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Riaan

[Archived]Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood

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I was recently contacted by Alewyn Raubenheimer, a fellow South African, who has just published a new theory about the Great Flood in a book called Survivors of the Great Tsunami. He based his theories on the so-called Oera Linda Book, which I in fact had never heard of before. If you are interested, you can read more about its contents on his website (here). Although I do not necessarily agree with his theories, you may find it an interesting read. The book can be purchased here.

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I was recently contacted by Alewyn Raubenheimer, a fellow South African, who has just published a new theory about the Great Flood in a book called Survivors of the Great Tsunami. He based his theories on the so-called Oera Linda Book, which I in fact had never heard of before. If you are interested, you can read more about its contents on his website (here). Although I do not necessarily agree with his theories, you may find it an interesting read. The book can be purchased here.

OMG, the Oera Linda Bo(o)k is a known hoax.

Just go to the Wiki page about that book, and you will know.

But any Dutch person with something resembling brains could have told you long ago; the etymology portrayed in that book is simply ridiculous.

You never heard of it before?? Well. I have mentioned it many times on this site in connection with Doggerland (sorry Spartan...).

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OMG, the Oera Linda Bo(o)k is a known hoax.

Just go to the Wiki page about that book, and you will know.

But any Dutch person with something resembling brains could have told you long ago; the etymology portrayed in that book is simply ridiculous.

You never heard of it before?? Well. I have mentioned it many times on this site in connection with Doggerland (sorry Spartan...).

I had only a very quick look at the book, but read the Wiki page carefully. It indeed seems to be a hoax, although the author of the book evidently does not think so. Thought I'd introduce you to the book. That's all.

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I had only a very quick look at the book, but read the Wiki page carefully. It indeed seems to be a hoax, although the author of the book evidently does not think so. Thought I'd introduce you to the book. That's all.

I am convinced many here will know about that book already.

Maybe it only seems to be a hoax if your don't speak Dutch or Frisian, but if you do, you will know.

It's like a clever 12 years old kid concocted the story..

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You never heard of it before?? Well. I have mentioned it many times on this site in connection with Doggerland (sorry Spartan...).

:lol:

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I had only a very quick look at the book, but read the Wiki page carefully. It indeed seems to be a hoax, although the author of the book evidently does not think so. Thought I'd introduce you to the book. That's all.

Mate, I'm sorry to say that Abramelin is quite correct, it is a hoax. The etymology is totally wrong for the claims it makes, it uses wordings that are too contemporary to be correct, etc.

Most dutch speakers know this to be a hoax, with the exception of some neo-nazi groups, that use it for their own propaganda.

Sorry mate, but if the research is based on it, it's just based on a hoax and subsequently worthless.

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Time line of events for that book throw of the known history by a good deal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2100_BC

If it were not a hoax...but alas.....

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Mate, I'm sorry to say that Abramelin is quite correct, it is a hoax. The etymology is totally wrong for the claims it makes, it uses wordings that are too contemporary to be correct, etc.

Most dutch speakers know this to be a hoax, with the exception of some neo-nazi groups, that use it for their own propaganda.

Sorry mate, but if the research is based on it, it's just based on a hoax and subsequently worthless.

Many, but not all, are convinced beyond any shadow of a doubt that the Oera Linda Book is a hoax. Nevertheless, please consider the following few randomly selected facts (of many):

1. The Oera Linda Book(OLB)(1867) claims that their civilization in Europe was destroyed in 2193 BC by a massive natural disaster. The book mentions earthquakes, volcanic activity, fires, tsunamis, etc. that lasted for 3 years. Archaeologists and historians agree that the Old Kingdom in Egypt came to an end in ca. 2200 BC; the Harrapan (Indus Valley) civilization came to an end in ca.2200 BC; The Hongsan Culture in China came to an end in ca 2200 BC and Professor Harvey Weiss stated that the Akkadian Empire in Syria was destroyed in 2193 BC. In addition, the last Mammoths on Wrangle Island in the Arctic became extinct at the same time. In fact, carbon dating on one of the Mammoths indicated that the animal died about 2192 BC. Non of this information was available 140 years ago when the OLB surfaced.(Except possibly for the Old Kingdom in Egypt)

2. The OLB stated that before the disaster "the sun rose higher". This would indicate that they were closer to the equator. The book of Enoch (Noah's Great-Grandfather) stated that the "pillar of the earth shook from its foundation" and "the earth was violently shaken and became inclined" Various ancient scribes described the unmistakable effects of a cosmic impact.(Ipuwer, Neferti, etc.) Very prominent scientists such as Dr. Dallas Abbott et al have actually found evidence of this in 2005 (Please check the "Burckle Crater")

