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nn23
Helloooooo,

Firstly regarding the poll, i'd rather have you make your vote before reading the rest of this post and then i can be sure that as a study the results are unaffected by what is written below. Secondly, it is possible that you agree a little with all of the options or do not completely agree with any. If this is the case, just tick which ever box is closest to your views and feelings even if the option does not reflect them exactly. edit: thirdly, (darn it i forgot to put this one in) as tempting as it may be for some, can you make your vote before looking at the results so far so that they are uninfluenced....NICE ONE!!! thumbup.gif ... he he, i'm a good little amateur sociologist yes.gif

Well, there are many different understandings of the term love, it probably means something different to everybody. Here are some writings on the subject displaying many of the different perspectives on the topic.


QUOTE
Sonnet CXVI
by William Shakespeare

Let me not to the marriage of true minds
Admit impediments. Love is not love,
Which alters when it alteration finds,
Or bends with the remover to remove.
Oh, no! it is an ever-fixed mark
That looks on tempests.. and is never shaken.
It is the star to every wandering bark

Whose worth's unknown, although his height be taken.
Love is not Time's fool, though rosy lips and cheeks
Within his bending sickle's compass come.
Love alters not with his brief hours and weeks,
But bears it out.. even to the edge of doom.

If this be error and upon me proved,
I never writ, nor no man ever loved.

Who better than to start with, than the consumate craftsman himself. Shakespears poetry has a far more thoughtful introspective nature and can be quite philisophical. This poem concerns itself with the constancy of love, drawing its comparrison to that of a star which symolised loves constancy and also guidance. People used stars in those days to navigate when sailing. He also speaks of how true love lasts through age and hard times.


QUOTE
The Clod & the Pebble
by William Blake

Love seeketh not Itself to please,
Nor for itself hath any care;
But for another gives its ease,
And builds a Heaven in Hell's despair.

So sang a little Clod of Clay,
Trodden with the cattle's feet;
But a Pebble of the brook,
Warbled out these metres meet.

Love seeketh only Self to please,
To bind another to It's delight:
Joys in another's loss of ease,
And builds a Hell in Heavens despite.

It seems that Mr Blake had a far more negative oppinion of love. He speaks of it as something that is quite selfish, as something that only seeks to satisfy one's personal needs, but it is also interesting that he talks of it as though it were some sort of outward entity, a disease almost. In the beginning it starts off as something that appears to be wonderful and ultimately results in something quite awful.

Here are some extracts from a psychology study entitled Romantic Love: An fMRI study of a Neural Mechanism for Mate Choice, which looks into the correlate brain function of love, what peoples brains are doing when they're in luuurrrve laugh.gif . I found it very interesting indeed, theres a link to the full article at the bottom.
QUOTE
.....Romantic love is accociated with subcortical doperminergic pathways in the reward system, and romantic love is primarily a motivation system, which leads to various emotions, rather than a specific emotion. However activation of subcortical doperminergic pathways of the VTA and caudate may comprise only the "general arousal" componant (Pfaff 1999) of early stage intense romantic love.
Nevertheless, these data suggest two important things about romantic passion: Foremost romantic love may be a primary motivation system, a fundamental human mating drive. Pfaff (1999) defines a drive as a neural state that energises and directs behaviour to aquire a particular biological need to survive or reproduce; and he reports that all drives are associated with the activity of dopamine. Like drives, romantic love is tenacious; it is focused on a specific reward; it is not associated with any particular facial expression; it is exceedingly difficult to control; and it is associated with dopamine-rich neural regions (Fischer, 2004). Drives lye along a continuum. Thirst is almost impossible to control, while the sex drive can be redirected, even quelled. Falling inlove is evidently stronger than the sex drive because when one's sexual overtures are rejected, people do not kill themselves or someone else. Rejected lovers sometimes commit suicide or homicide.....


QUOTE
.....Our subjects in longer term relationships also showed increased activity in ventral pallidum. The ventral pallidum has been associated with attatchment behaviours in prairie vowls (Lim et al., 2004; Lim and young, 2004). These data suggest that as romantic love changes across time, brain systems associated with attatchment increase activity - perhaps to enhance relationship stability and motivate parenting behaviours.....


QUOTE
.....While viewing their beloved, those who self-reported higher levels of romantic love also showed greater activation in the right anteromedial caudate body (r = 0.60; p = 0.12). This result provides strong evidence for the link between a specific brain region and a specific brain function, romantic love. However, this specific region was also activated during anticipation of a monetary reward (Knutson et al., 2001).....


QUOTE
.....In a study of 37 societies, Buss (1994) reports that men and women rank love, or mutual attraction, as the first criterion for choosing a spouse. This brain system has inspired Love songs, Love poems, Love magic, myths and legends about love, and sucide and homicide cross culturally (Jankowiak and Fischer, 1992; Fischer 2004). Romantic love is most likely a primary aspect of our complex human reproductive stratergy.....
(Helen Fischer, Authur Aron and Lucy L. Brown 2005)
http://homepage.mac.com/helenfisher/Sites/...ourCompNeur.pdf
This article speaks more technically of some of the behaviours associated with love and attributes it to many processes rather than defining it as one. It defines the beginning stages of love as a reward system. This highlights love as something of an exchange rather than the personification it claimed from Mr Blakes poem and the nurturing eternal romance denoted in Shakespeares Sonnet.

M. Scott Peck (1978) defines love as:
QUOTE
....The will to extend one's self for the purpose of nurturing one's own or another's spiritual growth....

QUOTE
....it may be noticed that, as defined, love is a strangely circular process. For the process of extending one's self is an evolutionary process. When one has successfully extended one's limits, one has then grown into a larger state of being. Thus the act of loving is an act of self-evolution even when the purpose of the act is someone else's growth. It is through reaching toward evolution that we evolve....
(extract taken from 'The Road Less Travelled')

but he also differentiates between love and "falling in love"

QUOTE
....The temporary collapse of ego boundaries that constitutes falling in love is a sterotypic response of human beings to a configuration of internal sexual drives and external sexual stimuli, which serves to increase the probability of sexual pairing and bonding so as to enhance the survival of the species. Or to put it in another rather crass way, falling in love is a trick that our genes pull on our otherwise perceptive mind to hoodwink or trap us into marriage....
(extract taken from 'The Road Less Travelled')

Here is an extract from chapter five of the Bhagavad Gita, it is a beautiful representation of a view that many faiths relatively adopt that awareness of one's divine self is a True love which is infinate and extends to all but also identifys that it is not something that comes from feelings but from awareness. The parts that i have highlighted demonstrate this.

