philco Ford. They changed their name several times. Over the years, I worked in the photo lab and in different areas of the company on and offsite.

During the ‘70’s, I don’t know the exact date, I walked into the photo lab, into one of the restricted areas- I did have a secret clearance. I walked into a restricted area which was not my company- it was the NASA photo lab. And there they developed the film from the moon and satellite pictures, everything that’s done by NASA.

One of the gentlemen I had been friends with and I still talk to occasionally pointed my attention to one area of this mosaic. It was one panel of a mosaic which are several panels put together to form a larger picture. I believe they were satellite pictures but I’m not sure. They were aerial looking down. And I said, this is really interesting.

He explained everything. And then, with a smile on his face he said, look over there. And I looked. And in one of the photo panels I saw a round white dot. And at the time it was very crisp, very sharp lines on it. And I said to him what is that? Is that a dot on the emulsion? And then he’s grinning and he says dots on the emulsion don’t leave round shadows on the ground. And there was a round shadow at the correct angle with the sun shining on the trees. I looked at him and I was pretty startled because I had worked out there several years and had never seen anything like this, never heard of anything like this. And I said, is this a UFO? And he’s smiling at me and he says, I can’t tell you that. I can’t tell you that. What I knew he meant was, it was [a UFO] but he couldn’t tell me. So I said, what are you going to do with this information? And he said, well, we always have to airbrush them out before we sell them to the public. And I was just amazed that they had a protocol in place for getting rid of UFO pictures on these things…

He said that some [of the astronauts] who wanted to talk were threatened. They’d signed papers not to talk. They would have their retirements taken away. I was just overwhelmed with that piece of information so I started asking questions. Certain people that I knew were key people in the organization so I’d take them away from the site. We’d go to lunch and I’d talk to them. And alone they would tell me things and then swear if I ever said they said it, they would say I was lying. One gentleman that I knew very well was in quarantine with the astronauts. He said, just about every one of them has seen things when they went to the moon. In fact, one said that craft were on the moon at the time of the landing. But this man has disappeared off the face of the Earth. I’ve tried to find him but I only have his name. I’ve given it to SG.

I also met a security guard that was forced to burn a lot of UFO pictures. He came into my office and he was very frightened. He said, Donna, I heard you were interested in this subject. He said, I used to work out there. And one day some soldiers came in fatigues and had me burn pictures. He said that he was burning them and he was forced not to look at them. But he was tempted. He looked at one of them and it was a UFO on the ground. Shortly thereafter he was hit in the head with a gun butt and he still had a scar on his forehead. Now, this gentleman was terrified. He was scared out of his mind. And he also said that in the picture was a UFO with little bumps on it. It looked like it had just landed…

There was a point in time when I had some people come out and tell me I shouldn’t talk about this. They didn’t threaten to kill me but I got the message I shouldn’t talk about it. But I’d already talked about it so much it didn’t really matter anymore. And like I said at the [1997] congressional briefings, I really started feeling like this topic was like sex. You know, everybody knew about it but nobody talked about in mixed company. I’m waiting to tell more whenever there’s a congressional hearing where I could be protected. I trust SG. I feel he’s done everything he said he would do as far as protection, secrecy of what I give him, for now. I want it to come out when it’s necessary and proper and can do some good. I don’t want people going around that are trying to get rid of these people or hurting them or challenging them or making them so frightened they move away-like this one particular man I know of who has just disappeared off the face of the Earth. This one man, he has disappeared. I just don’t want that.

One of the things that I’m upset about is that good people are forced to do illegal things. And I believe that this information should be given to the American [people].

I agree but I know it's not alien just based on things I've seen and circles i roll in.

No it's cause no one in the disclosure project is really telling the truth about the government,. Infact they are doing what they are supposed to trick civillians

Your entitled to your opinion but don't tell me what I do or do not know simply based on your own and other hypothesis or views on the subject matter.

No, but it helps, esp when you have radar evidence or video or photo evidence, plus high ranking testinmonies.



Not a good answer!!!!!!



