good post DML

Darkmoon lady excellent read and i concur, if you wantot know about someone ask them, each person is different i too have not known a pagan( and a good freind of mine is a pagan) that would ever conceive of violence the ones i know revere nature and all others and my friend in particular has got to be the most open minded understanding person I know..... and the pagans we have on UM are no exception..... great post

Why say SORRY??? What have you to be sorry for heather?? Im curious as to why you feel sorry?? When IMO you have NOTHING to be sorry about...

Are you sorry for what other authors have written in the links you posted??

Are you sorry that others took a stab at you...twisting it around, making it look as though you are the one that created these web pages??

Nah i dont think you should be sorry for that...

moving along....




STOP right there missy...........you didnt make it out as though the avarage joe pafan does anything rotten...no you didnt...you simply posted a link that made something rotten of the wiccan / pagan religion.....NOT YOU Hun...and I dont know why you are worried over this.....If anyone takes a pop at YOU for what was written in the websites posted..then they are the ones that SHOULD be sorry...not you...

And dont you dare tell me you are going to leave UM...ohh God no please dont ever think you dont want to return Texas...IM SERIOUS...you better start re-thinking lol, otherwise I will come over and kick your a*se into orbit ...................please dont ever want to leave ((hugies))


Or toilet paper your profile lol.........................enough of not wanting to come on here...I value you and your posts woman....

If it wernt for you, I would most likely still remain the feisty arrogant BM..and blind to what the christian faith is....so dont you freaking go wanting to leave...DONT!!!
You make me laugh too lol...

moving onwards...



you are correct, we are all guilty of it....everyone will always disagree with something or other, but thats what makes debates intresting, the point I think you are making is...we can be bloddy civil about it and still remain friends





I made it my goal to learn more about your faith..by asking you questions, and to add to that Heather, I found it easier to actually look up christian sites.....its the best way to find out more about the christian faith

My point is, If you want to find out more...try looking at real pegan sites....rather than what others have to say about them

I mean it would be silly of me to look up things on the christian faith, that was written by some non believer......

Here are a few if you like --> http://www.paganspath.com/index2.htm (the pegan path)

another --> http://www.iol.ie/~plugin/wiccans.htm

Everyone - please dont get at Texas...she didnt write those articals...if you really want to rant and rave about the articals posted, then email the authors...not jump at Texas...after all I took the time to research the articals and had a go at the author...not at texas herself no way

Its mad cause Christian Mass is very similer to Antient Pagan rituals, cool thread . The drinking of Jesus' blood was introduced to try and convert pagans in the olden times when blood sacrafice was considered to be of ritualistic and mystical value in communication with Gods.

Of course this is something that is practiced far less today and there are many people who are into Wicca and Pagan practices that simply appreciate and make use of the natural things which surround them, which doesnt include blood sacrifice (usually). Unlike of course Christian mass which is based on the ritual sacrafice of Jesus' blood, which many people drink (symbolically or actually in their view) every week...how sinister!? . It always makes me laugh

Christian Mass became like this as a means to convert people to Christianity in a time when sacrificial acts were the norm....yeah well, there we go.

edit: removed "Its said by some historians that..." from above sentence cause if i'm gona say that i should provide a source too, and i duno if i'm actually arsed enough LOL.

I am not advocating loss of the Freedom of Speech. But there are consequences for speech. One consequence of this thread is that it is NOT spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ....so what the hell is it even here for...for one reason and one reason only...to spread hate. Because if you aren't spreading love, then you are spreading hate. If you don't think this thread is spreading hate, then read again the reactions of SC and others. Don't try and tell me Texas Heather Girl loves Pagans. I don't believe it. But I DO believe that Jesus does. See this is the whole thing...if one is going to follow Jesus...a whole new standard of actions must take place...one can call themselves a Christian but if one isn't following the teachings of Christ then
one's actions show to the world what one really is...a hypocrite. As you know, Jesus wasn't really big on hypocrites either.

