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louie

The Mysterious Egyptian Tri-Lobed Disc

801 posts in this topic

tri-lobe: Apologies for the slow reply. First, I do not personally consider you to be a "fringy". It would appear that you are a practical and talented individual who has taken the time and effort to more fully understand the nature of the artifact. As previously noted, I compliment your efforts and what can be learned from them.

I would suggest, however, that your own points support the current supposition that the artifact in question may have had a more ceremonial/religious function.

The current lack of parallels (particularly in other mediums), combined with its presence as a funerary item, may lead one to speculate that the artifact was not intended to be a sub-assemblage of a more elaborate mechanism.

I would speculate that you are aware of the wide array of non-mechanical items associated with burials across the planet. "One-offs" of spiritual/position significance would appear to be not at all uncommon.

As to the bare mechanics; my mention of associated apparati is factor that I am confident you fully understand. Axles, transfer gearing, load bearings, super-structure, etc. For an object of this nature to actually function as part of a water transport mechanism would entail quite an extensive array of components. There would appear, at least to date, no evidence of artifacts that would compliment such an apparatus.

.

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you idiots its a chariot wheel ROFL

those flaps would make it hard for you to stick a spear somewhere now would it not?

Edited by chronoss

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you idiots its a chariot wheel ROFL

those flaps would make it hard for you to stick a spear somewhere now would it not?

Oh dear, rims for chariots...... They are the actual bling for any self-conscious pharaoh, who want's to keep his rep as a playa .....

:D:lol:

Edited by TheSearcher

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I go with our old friend the searcher. He doubts thats even Egyptian vase in the first place. There is no indication. It could be same as Tuts dagger.

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I just solved the mystery. It was a sun umbrella base, designet to the pharao when he went to the beach. :w00t:

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I just solved the mystery. It was a sun umbrella base, designet to the pharao when he went to the beach. :w00t:

Naw dude, it's a Christmas tree base. It's just missing the tripod.

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The Pyramid Texts is becoming an open book to me. Once you get used to the

strange formatting and "hidden"referents it's actually pretty easy. I could write this

stuff. There's another reference to the fire-pan. This one is a little more complex

to understand. Of course this specific segment is more opaque because so much

is missing as well. Some of the concepts appear nowhere else so can't be deduced

by context.

1781d. he has illuminated the earth with his first divine being.

The king was cremated atop the pyramid to complete his ascension to heaven. He

arose to heaven on the smoke of incense thus being freed from his bandages. His

"first divine being" is as Atum/ Osiris after he has been transmogrified by the flames.

In life he was mortal and a man with divine potential as Horus, son of "Osiris". In death

he illuminates the earth by causing the fire-pan to rock and be continually refueled.

1781a. --------------------

1781b. N. [went?] to the field of the glorified;

1781c. his hands fell upon Dbn-wp.wt (him of the twisted horns), north of the island of Elephantiné (ȝbw);

1781d. he has illuminated the earth with his first divine being.

1782a (N. I 168). To the side ----------

1782b. ------------ the [urae]us, the gu[ide], in his first birth.

The uraeus is the original source of the CO2 in the ben ben. There's not a lot of

context to go by but it certainly appears that author intent is the ability of the dead

king to maintain the flame after he has died. The concept fits the tenor of this spec-

ific ritual well.

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I am really interested in it

I'm guessing you have some sort of modern application in mind such as an automatic

shut off valve in case of over or under-aeration in fluid handling?

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I'm guessing you have some sort of modern application in mind such as an automatic

shut off valve in case of over or under-aeration in fluid handling?

Or he's spamming and the post will be removed by a Mod sooner or later?

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The surprise this artifact causes for me is more due to the fact that AE could carve a mean circular object out of stone with a circular cavity in the middle through which a rod of somekind could fit and use it as a lamp,but not realise that the circular object could rotate around that central axis and could be used as a gear or more simply a wheel.Strange people these AE were who would drag huge stones weighing several tonnes on sledges and wooden rollers and lift them to great heights building pyrimads which probably requires a great knowledge about levers,pulleys,simple mechanics and complex geometry and math but they would'nt figure out that they should use a wheel i.e a circular object rotating around an axis for transporting heavy loads etc. They knew about boats at the time of building the great pyramids but no wheels.Wheels getting stuck in the desert sand and hence not being used or preferred can be understood by me but the AE not knowing about the wheel and building the great pyramids is a little difficult for me to swallow.

