human torture

[snapple]

what do you think . of people who are abusive and torture people?

what kind of human would torture another person? is something else going on because its against human nature

i dont see what i would get out of making others suffer.

i hear stories on the news of rapes and small children being murdered. child abuse and other

there was a little girl in my neighborhood who was tied to chairs and starved and murdered after trying to eat food. she was all over the news.

who does that, or tortures animals

there was a 45 yr old woman on the news who was hostage in a basement for 20 years and had 6 kids with her father because her dad locked her up.

what makes people do this. are they human?

alot of these people passed mental health tests.

so its not insanity

why would someone have an agenda and need to do things to others

[Nephilim_Slayer]

You have free-will but you will be accountable for your actions before God. Some people are from the descendants of Cain. The people who can torture puppies/people...etc....They are the lost ones, the soulless ones who feel no remorse or emotions. They are the wastes of human flesh and are going to be left out of the grand scheme of things.

[1.618]

Everyone is different.

[Emma_Acid]

what makes people do this.

Watch the movie Das Experiment.

[Postulant]

People that have no soul, people who will never the see light, people who walk in darkness.

Edited August 27, 2008 by Pathofthelefthand

[Lord Sappington]

Conversely, maybe it's NOT because of thousands of years worth of diluted genes. Maybe it's not because of divine will. Maybe it's just because that's how some people were born and how they tick. Even the strangest, most complex things can have the most obvious answer.

[Radian]

what do you think . of people who are abusive and torture people?

One who does that is usually classified or diagnosed as a Psychopath (antisocial personality disorder). They are known to be able to cut a person up and think no more if it than if that person was a piece of beef before dinnertime.

Imo, these people are influenced by nothing other than evil in this world, and to me, there is a real genuine evil here.

I'm not talking about those people with mental disorders other than what I mentioned, but those specific.

They are walking machines, and are NOT able to feel empathy.

I was told by one of my abnormal Psychology professors when someone asked him what hell was... and he replied "hell, it's a place without empathy." I believe it.

We all have will. But, when we let evil break our will down, that evil tends to influence us. And it does this starting from the very core of our very being.

[puridalan]

This is my greatest fear...torture. I do not fear death, but torture is a prolonging in living that is painful to the point that you wish every single nano second you were dead. But the thing is you can't die, your body acts as a weapon against you and you are forced into many unthinkable things. em...something I've thought of many a many times.

[insanemind]

Some people just like to watch the world burn -Alfred from Batman well he said men but I'm not sexist.

I think its kinda wide answer for a narrow question, it all comes down to how there mind is.

It only takes 5 min and 9 months to create a life that doesn't really seem like life is all that special huh?

[John from Lowell]

This is my greatest fear...torture. I do not fear death, but torture is a prolonging in living that is painful to the point that you wish every single nano second you were dead. But the thing is you can't die, your body acts as a weapon against you and you are forced into many unthinkable things. em...something I've thought of many a many times.

Yes there are all kinds of ways in which we can be hard on ourself. May I ask your age? There is something about a degree of openness that leads me to think and feel you may be torturing yourself unnecessarily. I say that because many open people like yourself have developed shielding that can become counter productive.

John

[paranormalguy]

START [WARNING * MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL OR TAKEN THE WRONG WAY] START

I haven't read all the posts in this thread so I can't be sure if some one has already said this, but I'm sure that all the things you claim are "against human nature" are in fact some of the most natural things left that anyone does anymore. Rape, murder and torture all stem from traits that every human has, those being greed and a want for pleasure. What humans have become is so un-natural that it disguists me. Sharing, being considerate, holding back urges, waiting for some one to say "yes". All these things are just soooooooo damn un-natural. Rarely if ever found in nature. So though they may be against many peoples common interest and there morality in the big scheme of things they're more natural than a human spending eight hours a day making spread sheets in a 10 x 10 cubical on a computer. Now I agree with you on the topic of holding people in dungeons for years, that is against all nature. But in my opinion murder, rape, abuse and torture for sport are all natural. Before religion came and told us what was right these were all natural. (nothing against religion, I guess it was done with best intentions {kind of} but none-the-less religion has got us playing a game we never really agreed to ourselves) And I just glanced over a thread and saw the word "Psychopath". People who are insane or supposedly sick or defficient in some manner of the mind I believe are just people who could have just realized where they are and what they're doing...if that makes any sense. Anyways, sorry for the long post but I had to get this off my back.

