thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 #1 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Was just thinking about this. If a woolly mammoth can be cloned from frozen DNA, according to Japanese scientists. My link Does that mean that we could also actually restore (a dead person) to life ? By using it's DNA ? If so, can you imagine, for example, a family that lost a very young child, like a baby. Could science restore the same baby back to life with help of the baby's DNA, so the family has the same baby back again to start over again ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rashore Posted December 29, 2011 #2 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Well, I think a problem with that would be that they wouldn't get the same baby back. The body would be a perfect clone, and that's it. The soul, mentality, personality or however you want to call it would be gone with the deceased, and a clone would have a different one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #3 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Well, I think a problem with that would be that they wouldn't get the same baby back. The body would be a perfect clone, and that's it. The soul, mentality, personality or however you want to call it would be gone with the deceased, and a clone would have a different one. True, but don't we, as parents pave the road for a child's mentality and personality, with how we treat, love and teach them ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rashore Posted December 29, 2011 #4 Share Posted December 29, 2011 True, but don't we, as parents pave the road for a child's mentality and personality, with how we treat, love and teach them ? Yes, nurture does play a role... But so does nature. If all it took was the same genetic material being treated the same, some physical identical twins would have exactly the same personality as well, and usually they don't. It is in their nature to be different, even if their nurturing is the same. We as parents may pave the road, but the child still drives their own car on it. Personally, I think cloning a person to replace a deceased is kind of morally wrong. There is good reason for birth, life, and death cycle- and if we could simply negate part of that cycle, it's likely we would value life less in general. And it's just kind of weird if a person can't get over a loss to the point that they will try anything, including cloning and forcing the resulting life to behave exactly the same as the life that is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Snstr Posted December 29, 2011 #5 Share Posted December 29, 2011 True, but don't we, as parents pave the road for a child's mentality and personality, with how we treat, love and teach them ? That's true; cloning a lost child would just be an expensive and complicated way to just have another child. Why not cut the cost and complication and do it the old fashion way; IE doin' it, horizontal tango, showin' her the O face, etc, etc, unprotected intercourse during ovulation. Though there are other applications; beside the one you mentioned. Wonder how far off we are from cloning and brain transplants... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rashore Posted December 29, 2011 #6 Share Posted December 29, 2011 We can currently successfully clone other animals. And I do believe that skin graft cloning is in it's infancy of use in the real world if I am not mistaken. Not quite cloned humans and brains yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #7 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Yes, nurture does play a role... But so does nature. If all it took was the same genetic material being treated the same, some physical identical twins would have exactly the same personality as well, and usually they don't. It is in their nature to be different, even if their nurturing is the same. We as parents may pave the road, but the child still drives their own car on it. Personally, I think cloning a person to replace a deceased is kind of morally wrong. There is good reason for birth, life, and death cycle- and if we could simply negate part of that cycle, it's likely we would value life less in general. And it's just kind of weird if a person can't get over a loss to the point that they will try anything, including cloning and forcing the resulting life to behave exactly the same as the life that is gone. I think that what happens, besides the nurture of the parents, in the direct environment of the child, like their own experiences in life and ways to deal with it eventually paves the road to their own unique mentality and personality. So i agree that the new "DNA" baby would develop it's own unique personality and mentality again. In regards to whether it is morally wrong to replace a deceased child/person by cloning ... i don't know. It might give people peace by knowing that their loved one that passed is now the "building stone" of the newborn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #8 Share Posted December 29, 2011 That's true; cloning a lost child would just be an expensive and complicated way to just have another child. Why not cut the cost and complication and do it the old fashion way; IE doin' it, horizontal tango, showin' her the O face, etc, etc, unprotected intercourse during ovulation. Though there are other applications; beside the one you mentioned. Wonder how far off we are from cloning and brain transplants... I agree Mr_Snstr, i rather favor the old fashioned way. But i was just trying to wrap my head around it to see if this would even be possible and if so, would it become an option for people in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ford Posted December 29, 2011 #9 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Hi, Quote from the OPs article:- "Researchers from Japan's Kinki University have found a way to isolate DNA from the frozen mammoth's tissue. Now they plan to insert that DNA into the egg cells of a normal, modern African elephant and then plant the resulting embryo into the elephant's womb." We could do this now to humans. Test tube babies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted December 29, 2011 #10 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Does that mean that we could also actually restore (a dead person) to life ? By using it's DNA ? If so, can you imagine, for example, a family that lost a very young child, like a baby. Could science restore the same baby back to life with help of the baby's DNA, so the family has the same baby back again to start over again ? Although Raelists believe DNA = soul, all thats happening is a clone is being made, the original is dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #11 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) Hi, Quote from the OPs article:- "Researchers from Japan's Kinki University have found a way to isolate DNA from the frozen mammoth's tissue. Now they plan to insert that DNA into the egg cells of a normal, modern African elephant and then plant the resulting embryo into the elephant's womb." We could do this now to humans. Test tube babies. Hi there Bulveye. I understand that. But test tube babies involve sperm i understand. In this case, it will be done with DNA from a deceased person. Edited December 29, 2011 by thedutchiedutch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #12 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Although Raelists believe DNA = soul, all thats happening is a clone is being made, the original is dead. True, but do you think that some parents might find it favorable to have a newborn that looks exactly like their deceased one. Maybe just the thought that the newborn was made out of/and thanks to the deceased one might be comforting for them. Or is this just to morbid an wrong you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted December 29, 2011 #13 Share Posted December 29, 2011 True, but do you think that some parents might find it favorable to have a newborn that looks exactly like their deceased one. Maybe just the thought that the newborn was made out of/and thanks to the deceased one might be comforting for them. Or is this just to morbid an wrong you think. To be honest I don't see the point in cloning their dead child. It sounds like the parents are after a superficial replacement and not an individual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purplos Posted December 29, 2011 #14 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Any parent who wants to clone their deceased child will have expectations of the clone being just like their former child, I would imagine. Why else would they do it? Those kind of expectations placed on a child would create, in my opinion, an awful environment to grow up in. Seeking to bring your dead child back to life seems like something to discuss with a psychiatrist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Right Wing Posted December 29, 2011 #15 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Was just thinking about this. If a woolly mammoth can be cloned from frozen DNA, according to Japanese scientists. My link Does that mean that we could also actually restore (a dead person) to life ? By using it's DNA ? If so, can you imagine, for example, a family that lost a very young child, like a baby. Could science restore the same baby back to life with help of the baby's DNA, so the family has the same baby back again to start over again ? Cloning Jesus from one of his blood cells? Wont it be strange if man resurrections Christ through cloning technology. Even stranger we'll get our answer to if the mind is totally stored in the brain. If it isnt we might get a Jesus complete with memories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Snstr Posted December 29, 2011 #16 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) I agree Mr_Snstr, i rather favor the old fashioned way. But i was just trying to wrap my head around it to see if this would even be possible and if so, would it become an option for people in the future. I'm sure it's totally possible. There's probably a working model for the process already; though it probably hasn't been applied to humans so much. As far as an option goes; even if you take the notion of ethics out of the equation, it just seems overly complicated and pointless compared to just having another child the normal way. Why clone a lost child; why not clone yourself and raise yourself from childhood? Imagine trying to explain that to your wife. "Honey, how about for our kids we just use my genetic material? If you loved me as much as you say you do then this should be what you want too. I literally can't be any more inside you than this... ". 1000th Post; I need to get a life. Edited December 29, 2011 by Mr_Snstr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Snstr Posted December 29, 2011 #17 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Cloning Jesus from one of his blood cells? Wont it be strange if man resurrections Christ through cloning technology. Even stranger we'll get our answer to if the mind is totally stored in the brain. If it isnt we might get a Jesus complete with memories. "It took you people this long to resurrect me?! I figured yall would've all come together and developed a technological utopia in a couple hundred years, tops. What have you all been doing with my teachings this whole time? ... sweet me this is awful, all wrong, all wrong, kill me now." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paracelse Posted December 29, 2011 #18 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) scientists are already looking into cloning Neanderthals, something I think is utterly wrong. Neanderthals are humans but in the case of cloning they would be considered as animals and locked in zoo or in science labs. http://www.archaeology.org/1003/etc/neanderthals.html Edited December 29, 2011 by Paracelse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #19 Share Posted December 29, 2011 To be honest I don't see the point in cloning their dead child. It sounds like the parents are after a superficial replacement and not an individual. Exactly. I agree. A replacement. But i honestly think that if this would be an option in the near future, we would be surprised as in how many people would go for this option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Right Wing Posted December 29, 2011 #20 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) "It took you people this long to resurrect me?! I figured yall would've all come together and developed a technological utopia in a couple hundred years, tops. What have you all been doing with my teachings this whole time? ... sweet me this is awful, all wrong, all wrong, kill me now." Or he pretends to be good, gets crowned leader then goes nuts over the bad treatment and cruxifiction. Maybe a cloned Christ is Satan? Edited December 29, 2011 by Mr Right Wing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Snstr Posted December 29, 2011 #21 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Or he pretends to be good, gets crowned leader then goes nuts over the bad treatment and cruxifiction. Many a cloned Christ is Satan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #22 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Any parent who wants to clone their deceased child will have expectations of the clone being just like their former child, I would imagine. Why else would they do it? Those kind of expectations placed on a child would create, in my opinion, an awful environment to grow up in. Seeking to bring your dead child back to life seems like something to discuss with a psychiatrist. Hi Purplos. Thanks for your input. You mean that people would expect that child to behave exactly the same as the deceased child. They should know that would be impossible. If they would conceive another child, would they expect that child to behave exactly the same as their previous child ? I can see your point and i do believe that some people will have those expectations and that would be wrong and unfair/unhealthy for the child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedutchiedutch Posted December 29, 2011 Author #23 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Cloning Jesus from one of his blood cells? Wont it be strange if man resurrections Christ through cloning technology. Even stranger we'll get our answer to if the mind is totally stored in the brain. If it isnt we might get a Jesus complete with memories. Hi Mr Right Wing. That would be very interesting to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilly Posted December 29, 2011 #24 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Think of it this way, are identical twins one in the same person? Do both identical twins have the exact same personality? The answer (as most of us already know) is a resounding "no". Cloning is akin to creating an identical twin, another person with the same DNA, but not the same person. When a person dies they die, you can't "get them back" via cloning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taun Posted December 29, 2011 #25 Share Posted December 29, 2011 If my understanding of genetics and cloning tech is right.. just because you clone someone (if that were possible) it would not necessarily look like the original... There is too much natural variation in an individuals DNA to make an exact 100% copy... Yeah, they might have some of the features of the original, but not be a 'photocopy'... I know Hollywood always has clones looking 100% like the original.. but so far as I know it is not what would happen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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