Yes this is true, well done!!!



Maybe, just that some of these craft have speeds and can move unlike earth bound craft.



well, we cant prove either way. Prove that they were earth craft?

Remember the guy who was giving an interview about the sea u.f.o's? his story was to claim that they are from the earth itself.

If you know what i'm talking about, then read his body language during the interview closely. It's pretty instructive, and i'll give my opinion on it in just a sec. But first i'll state that even though his body language indicated he was under a duress caused by others in his immediate vicinity, and that what he said was untrue, there will be, and is, many interpitation's.

The point of my reply is to point out a possable connect.

He was looking from side to side with his eye's, during the interview. His body posture was tense, and when his head was slightly to the left as he was raising it a little, his eye's rolled slightly to the right, and raised slightly, indicating some one or thing within the same room, but further away, and real fear came into his eye's, and yes, he was'nt looking at the camera guy.

Now look at his eye's at that point. They lit up a little. That one will be real open to speculation, as to what lit them up. All i can say is that it showed his fear at that moment clearly. And there is evidence using the same methos of observing to indicate that right after that, the continueing interview was in a different frame{the sense that it was slightly later}

At this point, he had the manner{and posture} of a man who had been frightened and nervous through intimidation, and had been placeted and calmed down{good cop, bad cop}
In any event, a standard interrorgation technique.

The real speculation come's from what all that may mean. The fact that an agency that has clout over our own goverment, enough to accomplish what they do, is plainly evident even at this site. I dissed them in my own way before, but what if were all wrong, i mean yes our goverment knows of it, but is it really condoning it?

What if their just the cleanup boy's for those who really rule? as well as the obvious coverups? perhaps their obvious because people are trying to say things, to warn the general public, in whatever little way's left to them? That is an indication of a level of control that is far from reassuring, to us as humans, even if the "aliens" are not real.

Another speculation is that they are aliens, and they control us thouroughly, and as others have speculated before, getting ready to express their dominance over us publicy. What better way to ensure general acceptance, then by claiming the've been here millions of years before, and that it's their home before us.

Well, i have more, but people generally don't like me, as i look right through belief's and faith's, because they are pointless, as well as being a usefull tool of the aliens, both to keep us fragmented, and prepare us for a "higher being" to be dominated by.

Again, bad guy, good guy. Or, he who causes chao's, also bring's peace. However you may look at it, or naming conventions you use{which can both disguise and advance their purpose} the truth is, something is trying to take what is ours away, much the way a parent would deal with a child.

And just because i used the child analog, don't go thinking you are inferior, we may be outmatched, but we are not lower lifeforms. We are human, and this is "our" world. Something we've been distracked from for quite some time. At all levels of our society, and it's been lead by those we have been decieved by.

Well, i hope this helps.

Well Lilly i'll tell you what i saw and you tell me what you'd think if you saw them okay.
When i was building my last house my cousin was out working on the roof,i heard him screaming and shouting...i thought he'd fallen off so i ran outside..i looked up and he was okay but pointing at the sky ( a clear blue sunny July day)
Hovering about 80 - 90 feet above the house were two glowing / golden spheres...they weren't moving except around each other slowly without making contact. I climbed up on the roof and to be honest we started to get a bit creeped out coz it looked like these things were "observing" us. Anyway after about a minute they slowly started to rise ,still moving around each other...they picked up speed and increased the angle of ascent quickly and then they were gone out of sight.
A few months later when i'd moved in my aunt came out one night...i was walking her to her car when SHE said "what the hell's that" i looked up and again two bright glowing lights twinned together and again moving around each other descended quickly to around 100 feet over the roof suddenly changed dirtection upwards and shot off at high speed..They made No noise whatsoever
I'm not asking anyone to beleive me but this what i saw....what would you think if you saw this ...exactly as i've described ?


EDIT :
No BS here, as soon as i finished doing this reply i had a look in the Book Of Thoth forum and theres a topic on these........check out the similarity
http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/localnews/d...orange_ufos.php

Absolute proof, without catching it, is pretty tricky.

