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Raptor Witness

Apocalyptic & Cryptographic Style Predictions

210 posts in this topic

This thread is dedicated to predictions of a graphic or artistic style. The event or events you are presenting here now, should be expected to occur before the date of December 21, 2012.

This type of forecast is like looking at a painting, or listening to a piece of music or poetry, and attempting to absorb the meaning of the piece. In this case, however, that meaning is pointing to a future event, that may be unexpected and historical, or unusually catastrophic.

The term "retroactive clairvoyance" doesn't cover every instance of cryptic or artistic prediction, but it's a fair argument in most claims, and this thread welcomes skeptics as heartily as believers. It's just another way of saying that hindsight is 20-20. A very valid argument ... with limits.

This style has been used to protect psychic and prophetic artists and writers during times of danger, when free speech was under attack. I would also argue ... to preserve and protect the timeline of history. If you have any doubt that this is a time of danger, you need only look at Julian Assange, the founder of Wikileaks. If you need an example of what I mean by the timeline of history, read the [Prime Directive] set forth by the writer Gene Rodenberry in the TV series Star Trek. You may not understand the message until the events unfold, because of the rules set forth by the very power revealing them through you. They then can become a signpost that points ahead, not backwards.

If you care to share a few past examples of this unique style along with your successes, and which can be verified by two dated sources on the Internet or elsewhere, please feel free to post these, as they may relate to your current body of work.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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Here's a good example of what I mean, and how it's done. My interpretation below is just a theory, but I think a valid one.

Even if you're not Christian, here's a science problem for you. What else have men made with their own hands in all of history, where they literally appear to worship a "talking idol image," and which you could argue is designed to deceive them. Nothing else that I can imagine would fall under the curious description below, but it may well have been predicted in a cryptic message to the future. If this is the item described, it means that things aren't quite what they seem.

[Rev. 13:]

14 Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived. 15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed.

If this were the only parallel in the same graphic text, you might consider it just a random shot in the dark, but there's more, because at the same time this "thing" was predicted to appear on earth, so was another phenomena. Can anyone here tell me what it was?

5283128195_8329e4d70a.jpg

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If one looks back at all the predictions/prophecy's that Nostradamus made then looks to our history we can (implant) actual events that happened and make them fit his predictions. As you mentioned hindsight is 20/20.

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It's not possible to relize a prediction and not be looking back at it. No matter how acurate or inacurate it is.

Relized revlations will always be in hindsight.

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Posted (edited)

I accept that hindsight is, and will always be more accurate than foresight. Also, using hindsight to help determine the degree of rarity of a predicted item, and which helps distinguish it from what some might consider the inevitable, is unavoidable. For example, if something really bad happens historically, such as the atomic bombing of Japan during WWII, and someone tells me two thousand years in advance that men will make fire come down from heaven in full view of other men, I doubt that my hindsight will eclipse the accuracy of the foresight I’ve been presented.

This makes the cryptic example I’ve given above in post #2 such a good one, because there are only two predictions in chapter 13 of a technological nature, attributed to the curious entity called the "F. P." One is fire from heaven presented in full view of men, and the other is this curious "talking idol image." I find the odds of both of these presented together, interesting, but far more amazing is that both probable technologies; namely, the atom bomb and the television, appeared on earth at the same time, and in the same country. Not to mention that one technology is likely how “full view” is accomplished of the other. In other words, we’re not just talking about a singular prediction, but a cohesive one. This cohesion increases the mathematical odds of a prediction dramatically.

I might expect a prediction of men to someday fly like birds and drop weapons of fire on other men, but the "full view" part is where my eyebrows raise, because that's not something I would expect from the imagination of a first century man. "Full view" via a "talking idol image" is pretty darn good.

So here’s part one of the technological prediction presented in post #2 above.

[Rev. 13]

13 And it performed great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to the earth in full view of the people. 14 Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived. 15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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Posted (edited)

I understand where you are comeing from. I have always viewed the "beast" as the technology/civilization/government/ machine that began with agriculture and the loss if our aboriginal ways ( the tree of knowledge and its fruits). Way to many things to be ignored. I study all spiritual writtings. One day I was reading revelations and the part about sounding trumpets, people being caught up in clouds, suddenly was playing on my television. It was the scenerio at wounded knee. Trumpets sounded the Indians died in hails of gun and cannon fire that created a thick gunpowdered cloud. It basically was the end of their race/way if life.

