I personally believe in the death penalty. In all honesty, I have some rather radical, hardcore opinions on punishment for certain types of criminals. I feel (and quite a few in the medical community as well) like rapists and pedophiles are not able to be rehabilitated. I feel the same about people who are criminally insane. As such, they should never be released back into society. Now, should they be executed? I don't know. One part of me thinks that, yes they should. We would not allow a rabid dog to live and that is how I view these types of criminals. The other part of me thinks that if my usual opinion is "eye for eye", then death is not the appropriate punishment.

What are your opinions? Do you think the death penalty should be punishment for anything other than murder? If you don't believe in the death penalty at all, what do you think the appropriate punishment should be for rapists, pedophiles and the criminally insane?

PLEASE READ THE ARTICLE BELOW


http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/ap/0507/2...ent_upheld.html

La. Child Rapist's Death Sentence Upheld


By Kevin McGill

NEW ORLEANS (AP) — Louisiana's Supreme Court ruled that a man may be executed for raping an 8-year-old girl, and lawyers say his case may become the test for whether the nation's highest court upholds the death penalty for someone who rapes a child.

Both sides say the sentence for Patrick Kennedy, 42, could expand a 1977 U.S. Supreme Court ruling that held the death penalty for rape violated the Eighth Amendment protection against cruel and unusual punishment. The high court said then that its ruling applied only to adult victims.

Attorney Jelpi Picou, director of the New Orleans-based Capital Appeals Project, said he will ask the Louisiana Supreme Court for a rehearing and, if rejected, will go to the U.S. Supreme Court.

"As horrid as (rape) is and as harshly as we believe it should be condemned, death is inappropriate in this case," Picou said.

Louisiana law allows the death penalty for the aggravated rape of someone less than 12 years old.

"He's the only person in the United States on death row for non-homicide rape," Picou said.

Kennedy was convicted in 2003 of raping a relative as she sorted Girl Scout cookies in the garage of her home in suburban New Orleans. He bragged to one man that the girl "became a lady today," deputies said.

His defense attorney at the time argued that blood testing was inconclusive and that the victim — who didn't report that Kennedy was her rapist until 21 months later — was pressured to change her story.

In Tuesday's opinion, Justice Jeffrey Victory wrote, "Our state Legislature and this court have determined this category of aggravated rapist to be among those deserving of the death penalty, and, short of a first-degree murderer, we can think of no other non-homicide crime more deserving."

Victory wrote that the Louisiana law meets the U.S. Supreme Court test requiring an aggravating circumstance — in this case the age of the victim — to justify the death penalty.

The governors of South Carolina and Oklahoma signed laws last year allowing the death penalty for people who repeatedly rape children. Richard Dieter of the Death Penalty Information Center in Washington, D.C., said he doesn't know of any successful prosecution under either of those laws.

A bill that would allow the death penalty for a second offense of child rape is awaiting the governor's decision in Texas.

Georgia law allows death as a penalty for rape. Dieter said Florida and Montana also have such laws, but authorities have said the penalty would be invoked only for rape of a child.

save the expense of the trial for the kitty raper, all i need is a quarter to take care if the problem.
Rapists are some of the most repugnant people on the planet, child rapists even more so. Sure the death sentence would be ok with me, as long as the evidence is iron clad. I see possible revenge scenarios, where a girl cries rape to get even with someone, its more common than ever. The convictions should have some forensic support as well.. I have daughters so i have discussed this with my wife before. We came up with castration for repeat offenders, nothing like pissing through a catheder for the rest of your life to adjust your attitude.

I agree. I have a whole combination of things I think we should be doing, but they're rather harsh and I don't share them often as they tend to offend people's delicate politically correct constitutions......

I believe in the death penalty, however, I don't think it's a one size fits all solution.
I'm a fan of island rehabilitation. Send 'em to an island that is big enough to support the millions that will be sent there over time.
Don't let it get like Australia. Have the perimeter small enough to be patroled by a UN navy. Every once in a while we should introduce a new species of poisonous snake, deadly frog, rabid lions, whatever. Keep it interesting. They can grow food if they can figure it out. They can hunt if they can build the tools for it.
Lawyers too.

Oh, there is a movie almost just like that, can't remember the name.

Okay, at the risk of sounding like Hitler (I'M NOT A NAZI PEOPLE), I think there should be a "Third Strike" rule that combines rehabilitation and education. If after the third strike they have not made use of their chance to reform, they should be sentenced to LIFE in..........work camps. Why should people who pay taxes and contribute to society pay year after year for their jail time? Why not put them in a work camp and force them to contribute something. Their lives have a been a total waste and drain on society, so why not get something out of their life?

I understand that even with rehabilitation and education, that people with a record do have a difficult time getting jobs. I don't know what the solution is to that. This is just my opinion on the punishment phase.

THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO SEX OFFENDERS, PEDOPHILES, OR THE CRIMINALLY INSANE.

Hi Pandora,

This thread should get interesting.

As fair minded as I try to be even I realize that there are some people, no matter how much support they are given, are not the type who reform. Rapist are at the top of that list.