3. Professor Timo Niroma , on his website “The Third Millennium BC¬ (3100-2100 BC)” states “During the years 2200-2100 BC the saltines of the soil rose markedly, possibly because of sea floods” at the time of the destruction of Akkadian Sumer (present day Syria). He also states:

“ Mesopotamia and other above-mentioned places were not the only victims of the 2200 BC event. As far away as in China, the Hongsan culture fell in pieces at this same time. This, if not anything else, is an indication of the mighty character of the event, and bolsters us to consider it as global. ”

4. The OLB tells the story of a "Sea King" (not a monarch) by the name of Minnos that settled on Crete in ca. 1630 BC. In the 19th century nobody even knew that a "Minoan Civilization" ever existed. Archaeological work during the 20th century confirms everything that the OLB stated regarding the Middle Minoan period - even the date of ca 1600 BC. This date was only established in the latter half of the 20th century.

5. The OLB mentions the destruction of Troy in 1188 BC. In the beginning of the 21st century (140 years after the OLB) archaeologists concluded that Hellenic Troy (Troy VIIa) was destroyed in ca 1188 BC. In the 19th century Troy was still regarded as a myth.

6. The OLB claims that “Nef Tunis” from Frisia founded Tyre (in Lebanon) in 2000 BC. The Bible refers to tyre as having been “inhabited by seafaring men” and “inhabited from across the sea” (Afrikaans Translation)

7. The OLB described how some of them was expelled from Athens in ca 1550 BC and fled to India. This ties up exactly with the Avesta and Rig-Veda scriptures(Dating back to ca. 1500 BC). This also exactly the time when iron working commenced in India, (and the Caste System!)

8. During the 1980's archaeologists discovered naturally mummified Caucasian bodies in the Tarim Basin in Western China. They dated these mummies to ca 1500 BC.

I have tested the OLB against genetics, linguistics, theology, volcanism, climatology and many other modern discoveries and information that was not available in the 19th century and in every case the OLB was vindicated. Even ancient scribes such as Homer, Tacitus, Herodotus, Arrian, Ovid, Josephus and others support the claims made in the OLB.

The OLB was essentially declared a hoax by linguists who felt that the language was too modern. That is about the same as saying that the King James Bible is a hoax because the Jews did not speak Victorian English. The original translator of the OLB, Dr. Ottema, was a very prominent linguist and he believed to the day of his death that the book was authentic.

The Dutch rejects the book (understandably) because it was abused by the Nazis and, still today, by neo-Nazi groups and others; but then, so is the Bible. It still does not detract from the historical value of the book.

People like to quote Wikipedia as the “ultimate truth”. Wiki can, however, only publish what is out there at any given time.

Remember, the Plate Tectonics Theory was ridiculed for 70 years before it was accepted and it took 10 years before scientists accepted that the dinosaurs could have been wiped out by an asteroid impact. There was a time when people thought they did the world a favour by burning anybody who said that the world was not flat. The list goes on.

I am convinced that we are talking about a hoax here but it is definitely not the Oera Linda Book and yes, you guessed correctly, I am the idiot that wrote “Survivors of the Great Tsunami”

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Alewyn. Thanks for posting that. I guess the book is perhaps worth a read. If it is real, then where did its information come from? Atlantis??

Be welcome to these Forums!

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Posted (edited)

Just to point something out (this is not the only error, but it is a glaring one

3. Professor Timo Niroma , on his website “The Third Millennium BC¬ (3100-2100 BC)” states “During the years 2200-2100 BC the saltines of the soil rose markedly, possibly because of sea floods” at the time of the destruction of Akkadian Sumer (present day Syria). He also states:

“ Mesopotamia and other above-mentioned places were not the only victims of the 2200 BC event. As far away as in China, the Hongsan culture fell in pieces at this same time. This, if not anything else, is an indication of the mighty character of the event, and bolsters us to consider it as global. ”

Timo Niroma is not a professor, he has no academic link outside of sending e-mails. He is a pseudo-scientist.

Also, Troy was found in 1865 and was inhabited and attack at least 4 times between the 13th and 10th century BCE, not to mention all they other time because that is just Troy VII.

Edited by Mattshark

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Just to point something out (this is not the only error, but it is a glaring one

Timo Niroma is not a professor, he has no academic link outside of sending e-mails. He is a pseudo-scientist.