As most of you probably already know, the Bhagavad Gita story is based on a conversation between Arjuna and Krishna on a battle field. This extract has Arjuna who represents us as we are in life as it is, having to deal with all the challenges that prevent us at times from progressing; Krishna, who represents our highest aspect, to some this is God and to others it is consciousness; Sanjaya, who is the seer of the King of the €œother€ side within the battle, he represents intuition; and King Dhritarashtra who was born blind, he represents our human mind which is ignorant of our true nature€he he, just a bit of background info so if anyone does want to read this they will understand it a bit better if they do not already thumbsup.gif

QUOTE
....Arjuna looked puzzled. "Can you explain what you mean by 'harmony in all things,' Krishna?" he asked.

Krishna could hardly wait to reply. "Yes," He said. "It means someone who is free from desire and therefore detached. He follows worldly pursuits like everyone else, but at the same time is completely free inside. He will not rejoice when good things happen or shudder when unpleasentness occurs." He paused, to make sure Arjuna understood what He was saying. "He is truly God, Arjuna," He said with feeling. "Is it any wonder that he finds no pleasure in sense objects?"

"What do you mean Krishna?" Arjuna was confused again.

"Well," Krishna replied patiently, "once the Chakora bird has tasted clear moonbeams among the beds of lotus flowers, would it ever want to lick sand?"

Arjuna smiled at the beauty of this imagery and Krishna waited for it to settle in his mind.

"When you have discovered the bliss of the Self, Arjuna," He said at last "and attained Self-realisation, you will find you will just give up all attachment to, or pursuit of, sense objects quite naturally."

Krishna looked at Arjuna's expression and saw that he was finding it hard to believe. "Your curiosity will make you wonder about this, no doubt," He said and Arjuna nodded. "You know that people who do not know themselves indulge in sense pleasures like a thirsty deer rushes at a mirage in a desert.

"It's important to understand that the happiness gained from enjoying sense objects is actually painful. But people are so deluded by the attraction that they feel that they cannot even live without these pleasures. To such unfortunate people, pain seems to be the heart of pleasure, but they simply cannot live without it, just like a fish cannot live without water." Arjuna felt slightly shocked by the truth in his words.
"Those who have learned to control their minds," Krishna continued, "and the physical tendencies of the body, experience only bliss in their hearts. Their sence of separateness simply vanishes in the same way that the wind is lost into the sky. When all trace of duality disappears could you say you are all that's left? You are united in the embrace of the Lord, and in such a state of union that only the bliss of the Self remains.


"Shutting out all external objects, focussing the attention between the eyebrows, equalising the in breath and the out breath, thus controling the mind, senses and intelligence, the sage whos highest aim is freedom and from whom desire and anger have departed, is forever free."

Arjuna sighed as the longing to experience this state swept over him again. "How do you become like this?" he asked eagerly.

"First of all you must renounce desire, and once you have done that, you must concentrate the mind within the body," Krishna replied. "With your gaze turned inwards and fixed between the eyebrows, equalise the incoming and outgoing breaths because when you control breath," He explained, "the mind becomes stilled in the inner space and desire ceases."

Arjuna was filled with wonder and at the same time relieved, because at last here was a practical method he could easily understand and follow. Krishna realised this and smiled. "Have my words brought you peace of mind?" He asked.

My Lord!" Arjuna replied. "You are such a master at understanding the mind and i know you completely understand the way mine works." Krishna smiled a secret smile that said nothing and gave nothing away.

"But listen!" Arjuna was now filled with enthusiasm, "the path you have shown me is indeed like a bridge which makes the river easier to cross, but it seems to me that for people who are weak, the path of yoga is easier than the path of knowledge. Can you just help me to understand this a little more clearly?"

Sanjaya turned towards the King. He was excited. "Oh great King," he said, "listen to what Lord Krishna is about to explain to Arjuna. It is though Krishna has prepared a great spiritual feast for him and we, the guests, have just arrived at the right time.

"Our good fortune is very great, dear master!" Sanjaya was so delighted to be able to hear the discussion between Krishna and Arjuna that he found himself babbling like an excited child. "We are like thirsty men who have found water in the desert."

Dhritarashtra was unmoved and unaffected by the information. "Just get on with it," he snapped impatiently.

Sanjaya understood what was in the King's heart. Blinded as he was by his love for his sons, he could not appreciate the great revelation that they were party to. "But how can he understand?" Sanjaya thought sadly. "How can a blind man see the light of day? Only those who have given up all thought of heaven and earth out of love for self-realisation can appreciate the sweetness of this knowledge."

He dare not say it, however, for fear of offending his beloved master and instead, turned his divine gaze eagerly back inside himself to experience the precious dialogue between Sri Krishna and Arjuna.


So, those are a few examples of different approaches and interpretations towards what love is. I think they all bring up interesting questions.

What are your oppinions and beliefs on the meaning of love?

How true are feelings of love and at what stage do you believe it becomes this?

How do your personal experiences prove your beliefs?

Does a true love come when you give up your desires rather than follow them?...why?

Is the love that comes from desire a cause for ignorance or a product of it?...why?

I think the section highlighted at the end of the Bhagavad Gita quote brings up an interesting question. For those that have faith, do you love your your children more than your divinity?

What does everybody else think of this concept?

hmmm, i think thats perhaps enough questions to be starting with, you don't have to answer any of them directly they're only a guide, i'm just interested in what you think original.gif

HA HAAA hope you enjoyed the read laugh.gif ....I LOV-IT!!!! yes.gif thumbsup.gif

linked-imagelinked-imagelinked-imageNICE ONE!!! linked-image

linked-imagenn23
Shadow_Hill
Aw, you posted my favourite Shakespeare sonnet. wub.gif
auhsoj
take it as your talking about eros love, yeah, i do believe in it... but not so much in that i have a soul mate out there somewhere i need to find, to only be truely in love...

dunno but for me it works out as there are a handful of females that i find something attractive about... both physically and with their personalty... and the more you show each other interests the more you start caring about each other... and it usually boils down to one you can't help but care mostly for... usually the one trying the least to get your attention or assumes you can't live without her... and doesn't need to tell her friends everything about you, or try to read signs on or good or bad a date goes...

if it feels fake, and not just because we have nothing to talk about or in common, but in a way you know when you feel comfortable being yourself around a certain woman (i'm a guy). if that feeling isn't there i don't bother...

i find it easier to start a relationship by being open about my feelings early on... rather than trying to read each other's minds...

i'll probably put it down to the woman i have the natural tendency to give the most s**t about... and can see her as a best friend... and she too feels that way about me... in a casual relaxed natural way... albeit given she has no history i need to be cautious of!!! grin2.gif
Kalien
I found my soulmate <3~
nn23
QUOTE(Kaylee @ Apr 22 2007, 06:56 AM) [snapback]1640865[/snapback]
I found my soulmate <3~
awwww good on ya! thumbup.gif

what is it that distinguishes a "soul mate" from an ordinary "mate" (mating partner)?