Relgious Agenda/intent DOESN'T = Human nature

END [WARNING * MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL OR TAKEN THE WRONG WAY] END

edit: Now looking back on this the term "Human Nature", it could be a pretty broad term. And one could argue that human nature now isn't neccesarily what human nature was 100 or 1000 years ago. I don't, but just thought I'd bring that up.

edit 2: To Shankpin - You say people who can cut people up like just another piece of meat are "anti-social" or something. So am I missing something?! What the hell are we, pieces of friggin meat. I think some one who thinks less of a cow or a pig than of a human is the one that's messed up. I feel pain, cow feels pain, I got family, cow got family. You've never met me so there fore you've got just as much of a personal and emotion connection to me as you do towards the cow (other than the fact that we're both human...big whoop.) So what makes me any different than the cow. Cow's have just as much reason and urge to live just as humans do. That's just confusing. You're calling these people evil! I'm calling them hungry and realistic. Peoples mind are so twisted now, and because the majority of the population is twisted the only people who've actually got it right in the head are the ones called crazy, they're the only sane ones left. But the government and church prosecute them and lock then in correctional facilities. SICK!!

Edited August 28, 2008 by paranormalguy

[Brighteyes]

Ok, so I read these forums every now and then but never bothered to register and particpate myself...until I read this. I'm not trying to change anyone's mind or argue but I felt to need to post. And, no I wasn't offended by your post paranormalguy, honestly, it left me feeling very sad.

START [WARNING * MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL OR TAKEN THE WRONG WAY] START

I haven't read all the posts in this thread so I can't be sure if some one has already said this, but I'm sure that all the things you claim are "against human nature" are in fact some of the most natural things left that anyone does anymore. Rape, murder and torture all stem from traits that every human has, those being greed and a want for pleasure. What humans have become is so un-natural that it disguists me. Sharing, being considerate, holding back urges, waiting for some one to say "yes". All these things are just soooooooo damn un-natural. Rarely if ever found in nature. So though they may be against many peoples common interest and there morality in the big scheme of things they're more natural than a human spending eight hours a day making spread sheets in a 10 x 10 cubical on a computer. Now I agree with you on the topic of holding people in dungeons for years, that is against all nature. But in my opinion murder, rape, abuse and torture for sport are all natural. Before religion came and told us what was right these were all natural. (nothing against religion, I guess it was done with best intentions {kind of} but none-the-less religion has got us playing a game we never really agreed to ourselves) And I just glanced over a thread and saw the word "Psychopath". People who are insane or supposedly sick or defficient in some manner of the mind I believe are just people who could have just realized where they are and what they're doing...if that makes any sense. Anyways, sorry for the long post but I had to get this off my back.

Relgious Agenda/intent DOESN'T = Human nature

END [WARNING * MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL OR TAKEN THE WRONG WAY] END

edit: Now looking back on this the term "Human Nature", it could be a pretty broad term. And one could argue that human nature now isn't neccesarily what human nature was 100 or 1000 years ago. I don't, but just thought I'd bring that up.

edit 2: To Shankpin - You say people who can cut people up like just another piece of meat are "anti-social" or something. So am I missing something?! What the hell are we, pieces of friggin meat. I think some one who thinks less of a cow or a pig than of a human is the one that's messed up. I feel pain, cow feels pain, I got family, cow got family. You've never met me so there fore you've got just as much of a personal and emotion connection to me as you do towards the cow (other than the fact that we're both human...big whoop.) So what makes me any different than the cow. Cow's have just as much reason and urge to live just as humans do. That's just confusing. You're calling these people evil! I'm calling them hungry and realistic. Peoples mind are so twisted now, and because the majority of the population is twisted the only people who've actually got it right in the head are the ones called crazy, they're the only sane ones left. But the government and church prosecute them and lock then in correctional facilities. SICK!!