Also, Troy was found in 1865 and was inhabited and attack at least 4 times between the 13th and 10th century BCE, not to mention all they other time because that is just Troy VII.

Thanks for your info on Timo Niroma. I accept it.

As for your comment on Troy, it seems to me that you are confirming my view. You mention the founding of Troy while I am talking about the destruction of Troy VIIa. Our "trusty" Wikipedia says the following:

"The city of the archaeological layer known as Troy VIIa, which has been dated on the basis of pottery styles to the mid- to late-13th century BC, lasted for about a century, with a destruction layer at ca. 1190 BC. It is the most often-cited candidate for the Troy of Homer and is believed to correspond to Assuwan Wilusa known from Hittite sources dating to the period of roughly 1300–1250 BC."

My info was based on Archaeological sources but in this case Wikipedia says exactly the same.

Have a nice day.

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Posted (edited)

Thanks for your info on Timo Niroma. I accept it.

As for your comment on Troy, it seems to me that you are confirming my view. You mention the founding of Troy while I am talking about the destruction of Troy VIIa. Our "trusty" Wikipedia says the following:

"The city of the archaeological layer known as Troy VIIa, which has been dated on the basis of pottery styles to the mid- to late-13th century BC, lasted for about a century, with a destruction layer at ca. 1190 BC. It is the most often-cited candidate for the Troy of Homer and is believed to correspond to Assuwan Wilusa known from Hittite sources dating to the period of roughly 1300–1250 BC."

My info was based on Archaeological sources but in this case Wikipedia says exactly the same.

Have a nice day.

But you are not accepting that is was found in 1865 and even with just a rough idea it woudl be easy to guess one of the dates for Troy VII and there is over 4 centuries to work with.

Just to add for point 1, not a chance, Europe with "earthquakes, volcanic activity, fires, tsunamis, etc. that lasted for 3 years" I find that a little unlikely and if it had happened as it would have left considerable geological evidence across Europe.

Edited by Mattshark

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Alewyn. Thanks for posting that. I guess the book is perhaps worth a read. If it is real, then where did its information come from? Atlantis??

Be welcome to these Forums!

Hi "DieCheker",

Thanks for welcoming me.

I am afraid there is nothing mystical about the old Oera Linda Book although it does contain some very short references to some of their old myths which I ignored. They were definitely not some superhuman race although their history is very fascinating. In fact, I don't believe we can understand European and world history unless we accept the OLB as a credible document. My research was based on accepted scientific and historical facts and especially information that was not available in the 19th century. I must admit that I indulged in some "deductive" speculation here and there but that was mostly outside the Oera Linda book eg. the"Sea People", "Barbarians", "Hyksos", etc. I would like to believe that in such instances I provided sufficient back-up information. All my sources are stated very clearly so anyone can verify it. The Bibliography is 3 pages; I left out the less important ones.

I am amazed that the Dutch chose to deny this important part of their history and decided that everything only started with the Roman occupation. The old chronicles, however, deals extensively with the history of the greater Europe and the world at large and therefore should not be confined to the Netherlands only.

Regards,

Alewyn

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Hi and welcome Alewyn, I have discussed the OLB with Abramelin in regrads to Doggerland and I was not totally convinced of the fradulence of it, if that is the right word. The paper dated from 1865 but this does not outlaw the possibility of it being copied from an earlier text on my thinking.

However, what it contains could have been deduced from historical if not archeological records of the time. For the destroyed nation, we should look to Thera but there is a small chance it refers to the much older Black sea flood also. from the Black sea region we find the most ancinet proto writing in the Tartaria tablets. From this region survivors could have dispersed along the rivers particularly the Danube and settled much of Europe becoming the la Tene among other cultures. A culture I found in the region of Holland was the Swifterbank but they did not have writing to my knowledge, still the possibility of a semi secretive culture living a naturalistic way of life drawing a line of descent along way back in time.

Here is a link that I like that discusses the sea or river people not just in Europe but across the world and is one explanation for many of the myths that survive today.

http://mermaid-williambond.blogspot.com/

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But you are not accepting that is was found in 1865 and even with just a rough idea it woudl be easy to guess one of the dates for Troy VII and there is over 4 centuries to work with.

Just to add for point 1, not a chance, Europe with "earthquakes, volcanic activity, fires, tsunamis, etc. that lasted for 3 years" I find that a little unlikely and if it had happened as it would have left considerable geological evidence across Europe.

