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Ashotep

London cops accused of racist stop-and-search

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Europe ruled it illegal, but police in Britain continue to stop and search people whenever and wherever they like, with little grounds for suspicion. The area of society which finds itself most often targeted believes there is only one reason for it.Read More Here

It seems stuff like this is going on everywhere. Have you been a victim of this type of search?

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Nothing as serious as this, but on certain days when dressed down and kind of scruffy I have been asked for ID at certain retail outlets when presenting a debit card. I can see how the youth feel, it wasn't pleasant to reach back into my wallet and provide a drivers license. I think next time I'll tell the clerk I have no ID and then file a complaint with the manager.

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And Russians arnt racists... <_<

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This bit made me lol :-

“One of the things that caused it was policing, the way the police talk to them, the overuse of stop and search, and a sense that the police are institutionally against young urban people and probably institutionally racist as well,” states Diane Abbott, MP from the Labour Party. ....(& sometime racist).

And also :-

"Eighty-five per cent of rioters cited anger at police as their reason for violence in a recent study by The Guardian newspaper." .....so looting wide screen t.vs & trainers had nothing to do with it. It's the lameass lefty sort of analysis we come to expect from the Guardian.

Perhaps if black kids in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search.

Edited by itsnotoutthere

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This bit made me lol :-

“One of the things that caused it was policing, the way the police talk to them, the overuse of stop and search, and a sense that the police are institutionally against young urban people and probably institutionally racist as well,” states Diane Abbott, MP from the Labour Party. ....(& sometime racist).

And also :-

"Eighty-five per cent of rioters cited anger at police as their reason for violence in a recent study by The Guardian newspaper." .....so looting wide screen t.vs & trainers had nothing to do with it. It's the lameass lefty sort of analysis we come to expect from the Guardian.

Perhaps if black kids in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search.

:tu::tu::tu::tu::tu:

Is it cos i is black...........

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And Russians arnt racists... <_<

They are probably as racist as everyone else but this article isn't about them. If you find an article on racism in Russia please post it.

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If you have nothing to hide, then why worry about the police looking in your pockets. Just think they may stop a person that could mug and stab you later!!

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This bit made me lol :-

“One of the things that caused it was policing, the way the police talk to them, the overuse of stop and search, and a sense that the police are institutionally against young urban people and probably institutionally racist as well,” states Diane Abbott, MP from the Labour Party. ....(& sometime racist).

And also :-

"Eighty-five per cent of rioters cited anger at police as their reason for violence in a recent study by The Guardian newspaper." .....so looting wide screen t.vs & trainers had nothing to do with it. It's the lameass lefty sort of analysis we come to expect from the Guardian.

Perhaps if black kids in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search.

Haha hit the nail on the head!!!!!:sk

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I've seen reporting on this type of stop and search in NYC. Seems their not finding any terrorists but are making a huge amount of income for the city in fines and court costs for..wait for it... MARIJUANA possession. Because of where the policing is done the majority of the arrested are racial minorities. My only problem with it is the use of the "terrorist" bugaboo. just tell the truth - we're looking to make money for the city.

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I have read many threads on UM and come across many views, opinons and statements that range from absurd to illogical but I am more shocked by some of the comments in this thread.

Perhaps if black kids in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search.

Hi itsnotoutthere,

Is this a joke I have overlooked? A light hearted quip about the state of inner city London maybe?

I am puzzled by your response, wouldn't "Perhaps if people in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search" be more suitable?

I live in London and come across just as many white and asian 'teenage thugs' as I do black 'teenage thugs'. I would really like to know if your statement meant 'only black kids stab each other in London'?

I have jumped on peoples comments in forums before and been mistaken (if this is the case I apologise), but otherwise I think you need to adjust your opinion of black kids.

Edit for spelling and grammar.

Edited by Junior Chubb

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If you have nothing to hide, then why worry about the police looking in your pockets. Just think they may stop a person that could mug and stab you later!!

It's degrading. Isn't a Brit who said something of like: All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. By letting cops search you without probable cause or a search warrant you are in the "good men do nothing" crowd Edmund was mentioning.

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Im surprised that London has police on normal street patrols...only ones i ever see are sat on motorways in expensive and powerful cars...disgust.gif

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I have read many threads on UM and come across many views, opinons and statements that range from absurd to illogical but I am more shocked by some of the comments in this thread.

Hi itsnotoutthere,

Is this a joke I have overlooked? A light hearted quip about the state of inner city London maybe?

I am puzzled by your response, wouldn't "Perhaps if people in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search" be more suitable?

I live in London and come across just as many white and asian 'teenage thugs' as I do black 'teenage thugs'. I would really like to know if your statement meant 'only black kids stab each other in London'?

I have jumped on peoples comments in forums before and been mistaken (if this is the case I apologise), but otherwise I think you need to adjust your opinion of black kids.

Edit for spelling and grammar.

