I know very little of the arguments of both sides in this. I have done a little research and have come to the conclusion that global warming as being a phenomenon being caused by man is a myth. The debating in here is what ticked me over to this conclusion. The evdience here to state that it is something not to be alarmed about it compelling.

Thanks guys

It is good to see the people debating so well for the arument against the man made global warming myth. I could cite my research here but it is only stuff that already been iterated in here again.

Again one thing that stands out and blows the argument for global warming, in my view, completely out of the water is that from 1940 to 1970 the temperatures actually dropped and then rose again to about the same temperatures before the temperature drop. If more carbon dioxide means more heat then surely during the the 40s and 50s when so much industrial development and activity was taking place the temperatures would not have dropped.

Seems like terrorism, global warming,etc are all just made up to keep us constantly in a state of fear.

Sorry pal, but the only "denial" is by those spreading this myth of man-made global warming. I could care less what Hawking says. In fact, as early as 1989, Hawking and many other mainstream scientists didn't even acknowledge global warming, much less man-made climate change, and many laughed at the mention of "global warming" ~ that is ~ until the millions of federal dollars to study it started filling their coffers.

Then, the myth of man-made global warming started and took off in the 1990s. You can even match the increase in climate science funding to the myth of man-made global warming hand-in-hand. The more monies devoted to study it, the more mainstream scientists began pushing it. Even in the scientific world ~ the dollar is king.

When the tens of multi-millions (almost billion) in federal and international dollars start to dry up on man-made climate change, just watch how many scientists drop it like a bad habit. They will go back to doing what they were doing before ~ and that was laughing at man-made climate change, and they were laughing before the money shut them up and they filled their pockets with money they did not deserve in the first place on man-made climate change. Why? Because it does not exist. It never did.

In classical scientific astrology, there are known celestial cycles of 36 years. We are currently in what is called the Cycle of the Sun (1980-2016) ~ and during the first 26 years of this cycle, the Sun has been witnessed to have doubled its magnetic field activity, causing radiation storms over the Earth's atmosphere which caused holes in the ozone layer in the 1980s and all of the 1990s. We are currently in the 27th year of solar forcing of the Earth's climate.

Some of the hottest years of the 20th century took place between 1980 to 2006, with one of the hottest years being 1988, 1991, 1995, 1998, when the Sun was at maximum peak magnetic activity, and again, in 2003, when auroras were witnessed worldwide. Temperature records over the last 27 years can be matched exactly to solar forcing of the Earth's climate. My argument for Solar Forcing is backed up by tons of evidence. Much of it on this thread.

See ~ http://www.john-daly.com/solar/solar.htm

See here ~ http://www.john-daly.com/index.htm

Climate Change in Layman's Terms ~

http://www.kn4lf.com/globalwarminglie.htm

In in this link, see the scientific data of how the Sun forces Earth's Climate ~

http://www.geo.arizona.edu/palynology/geos...0climsolar.html

Although I am sure Al Gore and those who believe in man-made climate change mean well, but the evidence they present is just not proof of man-made global warming. It is proof of just plain GLOBAL WARMING ~ which has been ongoing since 1980.

Remember the facts ~ that during the height of human industrial production worldwide, the Earth's climate actually COOLED. This was also due to the Sun. Most people who push man-made climate change do not seem to fully appreciate just how powerful the Sun truly is and how the Sun forces all climate change, not just on Earth, but on other planets as well where there is no human Co2 production.

Those who want to force everyone else to accept climate change as "man-made" mindlessly are only fooling themselves, and in denial about astrophysical and geophysical laws, and facts.

No amount of negative environmentalistic mantras like "only that corporations and man is the cause of global warming" ~ is going to change the facts that the Sun forces the Earth's climate. Those who fail to see that the Sun is the direct cause should have a reality check and stop blaming humans for what they are not doing, and never did, and that is cause global climate change through Co2 production. Carbon is natural to the Earth, we are also made of it, and the oceans and mountains emit much more carbon into the atmosphere than we humans ever could.

There is no reason to deny less developed countries, like those in Africa, the means to have electricity, or to demand that they use solar energy when developed countries do not use solar. Using the resources of the Earth cleanly is GOOD for business, and good for the world. To deny less developed nations the means to grow by using the falsity of "man-made global warming" is a crime because it is not true. It never was and never will be.

It is the Sun that is the cause of all climate changes on the Earth ~ both global cooling AND global warming. Humans are not able to either cool and warm the earth, and there is NOTHING we can do to stop the activity of the Sun. All we can do is adapt to clmate changes, while learning how to not pollute our air, and sea water.

As for global warming and climate change ~ ONLY the SUN can do this and that is exactly what that star in the skies has been doing since the Earth became a planet ~ forcing climate change.

Politics sux, yes. Iv'e lived in the Australian Outback for 25 years. In the last 10 years nothing is as it used to be. The weather is backtofront and ass about. Cold when Its hot, floods when its dry as a bone. In land monsoons, and where bloody well 1000 kms from the nearest beach. Also reacently in Kakadu I believe we had our first Tornado. I thought they only happened in the northern hemisphere, USA etc. The Aussie wildlife have spent millions of years adapting to this country. Big and small alike are now starting to show signs of depletion. Though experiance with studies of reptiles and native flora and fauna Ive seen a change in behaviour and the ongoing adaptions. Bush fires never cease, droughts and floodings in places unexpected.

I have provided facts and still have only recieved theories and references to "classic astrology", lol. Atleast make this interesting and provide some legit information please.The "height of human industrial production worldwide" is occuring right now and ever rising. Once again, look at the graph I posted showing how much C02 we are pumping into the air and how it is increasing (remember there is still C02 trapped from all the other years that is still building up):

The article you posted sounds like non-sense and not scientific at all.Why are you denying even the most basic scientific fact that an increase in greenhouse gases traps more of the suns rays which results in an increases the temperature? All your posts are the same, you just keep calling it a myth and saying it's impossible for us to affect our atmosphere. Then you're talking about your "classic astrology" and how Stephen Hawking is wrong and doesn't know what he is talking about. Do you also believe the earth is flat in your "classic astrology"? Do you think God is protecting the earth from our C02 emissions? Well he's not and we have to accept responsibility and face the facts.

