Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 11
Abramelin

Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood [Part 2]

6,100 posts in this topic

one of Tony Steele's? fam's

That is Tony Steal himself.

He has no Fams.

-

"if Fryans were in Near Krekaland it's possible they shared this word - then it passed into Latin as a clothing item that went to your/around your neck"

I concur.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is Tony Steal himself.

He has no Fams.

-

"if Fryans were in Near Krekaland it's possible they shared this word - then it passed into Latin as a clothing item that went to your/around your neck"

I concur.

:w00t:

:tu:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
NÉDGJA => nodigen, noden, noodzaken, dwingen (to force someone)

source: gtb.inl.nl/nodigen

Oldfrisian dictionary - Hettema (1832): nedga, neda, nedera, nednima

This got me thinking something that might prove significant.

NÉD in OLB is both need (Dutch: nood; German: not) and not-have (NE-HÉD).

Let's first have a look at oldschool etymology.

etymonline/need

need (n.)

Old English nied (West Saxon), ned (Mercian) "necessity, compulsion, duty; hardship, distress; errand, business," originally "violence, force," from Proto-Germanic *nauthis (cf. Old Saxon nod, Old Norse nauðr, Old Frisian ned, Middle Dutch, Dutch nood, Old High German not, German Not, Gothic nauþs "need"), probably cognate with Old Prussian nautin "need," and perhaps with Old Church Slavonic nazda, Russian nuzda, Polish nędza "misery, distress," from PIE *nau- "death, to be exhausted" (see narwhal).

The more common Old English word for "need, necessity, want" was ðearf, but they were connected via a notion of "trouble, pain," and the two formed a compound, niedðearf "need, necessity, compulsion, thing needed." Nied also might have been influenced by Old English neod "desire, longing," which often was spelled the same. Common in Old English compounds, e.g. niedfaru "compulsory journey," a euphemism for "death;" niedhæmed "rape," the second element being an Old English word meaning "sexual intercourse;" niedling "slave." Meaning "extreme poverty, destitution" is from c.1200.

etymologiebank/nood

nood zn. ‘gevaar; behoefte, gebrek’

Onl. nōt ‘gevaar; ellende, pijn; dwang’ in de samenstelling nodfyr ‘vuur ter afwending van onheil’ [eind 8e eeuw; CG II-1, 16], hiz duot mir michol nood ‘het doet mij veel pijn’ [ca. 1100; Will.], that thie uile unsculdige lîude uer tholodon so manige node ‘dat die volkomen onschuldige mensen zoveel ellende doormaakten’, ane not ‘zonder dwang’ [beide 1151-1200; Reimbibel]; mnl. síjn herte dat leet grote noet ‘zijn hart leed veel smart’, hi ulo dur die noet ‘hij vluchtte vanwege het gevaar’ [beide 1220-40; VMNW], hebbe his nod ‘als hij er behoefte aan heeft’ [1236; VMNW], noot ‘noodzaak’ [1240; Bern.].

Os. nōd (mnd. nōt); ohd. nōt (nhd. Not); ofri. nēd (nfri. need); oe. nēd, nīed (ne. need); on. nauðr (nzw. nöd); got. nauþs; alle ‘nood, gevaar, noodzaak, dwang, plicht e.d.’, < pgm. *naudi-, met grammatische wisseling uit *nauþí-.

Verwant met: Oudpruisisch nautin ‘nood’; Litouws nõvyti ‘kwellen’, Oudkerkslavisch naviti ‘vermoeien’ (Tsjechisch unavit); Oudiers núne ‘hongersnood’, Welsh newyn ‘id.’, Cornish naun ‘id.’; < pie. *nou-ti- (IEW 756). Mogelijk verder verwant met: Oudnoords nár ‘lijk’, Gotisch naus ‘id.’; Lets nâve ‘dood’, nâvêt ‘doden’; Oudrussisch navĭ ‘lijk’ (Russisch nav' ‘geest van overledene’); < pie. *neh2u-.

In de Oudgermaanse talen heeft dit woord al naast elkaar betekenissen als ‘ellende’, ‘dwang’ en ‘behoefte’. De oorspr. betekenisontwikkeling is niet helemaal duidelijk; de verwante niet-Germaanse woorden suggereren een oorspr. betekenis ‘ellende, kwelling’.

