me too(((HUGS))) now I'm glad you were able to help others with drug issues, my sister who was murdered was a herion addict i wish she could of met someone as you........

Just a quick post to say that I appreciate your humour, and yes the smilies do help alot.

but its not persoanl is that correct???? if i see myself as a sister i mean it as you are my family i would look out for you as a family member, like blood....I'm real intense anyways very passionate if i like you you know it..i love people too all peoel I see them alll as family.....

GOOD...im glad...cuz I would hate to think you would take anything I said...the wrong way...gosh noooooo

If you did..id be all....nooooooooooooooooooooooo jor noooooooooooo come back awwwwwwwwwww

*pm sheri* Jor has taken me thick...help!!!YIKES..go talk to him LOL

hee hee

Good for you Jor

Im really sorry to hear that sheri....about your sis

Aha but ya see IAMS is saying we have to be in groups..there is NO ALL in his eyes...its a lable thing...a christ following thing..groupif you dont follow his christ..you aint in his group..period..hence the lable...I dont care for lables...im UNIQUE...and proud of it

God knows im true to him and thats all that matters

I belive that we are ALL in the ONE catagory...all HUMAN BEINGS...all will kick the buckets some day too....

Sheri,

I like IamsSon, I find many of his views interesting, I even agree with a lot of them. Yes, I am liberal, very liberal. IamsSon is definately more conservative. Which is quite remarkable that we see eye to eye on a lot of things, considering our world views are quite a bit different.

Are he and I friendly? Yes, I'd say that is true. Are we friends? I don't know, how could I? I've never met him. But I'd say that I respect a lot of his opinions, I will vehemently disagree with others, some I will agree with wholeheartedly.

If I had to make an analogy it would be:

IamsSam and I are both hiking on the same path... we both have a map of the path, and he keeps his map in his hands and consults it frequently to ensure that he's on the right trail and will ask guidance from the Park Ranger to verify his position, he's conservative about his hiking adventure. My map is wadded up in my back pocket and I'm wandering down the path based on pure instinct. If I feel like I'm lost, I'll pull the map out and look at it and confirm whether i"m in the right place or not, if I still can't tell where I am, I'll sit down and wait till the Park Ranger comes and finds me. It's the same path, it's just a different method of hiking the same trail.

Sheri, I'm shocked, I'm really very sorry for your loss. I did not know this about you. I'm very, very, sorry.

Isnt this thread about...Fundy Atheists??


but I along with the rest have turned it into a quaker......I like....no I said I like...paths....we are bros and sisters....lables galore ...I love you too aww thread instead LMAO


Can we get back on topic?? aww go on...pretty please??


I'll start

Ahem

Yes there are those that I would consider fundy atheists...IMO a fundy atheist is someone who shows ignorance...throws dogs abuse...beats up a religious person...burns bibles (gosh even I wouldnt stoop as low..I dont believe in bibles but I wouldnt destroy one)..............people who want to ban prayers of any kind in schools....they should just let the school know, that their kid doesnt believe in God period...and let the school take it from there..no need to fuss about it

your thoughts??

I'm not sure what you mean, by not personal, but I think Mels just posted a great answer.


I'm not saying we have to be in groups, I am saying that we are in groups. You make quite a point about insuring no one thinks you're a Christian, and I am, so obviously you and I are in different groups; you make sure that you and I are not in the same group.

Nice go at taking this thread back OT! Commendable, really. Maybe it's just evolved into christian fundamentalism.

Thanks for putting us back in topic BM.

Would someone who demeans people for their beliefs, or makes fun of people's beliefs be a Fundy Atheist? I mean that seems to be part of the definition of Fundy Christians, so is it also part of the definition of Fundy Atheists?

Yes I would say that's true.

This may shock you..but believe it or not IAMS..you and I only differ in certain beiefs...appart from that (you may not like this next part)...YOU and I belong to ONE group....HUMAN BEINGS...and if you believe in God like I do..then you will go to the SAME place when we die...its called heaven...honest...and in heaven there is no room for your lil groups


Now back on topic

I DONT LIKE FUNDYS...PERIOD..and thanks for reminding me LOL whether it be a Fundy christian (grrr) or a fundy atheist grr I dislike them ALL

Dont you IAMS??? or do you only dislike the fundy atheists??? now you wouldnt want people to think you are baised now??? so what??