It can not be something physical for the word soul is of an immaterial context. The word soul denotes a more spiritual aspect to the relationship, but the word "my" implies something more formed and singular.

--------------------

The words "i love you" interest me. People often say it without battering an eyelid. But what does it represent to them? ...A way of securing something which is of benefit to them?...HOOFFF! harsh words ha ha! w00t.gif

The psychology perspective of love would see it as those exchange behaviours with the common goal to gain happiness, security, comfort, belonging...(reward). Is this right? How do the Romantic and Spiritual perspectives view it differently?

Are our actions caused by our desire for the effect...happiness etc. Do you think that is what love is? If it is more than this, what more?

thumbsup.gif
nn23

FOS
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 22 2007, 01:38 PM) [snapback]1641116[/snapback]
what is it that distinguishes a "soul mate" from an ordinary "mate" (mating partner)?

It can not be something physical for the word soul is of an immaterial context. The word soul denotes a more spiritual aspect to the relationship, but the word "my" implies something more formed and singular.


This fits niceley with me:

'Every one of us has a group of souls we are spiritually connected to, just that little more than we are connected with the collective consciousness. A group we are meant to connect with in both the spirit world, and here by choice in physical form. This is our soul group.

The group could be you, and one other person, or several people. Our spirit guides are also part of our soul group.

People from our soul group come into our lives at seemingly random times, but in fact these meetings were prearranged between us in spirit before we came here.

We agree to connect and enable each other to learn a lesson or many lessons depending on how long we have arranged to be in each others lifetime. This is why some people are only fleetingly but intensely involved in our lives, then move on.

Maybe you have felt a connection when you met someone for the first time, a feeling like you have known them forever, an instant rapport?'

http://www.rachelkeene.co.uk/soulgroups.html



Leonardo
I answered 'Yes' I know true love exists and I know this because I have found my soul mate wub.gif

I am ambivalent to the concept of divinity so I do not ascribe the feelings of love towards this and the nature of my relationship with my soul mate leads me to the conclusion that the experience of love is not due to an electro-chemical reaction.

For me true love is nothing less than giving everything you are to someone with no expectation of anything returned. There are many hallmarks of true love; trust, respect, honesty and the feeling of wanting the person you love feel as loved as possible are among these.

It is my opinion that those who believe in 'ultimate love' of some divinity or mystical revelatory experience are denying the very human quality of love. All love is flawed just as all people are flawed - well, except for my better half, that is! *phew! Glad I remembered to qualify that!!!*. True love simply overlooks those flaws to allow two people to realise the harmony of their love for each other. I also think that desire, in the sense of desiring someone for who they are not what they look like, is a part of love, but if you feel only desire then you do not feel love.
Shadow_Hill
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 02:45 PM) [snapback]1641178[/snapback]
I answered 'Yes' I know true love exists and I know this because I have found my soul mate wub.gif

I am ambivalent to the concept of divinity so I do not ascribe the feelings of love towards this and the nature of my relationship with my soul mate leads me to the conclusion that the experience of love is not due to an electro-chemical reaction.

For me true love is nothing less than giving everything you are to someone with no expectation of anything returned. There are many hallmarks of true love; trust, respect, honesty and the feeling of wanting the person you love feel as loved as possible are among these.

It is my opinion that those who believe in 'ultimate love' of some divinity or mystical revelatory experience are denying the very human quality of love. All love is flawed just as all people are flawed - well, except for my better half, that is! *phew! Glad I remembered to qualify that!!!*. True love simply overlooks those flaws to allow two people to realise the harmony of their love for each other. I also think that desire, in the sense of desiring someone for who they are not what they look like, is a part of love, but if you feel only desire then you do not feel love.


Indeed. yes.gif I completely agree.

I found my soul mate too. wub.gif
truethat
I think it depends on how you define yourself.

Soul mates to me are more than one. But since I'm all over the place in my passions I don't tend to have a full picture of who I am any more. I think this also has something to do with the fact that I have three sons who are three completely different personalities who I love very much for different reasons.

It seems to me that you might be doing a research paper on this topic for school.

If so you should check out Tristan which is a short story precursor to Romeo and Juliet and talks about the duty of love versus the passions or eros as has been mentioned before.

Here's a link. Its much more in keeping with your topic than William Blake whose works are basically feminist and political in nature.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tristan
Thozzman
I believe "true" love cannot exist between two or more human beings because humans by their very nature are fallible and imperfect, and true love is the state of perfect understanding and cohesion between parties.
What humans feel to be "true love" is nothing more than lust and a strong desire to belong.

I think once we die and get to the other side, we'll realize just how wrong we were about the concept of love.
Leonardo
QUOTE(Thozzman @ Apr 22 2007, 03:34 PM) [snapback]1641229[/snapback]
I believe "true" love cannot exist between two or more human beings because humans by their very nature are fallible and imperfect, and true love is the state of perfect understanding and cohesion between parties.
What humans feel to be "true love" is nothing more than lust and a strong desire to belong.

I think once we die and get to the other side, we'll realize just how wrong we were about the concept of love.


While I appreciate and respect your opinion Thozzman, I find this attitude towards love to be very sad. Why shouldn't two people be able to find 'true love'. No one says love has to be perfect, just perfect for the two people who are in love. I suspect many people turn to religion simply because they are afraid of the realisation of love - or that they will never find someone to really love.

Why wait to be 'on the other side' to try to experience true love? Why not strive for it now? You never know - it might just happen.
Thozzman
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 10:46 AM) [snapback]1641249[/snapback]
While I appreciate and respect your opinion Thozzman, I find this attitude towards love to be very sad. Why shouldn't two people be able to find 'true love'. No one says love has to be perfect, just perfect for the two people who are in love. I suspect many people turn to religion simply because they are afraid of the realisation of love - or that they will never find someone to really love.

