Well according to you brave God is everything. So this strikes me as a way of making a claim that can't be debated.

However if God is "everything" and it just IS then where do you show evidence of any sort of parameter of God? So what is the point in even quantifying or clarifying this God? If God is every single thing then what is the point in calling it "GOD"?

How do you "believe" in something that is everything? What's the point? If I believe that the Universe "is" I don't need to believe IN the Universe. I just accept it.

You state that you believe in Christ and that you believe in Mysticism? Why? Why do you attempt to connect with something that is so permeating that it is infinite?

In addition you state that "without Consciousness there is no God" so you have slapped a boundary on God with a thing that you have argued we can't prove exists in the first place.

What do you mean by consciousness? So to a person in a coma there is no God? To something that is dead there is no God? If God is everything who are you to arbitrarily slap limits on him?

Especially limits that are beyond human comprehension? For all you know God could flourish in death or lack of consciousness.

Well, if you ask me an omnipresent and omnipotent God has a lot more flaws than that.

So you believe that anything conceivable must exist? Where's any evidence of that? I am clearly imagining a $10 bill sitting on my desk, and what do you know.. it doesn't exist. I have the concept, but it is not in existence. I can not will things into being, and I do not shape my world. I can imagine things that do not exist. That is very obvious and simple.

People imagine that they can fly. They can't.

Well, what if one defines God as the sum of all energy?

Can we find an explanation of the great universe? Is there any convincing interpretation of the secret of existence? We realize that no family can function properly without a responsible head, that no city can prosperously exist without sound administration, and that no state can survive without a leader of some kind. We also realize that nothing comes into being on its own. Moreover, I observe that the universe exists and functions in the most orderly manner, and that it has survived for hundreds of thousand of years. Can we then say that all this is accidental and haphazard? Can we attribute the existence of man and the whole world to mere chance, Man represents only a very small portion of the great universe. And if he can make plans and appreciate the merits of planning, then his own existence and the survival of the universe must also be a planned policy. This means that there is an extraordinary power to bring things into being and keep them moving in order.

In the world then must be a great force in action to keep everything in order. In the beautiful nature there must be a Great creator who creates the most charming pieces of art produces every thing for a special purpose in life. The deeply enlightened people recognize this creator and call him "God". He is not a man because no man can create or make another man. He is not an animal, nor he is a plant. He is neither an Idol nor is He a statue of any kind because non of these things can make itself or create anything else. He is different from all these things because he is the maker and keeper of them all. The maker of anything must be different from and greater than things which he makes.

* how would we know about angels if they havent ever been reaveled to messengers of our kind to spread the word of god?

* Word of god in books so it wont be forgotten for those many years, and if it wasnt on books we wouldnt know anything about it today? if we had it for ourself it will die with us too, others wont know about it.

* I have noticed that we have many versions of the Bible, But the Quran has only 1 version in all copies. Where is the oldest and first version of the bible? =/

Order is simply our way of looking at things. The world is actually quite random. We have a tendency to see patterns in things but in actuality it is just our perspective.

Yeah.



I agree. There is no point. But then what is the point of calling everything everything when everything is everything else (science has proven all is energy)?



But I believe that the universe exists on a level more than the material (even though it is all God but we have to break the argument up for arguments sake) concept we have limited ourselves to. Sure "God" (or tao, infinite consciousness, isness, great spirit, allah or flying spagetti monster) exists in all things material but I have to be humble to the fact that this fact I am stating cannot be fully realized or comprehended by someone who isn't oneself a saint or mystic.

The material world or "relative world" at one level exists without question. But its existence is due solely because of the oneness that pervades and created it. For as I have put in my posts it ultimately is God. However to realize this on the same level as we state it one must undergo certain conditions of mortifications of imagination, will, consciousness, feelings, desires etc.

I believe it and accept it but do not know it on the level that can be attained. However without faith I'll never be able to attain it. It is paradoxical, for it can experienced directly but not described. Because what is experienced is infinite but inorder to describe it we must resort to finite terms, words and concepts. Hence the constant paradox and contradictions when describing "God".