I was actually very subtly (maybe too subtly, sorry) trying to point out that the definition for fundamentalist seems to change to encompass anything we don't like about a particular group.

See, like Jor-el pointed out early in this thread, in some ways many of us here are fundamentalist Christians because we hold firmly to the foundations of Christianity. See the definition of fundamental is:

fun·da·men·tal (fŭn'də-mĕn'tl) adj.
1. Of or relating to the foundation or base; elementary: the fundamental laws of the universe.
2. Forming or serving as an essential component of a system or structure; central: an example that was fundamental to the argument.
3. Of great significance or entailing major change: a book that underwent fundamental revision.

So, what would the definition of a fundamental atheist be? Would it have to do with holding to the foundations of atheism or should it just be used as an umbrella definition to account for anything that anyone does not like about atheists?

Instead of "Fundamental" should we be talking about extremist? Of course then we'd have to figure out who is an extremist atheist.

Or maybe we should just come to the realization that there are people from all walks of life and from all areas of philosophical/spiritual belief that are just hateful idiots and make what they do even worse by claiming to do it in the name of or because of Islam, Christianity, Paganism, Atheism, etc....

Funny that IAMS..when I use words that is seen from the bible (mainly harsh ones) I post out the dictionarys version of that word as its an english word to begin with...funny how some christians come and and correct the dictionary when it suits them...but here oyou are with a ...............dictionary LOL


A FUNDY to me is someone that goes way too extreme with beliefs of any kind..aka the extremists also fundys ..i have made this clear several times...now UNLESS you are a fundy christian yourself..well I can see WHY you woudld be so defencive....but when I read articals on fundys all of them are pure hate towards others...fundys/extremists show nothing but hate IMO


thats my opinions IAMS...like it or not now you did once tell me you wernt a fundy christian I will show you if you want the very quote you made when i asked you

And that's really what I've been saying, I've just been using the word fundamentalist because it's recognized in this topic as having a negative connotation.

My example way earlier in this thread was concerning "fundamentalism" in the computer software wars.

Because you use Linux and like it and tell people you like it, does not make you a "fundy", now if you are a Linux user who HATES Microsoft Windows and show up at a Windows User Group meeting and burns 500 copies of IE7 on the doorstep, that would make you both an extremist and a fundy (it's happened beleive it or not).

You can witness Sofware fundamentalism on Ziff Davis Web sites, the Linux users (or Penguins as they're called) sit on those sites all day long posting personal opinions on how Bill Gates is the Anti-christ and Windows is the biggest piece of crud on the market. Nevermind that 80% of the world uses Windows and likes it. Those Linux users are fundies.

Son, regardless of your religion or race or shoe size youare part of my family , i see no seperation, no borders... I wondered if you can only be family to fellow christians and why???

To disagree with beliefs would not be seen as fundie IMO.....I have not read a athiest who belittles one because of their beliefs..... mocking ones beleifs is not really fundie behavior IMO, its poor manners .... does anyone really interpet every single word in the bible as literal truth?????isn't that what a fundie is???

Mis wells thankyou for your post...

Texas (thanks ) for your kind words about my sister....hairston I'm sorry i didn't see it thankyou too..thanks sis...

What is a fundamentalist Christian?

In recent times, the term "fundamentalist" has become commonly used by the news media to refer to any religious group whom they consider to hold radical views. We may recall frequent references to the mid-east Islamic fundamentalists who have been viewed as fanatics, and often responsible for acts of terrorism.


Similarly, liberal society uses the term fundamentalist to identify any Christian whom they consider to be an extremist. Generally, they classify a Christian as a radical fundamentalist if they merely believe in the literal interpretation of the Bible, if they hold views against sexual permissiveness, homosexuality, abortion on demand, or any views which are politically incorrect.

FOUND --
http://www.victorious.org/churchbook/chur21.htm

now you might just see why I too put fundy in with extremists

So I am not alone on that one..to me they are the same..............its my opinion..and from reading that above posted from a web page..its not just my opinion either

Funny you should say WE in your statement IAMS...from I recall you always have said YOU dont belong to a religious group...now you have in fact said this..I can prove that too

Hairston..also mentioned your sister.....he was the 1st to take notice...just thought Id tell you...