And perhaps you should use the google search engine to investigate the surge in black on black (gangsta) stabbings in london in the last ten years or so.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/7856404/Police-statistics-shed-fresh-light-on-link-between-crime-and-race.html

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/hypocrisy-surrounding-black-crime-london-p-687.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/personal-view/3637720/It-is-time-to-be-honest-about-black-crime.html

Edited by itsnotoutthere

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http://www.citizensreportuk.org/reports/teenage-murder-london.html

http://www.citizensreportuk.org/news/2011/02/20/disproportionality-of-black-african-and-black-caribbean-youth-victims-of-serious-violence-murder-and-gbh-in-london/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/black-people-are-four-times-more-likely-to-be-murdered-475754.html

Just a few snippets from the last link for you chubb. :-

"Black people in London are four times more likely to be murder victims than white people, with those responsible for the murders and manslaughters also far more likely to be black. Homicide suspects are 12 times more likely to be black than white, in proportion to London's population."

"The study, which covers cases of all unlawful killings, found that people from an African and Caribbean background were disproportionately likely to be both victims and suspects. Of the 163 homicides in London in the year to April 2006, there were 50 black victims, 72 white, and 23 Asian. Other ethnic minority groups make up the remainder. This compares to a population in the capital in which black people account for 11 per cent, Indian and Pakistanis for 12 per cent and white Europeans for 74 per cent."

"Part of the explanation for such a high number of black victims and suspects is the continuing rivalry between crack cocaine gangs. The shooting of drug dealers and innocent bystanders accounts for, on average, 13 homicides per year."

So it's not just me telling you the awful truth, but if you wish to live in a state of denial that's entirely up to you.

Edited by itsnotoutthere

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Its so unfortunate. Although minorities do seem to have a higher rate of crime. It does tend to become a vicious cycle. Perhaps they feel there is no fairness. Even if they are decent. They are treated like criminals anyway. Reminds me of some of the men I've heard say. "If she thinks I'm cheating anyway, I might as well do it." Or such things. Crime is crime. And use of crime to commit more crime is weird.

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http://www.citizensr...der-london.html

http://www.citizensr...-gbh-in-london/

http://www.independe...red-475754.html

Just a few snippets from the last link for you chubb. :-

"Black people in London are four times more likely to be murder victims than white people, with those responsible for the murders and manslaughters also far more likely to be black. Homicide suspects are 12 times more likely to be black than white, in proportion to London's population."

"The study, which covers cases of all unlawful killings, found that people from an African and Caribbean background were disproportionately likely to be both victims and suspects. Of the 163 homicides in London in the year to April 2006, there were 50 black victims, 72 white, and 23 Asian. Other ethnic minority groups make up the remainder. This compares to a population in the capital in which black people account for 11 per cent, Indian and Pakistanis for 12 per cent and white Europeans for 74 per cent."

"Part of the explanation for such a high number of black victims and suspects is the continuing rivalry between crack cocaine gangs. The shooting of drug dealers and innocent bystanders accounts for, on average, 13 homicides per year."

So it's not just me telling you the awful truth, but if you wish to live in a state of denial that's entirely up to you.

I recently watched one of those 'fly on the wall' documentries following an ER department in a London inner city hospital and the nurses and doctors were having to bring in extra security to protect blacks that had been stabbed/shot by blacks so that they didn't come into the hospital wards to get revenge... it's was like watching a war zone. Very sad indeed to see such hatred :(

Edited by Star of the Sea

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I've been stopped and quizzed by police officers a few times. Been searched too, and although I was completely innocent and wasn't exactly pleased at the time, on reflection they were just doing their jobs. No need to be playing the victim. Would we rather the cops stopped quizzing and searching people they believe look suspicious?

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http://www.citizensr...der-london.html

http://www.citizensr...-gbh-in-london/

http://www.independe...red-475754.html

Just a few snippets from the last link for you chubb. :-

"Black people in London are four times more likely to be murder victims than white people, with those responsible for the murders and manslaughters also far more likely to be black. Homicide suspects are 12 times more likely to be black than white, in proportion to London's population."

"The study, which covers cases of all unlawful killings, found that people from an African and Caribbean background were disproportionately likely to be both victims and suspects. Of the 163 homicides in London in the year to April 2006, there were 50 black victims, 72 white, and 23 Asian. Other ethnic minority groups make up the remainder. This compares to a population in the capital in which black people account for 11 per cent, Indian and Pakistanis for 12 per cent and white Europeans for 74 per cent."

"Part of the explanation for such a high number of black victims and suspects is the continuing rivalry between crack cocaine gangs. The shooting of drug dealers and innocent bystanders accounts for, on average, 13 homicides per year."

So it's not just me telling you the awful truth, but if you wish to live in a state of denial that's entirely up to you.