I was chilled at the similarities.

War, disease, famin, that the new society white people brought also contributed to the demise of that entire civilization. Exactly as predicted for the world. I think it's easy to say that all societies end, and they all probably end exactly like that. Guess who is next?

Edited by Seeker79

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I accept that hindsight is, and will always be more accurate than foresight. Also, using hindsight to help determine the degree of rarity of a predicted item, and which helps distinguish it from what some might consider the inevitable, is unavoidable. For example, if something really bad happens historically, such as the atomic bombing of Japan during WWII, and someone tells me two thousand years in advance that men will make fire come down from heaven in full view of other men, I doubt that my hindsight will eclipse the accuracy of the foresight I’ve been presented.

This makes the cryptic example I’ve given above in post #2 such a good one, because there are only two predictions in chapter 13 of a technological nature, attributed to the curious entity called the "F. P." One is fire from heaven presented in full view of men, and the other is this curious "talking idol image." I find the odds of both of these presented together, interesting, but far more amazing is that both probable technologies; namely, the atom bomb and the television, appeared on earth at the same time, and in the same country. Not to mention that one technology is likely how “full view” is accomplished of the other. In other words, we’re not just talking about a singular prediction, but a cohesive one. This cohesion increases the mathematical odds of a prediction dramatically.

I might expect a prediction of men to someday fly like birds and drop weapons of fire on other men, but the "full view" part is where my eyebrows raise, because that's not something I would expect from the imagination of a first century man. "Full view" via a "talking idol image" is pretty darn good.

So here’s part one of the technological prediction presented in post #2 above.

[Rev. 13]

13 And it performed great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to the earth in full view of the people. 14 Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived. 15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed.

Right. Its so vague and can be left to interpretation and seen as correct any time. Even though we know its actually not, and its far off.

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Right. Its so vague and can be left to interpretation and seen as correct any time. Even though we know its actually not, and its far off.

Thanks for your input, but please explain at what point you wouldn't consider a prediction or example of foresight to be vague?

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Posted (edited)

Consider that the first beast is how the masses misrepresent themselves or are misrepresented, by for example social taboo's....

Revelation 13:14-15 (New International Version, ©2010)

14 Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived. 15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed.

Large populations influenced by the wrong decision....

In relation to the End of Days the last change in the cycle was about 7,800 years ago according to the record and in relation to modern interpretation... that interpretation could be incorrect and the time scales could be very much longer as in 78,000 years ago that being how it was taught to me.... while there are other cultures that do present that particular time in history as disastrous....

Toltec accounts speak of something fundamental that alters our way thinking about life. That when things change like this and given the potential of the masses, things can really go wrong...especially given that, due to how things have been misrepresented the masses have a false image of life...or a false image as to the consequences of there actions.

Just my thoughts?

Interesting topic Raptor :yes:

Edited by Virtual Particle

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End of days scenerios are all cyclical.

Civilizations rise, then fall, rise then fall, then sometimes major events usser in a dark age, then a renassunce. The tempo will get fevorish just line economys these days then a full collapse will be the result. Only aboriginal ideas survive without this.

Many point to modernism as pulling societies out of dark ages, but for aboriginal peoples, there were no dark ages. During the black death and the destruction of those times the "known world" was in trouble while north America, Australia, and places that still held aboriginal values were just fine. Nothing ever dark about their ages, until technology and "civilization" was brought to them, then it destroyed them.

The meam of civilization is the beast. It will destroy anything that gets in it's way. It has enslaved humanity under the guise of progress, it is destroying the earth, restrics and dulls all of our natural ways of being..... Spirituality, sexuality, instincts, love, and friendship. You cannot buy or sell without it's aprooval. Most of us are forced to work the greater part of our lives away with little or no free time or freedom, and if it takes notice of you as a threat it will kill or imprisson you. Make no mistake it is very conciouse. More so than any Antichrist.

All this from a guy with an iPhone and a nice Toyota tundra..... I'm a hypocrite.

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All this from a guy with an iPhone and a nice Toyota tundra..... I'm a hypocrite.

No one who thinks like you do, is a hypocrite in my book.