Als productief eerste lid komt nood voor in de betekenis ‘tijdelijk, als reserve’ in bijv. noodgebouw, noodreparatie, nooduitgang; de betekenis ‘behoefte’ in bijv. met een noodgang, hoge nood hebben, (BN) nood hebben aan en in de afleiding nodig.

=> "the original development of meaning is not all clear"

need - english

nood - dutch

not - german

nöd - swedish

not - english

niet - dutch

nicht - german

.

In the 41 fragments below varieties of the word NÉD are distributed as follows (# = fragment numbers):

NÉD = need (noun)

#1,2,3,7,8,9,10

NÉDICH = needy (adj.)

#4,15,36

NÉDLIK = needlike (adj.)

#27,30,37

in wordcombinations

NÉDTHREFTUM = necessaries

#9

NÉD.BAN = need-ban (emergency-decree)

#13

NÉD.FJURA = need-fires (emergency-fires)

#26

NÉD.HUSA = need-houses (emergency-houses)

#29

HONGERNÉDE = hunger-need (famine)

#40

as verb: NE-HA (not-have)

NÉDON NÉN = (n-)had no

#5,19,31

NÉDE NÉN/NA/NAVT/NINMER/NARNE/NAWET = (n-)had no/not/never/nowhere/nothing

#6,11,12,14(3x),16,17,18,22,23,24,25,32,33,34,35(2x),39,41

NÉDEN NÉN = (n-)had not

#20

NÉDIM NÉNE = (n-)had him no

#28

other verbs

NÉDGJA = to rape, force (Dutch: nodigen, dwingen)

#21

UTNÉDA = invite (Dutch: uitnodigen)

#38

.

Sometimes, NÉDE NÉN can both be translated as "(n-)had no", asa well as "needed no"; see fragments #5,6,33 (we had no wars => we needed no wars /// we had no slaves => we needed no slaves)

.

FRAGMENTS

.

1 [011/18]

SAHWERSA THJU NÉD ÀRG SY

[O-S p.19]

Zoo wanneer de nood erg is

When in dire distress [the need is bad]

2 [014/17]

KVMTH NÉD ÀND TVANG VS SETMA TO JÉVANE

[O-S p.23]

Komt nood en dwang ons inzettingen te geven

If by force or necessity... [:if need and force come...]

3 [014/29]

SVNDER NÉD ÀND TVANG

[O-S p.25]

zonder nood en dwang

except from absolute necessity [:without need and force]

4 [018/26]

IS.T NÉDICH ÉN ÀND TWINTICH WYKA LONG

[O-S p.29]

zoo het noodig is, eenentwintig weken lang

if necessary [:needy], for twenty-one weeks

5 [021/18]

THÉRVMBE NÉDON WI ÁK NÉN ORLOCH

[O-S p.33]

Daarom hadden [:noden] wij ook geen oorlog

and [therefore] we had no [also needed no] wars

6 [039/14]

HJA SPÉRDON THAT WI NÉN SLAVONA NÉDE

[O-S p.57]

zij bespeurden dat wij geene slaven hadden [:noden]

they discovered that we had [:needed] no slaves

7 [044/07]

NÉD WAS KVMEN AN SIN STÉD

[O-S p.65]

nood was in zijne plaats gekomen

famine came [need had come] in its place

8 [044/18]

HO NÉD THÉR SIN SÉTEL VPSTÀLTH HÉDE

[O-S p.65]

hoe de nood daar zijn zetel had opgesteld

what misery was there [how need had placed his seat there]

9 [044/20]

EN WÉIN FOL NÉDTHREFTUM THÉR HI NÉD MITH FON THÉRE HÉRD OF DRIWE

[O-S p.65]

een wagen vol nooddruftigheden, waarmede hij den nood van den haard verdreef

a waggon-load of necessaries to relieve their distress

10 [054/11]

AL HWAT WI DÉN HÀVE IS UT NÉD DÉN

[O-S p.77]

al wat wij gedaan hebben, is uit nood gedaan

all that we have done was done from necessity [:need]