Why wait to be 'on the other side' to try to experience true love? Why not strive for it now? You never know - it might just happen.


I do appreciate the sentiments Leonardo,
I married my current wife out of convenience rather than love, and yes she knows it.
I would have to go into a 5000 word essay to actually be able to explain my view on the subject. The only true love I've ever felt was either from Jesus, or my dog Zeke.
Simply put, I think love is just a word, until we reach wherever we end up after life ceases.
Besides, I'm 52.
If "true love" was going to come my way it would have done so by now. I'm used to the idea.
It was very painful for a few years but nothing one can't get used to.

Just like the Zepplin song says, "looking for a woman who's never been born". I'm sure she'll turn up in the afterlife someplace (fingers crossed). thumbsup.gif
nn23
QUOTE(truethat @ Apr 22 2007, 03:25 PM) [snapback]1641219[/snapback]
It seems to me that you might be doing a research paper on this topic for school.

he he...yeah, the school of life tongue.gif ...LMAO! ....no this hasnt got anything to do with my profession.

...i'm just interested, was inspired by these two blokes who were having quite a passionate discussion about it in another thread laugh.gif

Cheers for the link though, i'll check it out thumbsup.gif

NICE ONE!!
nn23
Leonardo
QUOTE(Thozzman @ Apr 22 2007, 04:01 PM) [snapback]1641269[/snapback]
I do appreciate the sentiments Leonardo,
I married my current wife out of convenience rather than love, and yes she knows it.
I would have to go into a 5000 word essay to actually be able to explain my view on the subject. The only true love I've ever felt was either from Jesus, or my dog Zeke.
Simply put, I think love is just a word, until we reach wherever we end up after life ceases.
Besides, I'm 52.
If "true love" was going to come my way it would have done so by now. I'm used to the idea.
It was very painful for a few years but nothing one can't get used to.

Just like the Zepplin song says, "looking for a woman who's never been born". I'm sure she'll turn up in the afterlife someplace (fingers crossed). thumbsup.gif


Thozz,

I'm 42 and was divorced for 7 years before I met the 'one' just recently. I too had pretty much decided it was never going to happen, but it did. I'll admit I'm lucky and I'm very jazzed that I have met this wonderful woman. I do think the soul searches through lifetimes for the one who makes us feel true love and perhaps we don't find that other soul in each lifetime we live. You've got a good, mature attitude to life (as you should!) and I know that, if not in this journey then in another, you will find that one thumbsup.gif

Just don't give up on the search!!!
Thozzman
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 11:18 AM) [snapback]1641294[/snapback]
Thozz,

I'm 42 and was divorced for 7 years before I met the 'one' just recently. I too had pretty much decided it was never going to happen, but it did. I'll admit I'm lucky and I'm very jazzed that I have met this wonderful woman. I do think the soul searches through lifetimes for the one who makes us feel true love and perhaps we don't find that other soul in each lifetime we live. You've got a good, mature attitude to life (as you should!) and I know that, if not in this journey then in another, you will find that one thumbsup.gif

Just don't give up on the search!!!


I won't give up Leonardo, yours is sound advice. thumbsup.gif
And the greatest of luck and love to you and yours.

peace original.gif
m. Moe
I don't know why I love some people. I've only really loved one person, before that everyone else I dated out of looks only and didn't really feel any real deep connection(you could call it "puppy love"), but she didn't love me back. sad.gif So I don't really know what love means to me, I'm still figuring it out.
Shadow_Hill
I'm very fortunate. I met my soul mate when I was only 17, so we've been together 20 years already. I think it happens for different people at different times... I'm just incredibly lucky that it happened for me when I was so young.
FOS
QUOTE(Shadow_Hill @ Apr 22 2007, 05:59 PM) [snapback]1641389[/snapback]
I'm very fortunate. I met my soul mate when I was only 17, so we've been together 20 years already. I think it happens for different people at different times... I'm just incredibly lucky that it happened for me when I was so young.


Oh yea? I'm not inclined to think that theres just one person out there who is my soul mate as that is a depressing thought, but I think theres a fair few people who I have the potential to have a special connexion with.
hyperactive
love: it is a trust relationship. nothing more.

People create "love", but it is not what they think it is. Worse, few people are capable of ever experiencing anything close to this romanticised concept of love. More often we find people confuse fear for love.

A sole mate is a sole mate because you cobble that shoe together, not for any other reason. (make it in the head, believe it in the head, and see[project] it in the world) laugh.gif
nn23
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 04:18 PM) [snapback]1641294[/snapback]
Thozz,

I'm 42 and was divorced for 7 years before I met the 'one' just recently. I too had pretty much decided it was never going to happen, but it did. I'll admit I'm lucky and I'm very jazzed that I have met this wonderful woman. I do think the soul searches through lifetimes for the one who makes us feel true love and perhaps we don't find that other soul in each lifetime we live. You've got a good, mature attitude to life (as you should!) and I know that, if not in this journey then in another, you will find that one thumbsup.gif

Just don't give up on the search!!!

he he, this is COMPLETELY hyperthetical for the sake of the discussion.

So, this wonderful woman is your soul mate. What if tommorrow she sat you down and started a caring talk...

"Leo, i have something to tell you, its something thats been troubling me for many years i have had much councilling that i have not spoken of to you before, seeing as we have not known each other long and have kept it to myself until i could be sure. Now we are at this stage i feel i can finally be myself. Leo, i have always felt that i am a gay man stuck in a womans body and i want to have a sex change."

As hilarious and rediculous as this sounds, rather than looking for reasons as to why it wouldnt happen, i am interested to know how you might react if it did.

Apart from all the supportive converse which i am sure there would be. If this was what she truely wanted, what would be your stand point as far as the continuence of your relationship? would this change affect the terms of your spiritual "soul mate" connection? Could you remain in a loving relationship with her/him as her/his partner?

Apologies for scaring you with this thought... he he.
nn23
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Apr 22 2007, 06:46 PM) [snapback]1641424[/snapback]
love: it is a trust relationship. nothing more.

People create "love", but it is not what they think it is. Worse, few people are capable of ever experiencing anything close to this romanticised concept of love. More often we find people confuse fear for love.

A sole mate is a sole mate because you cobble that shoe together, not for any other reason. (make it in the head, believe it in the head, and see[project] it in the world) laugh.gif
I like this original.gif
nn23
QUOTE(FOS @ Apr 22 2007, 02:07 PM) [snapback]1641129[/snapback]
This fits niceley with me:

'Every one of us has a group of souls we are spiritually connected to, just that little more than we are connected with the collective consciousness. A group we are meant to connect with in both the spirit world, and here by choice in physical form. This is our soul group.