I am afraid I do not follow your logic. Whether I do, or do not accept the date of Troy's founding has nothing to do with my treatise. I only mentioned the destruction of Troy as a vindication of the Oera Linda Book.

As for your second statement: Have it your way or read my book.

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Posted (edited)

I may be guilty of mixng cultural connections unnecessarily but here is the culture I was hinking of but couldn't quite place. They are the Vinca culture and had their own script. Check it out to see if it compares in anyway with the symbols of the OLB.

http://www.omniglot.com/writing/vinca.htm

and here is another decent link

http://www.archaeomythology.org/events/events_romania_08.html

Edited by SlimJim22

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I am afraid I do not follow your logic. Whether I do, or do not accept the date of Troy's founding has nothing to do with my treatise. I only mentioned the destruction of Troy as a vindication of the Oera Linda Book.

As for your second statement: Have it your way or read my book.

Don't you think it is somewhat strange that it's the Frisians themselves who are convinced the Oera Linda Book is a hoax, and that only non-Frisians (and non-Dutch) believe it's real?

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Posted (edited)

I may be guilty of mixng cultural connections unnecessarily but here is the culture I was hinking of but couldn't quite place. They are the Vinca culture and had their own script. Check it out to see if it compares in anyway with the symbols of the OLB.

http://www.omniglot....iting/vinca.htm

and here is another decent link

http://www.archaeomy...romania_08.html

Vinca script (from your link) :

vinca3.gif

The Oera Linda script:

OeraLinda_script.jpg

Nah, not much resemblence, is there?

Edited by Abramelin

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Many, but not all, are convinced beyond any shadow of a doubt that the Oera Linda Book is a hoax. Nevertheless, please consider the following few randomly selected facts (of many):

1. The Oera Linda Book(OLB)(1867) claims that their civilization in Europe was destroyed in 2193 BC by a massive natural disaster. The book mentions earthquakes, volcanic activity, fires, tsunamis, etc. that lasted for 3 years. Archaeologists and historians agree that the Old Kingdom in Egypt came to an end in ca. 2200 BC; the Harrapan (Indus Valley) civilization came to an end in ca.2200 BC; The Hongsan Culture in China came to an end in ca 2200 BC and Professor Harvey Weiss stated that the Akkadian Empire in Syria was destroyed in 2193 BC. In addition, the last Mammoths on Wrangle Island in the Arctic became extinct at the same time. In fact, carbon dating on one of the Mammoths indicated that the animal died about 2192 BC. Non of this information was available 140 years ago when the OLB surfaced.(Except possibly for the Old Kingdom in Egypt)

2. The OLB stated that before the disaster "the sun rose higher". This would indicate that they were closer to the equator. The book of Enoch (Noah's Great-Grandfather) stated that the "pillar of the earth shook from its foundation" and "the earth was violently shaken and became inclined" Various ancient scribes described the unmistakable effects of a cosmic impact.(Ipuwer, Neferti, etc.) Very prominent scientists such as Dr. Dallas Abbott et al have actually found evidence of this in 2005 (Please check the "Burckle Crater")

3. Professor Timo Niroma , on his website “The Third Millennium BC¬ (3100-2100 BC)” states “During the years 2200-2100 BC the saltines of the soil rose markedly, possibly because of sea floods” at the time of the destruction of Akkadian Sumer (present day Syria). He also states:

“ Mesopotamia and other above-mentioned places were not the only victims of the 2200 BC event. As far away as in China, the Hongsan culture fell in pieces at this same time. This, if not anything else, is an indication of the mighty character of the event, and bolsters us to consider it as global. ”

4. The OLB tells the story of a "Sea King" (not a monarch) by the name of Minnos that settled on Crete in ca. 1630 BC. In the 19th century nobody even knew that a "Minoan Civilization" ever existed. Archaeological work during the 20th century confirms everything that the OLB stated regarding the Middle Minoan period - even the date of ca 1600 BC. This date was only established in the latter half of the 20th century.

5. The OLB mentions the destruction of Troy in 1188 BC. In the beginning of the 21st century (140 years after the OLB) archaeologists concluded that Hellenic Troy (Troy VIIa) was destroyed in ca 1188 BC. In the 19th century Troy was still regarded as a myth.