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The surprise this artifact causes for me is more due to the fact that AE could carve a mean circular object out of stone with a circular cavity in the middle through which a rod of somekind could fit and use it as a lamp,but not realise that the circular object could rotate around that central axis and could be used as a gear or more simply a wheel.Strange people these AE were who would drag huge stones weighing several tonnes on sledges and wooden rollers and lift them to great heights building pyrimads which probably requires a great knowledge about levers,pulleys,simple mechanics and complex geometry and math but they would'nt figure out that they should use a wheel i.e a circular object rotating around an axis for transporting heavy loads etc. They knew about boats at the time of building the great pyramids but no wheels.Wheels getting stuck in the desert sand and hence not being used or preferred can be understood by me but the AE not knowing about the wheel and building the great pyramids is a little difficult for me to swallow.

There is sufficient evidence that peoples throughout the Near East knew of and used the wheel at this early time, and this includes Egypt. The main thing is, to what functions could the wheel be applied? For the sake of hauling heavy loads, the limiting factor is the strength of wheel and axel.

Egyptians were almost certainly using simple wheeled carts for agricultural purposes, but there's quite a difference between hauling grain and blocks of masonry. Wheels would've failed and axels snapped, so carts or wagons would not have been practical for hauling large and heavy loads. The Egyptians were always very intelligent and practical people. Sledges were much better suited to the task, and there is definitive evidence for using sledges from at least Dynasty 4 (if not earlier).

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But sesh it is not necessary for a hauling mechanism to have only four wheels and two axles it can have multiple axles and wheels to distribute any given amount of weight. And far as my knowledge of physics goes hauling huge heavy rocks over a dry surface will be easier by using a platform of wheels and axles then using sledges and lubrication.Dragging a sledge carrying huge loads in sand is surely a very painful ordeal.

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Yet there is evidence they did use sledges

E9050049-Ancient_engineering-SPL.jpg

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There are indeed so many pictographical evidences of sledges being used, but never ever a chain pulley mechanism.

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have seen the pictographs where they show the use of sledges but i wonder why they wouldn't use wheels.............also spartan is there any pictographic evidence of how they lifted heavy objects?

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Quarries of Balatai Plate 66-68

37.JPG

The statue is hauled out of the quarry plate 63-64

38.JPG

Further Transport plate 54-56

41.JPG

Aint those all SLEDGES??

Edit to Add : unless, cladking prefers to disagree. (yep. he is lurking in here). Remember Cladking, No Geysers. If you utter the world Geysers , i will set free my attack dobermans on you for sure.

Edited by The_Spartan

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have seen the pictographs where they show the use of sledges but i wonder why they wouldn't use wheels.............also spartan is there any pictographic evidence of how they lifted heavy objects?

I'm not an expert in anything but this is why I see them as not using wheels.

The weight of the stone being moved would tend to push the wheels into the sand eventually bogging the whole thing down, requiring them to offload the stone get the cart out of the sand and reload the cart and then maybe have to do it several more times before it reached it's destination. That is because there is relatively little area of each wheel that touches the sand. A sledge, on the other hand, has a much greater surface area and would be less prone to getting bogged down.

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have seen the pictographs where they show the use of sledges but i wonder why they wouldn't use wheels.............also spartan is there any pictographic evidence of how they lifted heavy objects?

I would suggest you to visit the following link which is so detailed

http://www.cheops-pyramide.ch/pyramid-building.html

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unless, cladking prefers to disagree.

Congratulations!

You've solved a question that wasn't asked and isn't relevant.

But we now know how they moved massive weights in 700 BC.

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But sesh it is not necessary for a hauling mechanism to have only four wheels and two axles it can have multiple axles and wheels to distribute any given amount of weight. And far as my knowledge of physics goes hauling huge heavy rocks over a dry surface will be easier by using a platform of wheels and axles then using sledges and lubrication.Dragging a sledge carrying huge loads in sand is surely a very painful ordeal.

If such a contrivance was used, there is no evidence for it. We have to go by extant evidence. While a mechanism with many wheels is unlikely, we know sledges were often hauled over timber rollers. There are depictions post-dating the Old Kingdom showing the moving of colossal objects such as the statue in the well-known Deir el Bersha depiction, and accompanying the workmen are men hauling rollers (in the link, see the group of men carrying the large timber roller below the left-corner of the statue base). Moreover, several ramp footings which have been excavated, including the large one at Khufu's pyramid complex, have yielded the remains of timber rollers. So we have evidence both pictorial and archaeological.

In one of Mark Lehner's experiential activities, which became the TV special This Old Pyramid, local Egyptian men were recruited to try out different ways of hauling stones the same size as those in the Great Pyramid. Their greatest success was in using the very method we're discussing: a block of masonry on a wooden sledge with timber rollers underneath. With men pulling from the front and others levering from the rear, a team of around a dozen had no problem hauling and maneuvering these blocks. This includes up inclines to approximate ramps. It was impressive to watch.

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