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LucidElement

Vampirism

225 posts in this topic

You can't bring someone back from the dead. You don't know wether a vampire is actually dead. The detail's of such a being are difficult, if you know what I mean..

anyway, why do you always say "Nibs" at the end of your post's, just wondering.

I do understand what you mean, that's why I posted what definition I'm working with "undead blood-drinker". :) I find that the term vampire has been redefined so many times in the recent decades that it can mean anything from an "undead blood drinker" to a minor role-player.

But for the old definition of reanimated corpse - nope. Doesn't exist. As to other definitions, I'd have to read what the term "vampire" meant.

I sign "Nibs" out of habit. :) It's part of my UM name.

Nibs

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IMO, its their sig. More or less.

But ill let Nibs elaborate.

*hugs* hey handsome!

Yup, its my sig and it's easier than typing Anastasia Beaverhausen.

:P

Nibs

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No. Theres not a small chance. Thats bad logic and just wishful thinking.

Would you like to elaborate how this is bad logic?

Simple fact: we do not know everything there is to know.

Therefore: there is an extremely small chance it could exist and we just haven't discovered it yet.

It's hardly wishful thinking; I don't believe vampires exist and I'm glad of it.

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Would you like to elaborate how this is bad logic?

Simple fact: we do not know everything there is to know.

Therefore: there is an extremely small chance it could exist and we just haven't discovered it yet.

It's hardly wishful thinking; I don't believe vampires exist and I'm glad of it.

Its pretty wishful thinking, that ANYTHING that pops out of ones imagination, has a small chance of being here, but remains undiscovered.

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Would you like to elaborate how this is bad logic?

Simple fact: we do not know everything there is to know.

Therefore: there is an extremely small chance it could exist and we just haven't discovered it yet.

It's hardly wishful thinking; I don't believe vampires exist and I'm glad of it.

I think we are back to the "define vampire" issue.

:D Heck, we could go with "undead, drinks blood and can turn into a bat or mist" definition.

I think I'm on pretty solid ground with biology and physics don't work that way.

Nibs

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Seems like when it's pointed out that the traditional view of vampires (or other monsters) can't exist in nature we get "oh no that's not what a real vampire is". Then we get a brand new definition.

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Its pretty wishful thinking, that ANYTHING that pops out of ones imagination, has a small chance of being here, but remains undiscovered.

But nevertheless there is no way to say categorically, that something does not exist anywhere, at all, ever. As Nibs pointed out, the only way to say something does not exist is that physics/biology etc do not work that way. It could still be the case that our entire understanding of sciences is wrong and our laws of physics just happen to work through sheer chance. Naturally, I don't think this is the case but no-one can prove it unless we know everything there is to know in the universe.

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But nevertheless there is no way to say categorically, that something does not exist anywhere, at all, ever. As Nibs pointed out, the only way to say something does not exist is that physics/biology etc do not work that way. It could still be the case that our entire understanding of sciences is wrong and our laws of physics just happen to work through sheer chance. Naturally, I don't think this is the case but no-one can prove it unless we know everything there is to know in the universe.

Physics and biology lean towards vampires being pure fiction.

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Physics and biology lean towards vampires being pure fiction.

Yes, I know that, as you'd know from my other posts. But, as I said, this relies on the (very reasonable) assumption that our understanding of physics and biology is correct. From all the evidence available today, this is the case but that doesn't mean something couldn't be discovered tomorrow that proves it all to be wrong.

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Yes, I know that, as you'd know from my other posts. But, as I said, this relies on the (very reasonable) assumption that our understanding of physics and biology is correct. From all the evidence available today, this is the case but that doesn't mean something couldn't be discovered tomorrow that proves it all to be wrong.

I will shoot myself if that happens.

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I will shoot myself if that happens.

Umm...ok then. If it makes you feel better...

I'm not sure how this makes it any less possible but hey, each to their own.

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I think we are back to the "define vampire" issue.

:D Heck, we could go with "undead, drinks blood and can turn into a bat or mist" definition.

I think I'm on pretty solid ground with biology and physics don't work that way.

Nibs

We can only make a description on the "vampire" through alleged sighting's.

We cannot relie on Novel's and Movies etc.. They have been adapted to suit the author's need's, or they may simply be the image

the author has. Wether a shape shifting almost immortal afraid of garlic vampire exist's there is no doubt it is false.

Wether a blood drinking creature with certain abilities exist's, well it's possible, and there have been a lot of sighting's.

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We can only make a description on the "vampire" through alleged sighting's.

We cannot relie on Novel's and Movies etc.. They have been adapted to suit the author's need's, or they may simply be the image

the author has. Wether a shape shifting almost immortal afraid of garlic vampire exist's there is no doubt it is false.

Wether a blood drinking creature with certain abilities exist's, well it's possible, and there have been a lot of sighting's.

How again, is this possible?

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We can only make a description on the "vampire" through alleged sighting's.

We cannot relie on Novel's and Movies etc.. They have been adapted to suit the author's need's, or they may simply be the image

the author has. Wether a shape shifting almost immortal afraid of garlic vampire exist's there is no doubt it is false.

Wether a blood drinking creature with certain abilities exist's, well it's possible, and there have been a lot of sighting's.

I'm not sure where to go with this post...

The "sightings" and descriptions vary widely through out the ages so there is no one description.

I wasn't relying on novels or movies. I was relying on old folklore (which too is widely varied).

Why is there "no doubt" that shape shifting immortals are NOT afraid of garlic? How would you come to that conclusion?

Sightings are NOT evidence. They are stories. Interpretations of an incident.