6. The OLB claims that “Nef Tunis” from Frisia founded Tyre (in Lebanon) in 2000 BC. The Bible refers to tyre as having been “inhabited by seafaring men” and “inhabited from across the sea” (Afrikaans Translation)

7. The OLB described how some of them was expelled from Athens in ca 1550 BC and fled to India. This ties up exactly with the Avesta and Rig-Veda scriptures(Dating back to ca. 1500 BC). This also exactly the time when iron working commenced in India, (and the Caste System!)

8. During the 1980's archaeologists discovered naturally mummified Caucasian bodies in the Tarim Basin in Western China. They dated these mummies to ca 1500 BC.

I have tested the OLB against genetics, linguistics, theology, volcanism, climatology and many other modern discoveries and information that was not available in the 19th century and in every case the OLB was vindicated. Even ancient scribes such as Homer, Tacitus, Herodotus, Arrian, Ovid, Josephus and others support the claims made in the OLB.

The OLB was essentially declared a hoax by linguists who felt that the language was too modern. That is about the same as saying that the King James Bible is a hoax because the Jews did not speak Victorian English. The original translator of the OLB, Dr. Ottema, was a very prominent linguist and he believed to the day of his death that the book was authentic.

The Dutch rejects the book (understandably) because it was abused by the Nazis and, still today, by neo-Nazi groups and others; but then, so is the Bible. It still does not detract from the historical value of the book.

People like to quote Wikipedia as the “ultimate truth”. Wiki can, however, only publish what is out there at any given time.

Remember, the Plate Tectonics Theory was ridiculed for 70 years before it was accepted and it took 10 years before scientists accepted that the dinosaurs could have been wiped out by an asteroid impact. There was a time when people thought they did the world a favour by burning anybody who said that the world was not flat. The list goes on.

I am convinced that we are talking about a hoax here but it is definitely not the Oera Linda Book and yes, you guessed correctly, I am the idiot that wrote “Survivors of the Great Tsunami”

"8. During the 1980's archaeologists discovered naturally mummified Caucasian bodies in the Tarim Basin in Western China. They dated these mummies to ca 1500 BC."

Just to clarify; The Xinjiang (Tarim) remains were first documented in the early part of the of the 20th century by Marc Auriel Stein. It was during the 1970's that the extent of the number of such remains was fully recognized. While the earliest of these remains date to circa 4000 BP, the most recent date to circa 1500 BP (500 AD).

You may wish to consult the research of Victor Mair (U. of Pennsylvania) for a more insight into this topic.

"1. The Oera Linda Book(OLB)(1867) claims that their civilization in Europe was destroyed in 2193 BC by a massive natural disaster. The book mentions earthquakes, volcanic activity, fires, tsunamis, etc. that lasted for 3 years. Archaeologists and historians agree that the Old Kingdom in Egypt came to an end in ca. 2200 BC; the Harrapan (Indus Valley) civilization came to an end in ca.2200 BC; The Hongsan Culture in China came to an end in ca 2200 BC and Professor Harvey Weiss stated that the Akkadian Empire in Syria was destroyed in 2193 BC. In addition, the last Mammoths on Wrangle Island in the Arctic became extinct at the same time. In fact, carbon dating on one of the Mammoths indicated that the animal died about 2192 BC. Non of this information was available 140 years ago when the OLB surfaced.(Except possibly for the Old Kingdom in Egypt)"

In what manner was this quite precise date (2193 BC) determined? What degree of supportive evidence from the Western hemisphere (aside from Wrangle) has been documented?

As to Wrangle Island dating, the following may be of interest. Note latest dates.

http://packrat.aml.arizona.edu/Journal/v37n1/vartanyan.html

.

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In what manner was this quite precise date (2193 BC) determined? What degree of supportive evidence from the Western hemisphere (aside from Wrangle) has been documented?

.

The book articulates the first known example of the concept of root races (though it does not call them that), and probably influenced H.P. Blavatsky to develop her own, much more elaborate ideas on the subject, as outlined in The Secret Doctrine (1888). It also mentions Atland (the name given to Atlantis by the 17th century scholar Olof Rudbeck), which was supposedly submerged in 2193 BC, the same year as 19th century Dutch and Frisian almanacs, following traditional Biblical chronology, gave for Noah's flood.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oera_Linda

:rolleyes:

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Don't you think it is somewhat strange that it's the Frisians themselves who are convinced the Oera Linda Book is a hoax, and that only non-Frisians (and non-Dutch) believe it's real?

Hi Abramelin,

I do indeed find it strange that they(you) have rejected it. In fact, I started out by trying to prove to somebody else that the book was a hoax on grounds other than only the “language hypothesis”. I am afraid that I could find no such evidence.