The group could be you, and one other person, or several people. Our spirit guides are also part of our soul group.

People from our soul group come into our lives at seemingly random times, but in fact these meetings were prearranged between us in spirit before we came here.

We agree to connect and enable each other to learn a lesson or many lessons depending on how long we have arranged to be in each others lifetime. This is why some people are only fleetingly but intensely involved in our lives, then move on.

Maybe you have felt a connection when you met someone for the first time, a feeling like you have known them forever,‚ an instant rapport?'

http://www.rachelkeene.co.uk/soulgroups.html

Awww that is really sweet, i like it, its got a nice sentiment yes.gif ....but consciousness is one. The term collective consciousness while it attempts to denote a non-duality, by "collecting" consciousness' it is immediately dividing.

But yeah, there is always a group of people/person you meet that you feel like you can most relate to, but I also think we are all experiencing this together, even if others are not aware‚I think that feeling was a precursor to my wheely bin experience I was telling you about the other day. laugh.gif

Yeah this line from the link gave me a thought.
QUOTE
Well, another soul group member speaks the same language spiritually. We recognise their energy, not their appearance.

Language is a limitation.

---------------------------
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 02:45 PM) [snapback]1641178[/snapback]
It is my opinion that those who believe in 'ultimate love' of some divinity or mystical revelatory experience are denying the very human quality of love.
hmmm, he he sorry to pick on you again Leo tongue.gif

It could be said that those who only appreciate the human quality of love are denying the feeling of "ultimate love" that can be attained by letting go of limitations. Perhaps by letting go of the "human" in "quality" one will just be left with quality itself.

QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 02:45 PM) [snapback]1641178[/snapback]
All love is flawed just as all people are flawed - well, except for my better half, that is! *phew! Glad I remembered to qualify that!!!*. True love simply overlooks those flaws to allow two people to realise the harmony of their love for each other. I also think that desire, in the sense of desiring someone for who they are not what they look like, is a part of love, but if you feel only desire then you do not feel love.

I think its a shame that all flaws everywhere can not be overlooked by everyone...is it not?

-----------------------
QUOTE(Thozzman @ Apr 22 2007, 03:34 PM) [snapback]1641229[/snapback]
I believe "true" love cannot exist between two or more human beings because humans by their very nature are fallible and imperfect, and true love is the state of perfect understanding and cohesion between parties.
What humans feel to be "true love" is nothing more than lust and a strong desire to belong.

I think once we die and get to the other side, we'll realize just how wrong we were about the concept of love.

Yes, this is a point illustrated in the quote from Bhagavad Gita at the start of the thread, it shows resolution by demonstrating that the experience of bliss/true love is realised through awareness of what remains when all thoughts and desires are set free/let go. The self.

HA HAAA so, thats the message guys, let go of all desire and thought and what is left is the feeling of bliss that comes with the union of all, to oneness....its simple! thumbsup.gif

-------------------------
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 03:46 PM) [snapback]1641249[/snapback]
While I appreciate and respect your opinion Thozzman, I find this attitude towards love to be very sad. Why shouldn't two people be able to find 'true love'. No one says love has to be perfect, just perfect for the two people who are in love. I suspect many people turn to religion simply because they are afraid of the realisation of love - or that they will never find someone to really love.

Why wait to be 'on the other side' to try to experience true love? Why not strive for it now? You never know - it might just happen.

mmm, i think many people search for love because they are afraid also.


QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 22 2007, 04:18 PM) [snapback]1641294[/snapback]
Just don't give up on the search!!!

Hmmm, To quote Brave "The mystics would say" why search for whats already there. They see the bliss of harmony with ones self is not something that needs to be found because it is all that is here and now, you just need to let go of all thoughts that make it "not". The search would serve the same purpose as looking for a pair of glasses that were on top of your head all along. Its already there.

-----------------------
QUOTE(MR_MOE @ Apr 22 2007, 05:54 PM) [snapback]1641383[/snapback]
I don't know why I love some people. I've only really loved one person, before that everyone else I dated out of looks only and didn't really feel any real deep connection(you could call it "puppy love"), but she didn't love me back. sad.gif So I don't really know what love means to me, I'm still figuring it out.

he he, may aswell paste the same point in rather than think of another way to word it wink2.gif

When you let go of all desire and thought then what is left is the feeling of bliss that comes with the union of all, to oneness. thumbsup.gif



HA HAAA mind you, it probably seems a-lot easier and more fun just to go out on the pull LMAO!!! laugh.gif
Tangerine Sheri
QUOTE(hyperactive @ Apr 22 2007, 10:46 AM) [snapback]1641424[/snapback]
love: it is a trust relationship. nothing more.

People create "love", but it is not what they think it is. Worse, few people are capable of ever experiencing anything close to this romanticised concept of love. More often we find people confuse fear for love.

A sole mate is a sole mate because you cobble that shoe together, not for any other reason. (make it in the head, believe it in the head, and see[project] it in the world) laugh.gif

love is nothing more than removing limits, expectations and need...Its about letting go of the silly romanticied tales we spin and fully jsut being in this case in a union of trust.....i also agree with doc its in your head....
Leonardo
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 22 2007, 06:56 PM) [snapback]1641430[/snapback]
he he, this is COMPLETELY hyperthetical for the sake of the discussion.

So, this wonderful woman is your soul mate. What if tommorrow she sat you down and started a caring talk...

"Leo, i have something to tell you, its something thats been troubling me for many years i have had much councilling that i have not spoken of to you before, seeing as we have not known each other long and have kept it to myself until i could be sure. Now we are at this stage i feel i can finally be myself. Leo, i have always felt that i am a gay man stuck in a womans body and i want to have a sex change."

As hilarious and rediculous as this sounds, rather than looking for reasons as to why it wouldnt happen, i am interested to know how you might react if it did.

Apart from all the supportive converse which i am sure there would be. If this was what she truely wanted, what would be your stand point as far as the continuence of your relationship? would this change affect the terms of your spiritual "soul mate" connection? Could you remain in a loving relationship with her/him as her/his partner?

Apologies for scaring you with this thought... he he.


This is an interesting question, nn.

While I am not in this situation and I may react differently to how I hope I would react this is what I believe I would do and feel.