I've never explained what my current cryptic signature means, but I will here. It explains how tiny faith moved a mountain long ago, to where none existed, and how the faithless will be reminded of this through the destruction of their own man-made miracles. Essentially, the peril to come will be directly proportional to the denial of the power at hand. It's less a religious argument, and more one of how helpful change can occur.

If you can't see the danger ahead, then perhaps the artists presenting here can be of assistance.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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For the prophet to have seen that one day we would have the power to destroy ourselves is incredible..at the time mankind was nowhere near such a potential....in Ezekiel God states that his army would return Israel to the promised land..now that happened after WW II and the efficacy of that condition is still enforced by NATO of, which the US is a member...I feel that in relation to how one evaluates historical works one should consider certain primary terms in the context of that time in history....

A number of young-earth creationists purport to find in Isa. 40:22 and Job 26:7 evidence that the Bible teaches that the earth is spherical. A detailed analysis of key Hebrew words and their translations in ancient and modern versions shows that there is no substantive evidence and thus no warrant for this claim. This analysis is framed in the context of teaching a course in religion and science, and addresses the fundamental question, also explored in the course, of how one should interpret the Bible in the light of scientific knowledge.

Rest of link

I cannot help but consider when the prophet spoke in Revelations his understanding, of what the world was. Could have an effect upon where, specifically these events could be occuring and to who they will be occuring to and who functions as Gods army...

Edited by Virtual Particle

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I am certain that there are many interpretations as to the meaning of Revelations...My issue in respect to full scale nuclear war or some equivalent. Is that there would be nothing alive with exception of perhaps some forms of bacteria, specifically the ones that live deep underground. For me this presents as a potentially horrible event but not one akin to the above. A vision of the future, where somehow there is an intervention into what, could have resulted in mans extinction.

Taking current events into example one the issues that I have considered it that leaders of nations in the past held those positions for life....now inevitably a person will decompensate and how that is represented most often depends on the person...life was very difficult in the past and kings often did terrible things to protect there people...things were tolerated in those days..often times in relation to Judea-Christian culture they were excommunicated assuming everyone agreed it was warranted...

Potentially a leader in that same position today with access to Nuclear weapons could in his or her senility due to age, order a Nuclear strike against another country...

A way of interpreting the term "End of Days', is as an event that changes the way mankind relates to time...

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Thanks for your input, but please explain at what point you wouldn't consider a prediction or example of foresight to be vague?

Ummm, it was with what you just showed us up there, and what i quoted.

Thats an example of it. You interpreted it the way you want.

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Ummm, it was with what you just showed us up there, and what i quoted.

Thats an example of it. You interpreted it the way you want.

Some men are color blind, and can't fly airplanes. I guess they have "vague" eyes.

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If the two probable cryptographic candidates I've outlined above in chapter 13 weren't enough, I'm not done. There is yet a third item in the same paragraph, which appeared in the same snapshot of history, and in the same country. While it does not appear of a technological nature, it too has become a great one. This prediction will take an artist's eye to see it, as opposed to a religious one. That's how the time-line of history was preserved, because if Christians had seen this coming initially or even understood it, they never would have allowed it to happen in the first place.

Once again, statistically the odds are not merely added, but must be multiplied together .... to calculate the rarity of the growing cohesive prediction.

[Rev. 13]

16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.

First, don't get side tracked on the "mystery man" or his number, because you've got one too. The real question is, why use this strange clue to begin with? Keep in mind, at the time this prediction was made, men weren't known by their number. Rather, they would have been known as so and so from a place or town, where they or their clan lived; such as, Jesus of Nazareth. So to use a number to represent a man’s name is a clue, in and of itself. The religious eye is looking for THE man, but the artist asks why.

Also, in the ancient world the forehead was considered a third eye of sorts. They didn't understand the brain, but they had sense enough to know that something was processing visual information in addition to the eyes, because even with your eyes closed you could still see. Naturally they reasoned that to see is also to know, and to know is to see, not just believe in. So we're back to the artist's eyes, as opposed to the religious viewpoint. You can't use religious eyes alone, to find these important cryptic clues to the future. So to say that you've got a "mark" or a number on your forehead, amounted to knowing what your own number was, not just believing in it, or this entity that gives it to you. You remember it and you know it, or you don't get a paycheck, and you don't buy or sell goods to anyone else. That's literally THE BOTTOM LINE in this chapter.