I remember saying that, BM. But guess what? I spend time thinking and reflecting on things I read, including the things I read on these forums, and sometimes I realize that there may be more to something than I initially considered. This is one of those times, an what I was trying to point out is that I fit the dictionary definition of fundamental when it comes to Christianity. And since I am not a hateful person, then the definition of fundamental needs to be revisited, in my opinion.

I've read plenty of atheists belittling others for their beliefs. Being patronizing is a common human trait. I've read all kinds of people belittling others, and all kinds of people supporting others. Like I said somwhere in the Mormon thread, I think it has more to do with personality types than with faith. Some atheists consciously go out of their way to not offend people, then it comes out in snide remarks. Then again, some others don't. I think you would just find in a random sampling of people, that some people have derogatory communication styles, and like to score points by being either directly or indirectly snide; and some people just don't. And I think the people who have hateful undertones to their personalities because of unresolved issues, are more likely to be outspoken, perhaps rudely so, when it comes to issues that they feel gain them ground.

Some people like to communicate and just be people with other people, some people see teams and the need to score points. That's just my thought, anyway.

Now, I might disagree with what you say, and firmly state my beliefs, LOL that will just never change about me, but I don't think I operate on a desire to take away from anyone. I will talk to people who are different from me. I actually even do hang out with people that I disagree with, I love them and spend hours talking to them sometimes. Of course you can see me as a fundy if you would like to. ^That's your right.^ I don't stand on the street corner telling gays they are going to hell. I called my gay friend Maria and invited her to go to Six Flags Fiesta Texas, with me and my kids sometime soon, when we can coordinate days off. I talk to her a lot. Jesus put me here to love people, but that does not stop me from disagreeing with anyone.

Uhmm, BM, both times I used "we" in that post, it did not have anything to do with a particular denomination.

The first time I used "we" I was talking about we, as in humanity in general.

The second time I used "we" I was talking about we, as in Christians as a whole.

I have NEVER in my times on here ever said you where a fundy or a hateful person...you know this..dont you?? I know you do

I just posted some info from a chuch website on what a christian fundy was classed as...and pointed out that its not just me that thinks they are the extremists...goes to show you that im not the only one...and I posted a link just incase....hope you understand me now


I see you and Jor as christians...nothing more than your avarage chrstians...good kind christians..nothing hateful about that is there?? I dont think so

I get that vibe as well. You put this very nicely. Its seems to me that when people go on and on about what they believe its because they feel like someone is "gaining something on them"

We all might get snappish from time to time. I think the problem is when someone so much adheres their belief as "The TRUTH" rather than their choice, then when you challange them you challange something much bigger than just the sentence on the page.

One of my favorite quotes is by Colin Powell

"Avoid having your ego so close to your position that when your position falls, your ego goes with it."

Yes, I am aware of that, although early on, when we were still getting to know each other you insinuated it a couple of times


I understand, and I was pointing out that depending on how you define fundamental, there are several of us here who would actually fit within that definition and yet we are not hateful people.

okay, I see how we all define fundy differntly..No TEE you aren't a fundie IMO....I agree with Bm's definitions too extremeists is getting to kooky with beleifs but if htey aren't harmful i have no issue...


For me i try to encourge not to exclude others from the human family because they are gay, or a different religion ....

Well now, I do believe that I have the truth, but I recognize that not everyone sees it as such. I don't talk to my friends/non-believing people in my everyday life as if they assume it is the truth. That doesn't give us any common ground for discussion, if my friends are over there, -----> and I am way over here ------------------> I don't know where we would ever start talking with each other. I know they don't accept the truth as I know it, so it wouldn't make any sense for me to talk to them as if they do. ^LOL although the occasional debate breaks out^ If and when it comes up, I will share what I believe. Otherwise, I just try to live it. Because living it is the best speaking you can do, honestly.

I do admire Colin Powell quite a bit, and I like that quote. I like the wisdom that it indicates. To me, it says: "You should keep impartiality and objectivity in a situation where you are disagreed with, and keep your mind on your particulars of your argument/debate." But that's just what it says to me. I am positive others have a very different interpretation of it.

I do think we may all be agreeing that perhaps "extremist" is a better word for the picture we are all kind of having in our heads of what some call "fundy." I don't think extremist Christians understand the spirit of the word, nor know The Holy Spirit Himself, so to me anyway, "extremist" might be a good word.

Because I am definitely a fundamentalist, but I am not sure that I am a fundy, get my drift? Although some think I am, they probably have not tried to get to know me, I hope my closer friends right here have seen the difference by now?

