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stardustmeggie

Many Questions About Ritual Abuse

33 posts in this topic

Hello

If you are looking for suggetions for information or books on dealing with truamatic events and PTSD I would suggest Eric Lindemann.

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Hello Javril. Thank you. I think it has helped to talk about this experience and now from this discussion forum here, I have some information to begin with my own little investigation. Thank you to the others as well for helping me out. Perhaps this experience is the reason why I have not been involved in many religious oriented activities. What I know and understand in my own heart is what I stand by. It seems to be very difficult to connect within a religious community when you feel as though there is a degree of deception and people are truly not being honest with themselves or others. This can be the case no matter what your religious or spiritual beliefs happen to be, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist,Wiccan, Whatever. All I desire is truth and honesty and that seems to be rare to find these days, behind the facade of illusion or even in the name of some "Mystery". Such is bull. True sprirituality must mean something more than symbols and ceremonies. **** religious authority. These mean nothing to me in the end. The only spiritual truth that I care about is that written in the hearts of men. Not only were the camps feeble attempts at teaching us spiritual wisdom nonsensical, it was done without the greatest degree of openness, communication, or what could possibly be considered acceptance and approval. Then again, we are children and such are consequences of the adult banality upon us. Funny, the website says that some children may not understand the deeper meaning behind the ceremony. No, I do not understand the Blue Ragger poem above in even the slightest bit. Except to say hmm, somebody's psychological projection was clearly evident here. I guess this is how it goes though. Project Project onto another. If you cannot win them over in conversion than surely you can manipulate and deceive. Then surely they will not catch you in the act of your hypocrisy and false sense of faith. And this is exactly what that camp experience was. And we wonder why people hate organized religion. Why they are driven away with every breath in their body from it. And why even the Occult in its "Hidden" bull should be questiosn with the fiercest of skepticism. Sorry ladies in gentlemen, their was no truth or wisdom in what I experienced at this camp. Plain and simple. What is true I can you so is my story and every word of frustration I have expressed in this very post. "The children just dont understand what the meaning is behind the ceremony". Well then you give them something they can understand if indeed the purpose is to teach something. Was that not the purpose? So it should be something that they can grasp at that age with love, not force you Patrnozing d****. Okay I am sorry I am venting big time here.

stardustmeggie

Hello

If you are looking for suggetions for information or books on dealing with truamatic events and PTSD I would suggest Eric Lindemann.

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For some reason this thread has made me think of the crooked cross of Mithra carried by the Pope as a negative symbol of christianity. Was something similar used in your experience do you recall? Here is a link and there are pictures of the cross on the bottom half.

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vatican/esp_vatican18a.htm

The poem you were forced to recite seemed to have trace elements of Satanism in it but I am no expert on the subject. It is hard to think of the reasoning for taking you all out there. Was it to put you off organized religion or was it part of a satanic sacrament causing fear or a form of mind control. Good luck working it out.

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I am not sure what it really means. You could be right though. My mother read this poem and mentioned a psychological thing called double speak or something like that. I has something to do with projection of oneself

For some reason this thread has made me think of the crooked cross of Mithra carried by the Pope as a negative symbol of christianity. Was something similar used in your experience do you recall? Here is a link and there are pictures of the cross on the bottom half.

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vatican/esp_vatican18a.htm

The poem you were forced to recite seemed to have trace elements of Satanism in it but I am no expert on the subject. It is hard to think of the reasoning for taking you all out there. Was it to put you off organized religion or was it part of a satanic sacrament causing fear or a form of mind control. Good luck working it out.