I agree with a lot of what you stated, "Sharing, being considerate, holding back urges, waiting for some one to say "yes". All these things are just soooooooo damn un-natural." You're right, that is unnatural, which is why it's so important that we, as humans, do it! I believe that all the things stated, rape, murder, torture and abuse are not crimes against "human nature" per se, but rather against humanity. I know it has more than one defenition, but for the purpose of my post, I am referring to the following defenition: the quality of being humane; kindness; benevolence. Sure, we all are capable of doing horrible things to other beings, but just because we have that capability doesn't mean we should. It doesn't mean that because we can makes it right. I'm not even going to bother with the whole religion aspect because my own views may start some arguments. Back to the OP, people do disgusting acts for various reasons. It's hard to pin point and should evaluated case by case. There are many layers to what makes humans do the things they do. Another person touched on this before, but too often I think the ability to empathize with another living being is the deciding factor. If you are not able to understand empathy, then you are capable of anything and if you give in to "that" side of human nature that yes, you probably do deserve to be jail.

[paranormalguy]

I do very well understand empathy by the way. So Brighteyes... I understand these things are crimes against human, that's obvious. A crime in the eyes of the ones who enforce it. But when did being born human MAKE us responsible to do what is considered right or proper? You're making it sound like it isn't a privilege but a responsibility. I'm sure people take the ability to do what's best for themselves and others for granted. And shouldn't they or should they? Apparently being born into this world a human is a gift. But everything that makes us human also hurts us and often others. All these emotions and "responsibilities" that come with being human drag us down. Now I'm not saying to go out raping and killing people, society has dug itself too deep into this hole. Just a few people dare to dig themselves back out. Also I'm not neccesarely blaming religion, though they do instigate some what. I find it disturbing that it is so common and taken so lightly the way that people act and think. Like humans were put on this earth and there fore are responsible for her. My post may have left you feeling sad, but it's the truth, well in my opinion...that's why I wrote it. But you can believe what you please, blame murder, rape and theft on "the devil" and say that people are inherently good, but that isn't the case. People are inherently bad. In the seventeen hundreds the church blamed werewolves for horrible things that happened. Well sooner or later that got ruled out, now it's being blamed on the devil. Something that can be proven or disproved. How convenient. Thge church didn't want to accept that people could do this, that a god could make something capable of this "horrific" things. Did my previous post leave you sad because of my blatent and apparently wrong point of view or because you realized just now what I realized long ago?

p.s. Doing bad things just because we can doesn't make it right, but doing it cause it feels good does.... NB

p.p.s Though it may sound like it I'm not into hedenism!

Edited August 29, 2008 by paranormalguy

[paranormalguy]

sorry double post... computer lagged up.

Edited August 29, 2008 by paranormalguy

[insanemind]

Right and Wrong are just opinions of the collected masses.

[CosmicStaR]

Torture is ruthless and deserves no placement in policy what so ever!

[Brighteyes]

I do very well understand empathy by the way. So Brighteyes... I understand these things are crimes against human, that's obvious. A crime in the eyes of the ones who enforce it. But when did being born human MAKE us responsible to do what is considered right or proper? You're making it sound like it isn't a privilege but a responsibility. I'm sure people take the ability to do what's best for themselves and others for granted. And shouldn't they or should they? Apparently being born into this world a human is a gift. But everything that makes us human also hurts us and often others. All these emotions and "responsibilities" that come with being human drag us down. Now I'm not saying to go out raping and killing people, society has dug itself too deep into this hole. Just a few people dare to dig themselves back out. Also I'm not neccesarely blaming religion, though they do instigate some what. I find it disturbing that it is so common and taken so lightly the way that people act and think. Like humans were put on this earth and there fore are responsible for her. My post may have left you feeling sad, but it's the truth, well in my opinion...that's why I wrote it. But you can believe what you please, blame murder, rape and theft on "the devil" and say that people are inherently good, but that isn't the case. People are inherently bad. In the seventeen hundreds the church blamed werewolves for horrible things that happened. Well sooner or later that got ruled out, now it's being blamed on the devil. Something that can be proven or disproved. How convenient. Thge church didn't want to accept that people could do this, that a god could make something capable of this "horrific" things. Did my previous post leave you sad because of my blatent and apparently wrong point of view or because you realized just now what I realized long ago?

p.s. Doing bad things just because we can doesn't make it right, but doing it cause it feels good does.... NB

p.p.s Though it may sound like it I'm not into hedenism!