The description is not the described.



I do not believe in Jesus Christ as my lord and saviour in the sense that If I hold a belief system that he will "save me" I will be saved, no that would be not taking responsibility for my actions nor making any serious effort for my own deliverance from the sufferings of time which only union with the eternal can sooth. Experience of God as in a genuine mystical experiences is beyond belief .

I actually agree with the perennial philosophy which Jesus (whether he existed ornot) preached which is the means and knowledge to becoming one's own saviour. This same message is preached in Hinduism, Buddhism, Taosim, Sufism etc. Though the essence is the same they just using differet vocabularies and contexts.




Because God is us. And we are God. Because we are one and the same with God, God cannot exist without us. We never were and then were created by God. Like God we always were and always will be. We are eternity itself, however we (especially me) are ignorant of this fact and so identify with our finite body. The limitations we impose on God are the same as the limitations we impose on ourselves.



This is where we get real dirty and philosophical.......I mean this requires an open mind to all possibility or at least a large measure of it. When we go to sleep and dream we have consciousness. We are aware of our dream selves or aware of dream surroundings etc. But when we enter deep sleep without dreams we are conscious of nothing at all. Not even aware that we are not aware. No awareness.........Just nothing, not even nothing because nothing is something. We arnt even aware of nothing in deep sleep.

But we know we are there (even if we dont at the time) because when we wake up we say "I had a good sleep". How could we make such a statement unless we knew we were there? Unconsciousness is the consciousness of no consciousness and therefore a form of consciousness.

It is like a cinema screen. You have the Screen which symbolizes the "Self/God" and when the projector projects images (ego/the mind/our conscious self and dream self) on the screen, although the images change and move on, although the images may be images of an ocean or fire, the screen (True Self/God) doesnt change. When the projector turns off the images the screen doesnt go with it, it is still there (deep sleep).

The images need the screen to be able to be seen. But the screen is indifferent to whether the images are there or not. The screen is who we truly are. It gives rise to all things but is not dependent on all things.



As long as we identify with our mind and body and not with the consciousness in which these have their being we will always be suffering. And yes it is beyond human comprehension....it truly is...hence the reason to mortify ourselves and detach from our "ego self" which imposes limitations on us when we actually have no limitation.



Of course God flourishes in death and lack of consciousness. I wasnt implying that before even though I sounded like I was, what I meant is that God is us and therefore cannot exist without us because to say that we dont exist is the same as saying God doesnt exist.

The hard thing is the fact that God although all things that exist in this world of opposites is also beyond them. And because of this we can only use these opposites to describe that which is beyond them,hence the paradoxes and contradictions.

Even though I say God is infinite consciousness I know this can be contradicted. For God is actually beyond consciousness and unconsciousness.

If your concept is not in existence then how could you have the concept in the first place? You can will things into being ,you just subconsciously believe so hard that the impossible can never be possible that you dont manifest that reality.

If you truly believed without an ounce of doubt that you could will ten dollars into being you wouldnt be believing it but knowing you could and nothing would be able to stop you from doing it. What we cannot think we cannot think, therefore we cannot say what we cannot think or say what doesnt exist.

If there was a universe with out conscoiusness in it to expirience the universe.... Does the universe exsist? does it matter that it exsists? MWAHAHAHAHAHAHA

brave new world, frankly it seems to me that you are trying to make the definition of God so abstract that no one can debate it, but yet your belief in this God is not abstract.

If God is everything as you say, then there is no need for us to acknowledge the "Godness" at all. Its basically so far removed as to be to the point of insignificance or nothingness.

You trying to push this theory into a belief system is where it falters.

If this is truly your definition of God then why do you spend so much time trying to debate atheists? If God is simply "everything" then whether we believe in it or not it exists is irrelevant.

Not choosing to participate in recognition of this "God" as you describe God, is where an atheist would be at that point.