11 [059/25]

SA MÀN HJA NINMER NÉDE SJAN

[O-S p.83]

gelijk men ze nimmer gezien had

such as [one] had never been seen before

12 [062/25]

MIN.ERVA NÉDE THÉR NÉN WIT FON

[O-S p.89]

Minerva had daar geen weet van

Min-erva did not mind [:have wit of] that

13 [066/21]

ÀND LÉT EN MÉNA NÉD.BAN UTKÈTHA

[O-S p.93]

en liet een algemeene noodban uitroepen

to call a general levy [:need-...?]

14 [068/07]

THÀT KÉM ÉNIS DÉLIS.

THAT HJU NÉN MAR BURGA NÉDE.

TWÍAS THAT HJU THÉR NÉN BURCH.FÁNNA NÉDE

ÀND THRÍAS THRVCHDAM HJU NÉN EFTE FODDIK NAVT NÉDE.

[O-S p.95]

dat kwam eensdeels,

omdat zij geen burgten meer hadden,

anderdeels omdat zij daar geene burgtmaagden hadden

en in de derde plaats omdat zij geene echte lamp hadden.

partly

because they no longer had any citadel[-s];

secondly, because they had there no Burgtmaagden;

and thirdly, because they had no real lamps.

15 [069/14]

SKIL BY SKIN NÉN FRÉSE TOFARA FORSTUM NACH PRESTERUM NÉDICH WÉSA

[O-S p.97]

zal misschien geene vrees voor vorsten of priesters noodig wezen

we need not perhaps have any fear of princes or priests [:perhaps no fear of princes or priests shall be needy]

16 [075/13]

AS WI NÉN HÉDON ÀND TO FARA NIMMER NÉDE SJAN

[O-S p.105]

als wij er geen hadden, en te voren nimmer hadden gezien

than any that we possessed [:as we had not] or had ever seen [:and had never seen before]

17 [080/03]

THA DÉNEMARKAR NÉDE NARNE ÁRA NEI

[O-S p.111]

de Denemarkers hadden nergens ooren naar

the Denmarkers paid no attention [:had no ears] to her

18 [080/25]

THA GRÉVA NÉDON SELVA NAWET

[O-S p.111]

de graven hadden zelve niets

the counts had nothing to give [themselves]

19 [081/13]

THAT HJA NÉN GODA WÉPNE NAVT NÉDON

[O-S p.113]

dat zij geene goede wapenen hadden

As they had no good weapons

20 [082/16]

THRVCHDAM THA WÉRE NAVT NÉN GODE WACHT HALDEN NÉDEN

[O-S p.115]

omdat de krijgslieden geene goede wacht gehouden hadden

As the guard had not kept a good watch

21 [082/22]

ÁND WILDE HJA NÉDGJA

[O-S p.115]

en wilde haar geweld aandoen [:nodigen, verkrachten]

and would have done her violence [and wanted to rape her]

22 [083/06]

SÁ HÁCH AS HJU TOFARA NA NÉDE KENTH

[O-S p.115]

zoo hoog als zij nooit te voren gekend had

higher than she had ever done before [as high as she had not known before]

23 [087/26]

BIRA LÉVA NÉDE THJU MODER HJRA FOLGSTERE NAVT NOMTH

[O-S p.123]

Bij haar leven had de Moeder hare opvolgster niet genoemd

[by her life] The mother had not named her successor

24 [088/27]

AS MÀ TO FORA NA NÉDE SJAN

[O-S p.123]

als men er nooit te voren gezien had

than had ever been seen there before [as one had not seen before]

25 [093/22]

NINMAN NÉDE DIGER THAN TO ÁKANE SINA NOCHT

[O-S p.131]

niemand had zorg dan zijn vermaak na te jagen

no one thought of anything but diversion [no one had priority but to get his pleasure]

26 [093/29]

THA STRANDWÁKAR WÉRON FON HJARA NÉD.FJURA HLÁPEN

[O-S p.131]

De strandwakers waren van hunne noodvuren weggeloopen

The coastguard deserted their beacons [had walked from their needfires]

