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Homer

Wesley Clark assails McCain's credentials

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WASHINGTON: With Senator Barack Obama planning to visit the Middle East and Europe in an apparent effort to burnish his foreign policy credentials, the credentials of his likely presidential rival, Senator John McCain, came under sharp attack Sunday from a man considered a possible Democratic vice presidential candidate.

The retired general Wesley Clark said McCain had not "held executive responsibility" and had not commanded troops in wartime.

McCain's experience in Vietnam, where he was a prisoner of war for five years, has seemed at times almost to grant him invulnerability to criticism of his security background. But on Sunday he was assailed by a fellow military man, a highly decorated one who was once the NATO supreme commander.

McCain frequently points out that he led "the largest squadron in the U.S. Navy," but Clark said on CBS television that that was not enough to support a claim to the presidency.

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It would be a great move on Obama's behalf to pick Clark. If anybody could have gotten away with that speech it would be him. Though why didn't he critize Obama for his lack of military service? McCain has that much on Obama in this little spat.

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I've said before, he crashed into his carrier and almost destroyed it as well as being shot down and taken prisoner 40-50 YEARS ago. (back when they fought with bear skins and stone knives) Those are the highlights.

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for his lack of military service

is not a prerequisite for being president. Not even being AWOL from duty as the current one was.

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is not a prerequisite for being president. Not even being AWOL from duty as the current one was.

No, it isn't... But it helps. Everybody knows that at least. The '04 elections John Kerry brought up his military service a fair bit as I recall.

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Though why didn't he critize Obama for his lack of military service?

Because Clark has endorsed Obama, and is also probably wanting to stay on the short list for VP

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I've said before, he crashed into his carrier and almost destroyed it as well as being shot down and taken prisoner 40-50 YEARS ago. (back when they fought with bear skins and stone knives) Those are the highlights.

Jeese, talk about misinformation or ignorance. Who ever told you McCain crashed his plane and almost destroyed the carrier?

McCain did NOT crash his plane as he was preparing to take-off at the time. If you bothered to do just a LITTLE research about the 1967 Forrestal fire you would have known that an electrical discharge led to the explosion of a zuni rocket. That rocket struck McCain's plane and exploded the fuel tank.

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Didn't McCain "wet start", causing the problems?

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Didn't McCain "wet start", causing the problems?

About 10:50 (local time) on the 29th, while preparations for a second strike were being made near [show location on an interactive map] 19°9′5″N, 107°23′5″E,[3] an unguided 5-inch Mk-32 "Zuni" rocket, one of four contained in a LAU-10 underwing rocket pod mounted on a F-4 Phantom II, was accidentally fired due to an electrical power surge during the switch from external power to internal power.

The rocket flew across the flight deck, striking a wing-mounted external fuel tank on a A-4 Skyhawk awaiting launch[3], either aircraft No. 405, piloted by LCDR Fred D. White[1], or No. 416, piloted by future U.S. Senator and Presidential candidate, LCDR John McCain,[4]. The warhead's safety mechanism prevented it from detonating, but the impact tore the tank off the wing and ignited the resulting spray of escaping JP-5 fuel, causing an instantaneous conflagration. Other external fuel tanks overheated and ruptured, releasing more jet fuel to feed the flames which spread along the flight deck, leaving pilots in their aircraft with the options of being incinerated in their cockpits or running through the flames to escape. link

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And before somebody comes with rumor #2: It is not true that Sen. John McCain crashed 5 aircraft before getting his wings...that was his father.

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And before somebody comes with rumor #2: It is not true that Sen. John McCain crashed 5 aircraft before getting his wings...that was his father.

That's not true. While he has lost 5 aircraft, they were not lost before he got his wings. One was lost when he was shot down and captured and another on the flight deck of the Forrestal. I believe he only lost one during his training period.

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That's not true. While he has lost 5 aircraft, they were not lost before he got his wings. One was lost when he was shot down and captured and another on the flight deck of the Forrestal. I believe he only lost one during his training period.

you actually read my post?

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Posted (edited)

you actually read my post?

Sure, why not. Your posts are usually interesting and direct. If you were referring to McCain's father, he was a sub commander and a Navy Admiral.

Edited by Aztec Warrior

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Sure, why not. Your posts are usually interesting and direct.

The father, John McCain II was who....(and the rest of my post)

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The father, John McCain II was who....(and the rest of my post)

McCain II was not a pilot and didn't lose any planes.

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McCain II was not a pilot and didn't lose any planes.

He made his PPL (Private Pilot License) at age 50, having caused various degrees of destruction to 5 aircraft before getting it. You should get a little deeper into that.

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He made his PPL (Private Pilot License) at age 50, having caused various degrees of destruction to 5 aircraft before getting it. You should get a little deeper into that.

Sorry, but I don't see anything about McCain II being a pilot or damaging any planes. It would be a heck of a coincidence that they both damaged or lost 5 planes each.

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Posted (edited)

Sorry, but I don't see anything about McCain II being a pilot or damaging any planes. It would be a heck of a coincidence that they both damaged or lost 5 planes each.

Which is how the rumor started that John McCain III ... and so on.

McCain was born the son and grandson of admirals in Coco Sola, Panama, on 29 August 1936. As a self-confessed military brat, he inevitably chose a navy career. There was no other option for the grandson of John 'Slew' McCain, a man who had commanded aircraft carriers in the Second World War. Slew McCain was so driven that when the navy passed a rule saying only aviators could command a carrier, the old man went to flight school while in his fifties. He crashed five planes before finally getting his wings, and then his carrier. In one Pacific battle, planes under Slew McCain's command sank 49 Japanese ships in a single day.