An atheist is rejecting the claim, You'll notice in the example I gave on the other thread about John visiting the home,

(For those that haven't read it, Brave is home and John visits. Two hours later I come home and Brave says John was here. And I say I don't believe you. And Brave calls John but John was killed on the way home so Brave has no proof. I say "I don't believe that John was here")

In that post you will notice that John actually DID visit you Brave. But you can't prove it. And so it becomes insignificant in my life. I don't care that John visited. You care because you want me to believe you.

As an atheist, even if God is all these things you claim, you can't prove it. So at the end of the day it means nothing. I reject your claim and I don't believe that God exists, based on two things.

The first thing is always that you can't prove it.

The second thing is.....probably the part that believers can't understand. Ready

It makes no difference whatsoever in my life if it is true or not. Its so far removed from my life and what I consider important that I don't CARE if God exists. At this point, you can't prove it and I see no difference whatsoever in my life in not caring. Actually the difference I do see is that there is a lot more to life than God theories.

I think that's why people eventually give up the debate after a time. Because its not important. Perhaps in the early stages of my atheism I would want to prove that "God doesn't exist" but at this point my reality is "there is no proof, and I can't be bothered to worry about it."

I know that sounds ironic on this board but in my day to day life, God and his existence mean nothing. I raise my kids in their religions but it is so unimportant, its like watching cartoons. Not that big of a deal.

Its just when people make their faith, their very reason for existing that things go wonky in the world.

I'm not talking about "free will" here. I'm talking about the existence of ANY will



Oh really? How would you say the bass ostinatos and rhythmic accents complement the right hand melody in this Chick Corea excerpt (transcribed from La Fiesta, 1979) Given the relationship between the two hands, were would you start if you were doing a Schenkerian analysis of the passage?


In my humble opinion, music theory is hard as hell. You have this dense, dense structure and then the impossible question "what makes it happen? What the passage life?" Kind of like the philosophical query, "what makes the universe happen?"

Not trying to make the definition of God so abstract. Just pointing out that the version of God I believe in is abstract.

You seem to want everyone to have the same defintion of God which atheists like to pick fun at. The definition that God is some old wizard looking man in the sky that wrote texts and then wants us to follow the rules on those texts otherwise we go to hell.

There are more defintions of God than the western personal transcendent one which the fundamental Jews, christains and muslims believe in.

You dont realize that there are many versions abstract and not so abstract out there. Like with the Hindus, Taosists, Mahyahanist buddhists, Sufis, Christian mystics.

Try and reduce their version of the creator into anything less than abstact and you deserve a medal.

Sweetie this is the kind of thing that shows your age. Do you honestly believe what you just posted?

Of course I don't see "God" in the JudeoChristian tradition. Some big guy in the sky.

It helps your debate to belittle your debaters by suggesting that we have such a narrow minded view of God that we can't comprehend your big mystical interpretation of the Everything.

Its a little like the "Nothing" in the Never Ending Story, all that was needed way for Bastian to believe for it all to exist, the whole universe.

Nice theory. Nice fairy tale. NOT PROVEN.

Nice and slow........you can not prove it.

It seems you have already got the preconcieved notion and idea that God doesnt exist. You have already made up your mind before looking into it. I understand I know very little about God. To claim that a finite being like me can know alot about the infinite God (which is my real identity, not just me though everyones) is an act of arrogance. And I admit that I cant explain the little I do know without contradicting myself or being paradoxical because of the nature of the subject.

Either way those are my views. Im not trying to impose, take it or leave it.

But you are the one who is saying "some descriptions are too abstract".

I agree. God gets anthropomorphized to the point that he's like Santa Claus ("he sees you when you're sleeping, he knows when you're awake, he knows if you've been bad or good...")

Taoism doesn't have a humanistic God. It's possible to base a religion on an abstraction.

Again your age is showing. You assume that since you are so flummoxed by the abstract God theories, that the rest of us haven't investigated it much much more than you.


There is no arrogance. How can there be arrogance in irrelevance?

By your abstract definition of God, "God is everything" what difference does it make if acknowledge it or not.