I guess that's what I was trying to establish. While the dictionary defines Fundamentalism one way, the American media has defined it another, in effect making it popular slang. I use the term because it fits in line with today's excepted definition of the derogatory form made popular by today's media.

Yes, calling it slang is an accurate description of what it has become for a lot of people. "Fundy" has taken on a connotation of its own, that is removed from the denotation of the word, "fundamentalist." It is subjective to what different people dislike about organized religion, and there are some things I disagree with, depending on which religion we are talking about. Although with most religions, it is the "religion" that I disagree with, and not the "organized" part. We seem to generally disapprove of people who stand on street corners telling people they are going to hell. That I will readily agree with, I don't see the point. At times it may elicit meaningful conversation with someone whose heart is ready for that conversation; however, generally speaking, I don't believe that the majority of people approached in this manner, is going to be open and willing.

Each believer should go fearlessly where the Lord leads. It is my experience that being confrontational and hostile when one could go a more peaceful path, is counter-productive to all parties involved. I suspect that most people who do this are misguided, but I can not say for sure. Like I said, following the path that the Lord blazes for me, is more important than following a set formula, of x and y; although that being said, there are certain constants of how I interact with people. But, that's just me. I can not vouch for how the Lord speaks to others. I think there is a difference between open-air preaching, and in-your-face confrontation.

I find myself agreeing with this position. There is a significant difference between being a fundamentalist and an extremist, contrary to what many people think due to media influence of the word.

I see fundamentalism as going back to the foundation of a belief system, to try and live and act as the 1st christians did before organized religion took over. It is this organized religion that became extremist in its attitudes by applying a socio-political agenda to a belief system.

This socio-political agenda is what chraracterizes an extremist, independant of the belief system used as its foundation.

The early christians would have been extremely shocked to find out how their faith was perverted and used to foreward a political agenda. The same is happening at this time with Islam.

As it concerns Atheist fundamentalists or rather extremists. There is at this time, whether they accept this or not, a move to organize atheism into a belief system. It is also the purpose of this move to then utilize this belief system as a cohesive socio-political force.

So, we see history repeating before our eyes.

It seems several of us find ourselves in agreement that the current "popular" definition of "fundamentalist" is not the same as the accepted dictionary definition of it.

Given that, is the purpose of this thread to define or identify atheists who hold to the foundational tenets of atheism or are we, as I believe, attempting to identify and/or define atheists whose actions, words, and/or activities are extreme, especially in regards to how they treat non-atheist

See when you built this thread Jor...and posted up a thing on how some describe a fundy Atheist...so I figured, you must agree with it...so is it ok to say that about Atheists taging those that act that way Fundy Atheists...but its not ok to say the same about fundy christians? cuz now you dont class a fundy christian that acts the same as the fundy atheists (only in a religious manor) you now call them just extremists??

I posted up an artical from a church book website and it explains that many people will in fact see fundy christians as extremists...I posted it a few posts back and provided the link with it..so you have to see that I didnt just descide to descide to class them like extremists out of the blue, I had to have picked it up from somewhere...cuz im not alone

Kinna like when some people assume that a satanist must be from an evil cult, when really if you took a closer look at it..its not that bad after all

So...since some of you class yourselves as fundys...and made a few points....and I happen to be understanding....and like you guys....I WONT class fundy christians in the same cat as extremists...I know see where you..IAMS & Texas are coming from....and am willing to take that on board and now have a change of heart on the matter, after all its only decent ...and I do consider myself a decent gal LOL

So on that nore IAMS...Jor..& Texas...I am glad you all took the time to explain a lot more...I read each post............and now feel its only right, to treat you guys with respect...and will no longer class a fundamentalist Christian in the same boat as some wacked out extremist...from now on if i wanna rant about them..it will be them rotten extremists NOT fundys

Ok thats my mind changed...but hey one down ...gooodness KNOW how many more to follow...but its a start init??...I mean I could have remained ignorant towards the whole thing and descided to let the whole thing go...but geee even I have a heart, I wasn't dragged up...i was BROUGHT up LOL and have a decent side to me too...
Thanks guys...

BM, I'm glad you took the time to read all that stuff we posted, I appreciate it very much. I'm not surprised you were able and willing to see the point we were making, you are a very intelligent person and yes, we can see you have a decent side LOL.