Well, you can keep on "LOL" ~ but obviously, you express little knowledge about Classical Astrology as you do about what is causing global warming. Try reading more seriously, and paying closer attention, that would greatly help you to understand why the Earth's climate behaves the way that it does.

God regulates all things, and time would not exist without the motion of the planets. Moreover, it was classical astrologers who maintained that the Earth was NOT flat, and that it revolved around the Sun. Check your facts, and learn about classical astrology rather than mocking something you clearly don't have a clue as to what you are talking about, ok?

By the way, your "graph" doesn't prove "global warming" so you ought to try to do better than that. Get real dude.

Try more scientific facts rather than believing in the myth of "man-made global warming" ~ because if anything is funny, it is that ~

Global Warming: Why The Sun Is The Cause, Not People
By Theodore White, Astrometeorologist

As the worldwide hype over man-made climate change peaks with the advent of Al Gore's film, An Inconvenient Truth and the 2007 climate change report from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) there continues to be little evidence that humans are the cause of worldwide climate change, or, global warming.

The stated claims of the IPCC, which was created by the United Nations in 1988 was to assess what was called scientific information relevant to "human-induced climate change" and the "impacts of human-induced climate change" to develop "options for adaptation and mitigation."

What is often missed is that all the scientific data does not support man-made climate change, but rather ~ the opposite ~ solar forced climate change.

Meaning that the Sun is the cause of what is known as "global warming."

Back in the 1980s, when climate scientists began to notice that sea-surface temperatures were rising, speculation developed that suggested that perhaps the release of carbon into the atmosphere was the cause.

This came about in part because of climate research that showed that the Earth's ozone layers at the poles were showing signs of stress. We now know that the reasons for this was due to the increased magnetic activity of the Sun, which caused intense radiation storms just above the Earth's atmosphere ~ resulting in gaps observed in the Earth's ozone layers.

Several years ago over 17,000 scientists signed a petition about the Kyoto Protocol that stated that "there is no credible evidence that harmful man induced climate change (global warming) is occurring."

They also maintained this about the Earth's ozone layer ~

"The ozone holes in the atmosphere in the Arctic and Antarctic regions are naturally occurring due to meteorological effects, expanding and contracting with the change of season. The meteorological effects consist of high velocity stratospheric level winds that peak during local winter and act to destroy ozone. Also there is less ultraviolet (UV) radiation from the Sun due to the inclination of Earth's axis during hemispheric Winter.

Another variability impacting ozone layer density is the +/- 11 year sunspot cycle. When solar activity is intense at a peak of a solar cycle the ozone layer density increases due to increased UV radiation, just the opposite occurs at the bottom of solar cycle when the Sun is relatively quiet. Changes in ozone layer density is a normal occurrence."

Back in the late 1980s, the majority of mainstream climate scientists didn't even acknowledge global warming, much less man-made climate change, and laughed at the mention of "global warming" ~ that is ~ until the millions of federal and international dollars to study climate change started filling their coffers.

The myth of man-made global warming took off in the early 1990s, and continued throughout the decade as sea-surface temperatures and world temperatures continued to rise to record levels. Clearly, the Earth was warming, but the question remained: what was causing it?

One can match the increase in climate science funding to the increasingly shrill calls blaming global warming on man-made emissions. The more monies devoted to global warming ~ the more mainstream scientists and the media began pushing this myth onto the worldwide public stage.

Even in the scientific world ~ the dollar is king.

When the tens of multi-millions (almost billion) in federal and international dollars start to dry up on man-made climate change, just watch how many scientists drop the premise of man-made climate change like a bad habit.

They will go back to doing what they were doing before ~ and that was laughing at man-made climate change, and they were laughing before the money shut them up and they filled their pockets with money they did not deserve in the first place on man-made climate change.

Why?

Because man-made global warming does not exist.

It never did.

In classical scientific astrology, there are known celestial cycles ranging from months, to years, and over many decades that repeat themselves and correlate to events, including climate and weather. Astrometeorology is one of the oldest branches of classical scientific astrology, as Kim Farnell notes ~

"The forecasting of weather was considered to be part of natural astrology, which encompassed a geocosmic relationships between celestial phenomena and the natural environment of the Earth. It was considered a unified, reputable body of knowledge and formed an important part of natural philosophy. The study of natural astrology reflected the view of the universe that everything is connected. All earthly forms were seen as bound to the power of the Sun, Moon, stars, planets, and other phenomena of celestial or atmospheric origin, such as meteor showers, comets, aurora borealis, lightning, and precipitation."

"Johannes Kepler (1571-1630) noted that certain magnetic angles among the planets had a major bearing upon weather patterns. He discovered further harmonic or magnetic angles of planetary configurations and also observed that certain types of terrestrial weather patterns coincided with certain magnetic angles forming among the planets. Before he conceived his laws of planetary motion, Kepler's initial recognition came through his accurate long-range weather forecasting in predicting the bitterly cold winter in Austria in 1593. Kepler published his observations from June 28 1618 to August 9 1629."

One such astrological cycle is one that lasts 36 years. We are currently in what is called the Cycle of the Sun (1980-2016) ~ and during the first 26 years of this cycle, the Sun has been witnessed to have doubled its magnetic field activity, causing intense radiation storms over the Earth's atmosphere which caused gaps in the Earth's ozone layers during the late 1980s and continued into the 1990s.

We are currently in the 27th year of solar forcing of the Earth's climate. The Sun has just recently reached its minimum phase and is expected to peak once again at maximum sometime in the years 2010-2012.

Some of the hottest years on record of the 20th century have taken place between 1980 to 2005 ~ among the hottest years being 1988, 1991, 1995, 1998 & 2005, when the Sun was recorded having some of its most powerful magnetic field activity.