27 [103/04]

ALLER.WÉIKES WÉR ET NÉDLIK SY

[O-S p.143]

allerwege, waar het noodig [noodlijk] is

everywhere where it is necessary [needlike]

28 [103/32]

WR.ALDA NÉDIM NÉNE HELPE LÉNAD

[O-S p.143]

Wralda had hem geene hulp verleend

Wr-alda had given him no help

29 [107/23]

THRIJA TWILIF NÉD.HUSA

[O-S p.149]

drie maal twaalf noodhuizen

thirty-six refuge-houses [:three x twelve needhouses]

30 [108/23]

ALLERLÉJA THINGA THÉR HJAM NÉDLIK SEND

[O-S p.149]

allerhande dingen die haar noodig zijn

all that may be necessary [:needlike] for them

31 [117/20]

IN 282 JÉR NÉDON WI NÉN ÉRE.MODER NAVT HAT

[O-S p.161]

In 282 jaren hadden wij geene Eeremoeder gehad

For 282 years we had not had an Eeremoeder

32 [128/07]

FRISO NÉDE NACH NÉN FRÉTHE

[O-S p.175]

Friso had nog geen vrede

Friso was not yet satisfied [had no peace yet]

33 [128/27]

THRVCHDAN WI NÉNE SLÁVONA NAVT NÉDE

[O-S p.175]

omdat wij geene slaven hadden [:noden]

because we had [:needed] no slaves

34 [136/10]

HWÉRVPPA NIMMAN RÉKNED NÉDE

[O-S p.185]

waar niemand op gerekend had

which nobody had reckoned upon

35 [145/15]

THACH NÉDE HJU NÉN LJUCHT NER KLÁRHÉD IN THJUSE SÉKE NE FVNDEN. THÉRVMBE NÉDE HJU NÉNE MOD HÁN

[O-S p.197]

toch had zij geen licht noch helderheid in deze zaak gevonden; daarom had zij geen moed gehad

yet she had been unable to see any light or way out of this affair [:yet she had not found any light nor clarity in this affair]; therefore she had not had the courage

36 [145/29]

AS.ER NÉDICH HÉDE

[O-S p.199]

als hij noodig had

as he required [:had needy]

37 [149/25]

ALSA FAR WÉR.SKÉPA HOF ÀND NÉDLIK SÍ

[O-S p.203]

gelijk het voor krijgsschepen noodig en nuttig [behoeftig en benodigd] is

as is necessary and useful [:needlike] for men-of-war [war- or defence-ships]

38 [149/29]

HI WILDE AL VSA SÉ.KÀMPAR UTNÉDA

[O-S p.203]

hij wilde al onze zeekampers uitnoodigen

he wanted to engage [:invite] all our sea rovers

39 [156/31]

THACH HJA NÉDE NAVT NE HÉRED

[O-S p.211]

doch zij hadden niet geluisterd [:gehoord]

but they did not listen [:had not heared]

40 [165/25]

THISA HONGERNÉDE

[O-S p.223]

Deze hongersnood

The famines [:this hungerneed]

41 [198/15]

THAT.ER NÉNE MIDLE NAVT NÉDE

[O-S p.239]

dat hij geene middelen bezat [:had]

that they had no means

Edited by gestur

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
That is Tony Steal himself.

Also note that he was banned from that forum.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also note that he was banned from that forum.

Yes, I did note that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So "neuken" has an oldnorse equivalent.

That does not mean "neuken" is related to Oldfrisian NÉDGJA (nedga, neda, etc.)

I was thinking of the Frisian habit to change a -K- or sometimes -G- for -T- or -TSY-

I don't think 'neuken' is related to 'geneugte' (EN: pleasure) as you suggested earlier.

According to the Dutch etymology site it has to do with punch, pull, jerk

According to De Vries : on. (Old Norse) hnykkja, 'pull towards oneself'

It is an act of aggression.

.

Edited by Abramelin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok then we are not allowed by your reckoning to play around with the meaning behind the words.. so by your way what does that sentence say , word for word ?