However, that addressed fundamental Christians, and still leaves the issue about Atheist Fundamentalists... what are they? and are we actually talking about Atheist Extremists? And if we are, then who are they? What are they like? I think we all have a very good idea of who the Islamic Extremists are and who the Christian Extremists are and how they behave, but what makes one an Atheist Extremist? How do we identify them?

Son the missing link is ther is no canon, or churches or rues or guidelines to being an athiest , everyone aproaches it differnetly, it meeans something diffenrt to all, The only commanlity is their is no western diety as defined by the bible.. this is how i define athiesm for me..but you are gonna get tons of persectives that are all unique to the person..

specifically one to qualify for a fundie has to have a 'set of rules' that are taken literal , no exceptions...IMO

there can be rude folks in any group or walk of life.....

there are no rules to being an athiest, that is an oxymoron sort of defeats the point....LOL i have know folks that claimed to be athiest agnostics...No kidding...See what I'm saying??? also few if any athiests have no issue wih one who beleives in god, or decides their inner truth is something else..i was once married to an athiest, if anything they encourage you to be who ever you are.... explore all paths, never do they mock your beleifs....i felt being with an athiest fun and liberatiing and for the first time unjudged I never felt made fun of or mocked...The truth is they say alot of things that make sense and IMO some groups can get real uncomforatble with this . becasue many end up hearing because it makes sense.....they encourage you to be what you think you are thats the difference. i was married ot one for 12 years i feel versed on the subject........

Well now that I have come to terms with not classing the fundy christian the same as extremists...its only fair not to stick a fundy lable on that kind of atheist...perhapps EXTREMISTS?? of the atheist kind would be better

Thats my thoughts though...either way IAMS I hate all extremists...they are evil ya know...even those from the islamic faith that are terrorists they are in fact classes as extremists...pushing their luck too darn far

No one should use a faith to hurt or kill another...nor should they use it to insult another.............thats NOT what a religious faith is meant to be...but we that post here regular KNOW this...dont we??

my mind might have changed on that...WOW a break through for BM who what have thunk it...but that dont mean im going to change my OWN views on God LOL im sticking tight to those

traaa la laaa

Ok, let's drop the term fundy (which I still think is now popular slang) There ARE Atheist ... ummm... let me call them... ummm... "UnHoly Rollers"

Not all Atheists are unHoly Rollers but there are some that exist here on UM who insist on proselytizing their belief/cause. Drives me crazy. I don't want to listen to ANY extremist who uses guerilla tactics to badger people into believing what they do or using their tactics to call other stupid.

The one and only time I saw a proselytizing Christian on this board... the were BANNED.

But in the interest of a spirited debate, and letting people dig their own graves, I say keep 'em.

(this was edited because I changed my mind a little bit about what I first wrote)

Yea Geri! That's exactly what we were getting at!! Woot! Of course, my post above this one takes a little bit differnt tact. I suppose it's another line of thinking, and may not be a popular view for a lot of people on this board. I knew that when I wrote it. *sigh* Insert my foot into my mouth, but I don't mind eating a little shoe leather once in a while to make a subtle point.

Miss wells and who might we be talking about???? If this is the case than this would be Up to Saru, and he is just a Pm away...he is a wonderful Admin, he will listen to your complaints....

Cept looky... I said keep them... no need for me to complain

I"ve been on Um along time who are these Athiest that are extremist it was your post ?? I can Pm Saru if you want.....

I quoted myself on this because I think it is important to see that the people we are now calling extremists exist in all spheres of life, from sports, politics and religion.

It is a mindset that simply uses an available and widespread system in society to further a socio-political agenda.

When I purposely used the title "Atheist Fundamentalist" I was trying to draw attention to this little fact. Just as there are extremists (I hesitate to call them christians) in christian circles, there are extremists in Atheist circles. Their only real commonality is the socio-political agenda they are trying to impose on the rest of humanity.

These people (and I never said they were on UM) will use any vehicle that fits a specific criteria. Atheism is one such vehicle. They are trying to unite all these different thoughts on atheism into a common belief system that one can even call a religion.

These people are we people.


I think its high time people stopped pretending that the problem is THEM.


I have seen the enemy and he is me.


We all can from time to time be an extremist. The way things will change is when we all look at ourselves and recognize where we might have crossed the line.

We've all stuck the foot in the mouth at some time or another. And its ok. I think self awareness is the key.