Texas didnt claim to hate them either, she did say however she wants to learn more about them, and will only post more on this topic, when shereads up on it more..so in all fairness to Heather, if you had of taken the time to READ her previous post joc, you would have noticed this

no, that wasn't what he was saying...he was simply explaining why people are getting so hot under the collar about bringing up negative history of some pagans, why you should understand their inevitable reaction, as its how anyone would react if it was their faith under a not -so- flattering spotlight.
free speech is free, but if it hurts someone's feelings, don't be up-in-arms cos they decide to take offence and retaliate

I can totally understand people getting upset about someone posting negative information about Pagan beliefs. But I can't understand people slamming Tex for HER religious beliefs yet wanting respect for theirs. Its absolutely low class to do that in my mind.

I didn't say she Hates Pagans...I said she doesn't Love them and that Jesus does...and neither you nor she can convince me that this thread was designed to LEARN about Pagans.

Look...I like Texas Heather Girl (I like you TexasHeatherGirl ). I'm sorry if I seem mean or 'defensive'. I just call 'em the way I see 'em. And the way I saw it...bashing...is the way I saw it...and the way I still see it.

A good way to learn about Paganism might be to start a thread entitled: Teach me about Paganism.

absolutely

And to top it all off, Texas took a lot of time to post her real thoughts on what was said...still some dont seem to bother their backsides to hear her out

Right like all the "teach me about Christianity" threads started on here. People have made the point that Pagans don't start Christian bashing threads or Atheists don't start Christian bashing threads.....

And you know what???? We don't know if they do, because whenever a Christian bashing thread is started NONE of the Christians make a peep about the religion of the person starting the thread.

You've never seen on this site a Christian writing stuff like "Oh you are just saying that because you can't face your heathen beliefs, you Pagan fool"

Its a non issue what a persons religious beliefs are on here when someone starts a thread about Christianity. But when a Christian starts a thread it is ALWAYS derailed into a "How dare you you stupid Christian" blast session.

Pathetic.

It was bashing from the author..yes..but not from Texas..NO..and she never claimed to like or dislike them herself...

I believe that she will look it up from real pegan sites...but gee she didnt deserve most of what was said....

At least when I threw in my views, I made it clear it was all aimed at the author of one of the sites posted..not at christianity or texas...im not blind..I can see she had no part in the sites posted

and if she didnt give a monkies toss who got offended and who didn't..she wouldn't have taken the time to try and explain herself ect

but where did the pagans slam tex's beliefs??
which is the subject of this thread, is it not? pagans, and then, inevitably, christians??
as far as i can see they've only complained that theirs(beliefs) are being discussed in a negative light, and defending themselves and their beliefs, aswell as explaining them...

So BM, If I wanted to learn more about, lets say Muslims, would it be alright for me to post articles about how the Ancient Muslims overran Spain & Turkey and other countries, offering the inhabitants a choice between "convert or die"?

As others have said: If you want to learn about someone, you ask them questions.

NOT bring up the past.

My annoyance is directed at Heather, not for her religious beliefs, but for the way in which she began this thread.
Perhaps it is a misconception on my part, But I think there could have been a better way to learn about pagans and paganism that by posting such inflammatory links.

But then, it is similiar to the christian who posted this thread:

"A Survey on Christianity"

Who then proceeded to preach the word and pretty much disregard the fact that others have different beliefs.

I am all for learning about others and their beliefs, and WHY they believe as they do. But, sadly, this forum has become nothing more than a battlefield between faiths. Acts have been committed by both sides. And in the end, there are no winners.

I agree that there could have been a much better way to learn more, is to look into real pagan sites and not ones posted from people who totally disagree with them

I think Texas now understands what has went wrong...and at least she made a long post to tell us all that.