Hi paranormalguy,

I never said that you didn't understood empathy or you didn't recognize these things as criminal acts. Just want to make that clear. I even agree with most of your post. And while, yes, I do at times tend to have an "idealistic" view on life most of the time, and maybe that's part of the reason I believe that I do believe it is a reponsibility of us all to do what is proper and that we are resposible for this earth. But I'm not naive enough to believe we all will act accordingly. Frankly, most don't even bother. And that's what saddens me. Maybe we are inherently bad....but that doesn't mean we can't be more. And that which makes me human, all my emoitions and resposibilities, can help raise me up, and not just drag me down. What really seemed sad about your previous post is that it almost came across as a "that's just the way it is" kind of a situation so bother try to change. Should we just accept people you choose to commit such crimes because that's more natural and that's just the way it is?

And I'm going to assume that the whole "blame murder, rape and theft on "the devil" and say that people are inherently good" comment and the ones that followed are a result of someone else's comment because I never said anything of the sort, nor do I believe it. And I don't think what you "realized" is nothing people haven't thought or heard of before.

Sidenote: what hole has society dug itself into and how does one dig themselves out? PM with your opinion if you want. I'm just curious; you seem to have interesting opinions (and I mean that in a good way).

Edit: I was leaving work when I first replied. And yes I work in a cubicle and it sucks.

Edited August 29, 2008 by Brighteyes

[Picturesque Orion]

I certainly think the real question, in question here is:

Can a human being really deserve torture? Should a human being who has tortured others, deserve torture? And if so, should the torturer who tortured the other torturer, deserve torture? Don't you see?, what if torture is not always mindless?

[Aubrienne_Ellyrias]

u guys mean sympathy?

[Aubrienne_Ellyrias]

and as for why some people do these things. i'd say its mostly in your childhood. from my own experience when i was younger i used to get hit alot and treated like crap as a little kid. till i moved with my mom whn i was 10, but by that time i used to like torturing animals i remember i killed a fish and also a baby chiken and a bunny. and i wa sonly 8 then, after it i cried and felt bad for what i did,but in the moment it made me feel powerful, and what people used to do to me i wanted the little animals to feel my pain and i felt glad when thy were in pain and they couldnt defend themselves because it reminded me of me. no im not crazy or psychotic. but after i moved in with my mom she taught me many things about life. and the cruelty of torturing animals and everything else like that,

i'd say people who are like that is because they never get helped they just stayed in that phase and grow up in it and become what they are. i would never hurt an animal i feel so bad for what i did, but i was only 8 trust me your childhood has alot to do with your future and the way you think. and what to you may be right may be wrong for the rest. i can totaly put myself i those crazy peoples heads, but i choose not to and i chose not to become that way, its horrible thanks t0 my mom she changed me and she never hit me and the rest of my years are good =] idk i was thinking maybe you'd liek to see that point of view i think if i hadnt met my real mom ever i would be crazy by this time and have klled someone by now. its crazy and somepeople dont understand it and wont when they read this, but yeah?

[LogicalPiccolo]

u guys mean sympathy?

No...pretty sure they mean empathy. Though sympathy is pretty important too.

[Fenzo]

This all makes me wonder how screwed up this world would be if we didn't have any laws and never heard anything of "The Ten Commandments"

Do not kill, no not steal etc

We're all used to living in a world with rules to follow.

This effects the way you grow up and get educated since childhood

Imagine what the world would be without it, no punishments for killing etc, which makes it look normal

And as said before, psychopaths mostly have a screwed up childhood.