As for the right hand, this was known of as the "action hand" in the ancient world. It's what you used when transacting business. Most men shook with their right hands when they agreed on a deal. When you make a deal today, you give your number to determine your credit worthiness, your hiring worthiness, and so on. In essence, your right hand has become your number.

I'm not a poster boy for literal interpretations. I simply look at the work as a piece of cryptographic art. It's a puzzle, and these three big pieces are sitting side by side in two different ways .... historically, and geographically. I don't think that's by accident.

5332083475_88ea9bab45.jpg

Edited by Raptor Witness

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Up to now I've avoided using religious arguments to explain the artistic and cryptographic style predictions found in [Rev. Ch. 13,] except in post 5 where I briefly indicated that the predicted technologies were attributed to an entity known as the "F.P." I threw the abbreviation out there to give this creative entity a proper name, but avoid the purely religious arguments that go along with it.

If you fast forward two thousand years into the future, however, we come to a curious snag while attempting to use an artist's eyes alone to see the bigger picture. Amazingly, one of the likely predicted technologies to appear, and arguably the greatest of the three I've outlined here, was given an initial code name ... which is anything but secular, and which actually points backwards in time to the first century prediction itself. As I'll show you below, it's almost a perfect affirmation of the foreseer's conception, given by the creator of that future technology, himself.

The first atomic test, which for all intents and purposes looked like the sun, and will later be dropped from the sky on the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki in 1945 is the first example in history of true "fire from heaven" created by men. This clearly would have been foreseen as something "godlike" to this first century writer, because the only comparison he likely had of a similar phenomena, would have been the Old Testament story of Sodom and Gomorrah, where another god rains fire down upon two ancient cities, destroying them completely. Up until this point in history, men hadn't conquered the heavens or sky, much less dropped fire from them. So this is a very unique signpost, and one which is remarkably ignored by the Christian community, but if you're paying close attention, the prediction indicates that this will be the case. The future deception becomes another cohesive component of the combined technology, and since deception is more than a religious concept, this allows the artist's eyes to see what the religious eyes cannot. The Christians don't get it, because according to the first century artist painting this picture, they're not supposed to.

So of all the names the technological creator could have chosen for this initial test of his device, he chose code name "Trinity," which happens to also be a religious code name for the Christian Family of God. While you could argue some expectation for the use of a powerful name, especially in light of such a profound step forward in human engineering, from everything we know about the author of the code name, he wasn't Christian, nor does he claim western religion or philosophy as an inspiration. So why use a religious term that Christians might consider outrageously arrogant? As you'll see below, the "new creator" of this device is saying not only, "I'm a new god" .... but "I'm a new Christian God," by reason of this technological miracle I've performed.

Although [J. Robert Oppenheimer,] the Father of the atomic bomb never officially says this, [he implies his conception in a letter] to [General Groves,] who was in charge of the Manhattan Project and who hired Oppenheimer. After the successful test, Oppenheimer also famously recalled the [bhagavad Gita], or "Song of God" in sacred Hindu scripture. "If the radiance of a thousand suns were to burst at once into the sky, that would be like the splendor of the mighty one." and "Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." Thus, even the motivation for the name of this device, helps to confirm the technological foresight two thousand years before it appeared. It was literally a great "sign" in the sky, because only someone like a "god" could accomplish it. Curiously, Oppenheimer doesn't explain why he chose a Christian god's name, as opposed to one from an eastern religion, which he claims was the source of his inspiration. It's something of a paradox, but is it really?

Many other writers have pointed to this "godlike" act in various conceptual ways. The film "Beneath the Planet of the Apes," is a good example. What they fail to do, however, is look at the other cohesive parts of the technology puzzle, and put those pieces into place. "Fire from heaven" is just one of the signposts. I expect the other "great sign"posts, should be just as easy to find.

If a certain man premeditates and kills his neighbor's entire family, claiming "self defense," would you consider his story and motive to be more or less credible, if that certain man was observed by witnesses to be wearing a tee shirt that read .... "I am God," at the scene? I ask this question not for the purpose of judgment, but to underline the potential risks of using such an arrogant name, which appears in a Book read by millions of American Christians every Sunday. Why was this inconsequential? Put simply, the Christian God answers to no one, and the new "Trinity" won't have to either. Oppenheimer was more than just smart scientifically, he was well known to be deeply interested in philosophy, so much so that many of his peers argued his wide ranging interests kept him from getting a Nobel prize. I think he knew that Christians would be afraid to judge themselves or him, and in the process they all become false prophets(F.P.) for missing this first century prediction, written about them.