Full story, source: The Guardian

ED: missing source

Edited by questionmark

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Posted (edited)

oops...double post

Edited by questionmark

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No, it isn't... But it helps.

only amongst conservatives.

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only amongst conservatives.

Again... John Kerry (D) '04.

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Posted (edited)

Didn't McCain "wet start", causing the problems?

My uncle was aboard USS Forrestal on that terrible day in 1967.... It played havoc with his life forever thereafter,he was one of my favorite mentors up untill the the day he died. His 69 ram air GTO convertable is still safely tucked away in his garage. Every few years when I'm near the hallowed circle of veterens in my home town graveyard, that holds three of my family members, I always find his fighting tiger and place it back on his toombstone. On these days that I do this I always remember that Freedom indeed is not Free, and those who have shed their precious life blood for our freedoms shall never,ever be forgotten or trivialized.

I"ll always love you Virgil Becker may you finally rest in peace and put the terrible nightmares of July 1967 behind you.

Main article: 1967 USS Forrestal fire

In July 1967, Forrestal departed Norfolk for duty in waters off Vietnam. In the Gulf of Tonkin on 29 July, Forrestal had been launching aircraft from her flight deck. For four days, the planes of Attack Carrier Air Wing 17 flew about 150 missions against targets in North Vietnam from the ship. On July 29, 1967, during preparation for another strike, a Zuni rocket misfired, knocking off an external tank on another aircraft. Fuel from the leaking tank caught fire creating a massive conflagration that burned for hours, killing 134, injuring 161, destroying 21 aircraft and costing the Navy $72 million.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Forrestal

As of late I sure wish I would have asked him some questions about that day but it was always something we didnt discuss. He was always proud of his ship and kept a picture of her on his wall the rest of his life. He was burned with 3rd degree burns over a great portion of his body that day, I dont know exact specifics, it left pretty bad scars including facial and he was a very handsome man prior to that so that in of itself was a blow but by far the worse was his watching his best friend burn to death right in front of him. AV gas burns hot and fast it must have been horrible. My Uncle was released after he was healed physically but mentally he never overed that one day. He slowly over many years drank himself to death alchohol became his retreat and hanging out all nite at the vfw or eagles was a given. He always loved muslecars and he totaled many many classics during the 70s I remember them well roadrunners,t37 pontiacs,firebirds, LJ 455 Grand Prixs several Mustangs and GTOs he just didnt care about material things or his own life for that matter. Watching this saga unfold throughout my life and knowing about the root cause I decided way back then that the military life just wasnt for me and I took a different path in life one my uncle Virgil always encouraged.

Edited by nickoli

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Posted (edited)

here's a bit on McCrazy McCain from Human Events. com - a Conservative Movement !!!!!

on Johnny leading that squadron - ya know , the largest ?

“Because I know how to lead. I know how to lead. I led the largest squadron in the United States Navy. And I did it out of patriotism, not for profit”. (Sen. John McCain, CNN GOP debate, January 2008.

When I heard Senator McCain say that during the debate, it piqued my curiosity. I knew he had flown war time missions in Viet Nam, that he had been shot down, and that he spent years in a prisoner of war camp and endured torture by his captors. But I couldn’t recall him serving as the commander of an aviation squadron in combat.

The next day, I began researching, looking for the war ship where he commanded a squadron. I couldn’t find one. And then I started checking on peacetime navy assignments.

I would have had more respect for Senator McCain had he mentioned that VA-174 was a training squadron, based in Florida, and that his single year as commanding officer came in the years after Viet Nam.

Why should anyone care?

Because it’s one thing to lead men in combat and another to command them -- manage them -- in peacetime. This is not to demean Mr. McCain’s service. But it is one of those instances where claiming leadership experience is one thing and having it is another.

McCain’s heroism -- and real leadership, of the most valuable kind -- occurred when he was a prisoner in the infamous “Hanoi Hilton” prison, where his example sustained the lives of his fellow prisoners*. Why, then, claim the peacetime leadership instead? I don’t know. Only John McCain can answer that.

Nothing McCain can do will ever diminish that leadership and heroism. But his track record in Congress is not one to inspire the confidence that we need in our president.

It I’m tired of politicians using words to hide the truth from the American people. As tired of “what the definition of is is” as I am of fictions like “doing the jobs that American’s won’t do”. I’m sick of hearing “undocumented immigrants” when they mean illegal aliens and “revenue enhancement” when they mean tax increases. I can’t wait for news people to start calling bank robberies “undocumented withdrawals”, or for the police to announce the arrest of “undocumented pharmaceutical manufacturers” instead of meth cooks.

Senator McCain promises to cut taxes as President but he voted twice against tax cuts. He vows to stop illegal aliens from coming to our country, but he proposed to reward law breaking aliens. He promises to find new opportunities for American workers while simultaneously proposing an energy tax and global warming limits that will send hundreds of thousands of jobs offshore. If elected, McCain will take an oath to support a constitution that contains a guarantee of free speech which is denied by the McCain-Feingold campaign limits.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=24823

* yet to be proven since he refuses to open his record . he has released only 19 pages of over 250. And vets that were with him in that camp say things very different than McCain claims.

Edited by Lt_Ripley

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