Those years witnessed record high temperatures, powerful storms and hurricanes during the El Nino years of 1997/1998 when record heavy rains drenched the west coast of the U.S. and Canada, while heavy floods from hurricanes ravaged regions in Central America, where devastating storms resulted in the loss of thousands of lives.

Back in the year 1995, hundreds of people in the Midwest of the United States died because of oppressive summer heat. Global warming was highlighted again in Europe in 2003, when over 35,000 Europeans died because of the stifling summer heat.

Since the hottest years of the last century have taken place in the last 15 years, the calls blaming global warming on human Co2 emissions have risen as fast as the media and political pressures to "reverse" it.

But how can anyone reverse climate change on Earth that is caused directly by that star in the skies we call the Sun?

Temperature records over the last 27 years can be matched exactly to solar forcing of the Earth's climate. My argument for Solar Forcing is backed up by scientific evidence. Paleo-climatologists, climate scientists, astrophysicists and geophysicists have continue to maintain that the Sun is the cause of climate change ~ both global warming and global cooling.

The scientific evidence clearly shows that what is called man-made global warming is indeed a myth.

Moreover, many people who support the man-made global warming seem to ignore that some of the coldest winters in recorded history have also taken place during this time of global warming.

Climate scientists have noted that ~

"The record cold of the decades of the 1890's, 1940's, 1970's, 1980's and most recently the bitter northern hemisphere winters of 2000-2001, 2001-2002, 2002-2003 argue against the occurrence of harmful man induced climate change (global warming).

Also the Winters of 2000/2001 and 2004/2005 in Siberian Russia, as well as Winter 2005/2006 in Antarctica were among some of the [i]coldest in recorded history.

In January 2004, Boston, MA recorded one of the coldest month of January in 111 years. Grand Forks, ND set an all time record low of -44 degrees below zero and Fosston, MN saw also temperatures at -50 deg. below zero F and in Saskatchewan, Canada, saw record low temperatures fell to -62 deg. below zero F ~ all happening in the Winter of 2003/2004."[/i]

Below are more anomalous cold weather events that took place during the winters of 2004, 2005, 2006, and this past winter of 2007, that clearly depict that the Earth's climate is not only warming worldwide, but becoming increasingly colder as well.

In fact, astrological long-range climate forecasts continue to indicate that the Earth is transitioning from global warming to global cooling.

These anomalous colder events to come have already been taking place as a retired paleoclimatologist living in Florida has noted from news reports around the world during the years 2004 to 2007~

.....March 12, 2007 a North Pole expedition meant to bring attention to global warming was cancelled after one of the explorers got frostbite. The explorers, Ann Bancroft and Liv Arnesen, called off what was intended to be a 530-mile trek across the Arctic Ocean after Arnesen suffered frostbite on three of her toes. The extremely cold temperatures drained the batteries in their electronic equipment. Then there was the cold, quite a bit colder, Atwood said, then Bancroft and Arnesen had expected. One night they recorded the temperature inside their tent at 58 degrees below zero. Outside temperatures were exceeded 100 below zero at times, Atwood said. They were experienced temperatures that were not expected with global warming.....

.....The minimum temperature on Mt. Mansfield, VT on March 6, 2007 was -28 deg. F, breaking the old record of -25 deg. F set in 1955. On March 7, 2007 numerous minimum temperature records fell across Vermont at lower elevations. Missisquoi River at an elevation of 410 feet saw a minimum temperature of -37 deg. F. Island Pond at an elevation of 1201 feet saw a minimum temperature of -35 deg. F.....

.....The minimum temperature on Mt. Washington, NH on March 7, 2007 was -30 deg. F, breaking the old record of -21 deg. F set in 1937.....

.....The minimum temperature on Mt. Washington, NH on March 6, 2007 was -37 deg. F, breaking the old record of -23 deg. F set in 1950. The -37 deg. F reading fell short by one degree of the all time coldest March temperature of -38 deg. F set in 1950.....

.....In Toronto, Ontario, Canada, February 2007 was the coldest since February 1912.....

....On January 15, 2007 Lancaster, CA broke their monthly record, coming within one degree of their all-time record low temperature. LANCASTER TEMPERATURE OF 03 DEGREES TODAY SET A NEW MONTHLY RECORD FOR JANUARY. THE COLDEST ALL TIME RECORD FOR LANCASTER WAS 02 DEGREES SET DECEMBER 24 1984.....

.....In Boston, MA, USA, the minimum temperature dropped to 6 degrees on March 6, 2007, the coldest March minimum temperature since March 10, 1984.....

.....March 2006, New England, USA suffered through an unusually cold late season Arctic airmass. The Northeast on March 6, 2007 was the coldest March 6th since 1950.....

.....On June 1, 2005 measurable snow fell for the first time in recorded history in tropical Somalia. Falling at an elevation of 1000 feet at Puntland in the NE part of the country. Ironically, the freak snowstorm was blamed on man induced global warming....

.....The BBC reported that during the week of February 12, 2007 snow fell in Nepal's capital, Katmandu for the first time since 1944.

.....During the week of February 19, 2007 snow fell in portions of Argentina that have never seen snow so early in the season (late summer). A comparison would be snow in Philadelphia, PA on August 19th.....

.....On February 17, 2007 a minimum temperature of 18.6 deg. F was observed at Holder in Citrus County (the west central peninsula) of Florida. This temperature was the coldest ever observed so late in the winter season.....

.....On February 15, 2007 snow fell in Pensacola, Florida for the 4th time this winter season in this southern state.....

.....Snow showers fell across portions of the central peninsula of Florida on November 21-22, 2006, including the Orlando metro area. The snow showers were the earliest ever observed on the central peninsula and state and reported since European settlers arrived. On the morning of November 22, 2006 Archbold which is located on the south central peninsula region observed a minimum temperature of 28 deg.....

.....It snowed in downtown Los Angeles for the first time in modern times on Saturday February 18, 2006.....

.....During the first two weeks of February 2006 all of Alaska with the exception of the panhandle region was in the grip of extreme below zero temperature. Inland area temperatures repeatedly dropped into the -50 to -65 deg. F below zero range.....