If you're Christian, and you understand what I'm saying, then I understand your fear.

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Six

*6 paramitas, the "perfections" or virtues: generosity, self-discipline, patience, effort or energy/determination, concentration or insight/mindfulness, and compassion.

Wisdom can be regarded as their product.

There are six creatures that represent the Six Perfections. They are:

1) The lion representing the perfection of wisdom (prajna). 2) The elephant, concentration (dhyana). 3) The dwarf, effort (virya). 4) The makara, patience (kshanti). 5) The naga, morality (shila). 6) The garuda, the perfection of generosity (dana).

*6 senses:

apperception [with the mind, cognition]

sight

hearing

touch

taste

smell

*6 realms of rebirth:

gods [devas]

ashuras or demi-gods, "titans"

humans

ghosts

tormented/ "hell" beings

animals

Rest of link

Six represents equilibrium; harmony - balance. It is the perfect number within the decad: 1+2+3=6. It is the most productive of all numbers.

It symbolizes union of polarity, the hermaphrodite being represented by the two interlaced triangles, the upward- pointing as male, fire and the heavens, and the downward-pointing as female, the waters and the earth.

Six is the symbol of luck; love; health; beauty; chance. It is a winning number at the throw of the dice in the West.

There are six rays of the solar wheel and there are six interlaced triangles. There are six pointed stars or Seal of Solomon - and Star of David - Merkabah

Cultural References

Chinese: Six represents Universe, with its four cardinal points and the Above and Below - making it a total of six directions. Chinese culture there are six senses: tastse, touch, smell, sight, hearing, the sixth being mind. The day and night each have six periods.

Christian: Six is perfection; completion because man was created on the sixth day. Six is man's number The most obvious use of this number is in the notorious passage containing 666.

(Rev 13:18 NIV) This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man's number. His number is 666.

Hebrew: There are six days of creation. It symbolizes meditation and intelligence.

Kabbalism: Six is creation, and beauty.

Pythagorean: Luck

Sumerian: Six days of creation

Rest of link

13:18 This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast,for it is the number of a man.[e] That number is 666.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+13&version=NIV

They found Chinese silk in the mouths of Egyptian mummies...If the accounts that relate to Marco Polo are correct,this would be impossible....I was taught many accounts from all over the world. What I feel is going on is that the Orient figured prominently in relation to ancient society, despite the claims that Marco Polo discovered it....Silk, is also mentioned in the Bible.

Raptor I placed above in quotes a bold to point out a difference that perhaps should be investigated further, they are two different sentences......In World War II Germany applied Buddhist symbolism to it philosophy of superiority....When the Mongolian Empire

returned to Mongolia, because Genghis Khan had died and they needed to return to chose a new leader....the next Vatican Pope was German and Germany was given credit for defeating them and forcing them back to there territories...

In my opinion of one were to apply this to current events? I would say that Kim Jong-il is going to attack South Korea...the first strike with be of such devastation, as to cause the people of China to become really disgusted by the devastation that caused.....they do not come to there aid and neither does Russia...in that context North Korea was the Equvalent to Babylon in the Orient in ancient society....again this prediction is based upon, applying Revelations to current events...one could also look for example at the events related to when Andromeda collides with the Milky Way as another example of Apocalypses.....

Any thoughts?

Edited by Virtual Particle

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For the prophet to have seen that one day we would have the power to destroy ourselves is incredible...

It's not really that incredible if he knew and understood the Tower of Babel story, which I believe he did; probably a lot better than most people living today. If you're unfamiliar, it's a simple story about a god-family looking down on the intelligent beings they've created, and slowing down their technological development deliberately, for reasons that are unspecified.

[Gen. 11]

5 But the LORD came down to see the city and the tower the people were building. 6 The LORD said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then NOTHING they plan to do will be impossible for them. 7 Come, let "us" go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

8 So the LORD scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city.

I suspect that "nothing ...impossible," is the unspecified item, which the first century "prophet" will later fill in the blank for.