Hwil that alrek drok to Kaempane were................................You say it says

while that every or to .............................what did the whole of the sentence say word for word.. and does it make sense , or do you need to interpret it ??

what is the (or to ) doing there it does not help make sense of the sentence ?? alrek means every , drok means or .

Drok means DRUK = BUSY.

Not "OR".

You need to read the words in their context, not just go around searching for words that look somewhat similar.

Hwil that alrek drok to kaempane wêre, was thêr en wla Fin to thêre flête jefta bedrum fon thêre Moder inglupth, ând wilde hja nêdgja.

Sandbach:

While the fight was going on, a rascally Finn stole into the chamber of the mother, and would have done her violence.

Hwil that alrek drok to kaempane wêre, was thêr en wla Fin to thêre flête jefta bedrum fon thêre Moder inglupth, ând wilde hja nêdgja.

My translation:

Wijl dat elk druk te kampen waren, was daar een vuile Fin die der vleet of slaapkamer van de Moeder inglipte, ende wilde haar neuken/verkrachten.

While everyone (ALREK) was busy (DROK) fighting, there was a dirty Fin who had sneaked into the house, or (JEFTA) bedroom (BEDRVM), of the Mother and wanted to f_ /rape her.

.

Edited by Abramelin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Using a form of gibberish Old Dutch, and using Old Frisian (10th to 12th century) and Old English, and Old German and Old Norse I can translate and make sense of the OLB language.

I don't need words borrowed from Iranian, Sanskrit, Greek, and so on.

.

Edited by Abramelin
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Using a form of gibberish Old Dutch, and using Old Frisian (10th to 12th century) and Old English, and Old German and Old Norse I can translate and make sense of the OLB language.

I don't need words borrowed from Iranian, Sanskrit, Greek, and so on.

.

No words should be borrowed unless it's a foreign place name or something else viable to be an introduced word.

That's why it's important to break down words like tohnekka.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No words should be borrowed unless it's a foreign place name or something else viable to be an introduced word.

That's why it's important to break down words like tohnekka.

I'll go with the idea it's a borrowing from Latin, and that Latin borrowed it from Aramaic or Hebrew:

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=227240&st=3225#entry4716524

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hwand alrek werte arge that-er him master skolde makja boppa heth rjucht and welda e-lik tha slavona keninggar..........Sandbach translates as.

because everyone was afraid that he would set himself up above the law , and rule them like the slave kings.

is arge angry or afraid??

and whats your thoughts , does it say slave kings , or slavic kings , and does it mean the slavona were all slaves ?? and does the word boppa mean pope ??

Edited by NO-ID-EA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
as verb: NE-HA (not-have)

NÉDON NÉN = (n-)had no

#5,19,31

NÉDE NÉN/NA/NAVT/NINMER/NARNE/NAWET = (n-)had no/not/never/nowhere/nothing

#6,11,12,14(3x),16,17,18,22,23,24,25,32,33,34,35(2x),39,41

NÉDEN NÉN = (n-)had not

#20

NÉDIM NÉNE = (n-)had him no

#28

Those were all past tense.

To be complete, here are the other fragments with present:NETH = NE-HETH (not-has)

[051/28]

THÀT FOLK NETH NAVT ÉNIS EN NOME

[O-S p.73]

Het volk heeft niet eens een naam

This people have not even a name

[054/16]

HJA NETH VS NAVT NE MELD

[O-S p.77]

zij heeft zich om ons niet bekommerd

she took no [:has not taken] notice of us

[063/10]

THENE HONA NETH FAN NIMMAN FRJUNDSKIP

[O-S p.89]

de haan heeft voor [van] niemand vriendschap

[the c0ck has friendship from noman] {was left out by Sandbach}

[112/17]

THÀT NIMMAN NÉN SPRÉK VPPA SIN SKILD NETH

[O-S p.153]

dat niemand eene spreuk op zijn schild heeft

that no one has a motto ['speak'] on his shield

[145/01]

GOSA NETH VS NÉNE FOLGSTERE NOMETH

[O-S p.197]

Gosa heeft ons geene opvolgster benoemd

Gosa has given us no [:has not named for us a] successors

[207/06]

THAT NETH NÉNE GODE FRÜCHDA BÁRED

[O-S p.249]

dat heeft geene goede vruchten gebaard [gedragen]

it produced no real good to them

[:that has not born good fruits]

.