.....During the first week of December 2005 the coldest minimum temperatures ever observed so early in the season chilled the lower 48 states, with the exception of the Florida Peninsula. Below zero daytime readings dipped deep into Colorado and Kansas, with night time sub zero readings into west Texas. Frozen precipitation fell at Corpus Christi and Brownsville, TX and into northern Mexico S-SW of Brownsville and Del Rio. Some north and central Plains region areas saw minimum temperatures in the -20 to -30 deg. below zero range.....

.....November 2005 was the coldest in the last 30 years in the northern Great Plains, Mid West and Great Lakes regions.....

....During the Southern Hemisphere Winter of 2005 Russia's Vostok base on the ice cap of East Antarctica set the new all time coldest minimum temperature on Earth of -132 deg. below zero. The previous record was -129 deg below zero......The high of -101 degrees was fully 25 degrees below average for early May. The low was -104 degrees, or about 15 degrees below average.....

.....April 25, 2005 a 31.9 deg. minimum temperature observed in central Florida. Two other locations observed 32 deg.

.....Sunday-Monday April 24-25, 2005. A record breaking late season snowfall has occurred in parts of Indiana, Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania. Snowfall totals of up to 12-24" have been measured.

.....Sunday April 17, 2005 a 31.8 deg. minimum temperature is observed in central Florida.....

.....Greater Havana, Cuba, dawned rather chilly Monday morning April 4, 2005. At the Jose Marti international airport south of the city's center, the temperature dipped to 50 degrees whereas the average daily low during April is 70. A minimum temperature of 31.6 deg. was also observed in central Florida.....

.....Late season chill has descended on southeast Europe. At the same time, moisture streaming in from the Mediterranean has produced snow over parts of Turkey. The mountainous terrain over central Turkey has had a few inches of snow. Even in the capital city, Ankara, the snow managed to accumulate as temperatures were just below freezing and the snow was briefly heavy.....

.....The snowfall at Cleveland Hopkins airport for the day is 6.4 inches. This brings the snowfall total for the 2004-2005 season to 105.3 inches, which breaks the all time record for the snowiest season at Cleveland Hopkins airport, which was 101.1 inches in 1995-1996.....

.....The coldest night on record occurred across the Netherlands in March 2005. Sub-zero readings were recorded across the country. Marknesse fell to an overnight low of -5F. Such cold weather capped a week of heavy snows which buried some parts of the country under 20 inches. This winter has been the snowiest in the past 50 years for the Netherlands. In some parts of Holland snowfall was up to 20 inches, the highest levels recorded for March in the past 20 to 25 years, the Dutch meteorological institute said.....

.....Snow-covered palm trees in the Mediterranean, travel chaos on the continent and a rise in heating costs are the results of an unusual European cold snap.....

.....In Winter 2005/2006 Italy's port city of Genoa was paralyzed by a blanket of rare late winter white stuff that caused traffic chaos as far away as Milan, in one of the coldest starts to March on record, meteorologists said. Authorities closed Genoa airport, shut city schools and ordered buses off the roads as a blizzard blanketed the Liguria coastline. Milan also got a rare covering of snow during the morning, as did the nearby cities of Turin and Parma. In Turin, the thermometer fell to a record 17 Fahrenheit overnight, while Rome suffered its coldest March for 18 years.....

.....Heavy snowfall and below-freezing temperatures across most of northern and central Greece in winter 2005/2006 cut off dozens of mountain villages, blocked roads and led authorities to close some schools. In Spain, renowned for its warm winter sunshine in parts, palm trees in the Mediterranean city of Barcelona have been topped with snow and Madrid has seen its heaviest snowfall for about 15 years.....

One of the worst winters in decades in 2005/2006 brought heavy snows and cold air to Afghanistan and Pakistan. In Pakistan, over 300 people have died from the series of heavy snowfalls in the past few weeks. The heavy snows have stranded over hundreds of thousands of people in Kashmir.....

That same winter of 2005/2006 brought bitter cold in much of central Quebec, Canada. At Lac Benoit, for example, the early morning low was -48 degrees. Near Manouane, -46 degrees was registered early Monday, and the -43 degrees registered at Bonnard was a full 30 degrees below average.....

.....Heavy snowfall in Indian-controlled Kashmir has claimed more than 100 lives, and dozens were still missing Monday, the BBC reported. The snow created avalanches over villages south of Srinagar, destroying homes and killing about 70 people. Indian soldiers and medical personnel were searching for survivors Monday in the region, where 15 feet of snow has fallen since Friday.....

.....Snow even fell in northernmost Africa. In Algeria, the city of Constantine laid under seven inches of snow. A few weeks prior the same region was hit with 24-26" of the white stuff.....

.....In northern Norway, the town of Kautokeino set consecutive lows of -27 and -26 degrees Monday and Tuesday. These were followed by afternoon highs of -12 and -10 degrees. In February, an average day here would have a low of 0 and a high of 13 degrees, so the weather has been considerably colder than usual.....

.....An impressive cold wave persisted over much of the Balkan Peninsula that same winter. In Serbia, Sjenica registered consecutive lows of -17, -21, -21, -19 and -20 degrees F, whereas February's mean daily low is 23. Bitola, Macedonia, dipped 11 to 14 degrees below zero each of these five mornings.....

.....Cold rains and mountain snows fell along the eastern shores of the Mediterranean Sea. The latest bout of wet weather boosted rainfall at Beirut, Lebanon, to about six inches since the start of the month. Snow fell low enough to blanket ground down to at least 1000 feet, thereby whitening the hills from Lebanon south into Israel and the West Bank, and also to Amman, Jordan.....

Those newsworthy and numerous anomalous weather events taken from around the world is proof that the Earth's climate is indeed in transition from global warming towards global cooling, that is solar-forced. All climate and weather starts in space, and end up as weather on Earth.

