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Alan McDougall

Why does God the Benevolent allow evil

211 posts in this topic

The persons named Adam and Eve refers to humanity

The mythical story of the Garden of Eden

Enigma of the existence of evil and the Garden of Eden and “GOD” the Benevolent

I know the story of the Garden and Eden and the fall of man is most likely a mythical account of a people long past in the mists of time

I will try in my own humble way to answer this most difficult question.

How can we ever reconcile the fact of evil, suffering and pain, existing side by side with a benevolent holy “GOD” of light and love?

Let us go back to the story of the Garden of Eden “GOD” says to Adam in Gen,Chap 2 Verse 17 that he may eat of any tree except the “TREE OF KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL”

Note; “The tree of knowledge of Good and evil”, so Evil existed before Adam. “Adam” representing an entire people and how they related to “GOD”

However, “GOD” being all-knowing knew before hand that Adam was going to fail the test, so why did he give it in the first place? I hear a loud reply from the forum, “because he wanted us to have a free will and not be robots”.

I don’t buy this, completely, as “GOD” could easily given Adam absolute free rain and said to him “Adam your can do anything you want without any reservations”

Surely, the above would still have been free will without the “necessity of any test”.

Nevertheless, “GOD” in his infinite wisdom goes ahead and gives Adam (and Eve) a test he “knows they are going to fail, why? Was this fair seeing the awful consequences for humanity down through the age?

Yes absolutely as I will describe later in this essay

Let us go back to the origin of evil, where did it come from.

Isaiah Chapt. 45 Verse 7 “GOD” says “I form the light and create darkness: I make peace and create “evil” I “GOD” do all these things. “GOD” made everything so he must have made evil but why?

Let us go back to Adam and the pampered environment of the Garden of Eden. If Adam and Eve (Humanity) had remained and by obeying God ( as God knew the would not) they would have existed in forever a paradise setting of beauty warmth, comfort, never ever have to toil work just reach out and eat do any thing they want .

This would be wonderful for say a hundred years or a thousand years, but having never ever experienced cold they could not appreciate heat,, never being hungry never appreciate food, never being thirsty they would not appreciate the taste and satisfaction of sparking water , never knowing hate the would not know what love was.

They would have existed in a one-sided reality never knowing the opposite. But “GOD” knew that they must know evil, pain and sorrow to become fully functional free thinking beings similar to him in consciousness and indeed co- creators of their own domain and reality

Therefore, after countless years what we would this as paradise, would become a boring never changing hell for them. Therefore, “GOD” simply had to banish them from Eden into the world or toil sorrow and hardship.

So “GOD” being fair and just gave them the test, which they failed and drove them out of Eden into the present reality world of thorns, cold, dark, pain, evil etc, etc. This reality is based on a duality we know evil, so can also know Goodness, because we have some opposite to compare it with , We, know truth of Eden so we can hate the lie, and we experience the light so that we know dark etc etc.

Humanity can look back on a “paradise lost with a longing to for the eternal wonder and beauty of the original Eden, which they would love and rejoice as paradise regained by now knowing its true wonder.

I do not for one moment believe the nonsense that there is an eternal battle between “GOD” and the Satan or that this being is almost Almighty “GOD”s equal. Satan can only do what God permits him to do as we read in the book of Job.

In this world there are?

Good and evil

Light and dark

Truth and lie

Deception and honesty

Love and hate

War and Peace

Positive and negative

Faith and despair

Holiness and depravity

Warm and hot

Life and death

And so on and so on……………………

“GOD” bless

Any comments are welcome

Alan

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The way I see it. A benevolent(all loving), omniscient(all seeing), and omnipotent(all powerful) being would have nothing to do except create an amoral universe.

Either that or if the opposite existed. An indifferent, blind, and powerless being existed. The amoral universe we live in is the result of the first being trying to take care of it's opposite. Because it would love it regardless.

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What constitutes good and evil is largely dependent on your point of view, but, for arguments sake, even allowing there is absolute evil, how can people be constrained by a deity to do no evil, without free will going out the window ?

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Hi Alan,

Your views are interesting, but you start by saying (quote) :- I know the story of the Garden and Eden and the fall of man is most likely a mythical account of a people long past in the mists of time.

Could it also be that god and satan both fall into the same category? If one is a mythical account then it is stands to reason that anything to do with this garden of eden is also mythical, which would obviously include god and satan. It would also imply that everything written in the Bible is also a mythical account. I believe this to be the case, although with most myths there is an element of truth behind it so long as you dont take things literally. You must also be able to 'read between the lines' :)

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Satan cast doubts on God and God's word. Bottomline, the woman LISTENED to and obeyed the Devil and the man obeyed the woman. The Devil is very good at mixing abit of lie within a truth. Remember one third of the angels.

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Satan cast doubts on God and God's word. Bottomline, the woman LISTENED to and obeyed the Devil and the man obeyed the woman. The Devil is very good at mixing abit of lie within a truth. Remember one third of the angels.

