Hello all!
I have been exploring my spiriuality for quite some time now and have finally found a lifestyle (though some say a religion) that feel right.
I am a strong believer in energy and balance and have discovered the Taoism encompasses all my beliefs. Though I don't really tink of it as an organized religion, its more of a spiritual lifestyle for me.
When you think about God seems to be a Toaist. Well, maybe not the Bible God.
I was wondering if anyone here pratices Taoism and what your thoughts are on wu wei.
-Sarah

Not a practitioner of straight Taoism, but Zen was heavily influenced by Taoism.

From my understanding wu wei is the same fundamental principle as no-mind. A state where action and thought is pure because it is in harmony. Eat when you are hungry, sleep when you are tired, go to the bathroom when you have to go to the bathroom. Allow yourself to be flexible and accepting that the nature of the universe is change.

I admit my Lao Tzu and Chuang Tzu is a bit fuzzy.

Religion is a funny thing. When your mind/body are organized you're spiritual and when you live a spiritual life you're religious. Different types of spirituality are commonplace and each one is connected to religion. There's nothing wrong with believing in a higher power or a higher plain of existence, but religion is the blind man's folly. When you completely embrace a religion you lose a great deal. Life is about experience and sensory preception. When you endow in a religion, you lose an understanding and freedom your mind enjoys. Never allow a religion to completely envelope you, 'cos you'll lose a lot more than you gain. The best form of existence is to learn without the influence of others.

and yet here you are telling her how she should approach things. ironic, no?

Tower,
Toaism is not a religion, its just a philosphy. I am not keen on any organized religion, I believe that organized religion is primative...a feeling that we still need to belong to different groups.
Rev,
Ypu're pretty much correct on the wu wei is non action...but its hard to explain...people think that it means just sit on your arse all day, but its really just going with the flow...unless the flow jumps off a cliff then I guess I'd have a problem ;0

Hi Nature Girl,

Have you read "The Complete works of Lao Tzu" by Hua-Ching NI.

It's great. Lao Tzu actually was the author of two books. Tao Teh Ching and Hua Hu Ching.

Anyone familiar with Taoism knows the first one. But the second one was passed down orally for generations and then finally written down.

The translations of the Tao Teh Ching are the best i've ever read, and the Hua Hu Ching is wonderful if you want to read more works accredited to Lao Tzu.

I was lucky to find it and a book sale. Hope you get a chance to read it, I really think you will enjoy it if you havn't read it already.

Yes, and I see the irony. That's how the worlds works, everyone is influenced. It's a Catch 22 situation.

Even philosophy is a form of religion. You're praying to a faith in a theory in how real the world is through a form of sensory preception and thought. Philosophy is deep thought and through thought idealogy is captured, and when idealogy is captured, symbolism is established, and then religion is adopted to support that symbolism, thus creating an idealogy, thus begeting a philosophical view on the life you've centred through the process of thought. Hence a religion is created to hone that idea.

You see, everything we do revolves around religion. Life itself can't survive without it. It's intervexed into everything.

To me Taoism is not a religion, not a philosophy, but a way of life, state of mind if you wish.
I can recommend two great books on the subject:

The Great Tao and The complete system of self-healing, both by Dr. Stephen Chang

All just a play on words, IMO.

Thanks for the book recomendations! I'm actually going to the store today and want to buy some of them.
Relgion, Philsophy, way of life...I don't give a S*HIT what you do as long as no one is being hurt and you don't push your beliefs on others. If you pray to Satan or God or a tree, as long as it makes you happy and feel good inside then so be it. Giving to others in need is love, live your life with love.

"When those who give charity do so without any sense of
self-satisfaction and without any thought of reward, even a small
gift is great. When those who aid others calculate their own
sacrifice and demand gratitude and recompense, even a great gift is
small." -Tao Te Ching

If you are interested in the book I recommended and can't find it at the store (its not new), you can order the paperback from amazon for about $11.00. I just went online and found it there, so you shouldn't have any problems.

Ya. I too believe Jesus is a taoist just like lao tzu and chuang tzu are christians. All three of them are perennial philosopers. Taoism is a very profound religion that is practical. Through the works of Taoism alone, one has enough doctrinal knowledge to help point the way to spirirtual liberation. God and Tao are the exact same thing in my opinion. Both are names used to describe the same thing. Both God and Tao transcends all imagination and emcompasses it all. To be one with Tao is the same as being one with God or Love.