If I'm not mistaken, this is also the first place we see the "god-family" mentioned in this Book. This would compound the odds for what I've presented above, even more, because it adds another cohesive layer to the foresight.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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In relation to Babel an interesting sideline is that no building, no matter how tall today has a floor labeled 13th.... Raptor I am familiar with the more traditional interpretations for the Holy Bible and included in my upbringing. From the age of 7 to the age of 15 I attended several Christian schools...Catholic, Lutheran and Baptist....

There are a myriad of interpretations as I am presenting...events specifically at Babel could have been the result of how the structure was made...the materials used could have made it naturally attractive to lightning....given the modeling often offered the structure would have been quite sound...but if they, for example used Iron in its natural state...or rock that had a high enough content for and several elements....A really bad lightning storm could have made a real mess....getting into the matter of language as referenced in the Text?...in ancient times rather than teach people other several languages to address trade and relations, with other cultures a common language was applied....the more important people were in and near that tower when it went....it would make sense that if the tower was built of a certain material...the area surrounding was also made of the same material....Babel was an Icon to then society...

Present could have been many well educated people...In there context representatives from the known world who's function also were as keepers of the knowledge of this common language may have been present...hence could countries no longer communicate with each other....I would also be very possible that a reason they decided to build this structure is because they had some new material...In this interpretation I am still presenting this event was an act of God..but that if followed as a result of nature...

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The Tower of Babel is an interesting piece of cryptographic art, because it implies a risk for mankind that's somewhat unexpected. Anytime I see predictions with unexpected results, implications, or moral hazards; I pay special attention, because this is something a lot less likely to be retroactive clairvoyance. I want to see predictions that are unexpected, as in the example I gave above, of men obtaining "full view" of "fire from heaven." Even Sodom and Gomorrah weren't described as, in "full view" of mankind. So where does a first century writer get that idea from?

I would expect, if you asked any U.S. State Department diplomat, what they thought about people communicating better globally, they would reply that the better people communicate, the less chance of bad things happening to people on earth. I can't think of many wars that were started with too much communication. It's usually just the opposite. So how on earth, did the god-family come up with "everybody talking to one another," is bad?

Here's where the artist's eyes gaze a little closer at this picture, because there may be another bit of technology hidden in this Tower of Babel story, that religious eyes alone will miss. It's another cohesive layer to add to the growing mountain of odds, because it literally bubbles up in the same place geographically, and at the same time ... as all this other clever stuff.

[Gen. 11]

1 Now the whole world had one language and a common speech. 2 As people moved eastward, they found a plain in Babylonia and settled there.

3 They said to each other, “Come, let’s make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar. 4 Then they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves; otherwise we will be scattered over the face of the whole earth.”

.... You know, there's still a lot of that "tar" over there in Iraq.

So they used "tar" or bitumen, also known as petroleum to construct their tower to the sky. If you're paying attention, I could stop here, but the religious eyes need some help, so I'll keep going.

One of the key building blocks of modern aviation,(which brings people "closer together") and our new and improved version of the "Tower of Babel," is petroleum, which refines into jet fuel, or new mor"tar." Because without mor"tar," nobody is flying anywhere, and we wouldn't need to be back in Babylonia. ;)

He could have easily left that part out in the Book ... but he didn't, and now that unspecified "NOTHING," isn't a "Mystery" anymore.

535154219_86661b3ac7_o.jpg

So what is "the abomination" that leads to "desolation?"

You'd think the Holy "See" might have a better imagination.

Is it simply flying under the radar?

How about over overhead?

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I have read about some alternate conclusions as to what the tower of Babel was...and concede your referent to brick and tar as relatable to how the structure was built...but fire from the sky as defined in the ancient context often did imply lightning or a meteorite impact....Building construction in ancient times was not accomplished during the rainy seasons....thunder storms posed very serious problems and more often than not completion of a major project was prior to the next time of year such storms would occur...we are discussing in general a time in history where bronze and copper were the metal of choice and recent discovery...minerals like that, which are highly conductive of electricity could have been mixed in, with the idea it would help strengthen the structure. That could have been enough to turn the tower as well as the entire" "city" into a natural lightning rod...and that would have been a terrible mess with carnage to a level we can only imagine...

I have no doubt’s as to the existence of God. Raptor but I do question the efficacy of presenting that God was concerned about man developing.......When the King James Version of the Holy Bible was first introduced to the masses...Bibles fell from the sky...