Yup. I can just see it now. Adam said '' I am the boss in this house and I have Eve's permission to say so!'' :wacko:

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Yup. I can just see it now. Adam said '' I am the boss in this house and I have Eve's permission to say so!'' :wacko:

The Garden of Eden can be suggested an open interpretation. Perhaps, without any true scriptural authority mind you, Satan led an additional rebellion or mutiny. That man chose the creation above God and his authority. Furthermore, perhaps the Garden of Eden represents a universal law or universal principle.

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Who is this God the Benevolent?

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Who is this God the Benevolent?

The Creator of Your Eternal Spirit.

Love Omnmakla

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Who is this God the Benevolent?

This is the God who is creating character through experiences learned.

Think about it,

Karlis

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Who is this God the Benevolent?

I have no idea and I won't pretend I know.... I don't believe any man can know what a real God is...

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~~~ ...

... I don't believe any man can know what a real God is...

Unless the Creator God reveals any specific aspects about God to Mankind.

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The Creator of Your Eternal Spirit.

Any relation to God the Jealous, or God the Vengeful?

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Unless the Creator God reveals any specific aspects about God to Mankind.

Unless one happens to take ones simple word for it and believe God has... no facts needed to provide proof.. Just believe in what they say.... Not for me thanks

Any relation to God the Jealous, or God the Vengeful?

Ha ha very good...lol.....They could be the new trinity - God the Benevolent, the Jealous and the vengeful... lol

Edited by Beckys_Mom

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Any relation to God the Jealous, or God the Vengeful?

No, those are man made concepts.

Love Omnaka

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However, “GOD” being all-knowing knew before hand that Adam was going to fail the test, so why did he give it in the first place? I hear a loud reply from the forum, “because he wanted us to have a free will and not be robots”.

I don’t buy this, completely, as “GOD” could easily given Adam absolute free rain and said to him “Adam your can do anything you want without any reservations”

Surely, the above would still have been free will without the “necessity of any test”.

Nevertheless, “GOD” in his infinite wisdom goes ahead and gives Adam (and Eve) a test he “knows they are going to fail, why? Was this fair seeing the awful consequences for humanity down through the age?

So They could Experience their eternal Spirit in a temporal world.

Let us go back to the origin of evil, where did it come from.

Isaiah Chapt. 45 Verse 7 “GOD” says “I form the light and create darkness: I make peace and create “evil” I “GOD” do all these things. “GOD” made everything so he must have made evil but why?

How would one know what Good was if one had not also experienced Evil, or Bad?

Let us go back to Adam and the pampered environment of the Garden of Eden. If Adam and Eve (Humanity) had remained and by obeying God ( as God knew the would not) they would have existed in forever a paradise setting of beauty warmth, comfort, never ever have to toil work just reach out and eat do any thing they want .

This would be wonderful for say a hundred years or a thousand years, but having never ever experienced cold they could not appreciate heat,, never being hungry never appreciate food, never being thirsty they would not appreciate the taste and satisfaction of sparking water , never knowing hate the would not know what love was.

They would have existed in a one-sided reality never knowing the opposite. But “GOD” knew that they must know evil, pain and sorrow to become fully functional free thinking beings similar to him in consciousness and indeed co- creators of their own domain and reality

Therefore, after countless years what we would this as paradise, would become a boring never changing hell for them. Therefore, “GOD” simply had to banish them from Eden into the world or toil sorrow and hardship.

So “GOD” being fair and just gave them the test, which they failed and drove them out of Eden into the present reality world of thorns, cold, dark, pain, evil etc, etc. This reality is based on a duality we know evil, so can also know Goodness, because we have some opposite to compare it with , We, know truth of Eden so we can hate the lie, and we experience the light so that we know dark etc etc.

Looks like we have the same answer, but you had mre words. Adam and eve did not fail because it was expected.

[Love Omnaka

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The Garden of Eden can be suggested an open interpretation. Perhaps, without any true scriptural authority mind you, Satan led an additional rebellion or mutiny. That man chose the creation above God and his authority. Furthermore, perhaps the Garden of Eden represents a universal law or universal principle.

Maybe the "Garden of Eden" was just earth. The same place we reside now. With an animalistic mind; we humans could not have have seen it as anything other than paradise. After eating the "fruit" from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil; the simplistic view of the world of an animal would no longer be possible.

I've always seen the whole story as man's ascension from animal to "man". Armed with the "knowledge of good and evil" or really a notion of it; our outlook would be changed and be incompatible with seeing the world around us as paradise. Effectively being "cast out of the garden".

This thought also seems compatible with prehistoric human/primate eating psychedelic mushrooms(or any number or plants that would have a similar effect) as a catalyst for the evolution for modern human's mind.

Just a thought.

Edited by Mr_Snstr

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Satan cast doubts on God and God's word. Bottomline, the woman LISTENED to and obeyed the Devil and the man obeyed the woman. The Devil is very good at mixing abit of lie within a truth. Remember one third of the angels.

I'm glad there were at least one woman who didn't listen to god or man. (By the way the first real free woman wasn't Eve, but Lilith).