Great post by the way!@! Havn't seen many posts on Taoism so keep up the good work! I thought also that I might add a couple of writings and quotes from Taoist philosophers so people who come on can get a basic idea of it.

"The fish trap exists because of the fish; once you've gotten the fish you can forget the trap. The rabbit snare exists because of the rabbit, once you've gotten the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words exist because of meaning; once you've gotten the meaning, you can forget the words. Where can I find a man who has forgotten words so I can have a word with him?"--- Chuang Tzu

Master Tung-kuo asked Chuang tzu, "This thing called the Way---where does it exists?" Chuang Tzu said, "There's no place it doesn't exist." "Come," said Master Tung-kuo, "you must be more specific!"
"It is in the ant."
"As low a thing as that?"
"It is in the panic grass."
"But that is lower still!"
"It is in the tiles and shards."
"How can it be so low?"
"It is in the piss and sh**!"
Chuang Tzu said, "Sir, your questions simply don't get at the substance of the matter. When Inspector Huo asked the superintendent of the market how to test the fatness of a pig by pressing it with the foot, he was told that the lower down on the pig you press, the nearer you come to the truth. But you must not expect to find the Way(Tao) in any particular place---there is no thing that escapes its presence! Such is the Perfect Way(Tao), and so too are the truly great words. 'Complete,' 'universal,' 'all-inclusive'---these three are different words with the same meaning. All point to a single reality.

---Chuang Tzu

Lieh Tzu was on a trip and was eating by the roadside when he saw a hundred-year-old skull. Pulling away the weeds and pointing his finger, he said "Only you and I know that you have never died and you have never lived. Are you really unhappy? Am I really enjoying myself?"---Chuang Tzu

Do not ask whether the Principle(Tao) is in this or that; it is in all beings. It is on this account that we apply to it the epithets of supreme, universal, total....It has ordained that all things be limited, but is Itself unlimited, infinite. As to what pertains to manifestation, the Principle causes the succession of its phases, but is not this succession. It is the author of causes and effects, but is not the causes and effects. It is the author of condensations and dissipations(birth and death, changes of state), but is not itself condensations and dissipations. All proceeds from It and is under its influence. It is in all things, but is not identical with beings, for it is neither differentiated nor limited.----Chuang Tzu

What can we say about universal being except IT IS?---Chuang Tzu


A way that can be walked is not The Way(Tao)

A name that can be named is not The Name

Tao is both Named and Nameless

As Nameless, it is the origin of all things

As Named, it is the mother of all things

A mind free of thought, merged with itself, beholds the essence of Tao

A mind filled with thought, identified with its own perceptions, beholds the mere forms of this world

Tao and this world seem different but in truth they are one and the same

The only difference is in what we call them

How deep and mysterious is this unity

How profound, how great!

It is the truth beyond the truth, the hidden within the hidden

It is the path to all wonder, the gate to the essence of everything!

----Lao Tzu

By a man without passions I mean one who does not permit good or evil to disturb his inward economy, but rather falls in with what happens and does not add to the sum of his morality.--Chuang Tzu

He who knows does not speak;
He who speaks does not know.

--Lao tzu

Anyway here is a morsel of Taoism. I recommend anyone wanting to enrich their spiritual knowledge to look into taoism. Allah Bless Taoism!@!

Brave,
You way out did me on the quotes! Thank you for them! I agree completely with what you said about God and Tao being the same thing.
I think Taoism has been under a rock for way too long and needs to get some much needed sunlight.

Taoism has always striked me as holding some truth. I wish I was raised in a Taoist family rather than a baptist one!!! It would have taken less time to shake off all the religous nonsense and get on the path to a personal search for spirituality.

Very enlightening info and quotes, but remember Icarus. Get to close to the sun and you'll burn.

What do you mean by that?

Could be wrong, but I think it's some kind of analogy where "Sun" equals "Ultimate Truth" or some such thing. It's a flawed analogy though, as there is no evidence to suggest that getting so close to such a truth or realization is harmful.

Although, it might make you a lot less fun at parties

Maybe the truth is that there is no truth, its all just our perception.

Yes. I believe the same as you do. Very nice.

I am new to this place. Trying to find my was around. I like what I am reading so far.

Thank you. UM is a place to formulate and exercise principles and philosophies for others to read and discuss. Welcome.