In other words if I say I don't "believe in" oxygen. How is that arrogant? Does oxygen exist? Sure. But my belief in it is irrelevant.

If God is everything in this abstract way of yours, then what does this have to do with me? So what? I don't believe this theory because there is no proof. I don't care.

Like I said, if this is true then it is so far removed from the capabilities of man as to be insignificant, which as you have stated in the part I have bolded.


Ok God is everything. Now what? So what? Now by definition Everything is Everything. I say I might believe in the concept of Everything, but what has it to do with me?

Its when you try to stuff everything into a philosophy or religion, that it explodes.

You can't prove it to me, you can't even explain it. You believe in something you can't explain or proof.


So I sit here in disbelief.

Well why should it matter that the universe exists? Excellent point and well said.

In religions with an abstract diety the thing you believe in is the order and harmony with which all these pieces of "everything" fit together. Think Taoism

Its a belief system based on theory and things that can not be proven. If this "abstract diety" can not be proven then it is ...........

unproven.


You may believe in it if you wish. Its called an act of faith.


I don't. Because it has not been proven. Its called an act of disbelief.

You don't believe that the various fragments of the universe influence eachother and are part of a whole? (not being critical, just curious)

Ahhhhh tut tut tut tut. You are twisting my words. I never said it makes a difference whether you acknowledge God exists or not. The Thread at hand here is "Is there a God" not "Try and make truethat recognise that there is one".

Also I said that a finite being like me to think that I could know about the infinite is arogant. Not that knowing about finite things like oxygen etc is arrogant. We indeed do have experts and scientists who do know alot about oxygen.

You have twisted my words which will be self-evident to those who read the posts so I will illuminate my point with a quote by socrates of what I meant when I said " To claim that a finite being like me can know alot about the infinite God (which is my real identity, not just me though everyones) is an act of arrogance". Notice that I was referring to myself and not you?

Where did I state that you were arrogant in any of my last posts on this thread because of your beliefs?


Anyway this is what I mean since you cant understand it in my own words I'll cite someone elses:

True wisdom comes to each of us when we realize how little we understand about life, ourselves, and the world around us.

--Socrates

This in principle I believe also holds true with an infinite being whether personal or impersonal.



In future I wont participate in your threads. Nor again in this thread after this post. You think I am trying to convert you when that is not the case. I am simply putting forth my opinion on what I think constitutes as evidence for God's existence.



You cant disprove it to me.
So I sit here with my faith glowing as bright as ever.

I believe everything is random. I believe we see order where we wish to see order.


Here's an example


I was visiting a friend who had a two month old baby and we were discussing what the baby can see.

She said he could see "everything that we see" but it occurred to me that we fade out "everything" and tend to focus on what we want to see without even realizing it.

So a baby looking a person sitting on the couch would "See" everything, the couch, the pillows, the person, the clothing, the wall, the window, the lamp, the picture frames, etc etc.

I would tend to see the person, and the ambiance (to sum it up) but I would focus on the person.

So it is an effort to see the world a different way and aside from being a bit of fun, a complete waste of time.

I accept that it is all random. What that randomness means I don't know. I am open to anything but its more like "watching" rather than participating. Its interesting. That's it.


To Brave


I don't think you are trying to convert me. I just thing you make a lot of assumptions about other people's investigation into God theories and base it on your own former assumptions.

I was raised in a household that had a Buddhist altar in the attic and one of my sisters was Wiccan. My mother started out as Catholic and then we went to an Orthodox church and then it all dissolved into different things.

Our Easter tradition was going to church, coming home and my mother reading us Kafka and then reading our Tarot cards and giving out baskets.

Not a very traditional home to say the least. I have been exploring religion longer than you have been alive.

I daresay most people who would discuss these things don't do so from a narrow minded point of view.

But if you can't put things into your own words and have to hide behind the words of others because you are afraid your words are being "twisted" then perhaps you are correct that you don't have the capabilities to continue debating in a thread that asks people to only use their own words.

Huh... your interpretation of reality is different from mine.