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Yes Double Speak, like intentionally distoring or reversing meaning in language for some purpose. Another thing I find interesing is that in spite of the fact that the websites do say that the ceremony will take place and that for each level there will be a differet ragger, there is still a great deal of ambiguity. For example, why would we have to be awakened from the sleep we had already been in to do this ceremony very late at night? It seems confusing to me why it was done when we were so grogy and barely even awake. I do not understand this. I mean, was it not enough that it was not only dam near midnight or so and blind folded on top of that. Unless the camp adults just had a thing for the dramatic, way dramatic!!! And going back to the whole "Some children may not understand the ceremony" crap, what exactly was it we were supposed to be understanding. Some adult's own perverted sacrament. Think about this mentality here for a moment: The children may not understand the ceremony we have set forth for them. But we will structure the whole thing in a symbolic manner with a meaning they do not understand. We will offer very little opportunity for them to question anything while we present before them numerous inconsistenices between our actions and true christian spirituality (of which their parents cannot wait to put them in a wholesome christian camp with total strangers). Then when they do not understand what it is that is going on, we will appeal to their deepest desires for belonging and faith. So much so that they shall never challenge or question the ceremony at all and we can repeat this logic until we have convinced them they have earned their place of honor and can lose themselves in a "hidden" world of mystery and esoteric wisdom so intoxicating that they feel special in a sense, part something profound and immutable. Hmm this kind of mentality does sound very much like what cults do. And moving forward with oaths at different levels. What does that sound like? hmm. Just some of my thoughts

stardustmeggie

I am not sure what it really means. You could be right though. My mother read this poem and mentioned a psychological thing called double speak or something like that. I has something to do with projection of oneself

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I'm sorry that this event caused so much trauma for you. FWIW, I think that this was a case of immature and irresponsible camp counselors not realizing how sensitive individuals could be affected by an innocent, albeit weird, initiation. Tiggs answered your question, and it should put your fears to rest. It could be that you're reading into things based on how you felt when you had this experience. I beg you to not read assorted claims of SRA, as they could cause more psychological harm. Cornerstone Magazine did an expose on two or more individuals who claimed to be in cults that did such things. One man was a con, and one woman had mental problems. There's a whole industry built on false claims of SRA. The template is people claiming to be leaders or members of evil global cults that do unspeakable things to babies and children. Like the man said in this thread, the FBI investigated this "trend" and found *no* evidence of these groups' existence, so there is no substantiation of these claims. I'm not saying that there are no small groups that commit horrid crimes. I'm just advising you to use your discernment when you encounter such tales (remember the McMartin case).

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stardustmeggie,

I asked my uncle what the camp name was and it is called "Allandale Camp" in Brown county. He said it is surrounded by hills, woods, and has a lot of different activities there, at least nowadays. The camp has been around for a long time, he said, so I'm pretty sure it would've been around when you were twelve years old. He also said that only a few churches attend the camp, so, maybe, the church you went to as a child was affiliated with it in some way.

I hope this helps clarify whether this is the place you were talking about.

-H.H. Holmes

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On 07/10/2010 at 5:12 PM, stardustmeggie said:

First of all, thank you for the information both SlimJim 22 and Puridalan. I appreciate it. I should make a few things clear here. Yes, I have also heard of some of the information you both have sent me and have gotten into literature on the occult as well. What I first must make clear is that my experience did not involve sexual abuse Thank goodness, but it did involve some strong psychological abuse. In fact, I should make it clear that my story is in no way even close to that of others who I have heard about who have gone through child ritual sexual abuse and witnessing other serious violent crimes. The greatest infliction causes by my personal experience was indeed felt in the spiritual realm, for a I suffered from much confusion on my own beliefs and faith and spent the following three years with major sleeping problems, nightmares, and night terrors. There are also things that I do not recall because it has been so long since the incident occured and my memory has faded. Again, thank you both for providing me more info. What I truly am seeking here in this forum at this time is also to understand what the sybolism was in the ceremony that I was made to attend (and really had to choice actually). This more than an anything I want answered because although I have some very basic knowledge on occult/cult/religious matters, although I am not involved in these things and do not understand the actual symbolic nature behind this experience of mine. The event occured when I was 12. It was a camp that I attended for young boys and girls for about 5 days during the summer out in a wooded isolated area. It involved being told we had a mission to God that needed to be completed and us children would find out when the time arrived. The boys and girls were in different camps. It involved being awakened very late at night,lined up and blind folded, and a journey in the dark through the woods (obviously I know this because we had to walk back OUT of the woods with out the blind folds when the ceremony was complete and back to our cabins to go back to sleep). This was what truly bothered me deep down. I had no idea where I was being led or what the hell was going on. All I knew is that some of the other girls were crying and so obviously I was not the only one who had an issue with this. We were told, this is God's way and to not fear because God is with you through the darkness. Then we arrived at a place in the woods where we each were allowed to remove our blind folds. When I say we I mean just us girls at the camp. We had no idea what the boys were doing or where they even were because they too were told they had a mission to God to complete as well. Anyways, we arrived at a place in the woods where we each circles around candles that were in the circle on the ground. Someone (identity unkown) came into the circle with a rope and hood over his/her head where you could not see. They were holding a book and began to cite a prayer. We were all made to recite this prayer back to them. Another strange thing about this was that there was some kind of cross lying against what appeared to be some kind of wall or pile of rocks. In fact, this is perhaps the strangest part of my memory. The cross sitting there seemed odd, almost out place or context or something. Anyways, the prayer was done and we all retreated back to camp and received these raggers/scarfs. I wish so badly I could be looking at it right as I write this and tell you exactly what was on it but I do not have it any more. It was layered it this very detailed arrangement of various circles, triangles, and so forth. It was a very neat design, but as you can tell I feel like a clueless dumb blond right now. I have no idea what any of it meant, if in fact it meant anything at all. I hope this story helps. It is the best I can do for now. Much of my memory has gone away completely on this event. After it occured, I felt almost in trance and for the next three years or so, as I already mentioned, I had horrible night terrors, sleeping problems and everything. I may not be highly trained and well researched in these kind of matters, but what I can say is that something always, always, felt wrong about the whole thing. If you have anything further to add to this, please feel free.

stardustmeggie

I know this post is already 7 years old, but it came up as I was searching for the YMCA Ragger's Creed.  Anyway, I read through your description of the ceremony you attended and took part in.  I want to apologize for the traumatic experience you recall, as that is the opposite of what becoming a Ragger should be.  I was a counselor and director with the YMCA for seven years. I didn't obtain my Blue (first) Rag until I was 15 years old. During my time as camp staff, I had the pleasure of "counseling" numerous campers who sought to take on the personal challenges.  That is what the Rag Program is about. The symbols; circle, triangle and cross, all represent different things.  I wasn't a Christian so I didn't have a religious goal. There are guidelines provided to help an individual choose their personal goals, yes. But in the end. The only people who know what those goals are, is the Ragger and their counseling mentor.  The Rag itself is merely and outward symbol of an inward goal.  It provides a visual reminder to yourself to continue working on those goals.  The Rag is worn ONLY at YMCA resident camps.  It is worn during ceremonies off camp sites when appropriate.

Accepting the Rag should never be an obligation nor should the camp staff have made you believe this. The person who stood center with a hood, did NOT follow the ceremony protocol. It makes me even more angry that he did it for a BLUE Rag ceremony.  I never made my campers' ceremonies about god or religion. They were taken very seriously as taking on personal goals can be emotional.  I always let my campers know they weren't required to take part nor would they be treated any different if they chose to decline.  My ceremonies included music, special readings from other Raggers and lots of reassurance that they could take on the world. Once the ceremonies were complete, we usually stayed at the Point and enjoyed the stars, warm summer nights and I always brought snacks.  All of my campers and fellow staff went out of their way to make the event memorable in a positive way.

What you experienced was nothing more than an arrogant, bible thumping ******* who found it necessary to put the "fear of god" into you.  I hope you can look back now and know that the Raggers Program is a great thing. The staff you encountered would never have been allowed to do those things at our Camp.

Look up YMCA Ragger's Program for a better explanation of the history behind the program and the foundation of it.

Christianleadershipconf.org/rags

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