This global cooling is expected to pick up pace in the 2010s, and 2020s, and will peak around the year 2034/2035. This will mean less El Ninos and increasing La Nina climate conditions, along with much colder storms of the future. All this is forced by the Sun's activity. See ~

http://www.nexialinstitute.com/climate_el_nino.htm

According to my estimation, we are in the 27th year of Solar Forcing of the Earth's Climate. This global warming began in earnest in the year 1980, and according to my calculations, will come to an end in the year 2016.

While the world will continue to witness and experience the results of solar-forced global warming in rising sea-levels, excessive precipitation and powerful storms into the 2010s and 2020s, my astrological calculations shows that the Earth is headed for a colder cycle that will peak in the mid-2030s.

Until that time, we all will be living with what I call "extremes of weather" ~ in the form of increasingly anomalous climate conditions and weather events such as floods, strong tropical storms, hurricanes and cyclones, droughts, windstorms, heavy precipitation of continuing rains and significant snows, while the Earth transitions between warmer than average and colder than average temperatures.

See ~ http://www.john-daly.com/solar/solar.htm

See ~ http://www.john-daly.com/index.htm

http://www.geo.arizona.edu/palynology/geos...0climsolar.html

Although I am sure Al Gore and those who believe in man-made climate change mean well, but the evidence they present is just not proof of man-made global warming. However, it is proof of just plain GLOBAL WARMING ~ which has been ongoing since 1980 and continues today.

Remember the facts ~ that during the height of human industrial production worldwide, the Earth's climate actually COOLED. This was also due to the Sun.

Most people who push the myth of man-made climate change do not seem to fully appreciate just how powerful the Sun truly is, and how the Sun forces all climate change, not just on Earth, but on other planets as well, where there is no human Co2 production and emissions.

Those who want to force everyone else to accept climate change as "man-made" mindlessly are only fooling themselves, and in denial about astrophysical and geophysical laws of the cosmos and of nature on Earth.

No amount of negative environmentalistic mantras like "only that corporations and man is the cause of global warming" ~ is going to change the facts that the Sun forces the Earth's climate.

Those who fail to see that the Sun is the direct cause should have a reality check and stop cease blaming humans for what they are not doing, and never did, and that is cause global climate change through Co2 production.

Carbon is natural to the Earth, we are also made of it, and the oceans and mountains emit much more carbon into the Earth's atmosphere than we humans ever could.

There is no reason to deny less developed countries, like those in Africa, the means to have electricity, or to demand that they use solar energy when developed countries do not widely use solar-energy.

Using the resources of the Earth cleanly is good for business, and good for the world. To deny less developed nations the means to develop and grow by using the falsity of "man-made global warming" is a crime because it is not true. It never was and never will be.

It is the Sun that is the cause of all climate changes on the Earth ~ both global cooling AND global warming. Humans are not able to either cool and warm the earth, and there is NOTHING we can do to stop the activity of the Sun. All we can do is adapt to climate changes, while learning how to not pollute our air, and sea water.

As for global warming and climate change ~ only the SUN can accomplish this, and that is exactly what that star in the skies has been doing since the Earth was created ~ forcing climate change ~ worldwide.

I have snow in New Hampshire in april

Your unrealistic article is saying the biggest period of human industrial growth has come and gone when infact we are on a constant upward curve of C02 emissions. We are releasing more & more C02 into the air each year as my graph proves. Are you going to even deny that?

You are right about the sun causing climate change, yes it does happen but you are wrong where you think it's impossible for humans to hurt our atmosphere. Please explain to me how you think this C02 is being recycled when we are losing millions and millions of acres of trees every year from forest fires (from climate change) and deforestation. More greenhouse gases will increase the effects of climate change due to it trapping more of the suns rays.

The only thing "unrealistic" is just how much you under-estimate the Sun. That's not wise. Not wise at all. You should respect the power of the Sun much, much more than you do, and learn more about the Sun because it is the reason for all life on this planet ~ including your own.

Listen, that graph, and the others like it that you love to use, track the growth of the Industrial age. In the one above you highlight, since the American Civil War. So what? That has NOTHING to do with global warming. Show a graph from the Middle Ages, when populations experienced global warming as well. Where was the billions of metric tons of man-made Co2 emissions at that time?

Compare that graph of yours with actual recorded temperatures and you will note that there are decades of GLOBAL COOLING during rises of Co2 during the beginning of the Industrial Revolution ~ especially in western nations over that same period you highlight in the graph.

You use the words "the sun's rays" as if it is only secondary. How can I, or anyone take you seriously when you make the Sun sound as if it is merely there casting "rays" on the Earth? Are you aware that there are over 250,000 different kinds of cosmic rays, magnetic waves, etc., emitted from the Sun that pass through the Earth and that we can only record less than 10 of them? This is the problem you are having.

First you avoid that the Sun is the cause of climate change, then you falsely state that I (or anyone that disagrees with man-made global warming) and denies that it is impossible to "hurt our atmosphere." This is dishonest, and clearly shows that you are not looking at the scientific data objectively, and without bias.

Of course humans can "hurt" the environment, we can ruin air quality, destory land, and ruin water quality. It has been done before and is being done now. But that is NOT the reason for GLOBAL CLIMATE CHANGE, or global warming.

What will happen when, by the mid-2030s, it will be clear that the earth will have been cooling? Will you then say that that is man-made too?

Humans CANNOT force global climate change. That is a myth. A lie. It never has happened, and never will happen.

Only the SUN can do this, and all the scientific data shows that this is the truth.

Talking about cleaning our environment, saving trees, the birds, the bees, and making sure we all can breathe clean air and drink clean water is one thing ~ and I am ALL for it ~ but going out and blaming global warming on mankind is QUITE ANOTHER. It is not true and never has been true.

Moreover, carbon is natural to the Earth. The oceans, the mountains of Earth produce more Co2 than humans do. This is a fact. CO2 is not the reason for ozone depletion. The Sun is the reason.

During the 1980s and 1990s, the Sun caused intense radiation storms over the Earth that caused gaps to appear at the ozone layers at the Earth's poles. It also has caused the Earth to warm since this cycle began in 1980. We are now in the 27th year of Solar Forcing of the Earth's atmosphere. It has happened before and will happen again. This is a fact and has very, very little to do with Co2. The ozone reacts to solar radiation and is clearly related to the Sun's activity.