Here is another interesting little piece of information:

In his “Odyssey”(Book V, p1) Homer (ca 800 BC?) tells the story of Ulysses that landed up in “Scheria” in the land of the ”Phaeacians” after he was held captive by Calypso. To this day nobody knows who these “Phaeacians” were.

The Oera Linda Book gives us the answer: The “Phaeacians” were the “Frisians” and “Scheria” is the modern day “Schelde” in the Netherlands. “Calypso” was “Kalib” a.k.a “Kat”

Please also look at King Neptune (Nef Tunis in the OLB) who refers to the Phaeacians as “my own flesh and blood” (Book XIII, p3).

Obviously one cannot use only one such example to base your theories on. In my book I quote numerous other authors and historians from antiquity who unmistakably refer to your (our) forefathers in Western and North-Western Europe.

Please keep an open mind and ask yourself: “What if the Oera Linda Book is authentic ?”. You may be doing yourself and others a huge favour.

When I published "Survivors of the Great Tsunami" I realized that I am in for a “rough ride”. You don’t change entrenched ideas overnight. I am convinced, however, that my book proves beyond reasonable doubt that the OLB is not a fake.

Let me also put your mind at ease: My book has no political, racist or "white supremist" overtones. It is purely intended to be a bbok on factual history.

Regards,

Alewyn

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The book articulates the first known example of the concept of root races (though it does not call them that), and probably influenced H.P. Blavatsky to develop her own, much more elaborate ideas on the subject, as outlined in The Secret Doctrine (1888). It also mentions Atland (the name given to Atlantis by the 17th century scholar Olof Rudbeck), which was supposedly submerged in 2193 BC, the same year as 19th century Dutch and Frisian almanacs, following traditional Biblical chronology, gave for Noah's flood.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oera_Linda

:rolleyes:

Thanks Abe! I rather suspected as much...

.

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Posted (edited)

Hi Abramelin,

I do indeed find it strange that they(you) have rejected it. In fact, I started out by trying to prove to somebody else that the book was a hoax on grounds other than only the "language hypothesis". I am afraid that I could find no such evidence.

Here is another interesting little piece of information:

In his "Odyssey"(Book V, p1) Homer (ca 800 BC?) tells the story of Ulysses that landed up in "Scheria" in the land of the "Phaeacians" after he was held captive by Calypso. To this day nobody knows who these "Phaeacians" were.

The Oera Linda Book gives us the answer: The "Phaeacians" were the "Frisians" and "Scheria" is the modern day "Schelde" in the Netherlands. "Calypso" was "Kalib" a.k.a "Kat"

Please also look at King Neptune (Nef Tunis in the OLB) who refers to the Phaeacians as "my own flesh and blood" (Book XIII, p3).

Obviously one cannot use only one such example to base your theories on. In my book I quote numerous other authors and historians from antiquity who unmistakably refer to your (our) forefathers in Western and North-Western Europe.

Please keep an open mind and ask yourself: "What if the Oera Linda Book is authentic ?". You may be doing yourself and others a huge favour.

When I published "Survivors of the Great Tsunami" I realized that I am in for a "rough ride". You don't change entrenched ideas overnight. I am convinced, however, that my book proves beyond reasonable doubt that the OLB is not a fake.

Let me also put your mind at ease: My book has no political, racist or "white supremist" overtones. It is purely intended to be a bbok on factual history.

Regards,

Alewyn

I hope that you, Alewyn,, as a South African, understand the Dutch language for I have several links to texts written by and about Goffe Jensma. But also have some of his texts in English, so I think his message will be clear.

But before I fire, I want to ask you this: according to the Oera Linda Book, Aldland/Atland, or the 'old land" was located in the North Sea between Denmark and the Shetland Isles, and was submerged by a deluge at a date given as 2193 BC. That area is nowadays called "Doggerland", and there is a 32 page thread about it here. One of the scientific facts of Doggerland is that its last remants finally submerged around 6100 BC during a deluge caused by a huge tsunami (caused by the Storegga Slide). I realize that thread is a bit long, but I advise you to read it. And then I want to ask you: where is the proof that Doggerland was still above sea level around 2193 BC?? If you can, you will make me happy !!

Of course there was a large area west of Denmark that remained above sea level for a much longer time (and, together with Heligoland, inspired Juergen Spanuth for his 'Atlantis in the north' theory), but that was just a tiny part of Doggerland (or the OLB version, Aldland/Atland). I can also imagine that the Dogger Bank remained above sea level for maybe centuries after the deluge, but then as nothing but waste land, a mud plain.