Catching it, however, is also extremely difficult as nothing on Earth that fast has ever officially existed, to this very day.

You see, 7,200 mph. That's just pretty darn nippy.

NASA are almost there at 7,000 mph with their X-43A hypersonic aircraft back in 2004, which holds the current flight airspeed record.

So - to summarise - 50 years ago, something was recorded on radar moving faster through Earth's atmosphere than anything officially has done since.

That's why, circumstantially, it points more towards alien than human.

Who said anything about witnesses? That was in the Air Force's own words! You know, 'standard operating procedures,(SOP).



And, they described 'flying saucers' in much the same way we do today, only they didn't call them 'flying saucers' but 'flying shields.'



Nope, because the UFO phenomena is worldwide and any military assets sent abroad also requires many support flights, ground maintenance personnel and logistics support, which in themselves would cost millions of dollars, and as I have stated, we don't conduct such reckless operations illegally in our allies airspace with our valuable classified assets. If one crashes in the country of an ally of ours, then the downed classfied project won't be a secret anymore and our friendly relations will be friendly no more especially if the downed classified aircraft, which was in our ally's airspace illegally, results in death and destruction within our ally's borders. In other words, the UFOs have nothing do with our classified aircraft, UAV nor manned.



That is very ****EASY**** to do!! We didnt' have aircraft in 1952 that could fly at over 9000 mph and conduct right-angled maneuvers, and add to the fact our first supersonic jet fighter, the F-100, wasn't flying at that time. To further add, the UFOs were not secret aircraft because they were in prohibited airspace without permission from ground-controllers.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- <^>
Speed and Shock Waves

"A pilot and co-pilot for Mohawk Airlines spotted an interesting UFO one summer day in 1955 while cruising in their DC-3 at 3,000 ft near Utica, New York. An object passed at "great speed" 500 ft above their airplane. It was 150 ft wide, "light gray, almost round, with a center line . . ." At least four windows were observed emitting a bright blue-green light which seemed to change color as the object receded. It was also observed from two other aircraft. In addition, it was seen traveling east on airway Victor-2 from the control tower at Albany and by radar at Boston. Based upon the travel time between Utica and Boston, it must have been flying between 4,500 and 4,800 mph. And even at that speed, it did not produce a sonic boom. This sighting was not considered by the University of Colorado researchers to be due to anamalous propagation of radar signals; it was thought that it "must certainly be classed as an unknown pending further study, which it certainly deserves" but didn't get."

"The literature abounds with examples of UFOs flying at unusually high speeds and, as in this example, being tracked on radar. Many of them were measured at speeds greater than the world record for airplanes at the time. And some substantially out-performed even experimental, rocket-powered aircraft, as was shown in an analysis of 81 radar cases, spanning the period 1941 through 1962."[/b]

" In 1952, for example, the highest speed recorded was about [u]1,200 mph, whereas in August of that year a UFO was tracked by an Air Defense Command radar at 4,000 mph. During a famous display over Washington, D.C., the previous month, radars operated both by the Air Force and the CAA tracked UFOs "on the order of 7500 mph," and some of these events were coordinated with visual sightings. Four months later, several objects over the Gulf of Mexico were tracked on radar aboard a B-29 in bursts of speed between 5,240 and 9,000 mph at an altitude of 18,000 ft."

Edward J. Ruppelt, Captain, USAF

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<^>

The ball in now in your court, so show me an aircraft that can mimic such performance levels as listed above, or I will rest my case in support of ET.

Now, that's a new one! Got any proof the Disclosure witnesses were placed there to trick the public?

Man, the skeptics are relentless...LOL! To say the least. He can't give you any proof of anything. See they are the ones who are unbelievable. They don't have any proof just speculation. At leaset those of us who believe they are out there have eye witness accounts that we acknowledge as probably credible. The skeptics have nothing.....BUT FEAR!!!

The thought of all this being real is just too much for some people to take.

It's amazing that they are not doing their homework and instead, are playing a game of " I know I am right and the experts are wrong."