We can release even more Co2 into the atmosphere and it will not make the Earth any warmer than it already is now. No country ~ even all the countries of the world ~ are able to force climate change on the scale that the Sun does.

Learn much more about the Sun than you seem to know, because you obviously have a lot more to learn about that star that makes all the difference in the world to this planet. In fact, all the other planets in our solar system have been warming too since 1980 when this powerful solar cycle started and those other planets have no humans producing any Co2 whatsoever.

i couldnt of said it better theodore, bravo.

I never said everyone who disagrees with global warming denies it's impossible to hurt our atmosphere. I was acussing you of thinking that because of your own posts. Take a look:Nothing to do with climate change, eh? Think again.

Ya well said. Though I am curious as to how so many people get skin cancer these days? Is that due to the natrual thinning of the ozone layer? I know very little of this subject.

Again, re-read what I've said. Moreover, Reincarnated, you use the words "climate change" very, very loosely ~ by using it to claim humans are the reason for "global warming" and then at the same time mixing in that humans "impact the environment." Which one is it?

I will repost what I've said before. Try to understand what I've made clear about global warming ~

The only thing "unrealistic" is just how much you under-estimate the Sun. That's not wise. Not wise at all. You should respect the power of the Sun much, much more than you do, and learn more about the Sun because it is the reason for all life on this planet ~ including your own.

Listen, that graph, and the others like it that you love to use, track the growth of the Industrial age. In the one above you highlight, since the American Civil War. So what? That has NOTHING to do with global warming. Show a graph from the Middle Ages, when populations experienced global warming as well. Where was the billions of metric tons of man-made Co2 emissions at that time?

Compare that graph of yours with actual recorded temperatures and you will note that there are decades of GLOBAL COOLING during rises of Co2 during the beginning of the Industrial Revolution ~ especially in western nations over that same period you highlight in the graph.

You use the words "the sun's rays" as if it is only secondary. How can I, or anyone take you seriously when you make the Sun sound as if it is merely there casting "rays" on the Earth? Are you aware that there are over 250,000 different kinds of cosmic rays, magnetic waves, etc., emitted from the Sun that pass through the Earth and that we can only record less than 10 of them? This is the problem you are having.

First you avoid that the Sun is the cause of climate change, then you falsely state that I (or anyone that disagrees with man-made global warming) and denies that it is impossible to "hurt our atmosphere." This is dishonest, and clearly shows that you are not looking at the scientific data objectively, and without bias.

Of course humans can "hurt" the environment, we can ruin air quality, destory land, and ruin water quality. It has been done before and is being done now. But that is NOT the reason for GLOBAL CLIMATE CHANGE, or global warming.

What will happen when, by the mid-2030s, it will be clear that the earth will have been cooling? Will you then say that that is man-made too?

Humans CANNOT force global climate change. That is a myth. A lie. It never has happened, and never will happen.

Only the SUN can do this, and all the scientific data shows that this is the truth.

Talking about cleaning our environment, saving trees, the birds, the bees, and making sure we all can breathe clean air and drink clean water is one thing ~ and I am ALL for it ~ but going out and blaming global warming on mankind is QUITE ANOTHER. It is not true and never has been true.

Moreover, carbon is natural to the Earth. The oceans, the mountains of Earth produce more Co2 than humans do. This is a fact. CO2 is not the reason for ozone depletion. The Sun is the reason.

During the 1980s and 1990s, the Sun caused intense radiation storms over the Earth that caused gaps to appear at the ozone layers at the Earth's poles. It also has caused the Earth to warm since this cycle began in 1980. We are now in the 27th year of Solar Forcing of the Earth's atmosphere. It has happened before and will happen again. This is a fact and has very, very little to do with Co2. The ozone reacts to solar radiation and is clearly related to the Sun's activity.

We can release even more Co2 into the atmosphere and it will not make the Earth any warmer than it already is now. No country ~ even all the countries of the world ~ are able to force climate change on the scale that the Sun does.

Learn much more about the Sun than you seem to know, because you obviously have a lot more to learn about that star that makes all the difference in the world to this planet. In fact, all the other planets in our solar system have been warming too since 1980 when this powerful solar cycle started and those other planets have no humans producing any Co2 whatsoever.

Why can't it be both? It's all cause and effect... We're destroying the planet with out actions... Fairly simplistic, really...that is, if you're paying attention.
One would think with all your knowledge you would've been invited to: http://www.msnbc.msn.com:80/id/17953433/?GT1=9246
Or, did the mailman let the weatherman down?[left][/left]

No, it cannot be "both." Mankind is not responsible for climate change. The Sun is responsible. It is that simple.

Now, that does not mean that we humans cannot take responsiblity for protecting and taking care of God's good Earth, but to say that we are the cause of climate change ~ global warming ~ is wrong, and to state that is a crime, because we certainly are not.

As for the IPCC report, there are plenty of climate experts who are well aware of solar forcing; however, the mandate of the IPCC, as it was created back in 1988 by the U.N., was specifically to study only human intervention in the environment, but had little to do with blaming mankind for worldwide global warming. That "cause" was started in the 1990s, when millions of dollars turned some mainstream scientists into pushing the dubious claim of "man-made" global warming ~ which, as I've repeatedly stated ~ does not exist.

There is more Ice in the arctic NOW than in 1950.... 'nuff said.

Untrue.


Source

Source

Source

Oh, I guess since you said it, that must make it true! Thanks for the evidence.

I just watched An Inconvenient Truth this evening... apparently you and Theodore, the weatherman, haven't seen it. If I were either of you I'd watch it before you open your mouths again to change feet...
At least the weather guy has it half right...you, otoh, are completely wrong.