OK, back to Goffe Jensma.

English: Summary of "The Masked God - Francois Haverschmidt and the Oera Linda Book" by Goffe Jensma

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In 2004 the historian Goffe Jensma published a book about the case: De gemaskerde god. François Haverschmidt en het Oera Linda-boek. In his book, Jensma argued that Haverschmidt was the main writer of the book, with the help of Over de Linden and Verwijs. According to Jensma, Haverschmidt intended the Oera Linda Book as a parody of the Christian Bible. An article in late 2007 by Professor Jensma [2] says that the three authors intended it "to be a temporary hoax to fool some nationalist Frisians and orthodox Christians and as an experiential exemplary exercise in reading the Holy Bible in a non-fundamentalist, symbolical way." However, ignoring clues that it was a forgery, it was taken seriously by J.G. Ottema and achieved popularity for the reasons given above. Its creators felt unable to admit that they had written it, and it became the foundation for a new belief. Jensma concludes his article by saying "It is a perfect irony that a book written to unmask the Holy Bible as a book of human making was to become a bible itself."

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Oera_Linda

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How to Deal with Holy Books in an Age of Emerging Science. The Oera Linda Book as a New Age Bible

Goffe Jensma, Leeuwarden

Citation Information. Fabula. Volume 48, Issue 3-4, Pages 229–249, ISSN (Online) 1316-0464, ISSN (Print) 0014-6242, DOI: 10.1515/FABL.2007.019, /November/2007

Published Online: 17/03/2008

Abstract

François HaverSchmidt, Eelco Verwijs and Cornelis over de Linden intended their forgery of an Old Frisian manuscript, later known as the Oera Linda Book, to be a temporary hoax to fool some nationalist Frisians and orthodox Christians and as an experiential exemplary exercise in reading the Holy Bible in a non-fundamentalist, symbolical way. Despite several obvious clues that the text could not be genuine, it turned out otherwise: the learned Frisian J.G. Ottema took the book seriously as a chronicle of Frisian history, religion and mythology, and soon he published a text edition – followed by more editions and translations. At this time, nobody interpreted the Oera Linda Book as a text directed against the orthodox Reformed, and the jokers did not dare to speak up. Too many other features of the text appealed to nationalist Frisians as well as pre-war National Socialists and post-war New Age believers, for instance: the connection of the Frisians with Atlantis, their early use of a rune alphabet, their civilizing Western Europe, their pre-Christian monotheism and belief in an omnipresent being, their matriarchy with folksmothers and borough-maidens, and their freedom-loving mode of life. Instead of criticizing the orthodox Reformed way of believing, a new belief was unwittingly created with the Oera Linda Book.

http://www.reference...5/FABL.2007.019

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Dutch (youtube) :

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Dutch : Goffe Jensma over het Oera Linda Boek

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The manuscript was originally thought to have been written in Old Frisian but according to Jensma "the syntax of this artificial language proves to be completely in line with modern, read: nineteenth-century Dutch/Frisian" and included "linguistic delicacies like the hundreds of puns, popular etymologies and funny words that were derived from almost every modern European language. When they were weary, the folksmothers for instance could retire to their 'BEDRVM' (bedroom)".

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Oera_Linda

I have the Dutch translation by J.F.Overwijn of the Oera Linda Book (2d edition, 1951, signed copy).

http://antiqbook.nl/...ag/000255.shtml , and the number of really funny etymologies - like the BEDRVM example - is simply overwhelming.

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Dutch (and now I really hope you can read Dutch) : Nieuwste vertaling van het manuscript door Goffe Jenstra (2006)

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Dutch: Reactie van Jensma op kritiek

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Dutch: Recensie van Goffe Jensma's "Oera Linda Boek"

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English (despite its Dutch title) : Dissertation / De gemaskerde god. Francois Haver Schmidt en het Oera Linda- boek

The subject of this study is the so-called Oera Linda Book, an enigmatic manuscript which turned up in 1867 as an heirloom in the house of Cornelis over de Linden (Enkhuizen 1811- Den Helder 1874). Over de Linden, who worked as a shipwright at the naval dockyard in the city of Den Helder, had allegedly inherited the manuscript from his aunt Aafje from the town of Enkhuizen.