Its not wrong or bad to be extreme if you recognize it. Its only when you say "I am right and you are wrong"

Think of it this way.

There is a difference in saying "This is something I am passionate about."

We all have our passions and our blind spots. We are only human.

I appreciate that post truethat. I know I have stuck my foot in my mouth plenty of times .......Happens to everyone and no one is perfect.

When I can I stop in to see if the same old dogma is still running rampant.


AHH yes carm......a Christian based web site (a bit biased).....do you really think they will tell the whole truth about what you can read in the original ancient texts?

As I said if you want a better understanding of the ORIGINAL TEXT that your so called Holy book was copied from you are better off to use the source and not the edited (heavily in places if I might add) book that they/you seem to be using.


No more insult intended that you saying it is alright for your God to kill men, woman, and children. Your deity is no more important than the thousands of other Deities that Christians down through have tried to suppress with violence.


As far as my personal reply to you taking offense to my comment......

OH WELL!

Some times the truth hurts a little....some times it hurts a lot.

Some information I have posted before:

MASS KILLINGS AND CRUELTIES ORDERED, COMMITTED, AND APPROVED BY GOD.

The entire population of the earth at the time of Noah, except for eight survivors, in a flood. "And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth; and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark." Gen 7:23 [Jehovah, the first mass-murderer, starts His bloody career.]

Every inhabitant of Sodom and Gomorrah, and the surrounding plain, by "brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven." Gen 19:24 Lot and his family fled. [What about little innocent children in the city and around on the surrounding plain.]

All the first born of every family in Egypt, including children of those in dungeons and the successor to the throne of Egypt's Pharaoh, by God on the first Passover night. Ex 12:29 [Of those that are in prison and the first born of the cattle??????]

All the hosts of Pharaoh, including the captains of 600 chariots, who drown in the Red Sea whilebpursuing the Israelites. "... and the Lord overthrew the Egyptians in the midst of the sea." Ex 14:27-28
[The Christian God is so childish He has to murder instead of using His brain. He could have made them too sick to walk.]

Victims who perish in the conquest of seven nations in Canaan by the Jews under Gods guidance so that the Jews can occupy their lands as God had promised Abraham in Deut 7:1,2. The Hittites, Girgash**es, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites were all destroyed, every man, woman and child and mercy was shown to none. [Would have made Hitler and Custer feel good.]

Amalek and his people, by the edge of the sword, because God wants to fight with Amalek from generation to generation (maybe just for fun). The Israelites win if Aaron helps Moses to hold up his hands. [At times of crisis, God gets whimsical. People are dying everywhere and God wants to see Moses's palms.] Ex 17:11,16

3,000 Israelites die at the hands of their brothers, the Levites, every man, their brothers and their companions. Ex. 32:27 [These were the orders of God who would brook no disloyalty, a self styled "jealous" God.]

Rulers of Israel, eleven in number after spying for forty days that wouldn't invade the Promised Land are killed by a plague. Num. 14:37 [The first term limitation?]

250 Levite princes of the Jews who challenged the leadership of Moses. When Moses points out the injustice of killing the whole congregation God relents briefly, then swallows up two of the princes, "their wives, sons and little children", then sent a fire to consume the remaining princes. Num. 16:1-40 [The Christian God lies too.]

14,700 people die by plague who protest to Moses about the prior killing of the 250 princes. Aaron makes an atonement to stop the plague. Num 16:41-49 [The Christian God seems bent upon destroying helpless people.]

The Canaanites at Hormah, utterly destroyed, every man woman and child, by God at the request of the Jews. Num 21:3 The Amorites at Hesbon, Israel "took all these cities". Moses sums up the slaughter: "We... utterly destroyed the men and the women and the little ones." Num 21:25 and Deut 2:34

All the sons and subjects of Og, about whom the Lord said to Moses: "Fear him (the king of Bashan) not, for I have delivered him into thy hand." None was left alive. Num 21:34-35

24,000 Israelites who cohabitated with Moabite women and worshiped Baal. "And the Lord said to Moses, take all the heads of the people, and hang them up before the Lord against the sun..." Num 25:4,9 [Definitely a civil rights violation.]