[BTW- regarding your baby example, actually the difference in how babies see things is much greater than that. When they're born, they have a cerebrum but with very few neural networks. The network forms over the next 4 months. While it's developing babies have all sorts of weird cross-sensual impressions-- seeing sounds for example. I'll look around and send you the url. ]

Regards. Gotta go to work. [*** waves ***]

OK OK OK!!! Consciousness and the our body. we are conscious and our body channels energy through our senses (smell etc. etc.) we interprit them. Now NO ONE can say for sure that what we are expiriencing is REAL becuas we are all on a conscious level, you see red paint but to actually see it without your eyes, to see the universe with out your body... It's like trying to imagine what a mirror actually looks like because all it does is reflect light. "no one knows what the matrix is, you have to see it for yourself". People seem to forget that we are conscious they push it aside and become materialistic. I turned myself so materialistic i practically made myself Autistic. I saw everything as energy, causality, nothing mattered. In a materialistic point of view, there was no such thing a thing, everything was a whole it could not be described. The english language actually exsists on nothing when you describe something it's all understood in conscious terms but in physical terms it means nothing. When you get all materialistic the language breaks down and nothing can be described. Very depressing.

The universe is just energy. it follows what we call laws. It's just all causality, cause and effect. This system has played out for so long that we have a planet and life on it. We have organic systems and if they break (e.g lose blood) they system ceases (we die). Consciousness seems to be an illusion, we think we choose to get a drink but we it's all just chemicals in the brain and we get thirsty and we get a drink. No choice in the matter. Get me??? scientists and Atheists are THE WORST for using thee old we are Conscious and you are interpriting information and making patterns out of thing, Basically your brain is making a pattern out of that EVP and you thik you hear a ghost voice when it's just white noise, like you see a face in the clouds. Basically U can disprove any f**ken thing if your going to be like that. There is a cause for an effect, but because we are not the universe (well we are but.. you know) we are consciouss and in our rational minds and intelligence there could be a number of causes but there was one cause. I'm so workied up now i don't know what im on about, i'll post this anyway and see what happens.

I think that's a good post Mbyte.

Its what makes me skeptical. We assume that the order we have made out of our perception somehow means something.

I don't see why we can't accept what is IS....why do we need to subscribe meaning to these things.

If we don't put a meaning to something we would not be able to interprit anything. It's very hard to think at all when everything is a whole. You see we have to put meaning to something to understand. We see the edge of a table, it's just the edge of a table but when we make a ruler which is nothing but a piece of metal with black lines on it we have created a tool in the material plane to put a vulue to something in our mind. We just randonly draw two black lines on the metal strip and say that is a cm and it means something in our mind and then in reality we made books and told every other conscious being that a cm is this distance but in actuality there is no distance only in our mind.

I agree. We put meaning into things to help things run more smoothly, we draw parameters and assign value to everything.

So why would it not be any different with God theories. They are of use to mankind in setting boundaries, channeling energy, creating society etc. Creating order which we then attribute to our invention.

The cause and effect seem to be there, but in reality it is just random.

You see this is wear faith comes into it. i got sick of materialism and causality and just assumed that there was a value to consciousness that it means something. In all this mayham and all this moving cause and effect of energy, somewear in it all consciousness was created and it's something to be cherished. This my friend is wear we go into spirituality and other such things. You see when someone slaughters an animal they cause "pain" hmmmm there's something about this doesn't sound materialitic. This is wear empathy and emotion all come into play. We can actually cause pain to a conscious being. Now viewing the next example as a human it's like we have crated a child, we being the universe. It's might not be the best example or correct but can anyone else think of a better one?? well anyway this is wear things start rolling and fear and greed and happyness starts and we get sturucture and law and economy and money and all that stuff.

Not necessarily. If I was living in a cave and a thunderstorm raged outside I might be inclined to conceive that something greater than me is causing the weather to rage. Hence - the concept of god (something greater), which you seem to acknowledge is a concept.
God is a concept, as is morality. God and morality do not exist in nature...if they do not exist in nature how can they exist in our nature, other than conceptually?