She doesnt have to go and look anything up..but when she says she will, I believe she will...at the end of the day, it her choice

I did make a point in saying - If i wanted to learn all about christians, the BEST places to go, would be to actual christian websites...NOT websites that blast christians, cuz thats only going to cloud my judgement...it makes perfect sense to understand what I am saying



I dont know much about Muslis..but hey the best place to start is to look up the Holy Qur'an itself...or if you like - true muslim culture, written by muslims and not of the extremist kind

Is that how you interpret these comments? Because I see a lot of vicious personal attacks. Not "complaining" and "defending" in fact I don't see any defending at all. Just attack.


















Sorry but maybe you can explain why people felt such a hostile need to attack her like this for starting a thread not unlike ANY of these threads


http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=95778

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=95876

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=95956


http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=89846

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=94274

well, isn't gideon mage the only pagan you quoted there??
and yes, i interpret her quote as a defence, not an attack. she was defending her faith in a personal manner, because she felt personally attacked.
as for the rest you quoted...they are simply individuals whom are fed-up with the whole christianity debate, and their posts reflect that

I find it quite ironic that you are telling another poster in another thread that its childish to personally attack you for starting the thread you started and yet you are in here defending attacks against the poster of this thread as "oh woops they're just fed up?" Well why don't they ignore the thread then?

Attacking someone personally for saying something you disagree with is as you said in your other thread, childish.


ETA I don't know Gideon's religion. I don't know any of the other people's religion. I don't make it my business to know people's religion to bring it up against them.

DW aka Darkwind is though

Good point!

Just substitute Paganism or whathaveyou:

God Is Not Great - How Religion Poisons, Everything By: Christopher Hitchens
Paganism is Not Great-How Paganism Poisons
A List of Biblical Contradictions, Jim Meritt
A List of Pagan Contradictions


But if a 'Christian' does it...ewwwwwww very bad!!

I just wish everyone would be respectful of everyone else's faiths, opinions, etc. I don't like this thread because I don't like the links....

....but in all honesty I don't think Texas was expecting the uproar over it that she got. (just because I shoot from the hip doesn't mean I always shoot straight)

WELL SAID JOC

woah now, all i was trying to say is that the whole animosity in here is easily avoided if people could just communicate better

my point about gideon mage being the only pagan quoted was so to try and demonstrate that there was no need for anger between the christians and pagans in this thread because the pagans were only reacting as is to be expected to unkind pagan links, and texas obviously just didn't go about finding out more about pagan religion, in a very pagan-friendly way

thats just MHO

i would never defend personal attacks mon amie...

Sheri??

Just kidding lol

I don't think I attacked her personally other than questioning her motives. To me if she wants to learn more about pagans, don't go looking for the wing nuts and point to them and say see ya'll are baby killing, baby eating demon worshippers in one breath and say but I want to learn about you. It denotes a lack of sincerity. If you want to know ask, but don't ask things in an insulting manner and expect a nice response. No matter what your faith it doesn't work that way. Would you have asked a Muslim, hey I want to learn more about Islam but what about those burkha wearing, gun toting suicide bombers? It doesn't set up a friendly space for dialogue, what it does is say here are some stereotypes and don't get mad explain them because I think ya'll are just like them. Get it?

as in cherie??
mm..cher means "dear" so i'd reckon cherie would mean like, "dearie"...
...but i said amie, which just means "friend"...wait!! i got the tenses wrong..damn...its mon ami for masc. and ma amie for fem.!!!

oh, but i spose french is a little off-topic

nevermind!

I was curious about the origins of this religion and I found things that are startling. That is not me attacking anyone. I am sorry that what I am interested in is not favorable in your opinion but it is the focus of my curiosity right now and I am not going to apologize for that. When someone looks at, for example, the Crusades, do we question their motives? No, most people don't. It looks to me right now like a lot of things are tied together in some ways, and in some ways not. I am going to continue looking through things, and if I find something good, so be it. I never said yall eat babies, that is just something meant to make it look like I attacked you when I didn't. Demon and goddess worship is indeed a large part of paganism from what it seems. I am looking at the whole thing, little by little, and yes I am looking at all aspects of it before I will be ready to form my final opinion. And yes since extremism and suicide bombers are observable facts I would consider that a part of Islam that I have to look at in order to be considering the whole thing. Do I have to learn as much as possible in order to weigh what is valid and and what isn't? Do I have to ask questions in order to glean as much information from as many varied sources as possible? Well, yeah. And I don't think there is anything wrong with it, either.