All the answers are right infront of you non believers! Search the internet, more and more information is leaking out. In all actuality any seasoned internet users will tell you this. The factiol information is pouring out! Dont deny the truth, Stand with the rest of us and take hold of it, harness it! And use the truth to set us all free

For those of you who believe we are not accelerating/worsening climate change by burning fossil fuels;
Can you please explain to me how you think all of the ever increasing C02 released into our atmosphere is being is being recycled?

Again, graylady, you're not correct. I did see An Inconvenient Truth, I viewed it a total of three times. And will watch it once more making it four times.

Why would you assume that I, or others, who do not agree with the myth of "man-made global warming" would not have watched it? I happen to like Al Gore, he's done a lot of good public service work over many years, and received a lot of bad breaks too that he clearly didn't deserve. But, like anyone, he can be incorrect about some things, and I happen to believe that he is clearly off the mark about man-made global warming.

I see his passion, respect it, because I'm passionate too. However, the scientific evidence we already have on climate change ~ planet wide ~ clearly proves that it is all solar-forced. This means ~ that the Sun is the reason for global warming, for global cooling, and everything that's in-between that we call the climate and the weather.

Experts on climate science ~ who are versed in space weather science, astrophyiscs, geophysics especially ~ know that the Sun is the cause of all climate change on this Earth, in fact, throughout the entire solar system.

This includes other planets in our system. The Sun is the center of this solar system (although technically, it is the Barycenter, but we won't go there right now. You can google it though, and see what I am talking about if you don't know what the Barycenter is)

Try to see the bigger picture if you will. If you are able to think globally, then expand that out more, and include the regions that the Earth, our planet, also lives in ~ and that is in space.

Think globally, by all means. But also think cosmically too. Expand outward, and you will be able to include the Sun as well. Just go out a little further, and ask yourself, is there anything above the Earth's atmosphere that directly impacts our climate? Can it effect change in the climate? Does it have direct contact with the Earth?

But, is it ok to watch a documentary, and after doing so, not happen to agree with its conclusions and findings because one is informed and knowledgable on the topic?

Common Sense adds another nail to the Coffin of the Ridiculous panic-generating idea of Global Warming

SOURCE

Global warming is happening and it's not man made nor induced. Has anyone seen this? - http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=44...=global+warming

A good video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwcvN_eM0lE

These three (3) links will go a long way towards helping you understand why the Sun is so important Reincarnated. Hope they will be of help ~

http://www.geo.arizona.edu/palynology/geos...22climatmo.html

http://www.geo.arizona.edu/palynology/geos...0climsolar.html

http://www.geo.arizona.edu/palynology/geos...1climastro.html

The first link gives the basics as to how greenhouse gases work but I don't see anything explaining what is offsetting the tremendous amount of C02 trapped in our atmosphere. Or maybe I missed it? The last link you posted is the "Milankovitch cycle Theory" and cannot be taken seriously.

Here is a list explaining the major flaws in that theory;


Perhaps you wouldn't mind simply typing your answers, or using copy & paste along with a source, instead of posting a bunch of links and making me hunt down your answer? It would make this debate easier. It would also be nice if you could provide some legit information instead of sounding like a broken record and constantly repeating lines such as;
Something funny I noticed;Gee, looks like receiving is contradicting himself by cheering on Theodore. What a hypocrite!

You know Reincarnated, I've noticed that when you post your links ~ they are the ONLY ones you say are worthy. And when others post scientific links ~ you then proceed to quickly judge and dismiss them out of hand as they "cannot be taken seriously" and then asking someone to not make you "hunt down your answer?"

The real question is Reincarnated: are you serious? Is it that difficult to spend more than a couple of minutes reading and taking in the information? Must be great to be able to make those instant judgements. Wow...

Listen man, this isn't a popularity contest, ok? If you cannot make a strong case for your own argument without calling people "hypocrites" and then asking someone to think for you because you are just too lazy to study the content of the scientific links ~ then perhaps you are the one that is not serious and practicing hypocracy.

To debate, try getting this ~ you FIRST have to know about that which you are debating. You've shown that you are biased towards only one point of view and too easily dismiss the links of others who present a very strong case for solar forcing of Earth's climate.

So, do us all a favor, huh? Please stay on topic and take the time (more than five seconds, ok) to actually STUDY the links of solar forcing of the climate without asking others to do the reading and thinking for you.

By all means, do think for yourself, but, the key word is to ~ think. Ok? Let's try not to be quickly dismissive of others who challenge "man-made global warming" and make things personal because you somehow feel threatened by this point of view. No one is threatening you Reincarnated, so there's no need for you to be defensive. Ok? I've read your links, and posts, and graphs too.

Try doing the same with these other links and show some balance in your views before instantly judging them (like you did Milankovitch) which I highly doubt you've even comprehended considering your instant dismissive comments to the contrary in such a short period of time.

Pushing through the market square, so many mothers sighing. News had just come over, we had five years left to cry in.
News guy wept and told us, earth, was really dying. Cried so much his face was wet, then I knew he was not lying.

Not sure why people say GW is a myth?

I mean are the polar ice caps melting........YES they are.

There is far greater dangers to GW than just warmer temperatures.

For example in the Atlantic Ocean you have something called the Jet Stream. This is a conveyor belt type system that brings cool water from the North down south, it warms and warm water rises and cold water sinks. So you have a cyclical mechanised conveyor belt of cold water moving belowe and warm water rising and moving on top. This controls winds, clouds, and temperatures.

What happens when the ice caps begin melting and putting more COLD, FRESH water into our salty, proportionate Jet Stream......You have a change in the Jet Stream that causes extreme weather during this ongoing transition.

With the melting of the caps you also have an increase in water levels in the oceans. This affects something called the Tidal Buldge, if you look at Earth from space there is a definite buldge on the side where the moon is located, this is what causes tides as a result of the moon gravity.

If the Tidal Buldge gets bigger, and the Earthy is spinning, you get the same type of effect as an unbalanced tire......a WOBBLE!!

If the Earth wobbles ever so slighty as a result of the increase in size of the Tidal Buldge we will experience Techtonic reactions....more Earth Quakes, more Volcanoes. All this will take place while the Earth corrects its wobble along it's ecliptic.