How can you state this as fact?

Ah yes another thing i may add. Imagine if god was here for us and actually did help us out and talked to us in our minds. I went to a satinist site and it said flat out that christian god deosn't exsist satan is real adn he is our true creator and if you do a blood pact with satan he WILL talk to you and his demons WILL talk to you and tell you stuff. Your life will be better satan takes care of his own. He says that you should respect demons and they won't have a bad expirience with them, when you summon them. SOOOOOOOO for any atheist out there go on have a go at it and see if satan is real. I'm not going near that sh*t. An atheist should have no problam doing the ritual of summoning a demon... wel because they dont exsist. Well eeem what was the real point i was getting to... oh yes, when i first got over the flat out "yes satan will be there for you" i kinda went oh ok so now satan can take care of me..... thats sh*t. I finally have what i always wanted, a god that can actually prove himself and actually interact with me. You get me?? it's better if god stays annonymus.

http://www.angelfire.com/empire/serpentis666/HOME.html

For me the ultimate proof lies in death and birth. If there was a complete nothing after I die, that would be indeed a sorry state of affairs. On the otherhand, my feeling and hope is that the soul will carry on, eventually landing back into another being, not necessarily on this planet. Therefore, some order or organization must be at work to decide what goes where.

When I think of the human body, for me it is hard to contemplate evolution as described by Darwin. That doesn't mean I subscribe to the bible, Genesis or Adam and Eve. The sheer size of the universize also staggers me, and I wonder where it ends. When did it start? What was here before the big bang?

For me, living in this reality on earth has never demonstrated anything supernatural. I have never witnessed a ghost or spirit, nor has any higher power ever made contact with me. Not to say none of that exists, but rather "they" know confronting me directly would be a little upsetting and turn over the apple cart. Sometimes life is really cruel and one must ask why. Then there is an occasional miracle and the same question arises.

Just a few thoughts I had, sorry it wasn't in two paragraphs.

I know it's bad form to post a message that says nothing but "me too". But me too.

who cares, thats the idea behind this is to decide based on your intuitive sense of the piece, yet it doesn't mean anything this one size fits all way and thats the idea behind learning Schenkerian is to get away from that.... IMO ...the same applys to the universe... I wonder if you don't over complicate things ????LOL thats what i was trying to say i suppose, look for the simplicity...

brave this makes little sense it wouldn't matter if you made up our own or imitated anothers , its simply a way to understand the material, You are sounding heirarchial, heavily influenced by a moral dictum LOL.....

Yes I have heard of Jung....again its the letting go that one knows nature, i don't think in terms of absolutes Bravey..

Fair enough. I do not experience my beliefs as complex, but it's my head that they're coming out of, so what can I say? ***shrug***

To brave... Here is maybe a little more clear explanation of why I oppose your posting.

First, we look at the definition of God



God is by definition a supreme being. If God is everything, then it is not God. Everything is not one being. Everything is everything, and everything is different than God, whether God exists or not. By definition, God is not everything. I could say that I alone am God over everyone on earth. But since I am not a supreme being, that is not true, and nobody would have any reason to believe it's true. If I try to disprove the christian God by simply saying.. "no you're wrong see, I am god.. so the Christian God can't exist", nobody would pay any attention to me. The same goes for trying to prove God by saying "God is everything, everything is energy. Nothing is impossible, you just limit yourself because you believe it isn't possible." Tell me, you seem to be a strong believer in that the universe is whatever you want it to be, where are your Godly powers? You are to the point where you state it as fact, yet you are just as bound by the laws of physics as I am.

Anyway, the basic point is that you can't just make far-out claims and just expect people to go "Oh, I see your point. Everyone is God.. that makes plenty of sense."

LOL , the mind doing what it does best, over complicating things LOL...no insult intended , i have to remind myself too to be aware, Hyper is wonderful for reminding me of this...*shrugs with siara*

This is where I disagree with you.