A soul mate is a soul mate, there (imo) need be no physical relationship in this so that aspect of our relationship would not change. I am not attracted to the male form or a person's 'maleness' however. I am not homophobic at all, I just do not find men 'attractive' in this way. So the physical side of our relationship probably would change. I would still love my partner but would feel no physical passion towards 'him'.

I imagine these feelings would not just instantly stop and that would be very confusing. Whether we could continue in our relationship (sans the physical aspect) as a 'couple' I don't know...and I don't think this is a question I could answer without the experience of the situation.
Leonardo
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]1641749[/snapback]
hmmm, he he sorry to pick on you again Leo tongue.gif

It could be said that those who only appreciate the human quality of love are denying the feeling of "ultimate love" that can be attained by letting go of limitations. Perhaps by letting go of the "human" in "quality" one will just be left with quality itself.


Perhaps you are right, nn, and if that's what you believe than who am I to deny that belief. I simply believe that too many people deny the beauty and nobility that can be found in our very flawed, human selves and instead 'search' for an ideal, never satisfied that they haven't found that 'perfect state of being'. The perfect state of being is simply accepting ourselves for who we are, and others for who they are, not trying to force an ideal upon ourselves or others. To let go of being human is to let go of this acceptance, this might be the way to transcendence and I could be wrong in my belief, but I accept that I am human and I am flawed but I can work within these flaws to be loved and give love to others. What more could I want?

QUOTE
I think its a shame that all flaws everywhere can not be overlooked by everyone...is it not?


Fear is one of the easiest emotions to evoke as it is part of our basic survival instinct. Love is probably unnecessary from the survivalist point of view so can feel unnatural or uncomfortable to some people.

QUOTE
mmm, i think many people search for love because they are afraid also.


I agree, people are afraid of not being loved so they search for love - often in all the wrong places or from the wrong people. I had given up on the search and yet I found it - given what I believe I find this slightly ironic.

QUOTE
Hmmm, To quote Brave "The mystics would say" why search for whats already there. They see the bliss of harmony with ones self is not something that needs to be found because it is all that is here and now, you just need to let go of all thoughts that make it "not". The search would serve the same purpose as looking for a pair of glasses that were on top of your head all along. Its already there.


Ahhh, mysticism! Brave and I have had a few discussions about our beliefs regarding this. If someone wishes to sit on a mountaintop in isolation to meditate on what it means to be human, not realising all they have to do is live according to their nature and accept their humanity than who am I to dissuade them?
nn23
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 07:50 AM) [snapback]1642024[/snapback]
This is an interesting question, nn.

While I am not in this situation and I may react differently to how I hope I would react this is what I believe I would do and feel.

A soul mate is a soul mate, there (imo) need be no physical relationship in this so that aspect of our relationship would not change. I am not attracted to the male form or a person's 'maleness' however. I am not homophobic at all, I just do not find men 'attractive' in this way. So the physical side of our relationship probably would change. I would still love my partner but would feel no physical passion towards 'him'.

I imagine these feelings would not just instantly stop and that would be very confusing. Whether we could continue in our relationship (sans the physical aspect) as a 'couple' I don't know...and I don't think this is a question I could answer without the experience of the situation.
So as in your first reply you stated that you know true love exists because you have found your soul mate, how does this scenario reflect upon this view. Does it mean that true love is a unity between two peoples body aswell as consciousness? This does not make sense, for people and bodies are part of consciousness.

Perhaps it means that finding true love with your soul mate is actually dependent/controlled by our genetic requirements with regards to gender as the psychological arguments prepose. Its ironic that something that is defined in such a spiritual way can be affected by something so unspiritual.

I am not saying this to belittle anybodies relationship with their loved ones. When someone creates something that successfully forfills each others needs, i am very happy. Its purely for the sake of the discussion.


QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 08:11 AM) [snapback]1642033[/snapback]
Perhaps you are right, nn, and if that's what you believe than who am I to deny that belief. I simply believe that too many people deny the beauty and nobility that can be found in our very flawed, human selves and instead 'search' for an ideal, never satisfied that they haven't found that 'perfect state of being'. The perfect state of being is simply accepting ourselves for who we are, and others for who they are, not trying to force an ideal upon ourselves or others.
yes.gif well put.

QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 08:11 AM) [snapback]1642033[/snapback]
To let go of being human is to let go of this acceptance, this might be the way to transcendence and I could be wrong in my belief, but I accept that I am human and I am flawed but I can work within these flaws to be loved and give love to others. What more could I want?

The BG illustrates the point that by just being, you want for nothing.

HA HAAA "The mystics would say" If you realised that there were no flaws then there would be no work, only the feelings of bliss that come with the unity of self. All actions would simply be.

awww its so beautiful wub.gif

QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 08:11 AM) [snapback]1642033[/snapback]
Fear is one of the easiest emotions to evoke as it is part of our basic survival instinct. Love is probably unnecessary from the survivalist point of view so can feel unnatural or uncomfortable to some people.
If love is unnecessary from the survivalist p.o.v what is the point of view you are representing?

QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 08:11 AM) [snapback]1642033[/snapback]
I agree, people are afraid of not being loved so they search for love - often in all the wrong places or from the wrong people. I had given up on the search and yet I found it - given what I believe I find this slightly ironic.
Hmm, yeahh...but i was also thinking more along the lines of afraid to be alone, which creates a slightly different meaning to the point in relation to what we interpret to be love.

QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 08:11 AM) [snapback]1642033[/snapback]
Ahhh, mysticism! Brave and I have had a few discussions about our beliefs regarding this. If someone wishes to sit on a mountaintop in isolation to meditate on what it means to be human, not realising all they have to do is live according to their nature and accept their humanity than who am I to dissuade them?
HA HA! laugh.gif I agree.

Although i do not know how the reference to "someone who wishes to sit on a mountaintop in isolation to meditate on what it means to be human, not realising all they have to do is live according to their nature and accept their humanity" is relavent or relatable to mysticism huh.gif ...he he, Meditating to "find" meaning sounds a bit silly to me rofl.gif

Our nature is in our consciousness and being. Humanity is just one aspect of everything....


thumbup.gif linked-imagenn23linked-image
Kalien
I don't really question love. <3
nn23
QUOTE(Kaylee @ Apr 23 2007, 02:04 PM) [snapback]1642266[/snapback]
I don't really question love. <3
rofl.gif ok
tcgram
I believe in "true love." In true love, romantic love is prevalent in the beginning, but it changes over time; becomes something deeper, more enriching, becoming more of an emotional connection between a couple. My hubby and I have respect for one another, we trust each other, and are supportive of one another. We don't always agree but we talk out our differences and come to an agreement. wub.gif
Leonardo
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 01:31 PM) [snapback]1642229[/snapback]
So as in your first reply you stated that you know true love exists because you have found your soul mate, how does this scenario reflect upon this view. Does it mean that true love is a unity between two peoples body aswell as consciousness? This does not make sense, for people and bodies are part of consciousness.