We'd grow up as a psychopath =o

But yeah, I myself wouldn't ever be able to torture or kill someone..

Read somewhere that a tumor in your head can also effect social behaviour and such, also giving you urges to rape people or kill them. As well schizophrenia, so there are a lot of reasons why people can bring themself to kill others..but torture!

Thats way worse and it sickens me XD

[morrigan]

START [WARNING * MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL OR TAKEN THE WRONG WAY] START

I haven't read all the posts in this thread so I can't be sure if some one has already said this, but I'm sure that all the things you claim are "against human nature" are in fact some of the most natural things left that anyone does anymore. Rape, murder and torture all stem from traits that every human has, those being greed and a want for pleasure. What humans have become is so un-natural that it disguists me. Sharing, being considerate, holding back urges, waiting for some one to say "yes". All these things are just soooooooo damn un-natural. Rarely if ever found in nature. So though they may be against many peoples common interest and there morality in the big scheme of things they're more natural than a human spending eight hours a day making spread sheets in a 10 x 10 cubical on a computer. Now I agree with you on the topic of holding people in dungeons for years, that is against all nature. But in my opinion murder, rape, abuse and torture for sport are all natural. Before religion came and told us what was right these were all natural. (nothing against religion, I guess it was done with best intentions {kind of} but none-the-less religion has got us playing a game we never really agreed to ourselves) And I just glanced over a thread and saw the word "Psychopath". People who are insane or supposedly sick or defficient in some manner of the mind I believe are just people who could have just realized where they are and what they're doing...if that makes any sense. Anyways, sorry for the long post but I had to get this off my back.

Relgious Agenda/intent DOESN'T = Human nature

END [WARNING * MAY BE CONTROVERSIAL OR TAKEN THE WRONG WAY] END

edit: Now looking back on this the term "Human Nature", it could be a pretty broad term. And one could argue that human nature now isn't neccesarily what human nature was 100 or 1000 years ago. I don't, but just thought I'd bring that up.

edit 2: To Shankpin - You say people who can cut people up like just another piece of meat are "anti-social" or something. So am I missing something?! What the hell are we, pieces of friggin meat. I think some one who thinks less of a cow or a pig than of a human is the one that's messed up. I feel pain, cow feels pain, I got family, cow got family. You've never met me so there fore you've got just as much of a personal and emotion connection to me as you do towards the cow (other than the fact that we're both human...big whoop.) So what makes me any different than the cow. Cow's have just as much reason and urge to live just as humans do. That's just confusing. You're calling these people evil! I'm calling them hungry and realistic. Peoples mind are so twisted now, and because the majority of the population is twisted the only people who've actually got it right in the head are the ones called crazy, they're the only sane ones left. But the government and church prosecute them and lock then in correctional facilities. SICK!!

Just to make sure I understand you properly, you are stating that killing and raping for fun, power, or whatever floats your boat is sane while respecting life and protecting one another is crazy? If that is truly what you feel then wow....just...wow.

For what it's worth, I am not religious in any way. You see, I was raised in an abusive environment. Not as bad as some, but far worse than most. I've been on the receiving end plenty of times. I know how it feels to be victimized. Sure, I could have become just like them. It would have been easy to do. But I chose not to. I saw the damage that your train of thought causes, and I chose not to be a part of it. Negativity breeds negativity. I refused to cause the fear and pain that I was subjected to in anyone else.

From your post I can surmise one of two things: that you have never been victimized at the whim of a cruel, sadistic person and lack the ability to empathize with those that have OR you have been victimized and see no point in breaking the cycle. Either way, I can only hope that time and perspective causes you to reflect and eventually change your mind.

[Kazahel]

I think its more common than whats thought of. Especially since "torture means any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted"..

So I think people only notice the more vile(extreme)kinds of torture, while at the same time we plod along abusing the same beggars in the street everyday. If you know what I mean.

[paranormalguy]

To morrigan: I don't think you understand what I'm saying. I clearly stated that I in no way encourage the said actions. But simply said that although thought by the majority to be wrong (thanks to religion and Gov't) they are still the most natural things that anyone does anymore.