I personally am just over the whole "you're attacking me/no I'm not" conversation so I'll just everyone else have at it. I found things that were personally interesting to me and I wanted to share it with those who would also be interested. I am so SICK of this non-stop argument over "do we have the right to say things that are not favorable or do we not?".... Why does every single thread end up like this? Thank you everyone for your interest and have a great evening.

I don't understand what is was you did that was so horribly shocking, to tell the truth!!! So, you brought something up in the Pagan history that wouldn't be viewed as all goodness.. and............

haven't we all been there..


You have nothing to be sorry about.

He he...you may need to look over some of the threads where Tex got her ass handed to her on threads started out with statements like "Why are all Christians evil and beat their kids and drink blood and hate everyone?"

I think it started out a little over the top, but in reality few if any of the Christians around here think other belief systems are evil.

I like how you put it though, the Muslim comments are typical too.

Wait-I'm a pagan because I defend pagans? Nope, not a pagan, although I deeply respect them. As an occultist, I have participated in a pagan rite or two. I don't have a "religion", unless you want to consider me a "New-Ager". I feel that all Gods are just manifestations of the one. he true Eternal Spirit is beyond all of our imaginings. No religion is right or wrong; they are just representations our cravings to perceive the truth. I have made my comments because it sickens me to read articles denigrating other reasons for no reason. There are no pagans going around sacricing aborted babies to Artemis, just like Jews never slaughtered Christian babies to make matzoh. Prejudice is prejudice, slander is slander.

Bingo.

The same pagans that killed Christians because they were Christians from the first to fourth century?

just as christians killed. still kill.

evidenced by the Serbian Genetic Cleansing and the Rwandan Genocide, among others.

Ah, just pointing out that pagans haven't been so innocent either. Lets not drive this in another direction. That direction has been quite over-driven on UM. To be honest though, it doesn't matter what people believe. There are good people and bad people. The religion doesn't make people bad.

Have to agree with you on that BF, unfortunately too many bad people use religion for their own means and too many of the weak-willed go along with them, thinking that they are actually following "God's will". For the very reason, religion can be deemed dangerous for puppies and small children...

Puppies? They worship tails, laps, and warm patches of sunshine on hardwood floors. No...I think puppies are OK...as long as their "Great reward" is an ear scratch, belly-rub, and a bowl full of grub, humanity is safe, even if they go fundamentalist.

woops...
sorry

my only point was to say that pagans would obviously not be happy about those particualr links as they try to lump all pagans as baby-eating, pro-abortionists

i don't think anyone has a problem with texas being curious about paganism i think the arguments just arose over the her intentions in posting those links...but i think she's pretty much cleared that up too

on a sidenote, when you say worshipping demons...what kind of demons are we talking about, and what sect of pagans??
just curious

Your quotes contradict themselves. That's what is wrong with UM. It is expected that Christians will be the focus, and ridiculous comments like this are expected and are not even shocking because everyone expects them.

Hm.. there's nothing intolerant about indicating that people who have a different belief than you are going to turn into Molochs, is there? And yes I did read that book so I know exactly how insulting that term is (Of course it doesn't say anything good for evolution if people can devolve into Molochs because they follow a certain faith. They have their facts wrong but I am sure we all have facts wrong about something... I dont' know all the facts about quantum physics and I'm willing to be that you don't either, does that mean we'll both turn into Molochs? lol). The comments against Christians are not backlashes. They are just hate. When someone comes into a thread and just starts mocking and calling names like a little kid, it is just hate. We use the word "backlash" to justify it. It's like when two kids are arguing. They both are being selfish, cruel, and hateful, but they always say, "Well SHE started it." Which of course does not dismiss the actions of either. There may have been a difference initially that could have been worked out, but when it devolved to two people just being ugly and sneering, the fact that there was an initial difference does not excuse the sneering going on. So if you backlash against me personally because of something in my faith that you dont' like, how is that not just hate? I wasn't in the Crusades. But it's hateful when I look at something unfavorable in something's history, isnt' it?