First I will define my term of a rapist. A person of legal age or above legal age who has consensual relations with a person who is underage; if person looks to be 18 or has lied about their age, age didn't come up because they met in what was supposedly to be an adult environment, (carded club or bar) or if they are in a consent sexual relationship but the parents disapprove and press charges. In all of those scenarios the 'legal adult' will be considered a rapist.
And to me there is an age limit surrounding this. 18- 25 year old males are about the same maturity level as a 13- 18 year old girl give or take on both sides. Usually a person older than 25 can figure out by wisdom and experience if the underage person is posing to be older.
But if a 17 year old and an 18 year old are having consensual sex the 18 still can be charged with rape. That to me is decidedly unfair.

However any person regardless of their gender or age who forces, coerces, themselves on another is a rapist. And the larger the age difference between victim and perpetrator the less inclined toward charity I personally am. No one could mistake a child under ten for being an adult unless the perpetrator is of limited capacity.

Eye for an eye, no not so much... Lock them up forever! OH! yeah! Or even in extreme cases execution! But as an earlier poster said for that I would have to have lots of proof. I would rather there be preemptive measures for these crimes. Family members should provide help for children who are being abused as these victims are more likely to become molesters/rapist than not later in life. There is a conspiracy of silence about sex offenses. And I think that the people who know of sexual abuse or sexual abuser within a family and keep quite about it are just as guilty as the molester/rapist is.

Stop filling the jails with frivolous crimes. You got caught with a recreational substance on you the current climate is go to jail for life. Rape a child and you get out in 5-10 years. It doesn't make sense. The person who gets caught with a recreational drug has a shot at getting help, a sex offender rarely does. Because by the time they get caught they've usually been at it for a long time.
It's not about sex, it's about power the perpetrator has over the victim and in the US society it's about the lack of importance we place on a victim or fear of the shame and scorn having a sexual victim in the family will bring.

My two cents.
Mabon.

Yes, I think so......

I also agree with your rock breaking prison idea! Always have thought that way! The island idea of an earlier poster is interesting to me. I don't understand why they don't rebuild someplace like Alcatraz and use it again. Easier to patrol.

Regards,
Mabon.

Oh that would be mental punishment. Lots of ghosties to scare the bejesus out of 'em!

For the record, I don't believe in the Death Penalty at all, for a lot of various reasons. I've talked about those reasons on UM a lot. I'll never support it for any criminal.

Now, that being said... the state I live in, actually DOES have a 3 strikes law AND... check this out...

If a pedofile is deemed by the court system too dangerous for society and likely to re-offend, the state can and will hold that prisoner indefinitely, even after their sentence is completed. Yes, Washington State has this law, and they use it. It hasn't been overturned yet as far as I'm aware. I believe New York state has a similar law.

Hopefully other states are observing what WA is doing.

I've been to Alcatraz (as a free guest of course) and that's not exactly what I had in mind More like Lost. If you're tired of being rained on then you better figure out how to build a shelter. That, my friends, is the only kind of education that some people will respond to.
Telling them they are being rehabilitated isn't the same as actual rehab. When you have taken blood then blood needs to be involved in your own healing.

I am completely pro-death penalty for the murders, rapists, criminally insane...whatever. For those who commit other various crimes, I have extreme opinions on what needs to be done with them. Personally, I think loosing body parts would make people think before they do... *shrugs* I'd totally be pondering the what if's of being caught.

Only downside is if they really are innocent.

Hey why not have a grand colleseum for criminals. Hey if some guy wants to rape a 10 year old then he might have a harder time dealing with mungo the 400 pound drug dealer at the other end of the stadium. Not only that but it would make prison just that much worse.

A common statement I have noticed was in the proof. Any one who is a serial anything should just be executed. Obviously they will not stop. That one life is not worth the many it will shred to pieces. And yes, with rape there is always the 'cry wolf' syndrome. But with technology now, there are many ways to prove that it did indeed happen-as long as it is reported right away. Anyone who does a crime against a child, that in my opinion is the worst 'degree' of crime and should be punished accordingly. To rob a bank you get the book thrown at you, but to murder someone you can get off on probation? Come on! And if you take away some innocent victim's rights-you shouldn't have any. These people who say that jail is inhumane, what did the person do to get there? If they had to work for a mattress, for sheets, for shoes, for clothes, for food, for water, etc. They wouldn't want to go back if they were let out. And if they were that busy while in prison, they wouldn't be killing others or raping others in there either-they'd be too tired.

No Escape with Ray Liotta. Great movie.

I do believe in the death penalty. As someone esle said there are some that are innocent though. That is why I think that the death penalty should only be considered if there are 3 seperate witnesses, not related in any way, then and only then should it be on thee table.

There are offenses that I feel cannot be rehabilitated, rape amd child molestation are the top of the list. The island thing would actually be to good for them but it is better than paying for them to lay up in air conditioned cells watching HBO.

IWNH, correct me if I'm wrong. I do sense a half serious half joking tone in your reply.. There is a baser part of my own nature that I admit having. Personally, no island, no second chances for some but a simple quick sword stroke in public and the nature of the crime well known. But that is a vengeful part of myself and does not take into account the whole picture. There is the victim and the victims family. There is also the fact that the perpetrators has family and I can and do feel a sort of pity depending on the crime what brought the perpetrator to that state of bestial instinct.