This book is presented as a chronicle, composed by Over de Lindren's ancestors from c. 600 BC until 50 BC. It was written in a sort of Old Frisian and in a peculiar script which resembles runes. The book deals with the history of the Frisians from c 2200 BC onwards. It tells of an ancient Frisian, freedom-loving civilization which was led by women and which laid the foundation for the entire white Western European civilization to come. In the course of the centuries this Frisian empire was conquered and corrupted by Phoenicians, Gauls and other tribes, people and nations, some of which are known from classical historical sources. ...

Zie: Summary.

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Edited by Abramelin

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I hope that you, Alewyn,, as a South African, understand the Dutch language for I have several links to texts written by and about Goffe Jensma. But also have some of his texts in English, so I think his message will be clear.

But before I fire, I want to ask you this: according to the Oera Linda Book, Aldland/Atland, or the 'old land" was located in the North Sea between Denmark and the Shetland Isles, and was submerged by a deluge at a date given as 2193 BC. That area is nowadays called "Doggerland", and there is a 32 page thread about it here. One of the scientific facts of Doggerland is that its last remants finally submerged around 6100 BC during a deluge caused by a huge tsunami (caused by the Storegga Slide). I realize that thread is a bit long, but I advise you to read it. And then I want to ask you: where is the proof that Doggerland was still above sea level around 2193 BC?? If you can, you will make me happy !!

Hi Abramelin,

I am afraid my Dutch is very limited although my home language is Afrikaans. I will not be able to pick up the finer nuances in Dutch and definitely not the technical terms in a academic dissertation. (My forefathers left Europe more than 300 years ago.) Anything concerning Professor Jensma will unfortunately have to be in English

I shall try to respond to your comments about the Dogger Bank or “Doggerland” first and the rest will have to wait a while.

I could not find anywhere in the OLB where they say that their Altland was in the North Sea. What does seem clear to me is that this Old Land was somewhere to the West of Europe. In Chapters XXIII and XXIV of “the Book of Adela’s followers” they relate the story of Tunis and Inka who became outcasts. They sailed from Sweden to Spain 193 years after the disappearance of Atland. In “Kadik” (present day Cadiz) they parted ways. Tunis sailed east and Inka apparently sailed west:

“Chapter XXIV

2. …Tunis wished to sail through the straits to the Middel Sea, and enter the service of the rich king of Egiptaland, as he had done before, but Inka said he had had enough of all those Finda's people. Inka thought that perchance some high-lying part of Atland might remain as an island, where he and his people might live in peace.”

This tells me that their Altland could not have been close to Europe otherwise they would have known whether there was anything left. This was already 193 years after the disaster. In addition, they had just sailed through the North Sea. Atland therefore must have been a fair distance away and therefore not near the Dogger Bank.

I did, however, find the following which you may find interesting. (My book obviously contain much more detail.)

You are aware of “Frisland” on the old “Zeno” map and all it’s variants (Mercator, Lafreri, etc) which dates from pre-1400 AD and which was also declared a hoax.

I redrew Frisland from the map on Autocad and then superimposed it on a satellite image of the sea floor around the Faroe Islands. I rotated the map 19 degrees clockwise and adjusted the scale to the sea floor (The old maps were not too accurate). Lastly I imported 100m contour intervals into the drawing. The match is almost perfect.

I gave a presentation (October 2009) to two professors at the School of Geo-Sciences of the University of the Witwatersrand in Johannesburg (Prof Morris Viljoen and Prof Richard Viljoen). They could not fault my presentation. In fact, Professor Morris Viljoen exclaimed: “You have discovered Atlantis!” I disagreed and told him that I can only agree to having discovered “Frisland”. I am not in a position to say whether Frisland was Atlantis. From the contours I also pointed out a 200 kilometer long riverbed with which they both agreed. River beds do not form under the sea. These contours therefore indicate that this land must have been above sea level at some stage.

Lastly I presented a likely geological explanation to them as to what could have caused the submergence.(I have some 34 years experience in structural geology). Professor Richard Viljoen studied my slides for a while and then said :”I think you are right”

Whether Frisland was Atland or Atlantis, I cannot say. I also cannot say when this Frisland disappeared below the waves. What I can say with confidence is that the old map fits exactly on the contours. In research subsequent to my book I found that the coral reefs around the Faroe Islands seem to be in the vicinities of the old towns and old coastline – especially on the east side. Unfortunately I do not know how to import my jpeg figures onto this website. If somebody could advise me I will gladly post a few here from my book.

Regards,

Alewyn

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