I think it's hysterically funny that we devote threads to the intolerance of Christians and then run around saying things like this. And there are thousands of examples on UM. Christians are called immoral and evil (BTW we are called that for following a God that the person being hateful has determined is evil BASED ON THE EARLY HISTORY OF CHRISTIANITY, but it is somehow horribly wrong of me to begin looking at something by looking at it's roots and express shock or disapproval in any way.... but hey just keep calling God evil it's all good.... nothing hypocritical about that), backward, intolerant, all kinds of judgemental labels are sneered at us (So I wonder is it OK to be judgemental or not? Everyone says it's not but I wonder... hmm... I thought being judgemental was the biggest thing you can do wrong in these enlightened modern times, I guess I was wrong, it's OK to be judgemental if you don't like something, but it's not OK for others to be what YOU think is judgemental when there's something they don't like or agree with.... it apparently doesn't work both ways).

We have to decide which way it's going to be. Either it's wrong to call attention to things that disturb us, or it's not. It't not wrong for Christians and OK for Nons. The double standard is what everyone is sick of. Either it's OK to criticize and ask questions or it's not. It's either OK to

It has to work both ways. If it's OK to look at the roots of something and criticize, and call something evil because of it's roots, it's going to be OK for everyone. Or it's going to be OK for no one.

I am no longer going to fight what this thread is turning into. Everything in this section is just a ruse for calling Christians names. We should just have one giant mega-thread entitled, "Christians are stupid/No they're not/Yes they are/No they're not" It would save everyone a lot of clicking.

As my friend Shadow Hill just said in another thread, (I am going to interchange a couple of the words she used with "pagan" but the meaning is the same and should apply all around, and not just to criticizing Christianity):
Debating the contradictions in *paganism* is not intolerance, assessing the likelihood that a *pagan practice/deity* even exists is not intolerance, not wanting the religious beliefs of others rammed down your throat is not intolerance. Being unwilling to forget the horrors which have taken place throughout history in the name of *paganism* is not intolerance. Pointing out *pagan* hypocracy is not intolerance.

Shadow's quote is from another thread, but since context doesn't matter (that's what I always hear anyway) I think it's valid here. The truth is universal, I think, and applies to all subjects of religious exploration.

Yes, I am interested in finding out about paganism. In the course of that, I am going to come across things that I do not consider favorable or moral. And I am going to point it out or ask about it. I am also going to come across things that I may like, it won't change my beliefs personally but if I like something I'll say so. If the whole thing disagrees with me, I'm going to say so. And whomever doesn't apply the same standard to my exploration, as they do to their own, is a hypocrite. Those who begin behaving hatefully are poor representations of their own faith or belief. There are those who can engage in peaceful conversation about controversial or unpleasant subjects, and sadly there are those who just can't. And they kind of ruin it for everyone else.



Sure as the sky is blue someone is going to come on and say "WHAT!!! HOW DARE YOU CALL ATTENTION TO ANYTHING NON-CHRISTIANS DO OR SAY.... LOOK AT THE HISTORY OF YOUR OWN GOD..." while completely glossing over everything I just said of course.

That's OK everyone just go ahead and tell me how judgemental I am for commenting on the hypocricy here. And then turn around five minutes later and point out something that you think is hypocritical..