Nibs

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Can you definitively prove it doesn't exist?

No, I didn't think so.

Thats silly logic. Come. I cant prove Santa doesn't exist either.

You cant prove that I can't fly.

This thread makes me really wonder aoubt the state of our public schools. :rolleyes:

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Posted (edited)

We can only make a description on the "vampire" through alleged sighting's.

We cannot relie on Novel's and Movies etc.. They have been adapted to suit the author's need's, or they may simply be the image

the author has. Wether a shape shifting almost immortal afraid of garlic vampire exist's there is no doubt it is false.

Wether a blood drinking creature with certain abilities exist's, well it's possible, and there have been a lot of sighting's.

Your hypothetical is lacking in fundamental features such as a plausible physiology and a basis for such a creature existing. Just because you think it may be possible for a creature like a vampire to exist, doesn't mean that it actually is possible. And if it differs enough from what one could could consider the universal understanding of what a vampire is, then it is simply another creature all together. A being that is dead and subsides on the blood of living creatures to exist, is an impossibility. Anything that strays from these basic features ceases to have the ability to be classified as a "vampire". Changing the definition too far from what is commonly understood to be traits of a vampire is describing some entirely different entity. Right?

ETA: Clarification.

Edited by Paul Disaster

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Your hypothetical is lacking in fundamental features such as a plausible physiology and a basis for such a creature existing. Just because you think it may be possible for a creature like a vampire to exist, doesn't mean that it actually is possible. And if it differs enough from what one could could consider the universal understanding of what a vampire is, then it is simply another creature all together. A being that is dead and subsides on the blood of living creatures to exist is an impossibility. Anything that strays from these basic features ceases to have the ability to be classified as a "vampire". Changing the definition too far from what is commonly understood to be traits of a vampire is describing some entirely different entity.

So do vampires in the sense we know exist? or could there be something slightly different going on?

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So do vampires in the sense we know exist? or could there be something slightly different going on?

Vampires do not exist. Full stop.

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So do vampires in the sense we know exist? or could there be something slightly different going on?

This doesn't make a lot of sense. If they don't exist under what we understand as a vampire (standard definition) then they wouldn't be vampires would they?

Can you define what you mean by vampire?

Nibs

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Vampires do not exist. Full stop.

Okay Mr. know's it all. Since we are all so ignorant, why don't you enlighten us with your proof that

show's vampire's do not exist, if you can't, then I think I will remain a tiny bit skeptical of

your statement's.

If you make a statement then prove it, You cannot prove this statement, It is your opinion, not fact, so unless you come up with some proof,

then maybe you should think before you write.

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Okay Mr. know's it all. Since we are all so ignorant, why don't you enlighten us with your proof that

show's vampire's do not exist, if you can't, then I think I will remain a tiny bit skeptical of

your statement's.

If you make a statement then prove it, You cannot prove this statement, It is your opinion, not fact, so unless you come up with some proof,

then maybe you should think before you write.

I showed how the standard idea of a vampire cannot exist. I explained how it flies in the face of biology.

Please give us the definition or description of what you are talking about.

Nibs

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Okay Mr. know's it all. Since we are all so ignorant, why don't you enlighten us with your proof that

show's vampire's do not exist, if you can't, then I think I will remain a tiny bit skeptical of

your statement's.

If you make a statement then prove it, You cannot prove this statement, It is your opinion, not fact, so unless you come up with some proof,

then maybe you should think before you write.

Have there been any vampire sightings where there IS a vampire? NO

Any news reports? NO

The facr that you have not provided concrete eviidence of these sightings make them not real.

I want you to prove me wrong by.]

Showing witness statements

Pictures

Drawings

Newspaper Clippings

Photos

Video tapes

Actual bite marks

This is I want YOU to find. So no stuff from fake vampire websites.

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Posted (edited)

So do vampires in the sense we know exist? or could there be something slightly different going on?

Well, that depends on how you mean "slightly" different, doesn't it? If it's not dead, but drinks blood (and only blood, not some person who eats normal food and may choose to drink blood, but a creature that can only survive on blood) to survive, then I suppose we may have a case for some type of living vampire. But again, straying too far from the Dead/Came back/drinks blood defintion of vampire, then we are just talking about some other "thing", not a vampire. So when you say slightly different, what do you mean?

The other issue is that people have been telling tales of vampires, as so many proponents like to point out, for centuries, why is there not 1 single specimen that can be studied? Not one creature whose physiology can be looked at that we can study and determine how they survive only on blood? Centuries of stories, but not one single body. How is that?

Edited by Paul Disaster

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Have there been any vampire sightings where there IS a vampire? NO

Any news reports? NO

The facr that you have not provided concrete eviidence of these sightings make them not real.

I want you to prove me wrong by.]

Showing witness statements

Pictures

Drawings

Newspaper Clippings

Photos

Video tapes

Actual bite marks

This is I want YOU to find. So no stuff from fake vampire websites.

If (hypothetically speaking) vampire's do exist, I'm sure they would not want us to find out about them, so they are careful.

And you have NO evidence to support your claim either. Anyway, It seems unlikely that so many stories over so many year's could

come from something that does not exist.

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If (hypothetically speaking) vampire's do exist, I'm sure they would not want us to find out about them, so they are careful.

And you have NO evidence to support your claim either. Anyway, It seems unlikely that so many stories over so many year's could

come from something that does not exist.

PLEASE explain to us what you mean by vampire. Otherwise we are just providing logic and evidence for something you are NOT talking about.

No, again, stories are NOT evidence. Please, link to any stories that CANNOT be explained by either ignorance or mistaken conclusion.

Nibs

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