That is the same argument I received on another message board where a Roswell skeptic tried to discredit a Roswell witness and claimed that the witness was wrong because the Air Force's C-54 could not land at Kirtland AFB because the runway was too short. Well, as history has now shown, and what the skeptic had found to his dismay shortly afterwards, the C-54 did fact, operate from that base occasionally, so he (the skeptic) found that he was not only wrong, but that his source of information from a skeptical website was also wrong, and that website later admitted in a public announcement that it was wrong, which means that the source of that skeptical website was wrong as well.

Had the skeptic done his homework, things wouldn't have gone that far.

All this has been debated so many times over the years, its an old argument which has been put to rest many times yet it keeps coming back.... What your saying is our latest "SECRET" technology allows craft to do circles around an airliner traveling at 400knts? The G forces alone would kill a human!! Thats just one example with multi witnesses in the air and in radar towers... I would love to hear about ANY science which has led up to this sort of craft which makes no sound and makes right angle turns on a dime (which a human could not endure). I'd also love to hear how "TOP SECRET" craft are seen by all these witnesses over major metropolitan areas? I have tons more good questions like this but I have a feeling they go no where here so I wont waste any more time on it.

If the military and government have been hiding the 'truth' which they certainly have. How do you know they aren't just telling what you and others want to hear?

As for standard procedures they don't always follow them especially in regards to super black programs.



This was in times B.C well over 2000 years ago and texts and such from this far back aren't always historically accurate. But again people reported strange things like dragons, gods and other mythological things. It doesn't really prove anything and other such claims cannot be validated. The story itself is full of historical accuracies to begin with which is more then enough reason to doubt it. This is for a different topic....



First your thinking of things in the conventional military sense it's not recklass if you have tech light years ahead of the enemy. As for not conducting recklass flight with classified aircraft this has infact happened do you recklass mission that cause a U2 to be downed in Russia ending it's career and paving the way for the SR-71.



Unless you had the highest priority of clearence you would not know what was in the skies at the time and again really proves nothing. They count on such eye witness reports and reports from air traffic controllers to keep you beleiving.


Do you have an alien body or have seen the pilots of such vehicles. In regards to the question every UFO sighting since world war 2.



I don't doubt most eye witness accounts but I do doubt government sources of information which you love when they tell you what you want to hear. UFO's do exist my argument is again'st their existence it is again'st their creators.


No it just doesn't make sense that UFO's are aliens for some especially to me when I have witnessed otherwise. Including a triangle ufo with no windows, no visable propulsion and marked with earth numbers. It flew fast and made no noise.


Coputer or remote controlled easily trumps this set back.


To keep the public docile and thinking they are being visited by aliens. A type of massive psy-op if you will.

Let's just say, I know what I am talking about.



If we hide classified aircraft on secret bases from the eyes of those who possesss top secret clearances, then we are definitely not going to let the pubic see it nor will we fly or hover it over a city for everyone to see and photograph.

The procedure is that even if you posssess a top secret clearance but not the clearance for a particular project at hand, you will not be allowed access. In order for you to have access to a certain classified project, you must have a need to know. As the Air Force noted, those who are not cleared on a certain classified aircraft, they must enter a windowless building before that aircraft is brought out into the open.



How would an ancient person describe a full-suited astronaut? How would they describe a B-747 or even a helicopter?



If it's classified, it's classified. You don't give an enemy a reason to begin efforts to steal information about your classified project. In other words, you don't reveal anything regardless how advanced the technology, which in itself would be a primary reason to hide it from the eyes of the publc and not even speak about it. You know the old saying; "loose lips sink ships."



They are risky flights and not operated in a reckless manner. They are well-planned flights, not of the reckless nature that you are implying as far as UFOs are concerned.



We definitely not going to hover it over Los Angeles at high noon for everyone to see to where all doubt is removed!



Once again, we don't conduct classified flights by violating just about every FAA flight regulation in existence and that is what you are implying. We are not allowed to violate any flight rules just because we are involved in classified flight operations. ATC personnel have also made UFO reports, which at times were witnessed by pilots and ground observers, all at the same time the radar opeators were identifying the same targets on their radar screens.