The Earth will definetly survive and correct itself , but the damage as a result will cause a very rocky ride for the infastructure we humans have constructed during our existence here.

I have posted legit information that you have not been able to prove wrong. It's easy to post links all day and say "find whatever answers you have in here".But if he followed the trashy logic in the article he posted, that would render your opinions as non-sense. But since in this case it is in his favor, it's fine with him! These hypocritical actions should be brought to light so members can see the games you like to play. As I said before, I have read your links and have not found what I'm looking for. If you are going to continue refusing to answer then don't accuse me of going off topic.Once again, I have read the links you posted and I did not find my answer. What is so hard about typing it yourself? It's funny you accuse me of going off topic when I'm asking you to elaborate a few links you posted and you are refusing to do so. Then you posted a theory with many major flaws and expect that to be proof. People who repeatedly claim that it's impossible for humans to affect our climate by burning fossil fuels are a threat to our enviroment. Your point of view threatens us all and we should all take it personally.It contains several major flaws and it is still a theory.

Perhaps, if you would read and study the links on Solar Forcing ~ rather than trying to find things to support your own opinions of man-made global warming, you might just learn more about why the Sun is the reason for Global Warming.

Listen Reincarnated, you've done this quite a bit already, which is make your own "claims" ~ but it is obvious that you've not completed your understandings of climate science. Certainly, you appear to lack basic understanding of even the Sun, and fail to note that it is the Sun that is the major energy producer on this planet.

My point of view does NOT threaten us all. Only you. And that's a shame, but it is your choice. Ok pal? No one can make you believe anything you do not, however, it is obvious that you don't know a lot about your planet, and certainly not about astrophysical and geophysical facts.

Try learning more before concluding that there are "flaws" ~ just how, may I ask you, would you know that? What flaws are there that the Sun forces the Earth's climate? I mean, duh, it is very obvious that it does. So how does you saying it is still a "theory" mean that this is so?

My point of view holds promise for humanity, and many others share it. The reason why it "threatens" you is that you've ALREADY decided that man is the cause of global warming, and for some strange reason, feel that if you were somehow wrong about it, that that would mean what exactly? It's ok, that is how we sometimes come into understanding more about the world and the comos. Dropping our predispositions of biases, and mis-informed opinions to accept some things we did not yet consider, nor, even know about.

By forecasting advance climate conditions astronomically ~ you will have many months, and years of preparation for climate change. Rather than running around blaming it on MAN. Give it a rest why don't you and read more FIRST about that Sun in the skies before blaming everything on Mankind, or which you are a part of by the way.

We humans have ENOUGH problems to deal with, so, stop blaming everything on humans. When it comes to global warming, and global cooling, and ALL THAT IS IN-BETWEEN ~ look up in the sky, is it a bird, a plane? NO. It's the SUN.

There's NOTHING we can do about the Sun. It is there, and will stay there doing EXACTLY what it has been doing since the beginning of Time. All we can do is adapt, and this means forecasting ~ not HYPE ~ and that is what you and some others have been doing with this "man-made global warming" snick you've got going ~ hyping it, and you barely know what you are talking about in the first place.

Stop believing everything you hear and get informed. That means READING & STUDYING the scientific facts and knowing the difference between fake-directed stuff and the real thing. You haven't learned that yet, it is obvious from your posts. Get informed on the SUN-EARTH system, ok?

That is where ALL CLIMATE CHANGE COME FROM ~ the SUN.

With that "man-made global waming" ~ you are just wasting your time, and time my friend, is one thing none of us cannot afford to waste.

well, if people would stop farting so much, then maybe all the ice would stop melting

Blah Blah Blah, answer my question already! Stop being a hypocrite and avoiding debate, this is what these forums are for! Listen, we all know the Sun is the main energy source to Earth, who do we think we are? Preschoolers? The question isn't WHERE this warming is coming from because we all know that, its WHAT is trapping it in our atmopshere and WHAT is accelerating climate change at a pace never before seen. I thought you are supposed to be some professional "astrometeorologist"? You sound more like an immature 13 year old with a telescope from Wal-Mart.

So, this is your answer? "Blah, blah, blah," and references to telescopes from Wal-Mart? And you call me "immature?" I much older than 13 pal, and know climate science. Warming never before seen?Come on. Learn much more than you do about climate and space weather science before going any further, ok?

Scroll back up to those scientific links I posted. Spend more than "pre-schooler time" on them Reincarnated, before trying to blame global warming on us poor humans. Avoid debate? How are you able to debate at all when you exhibit little knowledge about climate change in the first place? How is that possible?

Listen, opinion is one thing. But yours is not even informed, you're just recycling all the myth-making that you've heard, on top of the name-calling. Hypocrite? What does that have to do with solar forcing of the Earth's climate? Because I don't support man-made global warming, that makes me a hypocritical? How? I live on this planet like you do and I live as Green as possible. You don't know me bud.

Your argument is already weak enough as it is Reincarnated, don't make it any more weaker by slinging cheap lines. Jeez.

Instead of telling me I'm wrong and acting like your knowledge of theories with major flaws is holier than thou, why don't you prove me wrong? Show us evidence. You also keep assuming what my thoughts are on global warming and even ignore me when I say otherwise, another one of your immature games. You are being a hypocrite because you are accusing me of hindering the topic and debate when you can't even respond properly to a post. Notice how you still haven't answered my question yet, you are only making things more difficult.

I will repeat myself; I believe the burning of fossil fuels by humans has greatly increased and worsened the effects of natural climate change. You are trying to be Mr. Hot Shot over there and assuming I'm a dumbwit who thinks C02 is the reason why climate change exists. I have done my research and plenty of it. I've been doing projects and writing papers on climate change since high school and into college. I have read and heard just about every theory out there. While solar forces may be the orgin of climate change, our C02 emissions are speeding up and worsening it's effects. That is where you are wrong and so far you haven't been able to prove otherwise.

This is to show you how high our greenhouse gas levels are and how it got that way: