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crystal sage

Evidence of civilization on Venus

32 posts in this topic

.. B)

... Just came across this article...

VENUS DECLASSIFIED

UFOlogia Top Secret File

TOP SECRET FILE

FORM INFRA D.I.P. PROJECT MARXEN UF088

DEPARTMENT OF INTERPLANETARY AFFAIRS OFFICIAL DOCUMENT/TRANS ENVATE/PROJECT MARXEN data inclusive DE-CLASSIFIED JANUARY 1, 1989 1NEREN CLEARANCE BY S . E.

MAR

SUBJECT: U.F.O. AND REPORTED EXTRATERRESTRIAL ENCOUNTERS ON MAUI, HAWAII. JANUARY 1970 TO DECEMBER 1989 CLASSIFICATION: Formerly TOP SECRET U.F.O., E B.E., AND E.T. CELL] DATA AND OFFICIAL COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN THIS AGENCY AND OFFICIALS FORMERLY OR ACTIVELY REPRESENTING THE UNITED NATIONS, MILITARY INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES, AND THE N.A.S.A. SPACE PROGRAM, AS WELL AS CIVILIAN SCIENTIFIC U.F.O. INVESTIGATIVE COMMITTEES AND NETWORKS AND THE FILES OF M.I.N.D. INTERNATIONAL.

COMPILED BY S.E. MAR, DIRECTOR OF THE DEPARTMENT OF INTERPLANETARY AFFAIRS JANUARY THROUGH MAY 1972 AND IN 1990.

EVIDENCE OF CIVILIZATION ON VENUS

It is scientifically possible for material plane beings to live in an atmosphere on another planet, that is too hot or chemically fatal to Earth humans, by constructing underground air-conditioned bases or cities protected from the elements on the surface. It is also feasible to create air---conditioned domes on the surface of other planets that have artificial atmospheres exactly like on Earth, and American scientists admit they already have the technology and plans to create these bases on Mars and our Moon. Therefore extraterrestrials with the superior technology to create disc--shaped U.F.O.s, that are detailed in dozens of photos and documents in the U.S. Air Force released Project Bluebook files, could logically possess the advanced science to create such bases on the surface of the planet Venus.

The physicists William Plummer and John Strong stated that Venus may have large areas of bearable temperatures. The regions near the Venusian north and south poles would be much cooler than the areas reportedly monitored by space probes. Furthermore, according to Professor Alexander Lebedinsky, in the Soviet Union, in data suppressed by the United States Pentagon complex, the usual surface temperature of much of Venus must be about 110 degrees Fahrenheit, even though "radio---electric" measurements indicated 700 or more degrees. Similar observations can be made on the relatively COOL surfaces of gas tubes used in neon signs, because the radio--electric equivalent of those tubes is also several thousand degrees!

Why did a number of American orbiting spacecraft transmit data that Earth itself is too hot for human life with a deadly atmosphere, insufficient oxygen, and hostile elements, and then they expect us to believe their Venus probe data is accurate? Temperatures up to 180OF. have been recorded in Earth's ionosphere 180 miles up. Could it be that the NASA official temperature readings on Venus originated in the Venusian ionosphere.

The temperatures given to the public from the American and the Soviet Venus probes contradicted each other by hundreds of degrees, and the temperatures given off by different American Venus rockets also were in conflict, proving all this data is very unreliable. If a probe orbiting Earth sent back a temperature reading of Alaska that was as conflicting as the Venus data, we could be told it was 200 degrees there in the ice!

We were told that the atmosphere of Venus is over 100 times denser than Earth, so how would it be possible for a parachute to be used to slow the landing of the Venus craft, when in pressures that great the space rocket would FLOAT slowly to the surface without the need of a parachute like boats sink in an ocean? That pressure is like trying to parachute the spacecraft 2,000 feet to the bottom of the ocean! Why also did NASA contradict these releases by claiming that a parachute would not work on the moon Titan, because the atmosphere there(similar to Venus) is too dense(just like Venus). That data was in a press release December 12, 1980 with space expert James Murphy.

When the Soviets landed their spacecraft Venera on the surface of Venus, it sent excellent photographs showing a bright landscape of hills and rocks, much like our deserts on Earth yet an atmosphere that dense was expected to produce photos of total darkness. How can Venus be mapped by radar in such a dense atmosphere, the equivalent of using radar to map the bottom of our oceans at a depth that is impossible?

PROJECT MAGNET took Tesla seriously. This report details a formerly secret experimental UFO landing site built by the Canadian government during their attempts to contact UFOs their air force had monitored in the skies. Former Canadian Defense Minister, Paul Hellyear, later publicly admitted that project existed. However, he did not mention what Smith reported. the project had actually detected a real UFO with their scientific equipment, and later a scientific research group he directed established communications with a landed interplanetary ship from what their pilots said was Venus. Tesla's closest scientific assistant at one time, Arthur Matthews, was involved in this contact. The Project Magnet report added that Matthews had been trying to complete some of Tesla's incomplete inventions, when the Venusians helped him with instructions on finishing that work. The report also details several inventions the Venusians gave to Project Magnet through Dr. Matthews' committee, which were tested and worked perfectly. The Venusians were also seriously concerned about our environmental damage and danger from nuclear testing and fossil fuels, warned the government to try to stop these practices, and offered alternative non-polluting nearly-free energy systems that government leaders, kept in power by multi-billion dollar oil, gas, coal, and war industries all rejected for "Economic reasons."

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Posted (edited)

This sooo sounds like a Sci Fi novel...

.. as Mark Twain said....... ;) "Truth is stranger than fiction"

but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't.

http://www.burlingtonnews.net/venusians.html

Before we detail life on Venus in a later section of this research, would like to point out that this information is not from some wild-eyed spacey true-believer cultist, some fanatic looking for space brothers to rescue him, or some drugged or boozed derelict. This information is the writings of one of the greatest scientists of the 20th century, Wilburt B. Smith, who was director of Project Magnet, the Canadian government scientific UFO investigations committee. This prominent scientist was extremely respected, credited for numerous technological inventions, had an excellent public reputation, and held prestigious degrees, awards, and patents. Smith was arguably the greatest Canadian scientist of his times, and Tesla and Einstein were arguably the two greatest scientists of their time, based on the patented evidence.

We would also like to emphasize that the details of Venus and it's people in this report in no way contradict details we obtained from totally different sources.

Edited by crystal sage

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Posted (edited)

... ;)

some random Venusian photos...

http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA00242

linked-image

linked-image

linked-image

Original Caption Released with Image:

This Magellan radar image shows a region approximately 300 kilometers (180 miles) across, centered on 59 degrees south latitude, 164 degrees east longitude and located in a vast plain to the south of Aphrodite Terra. The data for this image was obtained in January 1991. The large circular structure near the center of the image is a corona, approximately 200 kilometers (120 miles) in diameter and provisionally named Aine Corona. Just north of Aine Corona is one of the flat-topped volcanic constructs known as 'pancake' domes for their shape and flap-jack appearance. This pancake dome is about 35 kilometers (21 miles) in diameter and is thought to have formed by the eruption of an extremely viscous lava. Another pancake dome is located inside the western parts of the annulus of the corona fractures. Complex fracture patterns like the one in the upper right of the image are often observed in association with coronae and various volcanic features. They are thought to form because magma beneath the surface follows pre-existing fracture patterns. When eruptions or other movements of the magma occur, the magma drains from the fractures and the overlying surface rock collapses. Other volcanic features associated with Aine Corona include a set of small domes, each less than 10 kilometers (6 miles) across, located along the southern portion of the annulus of fractures, and a smooth, flat region in the center of the corona, probably a relatively young lava flow. The range of volcanic features associated with coronae suggests that volcanism plays a significant role in their formation.

linked-image

In the area seen here, approximately 200 small volcanoes, ranging in diameter from 2 to 12 kilometers (1.2 to 7.4 miles) can be identified. These volcanoes were first identified as small hills in Venera 15/16 images and were predicted to be shield-type volcanoes constructed mainly from eruptions of fluid lava flows similar to those that produce the Hawaiian Islands and sea floor volcanoes - a prediction that was confirmed by Magellan. These small shield-type volcanoes are the most abundant geologic feature on the surface of Venus, believed to number in the hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, and are important evidence in understanding the geologic evolution of the planet. The only other planet in our Solar System with this large number of volcanoes is Earth.

http://www.uwa.edu.au/media/statements/med...ember/volcanoes

B) They discovered that the rise of atmospheric oxygen levels, which allowed life to flourish but had long been simply attributed to ancient bacteria, was also due to terrestrial volcanic activity.

The prestigious international journal Nature has published the research paper, “Increased subaerial volcanism and the rise of atmospheric oxygen 2.5 billion years ago”.

The paper is co-authored by Professor Lee Kump, from the NASA Astrobiology Institute and Department of Geosciences at Pennsylvania State University and Professor Mark Barley, from the School of Earth and Geographical Sciences at UWA.

The paper analyses the period covering Earth’s transition from a hostile environment, where poisonous gases absorbed all the oxygen produced by the first photosynthetic organisms, to one in which oxygen levels in the atmosphere and oceans could increase and allow complex life to develop.

Edited by crystal sage

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Posted (edited)

B) This is certainly worth looking into further!!!!!

http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/toxico2.htm

The air we breathe contains about 21 percent oxygen. But cells in our body are used to much less than that usually in the range of 10 to 0.5 percent.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html...755C0A961958260

Dangers of Oxygen Bars

To the Editor:

Re ''Just When You Thought the Air Was Free'' (Styles section, June 22), on the fad of oxygen bars:

Oxygen as an elixir is a nutty idea and can be harmful to your health. While essential for human life, oxygen also produces cellular abnormalities and other problems.

The purpose of foods and supplements that contain antioxidants is to counter and reduce the undesirable effects of oxygen on our cells.

The ideal human situation would be to survive at the lowest oxygen level.

This may account for the anecdotal (but perhaps true) legends of the longevity of people living in high mountainous regions, where they have acclimated to the lower levels of oxygen.

STEPHEN Z. WOLNER

New York, June 22, 1997

The writer is a dentist.

:unsure: You often read that when one exercises ... we breath more oxygen.. the body also produces more free radicals...

http://www.rice.edu/~jenky/sports/antiox.html

It's the radicals, man

Free radicals are atoms or groups of atoms with an odd (unpaired) number of electrons and can be formed when oxygen interacts with certain molecules. Once formed these highly reactive radicals can start a chain reaction, like dominoes. Their chief danger comes from the damage they can do when they react with important cellular components such as DNA, or the cell membrane. Cells may function poorly or die if this occurs. To prevent free radical damage the body has a defense system of antioxidants.

Edited by crystal sage

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another cool Venusian picture.... :)

http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA00314

linked-image

http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA00314

Original Caption Released with Image:

This perspective view of Venus, generated by computer from Magellan data and color-coded with emissivity, shows part of the lowland plains in Sedna Planitia. Circular depressions with associated fracture patterns, called "coronae", are apparently unique to the lowlands of Venus, and tend to occur in linear clusters along the planet's major tectonic belts, as seen in this image.

:huh: Lights????

linked-image

http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/targetFam...SC&start=20

Original Caption Released with Image:

This comet-like tail, trending northeast from the volcanic structure, is a relatively radar-bright deposit. The volcano, with a base diameter of 5 kilometers (about 3 miles) is a local topographic high point that has slowed down northeast trending winds enough to cause deposition of this material. The streak is 35 kilometers (about 22 miles) long and 10 kilometers (about 6 miles) wide. The volcano is located at the western end of Parga Chasma at 9.4 degrees south latitude and 247.5 degrees east longitude.

:tu: I'd like a more detailed shot of this one!!!!

linked-image

Edited by crystal sage

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Just because cells are used to 10% oxygen doesn't mean that air of that mixture would be very safe to breathe. If there was less oxygen, there would be more of other substances, greatly interfering with breathing.

Sounds like a lot of paranormal arguments to me... "science COULD be wrong there, because it was wrong here".

But if you think logically, the sun radiates heat intensely and, like a gradient, the heat is less intense the further you get from the sun. Atmosphere makes a huge difference, but Venus is infathomably closer to the Sun than we are and it is safe to assume that the planet's surface is much hotter, just as Mars' is much colder.

In order to build such complex underground bases (air conditioning uses up a lot of power... and "alien technologies" is not a feasable alternative at this point in time) you would first have to survive the surface. Although science COULD be wrong, it could also be right, and keep in mind that things that have landed on Venus's surface in the past haven't lasted long at all because of the corrosive nature of the atmosphere.

"the project had actually detected a real UFO with their scientific equipment, and later a scientific research group he directed established communications with a landed interplanetary ship from what their pilots said was Venus. Tesla's closest scientific assistant at one time, Arthur Matthews, was involved in this contact. The Project Magnet report added that Matthews had been trying to complete some of Tesla's incomplete inventions, when the Venusians helped him with instructions on finishing that work. The report also details several inventions the Venusians gave to Project Magnet through Dr. Matthews' committee, which were tested and worked perfectly. The Venusians were also seriously concerned about our environmental damage and danger from nuclear testing and fossil fuels, warned the government to try to stop these practices, and offered alternative non-polluting nearly-free energy systems that government leaders, kept in power by multi-billion dollar oil, gas, coal, and war industries all rejected for "Economic reasons.""

Wait, what's your source for this, exactly? The whole argument about a more hospitable Venus sounds infinitely more insane when you add things like this in. =/

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I'd love nothing more than, for there to be life on other planets, but Its time we stopped assuming that every satellite image we receive from another planet that has abnormality, means there was a civilization on that planet. There are so many alternative theories that are just as credible as the former...

And when a claim is made with such magnificence as this, then one should truly have inconclusive proof... but anyhow, I personally believe they may have been life on other planets, other huge particles of matter that may necessarily have been a planet nonetheless a home... they may have existed well before the dinosaurs, not mentioned on in any scriptures because they were created separately with a difference purpose perhaps? Who really knows, not I...

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But if you think logically, the sun radiates heat intensely and, like a gradient, the heat is less intense the further you get from the sun. Atmosphere makes a huge difference, but Venus is infathomably closer to the Sun than we are and it is safe to assume that the planet's surface is much hotter, just as Mars' is much colder.

In order to build such complex underground bases (air conditioning uses up a lot of power... and "alien technologies" is not a feasable alternative at this point in time) you would first have to survive the surface. Although science COULD be wrong, it could also be right, and keep in mind that things that have landed on Venus's surface in the past haven't lasted long at all because of the corrosive nature of the atmosphere.

Wait, what's your source for this, exactly? The whole argument about a more hospitable Venus sounds infinitely more insane when you add things like this in. =/

With all the volcanic activity there ... they'd have a huge system of Lava tubes... Scientist already are planning to make use of them for their planned settlement of Mars and the Moon ....

http://www.argoverse.com/LAVATUBE.html

http://www.asi.org/adb/06/09/03/02/100/12-questions.html

How might typical lunar lava tubes differ from typical tubes found on Earth? (1) The formative episodes of lava sheet flooding on the Moon are all very ancient events on the order of 3.5-3.8 Billion years ago. Surviving lavatubes on Earth are all much much younger than that, some only thousands of years old. (2) In addition to being very ancient, lunar lava tubes differ in scale. Probably because of the lower gravity in which they formed (1/6th Earth's) tube-relic rille valleys already observed, photographed and visited run an order of magnitude (ten times) typical terrestrial dimensions in width, ceiling height, and total length. Lunar tubes are BIG. (3) lunar lava tubes have never been exposed to air or water (unless a comet happen to pierce the ceiling and vaporize inside with some of the volatiles freezing out on the tube's still intact inner surfaces - a real "lucky strike"!). Like tubes and caves on Earth, the temperature will be steady, but colder (Earth in general is 50xF warmer than the Moon because of the oceanic-atmospheric heat sink.)

How intact and stable would lunar lava tubes be? How prone to future collapse, total or partial? Any lava tubes that have survived to this day wholly or partially intact are likely to continue to do so for the rest of time. The vast bulk of major asteroidal bombardment which has pocked the Moon took place in the first billion years of the Moon's history. Lunar lava tubes, not subject to any sort of active geological forces or to any kind or weathering are perhaps the safest, most stable, protected volumes to be found anywhere in the solar system. They are veritable vaults, sanctums, sanctuaries we can bank on - no bet-hedging needed.

http://www.newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph...101c8a6fad6a71c

I've always been in favor of doming over a small canyon. That way all the hard digging is already done and all you have to do is add a durable roof.

Even better would be to use a large lava tube ala KSR (I think). All you have to do that way is add an air lock in the opening and your done.

Dr. Zubrin came up with a similar plan involving inflatable spheres.

The idea was to dig a hemispherical hole, place the inflatable sphere in it, inflate the sphere, and put the regolith back inside the lower half of the sphere via the airlock. Since the atmosphere-retaining material is in the shape of a sphere, there's no problem with internal pressure lifting the resultant dome off the surface.

Josh and I discussed this at some length and modified the idea slightly. We suggested placing the sphere in the hemispherical hole in the ground (an impact crater of suitable dimensions would save a lot of excavating) but, instead of putting all the dirt back inside, construct a few floors using aluminium beams and sheeting and use some of the dirt to make a, say, 2 metre regolith shield on top of the uppermost ceiling.

Looking at your excavation above - 40m by 8m by 8m - you're moving 2560 cu.m of regolith.

Even if we can't find a suitable crater in the area, meaning we have to dig out a whole hemisphere of dirt, a similar effort means we can situate a sphere of about 21m in diameter. (a total excavation of 2425 cu.m)

Assuming we wish to occupy the lower half of the sphere, we have a hemisphere with a radius of 10.5m in which to build floors ... minus the 2m of soil to be placed on top of the uppermost ceiling.

Thus we have a height of 8.5m available for floors. I would suggest 3 floors in this case, each of about 2.65m vertical dimension - about 8'8" in the old money! Obviously, the lowest floor would have the least useable space because of the walls of the sphere and might become the storage area.

In the middle, there could be a cylindrical open space for an elevator and/or ladder, and to provide a degree of natural daylight down into the living areas. A translucent water tank above the open space might stop radiation but allow visible light through.

The advantage with this idea is that you also have a clear dome above ground covering nearly 350 sq.m of regolith, in which you can have a livable atmosphere. The 2m of soil deposited on top of the living levels can also be fertilised and used to grow crops. Wearing only a Demron suit and hat, the colonists could tend to their crops 'out in the open', so to speak - a big psychological plus.

Waddya think?

??? Smile

Edited by crystal sage

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That techology sounds incredibly far off. =/ And it doesn't solve the problem of corrosion of instruments upon landing before the protective sphere is built and filled with good air, or the effects of said corrosion on the roofs or doorways that would separate living spaces from the true surface.

"So far, the only evidence that exists for extraterrestrial lava tubes comes from visual images taken from orbit, a very general tool for planetary exploration. In the case of the Moon, some methods of exploration more specifically tailored for sensing lava tubes have been proposed. Some of these may be extended to the exploration of Mars as well."

These visuals were also of collapsed lava tubes, I looked it up... doesn't seem like scientists are "planning" anything, simply theorizing.

The moon also has no atmosphere and is essentially a vacuum, so it's another alternative that doesn't seem plausible for anything more than bases. Mars remains the best candidate, especially with terraforming technologies the way they are now. Many universities are experimenting on plants and bacteria, growing them in Mars-like conditions and monitoring their success. I'd imagine it won't be long before they'll want to put them on Mars itself, and the only thing stopping them will be the "It's immoral" advocates.

Also, I wanted a source for the original article. ;P

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Actually, I think CS raised an interesting question -- how do we know about the surface of Venus? I'm not asking this in the "I think there's Venusians down there" type thing, but more as "How'd they do that?", I'm-not-a-child-of-the-Space-Age thing.

BTW, Crystal, I think it'd be much more likely that a Venusian life-form would evolve in some funky, we-can't-imagine-it-form-it's-so-different than something terran-normal would evolve, only to bunker down under the surface.

--Jaylemurph

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the source of the article...

http://www.burlingtonnews.net/venusians.html

B)

it's also mentioned here...

http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Hollow/4354/venus.htm

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http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/facts.../venusfact.html

Venus/Earth Comparison

Surface gravity of Venus (eq.) (m/s2) 8.87 Earth 9.80

Edited by crystal sage

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http://ftrsupplemental.blogspot.com/2005_11_24_archive.html

Former Canadian Minister Of Defence Asks Canadian Parliament To Hold Hearings On Relations With Alien "Et" Civilizations

PRWEB

OTTAWA, CANADA November 24, 2005 -- A former Canadian Minister of Defence and Deputy Prime Minister under Pierre Trudeau has joined forces with three Non-governmental organizations to ask the Parliament of Canada to hold public hearings on Exopolitics -- relations with “ETs.”

By “ETs,” Mr. Hellyer and these organizations mean ethical, advanced extraterrestrial civilizations that may now be visiting Earth.

linked-image

http://www.exopoliticsjournal.com/vol-1/1-4-Salla.htm

Edited by crystal sage

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Ah, I hate to nitpick, but geocities is not a valid source to me. It's kind of like MySpace, but not exclusively a profile site. The article was written by "Guillermo Alarcon"? It's not entirely clear. Some of the articles are accounts of sightings of supposed Venusian beings, but that doesn't say much... and where is the first part of the article from?

"COMPILED BY S.E. MAR, DIRECTOR OF THE DEPARTMENT OF INTERPLANETARY AFFAIRS JANUARY THROUGH MAY 1972 AND IN 1990."

The who of the what from the wherenow?

I think you need to seriously question the authenticity of this. ;P

Salla is a bit more grounded, but at the same time... "Salla pointed to evidence widely available on the internet as a source for his research on extraterrestrial visitation: "There's a lot of stuff on the Internet, and I just went around and pieced it together.""

This is not to say that these accounts are true, just that he kind of amalgamates them. That these beings are supposedly beautiful and Aryan in appearance makes it even harder to believe.

And your comparison source for Earth and Venus states the facts you're trying to disprove. =P Couldn't they be wrong about that too?

And finally:

"Average temperature: 737 K (464 C)

Diurnal temperature range: ~0

Wind speeds: 0.3 to 1.0 m/s (surface)

Mean molecular weight: 43.45 g/mole

Atmospheric composition (near surface, by volume):

Major: 96.5% Carbon Dioxide (CO2), 3.5% Nitrogen (N2)

Minor (ppm): Sulfur Dioxide (SO2) - 150; Argon (Ar) - 70; Water (H2O) - 20;

Carbon Monoxide (CO) - 17; Helium (He) - 12; Neon (Ne) - 7"

Edited by WraithGod

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Solar irradiance (W/m2) Venus 2613.9 earth 1367.6 Ratio.. ??( ^_^ who did the Math?? ) 1.911

so should the temperatures vary as much???

they do say that Venus has a much ...much thicker atmosphere... so the radiation levels shouldn't be as high...??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere_of_Venus

Despite the harsh conditions on the surface, at about a 50 km to 65 km level above the surface of the planet the atmospheric pressure and temperature is nearly the same as that of the Earth, making its upper atmosphere the most Earth-like area in the Solar System, even more so than the surface of Mars. Due to the similarity in pressure, temperature and the fact that breathable air (21% oxygen, 78% nitrogen) is a lifting gas on Venus in the same way that helium is a lifting gas on Earth, the upper atmosphere has been proposed as a location for both exploration and colonization.[1]\

:tu:B)

space hotels anyone??? Bigelow????

http://www.lasvegasmercury.com/2004/MERC-J...4/24250261.html

http://www.spacefuture.com/tourism/hotels.shtml

Edited by crystal sage

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QUOTE

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere_of_Venus

Despite the harsh conditions on the surface, at about a 50 km to 65 km level above the surface of the planet the atmospheric pressure and temperature is nearly the same as that of the Earth, making its upper atmosphere the most Earth-like area in the Solar System, even more so than the surface of Mars. Due to the similarity in pressure, temperature and the fact that breathable air (21% oxygen, 78% nitrogen) is a lifting gas on Venus in the same way that helium is a lifting gas on Earth, the upper atmosphere has been proposed as a location for both exploration and colonization.[1]\

:tu:B)

space hotels anyone??? Bigelow????

http://www.lasvegasmercury.com/2004/MERC-J...4/.html

http://www.spacefuture.com/tourism/hotels.shtml

B)

Hey this could be why there are rings around Saturn and Jupiter!!!!

:tu:

millions of Space Hotels!!!!!! and the ice... a floating water source!!!! as well as many habitable moons.. artificially created land masses????

http://csep10.phys.utk.edu/astr161/lect/saturn/moons.html

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http://www.spacetoday.org/SolSys/Jupiter/JupiterRings.html

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http://space.newscientist.com/channel/sola...bliterated.html

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http://astro.wsu.edu/worthey/astro/html/lec-jupiter.html

linked-image

At an image resolution of only a few meters, images from Galileo show jagged terrain not completely understood.

http://astro.wsu.edu/worthey/astro/html/lec-jupiter.html

linked-image

6 months separate images. Significant landscape changes seen! Galilieo.

Edited by crystal sage

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Ah, I hate to nitpick, but geocities is not a valid source to me. It's kind of like MySpace, but not exclusively a profile site. The article was written by "Guillermo Alarcon"? It's not entirely clear. Some of the articles are accounts of sightings of supposed Venusian beings, but that doesn't say much... and where is the first part of the article from?

"COMPILED BY S.E. MAR, DIRECTOR OF THE DEPARTMENT OF INTERPLANETARY AFFAIRS JANUARY THROUGH MAY 1972 AND IN 1990."

The who of the what from the wherenow?

I think you need to seriously question the authenticity of this. ;P

Salla is a bit more grounded, but at the same time... "Salla pointed to evidence widely available on the internet as a source for his research on extraterrestrial visitation: "There's a lot of stuff on the Internet, and I just went around and pieced it together.""

This is not to say that these accounts are true, just that he kind of amalgamates them. That these beings are supposedly beautiful and Aryan in appearance makes it even harder to believe.

And your comparison source for Earth and Venus states the facts you're trying to disprove. =P Couldn't they be wrong about that too?

And finally:

"Average temperature: 737 K (464 C)

Diurnal temperature range: ~0

Wind speeds: 0.3 to 1.0 m/s (surface)

Mean molecular weight: 43.45 g/mole

Atmospheric composition (near surface, by volume):

Major: 96.5% Carbon Dioxide (CO2), 3.5% Nitrogen (N2)

Minor (ppm): Sulfur Dioxide (SO2) - 150; Argon (Ar) - 70; Water (H2O) - 20;

Carbon Monoxide (CO) - 17; Helium (He) - 12; Neon (Ne) - 7"

^_^ If we use Mars as an example.... what we expected to find on Mar... ( similar to what we expect to find on Venus???) and then much to the surprise of all the scientist... what we actually discovered....( a livable planet.. with slight terraforming .. worth trying to settle)

http://www.angelfire.com/scifi/mta/index.html

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_ali...da_alien_37.htm

Fred Steckling, who has some thorough research on Mars, stated that,

“their true findings and most pictures are classified material which to this day have not been shown"

He added that we were told Mars is about half the size of Earth, with a surface gravity of about 40 percent and that the atmospheric pressure is about 7.7. millibars compared to 1,000 on Earth.

We are also told that the Martian temperature ranged from minus 22 below zero (F) to minus 122 degrees. One Viking probe landed about a thousand miles closer to their equator than the other one, yet contradicted logic by reporting the temperature at the equatorial region was colder than up north. He added,

“the amazed scientists discovered a 100 percent mistake during atmospheric measurements. The argon content of the Martian atmosphere was not 30 percent, but only 3 percent. A mistake of the same magnitude was admitted when a much higher water vapor reading was received than thought possible from earth measurements.”

Dr. George Sands, of Mission Control, stated,

“IT IS OBVIOUSLY WETTER THAN WE ANTICIPATED. THERE IS GROUND FOG AT THE LANDING SITE DURING PART OF THE DAY. Thirty microns of water have been found in the atmosphere, enough to not only cause ground fog, but ALSO FROST AND SNOW!”

NASA data, to a meteorologist, problematically proves Mars is much warmer than official reports stated. Ground fog is made by warm moist air moving across cool land or water, and ground fog is a product of temperatures ABOVE 32 degrees Fahrenheit. Water-based clouds like on Earth have been photographed about 15,000 feet over Mars, and such clouds and fog cannot exist in an atmospheric pressure of only 7.7 millibars. Evidence indicates that 32 degrees above zero must exist up to at least 15,000 feet on Mars, which is higher than Haleakala Crater in Hawaii. We all know we can live as we walk through Haleakala.

the earlier photo hinted that wind speeds could be much more...

linked-image

I do recall how earlier Mars was supposed to have similar temperatures..until they surprisingly found otherwise...