Seems that your religion embraces the concept of Original Sin, that the son suffers for the sins of the father seemingly forever...consequently it shouldn't be onerous for you to answer for the sins of your Christian ancestors, it should be the norm. Incidentially, we have given many examples of the evil perpetrated by modern Christians, ranging from the Bosnia Ethnic Cleansing to Rwanda to the persecution of an Atheist family in Oklahoma.

My quotes do not contradict themselves at all. I didn't say Christians in my post about the Creationists museum if you noticed. I'd feel the same way if any belief system spent 27 million dollars attempting to rewrite history. I don't subscribe to Creationism, and never said I did. The intolerance you seem to think I was putting forth must be and can only be if you yourself are a Creationist.

Funny thing though as a sidebar note here, Creationists only believe in the biblical creation story, and it isn't the only creation story out there. For nearly every culture out there, there is a differing creation story. However when it comes to debating something against evolution Christians never bring in those other creation stories as something just as valid. However to the cultures who believe them they are just as valid. The only difference is you don't see for example a bunch of Yamamato Indians from the Amazon protesting at a school board to push that their creation story be taught alongside evolution. The only ones who do that are Creationists.

Texas you might want to check my other posts about the difference between pushy vocal Fundamentalists and those who aren't. Like I said in that post (should you look it up as you have my other post) if you aren't of that ilk than take it that I"m not talking about you. Seeing as you got angry about my post about the Creationist then if you subscribe to those views I stand up and back what I said. I don't believe in Creationism, but some do and if that were the end of it fine. I will always respect a persons beliefs, but only up and until it violates my freedom or the freedom of others. If it stayed in the museum I could not care less but it doesn't, you know and I know that the objective of this is to get this information in the nations schools and I again will never think that is ok. You might but I am entitled to my opinion.

As far as saying what I said, I'm frustrated that one belief system is trying to force it's beliefs (and they are beliefs not fact) into public schools, where kids of many faiths (or none) go to school. This thing cost 27 million dollars to put forth a relgious idea but it goes beyond that. It goes to the heart of where we are going. There are many many people Christians included who do not subscribe to the Creationists idea of things. This museum in and of itself is something I don't agree with but if people choose to believe it they have that right. However the same folks that built it and funded it want the information taught alongside evolution, and not that is something I will never think is ok. And to connect this with paganism which is the topic of the thread, Pagans aren't at school boards pushing for the school to teach Goddess principles along side science either. You want to talk tolerance but Creationists trying to force their views into public schools is the hieght of intolerance. It disrespects the rights of kids getting a public education not to be endoctrinated into a religion.

so how many christians did witches kill ?

I think the answer is zero.

That we know of...witches are sneaky and know magic and stuff....
Every one knows that....duh Lt.

careful eggy, I might have to turn you into a newt.........

Ummm quite a few died before the christians got the upper hand number wise but all of that is neither here nor there. (ahh those were boring fights i mean a christian vs a lion is not that impressive of a show) . It is not like there are any running around doing it right now en masse at least not as far as I have heard.

? They weren't witches. They were Christian midwives accused of being witches. This kind of paranoia abuse is not rare in American history. It happened with McCarthyism. It happened to the Germans, Italians, and Japanese in America during WWII. It happened to the Arab people after 9/11. There are just some people that use paranoia to their political or social benefit by accusing anyone who appears suspicious. Its not an uncommon thing.

I KNEW it!
Can I be a toad? I think it was that kids book "Frog and Toad" but I've always thought toads were cool.

Yeah, anyway...I always got the impression from my limited studies and experience that "witches" were not really witches, and got lumped in with pagans and naturists, and anything that was not Christian. I think it still happens. So it's hardly fair to ask how many witches killed Christians. You may as well say how many non-Christians killed Christians.