Putting them on an island to make them fight for survival in no way makes them understand the reason for their crime, for as you said they would be too busy just fighting for survival and in that environment there would be a 'form' of order. The stronger of the the misfits would create their own standards and I don't think that those would be better than what they came from in the first place.
'Lord of the flies', comes to mind.

I agree completely telling someone that they are being rehabilitated isn't the same as them being rehabilitated. A convicted person goes and sees a counselor a few times while incarcerated and play a game of telling the counselor what they want to hear. Blah. Pedophiles know how to win trust that is how most can get close to their victims. Most Pedophiles aren't strangers to their victims, they are close either family or members of the community that the child/children grew up in. That is why I feel that people that know of a sex offender in their family/midst and does nothing is as guilty as the perpetrator. That is what I mean by there is a conspiracy of silence. No one wants to talk about the sex offender in their family because then they would have to admit that it didn't spontaneously appear. Instead a lot of people will say... stay away from X, never find yourself alone with them that is if you can even get that out of them.
And by remaining silent about sex offenses in a family or community it gives the offender a sense of power to expand their field of victims.

One of the things that I am happy to see is the sense of empowerment given to children. Telling them that they don't have to hug or be touched by anyone they don't want to is a joy to my heart. My own cousin told her daughter that she didn't have to hug or be hugged by anyone and for a while she didn't want to be hugged by her grandfather. Sure it hurt him because my uncle is a good and decent man and loves his granddaughter but he understood and respected her. She didn't see him every day but every week or every other week, so at two he was a semi stranger.. two year olds are funny that way. Now my cousin could have said, 'give your granddad a hug' but that would have countermanded her earlier 'you don't have to hug anyone you don't want to' statement and potentially put the child in danger.



See to me, loosing body parts wouldn't do a thing except make that individual more dangerous. Saw a special years ago on HBO where a sex offender had asked to be castrated in attempt to cure him of his tendencies. He went through rehab in prison and seemed to be making progress yet once he was out, he offended again. He still found a way is the politest way to put it. I am afraid of the rage that would build in such individuals who were willingly or unwillingly mutilated because again it isn't about sex it's about power. And sometimes we forget that females are offenders too. What is going to be cut off a female offender???

Regards,
Mabon.

The criminals family and their feelings should be irrellevant. You can't apply innocence to a guilty party simply because the rest of the malcontent's family are swell people. If they have got to the point where you disregard any possibility that they are worth saving and instead have to rely on the good feelings you have for their extended family, cgances are the person's family has already done enough for the individual in question.. Its time to reinstate an actual punishment system, with real consequences, so its actually a deterent instead of a speed bump.

I'm with contactismade.

The thing about the death penalty, I think, is that it makes a seductive slippery-slope. If something is abhorrent and completely unacceptable, then it's easy to say "they must die". Very few people would argue that rape and child molestation should receive any mercy, but look where the next step on the slope is ...

Personally, I think that drugs are abhorrent and completely unacceptable. And if I was was a maker of laws. I might be awefully tempted to have a mandatory death sentence for all cases of production, sales, or distribution of any illegal mind-altering substance (with no chance of clemency) There would be no repeat drug offenders, and no one left to want drugs legalized. Problem solved? I might think so, but I bet that a lot of people would disagree.

Maybe add tobacco to the list of illegal drugs? Most of my family is either dying or dead from nicotine. My grandmother didn't even smoke, it was second-hand smoke from living with a smoker. But it killed her anyways. That sounds like a capitol offense.

I had a friend in school who suffered severe brain damage after being hit by a drunk driver who got off with no punishment. And even if he'd gone to jail, that wouldn't have returned her brain cells. And prison doesn't seem to deter future drunk drivers. Maybe a new Prohibition would work better with a death penalty to stop repeat offenders?

Has the slope gotten slippery enough? I'm not arguing for mercy for sexual perverts, but there must be some other method of punishment and deterrance that doesn't degrade the society who must pass judgement on these creatures. What's the answer? I don't know.

If future technology could realize the classic science-fiction idea of memory implants, perhaps using RNA or whatever, I think that might be a suitable punishment. If the convicted's life is forfeit, then so must be their personality. Let the perverted monster know what it really feels like to be a child who was violated, for as many donor memories as you can fit into the RNA. Let the guilty have a conscience which will scream in their minds forever.

Yeah but when you get probation for DUIs, that's NOT a deterrent. If you got 5 years and your license permanently taken way, then yeah, it would be a deterrent. What is needed are punishments that meet the crime. Harsher penalties are needed.

Aren't the people most likely to commit crimes are the ones who either don't think about the consequences or else don't care? Especially in cases of Dui, even the people who might care while sober stop thinking clearly while intoxicated, so the deterrant value is lost. If the penalty for Dui was 50 years in prison, I wonder if that would only lower the Dui rate by removing the opportunity to be a repeat offender?

That would solve the problem though because most people who get caught DUI once get caught twice, there is a high rate of repeat on this offense.