No I don't but then again, I don't have a piece of the planet Venus in my garage either, so does that mean it doesn't exist? Do you have a piece of Venus in your garage to prove its existence?

I hate it when people say this! we are all trying to prove either way so you saying prove that it is an alien spacecraft means you have to prove that its not. People say he is the one making the claim, but you are making the claim that it is not.

So please! leave out the CAN YOU PROVE ITS ALIEN because you cant prove its not.

I don't have to prove anything and I can say what I want. I am merely saying that these craft are not alien in origin but rather earth based... Another would say it's alien neither can prove their claims making the arguement useless.



I was asked to prove otherwise why should you not prove your claims that they are extraterrestrial...


Or at least you think you know...


They did it in the 70's and 80's with stealth planes.



The wouldn't because they never seen such things.


People see things in the sky they can't explain and the government as well as defense contractors need a cover. Aliens are perfect because that provides the cover that you don't have this technology. Why would someone try to steal something if they didn't think it was yours.

Such an act would reaffirm people that aliens exist because they would'nt expect people to fly such craft in this manner. People see a UFO and assume it's alien. Again a perfect cover...


If no one thinks it's a human craft their is no one who would be accountable. Violating flight regulations with such aircraft would again make people think it's not coming from earth or at least their nation.



No but there is no evidence of alien pressence other then in UFO sightings. Even then it's not really evidence since these capabilities are not at all impossible.

Ok!, prove that its not alien. I am asking you, so tell me why its not alien.



Ok, and again, im asking you to prove they are not! the thing is, no matter what we say or believe, we just dont know, as simple as that.



I can understand where sky is coming from on this one.



Yes of course there is a chance this is true. I dont think so because of the witnesses coming out of nasa, government, cia and military.



does not make sense. So they, the government could have been the ones hovering above washington, being fired at buy all angles from the ground, also other cases where we have retaliated and fired on these unknown craft. And also this is happening all over the world, with the governments thinking the same. You just have to look at russia to know this is not the case. I believe that alot of sightings could be our own, but not all.



There is evidence, its just not hardcore evidence. Maybe aliens, maybe human. But saying there is no proof that aliens are flying them is also saying there is no proof that we are flying them, as simple at that!

LMAO, you have the burden of proof!! Why? b/c it's already understood, known, given truth that aliens DON'T EXIST-- you differ with that reasoning, or FACT, so provide burden of proof to change this 'misunderstanding'.......prove away..
There is no proof aliens exist! Aliens are NOT proven! Therefore it couldn't be an alien, b/c they don't exist-- Aliens are from the SCI-FI network...

Most people believe that there is life elsewhere. Even skeptics who believe they are not visiting earth, but they know that the chances are very high that they are out there. It would be very ignorant and arrogant to believe that we are the only ones in this huge universe, that is just not logical. Scientist even believe that there could be life on one of the moons of jupiter, and also that maybe there was once some sort of life on mars, so seeing that there is a chance that in our own solar system there could be life, then chances are life is every in the universe.


I cant prove its an alien, like you cant prove that it is not, as simple as that, and thats what i was saying. I might see a ufo, it could be a disk shaped silver object bu still, I could see a silver disk shaped object in the sky, that is still not proof that it is alien.

But there is enough evidence( if you have looked at the cases) to know that something strange is happening in our, and other countries skies, that much we do know 100%

I dont have the burden of proof, because i know that everyone needs proof, but both sitting here saying prove it was or not an alien is not going to get us anywhere, in my opinion.

You dont know that they dont exist, now you have just said that to me, so prove it, that there is no life in the universe!!?

I really dont know where you get the ,Aliens dont exist from because we just dont know. And how many cases have you looked into? i bet not many. Its easy to sit here and say its crap, its all rubbish, so prove that aliens dont exist? dont say you dont have to, because you do.
And remember, aliens would be anything living that is not from this earth!