Other negative verbs are:

NILLA = NE-WILLA (not-will, not-want, not-wish)

NÉTA = NE-WÉTA (not-know)

Edited by gestur

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'll go with the idea it's a borrowing from Latin, and that Latin borrowed it from Aramaic or Hebrew:
tunic (n.)

c.1600, from Middle French tunique, from Latin tunica (cf. Spanish tunica, Italian tonica, Old English tunece, Old High German tunihha), probably from a Semitic source (cf. Hebrew kuttoneth "coat," Aramaic kittuna).

That "probable" etymology sucks.

Hebrew kuttoneth and Aramaic kittuna are related to cotton (Dutch: katoen, Arabic qutn)

tunic = to-neck is the most plausible explanation

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That "probable" etymology sucks.

Hebrew kuttoneth and Aramaic kittuna are related to cotton (Dutch: katoen, Arabic qutn)

tunic = to-neck is the most plausible explanation

It is another explanation, yes, but not the most plausible one.

Some clothes would have been made of cotton, and then the word 'cotton' started to mean 'clothing' itself, subsequently adopted by the Latins who used wool instead.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hwand alrek werte arge that-er him master skolde makja boppa heth rjucht and welda e-lik tha slavona keninggar..........Sandbach translates as.

because everyone was afraid that he would set himself up above the law , and rule them like the slave kings.

is arge angry or afraid??

and whats your thoughts , does it say slave kings , or slavic kings , and does it mean the slavona were all slaves ?? and does the word boppa mean pope ??

Tach nw wêr-er ênsêm and vrlêten, hwand alrek wêre ange that-er him mâster skolde mâkja boppa heth rjucht aend welda ê-lik tha slâvona kêninggar.

S:

But now he was lonely and forsaken, because every one was afraid that he would set himself above the law, and rule them like the slave kings.

http://oeralinda.angelfire.com/#bh

Dutch:

Doch nu waar-er eenzaam ende verlaten, want elk waar angstig dat-er hem(zelf) meester zoude maken boven het recht ende heersen gelijk de Slavonische koningen.

But now he was lonely and forsaken, because every one feared he would make himself master above the law and rule them like the Slavonian (?) kings.

benauwen = to frighten

The Dutch word "angst" means 'fear', but is etymologically related to "ang(u)" and "eng", or 'narrow'; "benauwdheid" or 'anxiety', a feeling of inclusion or containment

http://www.etymologi...refwoord/angst1

http://www.etymologi.../trefwoord/eng1

angst (n.)

1944, from German Angst "neurotic fear, anxiety, guilt, remorse," from Old High German angust, from the root of anger. George Eliot used it (in German) in 1849, and it was popularized in English by translation of Freud's work, but as a foreign word until 1940s. Old English had a cognate word, angsumnes "anxiety," but it died out.

http://www.etymonlin...searchmode=none

welda:

wield (v.)

Old English weldan (Mercian), wieldan, wealdan (West Saxon) "to govern, possess, have control over" (class VII strong verb; past tense weold, past participle gewealden), merged with weak verb wyldan, both from Proto-Germanic *wal-t- (cf. Old Saxon and Gothic waldan, Old Frisian walda "to govern, rule," Old Norse valda "to rule, wield, to cause," Old High German waltan, German walten "to rule, govern").

http://www.etymonlin...searchmode=none

http://www.etymologi...refwoord/geweld

The Old Frisian word for 'slave' (someone forced to serve a master) was "skalk":

skal-k 11, afries., st. M. (a): nhd. Unfreier, Knecht, Diener, Sklave, Bösewicht; ne.

serf, servant, slave (M.), villain; ÜG.: lat. servus L 10, L 12, L 20; Vw.: s. -bÐr,

-hê-d, -ic-hê-d, -werk; Hw.: vgl. got. skalks, an. skalkr (1), ae. scealc, anfrk. skalk,

as. skalk*, ahd. skalk*, lang. *skalk; Q.: R, E, H, W, L 10, L 12, L 20, AA 193;

E.: germ. *skalka-, *skalkaz, *skalska-, *skalskaz, st. M. (a), Springer, Knecht,

Diener; s. idg. *skel- (1), *kel- (7), V., schneiden, Pokorny 923?; W.: s. nfries.

ontschalken;

http://koeblergerhar...rieswbhinw.html

.