Perhaps it means that finding true love with your soul mate is actually dependent/controlled by our genetic requirements with regards to gender as the psychological arguments prepose. Its ironic that something that is defined in such a spiritual way can be affected by something so unspiritual.

I am not saying this to belittle anybodies relationship with their loved ones. When someone creates something that successfully forfills each others needs, i am very happy. Its purely for the sake of the discussion.


I probably wasn't too clear with the whole 'true love' and 'soul mate' thing. I don't mean to say you can only find true love with your soul mate, but I have found both in one package. The physical passion of love need not be a part of true love (or any love imo) but it often is.

QUOTE
If love is unnecessary from the survivalist p.o.v what is the point of view you are representing?


My own. I don't need love to keep living, but now that I have found love I feel so much more alive.

QUOTE
Hmm, yeahh...but i was also thinking more along the lines of afraid to be alone, which creates a slightly different meaning to the point in relation to what we interpret to be love.


Companionship may bring love with it, but people who are afraid of being alone are not really searching for love, but companionship. Note I am not talking of the love engendered by friendship, but the 'true love' of feeling one person somehow completes you in some undefinable way.
TheMeaningOfLife
I dont think love truly exsists,. I think there is ONE and only ONE perfect match out there for all of us, and in the coarse of a lifetime only a few of us will really find them, the rest is just heavy attachment and close friendship to that person.
Shadow_Hill
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 22 2007, 06:56 PM) [snapback]1641430[/snapback]
he he, this is COMPLETELY hyperthetical for the sake of the discussion.

So, this wonderful woman is your soul mate. What if tommorrow she sat you down and started a caring talk...

"Leo, i have something to tell you, its something thats been troubling me for many years i have had much councilling that i have not spoken of to you before, seeing as we have not known each other long and have kept it to myself until i could be sure. Now we are at this stage i feel i can finally be myself. Leo, i have always felt that i am a gay man stuck in a womans body and i want to have a sex change."

As hilarious and rediculous as this sounds, rather than looking for reasons as to why it wouldnt happen, i am interested to know how you might react if it did.

Apart from all the supportive converse which i am sure there would be. If this was what she truely wanted, what would be your stand point as far as the continuence of your relationship? would this change affect the terms of your spiritual "soul mate" connection? Could you remain in a loving relationship with her/him as her/his partner?

Apologies for scaring you with this thought... he he.


I know the question was addressed to Leo, but if you don't mind me answering... it wouldn't make any difference to me. My soul mate happens to be in a male body, but it's not his body I love (although I love that too blush.gif ).

My husband used to work for a man who began going through the sex change process. He dressed as a woman for several years - had breasts - and his wife stayed with him. People were very mean about it all, but they were soul mates. It's not what's on the outside that matters.
nn23
QUOTE(tcgram @ Apr 23 2007, 02:41 PM) [snapback]1642315[/snapback]
I believe in "true love." In true love, romantic love is prevalent in the beginning, but it changes over time; becomes something deeper, more enriching, becoming more of an emotional connection between a couple. My hubby and I have respect for one another, we trust each other, and are supportive of one another. We don't always agree but we talk out our differences and come to an agreement. wub.gif
awww, thats lovely laugh.gif It sounds like you have the sort of relationship which Scott Peck describes in the quote at the beginning. I suppose a relationships can dependent on how you deal with changes over time. This kind of supports the the psychological perspectives, in the correlation between how transition is dealt with and well-being. Do you hold any spiritual beliefs with regard to love?
nn23
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 02:52 PM) [snapback]1642331[/snapback]
I probably wasn't too clear with the whole 'true love' and 'soul mate' thing. I don't mean to say you can only find true love with your soul mate, but I have found both in one package. The physical passion of love need not be a part of true love (or any love imo) but it often is.
thumbsup.gif I like that.

QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 01:31 PM) [snapback]1642229[/snapback]
If love is unnecessary from the survivalist p.o.v what is the point of view you are representing?
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 02:52 PM) [snapback]1642331[/snapback]
My own. I don't need love to keep living, but now that I have found love I feel so much more alive.
blush.gif awww... So who is it then that has a survivalist p.o.v?

QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 02:52 PM) [snapback]1642331[/snapback]
Companionship may bring love with it, but people who are afraid of being alone are not really searching for love, but companionship. Note I am not talking of the love engendered by friendship, but the 'true love' of feeling one person somehow completes you in some undefinable way.
Do you think this is what all the people who are afraid to be alone would say? How many people who are afraid to be alone would have the courage to realise it i wonder?

Leonardo
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 04:14 PM) [snapback]1642431[/snapback]
blush.gif awww... So who is it then that has a survivalist p.o.v?


Survivalists!!!! rofl.gif
nn23
QUOTE(Shadow_Hill @ Apr 23 2007, 02:56 PM) [snapback]1642338[/snapback]
I know the question was addressed to Leo, but if you don't mind me answering
no, nooo thats fine thumbup.gif its a good question for everyone actually yes.gif

QUOTE(Shadow_Hill @ Apr 23 2007, 02:56 PM) [snapback]1642338[/snapback]
... it wouldn't make any difference to me. My soul mate happens to be in a male body, but it's not his body I love (although I love that too blush.gif ).

My husband used to work for a man who began going through the sex change process. He dressed as a woman for several years - had breasts - and his wife stayed with him. People were very mean about it all, but they were soul mates. It's not what's on the outside that matters.
laugh.gif Thats lovely.
Yes, it would be interesting to conduct a study on the difference between male and female answers. Not only the actual point of the answer but the structure with which it is described also, i'd be interested to know if there were any correlations. I do already have a hypothersis in mind...ha ha, i'm no sociologist though... I LOVE researching original.gif

NICE ONE
nn23
nn23
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 08:11 AM) [snapback]1642033[/snapback]
Fear is one of the easiest emotions to evoke as it is part of our basic survival instinct. Love is probably unnecessary from the survivalist point of view so can feel unnatural or uncomfortable to some people.
hmmm, on the contrary, i am wondering the exact opposite.

QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 01:31 PM) [snapback]1642229[/snapback]
If love is unnecessary from the survivalist p.o.v what is the point of view you are representing?
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 02:52 PM) [snapback]1642331[/snapback]

My own. I don't need love to keep living, but now that I have found love I feel so much more alive.
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 04:14 PM) [snapback]1642431[/snapback]

blush.gif awww... So who is it then that has a survivalist p.o.v?
QUOTE(Leonardo @ Apr 23 2007, 04:19 PM) [snapback]1642436[/snapback]

Survivalists!!!! rofl.gif


he he mmm...i suppose it takes one to know one tongue.gif
nn23
QUOTE(TheMeaningOfLife @ Apr 23 2007, 02:55 PM) [snapback]1642335[/snapback]
I dont think love truly exsists,. I think there is ONE and only ONE perfect match out there for all of us, and in the coarse of a lifetime only a few of us will really find them, the rest is just heavy attachment and close friendship to that person.
heh e yeah, i think its all just heavy attachment and close friendship...well i term it as partnership and pleasure. Although these two characteristics amoungst many within a relationship are used to define love, i believe that love is something much larger than this, that does not reside between just two people. Are there any reasons behind your statement that there is ONE and only ONE perfect match?

thumbsup.gif
nn23
Beckys_Mom
Ok my turn lol



True loves isn't easy

it hurts just as much as it can make you happy

Not everyone that dates..finds true love


When you find that mr right (for the guys miss right lol)...........then it hits you.............something you cannot explain

For me it took a lot of time...I used to ditch guys like it was going out of fashion lol

But I soon wised up, and descided to focus on a relationship, and when I did, thats when it hit me.

Soul mate?? yea prolly..

For me I go for someone who is the complete opposite LOL opposites attract ya know LMAO..........Just ask Paula Abdul and the CAT LMAO w00t.gif


But most importanly..what keeps the true love alive are these --> Understanding, Listening, caring, support at all times, not always putting yourself 1st being more thoughtful and considerate...honesty...all goes a long way...............and it don't cost much ............

True love comes for free..just like the best things in life are free.............catch is..you have to be willing to show them and give them...........
nn23
yes.gif EXCELLENT!!

How does your love for God differ from your love for your partner? apart from the obvious tongue.gif

Tangerine Sheri
QUOTE(Shadow_Hill @ Apr 23 2007, 06:56 AM) [snapback]1642338[/snapback]
I know the question was addressed to Leo, but if you don't mind me answering... it wouldn't make any difference to me. My soul mate happens to be in a male body, but it's not his body I love (although I love that too blush.gif ).

My husband used to work for a man who began going through the sex change process. He dressed as a woman for several years - had breasts - and his wife stayed with him. People were very mean about it all, but they were soul mates. It's not what's on the outside that matters.

i agree with this, if my hubby decided to be a woman i'd not have an issue with it....its about the persons journey and and this would be an interesting twist...*smiles*
Barek Halfhand
whistling2.gif








holy crap my side hurts, I can take no more! w00t.gif
Tangerine Sheri
QUOTE(Barek Halfhand @ Apr 23 2007, 07:36 PM) [snapback]1643405[/snapback]
whistling2.gif
holy crap my side hurts, I can take no more! w00t.gif

Barek, and your thoughts on love are...
Barek Halfhand
QUOTE(Supra Sheri @ Apr 23 2007, 10:19 PM) [snapback]1643441[/snapback]
Barek, and your thoughts on love are...
I'm sorry were you addressing Mr Halfhand?... and what does your hubby wanting to be a woman have to do with love?.....B
nativechick1989
Do you Believe in True Love?
No
Cadetak
QUOTE(nativechick1989 @ Apr 24 2007, 01:38 AM) [snapback]1643553[/snapback]
Do you Believe in True Love?
No


All real love is true.

Quote Time!

"When you love, your life is nothing, not a fraction, not a speck of dust, nothing when compared to the life of the one you love. You would give it in a second."
"True love is the souls recognition of its counterpart."
"Love is but a beautiful rose, it is nice to have and every one wants one, but the thorns hurt, and one day the rose has to die."
"Tis better to have loved and lost then never to have loved at all."
"It is remarkable how similar the pattern of love is to the pattern of insanity."
"Love is the big booming beat which covers up the noise of hate."
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
''One word frees us of all the weight and pain of life: That word is love."
Barek Halfhand
I think love is a magical,mystical journey..... full of self actualization and joy! ..... yes.gif
Emo Halfhand






that better?
tcgram
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 23 2007, 10:00 AM) [snapback]1642344[/snapback]
Do you hold any spiritual beliefs with regard to love?


I don't mean to sound ignorant, but would you please clarify? original.gif
Beckys_Mom
QUOTE(nn23 @ Apr 24 2007, 02:21 AM) [snapback]1643309[/snapback]
yes.gif EXCELLENT!!

How does your love for God differ from your love for your partner? apart from the obvious tongue.gif

LMAO @ apprt from the obvious LMAO rofl.gif

Ok...well I am not maddly in love with God

I dont have to worry about God..............meaning..is God going to make it home on time SAFE and SOUND?? I dont have to do that with God

I don't have to worry if God is going to die on me!!!.he aint going to die LMAO...................but I dont want my Gary to die on me either

I dont have to worry if God will take sick...................... my partner has gotten sick and it nearly killed me..with worry

I am not responcible for God.....I only see him as a father figure


I see my partner as more than that...someone to cuddle up to..ect ect....................umm you know the rest LMAO......................but I cant think of a God in that way

I dont want to do everything with God LMAO.......................But I do with gary..............I mean come on..who else is going to help me put my fake tan on?? LMAO

I can see Gary..smells him (on a bad day from his work you dont wanna go there LMAO)...kiss him lol..............touch him....need him....

I need gary to support me

I need God to be there in my time of need


But my love for Gary is stronger

my love for my lil girl is a lot stronger

my love for God is just strong

Do I put family and loved ones over God????????????..............................YES I sure do................they need me and I need them

God doesnt need me..................he is just there to listen


BIG DIFFERENCE!!



Tangerine Sheri
QUOTE(Barek Halfhand @ Apr 23 2007, 08:28 PM) [snapback]1643447[/snapback]
I'm sorry were you addressing Mr Halfhand?... and what does you hubby wanting to be a woman have to do with love?.....B

I said 'if' he did it wouldn't matter in response to another post...Its just a ' post' Barek... why don't you focus on posting a POV instead of wasting time on saying nothing???
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