Click to view attachment

It all depends on what your definition of "is" is. It would seem that during the time period in question that witches were anyone who did not follow standard Christian protocol.
Plus I am thinking that there had to have been at least a few actual pagans caught up in the whole witch hunt thing.

in France for example the christians were accusing of witchcraft and burning at the stake.

and not all those people hung in Salem were midwives. most weren't. all of them ( save possibly Tituba) was christian , it was a small community !

http://www.religioustolerance.org/wic_burn1.htm


Traditional [tolerant] attitudes towards witchcraft began to change in the 14th century, at the very end of the Middle Ages. ... Early 14th century central Europe was seized by a series of rumor-panics. Some malign conspiracy (Jews and lepers, Moslems, or Jews and witches) was attempting to destroy the Christian kingdoms through magick and poison. After the terrible devastation caused by the Black Death [bubonic plague] (1347-1349), these rumors increased in intensity and focused primarily on witches and "plague-spreaders." Witchcraft cases increased slowly but steadily from the 14th-15th century. The first mass trials appeared in the 15th century. At the beginning of the 16th century, as the first shock-waves from the Reformation hit, the number of witch trials actually dropped. Then, around 1550, the persecution skyrocketed. What we think of as "the Burning Times" -- the crazes, panics, and mass hysteria -- largely occurred in one century, from 1550-1650. In the 17th century, the Great Hunt passed nearly as suddenly as it had arisen. Trials dropped sharply after 1650 and disappeared completely by the end of the 18th century. (Gibbons, "Recent Developments in the Study of the Great European Witch Hunt".)

not all murdered as witches were women -

Robin Briggs calculates that 20 to 25 percent of Europeans executed for witchcraft between the 14th and 17th centuries were male. Regional variations are again notable. France was "a fascinating exception to the wider pattern, for over much of the country witchcraft seems to have had no obvious link with gender at all. Of nearly 1,300 witches whose cases went to the parlement of Paris on appeal, just over half were men. ... The great majority of the men accused were poor peasants and artisans, a fairly representative sample of the ordinary population." Briggs adds:


There are some extreme cases in peripheral regions of Europe, with men accounting for 90 percent of the accused in Iceland, 60 percent in Estonia and nearly 50 per cent in Finland. On the other hand, there are regions where 90 per cent or more of known witches were women; these include Hungary, Denmark and England. The fact that many recent writers on the subject have relied on English and north American evidence has probably encouraged an error of perspective here, with the overwhelming predominance of female suspects in these areas (also characterized by low rates of persecution) being assumed to be typical. Nor is it the case that the courts treated male suspects more favourably; the conviction rates are usually much the same for both sexes. (Briggs, Witches & Neighbours: The Social and Cultural Context of European Witchcraft, pp. 260-61.)

Witch-hunts today

Few people are aware that witch-hunts still claim thousands of lives every year, especially in the countries of sub-Saharan Africa, and above all in South Africa.

Witch-hunts in South Africa have become "a national scourge," according to Phumele Ntombele-Nzimande of the country's Commission on Gender Equality. (Quoted in Gilbert Lewthwaite, "South Africans go on witch hunts," Baltimore Sun, September 27, 1998.) The phenomenon is centered in the country's poverty-stricken Northern Province, where "legislators counted 204 witchcraft-related killings [from 1985-95] ... Police counted 312 for the same period. Everybody agreed both numbers were gross underestimates." (Neely Tucker, "Season of the Witch Haunts Africa," The Toronto Star, August 1, 1999.) In 1996 The Observer (UK) reported that "the precise statistics are not known, but the deaths from witch-burning episodes number in the hundreds each year and the trend appears to be on the rise." (David Beresford, "Ancient superstitions, fear of witches cast spell on new nation," reprinted in The Ottawa Citizen, June 18, 1996.)

http://womenshistory.about.com/gi/dynamic/...witchhunts.html

I've just thought of something......ref to one of the links heather posted in the OP

The author claimed pagan / wicca is NOT older than christianity...........that don't add up to me, reason being, is because IN the bible, it is said that they burned what they believed to be WITCHES...now if wicca (linked to witches & witchcraft)...were not as old, then who the heck were these people being burned alive in the bible??