BTW- I agree with you about the complexity thing. Big truths are simple.

beingness means a state of or condition, supreme means beyond beingness, all constructs ideas labels, happiness, blah blah etc to "no 'thing' , god is really no-thing at the very basic undertanding.... gasp , shock....surprise surprise... ohs and ahs.... its a little word used to describe, to undersaind a seeminly 'big' universe( the material) ...... its not a person or a daddy or a deity or a fairy or a pumpkin seed , is a generic term "used" to mean the many ideas, things, constructs blah blah....So boys and girls there are no gods only the ones you come up with yourself or except via hand me down beleifs.....


Brave simple, simple does it... simple down kid simple down...all that mess up in your head is confusing me...

behind the greatest of complexity lies the greatest of simplicisty, anyone who has acheived mastery of life. sees this.. ...

first i think one believes that there is a god a creator or they do not. god can not be proven to one who does not believe in his existence . with the rising of the sun and going down of the sun to me there must be a creator of such a great thing. the sound of the wind blowing through the limbs of a tree for such a wonderful sound to exist to me there must be a creator that too enjoys such music. the wings of an engle that sorr high in sky with such grace to me there must be a creator to create such a sight. how the planets are all circles. inline. and thus far no other life or other plant with such beauty. to me there must be a higher being a god who created all things .

once youve made that connection. and know that god exists the peace and comfort that one finds is unlike any feeling one could feel. it makes one continent satisified and nothing in the world can met that feeling of completence. just my input.

yes sbradj, one believes this to be so, so its so for them, but it dosen't make gods valid or real , the winds blowing through the tress is nature my friend,the same wind that I as a NB 'get' as we had a thread before one doesn't need to label this god to get how kool it is or deify it call it god thats the whole point that many are missing, ..why do you need to label ? or beleive,???these are the questions you would want to answer..

make the connection you are the connection LOL you have been connvinced you are something in need , hmm I wonder why, well its interesting how these ideas control ones experince...Can you spell Slave?????

That's not really typing randomly; that's choosing ten keys, out of a possible 61 character keys and repeatedly typing them. The only pattern is that the same keys are used, each more than once. Except for the apostrophe, which was only used once.

Depends on which god you are talking about.

If you mean the omniscient, omnipotent, perfect being of Abrahamic myth then I would say no, simply because we exist. The being described would have no requirement to create us (or anything) and, if we were created out of pure curiosity or love, then the perfect being would not let all the horrors that have been propagated upon humanity and this planet happen.

Believers would have us know there is some great cosmic plan in which we feature - but no such plan is necessary for this perfect being. All ends are available and known so 'planning' is an irrelevance.

If the being has created and abandoned us then it cannot be the God described.

If you are referring to the more capricious gods of other ancient mythologies though (Egyptian, Greek etc), then I would be inclined to believe these being may be possible. Having recognisably human qualities, their creation of us would make more sense, as would the mistakes made with our creation.

maybe you should catch wind of what you yourself are a slave too...nature itself will praise god..if one does not beleive in god there will be no need for revelation in him. . first you gotta believe...then you actualy know....without someone telling you anything..you began a personal relationship unlike anyother..

praise, hero worship another name for fear construct , modern day slavery for me , yet i can't speak for you....

Is there a god...

Hmm...

Can't say. It's rather ignorant to assume there strictly is, or strictly isn't. Have any of you been dead? Didn't think so. Thus, the logical things to do is to simply say "I don't know". Now, I do not know, thus, I do not believe in any god(s). I was once a christian, but never felt that "Inner-knowingness" that so many claim to. Honestly? Atleast for the god of Judaism, Islam, and Christianity: Bunch of bull made up by some *extremely* stoned 1st Century people who were sexually and emotionally maljusted.

Is it possible that "connection" is a man made placebo? Can you really "know" that god exists? It's a belief, not necessarily knowledge...

Would you please elucidate? How does nature praise god? Does a pack of wolves gather and pay homage? Do trees bend in awe? Does the tsunami wipe out thousands of people in the name of god? Are devastating earthquakes from god? Does a volcano erupt in heated praise of god?