Thanks for the links, some very interesting reading. I was aware of the basic gist of your links (Black people in London are more likely to be murder victims than white people, people from an African and Caribbean background were disproportionately likely to be both victims and suspects) so no denial as far as that is concerned, just a bit surer of the figures and maybe some of the reasons too. There are some undeniable facts and I have no issues with them at all. The way you posted your original comment didn't seem to be telling an 'awful truth', more jokingly pointing at skin colour.

Your comment started with a 'lol' reference.

This bit made me lol :-

"One of the things that caused it was policing, the way the police talk to them, the overuse of stop and search, and a sense that the police are institutionally against young urban people and probably institutionally racist as well," states Diane Abbott, MP from the Labour Party. ....(& sometime racist).

Midly amusing (mixed feelings on this). Then followed with what seems to be another 'lol' (And also).

And also :-

"Eighty-five per cent of rioters cited anger at police as their reason for violence in a recent study by The Guardian newspaper." .....so looting wide screen t.vs & trainers had nothing to do with it. It's the lameass lefty sort of analysis we come to expect from the Guardian.

Your right, very amusing.

Then to follow this with the statement I questioned...

Perhaps if black kids in London stopped stabbing each other for a while the police might have less reason to stop & search.

...seems you may be taking a lighthearted approach when making this statement (hence the 'Is this a joke?' comment). Your knowledge on the subject shows this is not the case. This statement (on its own which is how it was presented, a note added to a humorous post) comes across as short sighted (IMO). You must realise an unsupported comment like that will upset some readers. This is different from upsetting someone who does not agree with a theory or an idea, your statement was blunt and targeted at a specific group of people who have no means of choosing or leaving that group.Are you saying that skin colour is more of a dominant factor in your mental development and decision making than environment (some of your linked articles chose environment) does? That is the impression I got. I hear comments like this from people face to face and it usually comes with an underlying menace. I hope this is not the case here.

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Yes, i do come across as blunt sometimes. But i do get fed up with 'pussyfooting' around a serious subject for fear of 'upsetting' someone & this snippet from the last link shows the harm that can do :-

Just as using the word "black" in this context is to lay oneself open to the smear of racism, any perceptible targeting of black youths for particular attention by the police lays officers open to career-ending disciplinary procedures.

The "sus" laws, which allowed officers to stop and search people on suspicion of carrying weapons or drugs, were scrapped because they were said to be a form of racial harassment.

That was the beginning of what became a systematic programme of denial, the ultimate consequence of which was that blameless black people were left unprotected in effectively unpoliced neighbourhoods, and that many black mothers were left to grieve for their sons.

When your child has been shot, having droves of police combing the scene for forensic evidence after the event must offer little comfort.

Edited by itsnotoutthere

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Yes, i do come across as blunt sometimes. But i do get fed up with 'pussyfooting' around a serious subject for fear of 'upsetting' someone & this snippet from the last link shows the harm that can do :-

Just as using the word "black" in this context is to lay oneself open to the smear of racism, any perceptible targeting of black youths for particular attention by the police lays officers open to career-ending disciplinary procedures.

The "sus" laws, which allowed officers to stop and search people on suspicion of carrying weapons or drugs, were scrapped because they were said to be a form of racial harassment.

That was the beginning of what became a systematic programme of denial, the ultimate consequence of which was that blameless black people were left unprotected in effectively unpoliced neighbourhoods, and that many black mothers were left to grieve for their sons.

When your child has been shot, having droves of police combing the scene for forensic evidence after the event must offer little comfort.

:tu:

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A couple of years ago in - Cincinnati - I think... police were basically banned from some neighborhoods due to a police shooting that was deemed illegal. Justifiable anger but it lead to a frenzy of lawlessness that had the police unwilling to come in and help. Eventually they did go back at the request of the populace. Relations improved much in the aftermath. My point is that it takes compromise and understanding between the cops and the citizens for community policing to work well.

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A couple of years ago in - Cincinnati - I think... police were basically banned from some neighborhoods due to a police shooting that was deemed illegal. Justifiable anger but it lead to a frenzy of lawlessness that had the police unwilling to come in and help. Eventually they did go back at the request of the populace. Relations improved much in the aftermath. My point is that it takes compromise and understanding between the cops and the citizens for community policing to work well.

Or people can simply obey the law of the land and more importantly take responsibility for their own actions...rather than blame the world

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Or people can simply obey the law of the land and more importantly take responsibility for their own actions...rather than blame the world

That too...but I WAS talking about Cincinnati :w00t:

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That too...but I WAS talking about Cincinnati :w00t:

fair enough but the comment I made isn't restricted to London. :rolleyes:

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Nothing as serious as this, but on certain days when dressed down and kind of scruffy I have been asked for ID at certain retail outlets when presenting a debit card. I can see how the youth feel, it wasn't pleasant to reach back into my wallet and provide a drivers license. I think next time I'll tell the clerk I have no ID and then file a complaint with the manager.

I imagine that would be quite traumatizing.

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