I have been studying Taoism. I think it explains a lot of things that other religions and philosophies don't explain. It works for me. I believe God is a Taoist. I could give you a link for a website that teaches Taoism. They have a page that explains wu wei.

http://www.taopage.org/

I'm talking one of thier courses now. I find it helpful.

I've owned a copy of the Tao Te Ching, for years. It's interesting in that the Tao also contains references to magic. I was surprised when I found that out.

Alchemy, I-Ching consultations, Feng Shuei, Qi Gong, and a little bit o' "sorcery". There is no separation of the "spiritual" and "material" world.

It depends on who you ask though, Philosophical Taoists tend to scoff at such things, but Religious Taoism is much like the old school Western pagan religions.

Some of the Tao Te Ching is on meditation. There are qi gong techniques described in the Tao Te Ching. Maybe that is what they're referring to by magic. I read some where that there is magic in Leih.tzu. I found Leih.tzu on the Internet. If your interested follow the link.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/tao/index.htm

All I found in it so far are stories of people with magical powers. I haven't found any magic in it. I haven't read the entire book of Leih.tzu so I have no idea what is in the rest of the text.

I read a book on religious Taoism. It has all sorts of magic in it. They use a lot of Talismanic magic. In one sect the priests us magic to help the dead get to the underworld. Religious Taoism believes in an underworld. According to the book, religious Taoism comes the Taoist philosophy and from ancient Chinese shamanism. It does have a lot of dieties. Some of there dieties are just men that they believe obtained immortality. They diefy Lao.tzu and some Chinese historical figures.

I don't believe in all thier dieties. I just believe in the philosophy of Taoism.

I have to make a correction. There are qi kung techniques described in the Tao Te Ching, not qi gong.

Qi Gong is a type of meditation. Even if you don't believe in the "harnessing your qi" aspect it still has benefits. The talismanic magic is quite interesting.

Religious Taoism does have a lot of gods pulled from all over the place. One could argue that Philosophical Taoism is "pure" but even then you have multiple influences it. Hui Neng's (the 6th patriarch of Zen) teaching caused a resurgence in Taoism due to the similarities between the two. I have even heard it posited that Gautama himself came across Taoism on his journeys and thus was a catalyst to the development of Buddhism. Don't know if it is true, but it would make sense.

qi gong is the pinyin spelling of chi kung. same comcept. it translates roughly to "breath work".

I love taoism.

Yeah, fun stuff.

I have a question for you guys. Anybody know the theory behind how the I Ching works? I know how to get an I Ching reading, but I don't know the theory behind how the I Ching works.

One woman who posted on one of the Yahoo forums thought you were consulting a spirit when you consult the I Ching. That was her theory on how it works. I don't know if that's true. I've heard the I Ching referred to as the oracle. I don't know why they call it that.

The I Ching as a divinatory tool is supposed to represent the interplay of Yin and Yang in relation to certain situations in your life. It is not meant to foretell the future but rather to give you things to ponder as you make a decision as to a particular course of action.

I've been dabbling into the eastern religions recently. Not so much their beliefs in god, but rather their view of reality.

I finished reading Leih.tzu. What I read was wrong. There is no magic in there. It just has stories of people with magical powers.

No, there is a Tao religion that worships Lao Tzu

you are correct
there is this man
on youtube
youtube.com/yogameditation
he has videos about how jesus was a Taoist

If you want to learn more about Taoism, you can go to youtube.com/yogameditation
he has some wonderful videos about Taoism and chakras and things.


Good day to you!

If I weren't LDS I'd be Taoist. Best non-LDS religion out there, imo.

Maybe atheists should consider being Buddhists. They don't worship any god either. I got that straight from a monk. Also ladies when a buddhists monk refuses to shake hands with you. They are not being sexist. They just can't touch women period part of their vow.

Bhuddists are not Taoists

But that is not Taoism.

I know but when would I get to use that knowledge any place else.

because it goes agaisnt what Lao Tzu teaches

Taoism is an organized religion in China, with temples and priests, rituals and dogma, Gods and Saints. The west has picked it up as a philosphical way of being. Nothing wrong with that. Just wanted to clear up that it is a religion.

Thats the logical side understanding of it. Taoism is experienced and cannot actually be explained. It's like describing sight to a blind man. Well not exactly taoism but Zen