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Good and evil cannot exist without each others, like the positive and negative of a battery, both are needed to work, but cannot be mixed together without a burning spark like mater and antimater...

Some points in history good was more powerfull than evil, and some time evil was more powerfull, the thing is to find the right calibration between both, mankind is left to his own on this planet you chose your paths, no God or Devil has any powers over your choices, you are the one making your own choices, good or evil.

This is why some peoples are good and others are evil.

Like a wise man once said, "if everyone on this planet was good and followed the religions code to the letter, it would be a Hell to live or a very boring place."

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I do not for one moment believe the nonsense that there is an eternal battle between “GOD” and the Satan or that this being is almost Almighty “GOD”s equal. Satan can only do what God permits him to do as we read in the book of Job.

Have you ever though for a moment that God was not an entity who has concience that man did exist, that he is just a force that created the universe without knowing of the act of the creatures that crawled over the planets he created, that mankind was just a parasite eating away the healt of a world God created.

You talk about Good and Evil, but the Good and Evil from your point of view.

Do you think Pagans who worships their horned God and Goddess are evil...?

The American soldiers in Irak Killing innocent peoples (Collateral damages). are they Good or Evil.?

I think no one can give a real diffinition of Good and Evil, because it's a question of point of view, what you see as Evil might not be evil for others.

Why should someone fighting for his own freedom from invaders from another country should be seen as Evildoers like ex president Bush once said.

For myself i see some things as Evil while other things you might see as evil i think are normal actions for a human being.

When it comes to Good and Evil, peoples must keep an open mind, of course there are some actions in life wich are pure evil, like Murder, child abuse, and so on....

Good and Evil is in reality just a concept of our moral created by humans, there is really no good or evil, we have laws thar say's what is ok to do and what is not.

Very complicated topic in fact...

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When it comes to Good and Evil, peoples must keep an open mind, of course there are some actions in life wich are pure evil, like Murder, child abuse, and so on....

Good and Evil is in reality just a concept of our moral created by humans, there is really no good or evil, we have laws thar say's what is ok to do and what is not.

Very complicated topic in fact...

Excellent point. My family was severely reduced during WW2 by the dead of hitler (in particular) and staline. I always wondered if knowing what I know now, what would have been my reactions if I had faced those 2 in 1933 while caring a gun. At that time neither one had done particularly bad deeds toward my family.

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Maybe the "Garden of Eden" was just earth. The same place we reside now. With an animalistic mind; we humans could not have have seen it as anything other than paradise. After eating the "fruit" from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil; the simplistic view of the world of an animal would no longer be possible.

I've always seen the whole story as man's ascension from animal to "man". Armed with the "knowledge of good and evil" or really a notion of it; our outlook would be changed and be incompatible with seeing the world around us as paradise. Effectively being "cast out of the garden".

This thought also seems compatible with prehistoric human/primate eating psychedelic mushrooms(or any number or plants that would have a similar effect) as a catalyst for the evolution for modern human's mind.

Just a thought.

Or rather the principal, obeying God leads to life, peace, and a just civilization, disobeying God leads to death, disaster, and an immoral civilization. If we modelled our governments and laws on the Law of God there would be vast improvements. Especially if everyone loved God and if everyone loved their neighbors as themselves with a good sound conscience towards God by SERVING GOD IN EVERYTHING and PLACING GOD FIRST IN EVERY SITUATION OF THEIR LIVES.

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I'm glad there were at least one woman who didn't listen to god or man. (By the way the first real free woman wasn't Eve, but Lilith).

I know about Lilith, but she is only mentioned in the Bible once and to top it she is an evil demon, Remember in my post that started the thread I said the Garden of Eden story was most likely a mythical account of early humans interaction with GOD.

I said God is benevolent because this is the viewpoint of most religions, my idea of God is the Supreme Consciousness that pervades, the universe/s sustains matter energy and continually creates existence

By the way guys really great responses to the topic!!

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Dear OP,

I think that God does not tolerate evil per say, but he does know about it. IMO, evil exists because of satan. As far as I know, there was no evil prior to satan. Once he fell from grace and left Heaven evil was created. God is not going to let it stay that way and he will address it when he is ready to do so. Of course, it does not seem soon enough for us but we must go on believing that God has a plan and he will take action at some point in the future.

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I know about Lilith, but she is only mentioned in the Bible once and to top it she is an evil demon, Remember in my post that started the thread I said the Garden of Eden story was most likely a mythical account of early humans interaction with GOD.

I said God is benevolent because this is the viewpoint of most religions, my idea of God is the Supreme Consciousness that pervades, the universe/s sustains matter energy and continually creates existence

By the way guys really great responses to the topic!!

Actually Lilith was mentioned more than once, She had entire chapters written but all was deleted since it wasn't what the devotee wanted to hear. Or perhaps the clergy didn't want to mention She became equal to god just for refusing to be on the bottom with adam. And the myth asserts She was in the garden of eden only to assent to the "almighty".

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