Edited by Abramelin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If it does indeed mean 'slave' and not Slavonic, then it is not correct Old Frisian:

http://www.etymonlin...owed_in_frame=0

.

Edited by Abramelin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll go with the idea it's a borrowing from Latin, and that Latin borrowed it from Aramaic or Hebrew:

http://www.unexplain...25#entry4716524

OK but I don't buy it. I'm agreeing with gestur:

That "probable" etymology sucks.

Hebrew kuttoneth and Aramaic kittuna are related to cotton (Dutch: katoen, Arabic qutn)

tunic = to-neck is the most plausible explanation

Edited by The Puzzler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

wield (v.)

Old English weldan (Mercian), wieldan, wealdan (West Saxon) "to govern, possess, have control over" (class VII strong verb; past tense weold, past participle gewealden), merged with weak verb wyldan, both from Proto-Germanic *wal-t- (cf. Old Saxon and Gothic waldan, Old Frisian walda "to govern, rule," Old Norse valda "to rule, wield, to cause," Old High German waltan, German walten "to rule, govern").

Looking somewhat like a word for Wralda imo.

I know the old man age old etymology but that could be all wrong.

to govern, have control over, to cause - sounds quite logical to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

tunic = to-neck is the most plausible explanation

In the form of tohnekka, yes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It is another explanation, yes, but not the most plausible one.

It is.

Yours is what you call Lego-etymology, tossing around letters.

TOHNEKKA (olb) - TONICA (Italian) =>> T-N-K

kuttoneth - kittuna - cotton - katoen - qutn =>> K-T-N

Why would the K-sound have moved to the back?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One thing that bothers me is the apparent use of what seems to be a Latin v in place of letters. eg; svn, bedrvm

This seems to occur when the letter is a double o sound - could be soon/zoon became son and it is room - has anyone else noticed any pattern with this small v used in words?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is.

Yours is what you call Lego-etymology, tossing around letters.

TOHNEKKA (olb) - TONICA (Italian) =>> T-N-K

kuttoneth - kittuna - cotton - katoen - qutn =>> K-T-N

Why would the K-sound have moved to the back?

No, THIS is an example of lego-etymology:

tunic = to-neck

The Semitic etymology is nothing but a probable one, the Latin one ("tunica") is most probably the one used for the OLB.

To make it look Old Frisian-ish, they fabricated "tohnekka".

These things didn't reach the neck persé; Google 'tunica', images, and you'll see.for yourself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, THIS is an example of lego-etymology:

tunic = to-neck

The Semitic etymology is nothing but a probable one, the Latin one ("tunica") is most probably the one used for the OLB.

To make it look Old Frisian-ish, they fabricated "tohnekka".

These things didn't reach the neck persé; Google 'tunica', images, and you'll see.for yourself.

They did actually.

The body garment was loose-fitting for males, usually beginning at the neck and ending above the knee. A woman's garment could be either close fitting or loose, beginning at the neck and extending over a skirt or skirts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunic

The Semitic etymology is not for tunic - it's for cotton/linen. Also, a website I showed said it might be Etruscan, that's how probable the Hebrew/Phoenician/Semitic link is...

Edited by The Puzzler
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They did actually.

The body garment was loose-fitting for males, usually beginning at the neck and ending above the knee. A woman's garment could be either close fitting or loose, beginning at the neck and extending over a skirt or skirts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunic

The Semitic etymology is not for tunic - it's for cotton/linen. Also, a website I showed said it might be Etruscan, that's how probable the Hebrew/Phoenician/Semitic link is...

The images I posted are examples of ancient and modern times, and as you can see, not reaching up to the neck.

And I said that the Semitic etymology is a probable one, even though based on 'cotton', but the Latin word 'tunica' is very probably the source of the OLB word tohnekka.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 11

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.