I do not believe as was offered then that this version came from heaven... but perhaps King James took advantage of what was known then as

a Catapult....that idea is no longer a part of Christian thinking in the day all were suppose to accept that the King James version came from heaven....

"Everybody is talking is bad," and that is also what I find confusing....up until about 150 years ago "common knowledge" for anyone who thought it was important presented that the Universe was about equivalent in size to just outside the orbit of Saturn...many things have changed....when it comes to structures I feel it is obvious we have built structures way taller that anything, that could have been built slightly more that several thousand years ago....

I certainly understand the conclusion that Revelations is in relation to the Earth in general.....But I still feel that one needs to look at the context in relation to when it was written....I would question your opinion that Revelations, is not the result of retro-clairvoyance by the very nature of the term Prophet as to Prophesies.......Prophets present data about the future...I believe that the Promised land offered to Israel, is the same land known today as Israel....and given Ezekiel the Army of God restored Israel just after World War 2...

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I have read about some alternate conclusions as to what the tower of Babel was...and concede your referent to brick and tar as relatable[sic] to how the structure was built...but fire from the sky as defined in the ancient context often did imply lightning or a meteorite impact....

You're confusing manmade miracles, which appear god-like to the real thing.

The picture I see painted in the Rev. Ch.13 examples I've outlined above, are clearly of men being "ordered" not to buy or sell without a number representing a name. They are then "ordered" to create an idol image with the curious power of speech. The third order, while not consecutive here is implied. If two of the items are clearly manmade by "order," it stands to reason the third("fire from heaven,") is also, because that's the artistic theme we're presented. Forget about religion, I see mankind being "ordered" to make technology. They don't need "lightning or meteors," because in two thousand years they'll be making their own.

The picture that is painted is not of some bad guy or thing coming to hurt humanity by himself. This is story about complicity. A weapon of choice is transformed into a "Prince of Peace," literally. While I think manmade "fire from heaven" has helped keep the broader world at peace, so far, I wouldn't count on that lasting.

The bad things we see happening all over the place in the bigger Rev. book picture, which I’m not going to get into here, are directed not just against some bad guy or thing ... but us. The complicity is what reveals the technology in this cryptographic picture.

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A natural disaster even today, in the opinion of some are the result of God's wrath...but in essence as Nature was created by God then.....if you were to go to a super-market in North Korea whose image would be featured??? even on the bags of rice...whose image is on the money???

Creating an idol image, that has the ability to speak does seem very futuristic but again...the context in which, the Holy Bible was written, I feel needs to be taken into consideration....and can be the claim a man is a god....an anti-Christ would have accepted what Jesus denied in the desert...he or she would want control of the world...actually placing the entire planet at present under one leader is actually really unrealistic today....perhaps 2000 years ago...maybe if one had the right person....but today?? I feel then if we are prepared not to argue religion one should consider the a person who understood the future and provided an interpretation based upon his understanding of reality..

Gods presence is represented in a context that evaluated perceptually God's influence upon reality and in consideration to Gods mysteries...His observations holds a truth that is presented in the text....In Revelations God creates a new Earth and a New Universe...and today how we define the Earth and Universe is really different....The manner of the War that occurs could very well be definable in cause as an event that brings the world together because of the greed of some...

If a Man or a Woman is declared a god then it is not ok to hand them a gun when they develop dementia.....but that is not the case today...that is a very dangerous situation in light of nuclear weapons and today as the media presents, a very real problem...The Holy Bible states not enough in relation to the Earth being a Sphere...reasoning, to present, that the Prophet saw only certain parts of the world, when he spoke of it as the world....

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I've only made one prediction [here,] so far this year. I'd like an honest critique of the primary elements.

Is a curtain rising over Greater Egypt? Are an oppressed people attempting to escape the bondage of a modern Pharaoh?

Is there a "denial of power," and is it "directly proportional to the peril at hand?"

If you can answer these questions, then you know the future of this nation.

... I've never explained what my current cryptic signature means, but I will here. It explains how tiny faith moved a mountain long ago, to where none existed, and how the faithless will be reminded of this through the destruction of their own man-made miracles. Essentially, the peril to come will be directly proportional to the denial of the power at hand. It's less a religious argument, and more one of how helpful change can occur.

If you can't see the danger ahead, then perhaps the artists presenting here can be of assistance.

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