All the males and the kings of the Middianites, because they worshiped idols, and all their wives and male children were sold into slavery. "And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, vex the Midianites, and smite them." Num 25:16-17 and Num 31:7-8

The subjects of two kingdoms on the east side of the Jordan, in order that Reuben and Gad might seize the land for their own as a gift from God. Num 32

The Ammonites, decimated by the Lord so that Lot might possess their land. Deut 2:19-21

The Horims, slain by God in order that Esau might take their land. Deut 2:22

All the citizens of Jericho, except for a whore and her family. "And they utterly destroyed all in the city, man and woman, young and old, and ox... with the edge of the sword." Josh 6 "They" make a grisly game of it , using the superstitious number 7 popular in the Bible. [Joshua competes with Moses, the leader he replaced, for the title of Gods number 1 hit man as he follows Gods orders.]

12,000 men, women and children die in a treacherous ambush conceived and directed by God. Joshua, with the usual mindless hocus-pocus, holds out his spear until all the inhabitants are dead. The city was then burned. Afterwards Joshua builds an altar and offers thanks to God. Josh 8:1-30 [A political monster worships a Murderous Monster of a Deity.]

All the people of Makkedah, and their king hanged, by Joshua. Joshua 10:28

All the people of Libnah. Not a soul remained. Joshua 10:29-30 [Joshua and God were agreed upon the finality of capital punishment.]

All the people of Gezer, with none remaining, are killed. Josh 10:33

All the people of Eglon, none remaining, are killed. Joshua 10:34-35

All the people of Hebron, "All the cities and souls that were in them". Joshua 10:36-37

All the inhabitants of the country of the hills, and the south of the vale, and the springs and their kings, he left none remaining but utterly destroyed all that breathed, as the Lord God of Israel commanded. Joshua 10:40 [Joshua simply kills everyone else.]

The inhabitants of Gaza, Askerlon, and Ekron, killed by Judah and Caleb. Judges 1:18-19

10,000 Moabites, killed by the Israelites. Judges 3:29

10,000 Perizzites and Canaanites die at the hand of Judah and Simeon. Judges 1:4 [Isn't it nice how the body counts always come out as nice round numbers?]

120,000 Midianites die by the hands of Gideons three hundred men. Judges 8:10

50,070 people of Bethshemesh, struck dead by God because a few of them looked at/into the Ark carrying the stone tablets. 1st Samuel 6:19 [The murderous Christian God keeps the grave-diggers busy with overtime burying the innocents.]

70,000 victims (more round numbers?) die of a pestilence sent by God because David took a census.11 Sam 24:15

Although Adam and Eve have no sense of right and wrong when they eat of the Tree of Knowledge, God accuses them of sinning and tosses them out of their home. Prejudging the human race he then decrees that all shall suffer for this "sin" by returning to the dust from which Adam was made. The Christian God curses women with painful birth. Gen 3

Cain kills Abel because God is partial to altar sacrifices, preferring animals to grain. Gen 4 [The Christian God plainly doesn't like vegetarians.]

At the time of the Flood, a disaster not uncommon to the tradition of other religions, Noah, an imbiber, and his family are the only persons deemed righteous enough to be saved from drowning. All others, including pregnant women and children, are given no opportunity to survive the rising waters. Gen 7,8

Again attributing sin to innocents God fails to find even 10 persons, or embryos in any stage of gestation, saintly enough to escape the fire and brimstone (Biblical napalm).

God turns Lots wife into a pillar of salt when she looks back in horror at what is happening to her friends and neighbors. Gen 19 [Today many Christians oppose any abortion as a God forbidden murder. Where is the logical precedent here? The Omnipotent Christian God is the Abortionist to abort all abortionists.]

Abraham is certainly willing to do what ever the Lord demands of him, even when God orders him to kill his son. But all turns out Ok when an angel yells really loud to Abraham that it was just a test to see how much he loved God. Isaac is very lucky indeed. Abraham may have been near deaf at his age and the Angel was calling long distance from heaven. [Truly a miracle.] Gen 22

When Sarah gets jealous and insists, proven Abraham consigns Hagar and Ishmael to the deserts to die. Gen 21 [Does this qualify as domestic abuse or violence?]

Pharaoh orders all midwifes to strangle new born Jewish children. Of course they refused. Pharaoh then orders them to throw the babies into the river. Ex 1:18,22 [What's interesting to note here is that some Christian parents at the present time deny their children blood-curdling television and give them blood-curdling Bibles.]