Edited by crystal sage

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:tu:;)

http://www.rfreitas.com/Astro/TerraformSRS1983.htm

TERRAFORMING MARS AND VENUS USING MACHINE SELF-REPLICATING SYSTEMS (SRS)

. TERRAFORMING VENUS WITH SRS

The main obstacles in terraforming Venus are high temperature and high pressure. Both problems may be solved through elimination of the atmosphere, either by removal to space or by physical/chemical burial in the crust. All schemes proposed to date [20] require at least 1028 joules for execution, but only using self-replicating machines can humanitýs investment be reduced to reasonable levels and payoff be maximised.

4. 1 Preferred Scenario

The mass of the Venusian atmosphere is 4.7 x1020 kg. To remove the gravitationally-bound atmosphere to Sun/Venus L1/L2, where it enters heliocentric orbit and disperses rapidly, Ei = 2.5 x1028 joules are required. The simplest way to provide this energy is by impact with an asteroid of mass Ei[GMo (Rv-1 Rj-1)]-1 = 2 x 1019 kg, roughly the size of 624 Hektor, a Trojan asteroid near Sun-Jupiter L4. A gravitational assist manoeuvre at Jupiter to aim Hektor at Venus requires a delta-V of about 1 km/sec from Hektor's present location, with a 1-2 year post-encounter fall time to Venus. A single SRS seed would be sent to Hektor to replicate into a large factory able first to build thrusters adequate for moving Hektor to Jupiter, then later to break up the asteroid into shaped, autopiloted chunks to ensure maximum energy transfer to the Venusian atmosphere upon impact. Related impact methods have already been proposed [20-21].

With Venus' atmosphere gone, its surface begins to cool. A sunscreen twice the diameter of the solar disk positioned at Sun-Venus L1, constructed of 50 gm/m2 solar sail material [22], has a mass of 3 x 1013 kg which can most cheaply be obtained from the Moon. Hence, simultaneous with the launching of the Hektor seed, another standard SRS unit is dispatched to the Moon where in 18 years it replicates into a factory covering less than 2% of the lunar surface, able to manufacture the screens in seven more years and then to generate the launching energy to Venus orbit in ten years. The screen arrives just after Hektor's impact, perhaps 50 years from the start of the programme.

With its atmosphere gone and a >90% reflective screen in place, Venus's crust should cool to 373°K in about 300 years assuming weak mantle-crust thermal coupling. After that, a third SRS seed unit lands on Venus and replicates 5.9 x1010 copies of itself in 26 years. This planetary factory can then be reprogrammed to produce 7.9 x1017 kg O2, enough to provide a 150 mbar breathable atmosphere, in 134 years' -As for the source of oxygen, Khodakovsky [23] has estimated that about 1020 kg H2O may be bound in hydrated minerals in the 33-km Venusian crust, and that oxygenated minerals may contain an additional 1020-1021 kg oxygen. The SRS field produces more than enough energy to release these resources. Although 650 years of cooling are nominally required for surface temperatures to reach a human comfortable 3000 K, the liberation of only 10% of the crustal water produces an ocean of mean global depth 22 m which may hasten global cooling during its condensation. Hence the terraforming time for Venus via SRS is >= 500-600 years.

Other options may be added to this plan. If it is desired to save some of the nitrogen and carbon from the original atmosphere, biological concentrators might be released in the Venusian atmosphere prior to the arrival of Hektor to precipitate these elements on to the crust for later salvage. If Venus' rotation rate must be increased, another medium size Trojan asteroid could be deorbited, immediately following Hektor to prograde impact, adding 1028 joules to Venus' rotational energy producing a 100-hour day.

4.2 Additional Considerations

One option to eliminate the atmosphere is to garden the topmost 100 km of Venus to promote mineralogical oxidation once. biological methods have decarbonised the air [20]. While this scheme may or may not produce the desired result, the only hope of carrying it out in reasonable time is to use a fleet of SRS-generated burrowing robots. Another option is to bury rather than disperse the excess atmosphere of Venus. In this scenario, with the sunscreen in place, the planet cools to near 200°K in about 3600 years, at which point the CO2 atmosphere would first liquefy and later freeze, precipitating as snow. During this time SRS machines could prepare giant caverns deep in the crust, draining off and burying the CO2 liquid slurry as it condenses. These caverns could then be sealed off permanently, of be mined for volatiles as required. More speculative is the possibility of outfitting the crustal caverns with giant canted rock nozzles capable of generating an exhaust velocity (>= Venus escape velocity) of at least 10.3 km/sec as the planet is allowed to re-warm and the CO2 to re-vaporise underground. 4.7 x1020 kg of atmosphere ejected at escape velocity would impart a maximum rotation to the planet of 66 hours/day and would also rid Venus of the excess gas.

The many advantages cited earlier in regard to an SRS approach to terraforming Mars are equally applicable here. Human colonists would arrive to find a planet not only terraformed but also industiformed - teeming with industrial machinery and habitats in addition to air and water. To maintain an Earthlike temperature the solar insolation must be permanently reduced by 50%, more if greenhousing is taken into account, or else Venus will become unbearably hot. This reduction may be accomplished either by maintaining a sunscreen at L1 or a reflective cloud layer around the planet. This layer could either be of natural origin or may consist of a fleet of high-altitude reflective balloons manufactured, launched, and maintained by the planetary SRS factory system.

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Near the end of the article, he say that the aliens said they’re from Venus. How can they say they from Venus? I mean, Venus is a name that we humans gave to that planet. For the inhabitants of the planet it could be anything different. A name in their own language…

The problem in this history is that they say aliens said, instructed, etc.

Do the aliens know how to speak English? How they know we call Venus “Venus”?

How they would know what Tesla was trying to achieve?

I don’t know, this is all too unexplained, but wait… Hell. This is Unexplained-Mysteries. So it is ok….

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Near the end of the article, he say that the aliens said they're from Venus. How can they say they from Venus? I mean, Venus is a name that we humans gave to that planet. For the inhabitants of the planet it could be anything different. A name in their own language…

The problem in this history is that they say aliens said, instructed, etc.

Do the aliens know how to speak English? How they know we call Venus "Venus"?

How they would know what Tesla was trying to achieve?

I don't know, this is all too unexplained, but wait… Hell. This is Unexplained-Mysteries. So it is ok….

lol even if they can adapt or just simply speak English, their mother language lol, then um yeah, I'm sure they'd call it something else or have their own superior language and their own name for it... lol

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I was lured in by the word "evidence" in the title. Silly me for expecting anything of the sort.

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I so want to get a job with the Department of Interplanetary Affairs.

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I so want to get a job with the Department of Interplanetary Affairs.

I so want to become an interplanetary hitch hiker. :)

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^_^

Well if they'd been communicating... been in touch with Earthlings for thousands of years. ( rumored biblical evidence..eg gods from the heavens... angels.. watchers.).. and of course being from a more advanced civilization than us... (they managed to keep a long standing connection..space travel... with Earth) then of course they'd bother to learn our language... just like good diplomats do when they have to visit /work other countries.... and learned to use our reference name for their planet... who knows???... ;) ... they could have been the ones who originally taught us what that planet was called....

There are Rumors that Jesus (genetically) was from Venus..

http://www.askrealjesus.com/K_JESUS_ANSWER...orningstar.html

http://www.scripturescholar.com/VenusStarofBethlehem.htm

http://www.amazon.com/Book-Hiram-Freemason...t/dp/1402735200

.(The tales of Mary being impregnated ... ( IVF????) by an angel... (alien???)......also lots of references in the Koran about the specialness of Mary's lineage

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...102886&st=0

http://www.ewtn.com/library/MARY/MARYKRAN.HTM

Mary's childhood, as seen through the Koran narration and Islamic tradition, is entirely a miracle. Mary grows under direct divine protection, she is nourished daily by angels (III, 32) and has visions of God every day. Everything contributes to making her and her Son a signum for mankind (V, 79; XXI, 91; XXIII, 50). But if the detailed narration of Mary's childhood confirms the exceptional value of her person, it is necessary to stress that the greatness of Mary is completely related to the extraordinary event constituted by the birth of her son Jesus. The fearful and sweet vicissitudes that precede and accompany the birth and the childhood of her whom God chose above all women, are, in fact; nothing but the prelude to the coming of the Messiah (III, 40). Therefore, in the intentions of Mahomet and the whole Islamic tradition, the advent of the Man generated by the Word (III, 45) finds in the history of the little Mary the mysterious preceding fact that prepares the believer, even more than the Gospels themselves do, for an expectation full of awe and hope.

This atmosphere, so charged with expectation and wonder, certainly does not disappear at the moment of the annunciation—a moment that for Mary is the highest and most mysterious one in her earthly life, and that reveals to her at last the significance of her function in the history of men. The Koran does not indicate the place in which this mystery was carried but (XIX, 16). It asserts, on the contrary, (III, 42 FF: XIX, 17) that God sent his Spirit under the semblance of a handsome young man who, similarly to what is narrated in the Gospel of Pseudo Matthew, was the Archangel Gabriel, often identified in ancient time with the Spirit of truth or with times divine Spirit (ruh ul-amin and ruh Allah, XVI, 102; XIX, 17; XXVI, 193). It. should be pointed out that in the Koran version Mary does not utter the fiat which expresses her responsible acceptance of the divine will. Here she merely asks: "How can I give birth to a son if no man has touched me?"; receiving the answer; "Just so! God creates what he wants: when he decides something, it is enough that he should say: let it be! and it is" (III, 147; XIX, 203). A version that confirms the typically Islamic sense of the absolute authority and power of God, and the complete submission of man to his will.

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