Moses kills an Egyptian deliberately for beating an Israelite. Ex 2:12

He then becomes God's Lawgiver. One of his commandments straight from God is thou shalt not kill (murder). [Two wrongs don't make a right. Was Moses a murderer even before he led the Israelite rebellion??]

God tries to kill Moses, because his son by a Middianite woman is not circumcised. His wife, angered, circumcises the boy with a sharp rock and throws the foreskin at Moses's feet. God then lets Moses off the hook. Ex 4:24-26 [God has priorities, including the horrible genital mutilation of young boys.]

After first purposely hardening Pharaoh's heart so that he will not see the Israelites free, God, through the black magic of Aarons rod, visits ten terrible plagues upon the unsuspecting Egyptians. Ex 7-11 [Even the innocent animals are victims of this truly evil black magic.]

The needless, brutal slaughter of the Passover night is the intended result of another hardening of Pharaohs heart by an egotistical maniacal God who wishes to parade his power. Ex 12:29 [Thus God continues his propensity for making the innocents suffer for the guilty which culminates in the crucifixion of His own innocent Son Jesus.]

More heart hardening by God causes Pharaoh to chase the Israelites into the Red Sea, where the soldiers die by drowning. Ex 14:28 [If God could harden pharaoh's heart he could have caused pharaoh to let them go free. Nothing to it.]

For "offering strange fire before the Lord", two sons of Aaron, priests of the tabernacle, are struck dead. Lev 10:1-2 [Not to worry, replacements are on the way.]

A blasphemer curses the name of God in the wilderness camp, and God orders him stoned to death: "And he children of Israel did as the Lord commanded Moses. Lev 24:23 [The rocky terrain of Palestine broods ill for miscreants and protesters. (Again God could have changed his heart and not killed him.)]

Israelites who complain, with good reason, in the desert, are burned with fire by God in the uttermost parts of the camp. Num 11:1 [Evidently the Christian God loves the smell of roasting, poaching, baking, broiling or burning human flesh?]

Seeing that the Jews are dissatisfied on their journey to the Promised Land because they have no flesh to eat as they had in Egypt, God typically loses his temper again and in a childish way sends a vast excess of quail, enough to cover the ground a days travel in each direction and they stack up to a height of more than 3 feet. As the people started to eat the fruits of their labor "God smote them with a very great plague." Num 11:31-33 [I guess it was better to be a vegetarian after all. Remember Cain?]

The Israelites are forced to wander for 40 years in the desert so that the older people would die. Num 14 [The Christian God despises old people.]

A man caught picking up sticks on the Sabbath is ordered by God to be put to death, and the wandering tribes comply. Num15:35-36 [A novel approach to the homeless problem?]

Challenge of the authority of Moses (remember him murdering people in Egypt?) by anyone always brought out the worse in God, and he buries alive the wives and children of the two princes who oppose Moses. Num 16:32-35

After striving to reach the Promised Land for forty years, Moses and Aaron are denied entry because Moses had struck a rock in anger to obtain water. Moses is allowed to look at it once though just before he dies. Num 20:11-12 and Deut 34 [The Christian God might have shown a little compassion for Moses who was probably at his wits end.]

God turns Miraim into a leper after she criticizes Moses for marring an Ethiopian woman. Such unions were contrary to Jewish custom and also disapproved of by God for everyone except Moses. Num 12:10 [The Christian God is a two-faced, misogynist Dog.]

It looks pretty plain to me that the Jehovah God is really Jehovah War God who likes to childishly parade his power before the masses and destroy those who don't like his totalitarian regime. Jehovah is the God of Evil, many more times worse than any Satan we can conceive of.

----------------------------------------

As I have in the past told a few others here:


I got better things to do than talk to hamsters.

I'm really having to take a deep breath and step back for a minute.

I have a lot of time on my hands for the next month while my work schedule is non-existant and UM has become a pretty entertaining and informative way to pass some time. I'm caught up with the charitable endowment work I am so dedicated to, it's been pouring down rain for days (I think my neighbors are building an Ark!), and this is causing me to be far more emotional about a few topics than I normally ever would be.

Thank you TrueThat, I needed that little clunk upside the head. *deep breath, deep breath**

Except me..........


lol


Actually i have done it plenty of times also and i probably still will.

hay every body
somebody tell me Where do you find a good coffee in this joint?
im looking forward to getting to know you (not biblicly)
ny way look at me and see
whats going on inside
the mind of a person like me